New World: Open, Full-Loot PvP?

MightyUnclean

Wait, wait.  Is this another attempt at an involuntary, open-world PvP, full-loot MMO?  Is that possible?  If so, when are developers going to learn that 99% of those MMOs die a painful, early death because they appeal primarily to gankers?  Why do they always think their game is going to be the magical exception?  Do they think that they're going to be the ones to develop the ideal justice system that players can't exploit?

Please tell me that my impressions are wrong, and that PvP is going to be in contested areas only, or otherwise voluntary.

MightyUnclean

DMKano said:

Amazon is hoping for high twitch streaming of all their games.

That's why it's a PvP game because those are the most watched games by far on Twitch - just look at the top 5 streams every day.

The question remains if they succeed - but make no mistake the first people who have been playing this since Alpha are all twitch influencers as you have to get the popular streamers on board first.



Maybe I'm just totally out of touch with what MMO players want now.  I mean, I understand open PvP and full-loot in games that last 30 minutes.  There isn't much time or effort invested in what you lose.  But do people want that in a game that they would build their resources in for potentially months, or years?  Maybe they do.  They haven't historically, though, right?  Am I missing a major MMO that had these aspects for all players?

FlyByKnight

There isn't anything watchable about it.

The combat is so @$$, and it doesn't have many redeemable qualities beyond the gathering. It's like watching paint dry.

It's clear what their intentions are and it was never to create some MMORPG/Survival Mashup in a occult setting. It's a survival MMO tech demo for Lumberyard.

Cazriel

I'm sure it will have a huge following for the first three months.  Then all the PvE players who have other games with friendlier mechanics will leave.  Six months in all the PvE players who were determined to stick it out will leave.  A year in, all the PvP players will have departed for other venues.

But glad to hear it will be a hit on Twitch. 

cheyane

I can totally get why a twitch player might play if he is being paid to play but a normal player would not play unless they find it fun not because it is popular surely or do people play games just because they are popular.

Well if your friends play you will play too is the obvious answer but personally I would not play a game unless it is fun for me.

wielkip

Full loot PVP is the best what they can do. The game with full loot PVP are not P2W because you need to have a skill.

Kinring

FlyByKnight said:

There isn't anything watchable about it.

The combat is so @$$, and it doesn't have many redeemable qualities beyond the gathering. It's like watching paint dry.

The combat is very bland so far, HOWEVER, it is also very far from finished. Half of the combat isn't even implemented yet. It is there, and we can see that it will be trainable, but its not activated yet. I would chill out about the combat as that is something they are likely waiting until beta (or a later stage of alpha) to implement/work on. 

The gathering and crafting system seems to be the focus so far, and I must admit that I am pleasantly surprised at how polished it is at this early stage. It still needs more depth, and it still needs tweaking, but at this early stage there is a very good foundation. 

One thing that no one has pointed out is that all alpha testers were invited to the alpha. No one had to pay to get in. Anyone saying this is a cash grab needs to consider previous cash grab games. They always charge for alpha and beta access! So far New World hasn't and I hope it stays that way. Also, I am not a streamer, so it is not offered to streamers only. I do have a Prime membership though *shrugs*.

SpottyGekko

Kinring said:
... 

One thing that no one has pointed out is that all alpha testers were invited to the alpha. No one had to pay to get in.
...

Amazon are playing the "long game" here, they want maximum exposure and need to establish themselves as a serious presence on the gaming scene. They'll reap the rewards later.

Amazon's entire gaming strategy is geared to leveraging their Twitch ownership. Their games are meant to boost their Twitch viewer count, not the other way around...

Iselin

From what I have seen so far everything about this screams survival game and as such, yes it probably will be full loot PvP like most of them unless they decide to go the FO76 route and make it partial loot.

I also have my doubts that a game where you spend 90% of your time gathering mats will be much of a Twitch hit.

NorseGod

Isn't this game built on Lumberyard? lol You guys realize what else is using Lumberyard, don't you? lol

Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe this game is not.

Arglebargle

No one I know is going to be playing this.   Me neither.  But we're not the twitch streamer age/audience.

NorseGod

Arglebargle said:

No one I know is going to be playing this.   Me neither.  But we're not the twitch streamer age/audience.

Amazon and Lumberyard was enough to get a pass from me. Not giving Bezos my money or personal information to sell. Already seen Lumberyard in "action". lol 

anxelesaxe

This game could be like pre-T2A UO with the politics/city building of shadowbane. Amazon could have a hit on their hands if they don't rush and do things right. 

I'd say Darkfall Unohly Wars is probably the closest comparison. That game was fun but good god Aventurine was a terrible company. 

Octagon7711

So they don't really care how successful the game is, they just want good twitch numbers so they can sell more Lumberyard.

Tiller

NorseGod said:

Isn't this game built on Lumberyard? lol You guys realize what else is using Lumberyard, don't you? lol

Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe this game is not.

It should be called Slumberyard Zzzzzzzzz

Hefaistos

How many players per server? Cuz it seems its going towards survival games, max 100.

NorseGod

Hefaistos said:

How many players per server? Cuz it seems its going towards survival games, max 100.

The other Lumberyard game can only have 50.

sassoonss

Not that I Know off but

Not full PVP loot - You dont lose money and what you are wearing . Only inventory gets looted.

Kinring

NorseGod said:

Arglebargle said:

No one I know is going to be playing this.   Me neither.  But we're not the twitch streamer age/audience.

Amazon and Lumberyard was enough to get a pass from me. Not giving Bezos my money or personal information to sell. Already seen Lumberyard in "action". lol 

Just curious, what game did you play that was from Lumberyard? 

ChildoftheShadows

Kinring said:

NorseGod said:

Arglebargle said:

No one I know is going to be playing this.   Me neither.  But we're not the twitch streamer age/audience.

Amazon and Lumberyard was enough to get a pass from me. Not giving Bezos my money or personal information to sell. Already seen Lumberyard in "action". lol 

Just curious, what game did you play that was from Lumberyard? 

It's CryEngine so I imagine you'll find lots of games made with it. Technically.

Kinring

Hefaistos said:

How many players per server? Cuz it seems its going towards survival games, max 100.

The alpha servers already have well over 100 each. They said they are going for MMO and they meant it. 

Frykka

MightyUnclean said:

DMKano said:

Maybe I'm just totally out of touch with what MMO players want now.  I mean, I understand open PvP and full-loot in games that last 30 minutes.  There isn't much time or effort invested in what you lose.  But do people want that in a game that they would build their resources in for potentially months, or years?  Maybe they do.  They haven't historically, though, right?  Am I missing a major MMO that had these aspects for all players?

Eve Online, Shadowbane, UO (pre-trammel), Warhammer Online, Lineage II, Archeage (pre-P2W)…   Kids who grew up in a Theme Park post WoW gaming world have never experienced a real sandbox PvP game.

rodarin

Obviously if people are trying to equate an MMO with full loot PvP to an ADD wet dream battle ground they dont understand anything about gaming in general. BGs last at most 30 minutes with 29 of that being looting for more than half the people who survive the first 5 minutes. While its all about Twitch and ad revenue these days for Amazon trying this in a game theyre trying to develop from the ground up and make something that people will want to play as an MMO doesnt make sense.

But it will eventually move from MMO to some sort of outright BG or quasi BG like most of the games who have announced big plans the past couple years.

MMOs are dead and the only people playing them are people over 30, and while those guys might be good for 'oldies' radio (80s music) theyre not the future of gaming in general.

The new generation loves to hate (at more than just gaming) so give them trash like fortnite and pubg or any of the other broken and battered adrenalinefests and theyre happy. Throw in 'updates' that break things and theyre even happier. As long as enough people keep playing it and nothing different comes along. Thats the delicate balance. Really has nothing to do with the games themselves but rather how many people are playing it and how boring it got.

Even the biggest games arent immune we have seen it three times already. PuBG was THE game then Fortnite came out and it was even bigger, now you have CoD (which for anyone with a brain call of duty has an automatic black mark against it) but it has taken a lot of the bigger PuBG and Fortnite streamers into their fold, at least for awhile.

Either way expecting ANYTHING from ANY so called MMO thats has been announced or is in outright development is wishing. Because none of these companies are going to put the money necessary into these games to make them meet expectations. And any crowdfunded game (beyond apparently SC) isnt going to make enough to register. Which means either years of scraping money up (dating a genre that is already dated from announce to release even more) or using said 'backing' to persuade 'investors' which generally leads to them wanting their money back whicvh in turn is defeated buy the whole MMO genre in general unless it has things players hate namely micro transactions or pay to win elements. So its a vicious circle.

Regnor

PvP games are niche and hanging by a thread. All you have to do is look at the top tier MMOs, the ones with mega subs (e.g., WoW, ESO, FFXIV ...) to see that the most successful games are the ones that  keep PvP compartmentalized and consensual. Any MMO that features non-consensual PvP is going to struggle to survive.

Kajidourden

Kano talking out of his ass as usual.  There's nothing watchable about the way New World plays.

Cybersig211

its all so confusing to me.  it looks like its going to be an ARK type survival game where you spend 75% of your time harvesting mats so you can build stuff to harvest better mats and make stuff....all jam packed into a giant persistent mmo world?

Might make for interesting twitch streams if there are sieges maybe but the core gameplay loop is by design boring as fuck....also ive played a few games that tried this survival/building in a persistent world thing...you get a game world littered with half built abandoned shit, or a game destroyed by people not interested in building but destroying. My guess is there will be areas that are "contested" and areas that are not.

Also its a REALLY boring theme going on...bows/axes/swords...yawn...they could have gone scifi and at least spiced up the mundane a bit.  Watching the leaked video, understanding its not done, and just imagining myself in a boring field/forest chopping wood, clicking rocks, slowly killing wildlife for mats...even if the combat was out of this world somehow with boring weapons...ugh...no thanks.

Im just so confused how a company with massive money to spend would throw down on something so...boring looking...with a boring gameplay loop of harvest/basic combat/build/craft...this studio has the resources to blow our minds with a AAA gaming experience and this is what they are working on?

Also once you seen one stream youve seen em all with games like this...none of this makes sense...even if they throw in pvp sieges and clans building "castles" which could be interesting but then were talking about 18th century stuff so it will be boring and predictable since they are constrained by a limited technology of the time frame.

This game will be average at best...i just hope it doesnt spook amazon out of the MMO market, there are VERY few major companies with nearly unlimited funding potential interested in MMO anything.