I personally don't like that they set expectations that players will be able to play for X hours and achieve Y - whatever Y may be. That kind of thing is far too subjective. In a virtual world, the only thing you should be able to expect is the unexpected. I've played games for 2 hours and gained levels, equipment, and other visible progress, but still felt pretty 'meh' about the experience.
Then again, I played EQ for an hour, traveled across some dangerous territory, made plans with some friends, got my character set up in a spot I wanted to camp on the weekend when I had more time, and logged out satisfied knowing that I made progress to something greater. Sometimes gratification must be deferred to make your achievement feel worthwhile.
To me, if a player needs some sort of tangible (virtually tangible) reward in a two hour period of time, they probably should seek a different form of entertainment; because if we can really expect to make serious gains in that timeframe in an mmorpg, progression is going to feel rather trite.
He's definitely not better than us. He's the spammer who doesn't know the difference between your and you're and lose and loose . That's not a joke. There were multiple posts about it and he really didn't understand basic 3rd grade grammar.
Just put him on ignore and move on like most people. He isn't worth your time. I haven't seen any of his posts in a long time but I see the responses. It is always more of the same.
Most of what is said is likely true IF they flat out copy say EQ1 and that imo is a big mistake.
Yeah yeah tired of hearing me mention FFXI but imo FFXi was an improvement on everything EQ1 did.Only surpassed by EQ2 because of graphics and housing.
Now what i am about to say is FACT,i been there,seen it ,it works.FFXi's sub class system allowed players with less play time to never fall behind for years because players always leveling subs or mains. Most sad designs it is simply a RACE,then maybe some alts for crafting but always a race to be first to kill bosses.Even crafting was improved because with such a demanding system,often players would rather buy than work for it,so even noobs can be profitable.
"Grouping"although mostly true,again if looking at FFXI not entirely and not a restriction.What i like to see however,is if adding solo type classes,you should EARN them,work for them and not just handed to you.Example ,a pet class,not done like all OTHER games where the combined duo feels like one but like FFXI where a pet is likely even stronger than you or equal but feels like two players.
Where am i going with this?it is possible to keep most all types of players happy within reason while still maintaining a mostly grouping game.If classes are done really well,you can even get thinking players to turn duos into a near party .The trade off is SPEED,sure you can solo or duo but it is slower,grouping can and should offer faster killing and bonuses for faster killing because it also means you did a good job with your mages/healers resources,aka killing chains. The other obvious is that grouping offers more buffs,more debuffs,there should be player to player combos to add more attack etc etc,sop grouping would ALWAYS be the best option but not the ONLY option.
If all people want is another EQ1,you are going to get same old but a not so good game by now a days standards.If Pantheon team's agenda is to attract Raiding and or use that as a selling point,i will not play it,i do not want to play a game that is turned into nothing more than 24/7 raiding with chat spam ..WTS this and WTS that.NO thanks to that crap.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
While hardcore guilds tend to frown on people not having to much time there tend to be casual guilds as well and if they aren't common enough you just should create one of yourself.
Far too many of us oldschool players don't really have the time to play like it is 1999. But as long as you aren't in a hurry to reach max level there is nothing wrong with playing an hour now and then when you have time and maybe play a longer dungeon session weekends when you have more time to spend.
It is really not good to look on someone unenployed that just play all the time, just enjoy playing when you can and you'll be fine.
I think there will be plenty of more casual guilds and weekend active guilds, most oldschool fans are older now after all and have more things to deal with. There certainly will be some players that spend most of their awake time in game and trying to compete with them are useless unless you have the time and will to focus much of your life on a game.
I myslef have 3 days weekends and will probably play my share then but I work long hours otherwise and loads of overtime so it is unlikely I would play much if anything monday-thursday.
While hardcore guilds tend to frown on people not having to much time there tend to be casual guilds as well and if they aren't common enough you just should create one of yourself.
Far too many of us oldschool players don't really have the time to play like it is 1999. But as long as you aren't in a hurry to reach max level there is nothing wrong with playing an hour now and then when you have time and maybe play a longer dungeon session weekends when you have more time to spend.
It is really not good to look on someone unenployed that just play all the time, just enjoy playing when you can and you'll be fine.
I think there will be plenty of more casual guilds and weekend active guilds, most oldschool fans are older now after all and have more things to deal with. There certainly will be some players that spend most of their awake time in game and trying to compete with them are useless unless you have the time and will to focus much of your life on a game.
I myslef have 3 days weekends and will probably play my share then but I work long hours otherwise and loads of overtime so it is unlikely I would play much if anything monday-thursday.
I'm glad some understand what I'm saying about "block time players"
We are many, and responsible adults, that would like to play long and hard at times. If the social tools are their, an mmorpg like this can go far
This is a good story of a responsible adult to life too.
I personally don't like that they set expectations that players will be able to play for X hours and achieve Y - whatever Y may be. That kind of thing is far too subjective. In a virtual world, the only thing you should be able to expect is the unexpected. I've played games for 2 hours and gained levels, equipment, and other visible progress, but still felt pretty 'meh' about the experience.
Then again, I played EQ for an hour, traveled across some dangerous territory, made plans with some friends, got my character set up in a spot I wanted to camp on the weekend when I had more time, and logged out satisfied knowing that I made progress to something greater. Sometimes gratification must be deferred to make your achievement feel worthwhile.
To me, if a player needs some sort of tangible (virtually tangible) reward in a two hour period of time, they probably should seek a different form of entertainment; because if we can really expect to make serious gains in that timeframe in an mmorpg, progression is going to feel rather trite.
At least to me.
I think you make a good point. It has been so long since I had an evening of play just be preliminary to things I want to do another day, I had forgotten what that was like. Good times.
But I don't read them as promising that any specific goals can be achieved in any specified amount of time. I interpret it only to mean that if you log on and have just a couple of hours to play, perhaps also without the benefit of a group, your time needn't be completely wasted. There will still be a few baddies out in the woods you can try to whack (with the attendant risks), or some minor quests you might run (or get started on). But again, just because you have that opportunity doesn't mean it will all work out as planned.
It won't (I believe) be anything like WoW (modern WoW anyway) where in two hours you can do a ton of stuff, due to instant teleport everywhere, flying mounts, speed run dungeons, soft death penalty, a zillion daily quests, and on and on. Nor would I at least want it to be.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
That is kind of the disconnect some older generation players have (myself included) when wanting experiences to be similar to the past. In reality, most of us do not have the kind of time we used to 10+ years ago when some of these older titles were at their "peak." I mean, when I see some of these titles going back to "vanilla" stages, I'd probably want that too for FFXI but in reality its just not possible for me at least. I can't work myself around HNM schedules just so I can get some of the 'best' gear in game. I do get where the OP is coming from in this regard because some modern systems are great if done/managed better, like group finder tools and such. Keep in mind that a lot of people started to transition to other titles over the past 10-ish years due to time commitments. This cause development teams of older titles to 'dumb-down' their development styles to remain competitive with a changing market.
Wise post it seems. But I think another eleemnt is the industry got bigger--it added millions of players. This also dumbed it down a bit.
Frankly, I'm more friednly to people who don't have the time and can admit what you just admitted. Some can't or won't.
At end of day who cares really. Who should. Games are a patheitc race to the bottom. Just a n advanced waste of time.
The time spent on creating topics here and reading replies would be better spent on reading up the games you wish to play. Don't be lazy and expect others to give you cliff notes as reading up on the games you wish to play is part of the fun. Learn to do that yourself instead of asking others to help or shaming them into doing so. The knowledge you gain will be far more useful when you put that effort in.
Some nights I can manage 4 hours, assuming I don't get stuck in traffic on the way home from work. Some nights I cannot game at all. Some days I'm online 12+ hours (usually Sunday).
I used to do the hardcore raiding things: 40+ hours a week plus time soloing or grouping when I had a day off from my other job.
I cannot do that anymore. I'm not working 15 minutes from where I live, I have other commitments, I don't want to burn out again, etc.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do. Benjamin Franklin
The only time related issue I see is that one weekend you and your friends may be level 10, having a grand ole' time, and the next weekend they're level 30 telling you to catch up. If they can fix that issue while maintaining a sense of purpose for both low and higher level players, then total time is a non-issue.
You'll still have the people that only have 15 minutes to play trying to find a group, but that's ridiculous. Gaming is a leisure activity, and trying to force it in small increments is the reason cash shops and mobile games have such a large presence. As an example, you don't sit down to watch Braveheart when you know damn well that you have an appointment in a half an hour. You don't go hiking when you know damn well you need to be somewhere else in the time it takes you to get to the trail-head.
Lastly, I'm a true believer that content shouldn't be "everybody gets to ride this ride". Being in a top tier goal oriented guild should require a certain degree of dedication. If your goal is to slay a dragon, and you think that you should be able to achieve that by devoting 30 minutes a week, then you're either delusional or you're playing a game that has no sense of scale.
I could not agree more with this statement. MMORPGS need to stop trying to cater to the 15 a minute a week warriors. This is why MMORPGS are on the rocks. Now with that said I do not feel we need to go back to the 4 hour 5 night a week raid days of Vanilla WOW for games today because most of the gamers are older with kids. The key is to balance game play around 1 to 2 hours a night 4 to 5 days a week. Yes there should be content that takes hours to complete but being able to save progress we will not have issues if it takes weeks to complete content. Content that takes time is more important than speed gaming in MMORPGS. If people want Speed gaming MOBAs are more the genera for that.
When I personally only have 30 minutes to play I will play a game like TotalWar Warhammer or something I wouldnt try to run a Dungeon in a game because it cheapens the content.
Some nights I can manage 4 hours, assuming I don't get stuck in traffic on the way home from work. Some nights I cannot game at all. Some days I'm online 12+ hours (usually Sunday).
I used to do the hardcore raiding things: 40+ hours a week plus time soloing or grouping when I had a day off from my other job.
I cannot do that anymore. I'm not working 15 minutes from where I live, I have other commitments, I don't want to burn out again, etc.
I'm playing a single player game right now. - I came home from work feeling sick last night. - Now I have extra kids over my house, I barley have time to type this. - Tomorrow I'm counting on playing for hours like a mad man.
I'm a "block player"....... I think most responsible players are.
Pretty much me now in days... heck not even a block player anymore. I mean you try, but life 15 years later is just vastly different.
It's ironic, the older I get, the more I want a an MMORPG to have substantial single player content. Not easy to tell a raid, "Man... my son woke up neck deep in crap... hold 20..."
The time spent on creating topics here and reading replies would be better spent on reading up the games you wish to play. Don't be lazy and expect others to give you cliff notes as reading up on the games you wish to play is part of the fun. Learn to do that yourself instead of asking others to help or shaming them into doing so. The knowledge you gain will be far more useful when you put that effort in.
I'm sitting here thinking openly about what you say here.
Honestly your about 70% right, I should be reading more if I'm trying to hype a game that I feel strongly about..... I'm coming clean.
But I would like to talk about the other 30%. Pantheon has what, two more years before release ?
VR is giving us a lot of information. Rightly so, they're running a kickstarter campaign and trying to generate money. No one can fault them for that. Not only for early money, they do have passion and that's what will make this mmorpg stand out.
With this, I'm "absolutely convinced" very few are reading deeply into this game yet. I'll say it again 2 years !!!!
I have two VERY STRONG areas of concern !!! Both are NOT COVERED IN FAQ !!!
1) Coding - Watch the game play podcast. Look beyond the eye candy. It's plane to see it's a glitchey mess. Will it improve in two years ?....... I think so, I hope so !
2) Stigma - Pantheon has a MAJOR STIGMA attached to it. EVERYONE thinks this game is a "give up your life to play game". This includes every power poster on this site.
Unless you live in mom's basement, many are turned off unless it's for "time block players" too !!
Vanilla World of Warcraft was a game that could be played for 3 hours straight, then could be put aside for a few days, First Generation Everquest 1 was not.
@Kitarad This is between you and I........ I know what your thinking........ I failed at playing P1999, but I have time to type long winded post, am I right ?..........Guess what, you are right !!!
I'm a "time block player"...... I'm a "time block poster".
It's 3 am, I cant sleep, I have 3 hours before work. I have a "block of time now", will I have this tonight or tomorrow ?...... Absolutely not !
I'm speaking for 90% of the mmorpg population..... We can't commit to P1999, yet we have large blocks of time.
I do understand that you may have difficulty finding time to play a game like Project 1999 and I sincerely wish you the very best with your life. I also understand real life concerns are far more time consuming than playing a game and also take precedence over it.
I do however take exception to your pontificating on various games and using click bait titles that are deliberate attempts to condemn other games that people are playing and using this forum as your personal punching bag for the popularity of games that you dislike. This is unacceptable coming from you as you yourself have demonstrated your own limitations and yet feel it is your right as some elite gamer to berate others or write endlessly about the same nauseating topic you have rehashed many times already.
If this is what you find time to do I am hardly surprised you are unable to devote much time to the things you want to do as far as gaming goes. Games like Project 1999 are time consuming and you will not have the time for much else. You will also need to read up a lot about any game that has deep systems because they require a time commitment which you do not have the luxury for nor apparently willing to since you have squandered it thinking up new ways to frame old threads here.
You're totally entitled to spend your time as you see fit but the type of games you dream of playing need you to focus somewhat on them exclusively. That does not mean you need oodles of time to play daily just that any spare time you might have must be spent on learning about the game and maximizing the time available. In this regard you should practice and read up on any game you have interest in and not pick fights with people who have no wish to educate you on them.
In my opinion when Pantheon releases and if it is anything like Everquest it will require one to devote a substantial amount of their free time to gathering knowledge about the game. This will include a good understanding of the systems, workings of the game and classes, crafting and other aspects. While you may continue to badger people about these topics it would be to your own advantage to spend that time more fruitfully reading and gathering knowledge.
The reason I'm telling you this is because on the Project 1999 thread many people gave you links and explained things to you and suggested that you read up the links but from your subsequent posts it was very clear to me you had not bothered to do so. This is the attitude I have a problem with. I am perfectly willing to share my knowledge even if it is limited but I do get moderately annoyed when I sense that the person I'm trying to help has no interest in making any efforts of their own.
I know you're capable of it when there are scant resources to be had here as you have definitely done so while playing Gothic 3. Time spent wisely is far more effective than having lots of time to spend.
The time spent on creating topics here and reading replies would be better spent on reading up the games you wish to play. Don't be lazy and expect others to give you cliff notes as reading up on the games you wish to play is part of the fun. Learn to do that yourself instead of asking others to help or shaming them into doing so. The knowledge you gain will be far more useful when you put that effort in.
I'm sitting here thinking openly about what you say here.
Honestly your about 70% right, I should be reading more if I'm trying to hype a game that I feel strongly about..... I'm coming clean.
But I would like to talk about the other 30%. Pantheon has what, two more years before release ?
VR is giving us a lot of information. Rightly so, they're running a kickstarter campaign and trying to generate money. No one can fault them for that. Not only for early money, they do have passion and that's what will make this mmorpg stand out.
With this, I'm "absolutely convinced" very few are reading deeply into this game yet. I'll say it again 2 years !!!!
I have two VERY STRONG areas of concern !!! Both are NOT COVERED IN FAQ !!!
1) Coding - Watch the game play podcast. Look beyond the eye candy. It's plane to see it's a glitchey mess. Will it improve in two years ?....... I think so, I hope so !
2) Stigma - Pantheon has a MAJOR STIGMA attached to it. EVERYONE thinks this game is a "give up your life to play game". This includes every power poster on this site.
Unless you live in mom's basement, many are turned off unless it's for "time block players" too !!
Vanilla World of Warcraft was a game that could be played for 3 hours straight, then could be put aside for a few days, First Generation Everquest 1 was not.
@Kitarad This is between you and I........ I know what your thinking........ I failed at playing P1999, but I have time to type long winded post, am I right ?..........Guess what, you are right !!!
I'm a "time block player"...... I'm a "time block poster".
It's 3 am, I cant sleep, I have 3 hours before work. I have a "block of time now", will I have this tonight or tomorrow ?...... Absolutely not !
I'm speaking for 90% of the mmorpg population..... We can't commit to P1999, yet we have large blocks of time.
Let's hope Pantheon will be for us too
Vanilla WOW was nothing as you describe.. if you were in the 10% who were raiders.
Oh, there were large time blocks, outside of the raiding clock to gather materials, obtain resistance gear and farm gold for repairs to support raiding.
To borrow a phrase from the LOR movies, one does not just stroll into the Molten Core.
I joined a raiding guild that fit my real world schedule, with raids starting promptly at 8:30 PM ET. I was required to sit as a backup just outside the entrance and wait to fill in if someone had to leave early.
Took a month to earn a primary raid spot as the 6th Druid and start working my way up the rank ladder. (Made it to 3rd eventually)
Gear was handed out based on ranking, as a 6th the other 5 had to already have a set piece before I was given it.
Guild raided 5 night's a week until 12:30 am and I had to be there 4 nights a week, raid ready with all consumables to keep my slot.
My guess is EQ1 was similar, some groups raided, some camped with PUGS and some solo'd or multiboxed.
In DAOC multiboxing is how I played. Would first level up a strong soloing character and use it to powerlevel others. Wasnt as efficient as grouping but it let me play on my schedule.
If at all possible I'll multibox on Pantheon as I'm not a huge fan of grouping except with friends or good guildmates, PUGS are a no go anymore.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Vanilla World of Warcraft was a game that could be played for 3 hours straight, then could be put aside for a few days, First Generation Everquest 1 was not.
I played both games and neither required you to play every day unless maybe you were in some bleeding edge progression guild. If the concern is "getting behind" your friends, that would happen much more easily in WoW because character advancement was generally much faster in WoW.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
I do understand that you may have difficulty finding time to play a game like Project 1999 and I sincerely wish you the very best with your life. I also understand real life concerns are far more time consuming than playing a game and also take precedence over it.
I do however take exception to your pontificating on various games and using click bait titles that are deliberate attempts to condemn other games that people are playing and using this forum as your personal punching bag for the popularity of games that you dislike. This is unacceptable coming from you as you yourself have demonstrated your own limitations and yet feel it is your right as some elite gamer to berate others or write endlessly about the same nauseating topic you have rehashed many times already.
If this is what you find time to do I am hardly surprised you are unable to devote much time to the things you want to do as far as gaming goes. Games like Project 1999 are time consuming and you will not have the time for much else. You will also need to read up a lot about any game that has deep systems because they require a time commitment which you do not have the luxury for nor apparently willing to since you have squandered it thinking up new ways to frame old threads here.
You're totally entitled to spend your time as you see fit but the type of games you dream of playing need you to focus somewhat on them exclusively. That does not mean you need oodles of time to play daily just that any spare time you might have must be spent on learning about the game and maximizing the time available. In this regard you should practice and read up on any game you have interest in and not pick fights with people who have no wish to educate you on them.
In my opinion when Pantheon releases and if it is anything like Everquest it will require one to devote a substantial amount of their free time to gathering knowledge about the game. This will include a good understanding of the systems, workings of the game and classes, crafting and other aspects. While you may continue to badger people about these topics it would be to your own advantage to spend that time more fruitfully reading and gathering knowledge.
The reason I'm telling you this is because on the Project 1999 thread many people gave you links and explained things to you and suggested that you read up the links but from your subsequent posts it was very clear to me you had not bothered to do so. This is the attitude I have a problem with. I am perfectly willing to share my knowledge even if it is limited but I do get moderately annoyed when I sense that the person I'm trying to help has no interest in making any efforts of their own.
I know you're capable of it when there are scant resources to be had here as you have definitely done so while playing Gothic 3. Time spent wisely is far more effective than having lots of time to spend.
Ok.... Read it all.... Your right.... This hit home !!
I'll admit this knocked me back a peg or two.
With a small little defense I would just like to say this: My post are my strong beliefs... in my opinion I really think the majority feel cheated in the mmorpg department. When I make a post it's more often blunt and not aimed at anyone. However the aftermath throws me in defensive mode and causes a fight. I'll have to say I originally caused it AFTER READING THIS I can see that.
P1999...... My intent was genuine.... I was totally serious, I read every word you and several others typed. I read everything I could from message boards to every YouTube I could find. I actually understood how to play this game.
I actually got a character to level 6, with taking my time, trying to understand every action I did, I put a lot of time into it as funny as that may seem. I spent a lot of time chatting with people, they were very helpful, some even grouped to actually show me.
About this time I realized I don't think I could devote much time to get involved with so many wonderful people, only to let them down. I take mmorpg friends seriously, I don't like using people only to quit.
P1999 actually thought me something I'm a "block player", This is the first old old school game I ever played. You have to REALLY GET INVOLVED to get what this game has to offer.
I hope Pantheon is for block players too !
@kitarad I'll back way off on my crap. After all I did get my blunt point across several times over to the point it's sickening. I promise, you will see a change.
Vanilla World of Warcraft was a game that could be played for 3 hours straight, then could be put aside for a few days, First Generation Everquest 1 was not.
I played both games and neither required you to play every day unless maybe you were in some bleeding edge progression guild. If the concern is "getting behind" your friends, that would happen much more easily in WoW because character advancement was generally much faster in WoW.
I did not play EQ every day and I was able to hit cap prior to the first expansion. I was also part of a guild that had killed most contested raid bosses, though I was not able to be present for all of them. I found the vanilla WoW experience to actually be quite similar. Though I was able to often solo during leveling, it took a exponentially larger level of time devotion to get into the more exclusive content.
While people like to talk about rose colored glasses while looking back on EQ, what I find more often is a jaded misrepresentation of the actual game. It actually had something for everyone, as long as you didn't expect to see, do and achieve everything while playing casually.
Vanilla World of Warcraft was a game that could be played for 3 hours straight, then could be put aside for a few days, First Generation Everquest 1 was not.
I played both games and neither required you to play every day unless maybe you were in some bleeding edge progression guild. If the concern is "getting behind" your friends, that would happen much more easily in WoW because character advancement was generally much faster in WoW.
I did not play EQ every day and I was able to hit cap prior to the first expansion. I was also part of a guild that had killed most contested raid bosses, though I was not able to be present for all of them. I found the vanilla WoW experience to actually be quite similar. Though I was able to often solo during leveling, it took a exponentially larger level of time devotion to get into the more exclusive content.
While people like to talk about rose colored glasses while looking back on EQ, what I find more often is a jaded misrepresentation of the actual game. It actually had something for everyone, as long as you didn't expect to see, do and achieve everything while playing casually.
I thought about this today actually. I never played EQ1 extensively, that was FFXI for me. Same deal though, I probably only went to raid zones (sky, sea, etc) a handful of times and NEVER bothered with HNMS. Despite this I still had an amazing time playing, and when I DID jump into a raid with my Linkshell it felt that much more herculean/epic.
I have played and enjoyed modern MMOs and their raiding as well (Wildstar, ESO, FFXIV) but the heavy focus on raids being the end-all be-all content for which you absolutely MUST expedite the process of getting into them is why raid-logging (and game-hopping) is a thing for so many people.
I think people will find the time if the game is good enough. I would be willing to consolidate my time on certain evenings to do this. It would replace jumping around.
4) Want to be a block players but I barely have time to do it. Unless, I want to lose sleep all the time.
That's partly why I stay away from MMORPG's, I can't really put in the time to enjoy them, and they do not have innovation. Nonetheless, I love Delete5230's threads. The responses he gets are quite comical. I'm excited every time he makes a new discussion.
Cryomatrix
Catch me streaming at twitch.tv/cryomatrix You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
The time spent on creating topics here and reading replies would be better spent on reading up the games you wish to play. Don't be lazy and expect others to give you cliff notes as reading up on the games you wish to play is part of the fun. Learn to do that yourself instead of asking others to help or shaming them into doing so. The knowledge you gain will be far more useful when you put that effort in.
I'm sitting here thinking openly about what you say here.
Honestly your about 70% right, I should be reading more if I'm trying to hype a game that I feel strongly about..... I'm coming clean.
But I would like to talk about the other 30%. Pantheon has what, two more years before release ?
VR is giving us a lot of information. Rightly so, they're running a kickstarter campaign and trying to generate money. No one can fault them for that. Not only for early money, they do have passion and that's what will make this mmorpg stand out.
With this, I'm "absolutely convinced" very few are reading deeply into this game yet. I'll say it again 2 years !!!!
I have two VERY STRONG areas of concern !!! Both are NOT COVERED IN FAQ !!!
1) Coding - Watch the game play podcast. Look beyond the eye candy. It's plane to see it's a glitchey mess. Will it improve in two years ?....... I think so, I hope so !
2) Stigma - Pantheon has a MAJOR STIGMA attached to it. EVERYONE thinks this game is a "give up your life to play game". This includes every power poster on this site.
Unless you live in mom's basement, many are turned off unless it's for "time block players" too !!
Vanilla World of Warcraft was a game that could be played for 3 hours straight, then could be put aside for a few days, First Generation Everquest 1 was not.
@Kitarad This is between you and I........ I know what your thinking........ I failed at playing P1999, but I have time to type long winded post, am I right ?..........Guess what, you are right !!!
I'm a "time block player"...... I'm a "time block poster".
It's 3 am, I cant sleep, I have 3 hours before work. I have a "block of time now", will I have this tonight or tomorrow ?...... Absolutely not !
I'm speaking for 90% of the mmorpg population..... We can't commit to P1999, yet we have large blocks of time.
Let's hope Pantheon will be for us too
Vanilla WOW was nothing as you describe.. if you were in the 10% who were raiders.
Oh, there were large time blocks, outside of the raiding clock to gather materials, obtain resistance gear and farm gold for repairs to support raiding.
To borrow a phrase from the LOR movies, one does not just stroll into the Molten Core.
I joined a raiding guild that fit my real world schedule, with raids starting promptly at 8:30 PM ET. I was required to sit as a backup just outside the entrance and wait to fill in if someone had to leave early.
Took a month to earn a primary raid spot as the 6th Druid and start working my way up the rank ladder. (Made it to 3rd eventually)
Gear was handed out based on ranking, as a 6th the other 5 had to already have a set piece before I was given it.
Guild raided 5 night's a week until 12:30 am and I had to be there 4 nights a week, raid ready with all consumables to keep my slot.
My guess is EQ1 was similar, some groups raided, some camped with PUGS and some solo'd or multiboxed.
In DAOC multiboxing is how I played. Would first level up a strong soloing character and use it to powerlevel others. Wasnt as efficient as grouping but it let me play on my schedule.
If at all possible I'll multibox on Pantheon as I'm not a huge fan of grouping except with friends or good guildmates, PUGS are a no go anymore.
Y'know, if you are looking for group members that aren't simply additional sides of your own personality, there are a few of us regular posters here who play MMORPGs and like to group up.
4) Want to be a block players but I barely have time to do it. Unless, I want to lose sleep all the time.
That's partly why I stay away from MMORPG's, I can't really put in the time to enjoy them, and they do not have innovation. Nonetheless, I love Delete5230's threads. The responses he gets are quite comical. I'm excited every time he makes a new discussion.
Cryomatrix
I have the grace of a redneck in a red Ford pickup going to the hootenanny.
The time spent on creating topics here and reading replies would be better spent on reading up the games you wish to play. Don't be lazy and expect others to give you cliff notes as reading up on the games you wish to play is part of the fun. Learn to do that yourself instead of asking others to help or shaming them into doing so. The knowledge you gain will be far more useful when you put that effort in.
I'm sitting here thinking openly about what you say here.
Honestly your about 70% right, I should be reading more if I'm trying to hype a game that I feel strongly about..... I'm coming clean.
But I would like to talk about the other 30%. Pantheon has what, two more years before release ?
VR is giving us a lot of information. Rightly so, they're running a kickstarter campaign and trying to generate money. No one can fault them for that. Not only for early money, they do have passion and that's what will make this mmorpg stand out.
With this, I'm "absolutely convinced" very few are reading deeply into this game yet. I'll say it again 2 years !!!!
I have two VERY STRONG areas of concern !!! Both are NOT COVERED IN FAQ !!!
1) Coding - Watch the game play podcast. Look beyond the eye candy. It's plane to see it's a glitchey mess. Will it improve in two years ?....... I think so, I hope so !
2) Stigma - Pantheon has a MAJOR STIGMA attached to it. EVERYONE thinks this game is a "give up your life to play game". This includes every power poster on this site.
Unless you live in mom's basement, many are turned off unless it's for "time block players" too !!
Vanilla World of Warcraft was a game that could be played for 3 hours straight, then could be put aside for a few days, First Generation Everquest 1 was not.
@Kitarad This is between you and I........ I know what your thinking........ I failed at playing P1999, but I have time to type long winded post, am I right ?..........Guess what, you are right !!!
I'm a "time block player"...... I'm a "time block poster".
It's 3 am, I cant sleep, I have 3 hours before work. I have a "block of time now", will I have this tonight or tomorrow ?...... Absolutely not !
I'm speaking for 90% of the mmorpg population..... We can't commit to P1999, yet we have large blocks of time.
Let's hope Pantheon will be for us too
Vanilla WOW was nothing as you describe.. if you were in the 10% who were raiders.
Oh, there were large time blocks, outside of the raiding clock to gather materials, obtain resistance gear and farm gold for repairs to support raiding.
To borrow a phrase from the LOR movies, one does not just stroll into the Molten Core.
I joined a raiding guild that fit my real world schedule, with raids starting promptly at 8:30 PM ET. I was required to sit as a backup just outside the entrance and wait to fill in if someone had to leave early.
Took a month to earn a primary raid spot as the 6th Druid and start working my way up the rank ladder. (Made it to 3rd eventually)
Gear was handed out based on ranking, as a 6th the other 5 had to already have a set piece before I was given it.
Guild raided 5 night's a week until 12:30 am and I had to be there 4 nights a week, raid ready with all consumables to keep my slot.
My guess is EQ1 was similar, some groups raided, some camped with PUGS and some solo'd or multiboxed.
In DAOC multiboxing is how I played. Would first level up a strong soloing character and use it to powerlevel others. Wasnt as efficient as grouping but it let me play on my schedule.
If at all possible I'll multibox on Pantheon as I'm not a huge fan of grouping except with friends or good guildmates, PUGS are a no go anymore.
Y'know, if you are looking for group members that aren't simply additional sides of your own personality, there are a few of us regular posters here who play MMORPGs and like to group up.
Sure, besides at the speed this game is being developed at I might be retired by then and can play at any time I want.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Comments
Then again, I played EQ for an hour, traveled across some dangerous territory, made plans with some friends, got my character set up in a spot I wanted to camp on the weekend when I had more time, and logged out satisfied knowing that I made progress to something greater. Sometimes gratification must be deferred to make your achievement feel worthwhile.
To me, if a player needs some sort of tangible (virtually tangible) reward in a two hour period of time, they probably should seek a different form of entertainment; because if we can really expect to make serious gains in that timeframe in an mmorpg, progression is going to feel rather trite.
At least to me.
Just put him on ignore and move on like most people. He isn't worth your time. I haven't seen any of his posts in a long time but I see the responses. It is always more of the same.
Yeah yeah tired of hearing me mention FFXI but imo FFXi was an improvement on everything EQ1 did.Only surpassed by EQ2 because of graphics and housing.
Now what i am about to say is FACT,i been there,seen it ,it works.FFXi's sub class system allowed players with less play time to never fall behind for years because players always leveling subs or mains.
Most sad designs it is simply a RACE,then maybe some alts for crafting but always a race to be first to kill bosses.Even crafting was improved because with such a demanding system,often players would rather buy than work for it,so even noobs can be profitable.
"Grouping"although mostly true,again if looking at FFXI not entirely and not a restriction.What i like to see however,is if adding solo type classes,you should EARN them,work for them and not just handed to you.Example ,a pet class,not done like all OTHER games where the combined duo feels like one but like FFXI where a pet is likely even stronger than you or equal but feels like two players.
Where am i going with this?it is possible to keep most all types of players happy within reason while still maintaining a mostly grouping game.If classes are done really well,you can even get thinking players to turn duos into a near party .The trade off is SPEED,sure you can solo or duo but it is slower,grouping can and should offer faster killing and bonuses for faster killing because it also means you did a good job with your mages/healers resources,aka killing chains.
The other obvious is that grouping offers more buffs,more debuffs,there should be player to player combos to add more attack etc etc,sop grouping would ALWAYS be the best option but not the ONLY option.
If all people want is another EQ1,you are going to get same old but a not so good game by now a days standards.If Pantheon team's agenda is to attract Raiding and or use that as a selling point,i will not play it,i do not want to play a game that is turned into nothing more than 24/7 raiding with chat spam ..WTS this and WTS that.NO thanks to that crap.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Far too many of us oldschool players don't really have the time to play like it is 1999. But as long as you aren't in a hurry to reach max level there is nothing wrong with playing an hour now and then when you have time and maybe play a longer dungeon session weekends when you have more time to spend.
It is really not good to look on someone unenployed that just play all the time, just enjoy playing when you can and you'll be fine.
I think there will be plenty of more casual guilds and weekend active guilds, most oldschool fans are older now after all and have more things to deal with. There certainly will be some players that spend most of their awake time in game and trying to compete with them are useless unless you have the time and will to focus much of your life on a game.
I myslef have 3 days weekends and will probably play my share then but I work long hours otherwise and loads of overtime so it is unlikely I would play much if anything monday-thursday.
I'm glad some understand what I'm saying about "block time players"
We are many, and responsible adults, that would like to play long and hard at times. If the social tools are their, an mmorpg like this can go far
This is a good story of a responsible adult to life too.
And thanks for not saying refer to FAQ
But I don't read them as promising that any specific goals can be achieved in any specified amount of time. I interpret it only to mean that if you log on and have just a couple of hours to play, perhaps also without the benefit of a group, your time needn't be completely wasted. There will still be a few baddies out in the woods you can try to whack (with the attendant risks), or some minor quests you might run (or get started on). But again, just because you have that opportunity doesn't mean it will all work out as planned.
It won't (I believe) be anything like WoW (modern WoW anyway) where in two hours you can do a ton of stuff, due to instant teleport everywhere, flying mounts, speed run dungeons, soft death penalty, a zillion daily quests, and on and on. Nor would I at least want it to be.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Frankly, I'm more friednly to people who don't have the time and can admit what you just admitted. Some can't or won't.
At end of day who cares really. Who should. Games are a patheitc race to the bottom. Just a n advanced waste of time.
I am very much a "block player."
Some nights I can manage 4 hours, assuming I don't get stuck in traffic on the way home from work. Some nights I cannot game at all. Some days I'm online 12+ hours (usually Sunday).
I used to do the hardcore raiding things: 40+ hours a week plus time soloing or grouping when I had a day off from my other job.
I cannot do that anymore. I'm not working 15 minutes from where I live, I have other commitments, I don't want to burn out again, etc.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
When I personally only have 30 minutes to play I will play a game like TotalWar Warhammer or something I wouldnt try to run a Dungeon in a game because it cheapens the content.
I'm playing a single player game right now.
- I came home from work feeling sick last night.
- Now I have extra kids over my house, I barley have time to type this.
- Tomorrow I'm counting on playing for hours like a mad man.
I'm a "block player"....... I think most responsible players are.
It's ironic, the older I get, the more I want a an MMORPG to have substantial single player content. Not easy to tell a raid, "Man... my son woke up neck deep in crap... hold 20..."
I'm sitting here thinking openly about what you say here.
Honestly your about 70% right, I should be reading more if I'm trying to hype a game that I feel strongly about..... I'm coming clean.
But I would like to talk about the other 30%. Pantheon has what, two more years before release ?
VR is giving us a lot of information. Rightly so, they're running a kickstarter campaign and trying to generate money. No one can fault them for that. Not only for early money, they do have passion and that's what will make this mmorpg stand out.
With this, I'm "absolutely convinced" very few are reading deeply into this game yet. I'll say it again 2 years !!!!
I have two VERY STRONG areas of concern !!!
Both are NOT COVERED IN FAQ !!!
1) Coding - Watch the game play podcast. Look beyond the eye candy. It's plane to see it's a glitchey mess. Will it improve in two years ?....... I think so, I hope so !
2) Stigma - Pantheon has a MAJOR STIGMA attached to it.
EVERYONE thinks this game is a "give up your life to play game". This includes every power poster on this site.
Unless you live in mom's basement, many are turned off unless it's for "time block players" too !!
Vanilla World of Warcraft was a game that could be played for 3 hours straight, then could be put aside for a few days, First Generation Everquest 1 was not.
@Kitarad
This is between you and I........ I know what your thinking........ I failed at playing P1999, but I have time to type long winded post, am I right ?..........Guess what, you are right !!!
I'm a "time block player"...... I'm a "time block poster".
It's 3 am, I cant sleep, I have 3 hours before work. I have a "block of time now", will I have this tonight or tomorrow ?...... Absolutely not !
I'm speaking for 90% of the mmorpg population..... We can't commit to P1999, yet we have large blocks of time.
Let's hope Pantheon will be for us too
I do however take exception to your pontificating on various games and using click bait titles that are deliberate attempts to condemn other games that people are playing and using this forum as your personal punching bag for the popularity of games that you dislike. This is unacceptable coming from you as you yourself have demonstrated your own limitations and yet feel it is your right as some elite gamer to berate others or write endlessly about the same nauseating topic you have rehashed many times already.
If this is what you find time to do I am hardly surprised you are unable to devote much time to the things you want to do as far as gaming goes. Games like Project 1999 are time consuming and you will not have the time for much else. You will also need to read up a lot about any game that has deep systems because they require a time commitment which you do not have the luxury for nor apparently willing to since you have squandered it thinking up new ways to frame old threads here.
You're totally entitled to spend your time as you see fit but the type of games you dream of playing need you to focus somewhat on them exclusively. That does not mean you need oodles of time to play daily just that any spare time you might have must be spent on learning about the game and maximizing the time available. In this regard you should practice and read up on any game you have interest in and not pick fights with people who have no wish to educate you on them.
In my opinion when Pantheon releases and if it is anything like Everquest it will require one to devote a substantial amount of their free time to gathering knowledge about the game. This will include a good understanding of the systems, workings of the game and classes, crafting and other aspects. While you may continue to badger people about these topics it would be to your own advantage to spend that time more fruitfully reading and gathering knowledge.
The reason I'm telling you this is because on the Project 1999 thread many people gave you links and explained things to you and suggested that you read up the links but from your subsequent posts it was very clear to me you had not bothered to do so. This is the attitude I have a problem with. I am perfectly willing to share my knowledge even if it is limited but I do get moderately annoyed when I sense that the person I'm trying to help has no interest in making any efforts of their own.
I know you're capable of it when there are scant resources to be had here as you have definitely done so while playing Gothic 3. Time spent wisely is far more effective than having lots of time to spend.
Oh, there were large time blocks, outside of the raiding clock to gather materials, obtain resistance gear and farm gold for repairs to support raiding.
To borrow a phrase from the LOR movies, one does not just stroll into the Molten Core.
I joined a raiding guild that fit my real world schedule, with raids starting promptly at 8:30 PM ET. I was required to sit as a backup just outside the entrance and wait to fill in if someone had to leave early.
Took a month to earn a primary raid spot as the 6th Druid and start working my way up the rank ladder. (Made it to 3rd eventually)
Gear was handed out based on ranking, as a 6th the other 5 had to already have a set piece before I was given it.
Guild raided 5 night's a week until 12:30 am and I had to be there 4 nights a week, raid ready with all consumables to keep my slot.
My guess is EQ1 was similar, some groups raided, some camped with PUGS and some solo'd or multiboxed.
In DAOC multiboxing is how I played. Would first level up a strong soloing character and use it to powerlevel others. Wasnt as efficient as grouping but it let me play on my schedule.
If at all possible I'll multibox on Pantheon as I'm not a huge fan of grouping except with friends or good guildmates, PUGS are a no go anymore.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Ok.... Read it all.... Your right.... This hit home !!
I'll admit this knocked me back a peg or two.
With a small little defense I would just like to say this:
My post are my strong beliefs... in my opinion I really think the majority feel cheated in the mmorpg department. When I make a post it's more often blunt and not aimed at anyone. However the aftermath throws me in defensive mode and causes a fight. I'll have to say I originally caused it AFTER READING THIS I can see that.
P1999...... My intent was genuine.... I was totally serious, I read every word you and several others typed. I read everything I could from message boards to every YouTube I could find. I actually understood how to play this game.
I actually got a character to level 6, with taking my time, trying to understand every action I did, I put a lot of time into it as funny as that may seem. I spent a lot of time chatting with people, they were very helpful, some even grouped to actually show me.
About this time I realized I don't think I could devote much time to get involved with so many wonderful people, only to let them down. I take mmorpg friends seriously, I don't like using people only to quit.
P1999 actually thought me something I'm a "block player", This is the first old old school game I ever played. You have to REALLY GET INVOLVED to get what this game has to offer.
I hope Pantheon is for block players too !
@kitarad
I'll back way off on my crap.
After all I did get my blunt point across several times over to the point it's sickening.
I promise, you will see a change.
Soooo, I apologize
While people like to talk about rose colored glasses while looking back on EQ, what I find more often is a jaded misrepresentation of the actual game. It actually had something for everyone, as long as you didn't expect to see, do and achieve everything while playing casually.
I thought about this today actually. I never played EQ1 extensively, that was FFXI for me. Same deal though, I probably only went to raid zones (sky, sea, etc) a handful of times and NEVER bothered with HNMS. Despite this I still had an amazing time playing, and when I DID jump into a raid with my Linkshell it felt that much more herculean/epic.
I have played and enjoyed modern MMOs and their raiding as well (Wildstar, ESO, FFXIV) but the heavy focus on raids being the end-all be-all content for which you absolutely MUST expedite the process of getting into them is why raid-logging (and game-hopping) is a thing for so many people.
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
4) Want to be a block players but I barely have time to do it. Unless, I want to lose sleep all the time.
That's partly why I stay away from MMORPG's, I can't really put in the time to enjoy them, and they do not have innovation. Nonetheless, I love Delete5230's threads. The responses he gets are quite comical. I'm excited every time he makes a new discussion.
Cryomatrix
You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
Oh, the empires I'll build...
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon