Would You Play a FULL PVP Game with PermaDeath

thoreau

For all your hardcore PVPers. Would you play the ultimate pvp game if it had permadeath? 1 death and your gone.

Loish

hmmm...this one actually got me thinking.

I'm a fairly hardcore PvP'r, I like penalties for death, but having your caracter totally deleted...not sure.

I'm all abotu rez sickness, losing items, even losing xp...but totally losing my character forever...

I'd probably give it a try, but don't think I'd go for it.  I know, i know, now I'm a carebear.  

pinkdaisy

Diablo 2->Hardcore mode.

PvP with Permadeath. 

There's no shortage of people playing it.  Infact once you've played D2HC, you'll never look at softcore the same.

~PD

P.S. and for those who will pipe up with "diablo 2 is not an MMO" please go sign up for the MUD-Dev mailing list where this has been discussed ad nausium.  D2 is a fully instanced game with textual representation of the "lobby" area.  This is functionally equivalent to GuildWars where everything is instanced the only difference being the lobby areas are graphical in GW and textual in D2.  They both have persistent economies too BTW.  Also, DDO is taking the same approach so if you still think D2 isn't an MMO, then neither are GW or DDO. 

If you still think D2 isn't one, then please email the devs asking for GW and DDO to be removed from www.mmorg.com while you are at it.

/sarcasm

scaramoosh

I liked SWG old Jedi system with 3 deaths and you lose everything, you kept the main character but you had to start over with it.

Jimmy_Scythe

I have to agree with the guy that brought up Diablo 2. D2 was very challenging and rewarding in hardcore mode.

Would I pay for an MMO with permadeath though? That would depend on game balance. Provided that we're dealing with a level-less system with no broke ass character classes or builds, I would be all for it. The design of such a game would have to be very small and focused though, so I don't think it would take off with traditional MMO players. We'ver gotten used to long feature lists, tons of content, paper thin gameplay. A small game that's big on gameplay + content but short on features would probably keep most people away.

Ra've

Yes and im not even a hardcore pvper but i know that would keep alot of people away.

Gameloading

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Originally posted by pinkdaisy
Diablo 2->Hardcore mode.
PvP with Permadeath. 
There's no shortage of people playing it.  Infact once you've played D2HC, you'll never look at softcore the same.
~PD
P.S. and for those who will pipe up with "diablo 2 is not an MMO" please go sign up for the MUD-Dev mailing list where this has been discussed ad nausium.  D2 is a fully instanced game with textual representation of the "lobby" area.  This is functionally equivalent to GuildWars where everything is instanced the only difference being the lobby areas are graphical in GW and textual in D2.  They both have persistent economies too BTW.  Also, DDO is taking the same approach so if you still think D2 isn't an MMO, then neither are GW or DDO. 
If you still think D2 isn't one, then please email the devs asking for GW and DDO to be removed from www.mmorg.com while you are at it.
/sarcasm

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lets add Counterstrike to the list as well then.

Dekron

Yes, I would play.

Signe

I like PvP and I might give one a go, but chances are I wouldn't last long. I'm not a fan of severe death penalties or penalties at all, really. I don't need to be punished as a motivator to stay alive. I don't find that harsh penalties make PvP or any other part of my game more meaningful.

Having said that, I'm also not one to argue that these things shouldn't exist, either. I'm well aware that there are all sorts of gamers in the world, like anything else, who enjoy all sorts of different kinds of gaming. I care about the future of online gaming and I'm always glad to see them make it to launch... even if it's not something I'm particularly interested in playing. Sometimes it can be rather annoying to see people insult each other based on the sort of MMOs they prefer. The one thing we all have in common here is that we love gaming, regardless of how vast the difference in preferences are, no? It's all very subjective, anyway... how can one type be better than another if there are people who enjoy it?

lsutig

i wouldnt pay a monthly fee for it, but like was said above HC mode in d2 is very fun. until you lag out and die at lvl 84 asfklahsf;haklshfal;sk!

pinkdaisy

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Originally posted by Gameloading

lets add Counterstrike to the list as well then.

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Nope.  counterstrike lacks persistence.  Both Richard Bartle "Designing Virtual Worlds" and Raph Koster "A Theory of Fun For Game Design" (Former creative director for Star Wars Galaxies) state that for it to be a virtual world it must have some persistent qualities.

Counterstrike, and other FPS games for that matter, lack persistence.  Your character doesn't level up, there is nothing item wise that follows you around from map to map.  Not only is it 100% instanced it's 100% static.

I'm not saying that D2 has high levels of persistence, it doesn't.  Then again neither does GW.  In fact i often lament increasing use of instancing in MMOs.  It's a bad trend.

I'm only making the point that either D2 is a MMORPG or other games with the same gameplay mechanics aren't.  You don't get to pick and choose based on personal preference.

If your CS character leveled up, collected loot that he could carry from map to map, and trade that loot with other players, then yes it would be a MMORPG.  Not much in the way of roleplaying mind you, but still a MMORPG.  Oddly, more FPS like games are what many of the big companies are moving towards.  The last thing i want is Halo: the MMO.

~PD

Rattrap

My answer is Yes

I think that MMORPG with perma death , and free PVP but with sort of LAW SYSTEM implemented
would be most intense realistic roleplay experience , with untapped potentials.

On the other hand a free PVP fest - where players kill other for no apparent reason might be fun in chaotic kind of way - but characters would be wiped quite often and it could prove to be just a frustration.

nthnaoun

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Originally posted by thoreau

For all your hardcore PVPers. Would you play the ultimate pvp game if it had permadeath? 1 death and your gone.

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I'm your casual player type that doesn't care if a game has pvp in it or not, but I think a game with a serious death penalty would make the pvp worth playing. I would like a perma death system, but the truth is there are too many factors that make this system unworkable. Say for instance your playing and your wife calls you from downstairs and says get down here now I just hurt myself seriously. Your not going to take the time to log out in an emergency and if you do your just a low life sob that should die for putting a game as a higher priority than family. Another reason it wouldn't work is because lag will still exist and will cause someone their life. Then you have LD and power outages that could seriously screw you over.

It's a good idea, but not a feasible one to make it fair for all.

Hashman

Permadeath would be the ultimate death penalty. I just think that although D2 is a great example of it, there were just too many players who hacked it that it really just attracted the wrong kind of gamestyle for my liking. Give me the harshest death penalty you like, lose a level, items, I'm all for that, but permadeath just means there will never be a level playing field: people will try to beat the system rather than others.

baff

I played alot of Diablo 2 on Hardcore mode. (I ran that visibility cheat where the fog of war was removed).
But I avoided PvP.

I have to say it would depend on the game.
If it's a First Person Shooter, you can count me in, if it's a third person button masher or a point and click I going to be too busy to play.

devilduck

I would,  if the rest of the game mechanics supported it.  Meaning that the PvP wasnt unbalanced,  players had means to police their own,  and players had the ability to strategicly with draw from a battle as long as they didnt do things stupid

pyros98

Yes and that is why I plan to play The Chronicles http://www.mmocenter.com

I want challenge and I should get it here.

Herithius

I'd be on the fence.

Countless people will be losing their prized chars due to lag or lag in massive battles and won't be too thrilled about it. It's a tough way to lose an entire character.

daniellex55

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Originally posted by devilduck
I would,  if the rest of the game mechanics supported it.  Meaning that the PvP wasnt unbalanced,  players had means to police their own,  and players had the ability to strategicly with draw from a battle as long as they didnt do things stupid

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I agree, for a game with perma death there would have to be an abnormally large amount of NPCs, all areas would have to be locked in to lvl brackets (exp: lvl10-15, 16-20, etc), there would have to be a harsh punishment system for people who will gang and go around mobbing other players, otherwise
-it would end up coming down to who has the biggest mob- and that would take the fun out of the game for everyone.

Teala

Yes...if it were done right.  I once wrote up an article on how perma-death could be implemented in a PvP centric game.  Everyone said I was insane and that nobody would pay to play a game where there was the chance that they could loose their charcter permanently.  ::shrugs::  I liked my idea and I still think it would make for some very interesting game play.

seabass2003

No. I am not very good at games so I would be dead fairly early. Then I would die over and over. It would really suck for me but for the people killing me they would have fun.

Hifructose

I would, yup I would knowingly play and invest in a game well aware of the risks...until I died
then I would complain on the forums with a bunch of carebears until they took permadeath out, and then I would complain because pvp was too open and there were no safe spots, and then I would request more guards to protect me, and then I would complain about the higher levels being able to pk me, and finally I should be able to get PVP completely thrown out of the game...oh wait I wouldn't do that, I LIKED LINEAGE 2 THE WAY IT WAS!!!

RemyVorender

The game I'm most looking forward to is a game that has both open PvP and (if you so choose) Permadeath.

That game is called "The Chronicle". 

www.mmocenter.com/v2

Sarennia

I dont get the real point with permadeath. I think its more fun to get killed in PvP, go out and lvl for a while and then come back kick his ass. Then when there comes another one and kills you, you do the same thing again. But sure you get more happier to kill someone in hardcore mode, and more angry when you die.

Vampton

Quote:  I dont get the real point with permadeath. I think its more fun to get killed in PvP, go out and lvl for a while and then come back kick his ass. Then when there comes another one and kills you, you do the same thing again. But sure you get more happier to kill someone in hardcore mode, and more angry when you die.

3boy there is accually a point in selecting a Main(permadeath) instead of a regular(no permadeath) in this game.  The Main's are slightly stronger and gain skills slightly faster than Regulars.

thoreau

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Originally posted by 3boy
I dont get the real point with permadeath. I think its more fun to get killed in PvP, go out and lvl for a while and then come back kick his ass. Then when there comes another one and kills you, you do the same thing again. But sure you get more happier to kill someone in hardcore mode, and more angry when you die.

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and this is the reason for the question. in my opinion, if you are for pvp but against permadeath. you are a carebear.

if you want to be hardcore - be hardcore.