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Wow 5 mil, Guild Wars 2 mil accounts.
22222
Member Posts: 24
These games have only been out for like 2 years and have surpased all other mmos in accounts. What is the common binding factor both have? Pvp. I hope and pray vanguard does a nice job on their pvp... or maybe it will be another auto assualt. Lawl
Comments
Lets see... WoW ease of use and great marketing plus massive word of mouth hyping over 2 years. Guild wars cheap cost model = many users.
The popularity was not from PVP.
wow....i could really pick you apart on this one but i will be nice, there are lots of games with a heavy emphasis on pvp that are highly unsuccessful.
believe me when i say that it is not just the pvp that makes those games popular, IMO it is that they appeal to a broader more "mainstream" player base.
they are both catchy and fun games to play and really easy to pick up and play even if you have never played a mmorpg before. also i think for guildwars it has alot to do with it being free to play.
if it wasn't free people would just play wow for the most part, but yeah they both happen to have pvp.....but that is defiantly not the reason they are so popular, especially wow.
wow has arguably one of the worst pvp systems in any pvp oriented mmorpg out today, it is a horrible grind to get the highest rank and is pretty pointless.
i will say that a mmorpg needs to have a option for pvp to expand their horizons and reach alot more gamers, it is true alot of people (including myself) love to pvp.
but i just had to chuckle when you implied that wow and GW are so popular because of their good pvp, that is pretty dang funny.
Nah, if you must bring that to 1 FACT that they both share, unifying theme...
They both appeal to CASUALS. WoW is designed to be for casuals from level 1 to 59 and thereby interest casuals a lot (althought the "morphing casuals" into hardcore at 60+ aggravated them a LOT)...and GW is quite casual-oriented.
PvP is a side aspect and guess what, half of WoW servers are PvP-free...so PvP is not really the main factor, appealing to casuals is the main factor here.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
OMG, i actually agree with you about something?
I'm coming down on the side of casual-friendly is the main reason of the high sub. #'s. These games were the first MMORPG a lot of people played as well, so that is naturally going to garner loyalty as well. Which is the same reason that a lot of us regard EQ highly.
Actually WoW has crossed the 7 million mark.
The common denominator is that those games are fun. Fun games sell a lot of copies. Games where masochism is encouraged sell fewer copies.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
I would have to say after experiencing both of these MMO's for about a year now, I'd have to say that one of the main pulls for WoW is the community and the abilty to generate income weekly. That is MMO income.
Now, obivously, most of us really don't know what Vanguard will bring. However, it is my hope that it will continue along the lines of creative storytelling through rich questing. Roleplaying is the "bread and butter" of MMO designers and script writers. Textures and vast landscapes would also keep me coming back. I would also look for a community of adult players that share my desire to meet and commune with folks from all over the world. PvP is fun and should be considered in Vanguard possibly as a form of arena/battleground or even castle seiging challenge.
All-in-all, World of Warcraft, (Blizzard) and Guild Wars, (NCSoft) have made millions of dollars and gained vast popularity for various and different reasons. I would have to say that they are among the leaders in current MMO's.
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth
John Lennon
ummm, I like wet jeans, as long as it's a warm kinda wet...like when my diaper leaks....
Not so nice guy!
One thought GW... is it really an MMORPG? it plays kinda like Diablo 2 (with mroe PvP orientation) except the chat rooms are glorified cities.
Aso one thing people havn't figured out yet... is that... GW cost alot of money to play to, not as much as an MMORPG put it is costing alot of money if you buy all the new content.
They have stated 2 whole to expansions a year. thats $100 a year... so thats what you pay for guild wars. (Yes i understand that you have to pay for expansions created for MMORPGs, but its still a little more than you would have to pay for a single player game.
typical MMORPG: $15 a month = $180 a year +$30 a year for a yearly expansion = $210 a year.
GW: $100 a year
that is a huge difference, i know, but MMORPGs still have alot more than GW does, and they add content more often too that does not come with the next expansion.
Current MMO of interest: Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
MMO background: EQ, UO, AO, SWG, PS, EQ2, L2,EQoA, WoW, WWIIO, and AC2
I cant tell ya why WOW is popular. I found it linear, limiting and boring, it kinda reminded me of a crappy board game. I guess instant gratification coupled with never being able to lose anything appealed to the teen and preteen generation. I made a shaman to lvl 60, then tried to make another char and I just couldnt bring myself to do it. It was far to boring. No housing, lousy pvp, ultra slow movement, comically easy crafting and just plain tedium turned me off completely. When it came out I posted that the game was so bad it would'nt last a year, wont be the first or last time I'm wrong.
I played guild wars for maybe a week hoping I was wrong and everything was'nt just instanced, but again damn it I was wrong. Total turn-off for me so that puppy went into the ole microsoft trash bin along with wow.
All I can say is I hope vanguard doesnt cater to the instant gratification pre-teenie crew and makes a game that actually has a little bite to it.
oh so now you are helping Amathe and some of the others derail your own topic haha, nice one! i assume you are just another person looking for something to complain about or looking for a way to justify why you think vanguard wont be successful and your argument crashed and burned.
Originally posted by 22222
Amen. Mini chat games and pain in the ass crafting = Alot of fun Rofl Like wet freaking jeans.
oh so now you are helping Amathe and some of the others derail your own topic haha, nice one! i assume you are just another person looking for something to complain about or looking for a way to justify why you think vanguard wont be successful and your argument crashed and burned.
Amathe's reply looks to be in topic.
Baphamet, feeling a little threatened by Amathe? Hey?
Maybe Amathe's posts are hitting a little too close to the truth...
Spiritglow
oh so now you are helping Amathe and some of the others derail your own topic haha, nice one! i assume you are just another person looking for something to complain about or looking for a way to justify why you think vanguard wont be successful and your argument crashed and burned.
Amathe's reply looks to be in topic.
Baphamet, feeling a little threatened by Amathe? Hey?
Maybe Amathe's posts are hitting a little too close to the truth...
Spiritglow
nice first post there buddy, welcome to the discussion. i don't feel threatened by his posts in the least bit. i disprove them on a regular basis.
i don't consider things like "After Brad sells it (which he will), and after the market reaction has caused significant changes (which it will)" truth, it is speculation.
i don't disagree with everything he says but for the most part he comes he and finds a small bone to nitpick witch i have pointed out more than once, but that is a different topic.
i just find it funny that the OP tried to justify why he thinks wow and gw is so popular, saying it is because of pvp and myself as well as alot of others shot down his argument.
so now he jumps on the bandwagon and helps derail his own topic, witch is highly amusing.
but lets get something straight (referring to Amathe's post again) if he thinks vanguard will not be fun i have absolutely no beef with that.
if you want to argue that wow is popular because it is a fun game not only do i not have a problem with that, but i agree with it. so yeah, i am defiantly not "threatened" by his post in any way.
Is this a new rule? The party to a discussion who declares themself the winner, wins? Can I play?
I winnzorz the argument!
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
GWs: No monthly fee
WoW: PR/Easymode
WoW is more popular cause theres more stuff to do
ive been playin wow for like 5days and theres way more to do then gw
in gw i got to lvl 20 in like 2weeks
and gw players cant see other people outside of town which makes you feel your the only one playin
well you tend to dip out of a argument when it is clearly not going your way, just an observation.
oh so now you are helping Amathe and some of the others derail your own topic haha, nice one! i assume you are just another person looking for something to complain about or looking for a way to justify why you think vanguard wont be successful and your argument crashed and burned.
Amathe's reply looks to be in topic.
Baphamet, feeling a little threatened by Amathe? Hey?
Maybe Amathe's posts are hitting a little too close to the truth...
Spiritglow
nice first post there buddy, welcome to the discussion. i don't feel threatened by his posts in the least bit. i disprove them on a regular basis.
i don't consider things like "After Brad sells it (which he will), and after the market reaction has caused significant changes (which it will)" truth, it is speculation.
i don't disagree with everything he says but for the most part he comes he and finds a small bone to nitpick witch i have pointed out more than once, but that is a different topic.
i just find it funny that the OP tried to justify why he thinks wow and gw is so popular, saying it is because of pvp and myself as well as alot of others shot down his argument.
so now he jumps on the bandwagon and helps derail his own topic, witch is highly amusing.
but lets get something straight (referring to Amathe's post again) if he thinks vanguard will not be fun i have absolutely no beef with that.
if you want to argue that wow is popular because it is a fun game not only do i not have a problem with that, but i agree with it. so yeah, i am defiantly not "threatened" by his post in any way.
Yes it was my first post but I've been here for a good while, just had nothing to say till I picked up on the hatred or vitriol for Amathe which I think is misplaced. Amathe puts forth some well reasoned questions. So far the only ones
that have attemped to answer those questions were Brad and some folks
from Silky Venom which I have followed off and on for years while
waiting for new Vanguard news. You could say I was one of those
players who didn't mind exp grinding. I played EQ for six years which I
think is about one year after it's initial launch. Other then the
emphasis on raiding in EQ1 and the exp grind (except for Test server) I think it's a far better game now.
I've never played WoW. Looks too cartoony for me. I play GW. I don't
prefer PvP (never have) but I have enjoyed the observation mode for PvP
in GW. I enjoy GW except for the short timers on spells and those
invisible walls but I understand why they are there. If GW came out with a mmo server for pay without those invisible walls I wouldn't even consider Vanguard.
Having said that I would like to give Vanguard a try and I think it could be something
special but I'm simply not prepared to exp grind like I did in the
early years of EQ1, even now I wonder what I was thinking back then. It
was painful exp. I was really shocked that Sigil was joining with SOE
but I got over it.
So I hope Brad is being truthful about it being easier then EQ1 but
harder than WoW (admittedly I haven't played WoW). I'll see after I get
a beta key. Sorry to have gotten off topic some.
Recently I saw a post here saying that Sigil has put forward a massive change in Vanguard to be more appealing to the mainstream. I hope Brad can pull it off. I would suggest an alternate none uber raiding ruleset server or cap raids to a small number like two groups or something similar. Then he might get that million or two subs or more eventually.
Spiritglow
very nice post, i can certainly agree with most of what you wrote. i really don't know how bad the grind will be in vanguard, i do know it has been claimed that you can either chose to do quests to level up or grind eq1 style.
i have played guildwars, i own the game but its not just the "rails" that bothers me or the lack of jumping (I'm not sure if you can still not jump or not) but its the fact that there is no living breathing persistent world other than the towns that just act as a hub to get quests and meet party members.
its the same reason i cant stand DDO either, and i am a huge D&D pnp fan. i need to feel like i am in a fantasy world and if vanguard doesn't do it for me i will find/wait for a game that will.
but anyways, I'm done talking about Amathe....i can agree that he defiantly presents his argument in a good civilized manner, and does it alot better than most people that don't like vanguard.
but i just think he likes to nitpick on things that are sometimes just not there, but w/e it is all good as long as it sparks a good discussion.
very nice post, i can certainly agree with most of what you wrote. i really don't know how bad the grind will be in vanguard, i do know it has been claimed that you can either chose to do quests to level up or grind eq1 style.
i have played guildwars, i own the game but its not just the "rails" that bothers me or the lack of jumping (I'm not sure if you can still not jump or not) but its the fact that there is no living breathing persistent world other than the towns that just act as a hub to get quests and meet party members.
its the same reason i cant stand DDO either, and i am a huge D&D pnp fan. i need to feel like i am in a fantasy world and if vanguard doesn't do it for me i will find/wait for a game that will.
but anyways, I'm done talking about Amathe....i can agree that he defiantly presents his argument in a good civilized manner, and does it alot better than most people that don't like vanguard.
but i just think he likes to nitpick on things that are sometimes just not there, but w/e it is all good as long as it sparks a good discussion.
Thanks for the compliment, your post was pretty good as well. I haven't read all of Amathe's posts but of the ones I have read it looks like he wants to play Vanguard but is put off by some things. I know I want to play it and it's clear you want to as well. Hopefully Brad can somehow find a balance for us all. It took a long time for me to appreciate GW fully. Discovering its depth of lateral progression and it's implications did it for me. It not being a true mmo is certainly a drawback. But so far no one has it's blend of vertical and lateral progression thats just right for casuall as well as hardcore players and yet has no raid zones or instances. The pvp encounters are getting larger but that doesn't affect pve at all.
A good discussion it is and Brad is seeing and responding. It's all we can ask for except for the wait for Vanguard.
Spiritglow
Well, I will prolly help you here Baph, how many WoW servers are PvP enabled? How many are PvE? If PvP servers are not at least 80%, then it can be remove as the "main reason". I am pretty sure there are more PvE servers in sheer numbers anyway.
In EQ, the main servers, PvE-centric, are more than 80% of the basic servers, thereby it can safely be said that PvE-server is 1 of the major reason why EQ was successfull, if not the main reason.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren