Star Citizen Employees Reportedly Mandated to Work Seven Days a Week to Meet Citizencon Deadlines |

Slapshot1188

Scot said:

"Employees would receive TOIL (time off in lieu) that can be used later on." So the day after Sqn 42 ships you take that leave, it is not exactly a hardship.

Except for the part where they lay off staff right after the game is "complete".

Slapshot1188

Kyleran said:

I'm buying the limited  edition SQ42 ULTIMATE Commander pre-order pack as soon as it's available, heard it will be a total steal at $499, but only if you act as soon as they go on sale, price goes up after the first round are gone.

I don't actually think they sell anything for Squadron 42 other than the main game.

I'm sure that will change though. What's Sandi up to these days anyhow?

Theocritus

I thought this company had over 500 devs?

MaxBacon

Theocritus said:

I thought this company had over 500 devs?

As last info, around 1300~1400.

Slapshot1188 said:

I don't actually think they sell anything for Squadron 42 other than the main game.

I'm sure that will change though. What's Sandi up to these days anyhow?

Collector's edition I think likely. SQ42 being removed from the store is probably also they wanted to debundle SQ42 from SC and have it be a normal campaign game sold standalone with multiple editions and such.


Which also makes it more and more likely that SQ42 might be also announced for consoles.

Slapshot1188

MaxBacon said:

Which also makes it more and more likely that SQ42 might be also announced for consoles.

I absolutely hope not.  I mean THIS was literally the very first pitch for the game:

"The reports of my death have been greatly exaggerated"

The traditional publishers don't believe in PC or Space Sims. Venture Capitalists only want to back mobile or social gaming start ups.

We say they're wrong. We say that there is a large audience of PC gamers that want sophisticated games built for their platform. And inside this audience, a significant group of people that have always loved space games, and if given a quality one again will be happy to play it.


And this:

Today’s game publishers, like their Hollywood counterparts, want predictable returns from sequels to last year’s hits. A game in an out- of-favor genre, set in an original universe is viewed as a bad investment. And the concept of developing a new product exclusively for the PC sends publishing executives and most Venture Capitalists running for the exits.

And that hero is you, the unappreciated PC gamer. The ignored Space Sim fan.

This is your chance to have your voice heard. To tell the world that high end PC gaming lives. That you want to sit in the cockpit of your space fighter defending the galaxy or making your fortune as a wily entrepreneur.

Star Citizen is meant to be everything you ever dreamed you could have in a Space-Sim, all in one glorious ever-evolving package.

Honestly that would be a pretty huge betrayal.

MaxBacon

Slapshot1188 said:

I absolutely hope not.  I mean THIS was literally the very first pitch for the game:

Honestly that would be a pretty huge betrayal.

The context on which this played out before is no longer relevant, not only are current gen consoles powerful enough, muting the debate of "downgrade for consoles", they also no longer have crazy architectures to work with.... CIG themselves are seen playing the game with a controller when they did demos and such.

It makes sense for SQ42 being this linear campaign, it doesn't make sense for SC and I do not believe they would consider it for SC, as that'd probably require relevant design chances to accomodate.

Wargfoot

MaxBacon said:

Theocritus said:

I thought this company had over 500 devs?

As last info, around 1300~1400.

If that is true, they're easily burning through 200 million per year in salaries.
(devs, support staff, human resources, janitorial, etc)

Slapshot1188

MaxBacon said:

Slapshot1188 said:

I absolutely hope not.  I mean THIS was literally the very first pitch for the game:

Honestly that would be a pretty huge betrayal.

The context on which this played out before is no longer relevant, not only are current gen consoles powerful enough, muting the debate of "downgrade for consoles", they also no longer have crazy architectures to work with.... CIG themselves are seen playing the game with a controller when they did demos and such.

It makes sense for SQ42 being this linear campaign, it doesn't make sense for SC and I do not believe they would consider it for SC, as that'd probably require relevant design chances to accomodate.

I totally disagree.

This was sold as the savior of PC gaming.  I know.  I was part of this from the beginning. They specifically called out PC EXCLUSIVITY as one of the main reasons WE had to back this, because no publisher would.

MaxBacon

Wargfoot said:

If that is true, they're easily burning through 200 million per year in salaries.
(devs, support staff, human resources, janitorial, etc)

130million spent in 2022 with close to 900 staff. They added 440 employees in 2023 alone.


However, they also did rounds of layoffs this year, and the funding income is not much higher so they're probably doing some juggling with the costs.

MaxBacon

Slapshot1188 said:

I totally disagree.

This was sold as the savior of PC gaming.  I know.  I was part of this from the beginning. They specifically called out PC EXCLUSIVITY as one of the main reasons WE had to back this, because no publisher would.

Back when this was pitched, it was around the years of the whole "consoles are the future" debate, so they used that as to promote that "we'll never downgrade just to release on consoles".

But now, that's no longer relevant neither would it impact SQ42 negatively on PC if it does come on consoles, in fact this might even do what built for PC games do, release on consoles at some point after releasing on PC.

MMOExposed

Is this legal?

FrodoFragins

So their crunching them to get a demoable chapter 1 for SQ42 but won't give them time off until SQ42 actually releases?

They should get the time off available as soon as the convention is over.  Who knows when Roberts will decide it's worthy to release?  Let's be real here.

Scot

Slapshot1188 said:

Scot said:

"Employees would receive TOIL (time off in lieu) that can be used later on." So the day after Sqn 42 ships you take that leave, it is not exactly a hardship.

Except for the part where they lay off staff right after the game is "complete".

Allow me to repat my second post:

"And the invertible layoffs down the line when the game is no longer in full development mode. As long as those guys get all their holiday before that happens I see no issue."

harken33

Star Citizen fans we have heard your outrage over the forced TOIL overtime to try and get something ready for Citizen-con. In an effort to improve relations we will be providing not only Time off later but also triple overtime pay, with your generosity. 

To make this happen please buy our new ship the OVER TIME - Only $250.00, featuring 2 Gatling laser cannons, state of the art engines and a CLOCK which has not only a Hour Hand but a Minute Hand as well. For a shot time the Second Hand will be included so act Fast!.

Please do not try and buy this ship

Babuinix

Jerry Seinfeld got nothing on these jokers

olepi

MMOExposed said:

Is this legal?

In the US it is legal for exempt employees, and illegal for hourly employees. Not sure about other countries. Presumably most of CIG's employees are exempt. I would expect any contractors to get paid immediately.

cheyane

TOIL and time off in lieu is comically appropriate I guess it is exactly why that acronym fits perfectly.

Slapshot1188

MaxBacon said:

Slapshot1188 said:

I totally disagree.

This was sold as the savior of PC gaming.  I know.  I was part of this from the beginning. They specifically called out PC EXCLUSIVITY as one of the main reasons WE had to back this, because no publisher would.

Back when this was pitched, it was around the years of the whole "consoles are the future" debate, so they used that as to promote that "we'll never downgrade just to release on consoles".

But now, that's no longer relevant neither would it impact SQ42 negatively on PC if it does come on consoles, in fact this might even do what built for PC games do, release on consoles at some point after releasing on PC.

Again.  It was pitched, TO ME, as a PC exclusive title.  It was literally the initial pitch line.

You can try and find reason to justify the change all you want.  Just like all the other changes along the way that have taken what was originally promised and twisted it into something nearly unrecognizable.  You will sit and find reason to justify it. That's your right to do for yourself.

For me?  Nope.  I was there.  I know what I was told.  I know WHY I was told.  

MaxBacon

Slapshot1188 said:

Again.  It was pitched, TO ME, as a PC exclusive title.  It was literally the initial pitch line.

You can try and find reason to justify the change all you want.  Just like all the other changes along the way that have taken what was originally promised and twisted it into something nearly unrecognizable.  You will sit and find reason to justify it. That's your right to do for yourself.

For me?  Nope.  I was there.  I know what I was told.  I know WHY I was told.  

You're a Kickstarter-times, but yeah at this point the vast majority of the backers are much more recent obviously. Which is why there been design chances over the years.

If they stuck with the OG KS pitch, we'd have a full sim type of approach on the flight model and such, which would be far more unfriendly to the people outside the space sim niche and so forfh. So things have changed over the years, but I wouldn't necessarly say for the worse tbh, game is more open and more "casual friendly" which has allowed friends to jump in to play with them that otherwise would never get into a space sim (the fps crowd). I would say if SQ42 itself gets a move to consoles it would reflect the current crowd as well.

This is why there's the usual drama surrounding SC because the more OG people expect one thing and things expanded on different directions, but well nothing that can be done about it now.

Wargfoot

Slapshot1188 said:

For me?  Nope.  I was there.  I know what I was told.  I know WHY I was told.  

I understand your frustration.
I hate major changes to the vision I backed.

Slapshot1188

MaxBacon said:

Slapshot1188 said:

Again.  It was pitched, TO ME, as a PC exclusive title.  It was literally the initial pitch line.

You can try and find reason to justify the change all you want.  Just like all the other changes along the way that have taken what was originally promised and twisted it into something nearly unrecognizable.  You will sit and find reason to justify it. That's your right to do for yourself.

For me?  Nope.  I was there.  I know what I was told.  I know WHY I was told.  

You're a Kickstarter-times, but yeah at this point the vast majority of the backers are much more recent obviously. Which is why there been design chances over the years.

If they stuck with the OG KS pitch, we'd have a full sim type of approach on the flight model and such, which would be far more unfriendly to the people outside the space sim niche and so forfh. So things have changed over the years, but I wouldn't necessarly say for the worse tbh, game is more open and more "casual friendly" which has allowed friends to jump in to play with them that otherwise would never get into a space sim (the fps crowd). I would say if SQ42 itself gets a move to consoles it would reflect the current crowd as well.

This is why there's the usual drama surrounding SC because the more OG people expect one thing and things expanded on different directions, but well nothing that can be done about it now.

Maybe.. just maybe.. you should not promise different people different things that are diametrically opposed to each other?  Especially when it's a fundamental part of what you told group A.

Slapshot1188

Wargfoot said:

Slapshot1188 said:

For me?  Nope.  I was there.  I know what I was told.  I know WHY I was told.  

I understand your frustration.
I hate major changes to the vision I backed.

Yup.  And hey.  I am not saying they CAN'T change anything they want.  By now we all know how Crowdfunding goes...

 But yeah, when they say one thing and do another I am not going to be happy.

olepi

The original release date for SQ42 was in 2014. Imagine putting in crunch time then and expecting to get your time back after it releases. You'd still be waiting.

Today there is no release date and no roadmap that shows any release date. Imagine putting in crunch time now expecting to get the time back after release.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me.

Babuinix

Whatever stated at a time is only relevant at that time, time moves plans change, if your not ready for that stick to "finished" products and don't play "venture gamer" when you don't have the knowledge, funds and thick skin to deal with it.

Arglebargle

Given CIG's non-cromulence in their many claims and video blather, we should only consider their words to be vaguely relevant at any time. 

Given the amounts of the original Kickstarter, they could pay that back totally without blinking much.  It's just that that era shows the feature creep bloatation so well. 

Funny though, those original pitch quotes are in the pocket.  I guess that shows that Roberts is really great at making pitches.  Just don't let him go so granular in development that he's deciding on individual pixel colour.  Because that way leads to here, a decade later than the original release date.