So sick and tired of games being hyped up and talked about 5 years before they come out... This game is still 2 years away. "Targeting 2019" mean it could 12/31/2019. And thats just the target...
I have to say i agree Thunder .Then there's the we are gonna do something that no other game has done....
"we are aiming for something that nobody has been able to deliver on yet: a 1K player battle around a castle which maintains a playable FPS (30) on a decent, but not high-end, gamer rig."
It's the same old story every other MMO Throws out there. Then if the game actually releases the features aren't there or they are broken R.I.P as people leave and hop the next hype train .Why not use what we know works then develop the world ,lore ,classes do some newer things on smaller scales .Optimize the game engine make it run on a decent-average store bought PC cause the eye candy crowd will only stick around till the next shiny comes out the they move on .There's a reason some of the old MMO are still around and still have people playing them most definitely not the numbers of their glory days but enough to keep them up and keep content coming out and people buying it .
So you don't like innovation that allows new types of games to enter the market that no large developer would ever attempt to do? If clones of clones is your liking then you can stick with the 90% of the market dominated by game factories with the only intent of padding the CEOs pockets. Did you know that an EA CEO makes more in one month than than the 7.5 million investment this small company got in order to make a new type of game never seen before? They are money factories and the antithesis of innovators.
This is a big win for a small developer trying to offer variety within the market yet people still find time to complain using conjecture ... conjecture because the engine already runs large scale battles and no features are being scrubbed from CU unlike many other games out there. In a market filled with companies like EA throwing out games with less and less content, pay walls to already included content, full migration toward RMT pay models and aggressive absorption of market competitors ... you find time to bitch about small business innovation attempts.
You guys need to rethink your complaints. Many games took 5-6 years to develop in the past. We didn't hear about them because companies kept it internal until open testing neared. Crowd funded games are more open book so we can follow them from day 1. Small business has always been risky but the foundation of a market economy used to nurture it. Not anymore and you seem to support further destruction of it.
The only difference is perspective. Would you guys have complained when UO and EQ was in development? Nobody pushed the boundaries of what could be done massively online prior. You'd be happy sticking with single player games or 2d coop or even MUDs because it's proven tech of the time? Your logic baffles me.
I'm pretty confident that my patience will be rewarded in the end. Thanks for taking the time to do this interview and many thanks to Mark for participating.
Who cares? The game doesn't look like it has anything that will keep me interested. Its not really innovative at all.
That's a bummer, it was noted in their original founding principles document that you were their sole target player audience. I'm not sure what they are going to do with all those $millions now, kind of a waste.
Who cares? The game doesn't look like it has anything that will keep me interested. Its not really innovative at all.
That's a bummer, it was noted in their original founding principles document that you were their sole target player audience. I'm not sure what they are going to do with all those $millions now, kind of a waste.
CU is like a laundry list of new ideas never seen/done before even within the genre it is targeting ... but "not really innovative at all". lol
The guy is persistent in his ignorance and dislike of the game, I'll give him that.
I need to see that long list of RvR games with 1000+ player siege battles against constructable/destructible buildings using full server side physics on everything in game, moving land masses, multi-hit box damage and healing, real character animation combat, dedicated crafting class with SWG style crafting complexity, dedicated non-direct combat scout class, small through massive group size guild-like social mechanics, integrated Discord communications, fully cloud based server scaling, visually reactive player gear and interactive, custom built spells and combo system using the physics engine, advancement through realm contribution and not individual xp kill/questing, on the fly world environments updating reactively to seasons and faction control changes, furthest draw range of any game, a massive living, changing faction conflict dungeon where dead players can possess monsters to help rid their enemy's control over it, around 30 classes at launch ... *DEEP BREATH* ... hell good enough for now.
List the clones so I can go check them out asap and play!
If Mark Jacobs couldn't even figure out a reasonable place to found the studio and come up with an even remotely accurate timeline for the game's development, what makes you guys think he'll get anything else right?
If Mark Jacobs couldn't even figure out a reasonable place to found the studio and come up with an even remotely accurate timeline for the game's development, what makes you guys think he'll get anything else right?
Faith. "They want to believe" because the alternative is an oblivion of endlessly boring MMOs.
Besides, the best game is always the upcoming one you've never played, before disillusionment sets in.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
If Mark Jacobs couldn't even figure out a reasonable place to found the studio and come up with an even remotely accurate timeline for the game's development, what makes you guys think he'll get anything else right?
Faith. "They want to believe" because the alternative is an oblivion of endlessly boring MMOs.
Besides, the best game is always the upcoming one you've never played, before disillusionment sets in.
It's not like that hasn't always been the case. The difference is that in the old days we were usually following a few crumbs of detail from games that were definitely going to release at some point.
Now we're flooded with too much detail about games so that some people act as if they already exist. That and the fact that they may or may not eventually launch spices things up to the point that development watching plays like a long running TV series where you're trying to guess if Jon Snow, Daenerys and Tyrion are going to survive to the end
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
If Mark Jacobs couldn't even figure out a reasonable place to found the studio and come up with an even remotely accurate timeline for the game's development, what makes you guys think he'll get anything else right?
Faith. "They want to believe" because the alternative is an oblivion of endlessly boring MMOs.
Besides, the best game is always the upcoming one you've never played, before disillusionment sets in.
It's not like that hasn't always been the case. The difference is that in the old days we were usually following a few crumbs of detail from games that were definitely going to release at some point.
Now we're flooded with too much detail about games so that some people act as if they already exist. That and the fact that they may or may not eventually launch spices things up to the point that development watching plays like a long running TV series where you're trying to guess if Jon Snow, Daenerys and Tyrion are going to survive to the end
Don't ignore the failure rate of projects pre-KS days. Not every game was guaranteed. The ability for small companies to gain funding today is largely blocked by the dominant market share and business strategy of large companies. KS is a reflection of that. It came about as a necessity, not as a preferred alternative. How successful a KS project is based on how simple it is and mmorpgs are not simply nor cheap.
This is the point behind the importance of the this investment news. It is a small company earning a better chance to finish their project in a business environment built to ensure they fail. Don't confuse people's excitement for the CHANCE of a game being made over thinking it's a guarantee. I make no such claims nor predictions and never have. Not once have I ever said CU will be fun if ever completed. That is, and only should be, based on experience playing it and the game hasn't reached the point where I can make that determination yet. I only suggest it could be. This is called critical thinking ... analysis of current fact which still leaves room for interest and excitement.
Instead of all the prophetic talk of the future which both sides of the argument seems to harp on we could instead intelligently discuss the real issues facing indie development. I have an extremely low opinion of conjectural arguments ... it is opposite of critical thinking even though these people often claim it is. What I see are people scared to invest interest which is a often sign of insecurity and ignorance.
Why is this investment exciting? Because it's a sign small businesses can still functionally exist within an environment constructed to choke them out. If 1st gen MMORPGs faced this issue back in the day the genre would not have ever existed. The game the backers backed (and this has NEVER been about anyone else who hasn't any interest in the game) gets a chance to be completed successfully which OF COURSE should be exciting for them.
CU is also going for a very deep combat system that should be much more engaging long term......
What exactly do you mean by that? I haven't been paying any attention to this game at all.
When you say a" very deep combat system" do you mean lots and lots of abilities to use during fights. Like, you have 10 different hot bars each with 10 abilities/spells/combat moves to choose from? If that is what you mean I think it would run the risk of overcomplicating things to the point that it detracts from the fun. Or.....players would end up focusing on the handful of most effective abilities and mostly ignore all the others.
I am sincerely asking because I don't know. One thing that is obvious, however, is that this game will live or die by how much people enjoy the PvP combat. Fighting in these large Realm versus Realm PvP battles needs to actually be fun or the game is doomed. If it feels tedious or like a chore you have to do the game is doomed. If it feels like some kind of cluster fuck mess where everything happens so fast and chaotically in a big crowd of people so that most of the time you can't even tell if you're accomplishing anything...the game is doomed.
Can they make it fun? I don't know. Since I haven't been following this game I'm not even sure if I care. But that is what it all hinges on for this game.
When will a test server be available 24/7? Put whatever name you want on it, I just want to play...rrrr, test....when I have time available.
I have no idea actually. Likely increasing up time once real beta stages start. I believe I heard Mark say that this money influx will indeed help pay server costs for longer testing periods.
Beta announcement is coming soon but I'd imagine real beta 1 is a bit of a wait. They do a have a new producer getting up to speed right now and a community manager who will both oversee Beta likely in order to free up Mark and limit the crazy multi-role jobs a few of their staff have been doing for months.
I may pop into the current siege testing but Beta has always been my interest and I'm not hyping yet for it until I hear Mark say it's weeks away and not months.
Who cares? The game doesn't look like it has anything that will keep me interested. Its not really innovative at all.
It's not innovate in the sense that it has big anime titties, a new form of action combat, or new murderhobo mechnaics. But creating an engine that can support hundreds of players in the same vicinity at once with reasonable fps and can have huge player draw distances is a pretty big deal for mmos.
I feel like we hear this same thing every year from this project. I'm glad I've never bothered to get suckered into Kickstarters. I was intrigued by this when it was initially announced, but I dunno man. Seems like there may have been a better/more efficient way to do this.
I feel like we hear this same thing every year from this project. I'm glad I've never bothered to get suckered into Kickstarters. I was intrigued by this when it was initially announced, but I dunno man. Seems like there may have been a better/more efficient way to do this.
Well sure, "someone" could have given Mark $150M at the start so he could "get the band back together" (rehire a bunch of former DAOC devs) and let Mark relocate his home / studio to Austin or something.
But that isn't the way the world works....well unless you are Chris Roberts it seems.
Wait, SC is in the same place, even with all the extra money....so I dunno.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
This is THE GAME for me. I and my wife are x 12 year DAOC vets.I cannot wait to help with testing and onto the beginning of an unending war. Congratulations Mark on securing and taking the leap and accelerating the development of our new home and the realization of your dream.
Since nobody wanted to answer my question I went and looked around on their official site. After a short time there I remembered why I wasn't interested in this game.
They are going for very complicated character building but with no way to respec. Or maybe some very limited and difficult to get respecs.
You know, at first when I was reading through that stuff it almost sounded fun. Sort of like building a deck with Magic cards which I really did enjoy doing. But the problem is that it would be like building a Magic deck when you only get a few cards a week to choose from; you aren't told just exactly how all the cards will interact with each other; It will take months to finish building your deck, and after it's done you're stuck with it and can't make any changes.....ever.
Yeah....no thanks. Also, I got the very distinct impression that they are so focused on their convoluted character building system that they are probably forgetting that the actual combat itself needs to be fun. Ok guys, so you have this really complex character building stuff but when a player takes his character out into the battlefield to fight--is that part fun?
I feel like we hear this same thing every year from this project. I'm glad I've never bothered to get suckered into Kickstarters. I was intrigued by this when it was initially announced, but I dunno man. Seems like there may have been a better/more efficient way to do this.
Well sure, "someone" could have given Mark $150M at the start so he could "get the band back together" (rehire a bunch of former DAOC devs) and let Mark relocate his home / studio to Austin or something.
But that isn't the way the world works....well unless you are Chris Roberts it seems.
Wait, SC is in the same place, even with all the extra money....so I dunno.
If I give you 150m, will you move to Austin with me?
Frustrations aside, Mark is the only the one I was always sure he could finish his project. With others, I was just taking risks, and I don't regret anyone of them. You lose some, you win some, that's life.
I have to say Ashes of Creation has also proved they know what they are doing so far. I didn't back them because I was in my waiting for my seeds to grow seed. But now I think I'll support them anyways.
Constantine, The Console Poster
"One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
Since nobody wanted to answer my question I went and looked around on their official site. After a short time there I remembered why I wasn't interested in this game.
They are going for very complicated character building but with no way to respec. Or maybe some very limited and difficult to get respecs.
You know, at first when I was reading through that stuff it almost sounded fun. Sort of like building a deck with Magic cards which I really did enjoy doing. But the problem is that it would be like building a Magic deck when you only get a few cards a week to choose from; you aren't told just exactly how all the cards will interact with each other; It will take months to finish building your deck, and after it's done you're stuck with it and can't make any changes.....ever.
Yeah....no thanks. Also, I got the very distinct impression that they are so focused on their convoluted character building system that they are probably forgetting that the actual combat itself needs to be fun. Ok guys, so you have this really complex character building stuff but when a player takes his character out into the battlefield to fight--is that part fun?
If that is what you got from their site, there might be some mistakes printed there. The streams and forums and other ways of communications should be more reliable. The idea behind character progression is that you pick a class and a race at start, that part is very important because race selection is not just aesthetical but also functional (a Gargoyle is weaker to crushing damage because he's made of stone but more resistant to cutting for instance). That choice is the hard one and I would agree to call it not respec-friendly. The rest however is all open to you, all abilities can be levelled up if you have the time. One part I am not sure about so I would like someone else to pitch in on this: while statistics are a way for the character to unlock different gear you can still adapt these stats by "using" them. You can tailor your character to whatever spec you want to use, it's just can't be swapped instantly. It takes a long time as you pointed out, but you are not stuck with one "build" at the end.
On a side note: can you please tell me what parts of the site you read, which articles and/or videos you watched to get that impression? If one potential customer gets that idea it means that they might have to be revisited and I would like to point it out to them.
Comments
How about you toss a bone to those of us KS backers who have hung in there and give us some additional Founders Points!
Also- Is gifting available yet?
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
So you don't like innovation that allows new types of games to enter the market that no large developer would ever attempt to do? If clones of clones is your liking then you can stick with the 90% of the market dominated by game factories with the only intent of padding the CEOs pockets. Did you know that an EA CEO makes more in one month than than the 7.5 million investment this small company got in order to make a new type of game never seen before? They are money factories and the antithesis of innovators.
This is a big win for a small developer trying to offer variety within the market yet people still find time to complain using conjecture ... conjecture because the engine already runs large scale battles and no features are being scrubbed from CU unlike many other games out there. In a market filled with companies like EA throwing out games with less and less content, pay walls to already included content, full migration toward RMT pay models and aggressive absorption of market competitors ... you find time to bitch about small business innovation attempts.
You guys need to rethink your complaints. Many games took 5-6 years to develop in the past. We didn't hear about them because companies kept it internal until open testing neared. Crowd funded games are more open book so we can follow them from day 1. Small business has always been risky but the foundation of a market economy used to nurture it. Not anymore and you seem to support further destruction of it.
The only difference is perspective. Would you guys have complained when UO and EQ was in development? Nobody pushed the boundaries of what could be done massively online prior. You'd be happy sticking with single player games or 2d coop or even MUDs because it's proven tech of the time? Your logic baffles me.
You stay sassy!
This is a big win for MMO's.
Nanulak
The guy is persistent in his ignorance and dislike of the game, I'll give him that.
I need to see that long list of RvR games with 1000+ player siege battles against constructable/destructible buildings using full server side physics on everything in game, moving land masses, multi-hit box damage and healing, real character animation combat, dedicated crafting class with SWG style crafting complexity, dedicated non-direct combat scout class, small through massive group size guild-like social mechanics, integrated Discord communications, fully cloud based server scaling, visually reactive player gear and interactive, custom built spells and combo system using the physics engine, advancement through realm contribution and not individual xp kill/questing, on the fly world environments updating reactively to seasons and faction control changes, furthest draw range of any game, a massive living, changing faction conflict dungeon where dead players can possess monsters to help rid their enemy's control over it, around 30 classes at launch ... *DEEP BREATH* ... hell good enough for now.
List the clones so I can go check them out asap and play!
You stay sassy!
Besides, the best game is always the upcoming one you've never played, before disillusionment sets in.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Now we're flooded with too much detail about games so that some people act as if they already exist. That and the fact that they may or may not eventually launch spices things up to the point that development watching plays like a long running TV series where you're trying to guess if Jon Snow, Daenerys and Tyrion are going to survive to the end
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
This is the point behind the importance of the this investment news. It is a small company earning a better chance to finish their project in a business environment built to ensure they fail. Don't confuse people's excitement for the CHANCE of a game being made over thinking it's a guarantee. I make no such claims nor predictions and never have. Not once have I ever said CU will be fun if ever completed. That is, and only should be, based on experience playing it and the game hasn't reached the point where I can make that determination yet. I only suggest it could be. This is called critical thinking ... analysis of current fact which still leaves room for interest and excitement.
Instead of all the prophetic talk of the future which both sides of the argument seems to harp on we could instead intelligently discuss the real issues facing indie development. I have an extremely low opinion of conjectural arguments ... it is opposite of critical thinking even though these people often claim it is. What I see are people scared to invest interest which is a often sign of insecurity and ignorance.
Why is this investment exciting? Because it's a sign small businesses can still functionally exist within an environment constructed to choke them out. If 1st gen MMORPGs faced this issue back in the day the genre would not have ever existed. The game the backers backed (and this has NEVER been about anyone else who hasn't any interest in the game) gets a chance to be completed successfully which OF COURSE should be exciting for them.
You stay sassy!
No, clearly YOU'RE wrong.
What exactly do you mean by that? I haven't been paying any attention to this game at all.
When you say a" very deep combat system" do you mean lots and lots of abilities to use during fights. Like, you have 10 different hot bars each with 10 abilities/spells/combat moves to choose from? If that is what you mean I think it would run the risk of overcomplicating things to the point that it detracts from the fun. Or.....players would end up focusing on the handful of most effective abilities and mostly ignore all the others.
I am sincerely asking because I don't know. One thing that is obvious, however, is that this game will live or die by how much people enjoy the PvP combat. Fighting in these large Realm versus Realm PvP battles needs to actually be fun or the game is doomed. If it feels tedious or like a chore you have to do the game is doomed. If it feels like some kind of cluster fuck mess where everything happens so fast and chaotically in a big crowd of people so that most of the time you can't even tell if you're accomplishing anything...the game is doomed.
Can they make it fun? I don't know. Since I haven't been following this game I'm not even sure if I care. But that is what it all hinges on for this game.
why would someone use gold in pvp?
gold weapons suck
"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"
Beta announcement is coming soon but I'd imagine real beta 1 is a bit of a wait. They do a have a new producer getting up to speed right now and a community manager who will both oversee Beta likely in order to free up Mark and limit the crazy multi-role jobs a few of their staff have been doing for months.
I may pop into the current siege testing but Beta has always been my interest and I'm not hyping yet for it until I hear Mark say it's weeks away and not months.
You stay sassy!
It's not innovate in the sense that it has big anime titties, a new form of action combat, or new murderhobo mechnaics. But creating an engine that can support hundreds of players in the same vicinity at once with reasonable fps and can have huge player draw distances is a pretty big deal for mmos.
But that isn't the way the world works....well unless you are Chris Roberts it seems.
Wait, SC is in the same place, even with all the extra money....so I dunno.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Since nobody wanted to answer my question I went and looked around on their official site. After a short time there I remembered why I wasn't interested in this game.
They are going for very complicated character building but with no way to respec. Or maybe some very limited and difficult to get respecs.
You know, at first when I was reading through that stuff it almost sounded fun. Sort of like building a deck with Magic cards which I really did enjoy doing. But the problem is that it would be like building a Magic deck when you only get a few cards a week to choose from; you aren't told just exactly how all the cards will interact with each other; It will take months to finish building your deck, and after it's done you're stuck with it and can't make any changes.....ever.
Yeah....no thanks. Also, I got the very distinct impression that they are so focused on their convoluted character building system that they are probably forgetting that the actual combat itself needs to be fun. Ok guys, so you have this really complex character building stuff but when a player takes his character out into the battlefield to fight--is that part fun?
Frustrations aside, Mark is the only the one I was always sure he could finish his project. With others, I was just taking risks, and I don't regret anyone of them. You lose some, you win some, that's life.
I have to say Ashes of Creation has also proved they know what they are doing so far. I didn't back them because I was in my waiting for my seeds to grow seed. But now I think I'll support them anyways.
The idea behind character progression is that you pick a class and a race at start, that part is very important because race selection is not just aesthetical but also functional (a Gargoyle is weaker to crushing damage because he's made of stone but more resistant to cutting for instance). That choice is the hard one and I would agree to call it not respec-friendly.
The rest however is all open to you, all abilities can be levelled up if you have the time. One part I am not sure about so I would like someone else to pitch in on this: while statistics are a way for the character to unlock different gear you can still adapt these stats by "using" them. You can tailor your character to whatever spec you want to use, it's just can't be swapped instantly. It takes a long time as you pointed out, but you are not stuck with one "build" at the end.
On a side note: can you please tell me what parts of the site you read, which articles and/or videos you watched to get that impression? If one potential customer gets that idea it means that they might have to be revisited and I would like to point it out to them.