Originally posted by grimboj I hardly think frigate vs. frigate counts as mid-game pvp opportunities. How mnay 0.0 guilds are gonna let you in with ZERO sp? Are you offering?
You simply don't understand EVE online. Frigates play a crucial role in nearly all PvP battles. Your exmaple is in pretense of the concept of a 1 on 1 fight of you versus some other frigate. That's one of many, many variations on the theme.
As for how many guilds will allow you to join fresh off the boat? Go read the official forum Alliance and Corporation Recruitment Forum. Page upon page of people looking for players, and quite a few of them are willing to take complete noobs with no experience from day one.
I have to say that this is just not the case man. Let's get real.
Frigates can play a role. New frigate pilots will play that role less effectively than, say, an interceptor pilot with many of the crucial skills like gunnery and small turret raised to max level, with specializations. Which of course, takes time to train even with learning skills and a head full of implants.
But that's to be expected in any MMO, no?
I mean, any new player, in any game, can play a crucial role too, even in a high level group. A healer might not heal for much, but will heal. Just as a character who has been a healer for three months will be better, and play its role better. But it takes time to get to that level. Just like it takes time to get better in EVE.
I'm not saying this to say EVE is a bad game, but what you forgot to mention is that EVE is a game like any other. New players are not more empowered in EVE than anywhere else, and I don't know of one MMO that doesn't give a role to play from the start, no matter what MMO you are in.
But to say that a new player is going to play a crucial role as a two week old frigate tackler is like saying that a two week old Mezzer is going to play a crucial role in a group of engame raiders. Sure, if its the only Mezzer you can find, or a second Mezzer, or the guild leader's younger brother, its no problem. But most serious players, like most serious players in EVE, are not that stupid when they have a Mezzer already ground to the level.
Same goes for guilds, which is what corporations are. Go to any game site, for any game, and you'll see pages and pages of Guild X, Guild Y, and Guild Z saying, "Come enjoy the game with us! We want good, committed players! Must have Ventrillo!" They'll take players too. They may take down things like logon info too, and make you register with a website and install voice apps to qualify, or they may not. Just like in EVE.
Look, EVE is a pretty good game, but its also an MMO that operates like any other MMO, and the new players are treated no differently than anywhere else.
__________________________ "Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it." --Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints." --Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls." --Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
Originally posted by Elnator Ianubisi,I appreciate your enthusiasm but there isn't a corp out there that invites an utter newb into it's ranks because nobody wants to invite a spy on a trial account by accident. Too many corps have been ripped off that way. Unless things have RADICALLY changed most corps won't invite anyone who's not playing retail and has at minimum 500k SP (Usually 1mil). Also no person in a frigate with under 1 month training is going to enjoy PVP... they'll get oblitterated in the first salvo. Their ship will be too slow and won't have enough armor/shielding to survive. Their weapons will be very limited. They won't be able to tackle worth a darn and they won't have MWD's to get the heck outta dodge with. Heck, I have 4 months of retail under my toons belt (no I don't currently play) and with the training I have I can actually fly a cruiser faster, and with almost as much maneuverability, than most newbie frigate pilots could fly even the fastest of the frigates. I'm sorry, an utter newbie in a frigate is nothing more than a 1 salvo kill in any serious PVP battle.
Go read the recruitment forums. Plenty of opportunities for brand new pilots.
Are you expecting to fly a battleship on day one? Then you will be disappointed. But if you want to be involved and engaged in activities that are in the 0.0 pvp sector, there is more than enough opportunity.
Don't believe me? I don't care. But try it before you cry foul.
Originally posted by ianubisi Don't believe me? I don't care. But try it before you cry foul.
There is a two week trial available, so skeptical players can see these great PvPing opportunities in an established, 0.0 corporation, just like you said.
Players shouldn't have to shell out $20 American, just so they can see if you are telling the truth. Because the initial fee is non-refundable.
__________________________ "Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it." --Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints." --Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls." --Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
your eve online account can be reactivated at any time and your character will not have lost any skill points. soooooo, if you don't like guild wars, you can always play eve online again.
orrrrrrrr... play both. guild wars has no monthly fee.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Umm not in my experience you can't. In my experience even to just be a tackler you need about 1-2 months worth of certifications. Longer if you choose the wrong learning abilities when you first start out. I agree... 6 months is grossly over exxagerated but 2 days is also grossly over-exaggerated.
To be useful in PVP even in a frigate, you need about 2 months worth of training under your belt. 3 for a Cruiser.
To be useful in PvP in a frigate, you need minmatar frigate 3, high speed manuvering, and propulsion jamming. Thats about 3 days after creation. That makes you the best kind of frigate tackler - the disposable kind. You go in, hold something for the heavies, and then get out. Or explode. It doesnt matter. Larger ships take more time to skill up to, but thats life.
Whats far more valuable then SP is combat experience. Given the choice between a 3m SP person with PvP experience and a 40m SP person without, i'll take the 3m player.
Comments
You simply don't understand EVE online. Frigates play a crucial role in nearly all PvP battles. Your exmaple is in pretense of the concept of a 1 on 1 fight of you versus some other frigate. That's one of many, many variations on the theme.
As for how many guilds will allow you to join fresh off the boat? Go read the official forum Alliance and Corporation Recruitment Forum. Page upon page of people looking for players, and quite a few of them are willing to take complete noobs with no experience from day one.
I have to say that this is just not the case man. Let's get real.
Frigates can play a role. New frigate pilots will play that role less effectively than, say, an interceptor pilot with many of the crucial skills like gunnery and small turret raised to max level, with specializations. Which of course, takes time to train even with learning skills and a head full of implants.
But that's to be expected in any MMO, no?
I mean, any new player, in any game, can play a crucial role too, even in a high level group. A healer might not heal for much, but will heal. Just as a character who has been a healer for three months will be better, and play its role better. But it takes time to get to that level. Just like it takes time to get better in EVE.
I'm not saying this to say EVE is a bad game, but what you forgot to mention is that EVE is a game like any other. New players are not more empowered in EVE than anywhere else, and I don't know of one MMO that doesn't give a role to play from the start, no matter what MMO you are in.
But to say that a new player is going to play a crucial role as a two week old frigate tackler is like saying that a two week old Mezzer is going to play a crucial role in a group of engame raiders. Sure, if its the only Mezzer you can find, or a second Mezzer, or the guild leader's younger brother, its no problem. But most serious players, like most serious players in EVE, are not that stupid when they have a Mezzer already ground to the level.
Same goes for guilds, which is what corporations are. Go to any game site, for any game, and you'll see pages and pages of Guild X, Guild Y, and Guild Z saying, "Come enjoy the game with us! We want good, committed players! Must have Ventrillo!" They'll take players too. They may take down things like logon info too, and make you register with a website and install voice apps to qualify, or they may not. Just like in EVE.
Look, EVE is a pretty good game, but its also an MMO that operates like any other MMO, and the new players are treated no differently than anywhere else.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
Go read the recruitment forums. Plenty of opportunities for brand new pilots.
Are you expecting to fly a battleship on day one? Then you will be disappointed. But if you want to be involved and engaged in activities that are in the 0.0 pvp sector, there is more than enough opportunity.
Don't believe me? I don't care. But try it before you cry foul.
There is a two week trial available, so skeptical players can see these great PvPing opportunities in an established, 0.0 corporation, just like you said.
Players shouldn't have to shell out $20 American, just so they can see if you are telling the truth. Because the initial fee is non-refundable.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
your eve online account can be reactivated at any time and your character will not have lost any skill points. soooooo, if you don't like guild wars, you can always play eve online again.
orrrrrrrr... play both. guild wars has no monthly fee.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Whats far more valuable then SP is combat experience. Given the choice between a 3m SP person with PvP experience and a 40m SP person without, i'll take the 3m player.