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Freelancer-Eve Online-WWiionline.........
Nerf09
Member CommonPosts: 2,953
Reading the player reviews of Freelancer, I saw that there was no joystick use. So I put away my sidewinder and grudgingly downloaded their free trial. Fly by mouse usually never works right, but somehow they did it right in Freelancer. I was amazed. Neato, they actually did it right. Mousing combat that isn't awkward but actually fun.
But I am not going to buy Freelancer.
Freelancer has the great first person shooter aspect USING A MOUSE! But Freelancer doesn't have the dynamic economy of Eve Online. Eve Online has the dynamic economy, but point and click combat in Eve Online is ultra borring. Both Freelancer and Eve Online don't have the complexities of armor combat (armor penetrations) you find in wwiionline.
All these games out there are incomplete pieces of a puzzle of a great game to be made, yet. I await. And wait...and wait....and wait. Who will make the great game? When will the great game come? The pieces of the puzzles are there, who will complete the puzzle?
But I am not going to buy Freelancer.
Freelancer has the great first person shooter aspect USING A MOUSE! But Freelancer doesn't have the dynamic economy of Eve Online. Eve Online has the dynamic economy, but point and click combat in Eve Online is ultra borring. Both Freelancer and Eve Online don't have the complexities of armor combat (armor penetrations) you find in wwiionline.
All these games out there are incomplete pieces of a puzzle of a great game to be made, yet. I await. And wait...and wait....and wait. Who will make the great game? When will the great game come? The pieces of the puzzles are there, who will complete the puzzle?
Comments
There is a reason that eve does not have joystick support. Network lag makes it almost impossible the point and click is a lot more forgiving of lag than a joystick would be. This is an even bigger problem because of the single shard concept eve follows.
This game has so many techincal problems, you can barely play the
game. I have been looking for a game like Earth and Beyond for a
few years. Nothing even comes close.
Darkstar One started to really catch my interest when I started to play
it. Then it started to lock up, stutter and crash. The
forums there are loaded with other people having the same issues.
I might try Freelance
Not to mention the big game stopper for me, the real time skill system is absolutely horrible. Its hard-coded time-grinding.
To add more detail Some types of player owned stations need fusion reactors to run [a few K per week] And you get these on the NPC market, I will also say the price of certain npc goods have risen a lot lately.
also the tech 2 market is run by moon minerals and tech 2 components which are entirely player made using player owned stations and moon miners.
And the tech 1 market is almost entirely player made now requireing asteroid miners to make which are produced by mining asteroids funnily enough.
So yea there is cross market intereaction.
As for the skill system it doesant matter as you dont need many skills to do well the rest of the skill training is just a bonus while you are having fun, and is definatly more fun than the grinding you get in certain other mmo's, because you atleast can ignor the skill training.
The real grind in eve is the cash raising grind.
Your skills determine what ships you can use, which really limits your expansion. Maybe it's just the first couple of weeks that are a bore as you wait for the ability to do what you actually want to.
The real-time skill gain system is the reason I have never made it past a weeklong trial of EVE. That and the fact that it's so hard to find other people and there isn't a whole lot to do with them at low levels.
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I really enjoy Freelancer. Download a mod called 'Discovery' and it will really expand the playing area. It incorporates new options for multiplayer, TONS of new ships, weapons, etc. and adds new features to the controls.
I don't recall 100%, but I don't think vanilla Freelancer has vertical thrusters. Discover mod adds that, giving you more control over ship movement.
Also, Discovery has an 'official' server that used to have around 100 people on at a time. I haven't played in a long time, so I dont' know the status of their server now.
The modern MMORPG is simply not worthy, of the acronym RPG. The straight grind and lack of atmosphere leave me with no choice. From this day forth, World of Warcraft, Everquest 2, and all the games like them shall be referred to as PIGCRAP. People In Guilds Constantly Raiding And Power-leveling
Now that leads to alot of players that really do want to just try the game out means they get stuck because most corps won't take them and show them around. Once in a corp any lulls in game play because of skilling requirements are usually sidelined as you start working toward goals. You'll bitch because it going to take you a few weeks to get into that top level mining barge but it will be because you are now mining for a purpose such as building ships or perhaps even a outpost, and you want to help speed up the timeline. There is alot of stuff that low level players can do but with out a more experienced player around it can be difficult to find it.
The advantages of a real time, skill based, game system doesn't show untill you try and play with a bunch of people with differing amounts of play time. CoH/V had to add the sidekick/templar(?) system to deal with RL/ingame friends getting seperated by too many levels and no longer able to play together. A couple I know has this same issue playing WoW where she is lvl 60 and running the endgame content and since he is 49 he can't do anything with her.
I would also like to see marriage of Freelancer and EVE online
Freelancer has -> Interesting gameplay , content filled explorable universe, excelent solution for avatar/station/planets interaction .. the game has a soul and it is not bland and boring
EVE on other hand has -> real economy, dept of gameplay/skill/crafting
Fusing this two games would in my oppinion finaly produce game worthy of name
ELITE SUCCESOR
"Before this battle is over all the world will know that few...stood against many." - King Leonidas
The real-time skill gain system is the reason I have never made it
past a weeklong trial of EVE. That and the fact that it's so hard to
find other people and there isn't a whole lot to do with them at low
levels.
Heh this shows yoe either did not play eve and are just rolling or you did the wrong things.
perhaps you could tell what would have been possible instead of simple saying you're wrong?
couse when i tried there were a lot of people in the channels but i saw rarely a soul
in space
Pi*1337/100 = 42
I know all about Eve Online to know how mickey mouse the economies are emulated.
As for the skill system it doesant matter as you dont need many skills to do well the rest of the skill training is just a bonus while you are having fun, and is definatly more fun than the grinding you get in certain other mmo's, because you atleast can ignor the skill training.
The real grind in eve is the cash raising grind.
The difference between someone who has been playing Eve Online for 1 month, to someone who has been playing for 12 months is as vast as someone who has been grinding on World Of Warcraft for 1 month, to someone who has been grinding on World of Warcraft for 12 months. Same difference, I have no use for Eve Fanbois to come in here and ruin my thread.
Its no mystery how Eve Online fanbois are the most vocal. Eve Online is the ultimate Alt-Tab/AFK/MACRO game, you play by not playing.
Another thing wrong with Eve Online economy is the amount of space more valuable minerals take up in your cargo hold. Its a rediculous ballancing issue done by devs that have no vision. The higher priced ores take up a rediculously larger amount of cargo space, so even though you are hauling around more pricey stuff, the quantity of the item you can haul is significantly reduced. This pretty much destroys any hope of anyone thinking of being a trader. You are going to make the same profit hauling the more expensive stuff as the cheaper stuff, even though the risk is much higher.
Lets see, other things wrong with the Eve Online economy.
Well they mask the shallowness of the economy by the sheer number of items, useless and otherwise. The number of items is pretty much redundant, but most players don't recognize the shallowness because they are ooo'ed and awe'ed by the sheer number of redundant items in the game.
Lets see, what else...
Its a half PvP, half carebear world. And guess where all the good minerals are at. You guessed it. In PvP world, just like World of Warcraft. Nothing revolutionary here. Lack of vision by the devs again.
Transporting ore in eve anywhere but to the nearest refinery is just STUPID. All of the refined minerals regardless of rarety is the exact same size.... Yes the ORE takes more space but even trading a mid level/in empire ore is pointless compared to refining it and hualing the minerals around.
Pointless modules... there are a few but nowhere near the number that you think. problem is you by my guess never played the game long enough to find the uses for those items. but I will give you the ones I have found absolutely no use for:
Inertial stabilizers
Flux coils
okay thats it. All the rest I have a use for.
PVP areas having the rewards for fighting there.
ITS NO WHERE CLOSE TO WOW. Control territory in 0.0 sec actually means something in EVE because it means you control access to said resources. Amazingly WoW doesn't even have territory control yet. And you don't even have to PVP in 0.0 because amazingly if your able to produce stuff for those that do, the PVPers protect you.
There are plenty of things to bitch about in EVE and you missed every single one of them, Great job.
Come back when you know how to bitch about:
T2 lottery
Log in traps
BM Copying Lag
Complex exploits
Oh yeah and I am in that situation of being a 12 month+ character that has to convient;y "forget" to tell a 2month character(RL friend) about a specific game mechanics to keep a upper hand because were on par besides that.
Its like bitching that an Aircraft Carrier doesn't handle like a speedboat, its completely pointless and just shows you up as an idiot.
looking for. Sorry to say you will have to wait about 3 years for
it though. If you want to check out what we are doing go to www.crimsonrealms.com and check it out.
Douglas Kasten
Crimson Realms Entertainment
"If A is success in life, then A = X + Y + Z. Where work is X; Y is play; and Z is knowing when to keep your mouth shut." --Albert Einstein
It is more than worth the download, as Gamespot among other places called it the greatest space sim of all time. Though I should warn you, after you play FS2 you will always look down upon every other space sim out there. If you have installation questions, PM me.
"Kaneda! What...do you see?"
Its like bitching that an Aircraft Carrier doesn't handle like a speedboat, its completely pointless and just shows you up as an idiot.
Huh why are you dissin me? I have been playin eve since teh day it was released. I like it teh way it is but the issue of joystick control has been raised before and as I explained, the devs were of the opinion that lag would make it a problem. It might be ok if you were playin on broadband from the UK but people from otehr parts of the world might have issues. Now care to explain why exactly you called me an idiot?
Oh and in a world with spaceships, how do you know that they don't handle like spaceships. You need an implant to raise your IQ about that of a chimp.
Its like bitching that an Aircraft Carrier doesn't handle like a speedboat, its completely pointless and just shows you up as an idiot.
No the Main reason is because it's way more different to implement, and because it would be a bit difficult to avoid lag with their current game design. Seamless world my ass. With all the jumps and shit, you could easily make "zones" and servers.
Just because the ships are large, doesn't mean they should be handled with point and click. Do you handle a Boeing 747 with point and click? It's large as hell, and no way near handle like a F-16. Yet it's handled with a Joystick. Same should count for space ships with the option of auto pilot.
As I see it, EvE flight is all auto pilot. You tell it where to go, and the computer takes care of it for you. No flying space ships yourself.
Besides, it's not all Frigates/Cruisers and Battleships. And don't forgot handling Larger space ships with direct controls instead of that pseudo flying shit, has been done before with other games.
Yeah, but there is a difference. Combat is dynamic. Not a preplanned course that should be done with an auto pilot. And unless you would want multiple players per ship(which would be fun if designed correctly), I'd much rather you play the commander and the numerous roles steering the ship.
If you don't want joystick for larger ships, you could always have an interactive screen of some sort where you select heading and speed and how the ship should be rotated(the latter is only possible if the games actually used the laws of Inertia)
In EvE you actually have 2 auto pilots:
One for any x,y,z coordinate and one for targets.
Making shooting and travelling auto strongly decreases the required overview, reactions and Multitasking otherwise needed.
The capital required to put the great game together is great, but the rewards even greater. Looking at the WoW subscriber base alone.
The accesories on the automobile are like the concepts in the gaming world. They don't necessarilly have to be reinvented but put together in the right way.
Its like bitching that an Aircraft Carrier doesn't handle like a speedboat, its completely pointless and just shows you up as an idiot.
Huh why are you dissin me? I have been playin eve since teh day it was released. I like it teh way it is but the issue of joystick control has been raised before and as I explained, the devs were of the opinion that lag would make it a problem. It might be ok if you were playin on broadband from the UK but people from otehr parts of the world might have issues. Now care to explain why exactly you called me an idiot?
Oh and in a world with spaceships, how do you know that they don't handle like spaceships. You need an implant to raise your IQ about that of a chimp.
Sorry, I wasn't meaning to attack you. Moreso I was aiming it at the constant 'we want joystick control' rants.
And as to the how they would handle question. Well just simply due to pysical forces applied to su ch large objects the only thing capable of manuvering it with out putting unbearable stress on the superstructure would be a navigation computer.
To Jackcolt, Comercial airliners don't handle like jet fighters. They are for the most part on autopilot. (also they are a lot more stable than fighters which are made inherantly unstable so that they can do all their fancy manuvers).
Also Eve combat is more about your tactics, setup and group setup. A poorly setup battleship is easy prey for some well organised frigates. And how the ship is rotated means nothing in Eve as each weapon is comprised of a pair of units that each cover a little more than half the visible sky around the ship. Your reactions and multitasking are just as critical as in twitch, but in different areas. Managing your weapons, reloads, drones, tank (shield/armour/hull), secondary modules (web/scramble/ecm/eccm) maintaining high transfersals, targetting the right enemies, maintaining gang coherance, watching out for reinforcements in local, having some form of escape.
And combat may be dynamic, but the participants are not always the same. Think of Eve like naval combat back when dreadnoughts ruled the oceans. Its slow and tactical, with battles taking anything from a few minutes to a few hours. it is not like aerial combat where an engagement is over in seconds or minutes at most.