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When a mmorpg shuts down should you have the right to open up your own server?
scaramoosh
Member Posts: 3,424
I belive that the company should launch software to be able to patch and add things into the game and run your own server (aslong as your not making money from it)
Brought this up since AC2 was canceled and people have brought that new expansion and feel cheated out of the money!
Would be nice, seeing as you paid money for that software.
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Don't click here...no2
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Don't click here...no2
scientology
I'm also saying Nar, the source code isn't yours and Turbine can use the serversource for one of their upcomming titles perhaps. So it would be a big error to hand it out for free of course. When they on the other hand don't want to use it anymore they can put it up for sale, but not free. They invested money in it and it is theirs to keep or do with it what they want. And that goes for all engines of companies.
"If all magic fails, rely on three feet of steel and a strong arm"
it could be argued you should be able to still play it as you've payed so much for something. I mean any regular game you buy you can play again in 2 years. Not with AC2. But you have "consumed" the product so that kinda breaks down.
Well if they just give you the world map and npc coding, I see nothing wrong with creating a private server. Cause you will have to do the work of scripting the NPC positions, actions, and story. It takes quite a bit of script learning and coding to be able to do something like that. If you have alot of experience in HTML coding that would make it a slight bit easier. Some people probably get bit of the software from a company to toy with on your own basis but, not really to host a public/private server. This usually involves a deal or licensed agreement.
If you have a few friends and you share the server with them exclusively meaning you create the accounts for them solely then I see nothing wrong with it. You could use it as a learning process, the experience would be useful if you ever decide to start a career in online gaming development.
Use it as a form of inspiration, like the way musicians have their roots in say Led Zeppelin, the game coders have their roots in Ultima Online. I say Yar, just with "limits".
Professor Hubert Farnsworth - That question is less stupid but, you asked it in a profoundly stupid way.
I don't see any harm in allowing private servers as long as they remain private and don't cast the original developers and/or game in a bad light. As for AC2, I believe they should refund people's money who bought the expansion. I don't play AC 1 or 2, but I know I'd be a little peeved shelling out money for a game and then having it shut down soon afterward. They knew they were going to shut down but continued to sell the expansion. Seems a little shady to me.
Legally, you need their permission, which would probably mean buying the rights.
Morally, I'd say that as long as you do not present someone else's work as yours and you do not make financial profit out of it without giving a share to the creator, there should be no issue. Same goes for using someone else's work as a basis for yours, as long as the other person is credited. This is an important issue in fan films, for example. There's many brilliant Star Wars fan films out there (Pink Five, Jedi House, Troops, IMPS, etc.) but still risk a copyright infrigement problem.
Currently playing:
* City of Heroes: Deggial, Assault Rifle/Devices Blaster. Server: Defiant.
* City of Villains: Snakeroot, Plant/Thorns Dominator. Server: Defiant.
You might want to start reading the terms before you click ok. Almost all mmorpgs state that the source code is owned by the company and you are merely "leasing" the game in one form or another.
ah yeah but were the terms at the shop. You look at the package does it say game might not continue?
I don't know the legal grounds, and not pretending to know, but that could be argued and would be relevant.
However, where I'm coming is not from having bought the game because I didn't, but people who bought legends the expansion and my belief that the game didn't have to be shut down, there was other solutions.
You may want to consider it as a telephone lease or something. Buying the package is similar to the initial installation costs and the monthly subscription is your monthly telephone bill. You know that an MMOG is a subscription-based service and the service might be discontinued, much like your telephone company might go under and stop providing their services. Legally, there is no issue.
Currently playing:
* City of Heroes: Deggial, Assault Rifle/Devices Blaster. Server: Defiant.
* City of Villains: Snakeroot, Plant/Thorns Dominator. Server: Defiant.
Out of curiosity, what other options do you think they had? They probably spent a lot of money building that expansion, with the hopes that it would bring back/in a lot of players. It didn't. They must have looked at the possibility of letting the game run with any updates, and seen that it would still lose money.
Unfortunately, Turbine is a business, and they have to do what's in their best interest (which should have included giving something back to the people who spent money on the expansion, IMO)
Other options, well they got 6-10k subscribers.
Horizons has half that, Runescape there is no payment is there?, Tale of the desert have 2k subscribers.
Of course there could be no content improvements, but it was viable to continue.
Its a waste when so much time has spent developing the game, when theres subscribers still wanting to play and Turbine choose to close it down. And surely they can put it with AC1 or something?
You're buying the games too soon
You still actually have the software. Once the free month is provdied - i think the publisher has met their obligations. In the case of AC2 - the expac released in early May. AC2 will close roughly 7 months after the expac was released. That is a reasonable amount of time to play the expac before the game close.
And regardless as to how much you paid - you didnt buy the rights to the intellectual property. I really dont see how launching a failed expansion negates the concepts of the IP laws. Also the DMRCA makes it irrelevant whether or not the "public" server is charging or not.
To answer the OP's question directly - no, you shouldnt be able to open a free server if a game closes. If we dont protect IP rights, you would see a lot less commercial development of games...
You paid for the license to use a certain piece of software. It was indicated at the package that it is a subscription-based service (they're legally bound to state that). Any aspect of the game, including your virtual characters and their virtual items, being intellectual property, still belong to the game publisher.
You still have the right to use the client, though. I think there's no legal issue in using it for a seperate service, like an emulated server. Still, it is debatable whether an emulated server would infringe copyright laws or not.
The Terms of Service state that you may not create an emulated server. While the Terms of Service are adequate for the game publisher to discontinue providing you the service (like your telephone company could discontinue the service if, say, you didn't pay your bills in time), it is uncertain whether it is a legally binding contract (as it has not been "tested" in a court of law), which would have further legal consequences and the game publisher could sue a third party who would create an emulated server (copyright issues aside, that is).
Currently playing:
* City of Heroes: Deggial, Assault Rifle/Devices Blaster. Server: Defiant.
* City of Villains: Snakeroot, Plant/Thorns Dominator. Server: Defiant.
But we don't know what the minimum cost of running those games is compared to AC2. AC was almost certainly built with loftier goals in mind, making it a more complex product. Sure, they might have been able to retool it and found ways to make do with fewer machines, less bandwidth, less support, etc.. But that would have involved throwing even more money at something that was seeing it's player base disappear (personally, I think 6K subscribers is probably more accurate than 10K)
Human instinct is to try to save projects that's you're heavily invested in. I've worked on dying products (though not in gaming), and those who work on a product will do anything to save it. After all, there's the fear that you'll just be let go if they cancel it. Management wants to see a profit, if you can show it's possible, they'll listen. Turbine chose to build and release and expansion to try and save the game. That alone, IMO, showed that they wanted things to work out. It didn't. Management must have been convinced that none of the options that were presented to them could bring in enough money to keep the game viable.
As long as nobody makes money from it....
If you spend $50 on a game and you pay to play for a reasonable time they should give you the right to set up your own server. But there is a fine line there, should you be allowed to modify it, I do not think so, and you should not be able to take and tweak the game a little and release a free game for people to play, even though you are not making money from it.
How would you control all of that....you cannot.
Me I would love to have a server running my own private little EVE universe, but I would eventually try to add my own ships to it and to make new systems.
Witty saying to amuse you goes here.
But still, I never was a subscriber of AC2 I just feel sorry for the current AC2 subscribers and for what could have been a game of much bigger proportions. I look forward to both of Turbines new releases despite their decision to close down AC2. D&D Online could be something special.
I say nar but i also think any company thats respectful of its community would offer the code up. The fact that turbine wont help the community set something up show how little they really care about it. It shouldnt come as a shock to anyone though.
Make a difference!
no
because you don't own the rights.
People who have to create conspiracy and hate threads to further a cause lacks in intellectual comprehension of diversity.
That would be analogous to saying you bought a 747 jet because you bought a ticket to ride it.
You sure as hell did not pay for the server software.
Then who do you think did? You think they just ate that cost? Um no! We paid for it with our monthly fees and price of the game...if they aren't going to service the servers then they should provide access to server code for continued use of the software we purchased.
And using your analogy it's more a kin to selling you a plane ticket and then telling you that wings will no longer be provided for your plane.
Intellectual property doesnt mean what I think you guys think it means. Both 3 robots and deggilator mention Intellectual property and that is irrelevant concerning running a dedicated server for a game. I am not claiming that their intellectual property should be sold or used in any other way then they developed it and as such Intellectual property has no bearing.
I think there is an obligation by the producer to provide a way to access the software purchased whether that be renting a server or providing a way to set up your own server.
For example, do you think it would be legal/fair to sell you a game you could not play? I would assume any reasonable person would say no, but somehow you justify being sold a game and then stopping anyway to continue to play it. Very little difference.
Actually a good compromise would be for Turbine to design a skeleton staff for AC2, figure in the server and bandwith costs for the expected player base and then calculate a new set of monthly fees for that player base (be a bit conservative).
If the players want to play the game, with bare Turbine oversight, let them decide once they know the monthly fee.
Seems simple.
Regardless, the monthly cost will have to pay someone for hosting and bandwidth, Turbine for their development costs, and maybe a staff member to maintain the game (maybe minor fixes).