Fact, thats not enough money to make an MMO. Where is the rest coming from is my question? My guess is gamers is the plan?
How much it costs to make an MMO depends tremendously on what you want to do. If you want to make a fairly barebones MMORPG that doesn't have very many features or very much content, you could easily do it for under $1 million.
The closest AAA sandbox I think we had the oppurtunity to play was created released way back in 1997. The early days of Ultima Online was as perfect as an MMO could ever be. Lets hope Pax Dei is the start of something amazing.
And yet it still only survived because of Trammel.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
So I'm a game developer myself, working in Unreal 5. Prior to that, I have been working for about 8 years in Unreal 4.
It's exciting that they're using UE5 for this, but it also tempers my expectations of when this could possible release. It's very early days for UE5, making large worlds. They've just transitions from the older system of World Composition for open world content, to a new system called World Partition. This new system is really in flux, and feels like it is really a year or two away from being fully mature, feature and stability wise. This makes me wonder how far this game really is from release... I'd guess at least 2-3 years minimum. Exciting! but also makes me just me chill out a bit, expectation wise.
I know a few people who also are self proclaimed "game developers", who in reality just experiment with the engine as amateurs and are in no way on the level of a professional developer in a commercial game studio. Not to mention those guys, Blizzard veterans and others, are probably backed up by Epic directly.
Do you have examples of your work ?
Respect, walk, what did you say? Respect, walk Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me? - PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
This to me is a milking Unreal Engine 5 that does impressive visuals with little work.
If this doesn't have the budget of a mainstream MMO, I think this will fall short on well, every other aspect. This is the doubled edged sword of UE5, impressive visuals you can barely tell the difference between a small indie studio effort vs a high production value undertaking, because that matters, a hell lot, for the development effort an MMO game will englobe to ever hit on expectations.
So unless it can be confirmed they actually have a decently large development team on top of the money, I wouldn't read much into this project being something that'll be on the scope standards set by current mainstream MMOs.
The closest AAA sandbox I think we had the oppurtunity to play was created released way back in 1997. The early days of Ultima Online was as perfect as an MMO could ever be. Lets hope Pax Dei is the start of something amazing.
And yet it still only survived because of Trammel.
Trammel does not take away the fact that that UO is the best open World MMORPG sandbox , made to date , look at what we w are being offered today things like New World , which is more like a Litterbox compared.
Let's hope Pax Dei is a better effort than NW , but Amazon set tye bar quite low
The closest AAA sandbox I think we had the oppurtunity to play was created released way back in 1997. The early days of Ultima Online was as perfect as an MMO could ever be. Lets hope Pax Dei is the start of something amazing.
Let's hope they can do better than UO which "won" Computer Gaming World's "Coaster of the Year" award, meaning the CDs were best used to place your cold drinks on them.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I never played it, but recall one "issue" AC2 had which many viewed as a negative was no npc vendors, everything built by players, at least at launch.
Comment from a 2008 thread on this site.
"2) No NPC's that I recall. I think they wanted the players to make the world come alive and sell their wares as merchants in place of the NPC's. The result was that the world felt pretty empty."
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I never played it, but recall one "issue" AC2 had which many viewed as a negative was no npc vendors, everything built by players, at least at launch.
Sometimes I get the feeling that when they say SANDBOX BUILT BY PLAYERS we're supposed to stop what we're doing and salivate like dogs hearing "squirrel" in Up. It doesn't seem to work on me. It makes me tune out instead.
Give me a well-designed multiplayer game as idiot griefer-proof as possible instead and screw sandboxes.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
I never played it, but recall one "issue" AC2 had which many viewed as a negative was no npc vendors, everything built by players, at least at launch.
Comment from a 2008 thread on this site.
"2) No NPC's that I recall. I think they wanted the players to make the world come alive and sell their wares as merchants in place of the NPC's. The result was that the world felt pretty empty."
I think it is good there is no release date, we have seen those sorts of promises before. Actually some recognition of the problems with both "roadmaps" and polish before launch is needed by every CF venture.
I think it is good there is no release date, we have seen those sorts of promises before. Actually some recognition of the problems with both "roadmaps" and polish before launch is needed by every CF venture.
I absolutely would prefer devs not provide dates unless...they are asking players to hand over money to help build the game.
Even then I get that dates are aspirational in such endeavors, so no worries if dates have to be replanned as long as the reasons are shared at a high level.
What I abhor is devs who take customers money, totally miss all dates by absolutely unreasonable amounts (aka they were always too incompetent or lying even) and then go totally dark on the next planned release date for years on end.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I never played it, but recall one "issue" AC2 had which many viewed as a negative was no npc vendors, everything built by players, at least at launch.
Comment from a 2008 thread on this site.
"2) No NPC's that I recall. I think they wanted the players to make the world come alive and sell their wares as merchants in place of the NPC's. The result was that the world felt pretty empty."
The way Ryzom handled this is that there are NPC vendors, but they only sell basic items. So technically not everything is made by players. But the vendor items are grade C. Any good quality item is player made.
I never played it, but recall one "issue" AC2 had which many viewed as a negative was no npc vendors, everything built by players, at least at launch.
Comment from a 2008 thread on this site.
"2) No NPC's that I recall. I think they wanted the players to make the world come alive and sell their wares as merchants in place of the NPC's. The result was that the world felt pretty empty."
The way Ryzom handled this is that there are NPC vendors, but they only sell basic items. So technically not everything is made by players. But the vendor items are grade C. Any good quality item is player made.
Actually, New World doesn't have any "NPC Vendors" per se either. Faction vendors sell good "starter" stuff, but that's it. Everything else comes from player interaction.
Respect, walk, what did you say? Respect, walk Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me? - PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
I never played it, but recall one "issue" AC2 had which many viewed as a negative was no npc vendors, everything built by players, at least at launch.
Comment from a 2008 thread on this site.
"2) No NPC's that I recall. I think they wanted the players to make the world come alive and sell their wares as merchants in place of the NPC's. The result was that the world felt pretty empty."
The way Ryzom handled this is that there are NPC vendors, but they only sell basic items. So technically not everything is made by players. But the vendor items are grade C. Any good quality item is player made.
Actually, New World doesn't have any "NPC Vendors" per se either. Faction vendors sell good "starter" stuff, but that's it. Everything else comes from player interaction.
I'd even question that the faction starter gear is terribly relevant anymore, after the Burning Sands update I always found better, yet affordable gear on the trade merchants long before I got my faction level high enough to purchase anything very useful.
Hopefully they'll be looking to rebalance faction levelling and gear rewards as on my latest alt I only skilled it to max so I can purchase my two a day gypsum orbs and make bit of gold on my daily 3 faction quests.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Or for that matter why it would be a benefit at all to someone who already exclusively plays MMOs on a desktop PC.
"Cloud-Native" is the clue that these guys aren't Game Developers. They are Financial Hobgoblins. "Game" is just the dressing for the exploit.
It certainly appears that someone found an underutilized buzzword. I'll stick with my usual description of games that can be played on mobile, console, and PCs -- bad.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Can't remember which MMO i'm waiting for, but i do remember me waiting for.
"Human beings make life so interesting. Do you know, that in a universe so full of wonders, they have managed to invent boredom. (Death)” ― Terry Pratchett,
Comments
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
I know a few people who also are self proclaimed "game developers", who in reality just experiment with the engine as amateurs and are in no way on the level of a professional developer in a commercial game studio. Not to mention those guys, Blizzard veterans and others, are probably backed up by Epic directly.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
If this doesn't have the budget of a mainstream MMO, I think this will fall short on well, every other aspect. This is the doubled edged sword of UE5, impressive visuals you can barely tell the difference between a small indie studio effort vs a high production value undertaking, because that matters, a hell lot, for the development effort an MMO game will englobe to ever hit on expectations.
So unless it can be confirmed they actually have a decently large development team on top of the money, I wouldn't read much into this project being something that'll be on the scope standards set by current mainstream MMOs.
Let's hope Pax Dei is a better effort than NW , but Amazon set tye bar quite low
UO actually "won" two years in a row as I recall.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Like others already said, bit of a samey song and dance that we just have to see results.
Doesn't really explain how they plan to make the sandboxy stuff actually engaging on a large social scale.
EDIT: Oh seems there's no NPCs, just hostile monsters.
Well, I'll look at it again when they stop reliving the same mistake loop 76 worked it's way through.
Comment from a 2008 thread on this site.
"2) No NPC's that I recall. I think they wanted the players to make the world come alive and sell their wares as merchants in place of the NPC's. The result was that the world felt pretty empty."
https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/184735/asherons-call-2-what-was-it-like-why-did-it-fail
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Give me a well-designed multiplayer game as idiot griefer-proof as possible instead and screw sandboxes.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
AC2 was definitely not a sandbox at all.
That was one of its problems, it was a theme park built like a sandbox... of course it didn't work.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
Even then I get that dates are aspirational in such endeavors, so no worries if dates have to be replanned as long as the reasons are shared at a high level.
What I abhor is devs who take customers money, totally miss all dates by absolutely unreasonable amounts (aka they were always too incompetent or lying even) and then go totally dark on the next planned release date for years on end.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The way Ryzom handled this is that there are NPC vendors, but they only sell basic items. So technically not everything is made by players. But the vendor items are grade C. Any good quality item is player made.
------------
2024: 47 years on the Net.
Actually, New World doesn't have any "NPC Vendors" per se either. Faction vendors sell good "starter" stuff, but that's it. Everything else comes from player interaction.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
Hopefully they'll be looking to rebalance faction levelling and gear rewards as on my latest alt I only skilled it to max so I can purchase my two a day gypsum orbs and make bit of gold on my daily 3 faction quests.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Or for that matter why it would be a benefit at all to someone who already exclusively plays MMOs on a desktop PC.
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/That's pulling stuff out on one's ass as far as I know it.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
Right?
Right?
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
― Terry Pratchett,