Can a Failing MMORPG Ever Recover? | One Good Roll | MMORPG.com

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Can a Failing MMORPG Ever Recover? | One Good Roll | MMORPG.com

Its true many MMORPGs don't make the cut, and won't ever live up to the expectations the developers have for them. The real question is, can an MMORPG ever really recover from the brink of failure?

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Angrakhan

I would say the jury is still out on New World. While they had a pretty massive resurgence with Brimstone Sands according to the steam charts they're nose diving quickly right back to where they were.

FFXIV shows that it's possible but requires a pretty massive risk and effort to turn things around. No other company has had the stones to do what they did, and if they did there's no guarantee it would have the same results.

Fact of the matter is the MMO industry is a tough business to get into and stay in even if you're one of the handful of titles that's successful. It's a wonder anyone takes the risk, and I think that's why you don't see many AAA efforts to break into the market with new IPs. We'll have to see how Hogwarts does when it releases, but the industry is on life support.

ohrecon

Honestly, I do think people are just tired of the same ol stuff. It's been said here about 3 billion times but when we see that "brand new mmorpg!" it literally is taking a cookie cutter template, making a handful of super small changes and being released. Then the developers are flabbergasted that it tanked and don't understand why. Sure you might grab some new players to try your game but most are going to stay with what they are playing (more developed, longer history of not shutting down, etc) then jumping shit.

Just look at some of the long time MMO games still running. Minus WoW & FFXIV, you still have people playing games like Destiny 2, Warframe, POE, etc. They all entered the market not confined by whatever time the cookie cutter was.

renegeed

The only reason it succeeded for FFXIV is because of two things, a good producer took over and the FF brand with it's loyal playerbase. I feel the second is most important here, even with Yoshi-P, if it was some new IP with no existing fanbase, it would have still failed.

Greatness

An aversion to a bad taste in the past is nearly impossible to sooth.

Asturios

Angrakhan said:

I would say the jury is still out on New World. While they had a pretty massive resurgence with Brimstone Sands according to the steam charts they're nose diving quickly right back to where they were.



FFXIV shows that it's possible but requires a pretty massive risk and effort to turn things around. No other company has had the stones to do what they did, and if they did there's no guarantee it would have the same results.



Fact of the matter is the MMO industry is a tough business to get into and stay in even if you're one of the handful of titles that's successful. It's a wonder anyone takes the risk, and I think that's why you don't see many AAA efforts to break into the market with new IPs. We'll have to see how Hogwarts does when it releases, but the industry is on life support.

If you refere to Hogwarts Legacy with your mentioning to Hogwarts then what do you want to see ? i mean this is about if MMORPGS Can recover from failure not Singleplayer games ^^ you cant compare a Singleplayer / Coop Game (if they havent scrapped the Coop part) with an MMORPG. And as far as i know both Harry Potter MMOS from EA and Amazon stopped development correct me if iam wrong didnt follow the whole process of those games thats just what i heard so far.

Nasa

Going F2P has been the savior for at least LOTRO, SWTOR and AION

Mendel

I think that an MMORPG in distress is not completely lost, but no company has done enough to address the distressing factors and reverse its course.  Instead, they patch what are essentially quick fixes to try to mask serious systemic and design problems -- a bandaid where a tourniquet is needed.

To compound the issue, companies are very hesitant to wipe after launch, providing the 'early' adopters with potential extra benefits in-game.  Even if these benefits are non-existent, this will color any possible future player's perception of the game.  That first impression is very difficult to reverse.

Scot

The first MMORPG that turned itself round was Anarchy Online, but I am sure Stephen knows that, taking one to two years to do so. It never shut down to my knowledge but then the problems (from memory) were mostly inability to log on, lag and to a lesser extent lack of content. They were not bugs and duping, or gameplay systems but the problems AO did have lasted more than a few months. I was only in the game a couple of months then coming back at the two year point by which time the game had been fully up and running for nearly a year.

Back then there were far fewer online games to play let alone MMORPGs, there was room to make a huge mistake and time to rectify it and come back to success. That landscape does not exist now, so any game that is seen to fail at launch (what happens from launch to the few months point) is likely to never recover. But it is not impossible to do so, just far harder.

Is it better to crack on and update or close down and take the time to build the game up again? Well that's a devil and the deep blue sea decision, you have no guarantee either method is correct and taking either route could mark the end or new beginning of your MMORPG. I do think closing down is the braver step, even if it is a lot easier to work out a games issues when it is not in service. Appearance is all and a temporary close down of a game that has not gone well is going to have players writing off your game, but FF XIV pulled it off to great accolade so it can be done.

LamiaCritter

I don't think it's out of the question, but it'd be difficult.

Then again when people call every single MMO "dYiNg"- most of which are for no legitimate reason, and the way some people act like Steam pop-charts of anything less than basically 70k is automatically "dEaD gAmE".....

Nebless

Nasa said:

Going F2P has been the savior for at least LOTRO, SWTOR and AION

DDO too, but even though they were able to stay afloat; DDO, LotRO and SWTOR have never come totally back to where they were before.

So the 'ever recover' part of the article title ...... maybe not so much.

Brainy

Hard to get a 2nd impression.  Only 2 MMO's I know of to really come back from the brink are FFXIV and Albion Online (sort of).

New world has a core game loop problem and its minor resurgence despite the tons of money they are throwing at this game is only temporary and as steamcharts is showing its dropping down quickly again.  Expect more server merges.

Why do people think they can change the trajectory of a game without changing the fundemental problems causing its demise?  Until the devs can figure out what the public actually wants, these games will continue to death spiral.

Scot

Brainy said:

Hard to get a 2nd impression.  Only 2 MMO's I know of to really come back from the brink are FFXIV and Albion Online (sort of).

New world has a core game loop problem and its minor resurgence despite the tons of money they are throwing at this game is only temporary and as steamcharts is showing its dropping down quickly again.  Expect more server merges.

Why do people think they can change the trajectory of a game without changing the fundemental problems causing its demise?  Until the devs can figure out what the public actually wants, these games will continue to death spiral.

What do you think Albion Online changed to make the come back? I have heard about them adding more PvE, but that's about it.

maskedweasel

Scot said:

Brainy said:

Hard to get a 2nd impression.  Only 2 MMO's I know of to really come back from the brink are FFXIV and Albion Online (sort of).

New world has a core game loop problem and its minor resurgence despite the tons of money they are throwing at this game is only temporary and as steamcharts is showing its dropping down quickly again.  Expect more server merges.

Why do people think they can change the trajectory of a game without changing the fundemental problems causing its demise?  Until the devs can figure out what the public actually wants, these games will continue to death spiral.

What do you think Albion Online changed to make the come back? I have heard about them adding more PvE, but that's about it.

I don't think they changed anything I think they released on mobile and that was it. I still don't think the game is very good. 

Scot

maskedweasel said:

Scot said:

Brainy said:

Hard to get a 2nd impression.  Only 2 MMO's I know of to really come back from the brink are FFXIV and Albion Online (sort of).

New world has a core game loop problem and its minor resurgence despite the tons of money they are throwing at this game is only temporary and as steamcharts is showing its dropping down quickly again.  Expect more server merges.

Why do people think they can change the trajectory of a game without changing the fundemental problems causing its demise?  Until the devs can figure out what the public actually wants, these games will continue to death spiral.

What do you think Albion Online changed to make the come back? I have heard about them adding more PvE, but that's about it.

I don't think they changed anything I think they released on mobile and that was it. I still don't think the game is very good. 

My impression was it slowly gained traction after a bad start to a decent player base and then added PvE, though no idea if that helped the numbers.

ultimateduck

It's such an odd situation that were in. There are a lot of MMOs to chose from and a lot of them are easy to get into, but there's always something lacking that causes players to just stop playing. Some games that were considered decent at best, like Warhamer Online, died out but are now considered pretty good games worth looking into again. Star Wars Galaxies was loved by a lot of people and is often considered one of the greats, but it still died.

I think the genre in its current form has a problem of "been there, done that". Nothing is new. Nothing is mystical or original. Nothing has both depth in class, gameplay and social aspect as well as balance in play styles. It's either all PvE with endless grinding for an endgame or it's FFA full loot PvP. The games that do offer both have great implementation of one and poor implementation of another.

My hope is still with VR. Getting that feeling of exploration of a world I am literally standing in, not just look at on a screen. Fighting and casting spells using my entire body, not a keyboard and mouse. If it doesn't happen, I will be bummed and my only option will be to win a billion dollar lottery and buy the right to remake DAoC.

Brainy

Scot said:

Brainy said:

Hard to get a 2nd impression.  Only 2 MMO's I know of to really come back from the brink are FFXIV and Albion Online (sort of).

New world has a core game loop problem and its minor resurgence despite the tons of money they are throwing at this game is only temporary and as steamcharts is showing its dropping down quickly again.  Expect more server merges.

Why do people think they can change the trajectory of a game without changing the fundemental problems causing its demise?  Until the devs can figure out what the public actually wants, these games will continue to death spiral.

What do you think Albion Online changed to make the come back? I have heard about them adding more PvE, but that's about it.

The biggest thing they did was go Free to play.  That combined with a PVE expansion.  Albion got down to 450 players and was pretty consistent at that number.  The moment they launched Free to play combined with a PVE it jumped to 13k+ concurrent.

Its commen sense really.  PVP players NEEDS targets.  When they added PVE, it turned an average game into a little better than average game.  Free to play brought in the targets. Its one of the best free to play MMO's on the market. 

If you are a person that likes PVE or PVP but cant afford to buy a game, what other free to play MMO can you play thats better?

As long as they keep it F2P and no major competitors that are F2P are released that are "better".  This game will keep chugging along.

Mendel

ultimateduck said:

<snip>

My hope is still with VR. Getting that feeling of exploration of a world I am literally standing in, not just look at on a screen. Fighting and casting spells using my entire body, not a keyboard and mouse. If it doesn't happen, I will be bummed and my only option will be to win a billion dollar lottery and buy the right to remake DAoC.

With taxes and inflation, I'd suggesting winning 2 of those billion dollar lotteries.  Plus, you've tipped your hand.  Expect the asking price for the DAoC rights to double right there.

Nebless

ultimateduck said:

Star Wars Galaxies was loved by a lot of people and is often considered one of the greats, but it still died.

I don't think that's an accurate statement.  It didn't 'die', but it was killed when Lucas didn't renew the license, going in favor of SWTOR.

Granted going NGE drove off the older players, but a different demographic was coming in and most likely it would have been in the same category as DDO, LotRO and Age of Conan today with a small dedicated population keeping it afloat (if the pop of the SWG Legends server is anything to go by).

KnightFalz

It's been done, so yes.

Sovrath

Well, sure Final Fantasy IV did it.

It's just that "how to do it" is a bit evasive. It takes a total commitment and maybe even a willingness to completely remake the game.

Most companies aren't willing to do that. Squar Enix was because it was a matter of pride for them as well as them feeling embarrassed.

Iselin

They can only recover if they figure out why their original ideas were not well-received.

More often than not studios have no clue why their game is not well received so they do tweaks to what we dislike to make it more palatable instead of doing the core overhaul the game needs.

Sticking to your guns is not how you recover when the concept is flawed.

BarelyEinstein

I still think about Auto Assault fairly often

Angrakhan

Asturios said:

Angrakhan said:

I would say the jury is still out on New World. While they had a pretty massive resurgence with Brimstone Sands according to the steam charts they're nose diving quickly right back to where they were.





FFXIV shows that it's possible but requires a pretty massive risk and effort to turn things around. No other company has had the stones to do what they did, and if they did there's no guarantee it would have the same results.





Fact of the matter is the MMO industry is a tough business to get into and stay in even if you're one of the handful of titles that's successful. It's a wonder anyone takes the risk, and I think that's why you don't see many AAA efforts to break into the market with new IPs. We'll have to see how Hogwarts does when it releases, but the industry is on life support.

If you refere to Hogwarts Legacy with your mentioning to Hogwarts then what do you want to see ? i mean this is about if MMORPGS Can recover from failure not Singleplayer games ^^ you cant compare a Singleplayer / Coop Game (if they havent scrapped the Coop part) with an MMORPG.

And as far as i know both Harry Potter MMOS from EA and Amazon stopped development correct me if iam wrong didnt follow the whole process of those games thats just what i heard so far.

You know what I was completely confused about what Hogwarts Legacy was. I guess I saw "open world RPG" and confused that description with an MMO, so disregard the whole bit about that game. My apologies.

OG_Solareus

For western developers and publishers, they are building games for the fail. Hype as much, get the intial release cash in and sunset 3 months in.

Crowfall is a perfect example of this. They are taking it to a new level with a double pump cash grab.

Building for fail, is faster economically to gain from then running a game world 24/7 for years on end. I don't even at this point think Western developers look at running games past 1 year anymore.

DigDuggy

Ha!  Whose definition of 'failing'  This community?  Many predict failure within 36 hours of launch...no scratch that...before launch.  They get it right sometimes of course.    MMOs are a complicated business and many will fail.  Doesn't take much predicting, although, they'll post about how right they are.

Maybe we believe people who post statistics that can't be verified or come from sources that aren't generally regarded highly or have any methodology behind their prediction.  Do we believe them that the MMO is failing?

Now, let's take those who actually take the time to wait and see and do some reading and analysis.  I'll accept their analysis.  I would say yes, a game can come back.  However, it's tough.  There is a lot of competition, and the MMO world pretty unforgiving.  While it's not an MMO, No Man's Sky is kind of the poster child.  Another is FFXIV which failed, but was resurrected with ARR.

In order to truly predict whether an MMO will fail, we would need to be on the inside or do a lot of looking.  You would have to know a lot about what a company can tolerate before it has to close shop.