I really am starting to think studios are trying to confuse players as to what is actually launching. It is the "official launch" (I assume then they have unofficial ones?) but it is only early access. If they start using the word "release" with early access they are definitely trying to muddy the water.
Early access is a release, I see nothing wrong with that word - personally I do not pay attention to any of these labels anyway as they change from player to player and from developer to developer, rendering them meaningless. I do find the wordplay in this particular case hilarious though.
Now if they call this "official early access", the other one was "just" "early access", they were already using the term "pre-early access" for the stage before, eh, too silly. It reminds me of those count-to-threes where you say "1, 2, 2 and a half, 2 and three quarters, 2.9, 2.99, 2.999..."
What is the current state of the Early Access version?
How is the full version planned to differ from the Early Access version?
if you trust them (I only trust and judge current states against current pricing).
Well what term do you think should be used for "final release"? Studios did seem to be using the word "release" to indicate something that has come out of early access or was never in early access. We need a clear demarcation, the whole advent of early access has obscured when a game is fit for launch and when it is launched to release as I think of it.
It's hard to think of another business that gets away with this. Do people watch movies that aren't done yet?
Well in theater, especially musicals, there are tryouts where the final product can change quite a bit.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
And what's the difference between "early access" and "released"? Doesn't the dev put both tags arbitrarily anyway? Can you trust them? Are all released games complete? After release, are they not going to get more features (especially GaaS ones), and hence become more "complete"?
The terms are meaningless. At some point the studio decides to charge money and provide access to their game, and from that point on, you can keep evaluating whether it's worth its price point and play it or not - that's it.
Well I agree up to a point, there has always been this difficulty in that evaluation, but ask yourself who gains from early access gamers or studios? Remember when betas were played for free, that's gone. The launch and review was never a gold standard, but it was a standard and now studios have succeeded in removing that standard. What do we get, well we get the opportunity to play and pay for half completed games, which may never get completed. The studios are the only winners here, as EA exacerbates all the issues you just mentioned.
I did not reply to something you said in the other thread that struck a chord with me. One of the reasons you left us was all the people being banned for life. That has been so frustrating, I try to keep posters calm and urge everyone else to do so, but we still see it happening. I often don't agree with why they were banned, but we have to expect that, we will never agree with all such decisions. I am glad you decided that in spite of that you would come back!
Well in theater, especially musicals, there are tryouts where the final product can change quite a bit.
A comedian can change his routine on the fly, this is not the same as getting half the number of jokes as early access. Same for the theater in my eyes, the production may change but it is still a full production.
Do they still offer a early adopter package of some sort? I've several thousand dollars I'd like to invest.
Well... it's your lucky day! But note that these special packages are only available to us Founders. Peasants can only buy the $450 package. BUT, Founders can still buy AND GIFT packages! So if you are really nice and send me $10k I can still get you in.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I really am starting to think studios are trying to confuse players as to what is actually launching. It is the "official launch" (I assume then they have unofficial ones?) but it is only early access. If they start using the word "release" with early access they are definitely trying to muddy the water.
Early access is a release, I see nothing wrong with that word - personally I do not pay attention to any of these labels anyway as they change from player to player and from developer to developer, rendering them meaningless. I do find the wordplay in this particular case hilarious though.
Now if they call this "official early access", the other one was "just" "early access", they were already using the term "pre-early access" for the stage before, eh, too silly. It reminds me of those count-to-threes where you say "1, 2, 2 and a half, 2 and three quarters, 2.9, 2.99, 2.999..."
What is the current state of the Early Access version?
How is the full version planned to differ from the Early Access version?
if you trust them (I only trust and judge current states against current pricing).
Well what term do you think should be used for "final release"? Studios did seem to be using the word "release" to indicate something that has come out of early access or was never in early access. We need a clear demarcation, the whole advent of early access has obscured when a game is fit for launch and when it is launched to release as I think of it.
It's hard to think of another business that gets away with this. Do people watch movies that aren't done yet?
Well in theater, especially musicals, there are tryouts where the final product can change quite a bit.
Yes, but do they charge full price for an audience to see it? And do they claim that the musical has "released" and is ready for theaters to show it?
I didn't think tryouts were open to the public to watch as if they were watching the actual musical.
I really am starting to think studios are trying to confuse players as to what is actually launching. It is the "official launch" (I assume then they have unofficial ones?) but it is only early access. If they start using the word "release" with early access they are definitely trying to muddy the water.
Early access is a release, I see nothing wrong with that word - personally I do not pay attention to any of these labels anyway as they change from player to player and from developer to developer, rendering them meaningless. I do find the wordplay in this particular case hilarious though.
Now if they call this "official early access", the other one was "just" "early access", they were already using the term "pre-early access" for the stage before, eh, too silly. It reminds me of those count-to-threes where you say "1, 2, 2 and a half, 2 and three quarters, 2.9, 2.99, 2.999..."
What is the current state of the Early Access version?
How is the full version planned to differ from the Early Access version?
if you trust them (I only trust and judge current states against current pricing).
Well what term do you think should be used for "final release"? Studios did seem to be using the word "release" to indicate something that has come out of early access or was never in early access. We need a clear demarcation, the whole advent of early access has obscured when a game is fit for launch and when it is launched to release as I think of it.
It's hard to think of another business that gets away with this. Do people watch movies that aren't done yet?
Well in theater, especially musicals, there are tryouts where the final product can change quite a bit.
Yes, but do they charge full price for an audience to see it? And do they claim that the musical has "released" and is ready for theaters to show it?
I didn't think tryouts were open to the public to watch as if they were watching the actual musical.
Wait, I think you might be on to something, theater production companies should start charging for early access packages where fans can go watch during the rehearsal phases.
They could even offer digital online viewing and the whaling tier in person packages with ever higher prices for the best seats.
People could even resell their seats and packages on the gray market.
At the highest tier one could buy their seat on a seasonal basis, owning it for the entire duration, early access through every view date, reselling their seat to whoever they saw fit at whatever price they wanted.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Well in theater, especially musicals, there are tryouts where the final product can change quite a bit.
A comedian can change his routine on the fly, this is not the same as getting half the number of jokes as early access. Same for the theater in my eyes, the production may change but it is still a full production.
That's not necessarily true. You can get just one act of a production and perhaps an act of another production if it's a festival. You're still paying for the ticket.
Still a valid point for tryouts.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Camelot Unchained remains the only MMORPG in production that I'm excited by!
Do I think it'll release? Not really
Do I think itll release with the features that excite me most? No
But it's still a possibility! Mark Jacobs / CSE are the only developers attempting to fix some of the biggest problems I have with the genre and some of their design intentions are still miles ahead of what the competition are doing. So, if they release with the stuff I'm excited about, I think it'll be great. I just dont think it's gonna happen.
Currently Playing: WAR RoR - Spitt rr7X Black Orc | Scrotling rr6X Squig Herder | Scabrous rr4X Shaman
Camelot Unchained remains the only MMORPG in production that I'm excited by!
Do I think it'll release? Not really
Do I think itll release with the features that excite me most? No
But it's still a possibility! Mark Jacobs / CSE are the only developers attempting to fix some of the biggest problems I have with the genre and some of their design intentions are still miles ahead of what the competition are doing. So, if they release with the stuff I'm excited about, I think it'll be great. I just dont think it's gonna happen.
Camelot Unchained remains the only MMORPG in production that I'm excited by!
Do I think it'll release? Not really
Do I think itll release with the features that excite me most? No
But it's still a possibility! Mark Jacobs / CSE are the only developers attempting to fix some of the biggest problems I have with the genre and some of their design intentions are still miles ahead of what the competition are doing. So, if they release with the stuff I'm excited about, I think it'll be great. I just dont think it's gonna happen.
Let's talk about their great engine, looks like that's going to be available pretty soon.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Yes, but do they charge full price for an audience to see it? And do they claim that the musical has "released" and is ready for theaters to show it?
I didn't think tryouts were open to the public to watch as if they were watching the actual musical.
Oh no! Tryouts/Previews are open to the public. That's the idea.
Days of Wine and Roses are in Previews at Studio 54 before it moves to Broadway. The cheapest tickets are $109.00. Even though I initially did a search and found $64.
Previews are a "work in progress." I don't ever remember a message saying "this work can change" but it's known that "this work can change."
Now, most of the time it's a full musical. However, one can have an act of a show or even just several songs/scenes at a festival. A person would pay full price but they would get multiple songs/scenes from different shows.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Yes, but do they charge full price for an audience to see it? And do they claim that the musical has "released" and is ready for theaters to show it?
I didn't think tryouts were open to the public to watch as if they were watching the actual musical.
Oh no! Tryouts/Previews are open to the public. That's the idea.
Days of Wine and Roses are in Previews at Studio 54 before it moves to Broadway. The cheapest tickets are $109.00. Even though I initially did a search and found $64.
Previews are a "work in progress." I don't ever remember a message saying "this work can change" but it's known that "this work can change."
Now, most of the time it's a full musical. However, one can have an act of a show or even just several songs/scenes at a festival. A person would pay full price but they would get multiple songs/scenes from different shows.
Gawd, it looks like those early access cars are coming our way quicker than I thought.
Camelot Unchained remains the only MMORPG in production that I'm excited by!
Do I think it'll release? Not really
Do I think itll release with the features that excite me most? No
But it's still a possibility! Mark Jacobs / CSE are the only developers attempting to fix some of the biggest problems I have with the genre and some of their design intentions are still miles ahead of what the competition are doing. So, if they release with the stuff I'm excited about, I think it'll be great. I just dont think it's gonna happen.
Is that what makes this painful?
I'm not in any pain over the issue, lol!
I didn't crowdfund this game (or any others for that matter) so im not financially invested, or even emotionally invested. If this game doesn't release, or if it does release but its bad, how is that any different to the last 10 years in this genre?
Currently Playing: WAR RoR - Spitt rr7X Black Orc | Scrotling rr6X Squig Herder | Scabrous rr4X Shaman
Camelot Unchained remains the only MMORPG in production that I'm excited by!
Do I think it'll release? Not really
Do I think itll release with the features that excite me most? No
But it's still a possibility! Mark Jacobs / CSE are the only developers attempting to fix some of the biggest problems I have with the genre and some of their design intentions are still miles ahead of what the competition are doing. So, if they release with the stuff I'm excited about, I think it'll be great. I just dont think it's gonna happen.
Let's talk about their great engine, looks like that's going to be available pretty soon.
If the game is crap.....but the engine works well, I'll still count this as a win.
Given that there are no commercially available game engines that support massively multiplayer numbers out of the box, if the unchained engine does do that then it'll be a benefit for the genre.
We know the engine works in terms of network code, their tests have shown that to be true. But does it work once full combat mechanics have been added? Does it work once proper graphics have been plugged in? Does it work when we have 500+ players fighting over a huge player-built fort? That remains an unknown.
Currently Playing: WAR RoR - Spitt rr7X Black Orc | Scrotling rr6X Squig Herder | Scabrous rr4X Shaman
Camelot Unchained remains the only MMORPG in production that I'm excited by!
Do I think it'll release? Not really
Do I think itll release with the features that excite me most? No
But it's still a possibility! Mark Jacobs / CSE are the only developers attempting to fix some of the biggest problems I have with the genre and some of their design intentions are still miles ahead of what the competition are doing. So, if they release with the stuff I'm excited about, I think it'll be great. I just dont think it's gonna happen.
Let's talk about their great engine, looks like that's going to be available pretty soon.
If the game is crap.....but the engine works well, I'll still count this as a win.
Given that there are no commercially available game engines that support massively multiplayer numbers out of the box, if the unchained engine does do that then it'll be a benefit for the genre.
We know the engine works in terms of network code, their tests have shown that to be true. But does it work once full combat mechanics have been added? Does it work once proper graphics have been plugged in? Does it work when we have 500+ players fighting over a huge player-built fort? That remains an unknown.
Well one thing they recently validated was that their new Seasons Pass system works well with the first one in FS:R wrapping up in mid January.
I'm sure we are all happy to hear that great news.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Do they still offer a early adopter package of some sort? I've several thousand dollars I'd like to invest.
Well... it's your lucky day! But note that these special packages are only available to us Founders. Peasants can only buy the $450 package. BUT, Founders can still buy AND GIFT packages! So if you are really nice and send me $10k I can still get you in.
What in the actual ....F! That is crayzee!
You can buy Helldivers 2 on Steam for like $35, or $50 something if you want swag.
Also, it's hilarious that several of their "digital" tiers are sold out. Not because it's dumb to sellout of a virtual item that can be easily replicated, but because they're cutting off revenue streams. Notice that Star Citizen doesn't tell people they can't spend money. That's why they have half a billion and these guys are about broke af.
Do they still offer a early adopter package of some sort? I've several thousand dollars I'd like to invest.
Well... it's your lucky day! But note that these special packages are only available to us Founders. Peasants can only buy the $450 package. BUT, Founders can still buy AND GIFT packages! So if you are really nice and send me $10k I can still get you in.
What in the actual ....F! That is crayzee!
You can buy Helldivers 2 on Steam for like $35, or $50 something if you want swag.
Also, it's hilarious that several of their "digital" tiers are sold out. Not because it's dumb to sellout of a virtual item that can be easily replicated, but because they're cutting off revenue streams. Notice that Star Citizen doesn't tell people they can't spend money. That's why they have half a billion and these guys are about broke af.
Have to agree, your repost made me actually look at the numbers, shocking.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Comments
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I've several thousand dollars I'd like to invest.
I did not reply to something you said in the other thread that struck a chord with me. One of the reasons you left us was all the people being banned for life. That has been so frustrating, I try to keep posters calm and urge everyone else to do so, but we still see it happening. I often don't agree with why they were banned, but we have to expect that, we will never agree with all such decisions. I am glad you decided that in spite of that you would come back!
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I didn't think tryouts were open to the public to watch as if they were watching the actual musical.
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2024: 47 years on the Net.
They could even offer digital online viewing and the whaling tier in person packages with ever higher prices for the best seats.
People could even resell their seats and packages on the gray market.
At the highest tier one could buy their seat on a seasonal basis, owning it for the entire duration, early access through every view date, reselling their seat to whoever they saw fit at whatever price they wanted.
Now everyone can be a scalper like Ticket Master.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I'm sure we are all happy to hear that great news.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Feels a lot like how Linus must have felt
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon