I have never forced my kids in religion or my beliefs on them. I am divorced, so there is no Mommy figure at my house.
My youngest is very Christian as I stated. Thats one of the reasons I took my darminism decal off my SUV.
He enjoys his school and so does my oldest, but he is not as fervent as my youngest. When I was their age, my Mom made me go to church and used to question me on what the priest talked about in his sermon. I used to skip mass and go to the pool hall, then I would catch a friend leaving church and ask him what the sermon was....LOL so I could tell my Mom.
Well i go to your average school here in canada and we are not taught about regelion. No one questions someone eles regelion unless your very young and dont understand it( when i say very young i mean like 7 or 8).. i personally started questioning regelion at the age of 9 and then at 10 i just totally tought it was all bull(to me any type of regelion is bull) and right now im very happy beleaveing in nothing and accepting that i dont know what happens when im going to die or anyone eles or even how the heack we as humans got here and how the universe came to be
The big issue of Evolution vs Creationism is when it's in public schools.
If you send your kids to a Catholic school, well you know they are going to be taught Catholic ideals and beliefs. That is the whole point of you sending them there. The problem is if it's a public school, what if my kid isn't Catholic? Then my tax dollars going to teach a religion I do not share. This is why the founding fathers knew to separate church and state AND state there is no national religion. The freedom of religion also means the freedom to not be religious too.
Many creationists try to sound "scientific" by stating Intelligent Design instead of Creation. That way, God is in the background so it doesn't seem as religious a stand. The problem is that they only have the bible to base any claims off of, which then of course brings God back to the forefront. Then there is the issue of which God? Hebrew, Muslim, Christian, Buddist, etc? There are many versions of Creation, just depends on where in the world you are and what religion is most dominant.
Those that state since Evolution is only a theory it isn't true don't understand the scientific process. Science isn't like the Bible of absolutes, in the Bible you have to believe everything or it doesn't work. Science will post a theory, test it with observation, then debate whether the facts fit the theory. If they don't the theory is reworked or scrapped. The Steady State Theory of the Universe is an example, it opposed the Big Bang Theory but didn't hold up under observed data. The fact is that Evolution is the accepted science standard because it, so far, holds up vs observed data.
Creation is based on faith. If you have faith then Creation is "right" and you cannot be told otherwise. A person with faith won't need evidence to continue to believe, their faith is all they require.
I have asked my youngest on why he believes in the Bibles version of the creation of man. He said that his teacher said that there are too many flaws in the Evolution Theory to believe in it.
Originally posted by outfctrl I have asked my youngest on why he believes in the Bibles version of the creation of man. He said that his teacher said that there are too many flaws in the Evolution Theory to believe in it.
Hmmm, seems he's been a bit brainwashed then.
Sorry about the over-bearing comment earlier, I didn't read the second page of the thread, and that was my bad. It seems a bit weird though. It's not really healthy to believe because someone told him to. It's kind of what breeds zealots, and they're not usually very nice people.
That seems a bit stickier. It's been drilled in his head then, and he really doesn't have his own belief. When you ask a Christian why Evolution Theory is wrong, they should tell you "Because God/Jesus..." Not "Because my teacher/priest/friend/mother says so", but at the same time, it's not really cool to try and prove him wrong. Maybe you should tell him to do the intelligent thing and try and reason why he believes so. People who just throw out random Bible quotes and get defensive about their faith were often brought up like that. The sad truth is, most Christians haven't even read the Bible, or even a quarter of it. Most know about Genesis, Exodus, and Revelation, because those have the most general outlook of things.
Personally, if you have to look for faith answers from a priest or a teacher, or somebody else other than yourself, you may not be so secure in your faith.
I'm not pointing any blame, because I don't see any blame due on your part, but please, make sure you take the responsibility to at least let them know that they should be backing up any arguements or qualms, or justifications they have before jumping in head first. Otherwise, it'll bite them in the rear end some day.
Didn't seem like you got a lot of actual answers to your question.
I was in high school pretty recently and they taught both. Creationism was mentioned briefly though, and described vaguely; I don't believe any specific numbers were used i.e. 6000 years etc. Let's just say I'm in the SE USA.
I live in the SE too, Jacksonville, Fl. There is a huge following of Sothern Baptist here. When I lived up North, most were Catholics.
Hell, it wasnt too long ago when we couldnt buy beer on Sundays. There are still restaurants here in Orange Park that wont sell liquor till after 1 pm, but if I cross the Buckman bridge into Mandarin (3 miles away), I can get a bloody Mary at 11 am.
I went to Catholic school from K-12th grade, and I was taught Evolutionary theory in Science class, and Creationism (with the possibility for Evolution) in my religion classes. The funny thing is, most of my religion teachers were just as skeptical of some biblical and dogmatic disfluencies as I was. There were a few brothers that I got into many a debate with, and there was even an ex-NASA rocket scientist turned Priest who had some pretty cool ideas about religious theory. At least in my experience, religion classes (for the most part) didn't try to brainwash me or shove anything down my throat. They presented the Catholic belief about something, then left things up for debate if people so desired.
Originally posted by modjoe86 I went to Catholic school from K-12th grade, and I was taught Evolutionary theory in Science class, and Creationism (with the possibility for Evolution) in my religion classes. The funny thing is, most of my religion teachers were just as skeptical of some biblical and dogmatic disfluencies as I was. There were a few brothers that I got into many a debate with, and there was even an ex-NASA rocket scientist turned Priest who had some pretty cool ideas about religious theory. At least in my experience, religion classes (for the most part) didn't try to brainwash me or shove anything down my throat. They presented the Catholic belief about something, then left things up for debate if people so desired.
My priests and teachers had so blatent answers it was hard to believe anything back in the day.
". . . Because God made it that way. . ." What a good answer. I mean seriously, or their is the bible said thats what he said. Was the bible written by him? No. It wasn't even recorded until 100 years after Jesus christ. I don't know how it can be possible.
Change my mind so much I can't even trust it My mind change me so much I can't even trust myself
Originally posted by outfctrl but What exactly is taught in the schools? If they teach Evolution, do you get a student who questions it with his belief?
In both my middle and high school, they teach Evolution. BUT of course we have those that question it, and that's all perfectly fine.
Also though in my high school we have a bible science class that teaches creation.
I believe in evolution, but not because of science class. Well no, it did help with my choice, but my religion also teaches evolution as well.
I went to a catholic school from k-7th grade, and when I moved to texas, I went into public schooling. In catholic school, they taught us both creationism and evolution, although they didn't go into evolution as much as I wanted them too. They mostly dismissed it as a theory that was very flawed. I used to argue with my biology teacher that,"if evolution is flawed, how can you say that religion is not?" I was usually answered with the "because you have faith that it isn't" response. It bothered me greatly.
In that school, I had straight As in every single class, except for religion, which I maintained with a D, just because I refused to believe in something with no backing.
To me, the choice between creationism and evolution was clear. It bothers me that people can just take someone elses word for fact without even looking into it on their own, expecially on something as important as religion.
To answer your question outofctrl, most kids just assume Evolution is the way to good because it is taught in schools. I read about both sides, and came up with the conclusion by myself ie. The Myth of Creationism and the Science of Evolution, by Andrea Skybreak.
Interesting that you would bring this up...Because there is just about as much factual evidence supporting evolution as there is Creationism...sure there are hints and clues everywhere...but is there anything that can make everybody look at it and say "yup that is evolution" or "yup that is God" ? nope there sure isn't. I truly believe that Christianity is no more a religion than Evolution is, because both are based on faith. Say what you want about scientific research, but if you do enough of it yourself, you will quickly come to realize that evolution has gaping holes all around it...You shouldn't just believe in evolution because you are told to do so...nor should you just believe in God because you are told to do so...look for the facts yourself, objective facts, not theory, not "it is thought" crap..but actual KNOWN facts, and you will find that evolution has very few.
Before you go off about carbon dating and that sort of thing, do a little research on Carbon dating, it's not nearly as accurate as it is portrayed.
Your argument is like a two legged dog with an eating disorder...weak and unbalanced.
At my school we are taugh evolution, and sometimes the teacher might say "yes there is evidence that there was an earthquak were moses was leading the jews out of egypt, but who is to say he did not have any help?"
Originally posted by outfctrl I have asked my youngest on why he believes in the Bibles version of the creation of man. He said that his teacher said that there are too many flaws in the Evolution Theory to believe in it.
Originally posted by LostGrace At my school we are taugh evolution, and sometimes the teacher might say "yes there is evidence that there was an earthquak were moses was leading the jews out of egypt, but who is to say he did not have any help?" I believe in evolution.
There's also evidence of a global flood, and of the world being only 10 thousand years old(the most accurate dating techniques actually place the oldest rocks at around there)
But they don't talk about that stuff...they say that the flood was local and that the earth is billions of years old..whatever.
Who wants to debate the accuracy of current dating techniques?!?
Your argument is like a two legged dog with an eating disorder...weak and unbalanced.
Originally posted by Draenor Originally posted by LostGrace At my school we are taugh evolution, and sometimes the teacher might say "yes there is evidence that there was an earthquak were moses was leading the jews out of egypt, but who is to say he did not have any help?" I believe in evolution.
There's also evidence of a global flood, and of the world being only 10 thousand years old(the most accurate dating techniques actually place the oldest rocks at around there)
But they don't talk about that stuff...they say that the flood was local and that the earth is billions of years old..whatever.
Who wants to debate the accuracy of current dating techniques?!?
Show me those dating techniques, because I think your pulling that out of your ass.
Show me those dating techniques, because I think your pulling that out of your ass.
Well...since the most fun thing to talk about that's millions of years old is Dinosaurs...give this a read...read the whole thing if you are going to respond to the article at all please.
The man that wrote the article is Dr. Kent Hovind...a Christian Scientist who is offering a 250,000 dollar reward for anyone who can come forward with observable evidence of evolution, so far nobody has come forward.
Your argument is like a two legged dog with an eating disorder...weak and unbalanced.
Originally posted by Draenor The man that wrote the article is Dr. Kent Hovind...a Christian Scientist who is offering a 250,000 dollar reward for anyone who can come forward with observable evidence of evolution, so far nobody has come forward.
hmm... maybe that is because people dismiss it as "adaptation." Such as that of the Darwins finches in galapagos island, who over a generartion or two change their beak shape depending on the type of food available.
Originally posted by Xexima Originally posted by Draenor The man that wrote the article is Dr. Kent Hovind...a Christian Scientist who is offering a 250,000 dollar reward for anyone who can come forward with observable evidence of evolution, so far nobody has come forward.
hmm... maybe that is because people dismiss it as "adaptation." Such as that of the Darwins finches in galapagos island, who over a generartion or two change their beak shape depending on the type of food available. That was just on tv! About Darwins finches I mean. ;D
The planet being only 10,000 years old? LOL, thats a load of shit.
The man that wrote the article is Dr. Kent Hovind...a Christian Scientist who is offering a 250,000 dollar reward for anyone who can come forward with observable evidence of evolution, so far nobody has come forward.
hmm... maybe that is because people dismiss it as "adaptation." Such as that of the Darwins finches in galapagos island, who over a generartion or two change their beak shape depending on the type of food available.
You misunderstand what he means by evolution...he means if anyone can come forward with actual proof that an animal has added information to their DNA, as Evolution suggests, that he will give them 250,000 dollars...and nobody can do it, because it has never happened.
It's okay if you think that he's biased, bias doesn't really matter when all he is doing is showing that evolutionary science isn't science at all.
Your argument is like a two legged dog with an eating disorder...weak and unbalanced.
The man that wrote the article is Dr. Kent Hovind...a Christian Scientist who is offering a 250,000 dollar reward for anyone who can come forward with observable evidence of evolution, so far nobody has come forward.
hmm... maybe that is because people dismiss it as "adaptation." Such as that of the Darwins finches in galapagos island, who over a generartion or two change their beak shape depending on the type of food available.
That was just on tv! About Darwins finches I mean. ;D
The planet being only 10,000 years old? LOL, thats a load of shit.
Everything you see on TV is true...same goes for the internet.
Your argument is like a two legged dog with an eating disorder...weak and unbalanced.
Originally posted by Draenor Originally posted by LilithIshtar Originally posted by Xexima Originally posted by Draenor The man that wrote the article is Dr. Kent Hovind...a Christian Scientist who is offering a 250,000 dollar reward for anyone who can come forward with observable evidence of evolution, so far nobody has come forward.
hmm... maybe that is because people dismiss it as "adaptation." Such as that of the Darwins finches in galapagos island, who over a generartion or two change their beak shape depending on the type of food available. That was just on tv! About Darwins finches I mean. ;D
The planet being only 10,000 years old? LOL, thats a load of shit.
Everything you see on TV is true...same goes for the internet.
LOL dude, I was stating that it was on the tv afew hours ago, that's all. I didn't even bother to watch it for more than five minuets before I got bored.
You'd have to be an idiot to believe everything on you see on tv and the internet is true.
There is no factual evidence supporting any story in the bible. None. Incase your forgot, religeon is mainstream...I read somewhere that 70% of Americans are Christians.
If there was any halfway decent evidence supporting any story in the bible, it would be flaunted around profusely and creationism would most definatly be taught in schools.
EDIT; Oh, and humans and dinosaurs did not live together, thus making the "God created everything in 6 days" point invalid, and the "The Earth has only been around for 10,000 years" invalid as well. Also, the website you showed is bullshit. Sorry to burst your bubble.
Professional looking website, too. /sigh.
I keep adding to this post.
It is a fact that natural formations, such as the Grand Canyon and many mountain you see, those take millions of years to form. Also, the 10,000 year old theory dosen't support the fossils in the rock layers, and the depth of the sea.
Comments
I have never forced my kids in religion or my beliefs on them. I am divorced, so there is no Mommy figure at my house.
My youngest is very Christian as I stated. Thats one of the reasons I took my darminism decal off my SUV.
He enjoys his school and so does my oldest, but he is not as fervent as my youngest. When I was their age, my Mom made me go to church and used to question me on what the priest talked about in his sermon. I used to skip mass and go to the pool hall, then I would catch a friend leaving church and ask him what the sermon was....LOL so I could tell my Mom.
musha
The big issue of Evolution vs Creationism is when it's in public schools.
If you send your kids to a Catholic school, well you know they are going to be taught Catholic ideals and beliefs. That is the whole point of you sending them there. The problem is if it's a public school, what if my kid isn't Catholic? Then my tax dollars going to teach a religion I do not share. This is why the founding fathers knew to separate church and state AND state there is no national religion. The freedom of religion also means the freedom to not be religious too.
Many creationists try to sound "scientific" by stating Intelligent Design instead of Creation. That way, God is in the background so it doesn't seem as religious a stand. The problem is that they only have the bible to base any claims off of, which then of course brings God back to the forefront. Then there is the issue of which God? Hebrew, Muslim, Christian, Buddist, etc? There are many versions of Creation, just depends on where in the world you are and what religion is most dominant.
Those that state since Evolution is only a theory it isn't true don't understand the scientific process. Science isn't like the Bible of absolutes, in the Bible you have to believe everything or it doesn't work. Science will post a theory, test it with observation, then debate whether the facts fit the theory. If they don't the theory is reworked or scrapped. The Steady State Theory of the Universe is an example, it opposed the Big Bang Theory but didn't hold up under observed data. The fact is that Evolution is the accepted science standard because it, so far, holds up vs observed data.
Creation is based on faith. If you have faith then Creation is "right" and you cannot be told otherwise. A person with faith won't need evidence to continue to believe, their faith is all they require.
Sorry about the over-bearing comment earlier, I didn't read the second page of the thread, and that was my bad. It seems a bit weird though. It's not really healthy to believe because someone told him to. It's kind of what breeds zealots, and they're not usually very nice people.
That seems a bit stickier. It's been drilled in his head then, and he really doesn't have his own belief. When you ask a Christian why Evolution Theory is wrong, they should tell you "Because God/Jesus..." Not "Because my teacher/priest/friend/mother says so", but at the same time, it's not really cool to try and prove him wrong. Maybe you should tell him to do the intelligent thing and try and reason why he believes so. People who just throw out random Bible quotes and get defensive about their faith were often brought up like that. The sad truth is, most Christians haven't even read the Bible, or even a quarter of it. Most know about Genesis, Exodus, and Revelation, because those have the most general outlook of things.
Personally, if you have to look for faith answers from a priest or a teacher, or somebody else other than yourself, you may not be so secure in your faith.
I'm not pointing any blame, because I don't see any blame due on your part, but please, make sure you take the responsibility to at least let them know that they should be backing up any arguements or qualms, or justifications they have before jumping in head first. Otherwise, it'll bite them in the rear end some day.
Didn't seem like you got a lot of actual answers to your question.
I was in high school pretty recently and they taught both. Creationism was mentioned briefly though, and described vaguely; I don't believe any specific numbers were used i.e. 6000 years etc. Let's just say I'm in the SE USA.
I live in the SE too, Jacksonville, Fl. There is a huge following of Sothern Baptist here. When I lived up North, most were Catholics.
Hell, it wasnt too long ago when we couldnt buy beer on Sundays. There are still restaurants here in Orange Park that wont sell liquor till after 1 pm, but if I cross the Buckman bridge into Mandarin (3 miles away), I can get a bloody Mary at 11 am.
Weird
The funny thing is, most of my religion teachers were just as skeptical of some biblical and dogmatic disfluencies as I was. There were a few brothers that I got into many a debate with, and there was even an ex-NASA rocket scientist turned Priest who had some pretty cool ideas about religious theory.
At least in my experience, religion classes (for the most part) didn't try to brainwash me or shove anything down my throat. They presented the Catholic belief about something, then left things up for debate if people so desired.
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". . . Because God made it that way. . ." What a good answer. I mean seriously, or their is the bible said thats what he said. Was the bible written by him? No. It wasn't even recorded until 100 years after Jesus christ. I don't know how it can be possible.
Change my mind so much I can't even trust it
My mind change me so much I can't even trust myself
Also though in my high school we have a bible science class that teaches creation.
I believe in evolution, but not because of science class. Well no, it did help with my choice, but my religion also teaches evolution as well.
Independant, Shinto, Lesbian, and Proud!
In that school, I had straight As in every single class, except for religion, which I maintained with a D, just because I refused to believe in something with no backing.
To me, the choice between creationism and evolution was clear. It bothers me that people can just take someone elses word for fact without even looking into it on their own, expecially on something as important as religion.
Interesting that you would bring this up...Because there is just about as much factual evidence supporting evolution as there is Creationism...sure there are hints and clues everywhere...but is there anything that can make everybody look at it and say "yup that is evolution" or "yup that is God" ? nope there sure isn't. I truly believe that Christianity is no more a religion than Evolution is, because both are based on faith. Say what you want about scientific research, but if you do enough of it yourself, you will quickly come to realize that evolution has gaping holes all around it...You shouldn't just believe in evolution because you are told to do so...nor should you just believe in God because you are told to do so...look for the facts yourself, objective facts, not theory, not "it is thought" crap..but actual KNOWN facts, and you will find that evolution has very few.
Before you go off about carbon dating and that sort of thing, do a little research on Carbon dating, it's not nearly as accurate as it is portrayed.
Your argument is like a two legged dog with an eating disorder...weak and unbalanced.
At my school we are taugh evolution, and sometimes the teacher might say "yes there is evidence that there was an earthquak were moses was leading the jews out of egypt, but who is to say he did not have any help?"
I believe in evolution.
There's also evidence of a global flood, and of the world being only 10 thousand years old(the most accurate dating techniques actually place the oldest rocks at around there)
But they don't talk about that stuff...they say that the flood was local and that the earth is billions of years old..whatever.
Who wants to debate the accuracy of current dating techniques?!?
Your argument is like a two legged dog with an eating disorder...weak and unbalanced.
There's also evidence of a global flood, and of the world being only 10 thousand years old(the most accurate dating techniques actually place the oldest rocks at around there)
But they don't talk about that stuff...they say that the flood was local and that the earth is billions of years old..whatever.
Who wants to debate the accuracy of current dating techniques?!?
Show me those dating techniques, because I think your pulling that out of your ass.
Well...since the most fun thing to talk about that's millions of years old is Dinosaurs...give this a read...read the whole thing if you are going to respond to the article at all please.
http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/carbondating.html
The man that wrote the article is Dr. Kent Hovind...a Christian Scientist who is offering a 250,000 dollar reward for anyone who can come forward with observable evidence of evolution, so far nobody has come forward.
Your argument is like a two legged dog with an eating disorder...weak and unbalanced.
It was completely illogical and biased, also it only attacked very, very rare cases in which the dating came out oddly.
Here is a more accurate site, it also shows the flaws in creationist attacks.
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-age-of-earth.html
That was just on tv! About Darwins finches I mean. ;D
The planet being only 10,000 years old? LOL, thats a load of shit.
Independant, Shinto, Lesbian, and Proud!
You misunderstand what he means by evolution...he means if anyone can come forward with actual proof that an animal has added information to their DNA, as Evolution suggests, that he will give them 250,000 dollars...and nobody can do it, because it has never happened.
It's okay if you think that he's biased, bias doesn't really matter when all he is doing is showing that evolutionary science isn't science at all.
Your argument is like a two legged dog with an eating disorder...weak and unbalanced.
That was just on tv! About Darwins finches I mean. ;D
The planet being only 10,000 years old? LOL, thats a load of shit.
Everything you see on TV is true...same goes for the internet.
Your argument is like a two legged dog with an eating disorder...weak and unbalanced.
That was just on tv! About Darwins finches I mean. ;D
The planet being only 10,000 years old? LOL, thats a load of shit.
Everything you see on TV is true...same goes for the internet.
LOL dude, I was stating that it was on the tv afew hours ago, that's all. I didn't even bother to watch it for more than five minuets before I got bored.
You'd have to be an idiot to believe everything on you see on tv and the internet is true.
Independant, Shinto, Lesbian, and Proud!
Incase your forgot, religeon is mainstream...I read somewhere that 70%
of Americans are Christians.
If there was any halfway decent evidence supporting any story in the
bible, it would be flaunted around profusely and creationism would most
definatly be taught in schools.
EDIT; Oh, and humans and dinosaurs did not
live together, thus making the "God created everything in 6 days" point
invalid, and the "The Earth has only been around for 10,000 years"
invalid as well. Also, the website you showed is bullshit. Sorry to
burst your bubble.
Professional looking website, too. /sigh.
I keep adding to this post.
It is a fact that natural formations, such as the Grand Canyon and many mountain you see, those take millions of years to form. Also, the 10,000 year old theory dosen't support the fossils in the rock layers, and the depth of the sea.