Third party GPU question

MMOman101

Looking at getting some GPUs, for builds I will be doing soon, and I was wondering if people had any insights into what brand (EVGA, MSI, ASUS, Gigabyte, Sapphire, ASRock, etc.) I should choose or stay away from.  I suspect that all of the cooling comes from just a few different vendors with slightly differing specs. Does anyone know of any brands that have better, quieter cooling or brands to avoid (generally bad cooling). 

I do suspect that the more you pay for a card the better cooling get, but it would not surprise me if there was markup from some brands that had little to do with actual performance.  Conversely, I could see some brands just selling garbage coolers to bring down cost. 

Quizzical

A lot of brands will sell several SKUs of the same GPU with different coolers and different overclocks.  So there are a lot of brands from which you can get either a nice version or a cheap version depending on which particular SKU you get.

That said, you don't necessarily want the nice card.  The "good" version of a card might have 50% better cooling in order to clock 10% higher and burn 30% more power--and also cost 15% more and be more likely to die early because of the overclock.

People commonly say to avoid the single-fan blower cards, and I'd mostly agree with that for mid-range or high end cards unless you're going small form factor with peculiar cooling needs or trying to cram something into a bad case.  But a cooler with several heat pipes and multiple fans that spray heat off in all directions will be fine outside of some very high power (typically multi-GPU) cards if your case has ample airflow.

If you're looking at cards that are around $100 or less, then you start to get some coolers that are just bad.  If a card just has a heatsink and no heatpipes, then it isn't going to be a very good cooler.  That's fine on a 20 W card, but not what you want on a 75 W card--and no one will try it on a 150 W card because it would be so woefully inadequate.

Vrika

The large brands are all ok. When buying a GPU look for reviews of that GPU, because there's often much variance within the brand.

The only brands to stay away from are some small Chinese brands, but you should notice those brands because they're offering a lot less different models and you can't usually find reviews of them from reputable western review sites.

jitter77

Besides cooling some have different in/outputs and what not as well so just depends on what you are looking for.  I only have 1 monitor and dont overclock and only play at 1080 so a mid range card with just one output is fine with me.  Back in the day I installed a heatsink with heatpipes on a ATI 9700 pro all in wonder.  That card lasted me many years. 

Vrika

Quizzical said:

That said, you don't necessarily want the nice card.  The "good" version of a card might have 50% better cooling in order to clock 10% higher and burn 30% more power--and also cost 15% more and be more likely to die early because of the overclock.

Personally I think that in the reviews it's more important to try to find one that does acoustic measurements.

The performances of different models are usually so close to each other that the only meaningful differences between cards are their price, whether it fits inside your case, and how much noise the cooling is going to produce.

MMOman101

For example I have heard that EVGA tends to be loud, and I have only had two EVGA cards, about 15 years ago and they were both loud.  Obviously sample size.  I also know that manufacturing has consolidated a great deal in the last 20 years and most likely all of these cooler parts are being made at just a handful of different locations. 

I tend to be more skeptical of reviews as the review industry has become big business, even user reviews on sites. My wife recently bout something with over 100 reviews on Amazon and it was obviously a scam, impossible not to notice once you received the product. 

Marketing is the attempt to get uneducated people to make emotional decisions, and with more information there is more ways to accomplish that goal.

Quizzical

OG_Zorvan said:

On Nvidia side, I'd likely recommend EVGA, MSI, or ASUS. For AMD I can only recommend XFX, as it's the only AMD card I've gotten recently. http://www.xfxforce.com/en-us/products/amd-radeon-rx-500-series/rx-580-gts-8gb-dd-rx-580p8dfd6 It's really well made and has performed very well. 

So you'd recommend MSI or Asus for an Nvidia card, but not for an AMD card, even though they make cards for both?

MMOman101

Quizzical said:

People commonly say to avoid the single-fan blower cards, and I'd mostly agree with that for mid-range or high end cards unless you're going small form factor with peculiar cooling needs or trying to cram something into a bad case.  But a cooler with several heat pipes and multiple fans that spray heat off in all directions will be fine outside of some very high power (typically multi-GPU) cards if your case has ample airflow.

In general I just look for 2 things when getting a GPU.  Does it have a 2+ fans, heat pipe(s).  Normally if it has those I feel safe enough.  A backplate is also nice, but I am not sure how much it really helps. 

alkarionlog

MMOman101 said:

For example I have heard that EVGA tends to be loud, and I have only had two EVGA cards, about 15 years ago and they were both loud.  Obviously sample size.  I also know that manufacturing has consolidated a great deal in the last 20 years and most likely all of these cooler parts are being made at just a handful of different locations. 

I tend to be more skeptical of reviews as the review industry has become big business, even user reviews on sites. My wife recently bout something with over 100 reviews on Amazon and it was obviously a scam, impossible not to notice once you received the product. 

Marketing is the attempt to get uneducated people to make emotional decisions, and with more information there is more ways to accomplish that goal.

that is why you tend to read the specs of things, and after sometime you will start to understand, some things, research also helps a lot on this

Asm0deus

My requirement on gpu is this:

Does it have a good guarantee, is it a hassle to get it covered in your country and last but not least does it allow the guarantee to transfer to another owner if you sell it eventually.  This here is what should decide what brand you get.

Beyond that blowers are for smaller cases that don't have super great air flow as they are designed to blow the hot air from the gpu outside the case.  Good for small form factors cases etc.

Open air is the kind you want if your case has good air flow, this generally means lower temps for the gpu over a blower.

Beyond that I prefer they have min of two fans for decent cooling and they should have a nice heat pipe to help heat dissipation.

bonzoso21

Definitely read the specs and pay attention to pretty much everything: TDP, base and boost clocks, and card dimensions. The most monstrous triple-fan card that boosts to 1950mhz out of the box won't help you if it doesn't fit in your case. Match the card to the rest of your build, and be careful of overpaying right now as most retailers can't keep RTX Super and AMD Navi cards in stock so we're in a period of price gougers. 

I've had good experiences with EVGA and Sapphire in the past, and I'm looking at a Gigabyte card for my upcoming build but can't speak to that brand yet. As far as cooling specifics goes, I'm typically fine with running the factory overclock and not pushing further, so I don't worry much about it as long as it's not a single-fan blower. It never hurts to watch/read some benchmarks, though...Gamer's Nexus goes pretty in-depth on thermals and noise in their GPU videos

MMOman101

bonzoso21 said:

Definitely read the specs and pay attention to pretty much everything: TDP, base and boost clocks, and card dimensions. The most monstrous triple-fan card that boosts to 1950mhz out of the box won't help you if it doesn't fit in your case. Match the card to the rest of your build, and be careful of overpaying right now as most retailers can't keep RTX Super and AMD Navi cards in stock so we're in a period of price gougers. 

I've had good experiences with EVGA and Sapphire in the past, and I'm looking at a Gigabyte card for my upcoming build but can't speak to that brand yet. As far as cooling specifics goes, I'm typically fine with running the factory overclock and not pushing further, so I don't worry much about it as long as it's not a single-fan blower. It never hurts to watch/read some benchmarks, though...Gamer's Nexus goes pretty in-depth on thermals and noise in their GPU videos

I watch a lot of gamers nexus, but they don't hit all the cards.  Also these builds are not for me.  They are for friends/family and will be in the sub $750 range.  None of them will have RTX cards.  They will be much cheaper cards, 570-590 or 1660 depending on cost and what I can get a deal on at the local Microcenter, when they have them.  I have 3 builds I will probably be doing in the next two months.

Asm0deus

MMOman101 said:

bonzoso21 said:

Definitely read the specs and pay attention to pretty much everything: TDP, base and boost clocks, and card dimensions. The most monstrous triple-fan card that boosts to 1950mhz out of the box won't help you if it doesn't fit in your case. Match the card to the rest of your build, and be careful of overpaying right now as most retailers can't keep RTX Super and AMD Navi cards in stock so we're in a period of price gougers. 

I've had good experiences with EVGA and Sapphire in the past, and I'm looking at a Gigabyte card for my upcoming build but can't speak to that brand yet. As far as cooling specifics goes, I'm typically fine with running the factory overclock and not pushing further, so I don't worry much about it as long as it's not a single-fan blower. It never hurts to watch/read some benchmarks, though...Gamer's Nexus goes pretty in-depth on thermals and noise in their GPU videos

I watch a lot of gamers nexus, but they don't hit all the cards.  Also these builds are not for me.  They are for friends/family and will be in the sub $750 range.  None of them will have RTX cards.  They will be much cheaper cards, 570-590 or 1660 depending on cost and what I can get a deal on at the local Microcenter, when they have them.  I have 3 builds I will probably be doing in the next two months.

IF your builds are all in the sub 750 range just decide what gpu you want, 570, 580 or 590 etc and then when searching newegg or w/e site filter it to go from lowest to highest cost and look for a decent brand like msi, evga, xfx etc.  At the price fo your build the brand wont matter much as you are not getting a 500$+ gpu so they will all be about the same quality.

Like I said in my previous post try to get one with a good warranty/guarantee is all and maybe look for a two fan open air one or blower if  building in a small case with poor airflow.

About the only gpu brand I avoid is gigabyte gpu as I have heard/read they have bad quality control so chances of getting lemon are higher than other brands but that all anecdotal and what I heard on the grape vine.

Last I looked at the beginning of the year it was something like this:

• EVGA = Yes, by serial number, no receipt needed Update October 31, 2018 -  you must now register the second-hand card once you receive it. Warranty is still transferable.
• MSI = Yes, by serial number, no receipt needed
• Asus = No, original receipt needed (support rep told me no, warranty terms are ambiguous)
• All Others = Unknown (by me, I'm sure someone knows)
• Zotac = No
  

On the AMD side:

• MSI = Yes, by serial number, no receipt needed
• Sapphire = No
• XFX = No
• All Others = Unknown (same as above)

You should double check in case there have been changes though on whichever brand you buy.

Quizzical

I don't think a warranty on consumer parts has very much value, at least beyond the ability to RMA something that showed up dead.  If a part dies, you want it replaced immediately.  You don't want to ship the part away, wait three weeks for the replacement, and not have a working computer in that time.  And then maybe even after three weeks, only learn that you had misdiagnosed the problem and the computer still doesn't work.

Asm0deus

Quizzical said:

I don't think a warranty on consumer parts has very much value, at least beyond the ability to RMA something that showed up dead.  If a part dies, you want it replaced immediately.  You don't want to ship the part away, wait three weeks for the replacement, and not have a working computer in that time.  And then maybe even after three weeks, only learn that you had misdiagnosed the problem and the computer still doesn't work.

I don't agree, if you are on a budget and the gpu craps out you dont want it to be a hasssle to change as for transferable warranty if you buy used that should indeed be a factor in your purchase.

I mean unless you got lots of bucks to just chuck around.

Lets take it step further though why would you avoid looking at this? Why buy from a brand you know is shit on that front?   When you can buy from a company that you know it isn't if you can get comparable prices on comparable performing gpu's.

If you are in a super hurry and get another gpu that fine and all but what you just chuck the one that crapped out?  If it's relatively recent you don't instead you get it replaced and sell it or keep it as a spare.

I think this is just one of the Quizzical I need to say differently posts.

@DMKano ; Agreed my last 3 or 4 gpu have been MSI and they have all been great.

Ozmodan

I try to avoid overclocked gpus.  I have not had good results from any provider that boosts their gpu.  They tend to burn out much faster than unboosted ones no matter the cooling.

Ridelynn

Asm0deus said:

MMOman101 said:

bonzoso21 said:

Definitely read the specs and pay attention to pretty much everything: TDP, base and boost clocks, and card dimensions. The most monstrous triple-fan card that boosts to 1950mhz out of the box won't help you if it doesn't fit in your case. Match the card to the rest of your build, and be careful of overpaying right now as most retailers can't keep RTX Super and AMD Navi cards in stock so we're in a period of price gougers. 

I've had good experiences with EVGA and Sapphire in the past, and I'm looking at a Gigabyte card for my upcoming build but can't speak to that brand yet. As far as cooling specifics goes, I'm typically fine with running the factory overclock and not pushing further, so I don't worry much about it as long as it's not a single-fan blower. It never hurts to watch/read some benchmarks, though...Gamer's Nexus goes pretty in-depth on thermals and noise in their GPU videos

I watch a lot of gamers nexus, but they don't hit all the cards.  Also these builds are not for me.  They are for friends/family and will be in the sub $750 range.  None of them will have RTX cards.  They will be much cheaper cards, 570-590 or 1660 depending on cost and what I can get a deal on at the local Microcenter, when they have them.  I have 3 builds I will probably be doing in the next two months.

IF your builds are all in the sub 750 range just decide what gpu you want, 570, 580 or 590 etc and then when searching newegg or w/e site filter it to go from lowest to highest cost and look for a decent brand like msi, evga, xfx etc.

This is exactly what i do.

Asus still makes decent products, they just tend to be prices higher. And god help you if you need to use their RMA - it’s notoriously poor.

EVGA has a good RMA system, but unfortunately you need to use it more often than some other brands. A lot of folks have won the lottery on warranty service for older cards getting a free upgrade though.

Ive had great luck with XFX and sapphire on the AMD side.

i do recommend considering warranty - there are some cards out there with 5 year or even lifetime warranties available. You hope to never need it, but there are times that you do (like your PSU blowing up and taking your GPU with it)

Asm0deus

Ridelynn said:

Asm0deus said:

MMOman101 said:

bonzoso21 said:

Definitely read the specs and pay attention to pretty much everything: TDP, base and boost clocks, and card dimensions. The most monstrous triple-fan card that boosts to 1950mhz out of the box won't help you if it doesn't fit in your case. Match the card to the rest of your build, and be careful of overpaying right now as most retailers can't keep RTX Super and AMD Navi cards in stock so we're in a period of price gougers. 

I've had good experiences with EVGA and Sapphire in the past, and I'm looking at a Gigabyte card for my upcoming build but can't speak to that brand yet. As far as cooling specifics goes, I'm typically fine with running the factory overclock and not pushing further, so I don't worry much about it as long as it's not a single-fan blower. It never hurts to watch/read some benchmarks, though...Gamer's Nexus goes pretty in-depth on thermals and noise in their GPU videos

I watch a lot of gamers nexus, but they don't hit all the cards.  Also these builds are not for me.  They are for friends/family and will be in the sub $750 range.  None of them will have RTX cards.  They will be much cheaper cards, 570-590 or 1660 depending on cost and what I can get a deal on at the local Microcenter, when they have them.  I have 3 builds I will probably be doing in the next two months.

IF your builds are all in the sub 750 range just decide what gpu you want, 570, 580 or 590 etc and then when searching newegg or w/e site filter it to go from lowest to highest cost and look for a decent brand like msi, evga, xfx etc.

This is exactly what i do.

Asus still makes decent products, they just tend to be prices higher. And god help you if you need to use their RMA - it’s notoriously poor.

EVGA has a good RMA system, but unfortunately you need to use it more often than some other brands. A lot of folks have won the lottery on warranty service for older cards getting a free upgrade though.

Ive had great luck with XFX and sapphire on the AMD side.

i do recommend considering warranty - there are some cards out there with 5 year or even lifetime warranties available. You hope to never need it, but there are times that you do (like your PSU blowing up and taking your GPU with it)

Aye my XFX 5770's are still running, I got both in the closet right now and they had lifetime warrantees.  Was the last time I ran multi gpu set up too.

Quizzical

Asm0deus said:

Quizzical said:

I don't think a warranty on consumer parts has very much value, at least beyond the ability to RMA something that showed up dead.  If a part dies, you want it replaced immediately.  You don't want to ship the part away, wait three weeks for the replacement, and not have a working computer in that time.  And then maybe even after three weeks, only learn that you had misdiagnosed the problem and the computer still doesn't work.

I don't agree, if you are on a budget and the gpu craps out you dont want it to be a hasssle to change as for transferable warranty if you buy used that should indeed be a factor in your purchase.

I mean unless you got lots of bucks to just chuck around.

Lets take it step further though why would you avoid looking at this? Why buy from a brand you know is shit on that front?   When you can buy from a company that you know it isn't if you can get comparable prices on comparable performing gpu's.

If you are in a super hurry and get another gpu that fine and all but what you just chuck the one that crapped out?  If it's relatively recent you don't instead you get it replaced and sell it or keep it as a spare.

I think this is just one of the Quizzical I need to say differently posts.

@DMKano ; Agreed my last 3 or 4 gpu have been MSI and they have all been great.

It's your money, not mine.  Just remember that if you send in a video card for warranty service:

1)  That computer doesn't work for a few weeks while you wait for them to send you a replacement, unless you've got a spare card laying around.
2)  There's a good chance that your replacement card will be one that someone else sent in as defective, but the board partner thinks is fine.

Perhaps that's better than nothing.  If nothing else, you could buy another, cheaper GPU while waiting for the warranty replacement.  But it's not nearly as good as having a video card not die in the first place.

Asm0deus

Quizzical said:

...snip...

It's your money, not mine.  Just remember that if you send in a video card for warranty service:

1)  That computer doesn't work for a few weeks while you wait for them to send you a replacement, unless you've got a spare card laying around.
2)  There's a good chance that your replacement card will be one that someone else sent in as defective, but the board partner thinks is fine.

Perhaps that's better than nothing.  If nothing else, you could buy another, cheaper GPU while waiting for the warranty replacement.  But it's not nearly as good as having a video card not die in the first place.

What's your point?  Nothing in here is relevant other than some obscure mental gymnastic to try and prove you are right and I am wrong?

Like you say it's your money buy crap off a vendor that will give you the run around when your gpu craps out or you have to rma because it is DOA.

You have a knack of sticking on one thing said in a post and not taking the whole post into account then trying to prove something with irrelevant BS sometimes.

You in most posts about builds will propose people one thing over another so they save 20$ on it but now are gonna balk on looking at brands with decent guarantees  and potentially save you 350$ plus...lol

I will repeat it again if you don't care about guarantees and will just chuck a gpu in the bin to buy another if it craps out after a few years that's your business but don't come here saying or implying its the smarter thing to do cause it's not.

Quizzical

Asm0deus said:

Quizzical said:

...snip...

It's your money, not mine.  Just remember that if you send in a video card for warranty service:

1)  That computer doesn't work for a few weeks while you wait for them to send you a replacement, unless you've got a spare card laying around.
2)  There's a good chance that your replacement card will be one that someone else sent in as defective, but the board partner thinks is fine.

Perhaps that's better than nothing.  If nothing else, you could buy another, cheaper GPU while waiting for the warranty replacement.  But it's not nearly as good as having a video card not die in the first place.

What's your point?  Nothing in here is relevant other than some obscure mental gymnastic to try and prove you are right and I am wrong?

Like you say it's your money buy crap off a vendor that will give you the run around when your gpu craps out or you have to rma because it is DOA.

You have a knack of sticking on one thing said in a post and not taking the whole post into account then trying to prove something with irrelevant BS sometimes.

You in most posts about builds will propose people one thing over another so they save 20$ on it but now are gonna balk on looking at brands with decent guarantees  and potentially save you 350$ plus...lol

I will repeat it again if you don't care about guarantees and will just chuck a gpu in the bin to buy another if it craps out after a few years that's your business but don't come here saying or implying its the smarter thing to do cause it's not.

If a card is dead on arrival, you should be able to RMA it to the store you bought it from and not deal with the board partner.  The warranty only matters if the card works for a while and then dies.

Video cards also depreciate fast.  Yes, a warranty for a card that dies after you've had it for six months can have value, but everyone will cover it for that long.  If a card dies after four years, buying a brand new card with performance equivalent to the dead card would cost a lot less than the original card cost new--and use less power and have better features, while you're at it.

Maybe you've got a spare GPU around to keep the computer working while you send in parts for warranty service.  Or maybe in the event of a card dying, you don't mind having the computer not work at all for a few weeks if you're lucky, or longer if you're not.  As I said, it's your money and you can do what you want.

Ridelynn

There is a difference between an RMA to the reseller, as that’s usually just a refund or quick turn-around for direct replacement, and an RMA for warranty service, which is often coupled with some troubleshooting at the factory and sometimes replacement or repair.

Both suck if you need to use them, but it sucks less than just having a dead card.

Reseller is usually limited to 30 days or so from
purchase, and requires all the original
packaging. Typically not a lot
of questions asked, and usually it’s turned around in 7-10 days.

Warranty service lasts for years... for GPUs usually 3-5, sometimes life. Some companies will transfer warranty after sales. But it can be denied for certain reasons, and the service area will check out the card and run diagnostics. Turnaround time here can be weeks. There is a very slim chance you could receive an upgraded card in return, but being honest, it’s not very big and the company will look for any legit reason to deny your claim.

I’d rather not have to use RMA service at all, but it’s better to have it and not just be out hundreds of dollars than to have a very expensive paperweight with no other recourse available.

Warranty is a great reason to buy new and avoid the gray market. I wouldn’t pay a lot extra for a lifetime warranty though, and I wouldn’t count on a transferable warranty being honored on a used sale.

Asm0deus

Ridelynn said:

There is a difference between an RMA to the reseller, as that’s usually just a refund or quick turn-around for direct replacement, and an RMA for warranty service, which is often coupled with some troubleshooting at the factory and sometimes replacement or repair.

Both suck if you need to use them, but it sucks less than just having a dead card.

Reseller is usually limited to 30 days or so from
purchase, and requires all the original
packaging. Typically not a lot
of questions asked, and usually it’s turned around in 7-10 days.

Warranty service lasts for years... for GPUs usually 3-5, sometimes life. Some companies will transfer warranty after sales. But it can be denied for certain reasons, and the service area will check out the card and run diagnostics. Turnaround time here can be weeks. There is a very slim chance you could receive an upgraded card in return, but being honest, it’s not very big and the company will look for any legit reason to deny your claim.

I’d rather not have to use RMA service at all, but it’s better to have it and not just be out hundreds of dollars than to have a very expensive paperweight with no other recourse available.

Warranty is a great reason to buy new and avoid the gray market. I wouldn’t pay a lot extra for a lifetime warranty though, and I wouldn’t count on a transferable warranty being honored on a used sale.

This exactly this, happy someone understood what I wrote.

Quiz you misread or are being willfully obtuse here. 

Obviously it's better not to have a gpu crap out period but you of all people know that no matter what brand sometimes shit happens so it best to have a gpu with a decent guarantee/warranty period.  Oh there goes that loopy counter argument of yours....

Your counter arguments are frankly lame Quiz.  What do you propose? To not give a rats arse about this because hey you just buy another?...lol

No where in my post did I say you should pay MORE for extended warranty only to buy from a brand with a good rep in that area.

BTW my old XFX gpu I didn't pay more for lifetime warranty and I never had to use it either but better to have that option than not at all especially if it doesn't cost you more.

Frankly you have never made clear what your exception is to my saying this should be a major factor in buying a gpu? 

Like you said, which I think is pretty obvious and didn't need mention to anyone,  they pretty much all have a min. basic 3 years warranty...it's just some are better to deal with on that front than others which can also vary wildly depending on which country you live in.

Seems like you are grasping at straws here to prove yourself right on some point simply because you didn't say it first.

Oh your other major argument ...about the turn around time...lets say oh 8 month later my new gpu dies I will just chuck that 300$+ gpu in the garbage and buy another equivalent gpu for the same amount..sure sure buddy I will do that cause like you say I don't have another gpu in the closet and turn around is sooooo long  and quiz said so right?

Guess what though is a much better option..... you buy another one like you say but still rma the crapped out one and then sell that one as a used gpu OR you keep it as a back up..oh there goes your other loopy counter argument...lol

Here's an example I wont buy gigabyte gpu because the warranty for people in Canada sucks nuggets.  If the gpu break down past the 30 days or so return option of w/e retailer you bought the gpu from you need to send that damned thing all the way down south outside the country to California.....which would indeed be costly.