Project Gorgon has launched on Steam for $40 ($30 on sale)

MightyUnclean

Project Gorgon has launched on Steam.  Max players so far has been 121 per the Steam Charts.  The price is $40, currently $30 on sale.  This seems pretty pricey to me, considering the niche nature of the game.  What do you guys think?  Are they scaring people away with this pricing?

Finvega

Maybe, but this is pretty much a one man show for a dev team and the dude needs to eat. Think of all of the over-priced games we've bought before were the money goes to wasteful company management. Citan has been at this for a few years now on his own (for the most part).

Thebeasttt

The vast majority wouldn't even play this for free, let alone for $40. I like how their promotional video is all "from the minds that brought you Star Trek Online and Everquest 2." Those games were legit awful. Like seriously who funds these people?

Hawkster

I have to disagree, I liked EQ2.  Not sure I want to fork of 40 bucks for pre-access though.  Wish him the best, and if it does improve, I may give it a shot

sgel

Thebeasttt said:

The vast majority wouldn't even play this for free, let alone for $40. I like how their promotional video is all "from the minds that brought you Star Trek Online and Everquest 2." Those games were legit awful. Like seriously who funds these people?

I did.
I never liked STO or EQ2 but I tried the free version of Project Gorgon and really liked it... so I bought it.

The dev is passionate about it and the game has a lot of cool ideas.

Myrdynn

jeez I played this for a couple years off and on, donated a bit, but damned if I would pay 40$ to play a game that looks worse than Asheron's Call, when I can just play on the AC Emulators

MightyUnclean

The game seems very innovative, but so many people have been burned by early access games in the past few years...I'm just thinking they would have gotten a lot more interest if it was $15-20.

Tiller

lol I thought this was a free game. I was wondering how they would fund it to be honest. Still it seems a bit steep.  Also is this thing always going to be called Project: Gorgon?

MightyUnclean

Tiller said:

lol I thought this was a free game. I was wondering how they would fund it to be honest. Still it seems a bit steep.  Also is this thing always going to be called Project: Gorgon?

Not the best name, but at least it's not super generic, like what they did with Legends of Aria.

Tiller

MightyUnclean said:

Tiller said:

lol I thought this was a free game. I was wondering how they would fund it to be honest. Still it seems a bit steep.  Also is this thing always going to be called Project: Gorgon?

Not the best name, but at least it's not super generic, like what they did with Legends of Aria.

Yeah;  either way I like what they are trying to do with this game and I actually hope they succeed at it, but they should have started lower on the price then worked up.

Smoey

I know graphics aren't everything but this is just silly. DAoC at release had more appeal than the visuals displayed here and that was released 17 years ago.

MightyUnclean

My fear with the game is what I fear for most indie, crowdfunded MMOs:  That they'll never get a decent player base, will die an early death, and that the time I put into them will be "wasted."

LacedOpium

MightyUnclean said:

Project Gorgon has launched on Steam.  Max players so far has been 121 per the Steam Charts.  The price is $40, currently $30 on sale.  This seems pretty pricey to me, considering the niche nature of the game.  What do you guys think?  Are they scaring people away with this pricing?

You think?

121 players huh?

I mentioned as much in this thread ...

https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/472227/steam-launch-day-coming-on-march-13th-project-gorgon-news#latest

and got the usual push back.

I figured time would tell.  What I didn't figure on was that time being one day.

azarhal

MightyUnclean said:

My fear with the game is what I fear for most indie, crowdfunded MMOs:  That they'll never get a decent player base, will die an early death, and that the time I put into them will be "wasted."

All the time you put in games is wasted. It's a time killer hobbies not productive hobbies like painting or gardening.

Kajidourden

Torval said:

LacedOpium said:

MightyUnclean said:

Project Gorgon has launched on Steam.  Max players so far has been 121 per the Steam Charts.  The price is $40, currently $30 on sale.  This seems pretty pricey to me, considering the niche nature of the game.  What do you guys think?  Are they scaring people away with this pricing?

You think?

121 players huh?

I mentioned as much in this thread ...

https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/472227/steam-launch-day-coming-on-march-13th-project-gorgon-news#latest

and got the usual push back.

I figured time would tell.  What I didn't figure on was that time being one day.

It's better for games to fail and close than for people to play cheap. The entry fee for MMOs needs to go up so people who won't pay for games go leech somewhere else.

Way to show support for devs who make games the way you want them to be made.

You realize your logic is incredibly flawed right?  Nobody will make games the way you want if they continue to financially fail.

Panther2103

Torval said:

LacedOpium said:

MightyUnclean said:

Project Gorgon has launched on Steam.  Max players so far has been 121 per the Steam Charts.  The price is $40, currently $30 on sale.  This seems pretty pricey to me, considering the niche nature of the game.  What do you guys think?  Are they scaring people away with this pricing?

You think?

121 players huh?

I mentioned as much in this thread ...

https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/472227/steam-launch-day-coming-on-march-13th-project-gorgon-news#latest

and got the usual push back.

I figured time would tell.  What I didn't figure on was that time being one day.

It's better for games to fail and close than for people to play cheap. The entry fee for MMOs needs to go up so people who won't pay for games go leech somewhere else.

I agree with this statement. 

But at the same time I don't consider this a fail. Getting that many people with a box price on an early access indie MMORPG that isn't catering to a mass audience, is quite good. Especially without any advertising or anything. 

When it was free to play and download I think I would see a max of maybe 40 players, so 120 on at a time is a lot better. 

As long as there are people to play with I'm going to have fun on it. Plus who knows what will happen once the game actually releases in a year (or whenever they decide it's fully released) and isn't in early access.

MaxBacon

It's always the "graphics dun matter, gameplay everytim!", but when MMO's that are strong in gameplay mechanic focus but with visuals decades old release you see the games do not captivate interest, if they don't fail they'll always keep in the lower-end.

I kinda see the same happening with Phanteon, I'm not sure why they can't have both, it's like they have to sacrifice one entire aspect to be good at the other. o.o

Sovrath

I don't think it's pricey at all. Especially if the game is to succeed.

Years ago I was speaking with a Cellist in the area who taught at a local university. He taught students but in reality was so busy with students and then finding students who then quit, he didn't have time for his career.

His old teacher said to him "raise your rates". He responded with his concern that it would drive students away.

"No" said his teacher, "all the students who are serious and recognize the value in what you offer (I believe he also played in the Boston Symphony so that was his level) will gladly pay the amount and they will the the serious students so they will stay much longer. All the students who aren't serious will leave.

You will have less students but more money and more time and you won't have to worry about always finding new students."

And that teacher was right. It worked better than good.


People will always pay for things that they find of value. Those people who don't want to pay or don't want to pay "that much" aren't that serious and will move on anyway.

So good on them!

Sovrath

Nyctelios said:

I just don't get it why in depth games lacks design and polishment. It like they aim to be ugly and have bad UI. I really don't get it.

Because they "don't - have - the money"

It seems there is a disconnect between "deep games" and the large audiences who want to play "fun games" and don't want to level up "shoveling" or some such thing. Nothing wrong with that, it is what it is.

MaxBacon

Sovrath said:

I don't think it's pricey at all. Especially if the game is to succeed.

It is complex, at least it's not a crazy move like adding a SUB to one Indie MMO, things that I have really strong doubts can work out for DU or AoC, but still pushes back a lot of interest the game could captivate, this is the indie dilemma but in proper terms the bet success on earnings shows to be F2P with microtransactions.

Sovrath

Myrdynn said:

jeez I played this for a couple years off and on, donated a bit, but damned if I would pay 40$ to play a game that looks worse than Asheron's Call, when I can just play on the AC Emulators

This looks much better than Asheron's call.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KB0XyiJ79m8

LacedOpium

Torval said:

LacedOpium said:

MightyUnclean said:

Project Gorgon has launched on Steam.  Max players so far has been 121 per the Steam Charts.  The price is $40, currently $30 on sale.  This seems pretty pricey to me, considering the niche nature of the game.  What do you guys think?  Are they scaring people away with this pricing?

You think?

121 players huh?

I mentioned as much in this thread ...

https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/472227/steam-launch-day-coming-on-march-13th-project-gorgon-news#latest

and got the usual push back.

I figured time would tell.  What I didn't figure on was that time being one day.

It's better for games to fail and close than for people to play cheap. The entry fee for MMOs needs to go up so people who won't pay for games go leech somewhere else.

While I am certainly no fan of "leechers," or F2P games in general, there is a reason why the F2P business model is the predominant operating model for 99% of MMOs on the market today.  As alluded to by me in that thread, a gaming population is a valuable limited asset resource for any MMO.  Without a gaming population, an MMO simply ceases to exist.  Its a difficult dynamic to balance for sure, but so long as your game is garnering a profit, however small, even a majority "leecher" gaming population is not only necessary, but preferable, to a failed business venture. 

You, of course, should not have to submit to a F2P model, particularly if your game does not feature a cash shop, but if you don't youed be well advised to structure your business model in a manner that has the potential to "encourage" population growth, Ie., a welcoming free trial introductory offer.  The F2P "leecher" presence in MMOs is a necessity that is as valuable, important, and integral to the MMO industry, as the games themselves.  Developers/producers who fail to acknowledge this reality are doomed to failure.  

  

MadFrenchie

LacedOpium said:

Torval said:

LacedOpium said:

MightyUnclean said:

Project Gorgon has launched on Steam.  Max players so far has been 121 per the Steam Charts.  The price is $40, currently $30 on sale.  This seems pretty pricey to me, considering the niche nature of the game.  What do you guys think?  Are they scaring people away with this pricing?

You think?

121 players huh?

I mentioned as much in this thread ...

https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/472227/steam-launch-day-coming-on-march-13th-project-gorgon-news#latest

and got the usual push back.

I figured time would tell.  What I didn't figure on was that time being one day.

It's better for games to fail and close than for people to play cheap. The entry fee for MMOs needs to go up so people who won't pay for games go leech somewhere else.

While I am certainly no fan of "leechers," or F2P games in general, there is a reason why the F2P business model is the predominant operating model for 99% of MMOs on the market today.  As alluded to by me in that thread, a gaming population is a valuable limited asset resource for any MMO.  Without a gaming population, an MMO simply ceases to exist.  Its a difficult dynamic to balance for sure, but so long as your game is garnering a profit, however small, even a majority "leecher" gaming population is not only necessary, but preferable, to a failed business venture. 

You, of course, should not have to submit to a F2P model, particularly if your game does not feature a cash shop, but if you don't youed be well advised to structure your business model in a manner that has the potential to "encourage" population growth, Ie., a welcoming free trial introductory offer.  The F2P "leecher" presence in MMOs is a necessity that is as valuable, important, and integral to the MMO industry, as the games themselves.  Developers/producers who fail to acknowledge this reality are doomed to failure.  

  

That's only the case because the genre is so crowded that there's no value whatsoever in the base game to be sold anymore.  Too much supply, not enough demand to make merely creating an MMORPG to sell to consumers profitable.

MaxBacon

MadFrenchie said:

That's only the case because the genre is so crowded that there's no value whatsoever in the base game to be sold anymore.  Too much supply, not enough demand to make merely creating an MMORPG to sell to consumers profitable.

There is demand alright, what there isn't is enough variety on the genre with higher standards as the production of games like BDO or GW2.

When it comes to "more of the same", then yes, it is heavily saturated, but more of the same is not the MMO aspect, it is the type of game behind it.

MadFrenchie

MaxBacon said:

MadFrenchie said:

That's only the case because the genre is so crowded that there's no value whatsoever in the base game to be sold anymore.  Too much supply, not enough demand to make merely creating an MMORPG to sell to consumers profitable.

There is demand alright, what there isn't is enough variety on the genre with higher standards as the production of games like BDO or GW2.

When it comes to "more of the same", then yes, it is heavily saturated, but more of the same is not the MMO aspect, it is the type of game behind it.

Without a healthy outlook for a demand that's not being met, investors will continue to shy away from the genre.

Crowdfunding certainly proves that you can whip niches into a frenzy with pretty videos and nice words, but until we see a release state game enjoying success, it's poor evidence to publishers of a demand for a specifically unique take on the genre.

MaxBacon

MadFrenchie said:.

Without a healthy outlook for a demand that's not being met, investors will continue to shy away from the genre.

Crowdfunding certainly proves that you can whip niches into a frenzy with pretty videos and nice words, but until we see a release state game enjoying success, it's poor evidence to publishers of a demand for a specifically unique take on the genre.

The genre proves itself very profitable though, but the thing is that online games with microtransactions are cheaper to develop and maintain, yet way profitable, if we look at something like PUBG while developing a new MMO is a gamble on its own to see how it will play out on returns vs cost.

That does bottleneck the whole thing, because when it comes to variety you have to come up with something different, then risks, then investors run away from it, and it seems to be stuck on this most of the time. But when we talk evidence and we see projects like SC I guess that shows how far the wish for it is there, and we already see some larger scale investments happening on it, same with Dual Universe.