It's about time someone started to go after these leeches that seem to operate with such complete impunity.
Perhaps the internet's "Wild West" phase is beginning to fade a bit ? One can but hope...
Yeah, let's police the Internet like we do the real world...great. Can't wait to pay for a government permit to create an app or launch a website. Get after them blizzard, but leave the courts out of it. I'm sorry but the video game company crying to the courts about their profits is more shameful than the cheaters.
A world where a company can "get after someone" withOUT the courts would be one hell of a freakishly scary and oppressive world Oo
First of all Blizzard has filed for suits in many different courts.No wonder their games always look low budget,they are spending all the money on lawyers and courts.
I read over many documents and even the court case that started all this so called liability going back to the Napster days.The problem and a VERY big one is that there is no real clear cut factual determination of guilt,it is simply up to the jury or judge and who has better lawyers.
The court or i guess judge that started this very bad omen on the justice system determined that the supplier of a program should be liable for how users use the program.MANY lawyers and others disagree as so do i and they gave many reasons.
The judge determined that the supplier needs to prove they are creating means to continually make sure users are not abusing their software to infringe copyright.Obviously many jumped all over that retarded statement by stating it is impractical,impossible for a business or software creator to keep tabs on millions of different users and how they circumvent the software.
Perfect example is Torrents.According to THAT judge a software creator of a torrent would be liable if users are stealing copyright material wit that torrent.IMO that is totally unfair and impractical to try and stop millions of users from doing so.
Blizzard is simply flexing their $$$,several lawyers and in several countries in hopes even one judge will see their side of the complaint.
For the record ,one judge already determined that simply watching a bot on a screen is not copyright infringement.Watching ANY video is not copyright infringement,how you got it might be though.
There is like 5 suits one i remember has to do with claims Bossland is circumventing players to break the contract/TOS.Laws are just far too vague,it comes down to who's lawyers make a better argument trying to twist the definitions of law.
Unfortunately, it's another temporary solution to a permanent problem. Over a decade worth of bots, and the only thing you can be certain of is that when you create a void, someone will fill it.
The idea is to make it such a chance to lose everything if they go after you. I don't mind them doing this at all. Doesn't do any good to go after a single user ever because it doesn't change anything. You go after the ones selling these pieces of crap and take them to the cleaners, over time things will slowly change as people realize it isn't worth the risk vs reward. It really boils down to these people were making money based of someone else work and copyrighted material. They deserve whatever happens to be honest.
because everyone in life doesn't make money off of others :'D
They are being enabled by the providers. This is why you go after the drug dealers and not the users. Cut off the supply.
That is the biggest bullshit argument ever. No one forces you to take drugs. Until we stop absolving people from responsibility for their own actions, we will continue to have these kinds of issues.
It's about time someone started to go after these leeches that seem to operate with such complete impunity.
Perhaps the internet's "Wild West" phase is beginning to fade a bit ? One can but hope...
Yeah, let's police the Internet like we do the real world...great. Can't wait to pay for a government permit to create an app or launch a website. Get after them blizzard, but leave the courts out of it. I'm sorry but the video game company crying to the courts about their profits is more shameful than the cheaters.
A world where a company can "get after someone" withOUT the courts would be one hell of a freakishly scary and oppressive world Oo
Yeah man, what do you suggest they do, exactly, Daranar?
Sorry I LOL'd the news article, but Blizzard made a HUGE mistake suing this bot maker. If indeed the bot maker stops his business, a lot of (automated) accounts (10.000s, or even 100.000s?) will become inactive and Blizzard will loose a lot of subscription income.
I do agree though that bots/rmt should be fought by publishers.
Well now we know where their money is going instead of putting it into the game and actually fixing the classes. If anyone wonders why the classes are stupid right now this is why.
Unfortunately, it's another temporary solution to a permanent problem. Over a decade worth of bots, and the only thing you can be certain of is that when you create a void, someone will fill it.
That's what makes drug comparisons silly as there has been no stopping opiates and the like by going after the dealers (that's just for show), take one down the client just goes somewhere else. As they will here, you have to fight the urges to use to make any real headway, but that's the hard solution, in both cases. In terms of games you have to truly improve the experience if you wanna stop folks from wanting to skip it.
Are you LOLing Soki because you think that is not true, or because you perceive it as some slight against Blizzard? LOL @ both reasonings either way...
Exactly. The War on Drugs failed, and so will efforts to disrupt the botting industry by targeting individual providers.
The War on Drugs failed for many reasons (not the least of which: we outlaw drugs haphazardly and without any consistent reasoning), but one very glaring reason was the idea that you could arrest your way out of a worldwide, ongoing issue is ludicrous.
If you believe Blizzard is doing this to milk $ from the bot makers you are mistaken. The economics just don't work. A lawsuit of this type is costing Blizzard well into the seven figures (i.e. millions) wiping out any real immediate financial gain from a possible successful German court decision.
That being said, I expect it will likely save Blizzard significant $ in terms of the overhead and efforts required to track, ban and manage offenders and possible future offenders (both players and bot creators).
It is about the money - but not directly.
Blizzard - I believe - are using the court cases to put financial pressure on the developer; hoping to drive them out of business etc.
That means that e.g. people don't have access to short-cuts to bot them to endgame - so maybe they sub an extra month; gold farmers have a harder time (except they probably have other not-for-sale bots as mentioned) - so people are more likely to buy Blizzard gold. And so on.
Bots can seriously degrade other people enjoyment - no question in my mind - but they can also patch up what are seen as "shortfalls" in game designs. Where should the line be drawn?
Should DBM be next? Or maybe one of the mods that helps you gather mats? Or an enhanced mini-map? If you boil it all down the only difference is that Blizzard are going after some and not others. They all change the "game play as designed by Blizzard".
Worth bearing in mind as well that the legal basis of this is not about bots but about copyright.
I hate to back any large company, especially the lowlifes at blizzard but I'm happy to see this. It's about time somebody's taken a step against these people, now hopefully they go after these gold farmers next.
...because a company is large they're lowlifes?
Some people are still angry that the Occupy movement was a joke and made them look worse than the corporations/rich/elite/<insert whoever you hate here>.
I dunno. I personally don't see anything different with paying 60 dollars to get to endgame, or botting. Except, one is filling the company pockets with money and the other isn't.
So are you saying people botting doesn't bother you?
I feel bothered the same as someone paying their way to endgame. Pretty much same exact thing. Like, literally nothing different with botting your way to endgame and paying your way to endgame lol
When I play EVE or LOTRO, I never feel the need to pay my way to endgame or bot. LOTRO its all about the story and adventure, the exploration and being in the world. You'd literally miss 99.9% of the game paying your way to max. In EVE, its kinda the same thing but in a huge amazing sandbox. And botting in EVE would be so dumb anyway, cause you'd get killed/ganked so easily with any bot lol.
For sure, those guys in my corp controlling 30 plus mining Hulks aren't botting at all......right.
In fact CCP has battled mining bots for many years especially in high sec and it's one reason they wink at the behavior of Code who took it upon themselves to rid high sec of all those who afk mine. (or fail to pay for a permit)
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Unfortunately, it's another temporary solution to a permanent problem. Over a decade worth of bots, and the only thing you can be certain of is that when you create a void, someone will fill it.
That's what makes drug comparisons silly as there has been no stopping opiates and the like by going after the dealers (that's just for show), take one down the client just goes somewhere else. As they will here, you have to fight the urges to use to make any real headway, but that's the hard solution, in both cases. In terms of games you have to truly improve the experience if you wanna stop folks from wanting to skip it.
Are you LOLing Soki because you think that is not true, or because you perceive it as some slight against Blizzard? LOL @ both reasonings either way...
Exactly. The War on Drugs failed, and so will efforts to disrupt the botting industry by targeting individual providers.
The War on Drugs failed for many reasons (not the least of which: we outlaw drugs haphazardly and without any consistent reasoning), but one very glaring reason was the idea that you could arrest your way out of a worldwide, ongoing issue is ludicrous.
There are places in the world where the War on Drugs has been reasonably successful.
Of course they generally don't just "arrest" people, beatings and death sentences also are part of the solution.
While extreme in real life very easy to employ them in a game, if...you have the will to eliminate paying customers.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Blizzard is writing the following on their home page:
A Golden Opportunity
Time is money, friend--but sometimes one is harder to come by than the other. ... Getting gold has never been simpler! Just head to the in-game Shop and purchase a WoW Token for real money. Put it up for sale in the Auction House and wait for your auction to complete!
Blizzard is writing the following on their home page:
A Golden Opportunity
Time is money, friend--but sometimes one is harder to come by than the other. ... Getting gold has never been simpler! Just head to the in-game Shop and purchase a WoW Token for real money. Put it up for sale in the Auction House and wait for your auction to complete!
Yeah, I think botting is just fine...
You should not be confused.
In only one of these scenarios does Blizzard make money. All that matters from their viewpoint.
Maybe they could add a bot to the game, say for only a small fee, like $100.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Blizzard is writing the following on their home page:
A Golden Opportunity
Time is money, friend--but sometimes one is harder to come by than the other. ... Getting gold has never been simpler! Just head to the in-game Shop and purchase a WoW Token for real money. Put it up for sale in the Auction House and wait for your auction to complete!
Yeah, I think botting is just fine...
You should not be confused.
In only one of these scenarios does Blizzard make money. All that matters from their viewpoint.
Maybe they could add a bot to the game, say for only a small fee, like $100.
No no! 'Tis is a noble deed, thy Blizzard has committed! Against atrocious and morally-barren monsters! All developers should take heed of the heroics performed herein! Grab thy pitchfork and thy torch, for we must protect the virginity of our favorite game developer!
Blizzard is writing the following on their home page:
A Golden Opportunity
Time is money, friend--but sometimes one is harder to come by than the other. ... Getting gold has never been simpler! Just head to the in-game Shop and purchase a WoW Token for real money. Put it up for sale in the Auction House and wait for your auction to complete!
Yeah, I think botting is just fine...
You should not be confused.
In only one of these scenarios does Blizzard make money. All that matters from their viewpoint.
Maybe they could add a bot to the game, say for only a small fee, like $100.
Botting is for terrorists and enemy non-combatants, tokens are for freedom fighters.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Why would you want to bot a game? You have to be the laziest person in existence to do that. The entire point of most of these games is getting a feeling of accomplishment in doing something, you can't have that with a bot.
Tokens make money for Blizzard in a product they paid to develop. Botting leaches money from their efforts and causes damage to the player base while doing it. You can't see the difference?
Why would you want to bot a game? You have to be the laziest person in existence to do that. The entire point of most of these games is getting a feeling of accomplishment in doing something, you can't have that with a bot.
All pretty well explained in previous replies, consider reading them
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I dunno. I personally don't see anything different with paying 60 dollars to get to endgame, or botting. Except, one is filling the company pockets with money and the other isn't.
Except, people who use bots tend to ruin games for other players, take ESO, bots were used in that game extensively and it was a problem for other players, it negatively affected how those players thought of the game because of the activities of the 'botters', and when you look at those complaints about the bots in ESO, how many players actually quit? and this was when ESO was P2P, which meant that botters were causing Zenimax to lose money. When evaluating the impact of botters and the difference between a bot and a player, you really have to consider the 'big picture'. So personally i hope Blizzard nail Bossland hard, make an example of them that will dissuade other bot makers, personally i'd like to see them receive custodial sentences alongside the fines, but we can't have everything i guess.
ESO went F2P for console no other reason, the required sub was to milk as money money from the game while they did a massive beta test for console release, the game is actually in a really good spot now though, so clearly it paid off.
Comments
bla
because everyone in life doesn't make money off of others :'D
That is the biggest bullshit argument ever. No one forces you to take drugs. Until we stop absolving people from responsibility for their own actions, we will continue to have these kinds of issues.
~~ postlarval ~~
Yeah man, what do you suggest they do, exactly, Daranar?
I do agree though that bots/rmt should be fought by publishers.
The War on Drugs failed for many reasons (not the least of which: we outlaw drugs haphazardly and without any consistent reasoning), but one very glaring reason was the idea that you could arrest your way out of a worldwide, ongoing issue is ludicrous.
Blizzard - I believe - are using the court cases to put financial pressure on the developer; hoping to drive them out of business etc.
That means that e.g. people don't have access to short-cuts to bot them to endgame - so maybe they sub an extra month; gold farmers have a harder time (except they probably have other not-for-sale bots as mentioned) - so people are more likely to buy Blizzard gold. And so on.
Bots can seriously degrade other people enjoyment - no question in my mind - but they can also patch up what are seen as "shortfalls" in game designs. Where should the line be drawn?
Should DBM be next? Or maybe one of the mods that helps you gather mats? Or an enhanced mini-map? If you boil it all down the only difference is that Blizzard are going after some and not others. They all change the "game play as designed by Blizzard".
Worth bearing in mind as well that the legal basis of this is not about bots but about copyright.
Some people are still angry that the Occupy movement was a joke and made them look worse than the corporations/rich/elite/<insert whoever you hate here>.
~~ postlarval ~~
In fact CCP has battled mining bots for many years especially in high sec and it's one reason they wink at the behavior of Code who took it upon themselves to rid high sec of all those who afk mine. (or fail to pay for a permit)
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Of course they generally don't just "arrest" people, beatings and death sentences also are part of the solution.
While extreme in real life very easy to employ them in a game, if...you have the will to eliminate paying customers.
Few companies do.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Blizzard is writing the following on their home page:
A Golden Opportunity
Time is money, friend--but sometimes one is harder to come by than the other.
...
Getting gold has never been simpler! Just head to the in-game Shop and purchase a WoW Token for real money. Put it up for sale in the Auction House and wait for your auction to complete!
Yeah, I think botting is just fine...
In only one of these scenarios does Blizzard make money. All that matters from their viewpoint.
Maybe they could add a bot to the game, say for only a small fee, like $100.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon