Originally posted by Gameloading I know, I know, I hear you think. there he goes again, with his korean fanboism.
I don't want this to come off negative, but Granado Espada looks exactly like Lineage 2. Now, that's not necessarily a bad thing, but I was hoping for something different. It looks like a great game, but next gen? Not so far, but I'll wait and see. Aion has terrific graphics but it has the chance of being a Lineage 2 grind, which is fine as long as they can keep gold sellers, bots and farmers out to a larger degree than L2 ever did.
Huxley looks seriously rad, nothing bad to say about that one. I do like the eastern games, and I don't mind grinding, really I don't. I do mind asian gold farmers though. I pray that the "next gen" of asian video games does enough to combat bots, griefers and farmers. I don't hate much in this life, but I hate those.
Please tell me one good korean game that Americans play. No, stuff in beta or development doesn't count. You're just guessing those are good games. Just like people thought DDO, D&L, EQ2, and many others were the next generation. Korean games actually fare far worse tham EQ or DDO in America. We don't like to point and click to move, we don't like killing the same goblin 10,000 times.
Originally posted by brostyn Please tell me one good korean game that Americans play. No, stuff in beta or development doesn't count. You're just guessing those are good games. Just like people thought DDO, D&L, EQ2, and many others were the next generation. Korean games actually fare far worse tham EQ or DDO in America. We don't like to point and click to move, we don't like killing the same goblin 10,000 times.
When people speak of the western market, then they include europe. Because the european MMO market is EXACTLY the same like the US when it comes to MMO's.
That's the most incorrect thing I ever heard. No western MMO is as bad as EVE.
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Originally posted by Souldrainer Originally posted by Gameloading When people speak of the western market, then they include europe. Because the european MMO market is EXACTLY the same like the US when it comes to MMO's.
That's the most incorrect thing I ever heard. No western MMO is as bad as EVE.
Originally posted by anarchyart Originally posted by Gameloading I know, I know, I hear you think. there he goes again, with his korean fanboism.
I don't want this to come off negative, but Granado Espada looks exactly like Lineage 2. Now, that's not necessarily a bad thing, but I was hoping for something different. It looks like a great game, but next gen? Not so far, but I'll wait and see. Aion has terrific graphics but it has the chance of being a Lineage 2 grind, which is fine as long as they can keep gold sellers, bots and farmers out to a larger degree than L2 ever did.
Huxley looks seriously rad, nothing bad to say about that one. I do like the eastern games, and I don't mind grinding, really I don't. I do mind asian gold farmers though. I pray that the "next gen" of asian video games does enough to combat bots, griefers and farmers. I don't hate much in this life, but I hate those.
I don't think Aion will have the Lineage 2 heavy korean grind.
"According to Yong Taek Bae, Associate Producer for NCsoft Seoul, there will be none of the level-grinding which is common in Korean MMOs. Although not fully disclosed at this time, the leveling-up system will be different from what you would normally expect."
Personally I don't see either side on the leading edge of innovative and unique MMORPG genre. It's pretty much the same hack and slash game that gets rehashed over and over again. The only thing that really changes is with the evolution of graphics. Sure some games have a better textures than others, or rather textures that one just prefers. I really don't care for the eastern style of animation myself but some folks do.
The most important thing about eastern MMOGs is the strong competition they bring to the table...seeing that competition = better MMOGs for all of us! I hope they turn up the heat even more in the future!
It's not just the Koreans either...just wait 'til the Chinese start dishin' out MMOG ass-whoopin's!
I've said it many times before...the Koreans and the Chinese could totally dominate the MMOG market if they wanted to. Will they? Who knows...
At any rate, I agree with the OP...
Was that Iron Maiden playing in the background of the SUN video?
Many of you guys who flame us alot for liking Korean mmo's should give them a try if your complaining that no one is leading innovation. Not the ones out right now, but the ones listed above. Aside from SUN. I heard that one isn't so good and is a rehash of Guild Wars.
didn't you watch the videos? theres knockback! like omg! they got some physics!
Honestly except for huxley, the others just seem like the same old thing in a slightly altered package, and even GE, the 3 characters look cool... but its nothing new...its basically a glorified "pet" system, take a look at masterminds in coh, or even bonedancers in daoc, its similar in concept, but just fleshed out a bit more.
I honestly dont see anything special or new about any of them(again except for huxley)
Well Ragnarok 2 differs greatly from other Korean MMO's because of its twitch based gameplay. which has never really been done before in an asian MMO of RO's scale.
I understand your comment about GE, and it does sound its like a pet system. I had the chance to play the japanese beta for a short while, and It doesn't really quite work like that. its a bit difficult to explain in text, so the best I can give you now is to try once it reaches the west (which is going to take a while).
I also understand why many don't see why Aion could be a next gen title. from the limited information that has been given about Aion and the gameplay movies, its hard to figure out what the game is all about. I think it will be a real next gen titles for these reasons.
1: the comment it will have an unique character development system from the IGN article.
2: Its made by NCsoft.
I'll explain point 2.
NCsoft is the developer of Lineage 1 and Lineage 2.
Many people think a lot of korean MMORPG's are diablo clones. this isn't true, they are Lineage 1 clones. Lineage 1 was the first real successful korean MMO. Lineage 1 came with new things, naturally, because it was one of the first. soon games began to copy Lineage 1, and the result is a lot of L1 clones.
Then NCsoft came out with Lineage 2. Lineage 2 was new and innovative, believe it or not. it took clan politics and pvp to a next level. again, many companies began to copy Lineage 2. we know the result.
NCsoft produced original and new MMO's, and I believe they will do the same with Aion.
Originally posted by brostyn Please tell me one good korean game that Americans play. No, stuff in beta or development doesn't count. You're just guessing those are good games. Just like people thought DDO, D&L, EQ2, and many others were the next generation. Korean games actually fare far worse tham EQ or DDO in America. We don't like to point and click to move, we don't like killing the same goblin 10,000 times.
Good is a realitive term to say the least. What is good to one person may suck to the next person.
I personally think there are plenty of good korean games, I may not play them all but to say that there isn't any good korean games as far as American's are concerned is just your attempt to speak for every American MMO gamer.
-------------------------------- Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
So if I play WoW, EQ2 and Daoc, I know what EVE is like? or if I play D&L,Mourning and Runescape, then I can say that all western MMO's are crap? thats what I thought. QFT
-------------------------------- Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by Souldrainer Originally posted by Gameloading I know, I know, I hear you think. there he goes again, with his korean fanboism.
I know its a pretty harsh statement, But I really think that it will be Korea that will push the genre forward,
Korean MMO's suck. All of them. In every way. The companies that have innovated MMO's and other RPG's have always been American. I see nothing that will even put a crack in this trend, let alone break it. Companies like Bioware, Bethesda, and Mythic have innovated in ways that Koren developers can't. Unless Korea bombs every other country in the world out of existence, their grind games will always suck ass! So by this I assume you played all 100+ korean MMO's?judging by the fact that you seem to think all of them are nothing but Grind, I will assume you didn't. Bioware and Bethesda didn't create any MMORPG, and Mythic didn't bring out anything new either. DAOC is Everquest with PVP slapped on it. If you have played Lineage II then you have played every korean mmo ever made ...... ever korean games just blow hard overall, not an opinion, fact.
Originally posted by maputo no it is true, look at rappelz, L2, Silkroad, Archlord... all have the same graphics, same clunky POS point and click movement etc etc.
Your right man and so are teh others that see your points.. But please stop arguing with these East Fanboi's.. Eventually if you ignore them long enough they will go away..
Just like their tired (every game is the same) MMORPG's.
------------------------------ You see, every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with their surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You spread to an area, and you multiply, and you multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet.-Mr.Smith
Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by Souldrainer Originally posted by Gameloading I know, I know, I hear you think. there he goes again, with his korean fanboism.I know its a pretty harsh statement, But I really think that it will be Korea that will push the genre forward,
Korean MMO's suck. All of them. In every way. The companies that have innovated MMO's and other RPG's have always been American. I see nothing that will even put a crack in this trend, let alone break it. Companies like Bioware, Bethesda, and Mythic have innovated in ways that Koren developers can't. Unless Korea bombs every other country in the world out of existence, their grind games will always suck ass! So by this I assume you played all 100+ korean MMO's?judging by the fact that you seem to think all of them are nothing but Grind, I will assume you didn't. Bioware and Bethesda didn't create any MMORPG, and Mythic didn't bring out anything new either. DAOC is Everquest with PVP slapped on it.
If you had one post on these boards I might of wrote that off as ignorance. My respect for your future posts are now forever tainted.
Originally posted by Gameloading I know, I know, I hear you think. there he goes again, with his korean fanboism.
I know its a pretty harsh statement, But I really think that it will be Korea that will push the genre forward, instead of the west. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure the western developers will also bring a few titles that will break the mainstream MMO, such as Age of Conan. But the majority of MMO titles that will be original and can truly be called Next Generation will come from the east.
In fact, I'm willing to make another harsh statement. In less then 8 years, over 50% of you will be playing Korean MMO's, insead of western.
Obviously, I will provide a few titles to back up my theory.
This title is very diffrent from the first Ragnarok Online, although it is made by the same company, Gravity. most important aspect is that the game has full twitch based combat. the game is also supposed to have dynamic quest content,although I don't know all the details. I know, I'm not a big fan of the graphics either, But gameplay over graphics, right?
I couldn't pick which gameplay video to show, so I made a link to all 3 of them hehe Anyway, Granado Espada is made by Kim Hak Kyu, who is said to be the number 1 Korean game developer. He is also the founder of Gravity, Who became one of the biggest MMO companies of today, And original developer of Ragnarok Online, although he left a few years after Ragnarok Online was completed. See him as the korean Richard garriot. Kim Hak Kyu was given 56 Million USD to create Granado Espada (making it one, if not THE most expensive MMORPG ever created). The main feature that makes Granado Espada original is that you control 3 characters, instead of 1, called the Multi Character control (MCC) also original is the ability to recruit NPC's. Granado Espada is a bit of a mix between a typical MMORPG and a RTS.
Aion is a new project of NCsoft, and is aiming for a 2007 release, Beta is supposed to start Q4 of 2006. Sadly, not much is known about Aion yet. surprising is that it seems to have very western controls. In an ign interview, it is mentioned that the game will have a diffrent character development then the standard MMO, although no further details have been given. The game features Realm Vs Realm Vs Realm pvp. However, you can only chose from 2 factions, the Angels, and the Demons. the 3rd faction, the dragons, is an NPC faction. its there to keep the war balanced. If the angels are outnumbered, the Dragons will come to their aid, and the same counts for the demons. it works in theory, we will have to see how it will work.
I don't know a lot about this game. heck, I'm not even sure if its actually an MMORPG. I couldn't find a lot of good gameplay videos of it, but I hope this will do.
Well, I hope you found this post intresting!
I don't know Gameloading. While most western MMOs seem to be falling into a set formula on how they think MMOs need to be made to be a big hit (kinda like movies and Hollywood) none of the games you list there seem very revolutionary either or we just don't know enough about yet to know what they will be like. Changes to combat to being FPS or having your barracks of characters is only changes to combat and by itself just doesn't seem that big a deal to me. It needs more then that for me, a step away from the loot raid repeat only gameplay ..... or else it just seems like a litte advancement on what we have but nothing really revolutionary or deserving to be called another generation of MMOs.
Also you do get the odd little western game trying something different, like Chronicles of Spellborn where they at least take a step away from everyone wearing and wanting the same loot and give you the chance to look how you want.
Originally posted by Tinybina Originally posted by maputo no it is true, look at rappelz, L2, Silkroad, Archlord... all have the same graphics, same clunky POS point and click movement etc etc.
Your right man and so are teh others that see your points.. But please stop arguing with these East Fanboi's.. Eventually if you ignore them long enough they will go away..
Just like their tired (every game is the same) MMORPG's. I am not an eastern fanboi but to me both Western and Eastern games having this problem, they are all generally the same you roll up a character, grind and grind, rinse and repeat. That is part of being an MMO. Sure some you grind quest and others you grind mobs but it is still grind.
But don't fool yourself western games aren't really that different from eastern ones. WoW cloned EQ. EQ2 cloned WoW and EQ. And so on.
-------------------------------- Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Comments
I don't want this to come off negative, but Granado Espada looks exactly like Lineage 2. Now, that's not necessarily a bad thing, but I was hoping for something different. It looks like a great game, but next gen? Not so far, but I'll wait and see. Aion has terrific graphics but it has the chance of being a Lineage 2 grind, which is fine as long as they can keep gold sellers, bots and farmers out to a larger degree than L2 ever did.
Huxley looks seriously rad, nothing bad to say about that one. I do like the eastern games, and I don't mind grinding, really I don't. I do mind asian gold farmers though. I pray that the "next gen" of asian video games does enough to combat bots, griefers and farmers. I don't hate much in this life, but I hate those.
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That's the most incorrect thing I ever heard. No western MMO is as bad as EVE.
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That's the most incorrect thing I ever heard. No western MMO is as bad as EVE.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion......
I don't want this to come off negative, but Granado Espada looks exactly like Lineage 2. Now, that's not necessarily a bad thing, but I was hoping for something different. It looks like a great game, but next gen? Not so far, but I'll wait and see. Aion has terrific graphics but it has the chance of being a Lineage 2 grind, which is fine as long as they can keep gold sellers, bots and farmers out to a larger degree than L2 ever did.
Huxley looks seriously rad, nothing bad to say about that one. I do like the eastern games, and I don't mind grinding, really I don't. I do mind asian gold farmers though. I pray that the "next gen" of asian video games does enough to combat bots, griefers and farmers. I don't hate much in this life, but I hate those.
I don't think Aion will have the Lineage 2 heavy korean grind.
http://pc.ign.com/articles/708/708762p1.html
"According to Yong Taek Bae, Associate Producer for NCsoft Seoul, there
will be none of the level-grinding which is common in Korean MMOs.
Although not fully disclosed at this time, the leveling-up system will
be different from what you would normally expect."
Personally I don't see either side on the leading edge of innovative and unique MMORPG genre. It's pretty much the same hack and slash game that gets rehashed over and over again. The only thing that really changes is with the evolution of graphics. Sure some games have a better textures than others, or rather textures that one just prefers. I really don't care for the eastern style of animation myself but some folks do.
The most important thing about eastern MMOGs is the strong competition they bring to the table...seeing that competition = better MMOGs for all of us! I hope they turn up the heat even more in the future!
It's not just the Koreans either...just wait 'til the Chinese start dishin' out MMOG ass-whoopin's!
I've said it many times before...the Koreans and the Chinese could totally dominate the MMOG market if they wanted to. Will they? Who knows...
At any rate, I agree with the OP...
Was that Iron Maiden playing in the background of the SUN video?
Many of you guys who flame us alot for liking Korean mmo's should give them a try if your complaining that no one is leading innovation. Not the ones out right now, but the ones listed above. Aside from SUN. I heard that one isn't so good and is a rehash of Guild Wars.
mmm , so what else is new ?
asia is on rise , europe and america downhill
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Yeah this is going on in another thread and what I want to know is:
What makes 'em next gen?
Honestly except for huxley, the others just seem like the same old thing in a slightly altered package, and even GE, the 3 characters look cool... but its nothing new...its basically a glorified "pet" system, take a look at masterminds in coh, or even bonedancers in daoc, its similar in concept, but just fleshed out a bit more.
I honestly dont see anything special or new about any of them(again except for huxley)
I understand your comment about GE, and it does sound its like a pet system. I had the chance to play the japanese beta for a short while, and It doesn't really quite work like that. its a bit difficult to explain in text, so the best I can give you now is to try once it reaches the west (which is going to take a while).
I also understand why many don't see why Aion could be a next gen title. from the limited information that has been given about Aion and the gameplay movies, its hard to figure out what the game is all about. I think it will be a real next gen titles for these reasons.
1: the comment it will have an unique character development system from the IGN article.
2: Its made by NCsoft.
I'll explain point 2.
NCsoft is the developer of Lineage 1 and Lineage 2.
Many people think a lot of korean MMORPG's are diablo clones. this isn't true, they are Lineage 1 clones.
Lineage 1 was the first real successful korean MMO. Lineage 1 came with new things, naturally, because it was one of the first. soon games began to copy Lineage 1, and the result is a lot of L1 clones.
Then NCsoft came out with Lineage 2. Lineage 2 was new and innovative, believe it or not. it took clan politics and pvp to a next level. again, many companies began to copy Lineage 2. we know the result.
NCsoft produced original and new MMO's, and I believe they will do the same with Aion.
--------------------------------
Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
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I personally think there are plenty of good korean games, I may not play them all but to say that there isn't any good korean games as far as American's are concerned is just your attempt to speak for every American MMO gamer.
--------------------------------
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QFT
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Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Quit: Eden Eternal, Wakfu, DDO, STO, DCUO, Sword 2, Atlantica Online, LOTRO, SWTOR, RIFT, Earthrise, FFXIV, RoM, Allods Online, GA,WAR,CO,V:SoH,POTBS,TR,COH/COV, WOW, DDO,AL, EQ, Eve, L2, AA, Mx0, SWG, SoR, AO, RFO, DAoC, and others.
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So by this I assume you played all 100+ korean MMO's?judging by the fact that you seem to think all of them are nothing but Grind, I will assume you didn't. Bioware and Bethesda didn't create any MMORPG, and Mythic didn't bring out anything new either. DAOC is Everquest with PVP slapped on it.
If you have played Lineage II then you have played every korean mmo ever made ...... ever korean games just blow hard overall, not an opinion, fact.
--------------------------------
Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Quit: Eden Eternal, Wakfu, DDO, STO, DCUO, Sword 2, Atlantica Online, LOTRO, SWTOR, RIFT, Earthrise, FFXIV, RoM, Allods Online, GA,WAR,CO,V:SoH,POTBS,TR,COH/COV, WOW, DDO,AL, EQ, Eve, L2, AA, Mx0, SWG, SoR, AO, RFO, DAoC, and others.
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Just like their tired (every game is the same) MMORPG's.
------------------------------
You see, every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with their surrounding environment, but you humans do not. You spread to an area, and you multiply, and you multiply, until every natural resource is consumed. The only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet.-Mr.Smith
Doubt it, eastern games lack imagination and consists of scantly clad elves killing X mob over and over again.
YOU may enjoy them, but I personally cant stand anime style games.
And even if they werent anime style, I still wouldnt play them on account of their grind repetitiveness.
---
MMO's suck. All of them. In every way. The companies
that have innovated MMO's and other RPG's have always been
American. I see nothing that will even put a crack in this trend,
let alone break it. Companies like Bioware, Bethesda,
and Mythic have innovated in ways that Koren developers
can't. Unless Korea bombs every other country in the world out of
existence, their grind games will always suck ass!
So
by this I assume you played all 100+ korean MMO's?judging by the fact
that you seem to think all of them are nothing but Grind, I will assume
you didn't. Bioware and Bethesda didn't create any MMORPG, and
Mythic didn't bring out anything new either. DAOC is Everquest with PVP slapped on it.
If you had one post on these boards I might of wrote that off as ignorance.
My respect for your future posts are now forever tainted.
LOL doesn't this apply to amost every MMO eastern or not?
WoW, EQ2, yadda yadda yadda. This isn't anything that is just an eastern thing.
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Quit: Eden Eternal, Wakfu, DDO, STO, DCUO, Sword 2, Atlantica Online, LOTRO, SWTOR, RIFT, Earthrise, FFXIV, RoM, Allods Online, GA,WAR,CO,V:SoH,POTBS,TR,COH/COV, WOW, DDO,AL, EQ, Eve, L2, AA, Mx0, SWG, SoR, AO, RFO, DAoC, and others.
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I don't know Gameloading. While most western MMOs seem to be falling into a set formula on how they think MMOs need to be made to be a big hit (kinda like movies and Hollywood) none of the games you list there seem very revolutionary either or we just don't know enough about yet to know what they will be like. Changes to combat to being FPS or having your barracks of characters is only changes to combat and by itself just doesn't seem that big a deal to me. It needs more then that for me, a step away from the loot raid repeat only gameplay ..... or else it just seems like a litte advancement on what we have but nothing really revolutionary or deserving to be called another generation of MMOs.
Also you do get the odd little western game trying something different, like Chronicles of Spellborn where they at least take a step away from everyone wearing and wanting the same loot and give you the chance to look how you want.
Just like their tired (every game is the same) MMORPG's.
I am not an eastern fanboi but to me both Western and Eastern games having this problem, they are all generally the same you roll up a character, grind and grind, rinse and repeat. That is part of being an MMO. Sure some you grind quest and others you grind mobs but it is still grind.
But don't fool yourself western games aren't really that different from eastern ones. WoW cloned EQ. EQ2 cloned WoW and EQ. And so on.
--------------------------------
Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Quit: Eden Eternal, Wakfu, DDO, STO, DCUO, Sword 2, Atlantica Online, LOTRO, SWTOR, RIFT, Earthrise, FFXIV, RoM, Allods Online, GA,WAR,CO,V:SoH,POTBS,TR,COH/COV, WOW, DDO,AL, EQ, Eve, L2, AA, Mx0, SWG, SoR, AO, RFO, DAoC, and others.
www.twitter.com/mlwhitt
www.michaelwhitt.com