Judging by the gameplay they've been streaming of the new xpac, it looks like they did a massive stat squish. Tank health pool went from 10 million to around 26,000.
So are Warfronts pvp or pve? You guys mention 20 man raids vs npc armies Massively is saying 20 man pvp raids.
"Warfronts now. Warfronts are all about war in the homeland. They’re 20-man PvP raids, faction-based. It’s a pretty cool throwback to Warcraft RTS fantasy, as you’ll be collecting resources and indirectly ordering peons to build up your base, then you’ll need to defend it too. Lots of cheers for the rebuilt Stromgarde Keep!"
So are Warfronts pvp or pve? You guys mention 20 man raids vs npc armies Massively is saying 20 man pvp raids.
"Warfronts now. Warfronts are all about war in the homeland. They’re 20-man PvP raids, faction-based. It’s a pretty cool throwback to Warcraft RTS fantasy, as you’ll be collecting resources and indirectly ordering peons to build up your base, then you’ll need to defend it too. Lots of cheers for the rebuilt Stromgarde Keep!"
Could be an option for both. But so far, from what I've read, it sounds like just 20 players vs. AI.
@Iselin, @Coolit Wasn't GW2 first to introduce level scaling or my memory is playing tricks on me. Pretty sure GW2 was first.
They did something quite different - they only down-scaled after you leveled past a zone's cap. ESO scales low level players up to the one level that all the zones are. WOW is doing is something that seems similar but less radical than ESO's system.
It sounds to me like they have heard the complaints from some who don't like the ESO system because it appears at first glance to undermine progression (it doesn't but whatever... some think it does) and are scaling different zones to different levels.
One of the few things we disagree on. ESO's scaling might not destroy progression, but it sure destroyed the feeling of progression for me.
I miss having a great group in DAoC and pulling reds/purps because we were all more powerful than the sum of our parts. That was a cool feeling.
@Iselin, @Coolit Wasn't GW2 first to introduce level scaling or my memory is playing tricks on me. Pretty sure GW2 was first.
They did something quite different - they only down-scaled after you leveled past a zone's cap. ESO scales low level players up to the one level that all the zones are. WOW is doing is something that seems similar but less radical than ESO's system.
It sounds to me like they have heard the complaints from some who don't like the ESO system because it appears at first glance to undermine progression (it doesn't but whatever... some think it does) and are scaling different zones to different levels.
One of the few things we disagree on. ESO's scaling might not destroy progression, but it sure destroyed the feeling of progression for me.
I miss having a great group in DAoC and pulling reds/purps because we were all more powerful than the sum of our parts. That was a cool feeling.
You can certainly do that in ESO also. The only thing missing is the red or purple con but there are some tough mofo world bosses in every zone that need a group. The mobs may all be the same level but they sure as hell are not created equal.
It's pretty standard in zone chat to hear someone wanting to get a group going to do all the bosses in a zone. Those are some fun impromptu half hour to 1 hour groups.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Good stuff, except...... I wish they would make some changes to the world itself. It gets old playing the same content and having the same site to look at as I quest. It would be nice to see things get build, new tech, things get destroyed, some landscaping, and add new quests to old quest content.
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
so if servers are not pvp or pve, then how exactly does that work? Open pvp everywhere? or just in certain zones? thx
The PvP vs PvE server division is going away, replaced by an individual toggle. You can choose if you want to opt in to PvP or not when you are in town. Players that feel trapped on PvP servers have a way out. This opens up the game to changing and improving the world PvP ruleset.
New content like bounty hunting or assassination quests will become an option.
There will be bonuses to experience, reputation and other things when you are questing with PvP mode enabled to offset the inefficiency.
Building a foundation to make World PvP great again.
so if servers are not pvp or pve, then how exactly does that work? Open pvp everywhere? or just in certain zones? thx
Instancing. It sounds like they're Megaservering WOW. If you want PVP you're placed in that instance of a zone. If you don't, you go into the PVE version.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Torval said: People do tend to banter and chat a bit during those runs too.
As much as 2017 MMO players do anyway. No matter how we slice it, the social atmosphere in MMOs has changed from what it was back 15 years ago... kids these days!
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Today i see a mega load of Blizzard spam,it is like the rest of the gaming world never existed,all Blizzard threads. This is really boring to see this constantly,Destiny 2 has been beyond boring,i want to see a VARIETY,a QUALITY if variety gaming not just Blizzard threads all over,it looks like my spam folder.
All we ever see from you is negative complaining post. Today is no different. It's beyond boring we want to see VARITY a QUALITY post from you not just complaining negative post. This post just looks like everything in your history folder.
@Iselin, @Coolit Wasn't GW2 first to introduce level scaling or my memory is playing tricks on me. Pretty sure GW2 was first.
They did something quite different - they only down-scaled after you leveled past a zone's cap. ESO scales low level players up to the one level that all the zones are. WOW is doing is something that seems similar but less radical than ESO's system.
It sounds to me like they have heard the complaints from some who don't like the ESO system because it appears at first glance to undermine progression (it doesn't but whatever... some think it does) and are scaling different zones to different levels.
One of the few things we disagree on. ESO's scaling might not destroy progression, but it sure destroyed the feeling of progression for me.
I miss having a great group in DAoC and pulling reds/purps because we were all more powerful than the sum of our parts. That was a cool feeling.
You can certainly do that in ESO also. The only thing missing is the red or purple con but there are some tough mofo world bosses in every zone that need a group. The mobs may all be the same level but they sure as hell are not created equal.
It's pretty standard in zone chat to hear someone wanting to get a group going to do all the bosses in a zone. Those are some fun impromptu half hour to 1 hour groups.
I understand they've done a good job of it- it just still rubs me the wrong way.
I enjoyed GW2's system better as it's only down-scaling. Coupled with unique items that you can't find in other zones (not just equipment, but gems, crafting materials, etc. that are useful at higher levels), I feel like it would have much the same effect while still creating parts of the world that are deadly to the player and create a sense of awe in the idea of "ooh, I wanna get more powerful so I can come back here" idea.
However, that system alone isn't really enough to discourage me. I just also dislike the skill shards system too, as well as the weapon-swapping and the way so many skill lines are tethered to equipment. Never been a fan of the whole "your equipment defines you" kind of thing. Really the skill lines in general became a turn-off to me. I've tried to come back a couple times, but had to face the fact that it was simply a good MMORPG that isn't for me.
Not sure I like the scaling and this next Xpac sound like it's more PVP oriented. Blizz is determined to make PVP the focus of this game. I guess they really haven't learned. When they start interjecting PVP into the PVE portion of the game, it's never received well.
Still early yet, but this may be the nail in the WoW coffin for me.
I'm not an IT Specialist, Game Developer, or Clairvoyant in real life, but like others on here, I play one on the internet.
@Iselin, @Coolit Wasn't GW2 first to introduce level scaling or my memory is playing tricks on me. Pretty sure GW2 was first.
They did something quite different - they only down-scaled after you leveled past a zone's cap. ESO scales low level players up to the one level that all the zones are. WOW is doing is something that seems similar but less radical than ESO's system.
It sounds to me like they have heard the complaints from some who don't like the ESO system because it appears at first glance to undermine progression (it doesn't but whatever... some think it does) and are scaling different zones to different levels.
One of the few things we disagree on. ESO's scaling might not destroy progression, but it sure destroyed the feeling of progression for me.
I miss having a great group in DAoC and pulling reds/purps because we were all more powerful than the sum of our parts. That was a cool feeling.
You can certainly do that in ESO also. The only thing missing is the red or purple con but there are some tough mofo world bosses in every zone that need a group. The mobs may all be the same level but they sure as hell are not created equal.
It's pretty standard in zone chat to hear someone wanting to get a group going to do all the bosses in a zone. Those are some fun impromptu half hour to 1 hour groups.
I understand they've done a good job of it- it just still rubs me the wrong way.
I enjoyed GW2's system better as it's only down-scaling. Coupled with unique items that you can't find in other zones (not just equipment, but gems, crafting materials, etc. that are useful at higher levels), I feel like it would have much the same effect while still creating parts of the world that are deadly to the player and create a sense of awe in the idea of "ooh, I wanna get more powerful so I can come back here" idea.
However, that system alone isn't really enough to discourage me. I just also dislike the skill shards system too, as well as the weapon-swapping and the way so many skill lines are tethered to equipment. Never been a fan of the whole "your equipment defines you" kind of thing. Really the skill lines in general became a turn-off to me. I've tried to come back a couple times, but had to face the fact that it was simply a good MMORPG that isn't for me.
That's cool. There's no MMO that's for everyone. I was focusing just in the idea of the scaling system having or not having progression and different difficulties of mobs throughout the game.
It was a common topic in the ESO forums after One Tamriel with some people arguing that they actually got weaker as they leveled which is bogus unless someone is just really, really bad at the fundamentals of character building. The only way for that to be possible is if you do absolutely nothing but light and heavy attack with your LMB and only if the weapon you're using is worse than the one you had at the lower level and you have put 0 points into weapon damage passives.
You still occasionally see posts there from new players discombubelated by the scaling which is understandable since it's still a pretty rare thing in MMOs, they probably haven't experienced it before and most MMOs make such a huge freaking deal about "achieving" that next numerical level marker. I mean... what's more cliched in MMOs than "Ding!"... "Gratz!" which no one even bothers saying in ESO
I have leveled new characters before and after 1T since I'm an unrepentant altoholic in MMOs, so I know first hand that progression is alive and well as is content of varying difficulty at all levels.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Not sure I like the scaling and this next Xpac sound like it's more PVP oriented. Blizz is determined to make PVP the focus of this game. I guess they really haven't learned. When they start interjecting PVP into the PVE portion of the game, it's never received well.
Still early yet, but this may be the nail in the WoW coffin for me.
Buts not interjected as you can toggle it on or off so you dont have to roll a pve server for pve and a pvp server when you want that and have to level 2 chars. Makes more sense to keep server populations healthy too.
Honestly they did a complete 360 on anduins personality and background of his character by making him out to be a war mongering man. It kinda irks me that they were pushing peace at first with him and completely back tracked on it, and throwing the entire story arc way off.
I'm not sure if there have been deviations from this, just jumping back in to see the story parts I missed, but this was kind of a turning point for him.
Edit: And this may or may not (they haven't given the order yet) have been after the Horde burns Teldrassil down so.... yeah.
I like everything about it except the level scaling myself. Sometimes I just want to go back to the older content and get those achievements I missed by myself because getting a group together to do them can be a pain. This pretty much kills being able to do that. I actually save trying to do somethings because I know in the future I will be able to come back and complete it without pulling my hair out or having that one person screw it up for everyone. I will most likely hop back in when they drop the next xpac, I still go back every once in a while anyway to keep from burning out on other games.
Not sure I like the scaling and this next Xpac sound like it's more PVP oriented. Blizz is determined to make PVP the focus of this game. I guess they really haven't learned. When they start interjecting PVP into the PVE portion of the game, it's never received well.
Still early yet, but this may be the nail in the WoW coffin for me.
I'm extremely cautious about this expansion. Legion required significantly more group content to advance the story, class, hall, artifact, well, shoot, everything, than previous expansions. They seem determined to shoo away their solo players.
The Heart of Azeroth is a case in point. It advances when you gain azerite, which you'll get from doing warfronts and expeditions. My guess is you'll get a lot from that content and just a smidgen above squat for all other content. In short, they've added a must-have item that requires group play to advance.
I'm cynical about Blizz at this point. This expansion seems lacklustre, but that may just be my perspective as a solo player. Perhaps warfronts and expeditions are exciting and I'm just not seeing it.
City of Heroes I recall scaled my low level in missions with higher level people to match them so it enabled me to play with people of different levels. It also scaled you in certain zones too I think it was PvP ...correct me if I'm wrong please.
Was watching some demo gameplay of this expansion last night on twitch and goddam did it look boring. First off i could barely tell it was a new zone they were in, so bland. The dungeon they were running had overtuned trash mobs , think Sunwell burning crusade when the instance launched lol. Besides the overtuned trash the design and graphics just looked like more of the same old same old.
There is really nothing exciting going on with this expansion in my opinion other than the announcement of vanilla wow. I'll make a prediction now, This will go down as the WORST wow expansion.
I think its time for blizzard to move on from the current wow dev team, They need some new blood in there, from art design to class mechanics to world design and questing, i feel like they are really lacking any creativity whatsoever .
Comments
"Warfronts now. Warfronts are all about war in the homeland. They’re 20-man PvP raids, faction-based. It’s a pretty cool throwback to Warcraft RTS fantasy, as you’ll be collecting resources and indirectly ordering peons to build up your base, then you’ll need to defend it too. Lots of cheers for the rebuilt Stromgarde Keep!"
I miss having a great group in DAoC and pulling reds/purps because we were all more powerful than the sum of our parts. That was a cool feeling.
It's pretty standard in zone chat to hear someone wanting to get a group going to do all the bosses in a zone. Those are some fun impromptu half hour to 1 hour groups.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
All we ever see from you is negative complaining post. Today is no different. It's beyond boring we want to see VARITY a QUALITY post from you not just complaining negative post. This post just looks like everything in your history folder.
I enjoyed GW2's system better as it's only down-scaling. Coupled with unique items that you can't find in other zones (not just equipment, but gems, crafting materials, etc. that are useful at higher levels), I feel like it would have much the same effect while still creating parts of the world that are deadly to the player and create a sense of awe in the idea of "ooh, I wanna get more powerful so I can come back here" idea.
However, that system alone isn't really enough to discourage me. I just also dislike the skill shards system too, as well as the weapon-swapping and the way so many skill lines are tethered to equipment. Never been a fan of the whole "your equipment defines you" kind of thing. Really the skill lines in general became a turn-off to me. I've tried to come back a couple times, but had to face the fact that it was simply a good MMORPG that isn't for me.
Still early yet, but this may be the nail in the WoW coffin for me.
I'm not an IT Specialist, Game Developer, or Clairvoyant in real life, but like others on here, I play one on the internet.
It was a common topic in the ESO forums after One Tamriel with some people arguing that they actually got weaker as they leveled
You still occasionally see posts there from new players discombubelated by the scaling which is understandable since it's still a pretty rare thing in MMOs, they probably haven't experienced it before and most MMOs make such a huge freaking deal about "achieving" that next numerical level marker. I mean... what's more cliched in MMOs than "Ding!"... "Gratz!" which no one even bothers saying in ESO
I have leveled new characters before and after 1T since I'm an unrepentant altoholic in MMOs, so I know first hand that progression is alive and well as is content of varying difficulty at all levels.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/story/comic/son-of-the-wolf
I'm not sure if there have been deviations from this, just jumping back in to see the story parts I missed, but this was kind of a turning point for him. Edit: And this may or may not (they haven't given the order yet) have been after the Horde burns Teldrassil down so.... yeah.
I'm extremely cautious about this expansion. Legion required significantly more group content to advance the story, class, hall, artifact, well, shoot, everything, than previous expansions. They seem determined to shoo away their solo players.
The Heart of Azeroth is a case in point. It advances when you gain azerite, which you'll get from doing warfronts and expeditions. My guess is you'll get a lot from that content and just a smidgen above squat for all other content. In short, they've added a must-have item that requires group play to advance.
I'm cynical about Blizz at this point. This expansion seems lacklustre, but that may just be my perspective as a solo player. Perhaps warfronts and expeditions are exciting and I'm just not seeing it.
I have a dream
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
There is really nothing exciting going on with this expansion in my opinion other than the announcement of vanilla wow. I'll make a prediction now, This will go down as the WORST wow expansion.
I think its time for blizzard to move on from the current wow dev team, They need some new blood in there, from art design to class mechanics to world design and questing, i feel like they are really lacking any creativity whatsoever .
Aloha Mr Hand !