CCP Looks Back at 2020 with an Ecosystem Outlook Blog, 'Botting and RMT Negatively Affect Everyone'

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CCP Looks Back at 2020 with an Ecosystem Outlook Blog, 'Botting and RMT Negatively Affect Everyone' | MMORPG.com

CCP has released a lengthy blog about EVE Online's ecosystem outlook, which includes what they've learned from 2020, as well as what players have to look forward to in 2021.

Read the full story here

Wizardry

Yeah yeah another conspiracy theory..
I truly believe CCP is NOT honest in this at all and that they simply want to fully control every dollar from the ISK market.
The problem is the structure of the economy,it is designed to encourage heavy rmt use,so CCP is to blame.Every single part of the economy needs to be automated.Players cannot trade with each and cannot drop something and allow another player to pick it up.I am sure RMT could figure out an elaborate way which i can as well but i will not bring that up.

SO everything has to enter an auction house and every single item sold has to sit idle for 24 hours before it will even show up on the auction house.With no trading or picking up from player to player this means all purchases from the auction house would be via earned currency.
So there is more,ONE team communication channel no other means of talking to other players in game,thatg means even if a rmt wanted to contact a player to exploit the game through other means it would have to go through the entire chat channel of the corp for all to see/hear.

So then they could not simply setup another off corp to deal with rmt because no player trading so nothing would reach the hands of the perpetrators anyhow.I am sure if i was actually involved in the game i could figure out how to plug every hole but i am not so this would be a positive start. Ship insurance if that still exists,i am sure it does,earned through player actions in forms of credits,NO CURRENCY involved and NO credit trading of any kind.

Wizardry

Oh yeah and NO CASH SHOP from CCP either,completely get rid of outside the game interference,that is of course if CCP is sincere which of course i know they are not.
They want to earn moiney,do it the old fashion way,charge a subscription,this is an aged engine,aged game deff not worth 15 so maybe $10 tops.
Do everything i mention and see how fast this game turns into a ghost town,you'll truly find out if people are playing this for fun or not.

IchinumiTsukaya

Imagine thinking eve is p2w, what a joke, might be popular to say amongst a crowd of people who don't really play eve or otherwise know what they're talking about though. I'm sure everything feels p2w if ur just generally bad.

Kyleran

Torval said:

Well CCP, you mess with the bull, you get the horns. Maybe you shouldn't have gone full on RMT and P2W yourselves if you didn't want it in your game. You can't win that battle.

They have no problems with RMT as long as they are the sole proprietors for it, which is their right as the game's developer.

Botting disrupts the economy which CCP has always worked very hard to keep under carefully controlled parameters, which is vital to a game such as this.

Kyleran

Torval said:

Imagine players pretending paying for in game advantages aren't pay to win. How far up some posterior does a head have to be before it realizes where it's at?

In order to address your P2W concerns I'll need to know specifically which items you feel contribute to it.

I ask because people have often said having multiple accounts or purchasing cosmetics is P2W so need to know where to begin the conversation.

kitarad

 Lynyrd Skynyrd called him Mr.Young.

GeezerGamer

IchinumiTsukaya said:

Imagine thinking eve is p2w, what a joke, might be popular to say amongst a crowd of people who don't really play eve or otherwise know what they're talking about though. I'm sure everything feels p2w if ur just generally bad.

RMT destroyed the game's economy. You don't want to call it pay to win? How about pay to lose. Every time someone buys some ISK, someone else gets a free account paid for which is fully automated and provides the RMT advantage. The Irony here is that those who are spending their own money are making other players more powerful.  It's still the same RMT to win Bullshit. it's just that this pyramid is inverted. Now the economy is so bloated and controlled by a small minority of players, there is no way anyone can just come in and "play the game" It's all the same bullshit. I went through it with Anarchy Online and the BS associated with multiple accounts. Don't even think about playing that game back in its day with only one subscription.

Kyleran

Torval said:

Does this game sell resources, skills, or any other game aspect, OR the currency to buy those? Can you use real world money to acquire any or all of those. To me that would constitute what is classically called "P2W".

There is a difference between piece-mealing out a game by selling "cosmetics" in a cash shop and "P2W". That doesn't make piece-mealing less objectionable, just a different aspect of aggressive monetization.

To bring it home in our world, FO76 is "P2W" with their FO 1st sub by providing additional unlimited storage for crafting materials. It is also true of the lunch boxes, scrap kits, and repair kits. The many cosmetics they lock behind the Atom Shop and FO1st are not pay to win but does constitute piecem-mealing, as do the item packages that can only be bought with real world money directly. Those probably lie in a gray area. Some of the CAMP building objects somewhat skirt "P2W" in the advantage (they require few mats and have a lower building budget) and exclusivity they provide players who purchase them.

TL;DR - There is no greener grass.

Neil Young was once heckled by a fan in the audience, "They all sound the same!". Neil yelled back in reply, "It's all one song!"

As you have a much broader definition of P2W than me I doubt we could achieve any sort of consensus or understanding on the subject.

I do not equate such items as repair kits as P2W, rather they provide some small efficiency which I've never needed, seeing as I have earned 300 plus in game which clutter my inventory.

Back to EVE, you can create a free account however your Avatar will be severely restricted in what skills, skill levels they can learn, with much slower skill training rates than if a player decides to pay the monthly sub.

So, pay to win by your definition I guess, but certainly not mine, which is also how I view FO76s 1st sub, unlimited scrap box (and other nice benefits) is very convenient, but in no way constitutes a win.

Returning to EVE they do sell a skill extractor players can buy to extract skill points from characters which trained them up in game.

Once full, these can be sold for in game ISK which players can used to inject SPS into existing characters with diminishing returns for higher skill point characters.

So, a new player can purchase game time credits from CCP, sell them to another player for ISK, and theoretically inject them until they have ever skill at max level in the game. (Stupidly expensive though).

They could repeat the ISK buying process to fit the best ship / models in the game and yet unless they are a well seasoned vet the most probable outcome would be the loss of their very expensive ship.

So can someone pay to win in EVE, sure, but will they win, not likely.

I played EVE for 10 years and can honestly say I never felt I lost a fight because the other player bought an advantage.

Perhaps they did but it isn't really discernable from any other advantage a wealthy player or corporation has who earned such by subbing longer or making better uses of the tools provided.

Brume

I personally do believe Eve Online cross the line on the p2w status, there is still a gradation on the 2win definition and its not as bad as some people here would say. You can technically purchase isk with your own money, but they do not provide player with any other advantage. I stop playing only because I do not have enough time, and i still consider it the best MMO i ever played. The game is totally playable and i didnt see any disbalance as some other have mention. Becoming insanely rich is not hard at all if that is your goal.

apb2011

I love how RMT is such a bad thing. Like it or not RMT is the future. "RMT negatively effects everyone". Except those that are making money to feed themselves and their families.

RMT will be mainstream, when gamers realize that they get absolutely jack sht for the time they put into these games. RMT will be an optional compensation for those seeking that for the time they put into games. Time = money.

When Paypal finally implements crypto into their system, with all the big players following along. All you people that hate the fact the some people want to be compensated for the TIME they put into these games, ya'll can go fly a kite.

Game devs are allowed to make money off the consumers, but consumers can't make anything? Things will change.

Horusra

apb2011 said:

I love how RMT is such a bad thing. Like it or not RMT is the future. "RMT negatively effects everyone". Except those that are making money to feed themselves and their families.

RMT will be mainstream, when gamers realize that they get absolutely jack sht for the time they put into these games. RMT will be an optional compensation for those seeking that for the time they put into games. Time = money.

When Paypal finally implements crypto into their system, with all the big players following along. All you people that hate the fact the some people want to be compensated for the TIME they put into these games, ya'll can go fly a kite.

Game devs are allowed to make money off the consumers, but consumers can't make anything? Things will change.

Think cryptocurrency is in for a rude awakening soon.  Governments do not like people hiding money from them.

apb2011

Think cryptocurrency is in for a rude awakening soon.  Governments do not like people hiding money from them.

I agree with this, but why beat em if you can join em = Governments will have their own types of crypto.

And this will make BTC and other viable coins more lucrative.