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OPINION: Warcraft 3: Reforged was Review Bombed and That’s Just Fine - MMORPG.com

SystemSystem Member UncommonPosts: 12,599
edited February 2020 in News & Features Discussion

imageOPINION: Warcraft 3: Reforged was Review Bombed and That’s Just Fine - MMORPG.com

Warcraft 3: Reforged is officially the lowest-rated AAA game on Metacritic. Is it warranted? Chris thinks so. Let us know what you think in the comments below!

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Comments

  • goozmaniagoozmania Member RarePosts: 394
    You blame Activision, but it's definitely Blizzard incompetence. Activision has released multiple well-done remasters. It is Blizzard that consistently pisses on its own goodwill, over the past 5 years. Blizzard was behind the D3 auction house. Blizzard closed HGC. Blizzard suggested we all have phones and should stfu. Blizzard sided with China.
    McSleazGroqstrong[Deleted User]RemyVorenderpantaroinfomatzNephethcheebaalkarionlog
  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 8,063
    Generally speaking, I'm vehemently against review bombing. It delegitimizes user reviews, and is often done for reasons that have absolutely nothing to do with game quality (ie: console first party exclusivity).

    However, I think this may be one of those cases where it is valid. No, WC3 Reforged is not a 0.4/10 game. It's hard to imagine any game being worthy of a sub-1 score. But it is a bad remaster of a great game and does deserve as much negative press as it can garner for (and this is the important bit) reasons entirely related to the shoddy quality of the game.
    KylerannewbismxTacticalZombehinfomatzNephethKalafaxMaddog666
  • XiaokiXiaoki Member EpicPosts: 4,047
    When it's a game you like - review bombing is a horrible practice from angry internet trolls that needs to stop

    When it's a game you don't like - review bombing is a way for our voices of discontent to be heard

    I'm glad Reforged is like this. It exposes a lot of people as hypocrites.
    goozmaniaIceAgejimmywolfSandmanjwCaffynatedinfomatzalkarionlogkjempff
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 44,065
    edited February 2020
    Funny thing is I didn't know it was released nor have I seen any reviews.

    Yeah, I pretty much live under a rock when it comes to games I've little interest in.

    ;)

    Still not sure I can support review bombing but no real issue for me as I generally view the opinions of the masses as holding little value.
    TillerSandmanjwMaddog666

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Good rant, Chris. 

    Sad to see though that the aggregate critic score is still over 60 for something that deserves to be in the red not just because of the half-assed "reforging" but because it actually also broke parts of the game for those still playing the original.

    Critics need to dare to use the full score range for games from so-called AAA studios and not reserve the red zone for just weird ass games from scummy asset flippers and the like. That certainly doesn't help the disconnect between critics and users.
    KyleranTacticalZombehMcSleazGdemamiMaddog666
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • UtinniUtinni Member EpicPosts: 2,209
    Using the term "Review Bombed" implies that it was falsely bombarded with inaccurate, negative reviews. I don't know anyone who owns it who would say it deserves any positive reviews.
    KyleranAethaerynananitjimmywolfTacticalZombehGdemamiinfomatz
  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,671
    edited February 2020
    Personally, I'm justifying it not because of how Warforged turned out but what they did to classic Warcraft 3 by automatically 'upgrading' owners of it without consent. This also means that people automatically lost access to custom games and such due to the overall changes and shutdown of clients/servers. So not just the people who bought the new one got hit but the people who owned the original and had it via b-net as well. Even if you didn't have it via b-net, you still can't play public custom games, so screws everyone. GG, Acti-Blizz. Please stay the FUCK away from D2, k thx.
    IselinjimmywolfinfomatzWaan
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 44,065
    edited February 2020
    Utinni said:
    Using the term "Review Bombed" implies that it was falsely bombarded with inaccurate, negative reviews. I don't know anyone who owns it who would say it deserves any positive reviews.
    You mean there are gamers who bought this sight unseen  before checking reviews and metacritic scores?

    Weird.

    ;)

    (But Kyle,  it was a Blizzard game,  it just has to be good)

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • newbismxnewbismx Member UncommonPosts: 276
    I agree with review bombing when merited- Especially when we honestly cannot even get valid reviews and critique (in general) from gaming journalists.

    FO 76 getting a 7 out of 10 as one example off the top of my head.
    KyleranBrotherMaynardGdemamialkarionlog
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Albatroes said:
    Personally, I'm justifying it not because of how Warforged turned out but what they did to classic Warcraft 3 by automatically 'upgrading' owners of it without consent. This also means that people automatically lost access to custom games and such due to the overall changes and shutdown of clients/servers. So not just the people who bought the new one got hit but the people who owned the original and had it via b-net as well. Even if you didn't have it via b-net, you still can't play public custom games, so screws everyone. GG, Acti-Blizz. Please stay the FUCK away from D2, k thx.
    Even small studios like Larian have enough sense to not force upgrade. When they reworked Divinity Original Sin 1 they had the new version together with the first version side by side in Steam even though it was a free upgrade.

    What they did to the original W3 with this is like amateur hour. 
    AlbatroesGdemami
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • GroqstrongGroqstrong Member RarePosts: 826
    Utter trash. Cant believe Blizzard would even allow it to be released.
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 44,065
    newbismx said:
    I agree with review bombing when merited- Especially when we honestly cannot even get valid reviews and critique (in general) from gaming journalists.

    FO 76 getting a 7 out of 10 as one example off the top of my head.
    While 7/10 was too high at launch, the Metacritic scores were around 50% at launch which is where I would have placed it, but I am a FO fanboy so more forgiving.

    Clearly it suffered from some review bombing as the user score was 2.7 which I can't agree with.

    Trouble is, they have improved it quite a bit, certainly up to 6.5 or maybe 7  but anyone looking will find the poor player rating and likely never give it a go.


    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 8,063
    Kyleran said:
    Utinni said:
    Using the term "Review Bombed" implies that it was falsely bombarded with inaccurate, negative reviews. I don't know anyone who owns it who would say it deserves any positive reviews.
    You mean there are gamers who bought this sight unseen  before checking reviews and metacritic scores?

    Weird.

    ;)

    (But Kyle,  it was a Blizzard game,  it just has to be good)
    We should have expected quality. Not because it's a Blizzard game. Because it was a simple remaster of a 17 year old game that was already considered great.

    You have to either be incompetent or a troll to mess this up. And it turns out that Blizzard is one or both of these.
    TacticalZombehinfomatz
  • AethaerynAethaeryn Member RarePosts: 3,150
    Iselin said:
    Good rant, Chris. 

    Sad to see though that the aggregate critic score is still over 60 for something that deserves to be in the red not just because of the half-assed "reforging" but because it actually also broke parts of the game for those still playing the original.

    Critics need to dare to use the full score range for games from so-called AAA studios and not reserve the red zone for just weird ass games from scummy asset flippers and the like. That certainly doesn't help the disconnect between critics and users.
    I just wonder. . if someone hadn't played WC3. . and then played this. . forgetting about the price.. . what would the game score?  Maybe it is a 60 percent.

    For what it should have been and what was shown/promised it lives up to little of that so 20% seems fine relatively.  Is the game itself still that bad to merit that low of a score.

    I agree with the response of the community and the score is deserved in that sense. . just strictly removing all other things and reviewing the game as is might lend to a higher score?

    bonzoso21

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 44,065
    Aeander said:
    Kyleran said:
    Utinni said:
    Using the term "Review Bombed" implies that it was falsely bombarded with inaccurate, negative reviews. I don't know anyone who owns it who would say it deserves any positive reviews.
    You mean there are gamers who bought this sight unseen  before checking reviews and metacritic scores?

    Weird.

    ;)

    (But Kyle,  it was a Blizzard game,  it just has to be good)
    We should have expected quality. Not because it's a Blizzard game. Because it was a simple remaster of a 17 year old game that was already considered great.

    You have to either be incompetent or a troll to mess this up. And it turns out that Blizzard is one or both of these.
    Considering their track record the past few years I'm thinking they just aren't the company your father knew and loved.

    and haven't been for quite some time, most just didn't see it but the decline has been steady since Cataclysm.

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • BrotherMaynardBrotherMaynard Member RarePosts: 647
    edited February 2020

    newbismx said:

    I agree with review bombing when merited- Especially when we honestly cannot even get valid reviews and critique (in general) from gaming journalists.

    FO 76 getting a 7 out of 10 as one example off the top of my head.




    We should consider that:

    a) Critic reviews are too often too soft on the game they're reviewing; I'm not going to suggest they're paid, but there's a reason for IGN's (among many others) reputation;

    b) A large number of users will give 10/10 - either because they're involved (friends, family, diehard fans, etc.) or just to 'balance out the negative reviews'.

    And thus in the end it becomes a simple statistic: with sufficient number of user reviews, you stop looking at the individual scores, and just let the 0/10 and 10/10 battle it out.

    In such cases, the review effectively changes from a score-based system to the like/dislike (upvote / downvote) one.

    As long as the number of votes is sufficiently large, reviewing with 0/10s and 10/10s is just as good an indicator of a game's quality as any other system.


    KyleranTacticalZombehinfomatz
  • bonzoso21bonzoso21 Member UncommonPosts: 380
    Remasters/remakes are weird because on one hand they play on people's nostalgia and get fans of the original games to spend money on them a second time, and as such they should be subjected to comparisons to the original and scored based on what they have improved. In this sense, I completely understand and agree with poor reviews due to bugs, abandoned promises, and removed game modes.

    On the other hand, they're also bringing great games to people who never had the chance to play the originals, and are typically the only legitimate way consumers can get those games now, and for that reason I also feel like it's totally fine to review them in a vacuum without taking the original into account. 

    In the case of WC3, most media reviews begin along the lines of "this is one of the best RTS games ever made and it still plays great and this version looks better than the original", and then go on to score the game poorly because they're jilted fans just like all the users bombing Metacritic. And there are people who will ignore this chance to play WC3 for the first time because of that, and I think that kinda sucks. 
  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 8,063
    bonzoso21 said:
    Remasters/remakes are weird because on one hand they play on people's nostalgia and get fans of the original games to spend money on them a second time, and as such they should be subjected to comparisons to the original and scored based on what they have improved. In this sense, I completely understand and agree with poor reviews due to bugs, abandoned promises, and removed game modes.

    On the other hand, they're also bringing great games to people who never had the chance to play the originals, and are typically the only legitimate way consumers can get those games now, and for that reason I also feel like it's totally fine to review them in a vacuum without taking the original into account. 

    In the case of WC3, most media reviews begin along the lines of "this is one of the best RTS games ever made and it still plays great and this version looks better than the original", and then go on to score the game poorly because they're jilted fans just like all the users bombing Metacritic. And there are people who will ignore this chance to play WC3 for the first time because of that, and I think that kinda sucks. 
    Warcraft 3, the original, was plenty available up until the Reforged release. It still had an active community.

    So, "the chance" to play WC3 never really went away. It just got a whole lot worse.
    McSleaz
  • BruceYeeBruceYee Member EpicPosts: 2,556
    There is the toxicity factor that a lot of people aren't considering. Back in WC3 original days you could create a new name for every game you played but now it auto uses your Blizz ID. That means anyone who uses their streamer name will get trolled possibly even by his/her own teammates cause the game is a ffa. Also back in wc3 original days people had a thicker skin for online nonsense where now many are easily triggered and need to win the pointless argument with some random at all costs. Not saying this was a factor for the criticism but it's something I noticed that has a definite impact on the entire experience.
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • TheocritusTheocritus Member LegendaryPosts: 10,015
    Aeander said:
    Kyleran said:
    Utinni said:
    Using the term "Review Bombed" implies that it was falsely bombarded with inaccurate, negative reviews. I don't know anyone who owns it who would say it deserves any positive reviews.
    You mean there are gamers who bought this sight unseen  before checking reviews and metacritic scores?

    Weird.

    ;)

    (But Kyle,  it was a Blizzard game,  it just has to be good)
    We should have expected quality. Not because it's a Blizzard game. Because it was a simple remaster of a 17 year old game that was already considered great.

    You have to either be incompetent or a troll to mess this up. And it turns out that Blizzard is one or both of these.

    Who considers Warcraft 3 great? Blizzard?
    Aeandercheeba
  • MargraveMargrave Member RarePosts: 1,371
    Blizzard has pooped and sat it with this.
    [Deleted User]
  • AureltAurelt Member UncommonPosts: 64
    "In the meantime, let’s all hope that Blizzard pulls a Bungie and is able to buy themselves out from Activision’s drooling maw. That may well be impossible, but what’s a protest without a dream?"

    You clueless. people still defending blizzard-activision. Its one thing. there's no Blizzard and Activision. it's one. they merged. the seperation is impossible. When they make mistakes it's: activision-blizzard. when they win it's: activision-blizzard. It's crazy to me that they blame activision for all of this when all you should blame was blizzard in the first place to why they merged with such a company years ago. So yeah... it's impossible to be seperate. it's way different than bungie and activision-blizzard.
    Ridelynnalkarionlogkjempff
  • ChildoftheShadowsChildoftheShadows Member EpicPosts: 2,193
    I don’t consider this review bombing since it is the quality of the game being reviewed here. The “problem” comes when a game gets bombed due to reasons that have nothing to do with the quality of the game itself. 

    I’m not a journalist though so wtf do I know. 
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