COE funding continues to grow

StaalBurgher

A couple of month ago there was a discussion around here about what the required budget for this game was. This got me interested in whether COE was still raising cash and I started recording the funding level on their website to see what was happening. Seems they are raising just short of £30k every month. Probably not enough to cover all their costs but certainly enough to significantly extend how long they can develop for. 

Will this be enough for them to make a viable product?

Wedlen

When is this game supposd to be released? Any info? Its the first time i started reading about this game.

Vrika

$30k every month is enough for them to keep maybe 3 people employed. Every little bit helps, but 3 people more or less isn't going to make any large difference.



@StaalBurgher

You've used wrong unit of currency in your post. On their website the money is in dollars, not in pounds.

Vrika

Wedlen said:

When is this game supposd to be released? Any info? Its the first time i started reading about this game.

The devs have estimated that they'll release it in 2017, then they changed their estimate to 2018, then they changed their estimate to second half of 2019.

The game might release on second half of 2019, but to be realistic it's unlikely. CoE is yet another Kickstarter game that keeps missing all their release estimates.

MadFrenchie

Vrika said:

Wedlen said:

When is this game supposd to be released? Any info? Its the first time i started reading about this game.

The devs have estimated that they'll release it in 2017, then they changed their estimate to 2018, then they changed their estimate to second half of 2019.

The game might release on second half of 2019, but to be realistic it's unlikely. CoE is yet another Kickstarter game that keeps missing all their release estimates.

I think we can stop playing with these semantics and start calling it what it is: another Kickstarter game that's intentionally overestimating development progress to convince players to spend money to float the next year of actual, sluggish progress.

StaalBurgher

@StaalBurgher

You've used wrong unit of currency in your post. On their website the money is in dollars, not in pounds.

Yup you are right, thanks for pointing that out. Force of habit!

StaalBurgher

MadFrenchie said:

I think we can stop playing with these semantics and start calling it what it is: another Kickstarter game that's intentionally overestimating development progress to convince players to spend money to float the next year of actual, sluggish progress.

Not any different from successful publishers that overstate their game's qualities. The key point is; will there be a game at the end of it? And since it is Kickstarter people should know already there is a non-negligible risk that the project could fail. They have to decide for themselves whether they are willing to risk money to give the project a chance of succeeding.

ConstantineMerus

StaalBurgher said:

MadFrenchie said:

I think we can stop playing with these semantics and start calling it what it is: another Kickstarter game that's intentionally overestimating development progress to convince players to spend money to float the next year of actual, sluggish progress.

Not any different from successful publishers that overstate their game's qualities. The key point is; will there be a game at the end of it? And since it is Kickstarter people should know already there is a non-negligible risk that the project could fail. They have to decide for themselves whether they are willing to risk money to give the project a chance of succeeding.

People's willingness to take risks doesn't justifies deception. If a project I had invested on fails, I don't mind, that's part of a deal of taking risks. But in case of deception that turns to fraud and which results in confined spaces shared with other hopeless romantics.

Not saying COE is either, I don't know. But your logic is wrong. 

The end doesn't justify the means neither. If a dev is lying and cheating and still makes a great I'd still tell them fuck you and fuck your great game. If we were fine with deception and other types of funny business, as you pointed out correctly, then we prefer major publishers with their polished products on the shelf. 

Again, this is my general opinion. I'm in no position to judge CoE, but I wish them best of luck. 

StaalBurgher

I see what you are saying but I don't believe it is deception. They are marketing their product like anyone else would. Kickstarters are high risk projects, it is why they are here in the first place.

Slapshot1188

StaalBurgher said:

I see what you are saying but I don't believe it is deception. They are marketing their product like anyone else would. Kickstarters are high risk projects, it is why they are here in the first place.

Deception or incompetence.  We've covered this before.  I think the guy genuinely did not set out to deceive anyone, at least at the start.  I just think he's been proven to be an incompetent project manager. Also, he's proven to be poor at customer engagement and it doesn't help that he mocked those who pointed out how unreasonable his initial timeline was. Who can forget the epic (Have you seen our Gantt charts) rant...

Also, I think the most troubling monetary issue for this game is how they generate cash at "release". All the diehard fans have bought their multiple accounts, their titles and lands, their headstarts, their in game advantages and enough sparks to last years and years.  Most of the casual fans have already pledged for their accounts and a year of more of sparks.  This is the epitome of a niche game. IMHO the  population at launch isn't going to be dramatically different from what it is before launch. As a matter of fact I think it will plummet as non-hardcore PvP folks get steamrolled by those who bought their advantage.

Note that this isn't unique to CoE but affects most Kickstarters.  I just think CoE is even more exposed than its peers.

Kyleran

Slapshot1188 said:

StaalBurgher said:

I see what you are saying but I don't believe it is deception. They are marketing their product like anyone else would. Kickstarters are high risk projects, it is why they are here in the first place.

Deception or incompetence.  We've covered this before.  I think the guy genuinely did not set out to deceive anyone, at least at the start.  I just think he's been proven to be an incompetent project manager. Also, he's proven to be poor at customer engagement and it doesn't help that he mocked those who pointed out how unreasonable his initial timeline was. Who can forget the epic (Have you seen our Gantt charts) rant...

Also, I think the most troubling monetary issue for this game is how they generate cash at "release". All the diehard fans have bought their multiple accounts, their titles and lands, their headstarts, their in game advantages and enough sparks to last years and years.  Most of the casual fans have already pledged for their accounts and a year of more of sparks.  This is the epitome of a niche game. IMHO the  population at launch isn't going to be dramatically different from what it is before launch. As a matter of fact I think it will plummet as non-hardcore PvP folks get steamrolled by those who bought their advantage.

Note that this isn't unique to CoE but affects most Kickstarters.  I just think CoE is even more exposed than its peers.

You are probably correct but I'll probably buy a few sparks if and when the game has launched and been out for a while.

Slapshot1188

Kyleran said:

Slapshot1188 said:

StaalBurgher said:

I see what you are saying but I don't believe it is deception. They are marketing their product like anyone else would. Kickstarters are high risk projects, it is why they are here in the first place.

Deception or incompetence.  We've covered this before.  I think the guy genuinely did not set out to deceive anyone, at least at the start.  I just think he's been proven to be an incompetent project manager. Also, he's proven to be poor at customer engagement and it doesn't help that he mocked those who pointed out how unreasonable his initial timeline was. Who can forget the epic (Have you seen our Gantt charts) rant...

Also, I think the most troubling monetary issue for this game is how they generate cash at "release". All the diehard fans have bought their multiple accounts, their titles and lands, their headstarts, their in game advantages and enough sparks to last years and years.  Most of the casual fans have already pledged for their accounts and a year of more of sparks.  This is the epitome of a niche game. IMHO the  population at launch isn't going to be dramatically different from what it is before launch. As a matter of fact I think it will plummet as non-hardcore PvP folks get steamrolled by those who bought their advantage.

Note that this isn't unique to CoE but affects most Kickstarters.  I just think CoE is even more exposed than its peers.

You are probably correct but I'll probably buy a few sparks if and when the game has launched and been out for a while.

Oh there will be a little here and there no doubt but I think all these Crowdfunding games have to deal with the fact that they already spent most of their revenue by launch.  I think the COE model is actually even more challenging than the average Crowdfunded one. This is why they are trying to monetize things like the Prelude, etc... 

They need to find ways to keep money flowing from the niche they have already milked.

StaalBurgher

I've been on holiday for a bit and haven't updated the tracker for a while. There has been a considerable jump in cash generation for the game. I noticed the shop had a count down timer for a pledge price increase, not sure when it started but it ends in 5 days. Could be the reason for it.

Kyleran

New cash shop items having any effect yet? Or perhaps people are buying packages before it comes into play?

Wait,  I've got it, must be Jeremy's recent display of wit and charm here on MMORPG.com.....surely that must be what's happening.

Renoaku

I would like to see COE be a great game but look at Ashes OF Creation & Crow Fall both had really successful kickstarter, why couldn't COE?

Kyleran

Renoaku said:

I would like to see COE be a great game but look at Ashes OF Creation & Crow Fall both had really successful kickstarter, why couldn't COE?

The other two games have staff more well versed in marketing and have exhibited more competency and professionalism? 

StaalBurgher

Kyleran said:

New cash shop items having any effect yet? Or perhaps people are buying packages before it comes into play?

Wait,  I've got it, must be Jeremy's recent display of wit and charm here on MMORPG.com.....surely that must be what's happening.

Yeah, just started reading the other thread about the new ala carte items you can buy. That must be it I guess. Typically the usual suspect had to get his panties in a twist.

Slapshot1188

StaalBurgher said:

I've been on holiday for a bit and haven't updated the tracker for a while. There has been a considerable jump in cash generation for the game. I noticed the shop had a count down timer for a pledge price increase, not sure when it started but it ends in 5 days. Could be the reason for it.

Didn't the sale of the unlimited $10 buy your vote for King tokens start on Nov 1st? 
If so, don't you think that would be the main reason November 1 had a huge increase?

Kyleran

Hey, they are about 3/4 of the way there to the $4M Jeremy said was needed to complete the game.

http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/468811/www.kickstarter.com/projects/soulboundstudios/chronicles-of-elyria-epic-story-mmorpg-with-aging/posts/169http://

Slapshot1188

Kyleran said:

Hey, they are about 3/4 of the way there to the $4M Jeremy said was needed to complete the game.

www.kickstarter.com/projects/soulboundstudios/chronicles-of-elyria-epic-story-mmorpg-with-aging/posts/169

Pretty sure that's... umm... a moving target
 

MadFrenchie

StaalBurgher said:

MadFrenchie said:

I think we can stop playing with these semantics and start calling it what it is: another Kickstarter game that's intentionally overestimating development progress to convince players to spend money to float the next year of actual, sluggish progress.

Not any different from successful publishers that overstate their game's qualities. The key point is; will there be a game at the end of it? And since it is Kickstarter people should know already there is a non-negligible risk that the project could fail. They have to decide for themselves whether they are willing to risk money to give the project a chance of succeeding.

Just now seeing this response.  But it's very different.

Nobody from the general gaming public has to float AAA development based on those marketing tactics.  That's a huge difference.

StaalBurgher

Slapshot1188 said:

StaalBurgher said:

I've been on holiday for a bit and haven't updated the tracker for a while. There has been a considerable jump in cash generation for the game. I noticed the shop had a count down timer for a pledge price increase, not sure when it started but it ends in 5 days. Could be the reason for it.

Didn't the sale of the unlimited $10 buy your vote for King tokens start on Nov 1st? 
If so, don't you think that would be the main reason November 1 had a huge increase?

No idea. But the ability to buy individual aspects of a package must be driving some of it. Stuff like Coat-of-Arms and Land Tokens would be quite popular I imagine.

The total on the store page jumped £11k between today and yesterday.

Slapshot1188

StaalBurgher said:

Slapshot1188 said:

StaalBurgher said:

I've been on holiday for a bit and haven't updated the tracker for a while. There has been a considerable jump in cash generation for the game. I noticed the shop had a count down timer for a pledge price increase, not sure when it started but it ends in 5 days. Could be the reason for it.

Didn't the sale of the unlimited $10 buy your vote for King tokens start on Nov 1st? 
If so, don't you think that would be the main reason November 1 had a huge increase?

No idea. But the ability to buy individual aspects of a package must be driving some of it. Stuff like Coat-of-Arms and Land Tokens would be quite popular I imagine.

The total on the store page jumped £11k between today and yesterday.

Of course it did!

$10 a vote adds up quickly.

StaalBurgher

MadFrenchie said:

Nobody from the general gaming public has to float AAA development based on those marketing tactics.  That's a huge difference.

I don't really see much of a difference. I understand that you are trying to say that with a publisher there would already be a game whereas with the crowd-funded game there is nothing at the point you are laying your money down... but the big publisher is not willing to make the game.

There is no way to get around the fact that the gamer has to assume the monetary risk if they want a chance of a game like x, y, z being made. CoE might not turn out exactly how people want it but neither do games from big publishers alway deliver.

MadFrenchie

StaalBurgher said:

MadFrenchie said:

Nobody from the general gaming public has to float AAA development based on those marketing tactics.  That's a huge difference.

I don't really see much of a difference. I understand that you are trying to say that with a publisher there would already be a game whereas with the crowd-funded game there is nothing at the point you are laying your money down... but the big publisher is not willing to make the game.

There is no way to get around the fact that the gamer has to assume the monetary risk if they want a chance of a game like x, y, z being made. CoE might not turn out exactly how people want it but neither do games from big publishers alway deliver.

And there are very valid reasons those publishers don't want to fund these endeavors.  None of that qualifies a cautious wait and see attitude about these developers' ability to deliver, quite the contrary.  And it certainly doesn't mean we should give them carte blanche regarding monetization and marketing tactics.

Had the CoE team approached a traditional, reputable publisher and pitched this idea and timeline, how do you honestly think that would've went down?

SEANMCAD

MadFrenchie said:

StaalBurgher said:

MadFrenchie said:

Nobody from the general gaming public has to float AAA development based on those marketing tactics.  That's a huge difference.

I don't really see much of a difference. I understand that you are trying to say that with a publisher there would already be a game whereas with the crowd-funded game there is nothing at the point you are laying your money down... but the big publisher is not willing to make the game.

There is no way to get around the fact that the gamer has to assume the monetary risk if they want a chance of a game like x, y, z being made. CoE might not turn out exactly how people want it but neither do games from big publishers alway deliver.

...

Had the CoE team approached a traditional, reputable publisher and pitched this idea and timeline, how do you honestly think that would've went down?

it would have gotten rejected.

surely you know that which leaves me confused at the moment