However MMORPG site forums are viewed by consumers looking for new games, and looking to compare games. Some may even be interested in Vanguard and are monitoring the progress to decide whether/when they should purchase. Maybe they are interested in reading Vanguard threads here, so maybe it's okay to post the bitching about the game here. Just a thought mate, there are two sides to every coin. If you only want to read the positive Vanguard post, then skip the negative criticism posts.
Personally i enjoy reading the negative comments cuz 2 thirds of them seem to be completely made up or way over exxagerated by some die hard haters. It obvious the game needs some work still but it is not anywhere near as bad as some people complain it is. There have been far worse mmo's released thats been more buggy than vanguard. One of them even went on to have 8 million subscribers.
However MMORPG site forums are viewed by consumers looking for new games, and looking to compare games. Some may even be interested in Vanguard and are monitoring the progress to decide whether/when they should purchase. Maybe they are interested in reading Vanguard threads here, so maybe it's okay to post the bitching about the game here. Just a thought mate, there are two sides to every coin. If you only want to read the positive Vanguard post, then skip the negative criticism posts.
Personally i enjoy reading the negative comments cuz 2 thirds of them seem to be completely made up or way over exxagerated by some die hard haters. It obvious the game needs some work still but it is not anywhere near as bad as some people complain it is. There have been far worse mmo's released thats been more buggy than vanguard. One of them even went on to have 8 million subscribers.
Here's the funny thing though. Up until last night, everything was good, and I was posting positive comments. When they broke the game for me (and it is broken), I posted about that. Now, the minute anything negative about Vanguard is posted, you're swarmed by people saying things like "STFU", called a whiner, told to quit posting, etc., etc. It's BS. I'm lucky right now to be able to log my main into the game, and every time I run over a chunk line, I am kicked back out to character select. Not sometimes. Not often. EVERY TIME.
I'll agree that just saying something like "I hate this game; it sux." is a waste, but when you've got a legitimate complaint, you have every right to voice it without being told to shut up. Some people can't seem to handle the fact that the game has faults. They want to sweep them under the rug instead of discussing them out in the open. These people are no better than the ones with the "it sux" posts.
However MMORPG site forums are viewed by consumers looking for new games, and looking to compare games. Some may even be interested in Vanguard and are monitoring the progress to decide whether/when they should purchase. Maybe they are interested in reading Vanguard threads here, so maybe it's okay to post the bitching about the game here. Just a thought mate, there are two sides to every coin. If you only want to read the positive Vanguard post, then skip the negative criticism posts.
Personally i enjoy reading the negative comments cuz 2 thirds of them seem to be completely made up or way over exxagerated by some die hard haters. It obvious the game needs some work still but it is not anywhere near as bad as some people complain it is. There have been far worse mmo's released thats been more buggy than vanguard. One of them even went on to have 8 million subscribers.
Same holds true for the fanboys, bro
yes i will give you that one the same does hold true for the fanboys, however the exageration and out right lies are just more common on the haters side. Most of them wouldn't like the game even if it was completely polished and everything was perfect. Alot of the haters are fanbois of other mmo's so they feel the need to bash any new mmo whether it deserves are not. How can you honestly take those opinions as truth? that is why what i normally say to people that ask whether vanguard is worth or not i say wait till a free trial or grab a buddy pass from a friend and try it out themselves before they make an investment into the game. Like it or not most people will have to upgrade to even play the game anyways at a decent fps.
However MMORPG site forums are viewed by consumers looking for new games, and looking to compare games. Some may even be interested in Vanguard and are monitoring the progress to decide whether/when they should purchase. Maybe they are interested in reading Vanguard threads here, so maybe it's okay to post the bitching about the game here. Just a thought mate, there are two sides to every coin. If you only want to read the positive Vanguard post, then skip the negative criticism posts.
Personally i enjoy reading the negative comments cuz 2 thirds of them seem to be completely made up or way over exxagerated by some die hard haters. It obvious the game needs some work still but it is not anywhere near as bad as some people complain it is. There have been far worse mmo's released thats been more buggy than vanguard. One of them even went on to have 8 million subscribers.
I agree personally i havent seen alot of the bugs people talk about i have a smoking computer so i dont lag ever ,the only thing happening to me is all log in and my character is different and i have to log out and retry once or twice to get my main the way i made herl and to me i think thats funny myself , i was having problems talking to people in my group and only in the last few days have i ever crashed Oh and my top of the line rig wont draw some trees like the ones on the bridges outside Autumnglow Outpost ,put its maybe 10 trees in the whole area i can run into them just cant see them lol once again more funny than anything
i think people are just spoiled but by what am not sure. My last game was WOW and i seen more bugs in one day of running thier bg's than i do in vanguard i got disconnected all the time ,fell through the earth lots and lots and got feared through walls and killed by spells and bows through walls ya ive seen it all in WOW i dont know guess am just alot more easy going than most people i see something or run into a bug i report it and laugh and move on to something else
Same as it ever was. EQ, DAoC, SWG, WoW, or any other MMO out there. Any time a class gets a change made to it. If it's positive, everyone else bitches about how that class is now totally overpowered, and the game is broken, and if it's not changed IMMEDIATELY, they will take their $14.99 elsewhere. Yet, they never do, much to the annoyance of myself, and many others. If the change is negative, then it's the usual litany of Devs hate my class, the game is over for me, because now I can't play my class, and so forth. The only thing that changes is the name next to the post on the forum in question. Hell, I'm pretty sure most of the people making those kinds of posts are simply trying to stir shit up.
Like the thread here about how Disciples are totally ruined. I asked one of the Disciples in my guild about it, and they're still chugging away just fine solo. Some people will roll with the punches, and continue to do as they have been, and some people hit the forums in a fit of histrionics. Which is not to say that devs don't drop the ball on occasion, but 9 times out of 10, it's just chicken little alarmist BS.
For all the people bitching that X didn't receive an instantaneous patch the minute you issued a bug report on it. Did you include the fix for said bug with your bug report? Because you know, programming one of these silly little games is so easy that any idiot off the street could do it. In their sleep even. Or maybe keeping track of a few million lines of code, and the interactions between hundreds of multiple systems, and databases is a little more complicated than you armchair developers think it is, and an instantaneous solution doesn't allows present itself. But of course, you're an interweb superprogrammer, and the code would have been without flaw under your expert direction, which is why you've got so many successfull game titles under your belt.
Or you could just keep screaming that the sky is on fire, over here, where no one is listening. It'll lend credence to your post about how the devs don't listen later on.
Maybe its a good thing they get nerfs over with now, Instead of waiting untill you all had level 50s and were used to them... I am not saying they were right or wrong for the nerfs in general, Since I don't play, But, Like I said... would you have rathered them wait untill you were very used to your chars... *Like in a months time instead of a week after release*...
I'v heard all about the bugs needing fixed, and I agree they need to hop to it before I start playing :P ... But better nerf now then 2 months(or more) down the road.
~Redslayer-Saga of Ryzom~ Active again! ~Kinch/Lotu-WoW~ Retired True RedSlayer - Eve ~ Current Primary game
However MMORPG site forums are viewed by consumers looking for new games, and looking to compare games. Some may even be interested in Vanguard and are monitoring the progress to decide whether/when they should purchase. Maybe they are interested in reading Vanguard threads here, so maybe it's okay to post the bitching about the game here. Just a thought mate, there are two sides to every coin. If you only want to read the positive Vanguard post, then skip the negative criticism posts.
Personally i enjoy reading the negative comments cuz 2 thirds of them seem to be completely made up or way over exxagerated by some die hard haters. It obvious the game needs some work still but it is not anywhere near as bad as some people complain it is. There have been far worse mmo's released thats been more buggy than vanguard. One of them even went on to have 8 million subscribers.
Here's the funny thing though. Up until last night, everything was good, and I was posting positive comments. When they broke the game for me (and it is broken), I posted about that. Now, the minute anything negative about Vanguard is posted, you're swarmed by people saying things like "STFU", called a whiner, told to quit posting, etc., etc. It's BS. I'm lucky right now to be able to log my main into the game, and every time I run over a chunk line, I am kicked back out to character select. Not sometimes. Not often. EVERY TIME.
I'll agree that just saying something like "I hate this game; it sux." is a waste, but when you've got a legitimate complaint, you have every right to voice it without being told to shut up. Some people can't seem to handle the fact that the game has faults. They want to sweep them under the rug instead of discussing them out in the open. These people are no better than the ones with the "it sux" posts.
My how quickly the Vanguard community turns on each other....It's just like that scene in "Pitch Black" where the aliens start killing and eating each other.
Never be afraid of choices. More choices are always good things.
What good does bitching on these forums do? Nothing. You just spam up this forum with yet another generic complaint. Just post on another thread. Don't start a new one. There are plenty! Thanks.
Hopefully Sigil actually visits the forums of the fan sites. I hope they are very aware of the number of complaint posts on these sites. By not having their own forums, they're not getting direct customer feedback. That leads to them doing stupid things that the players don't like or want.
The thread titles in the "bitching" posts are usually pretty self explanatory. If you don't want to read them, don't click them. It's really not complicated.
But the complainers are not even going to affiliated sites to complain. . .perhaps because they are too scared?
Hm got 2 comps exactly the same hardware only difference is my son plays steam sometimes and the one he plays on went to black screen when he hit play after the last update. Instead of bitching and moaning and whinning lying on the floor throwing a tantrum we went through and an hour later he was on a running the same he always did. Point is for you slower people out there if there is a problem dont always assume that the problem is SOEs. Lotta people out there think they are Bill Gates and really dont have a clue. Check your comp out and try different settings before you go off. Im playing the game great on both my comps. So gotta be an issue with some comps not all.
Same as it ever was. EQ, DAoC, SWG, WoW, or any other MMO out there. Any time a class gets a change made to it. If it's positive, everyone else bitches about how that class is now totally overpowered, and the game is broken, and if it's not changed IMMEDIATELY, they will take their $14.99 elsewhere. Yet, they never do, much to the annoyance of myself, and many others. If the change is negative, then it's the usual litany of Devs hate my class, the game is over for me, because now I can't play my class, and so forth. The only thing that changes is the name next to the post on the forum in question. Hell, I'm pretty sure most of the people making those kinds of posts are simply trying to stir shit up. Like the thread here about how Disciples are totally ruined. I asked one of the Disciples in my guild about it, and they're still chugging away just fine solo. Some people will roll with the punches, and continue to do as they have been, and some people hit the forums in a fit of histrionics. Which is not to say that devs don't drop the ball on occasion, but 9 times out of 10, it's just chicken little alarmist BS. For all the people bitching that X didn't receive an instantaneous patch the minute you issued a bug report on it. Did you include the fix for said bug with your bug report? Because you know, programming one of these silly little games is so easy that any idiot off the street could do it. In their sleep even. Or maybe keeping track of a few million lines of code, and the interactions between hundreds of multiple systems, and databases is a little more complicated than you armchair developers think it is, and an instantaneous solution doesn't allows present itself. But of course, you're an interweb superprogrammer, and the code would have been without flaw under your expert direction, which is why you've got so many successfull game titles under your belt. Or you could just keep screaming that the sky is on fire, over here, where no one is listening. It'll lend credence to your post about how the devs don't listen later on.
/clap
My feelings exactly.
Now, granted, I don't like the fact that they have taken the servers down two days in a row during prime time to do things. However, maybe it was necessary for some reason we (the players) don't know about. Oh...wait... I should say me, cause apperently alot of you have way more inside knowledge then I do...
Anyway, I play a Dread Knight and personally thought the changes they made last night were good. I can actually tank now and take damage more effectively. Unlike before where a Sorc guild mate of mine could pretty much tank as well as I could. I'm guessing all the people complaining that their class is broke are the ones that were doing way too much damage in the begining. Now they actually have to LEARN how to play their class without just mashing buttons on spells. Talking with my guild none of them experienced the "game breaking" nerf to the classes. In fact, for the most part, it seemed more balanced. As to the character changing... I didn't experience this. But guild mates of mine did. OK, your character doesnt look like what you made. Frustrating I get, but hardly game breaking. If you saved your template for the character, no big deal, when they fix the bug causing it just reload the template and off you go. If you didn't save it, well, you have to spend a couple minutes before logging in to fix your face. Again, not game breaking, just more frustrating. And neither I or my girl have experienced the crash to the character screen when crossing chunks. Maybe its a localized thing or maybe just a certain server is having trouble, who knows, but at the rate the devs have been fixing things in the past you really think this is going to go on long? And by fixing things I mean big things, not little things like characters being shorter and fatter, but things like crashes, exp loss, game stopping issues.
And as far as for how bad this game supposedly runs. I do not have a top end computer I would say it's a high middle. I run on balanced settings and have an Nvidia video card (which from what I have heard and can tell have issues more then ATI) the only time I lag at all really or have graphical issues, if you will, is when I'm crossing chunks (delay of play more then anything) and it slows down some when I get into a populated area. My Fiance plays on a system that is barely above the minimum requirements and she doesnt have any trouble aside from the same things I experience. With some adjustment to the in game settings, everything runs fine.
Flame me all you want, call me a fanboy. IDC. I will tell you this I enjoy the game, it's more fun with all the bugs then all the time I spent in WoW. To me that is what matters, fun. Continue to complain, continue to bitch. In reality you sitting on THESE forums and doing so does nothing for the game. Your excuse of "looking out" for people who might be thinking of trying this, call it what it is, you dont like it so you dont think other people should like it and your opinion is the one all of us should listen to. NOW, before everyone freaks out, let me say that I am only refering to select people that post on this board consistantly with how bad Vanguard is. Informative posts, saying "hey, this is broke or did this happen to you?" these I'm good with. It's the ones that start out "This game is the biggest piece of junk ever, it will never have subs and needs to just die now..." that I am refering to.
As someone who is shopping for a new MMO, I find these threads the most informative. Sure, I read plenty of "The game sucks" threads, and plenty of "Vanguard is teh uber!" threads, but I usually ignore them. But here, we see so much about the game.
1. There are serious problems with the game. Obviously, we all know that the game was released too soon. Potential players like me need to know that. Many of us don't like to pay money to do beta testing. So, if the OP is lying about a problem, tell us. If it's a legitimate issue with the game, don't tell them not to post, as you are only reaffirming your vanboi status.
2. The community is confused about where to go for information and feedback, and is dispersed across affiliates and fansites. Not having an official forum (Station.com does NOT count) is an incredible mistake on Sigil's part.
3. The community is full of jackasses. Seriously, any time you use STFU, you've automatically become a jackass. I see in this thread, that a lot of Vanguard players in in such denial about the current state of the game, they don't want to hear anything negative about it. It's alright to have 6 threads about "Vanguard is awesome, great game!" on the front page, but all negative posts must be relegated to a single thread? That's what you implied, when you said that the OP should have posted in an existing thread. This is a public forum, don't tell people how to use them.
4. Sigil nerfs. There's something I hate to see. During Beta, it's alright for classes to be both nerfed and improved. But after release, nerfing is one of the biggest mistakes a game company can make. It's better to strengthen the weakest classes, not weaken the strongest ones.
I thank all of you, even the vanbois. You've helped me in deciding that this is not the game for me. I was hoping to join after a couple months, after the bugs were exterminated. But, seeing that Sigil makes inexcusable mistakes, and seeing that the Vanguard community is so immature, I'll take my business elsewhere.
I do hope the Vanguard fanbois realize that they only are hurting the game they love. Everytime they snarl at a newb, tell someone to "STFU" or "Go back to WoW," all they are doing is driving away potential customers. Nobody wants to play with assholes.
Seriously. It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
As someone who is shopping for a new MMO, I find these threads the most informative. Sure, I read plenty of "The game sucks" threads, and plenty of "Vanguard is teh uber!" threads, but I usually ignore them. But here, we see so much about the game. 1. There are serious problems with the game. Obviously, we all know that the game was released too soon. Potential players like me need to know that. Many of us don't like to pay money to do beta testing. So, if the OP is lying about a problem, tell us. If it's a legitimate issue with the game, don't tell them not to post, as you are only reaffirming your vanboi status. 2. The community is confused about where to go for information and feedback, and is dispersed across affiliates and fansites. Not having an official forum (Station.com does NOT count) is an incredible mistake on Sigil's part. 3. The community is full of jackasses. Seriously, any time you use STFU, you've automatically become a jackass. I see in this thread, that a lot of Vanguard players in in such denial about the current state of the game, they don't want to hear anything negative about it. It's alright to have 6 threads about "Vanguard is awesome, great game!" on the front page, but all negative posts must be relegated to a single thread? That's what you implied, when you said that the OP should have posted in an existing thread. This is a public forum, don't tell people how to use them. 4. Sigil nerfs. There's something I hate to see. During Beta, it's alright for classes to be both nerfed and improved. But after release, nerfing is one of the biggest mistakes a game company can make. It's better to strengthen the weakest classes, not weaken the strongest ones. I thank all of you, even the vanbois. You've helped me in deciding that this is not the game for me. I was hoping to join after a couple months, after the bugs were exterminated. But, seeing that Sigil makes inexcusable mistakes, and seeing that the Vanguard community is so immature, I'll take my business elsewhere. I do hope the Vanguard fanbois realize that they only are hurting the game they love. Everytime they snarl at a newb, tell someone to "STFU" or "Go back to WoW," all they are doing is driving away potential customers. Nobody wants to play with assholes.
Yeah, I'm pretty much getting the same vibe from the boards as you. I went from "oh, this looks kinda interesting" to " Ohhhh, maybe not" just on a general tone of the postings here. I'll check out a trial whenever it shows up. I'll try damn near any game once. But there's just NO appeal to me right now to take the risk of droppin the 50 bucks based on the "positive" posts I've read about it. Well, let's see what happens... <--- what is this emote supposed to be!?
You're right, you know. When they overpower a class, the other classes complain. When they nerf a class, then that class complains. It has been the same for 10 years of the MMO genre.
You would think by this point they would have learned to keep the tweakings and tonings down of class abilities to a minimum instead of stealth nerfs that completely change a class's capabilities since nothing but animosity ever results from such actions from either side. I wouldn't be taking it so hard myself if the game was a finished, polished, working, ready for release game, but it isn't. We're paying to play a beta, and I'm just dealing with that, but when I'm paying to play a beta, sending 10-20 /bug reports per session and then my class gets the floor pulled out from under them and my effectiveness reduced to a FRACTION of what it was, I will get irritated, and I will warn potential purchasers of the game to wait until Sigil figures out what its 'vision' is before making the investment in VG.
Gaming? That's not gaming! That's just people sat 'round in costumes drinking...
When they overpower a class, the other classes complain.
When they nerf a class, then that class complains.
It has been the same for 10 years of the MMO genre. You would think by this point they would have learned to keep the tweakings and tonings down of class abilities to a minimum instead of stealth nerfs that completely change a class's capabilities since nothing but animosity ever results from such actions from either side. I wouldn't be taking it so hard myself if the game was a finished, polished, working, ready for release game, but it isn't. We're paying to play a beta, and I'm just dealing with that, but when I'm paying to play a beta, sending 10-20 /bug reports per session and then my class gets the floor pulled out from under them and my effectiveness reduced to a FRACTION of what it was, I will get irritated, and I will warn potential purchasers of the game to wait until Sigil figures out what its 'vision' is before making the investment in VG.
Now, I know that this will get me flamed, but if you want to look at class changes done right, look no further than Blizzard. For WoW, they announce a couple months in advance that they are going to adjust a particular class in the next patch. Then, about a month before the patch, they release the changes and allow players to play with a "talent calculator." Plus, they have a beta server to test them on. Finally, when they do release the changes, they usually tweak or improve the class, never really nerfing.
All MMOs need to constantly alter their classes, balancing them as the players find inconsistancies. I believe MMO developers should take a page from how Blizzard handles this aspect of the genre.
Seriously. It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
Here's the funny thing though. Up until last night, everything was good, and I was posting positive comments. When they broke the game for me (and it is broken), I posted about that. Now, the minute anything negative about Vanguard is posted, you're swarmed by people saying things like "STFU", called a whiner, told to quit posting, etc., etc. It's BS. I'm lucky right now to be able to log my main into the game, and every time I run over a chunk line, I am kicked back out to character select. Not sometimes. Not often. EVERY TIME.
I'll agree that just saying something like "I hate this game; it sux." is a waste, but when you've got a legitimate complaint, you have every right to voice it without being told to shut up. Some people can't seem to handle the fact that the game has faults. They want to sweep them under the rug instead of discussing them out in the open. These people are no better than the ones with the "it sux" posts.
Welcome to the "Haters" world.
It's been stated for MONTHS that Vanboi's can't accept any criticism or any kind. Now that you're on the other side of the fence, you'll be flamed as well. You're either with them, or against them; they can't accept that people are in the middle ground.
I am a firm believer that the community has done far more damage for this game's future than Sigil could ever do with bugs, nerfs, patches, etc etc. The word of mouth is out; people know what sort of people are playing this game, and they don't like it. Word of mouth is more powerful advertising than any ad-campaign or PR Statement, period.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
Originally posted by Areel Originally posted by nynniva You're right, you know. When they overpower a class, the other classes complain. When they nerf a class, then that class complains. It has been the same for 10 years of the MMO genre. You would think by this point they would have learned to keep the tweakings and tonings down of class abilities to a minimum instead of stealth nerfs that completely change a class's capabilities since nothing but animosity ever results from such actions from either side. I wouldn't be taking it so hard myself if the game was a finished, polished, working, ready for release game, but it isn't. We're paying to play a beta, and I'm just dealing with that, but when I'm paying to play a beta, sending 10-20 /bug reports per session and then my class gets the floor pulled out from under them and my effectiveness reduced to a FRACTION of what it was, I will get irritated, and I will warn potential purchasers of the game to wait until Sigil figures out what its 'vision' is before making the investment in VG.
Now, I know that this will get me flamed, but if you want to look at class changes done right, look no further than Blizzard. For WoW, they announce a couple months in advance that they are going to adjust a particular class in the next patch. Then, about a month before the patch, they release the changes and allow players to play with a "talent calculator." Plus, they have a beta server to test them on. Finally, when they do release the changes, they usually tweak or improve the class, never really nerfing. All MMOs need to constantly alter their classes, balancing them as the players find inconsistancies. I believe MMO developers should take a page from how Blizzard handles this aspect of the genre.
As much as we hate to admit it, this is true, and a good way to handle class changes.
Sigil's method is to stealth-nerf a class during a prime time emergency fix and offer no stat reset whatsoever or even acknowledgement of how badly they nerfed the class.
I am not endorsing WoW, but you have to admit that even they handled this better.
Gaming? That's not gaming! That's just people sat 'round in costumes drinking...
Let me tell you this. I have been in this game since beta and its not bugs which is doing harm to the game but VANBOYS. I wonder how many left Vanguard in frustration after comign across the Vanoys who would just attack any kind of criticism. They didn't let you post when it was in beta and they still won't let you post even after the final release. And no it's not only limited to MMORPG. Try any fansite and you will see the same atmosphere.
In my opinion Vanguard attracts the most ignorant, rude and losers you can imagine. You want to enjoy the game? ignore 90% of the community. Have fun and don't let haters bring you down.
When they overpower a class, the other classes complain.
When they nerf a class, then that class complains.
It has been the same for 10 years of the MMO genre. You would think by this point they would have learned to keep the tweakings and tonings down of class abilities to a minimum instead of stealth nerfs that completely change a class's capabilities since nothing but animosity ever results from such actions from either side. I wouldn't be taking it so hard myself if the game was a finished, polished, working, ready for release game, but it isn't. We're paying to play a beta, and I'm just dealing with that, but when I'm paying to play a beta, sending 10-20 /bug reports per session and then my class gets the floor pulled out from under them and my effectiveness reduced to a FRACTION of what it was, I will get irritated, and I will warn potential purchasers of the game to wait until Sigil figures out what its 'vision' is before making the investment in VG.
Now, I know that this will get me flamed, but if you want to look at class changes done right, look no further than Blizzard. For WoW, they announce a couple months in advance that they are going to adjust a particular class in the next patch. Then, about a month before the patch, they release the changes and allow players to play with a "talent calculator." Plus, they have a beta server to test them on. Finally, when they do release the changes, they usually tweak or improve the class, never really nerfing.
All MMOs need to constantly alter their classes, balancing them as the players find inconsistancies. I believe MMO developers should take a page from how Blizzard handles this aspect of the genre.
And thats the reason that they have over 8 million players, and soon To get to 10.
Here's the funny thing though. Up until last night, everything was good, and I was posting positive comments. When they broke the game for me (and it is broken), I posted about that. Now, the minute anything negative about Vanguard is posted, you're swarmed by people saying things like "STFU", called a whiner, told to quit posting, etc., etc. It's BS. I'm lucky right now to be able to log my main into the game, and every time I run over a chunk line, I am kicked back out to character select. Not sometimes. Not often. EVERY TIME.
I'll agree that just saying something like "I hate this game; it sux." is a waste, but when you've got a legitimate complaint, you have every right to voice it without being told to shut up. Some people can't seem to handle the fact that the game has faults. They want to sweep them under the rug instead of discussing them out in the open. These people are no better than the ones with the "it sux" posts.
Welcome to the "Haters" world.
It's been stated for MONTHS that Vanboi's can't accept any criticism or any kind. Now that you're on the other side of the fence, you'll be flamed as well. You're either with them, or against them; they can't accept that people are in the middle ground.
I am a firm believer that the community has done far more damage for this game's future than Sigil could ever do with bugs, nerfs, patches, etc etc. The word of mouth is out; people know what sort of people are playing this game, and they don't like it. Word of mouth is more powerful advertising than any ad-campaign or PR Statement, period. Vanbois were as rabid in all of the betas aswell, ingame, and on the forums. They literally destroyed the community before it began to blossom. Yes, the Vanboi intolerance follows suite ingame. I have never been told numerous times to STFU, go play WoW, we hate you too, loser, like I have been in VG. That, and the lack luster performance are the reasons I have yet to buy this game. Little do they comprehend the more they scream STFU, the more they are hurting the game in the long run. They have turned this once fence sitter into an avid, vocal "hater".
On a bright note, Cymdai has given me hope that not all of the MMO press has been sold down the river. Atleast he has the balls to voice his opinion even if it isn't rosey.
Let me tell you this. I have been in this game since beta and its not bugs which is doing harm to the game but VANBOYS. I wonder how many left Vanguard in frustration after comign across the Vanoys who would just attack any kind of criticism. They didn't let you post when it was in beta and they still won't let you post even after the final release. And no it's not only limited to MMORPG. Try any fansite and you will see the same atmosphere.
In my opinion Vanguard attracts the most ignorant, rude and losers you can imagine. You want to enjoy the game? ignore 90% of the community. Have fun and don't let haters bring you down.
Yikes. Probably taking on more than I can handle in this thread, but oh well. We'll see if it's just talk, or if it goes both ways.
I'm particularly interested in the comment "They didn't let you post.." "...and they still won't let you post.." Hmm... I don't recall this event. Exactly how did that work? I seem to remember and still see plenty of comments from both sides of the fence. So, exactly when did this "didn't" and "won't" happen?
Heh, yeah I've seen plenty of posts with the "Go back to WoW" brilliant response. But, then are you telling me you haven't seen an equal amount of the "Vanguard SUX" responses as well? If not, you may want to refresh your screen more often because those are there in plenty as well.
Considering that this a forum dedicated for Vanguard, exactly where would you have those that are adamant about Vanguard post? Oh sure, we can agree that they aren't exactly rhodes scholar prospects, but they are at least in the correct forum. Can the same be said of those that come up with such superb comments like "VANGUARD SUX!" or "I HOPE THIS GAME DIES!" ? Really?
Comments
Personally i enjoy reading the negative comments cuz 2 thirds of them seem to be completely made up or way over exxagerated by some die hard haters. It obvious the game needs some work still but it is not anywhere near as bad as some people complain it is. There have been far worse mmo's released thats been more buggy than vanguard. One of them even went on to have 8 million subscribers.
Same holds true for the fanboys, bro
Personally i enjoy reading the negative comments cuz 2 thirds of them seem to be completely made up or way over exxagerated by some die hard haters. It obvious the game needs some work still but it is not anywhere near as bad as some people complain it is. There have been far worse mmo's released thats been more buggy than vanguard. One of them even went on to have 8 million subscribers.
Here's the funny thing though. Up until last night, everything was good, and I was posting positive comments. When they broke the game for me (and it is broken), I posted about that. Now, the minute anything negative about Vanguard is posted, you're swarmed by people saying things like "STFU", called a whiner, told to quit posting, etc., etc. It's BS. I'm lucky right now to be able to log my main into the game, and every time I run over a chunk line, I am kicked back out to character select. Not sometimes. Not often. EVERY TIME.
I'll agree that just saying something like "I hate this game; it sux." is a waste, but when you've got a legitimate complaint, you have every right to voice it without being told to shut up. Some people can't seem to handle the fact that the game has faults. They want to sweep them under the rug instead of discussing them out in the open. These people are no better than the ones with the "it sux" posts.
Personally i enjoy reading the negative comments cuz 2 thirds of them seem to be completely made up or way over exxagerated by some die hard haters. It obvious the game needs some work still but it is not anywhere near as bad as some people complain it is. There have been far worse mmo's released thats been more buggy than vanguard. One of them even went on to have 8 million subscribers.
Same holds true for the fanboys, bro
yes i will give you that one the same does hold true for the fanboys, however the exageration and out right lies are just more common on the haters side. Most of them wouldn't like the game even if it was completely polished and everything was perfect. Alot of the haters are fanbois of other mmo's so they feel the need to bash any new mmo whether it deserves are not. How can you honestly take those opinions as truth? that is why what i normally say to people that ask whether vanguard is worth or not i say wait till a free trial or grab a buddy pass from a friend and try it out themselves before they make an investment into the game. Like it or not most people will have to upgrade to even play the game anyways at a decent fps.
Personally i enjoy reading the negative comments cuz 2 thirds of them seem to be completely made up or way over exxagerated by some die hard haters. It obvious the game needs some work still but it is not anywhere near as bad as some people complain it is. There have been far worse mmo's released thats been more buggy than vanguard. One of them even went on to have 8 million subscribers.
I agree personally i havent seen alot of the bugs people talk about i have a smoking computer so i dont lag ever ,the only thing happening to me is all log in and my character is different and i have to log out and retry once or twice to get my main the way i made herl and to me i think thats funny myself , i was having problems talking to people in my group and only in the last few days have i ever crashed Oh and my top of the line rig wont draw some trees like the ones on the bridges outside Autumnglow Outpost ,put its maybe 10 trees in the whole area i can run into them just cant see them lol once again more funny than anything
i think people are just spoiled but by what am not sure. My last game was WOW and i seen more bugs in one day of running thier bg's than i do in vanguard i got disconnected all the time ,fell through the earth lots and lots and got feared through walls and killed by spells and bows through walls ya ive seen it all in WOW i dont know guess am just alot more easy going than most people i see something or run into a bug i report it and laugh and move on to something else
Same as it ever was. EQ, DAoC, SWG, WoW, or any other MMO out there. Any time a class gets a change made to it. If it's positive, everyone else bitches about how that class is now totally overpowered, and the game is broken, and if it's not changed IMMEDIATELY, they will take their $14.99 elsewhere. Yet, they never do, much to the annoyance of myself, and many others. If the change is negative, then it's the usual litany of Devs hate my class, the game is over for me, because now I can't play my class, and so forth. The only thing that changes is the name next to the post on the forum in question. Hell, I'm pretty sure most of the people making those kinds of posts are simply trying to stir shit up.
Like the thread here about how Disciples are totally ruined. I asked one of the Disciples in my guild about it, and they're still chugging away just fine solo. Some people will roll with the punches, and continue to do as they have been, and some people hit the forums in a fit of histrionics. Which is not to say that devs don't drop the ball on occasion, but 9 times out of 10, it's just chicken little alarmist BS.
For all the people bitching that X didn't receive an instantaneous patch the minute you issued a bug report on it. Did you include the fix for said bug with your bug report? Because you know, programming one of these silly little games is so easy that any idiot off the street could do it. In their sleep even. Or maybe keeping track of a few million lines of code, and the interactions between hundreds of multiple systems, and databases is a little more complicated than you armchair developers think it is, and an instantaneous solution doesn't allows present itself. But of course, you're an interweb superprogrammer, and the code would have been without flaw under your expert direction, which is why you've got so many successfull game titles under your belt.
Or you could just keep screaming that the sky is on fire, over here, where no one is listening. It'll lend credence to your post about how the devs don't listen later on.
*Only read the first two pages*
Maybe its a good thing they get nerfs over with now, Instead of waiting untill you all had level 50s and were used to them... I am not saying they were right or wrong for the nerfs in general, Since I don't play, But, Like I said... would you have rathered them wait untill you were very used to your chars... *Like in a months time instead of a week after release*...
I'v heard all about the bugs needing fixed, and I agree they need to hop to it before I start playing :P ... But better nerf now then 2 months(or more) down the road.
~Redslayer-Saga of Ryzom~ Active again!
~Kinch/Lotu-WoW~ Retired
True RedSlayer - Eve ~ Current Primary game
Personally i enjoy reading the negative comments cuz 2 thirds of them seem to be completely made up or way over exxagerated by some die hard haters. It obvious the game needs some work still but it is not anywhere near as bad as some people complain it is. There have been far worse mmo's released thats been more buggy than vanguard. One of them even went on to have 8 million subscribers.
Here's the funny thing though. Up until last night, everything was good, and I was posting positive comments. When they broke the game for me (and it is broken), I posted about that. Now, the minute anything negative about Vanguard is posted, you're swarmed by people saying things like "STFU", called a whiner, told to quit posting, etc., etc. It's BS. I'm lucky right now to be able to log my main into the game, and every time I run over a chunk line, I am kicked back out to character select. Not sometimes. Not often. EVERY TIME.
I'll agree that just saying something like "I hate this game; it sux." is a waste, but when you've got a legitimate complaint, you have every right to voice it without being told to shut up. Some people can't seem to handle the fact that the game has faults. They want to sweep them under the rug instead of discussing them out in the open. These people are no better than the ones with the "it sux" posts.
My how quickly the Vanguard community turns on each other....It's just like that scene in "Pitch Black" where the aliens start killing and eating each other.
Never be afraid of choices. More choices are always good things.
Hopefully Sigil actually visits the forums of the fan sites. I hope they are very aware of the number of complaint posts on these sites. By not having their own forums, they're not getting direct customer feedback. That leads to them doing stupid things that the players don't like or want.
The thread titles in the "bitching" posts are usually pretty self explanatory. If you don't want to read them, don't click them. It's really not complicated.
But the complainers are not even going to affiliated sites to complain. . .perhaps because they are too scared?
http://mentaltruancy.guildportal.com - Friendly Vanguard:Saga of Heroes Qalia based Guild.
/clap
My feelings exactly.
Now, granted, I don't like the fact that they have taken the servers down two days in a row during prime time to do things. However, maybe it was necessary for some reason we (the players) don't know about. Oh...wait... I should say me, cause apperently alot of you have way more inside knowledge then I do...
Anyway, I play a Dread Knight and personally thought the changes they made last night were good. I can actually tank now and take damage more effectively. Unlike before where a Sorc guild mate of mine could pretty much tank as well as I could. I'm guessing all the people complaining that their class is broke are the ones that were doing way too much damage in the begining. Now they actually have to LEARN how to play their class without just mashing buttons on spells. Talking with my guild none of them experienced the "game breaking" nerf to the classes. In fact, for the most part, it seemed more balanced. As to the character changing... I didn't experience this. But guild mates of mine did. OK, your character doesnt look like what you made. Frustrating I get, but hardly game breaking. If you saved your template for the character, no big deal, when they fix the bug causing it just reload the template and off you go. If you didn't save it, well, you have to spend a couple minutes before logging in to fix your face. Again, not game breaking, just more frustrating. And neither I or my girl have experienced the crash to the character screen when crossing chunks. Maybe its a localized thing or maybe just a certain server is having trouble, who knows, but at the rate the devs have been fixing things in the past you really think this is going to go on long? And by fixing things I mean big things, not little things like characters being shorter and fatter, but things like crashes, exp loss, game stopping issues.
And as far as for how bad this game supposedly runs. I do not have a top end computer I would say it's a high middle. I run on balanced settings and have an Nvidia video card (which from what I have heard and can tell have issues more then ATI) the only time I lag at all really or have graphical issues, if you will, is when I'm crossing chunks (delay of play more then anything) and it slows down some when I get into a populated area. My Fiance plays on a system that is barely above the minimum requirements and she doesnt have any trouble aside from the same things I experience. With some adjustment to the in game settings, everything runs fine.
Flame me all you want, call me a fanboy. IDC. I will tell you this I enjoy the game, it's more fun with all the bugs then all the time I spent in WoW. To me that is what matters, fun. Continue to complain, continue to bitch. In reality you sitting on THESE forums and doing so does nothing for the game. Your excuse of "looking out" for people who might be thinking of trying this, call it what it is, you dont like it so you dont think other people should like it and your opinion is the one all of us should listen to. NOW, before everyone freaks out, let me say that I am only refering to select people that post on this board consistantly with how bad Vanguard is. Informative posts, saying "hey, this is broke or did this happen to you?" these I'm good with. It's the ones that start out "This game is the biggest piece of junk ever, it will never have subs and needs to just die now..." that I am refering to.
Thalos Vipav
Star Wars Galaxies: R.I.P.
As someone who is shopping for a new MMO, I find these threads the most informative. Sure, I read plenty of "The game sucks" threads, and plenty of "Vanguard is teh uber!" threads, but I usually ignore them. But here, we see so much about the game.
1. There are serious problems with the game. Obviously, we all know that the game was released too soon. Potential players like me need to know that. Many of us don't like to pay money to do beta testing. So, if the OP is lying about a problem, tell us. If it's a legitimate issue with the game, don't tell them not to post, as you are only reaffirming your vanboi status.
2. The community is confused about where to go for information and feedback, and is dispersed across affiliates and fansites. Not having an official forum (Station.com does NOT count) is an incredible mistake on Sigil's part.
3. The community is full of jackasses. Seriously, any time you use STFU, you've automatically become a jackass. I see in this thread, that a lot of Vanguard players in in such denial about the current state of the game, they don't want to hear anything negative about it. It's alright to have 6 threads about "Vanguard is awesome, great game!" on the front page, but all negative posts must be relegated to a single thread? That's what you implied, when you said that the OP should have posted in an existing thread. This is a public forum, don't tell people how to use them.
4. Sigil nerfs. There's something I hate to see. During Beta, it's alright for classes to be both nerfed and improved. But after release, nerfing is one of the biggest mistakes a game company can make. It's better to strengthen the weakest classes, not weaken the strongest ones.
I thank all of you, even the vanbois. You've helped me in deciding that this is not the game for me. I was hoping to join after a couple months, after the bugs were exterminated. But, seeing that Sigil makes inexcusable mistakes, and seeing that the Vanguard community is so immature, I'll take my business elsewhere.
I do hope the Vanguard fanbois realize that they only are hurting the game they love. Everytime they snarl at a newb, tell someone to "STFU" or "Go back to WoW," all they are doing is driving away potential customers. Nobody wants to play with assholes.
Seriously.
It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
You're right, you know.
When they overpower a class, the other classes complain.
When they nerf a class, then that class complains.
It has been the same for 10 years of the MMO genre.
You would think by this point they would have learned to keep the tweakings and tonings down of class abilities to a minimum instead of stealth nerfs that completely change a class's capabilities since nothing but animosity ever results from such actions from either side. I wouldn't be taking it so hard myself if the game was a finished, polished, working, ready for release game, but it isn't. We're paying to play a beta, and I'm just dealing with that, but when I'm paying to play a beta, sending 10-20 /bug reports per session and then my class gets the floor pulled out from under them and my effectiveness reduced to a FRACTION of what it was, I will get irritated, and I will warn potential purchasers of the game to wait until Sigil figures out what its 'vision' is before making the investment in VG.
Gaming? That's not gaming!
That's just people sat 'round in costumes drinking...
Now, I know that this will get me flamed, but if you want to look at class changes done right, look no further than Blizzard. For WoW, they announce a couple months in advance that they are going to adjust a particular class in the next patch. Then, about a month before the patch, they release the changes and allow players to play with a "talent calculator." Plus, they have a beta server to test them on. Finally, when they do release the changes, they usually tweak or improve the class, never really nerfing.
All MMOs need to constantly alter their classes, balancing them as the players find inconsistancies. I believe MMO developers should take a page from how Blizzard handles this aspect of the genre.
Seriously.
It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
I'll agree that just saying something like "I hate this game; it sux." is a waste, but when you've got a legitimate complaint, you have every right to voice it without being told to shut up. Some people can't seem to handle the fact that the game has faults. They want to sweep them under the rug instead of discussing them out in the open. These people are no better than the ones with the "it sux" posts.
Welcome to the "Haters" world.
It's been stated for MONTHS that Vanboi's can't accept any criticism or any kind. Now that you're on the other side of the fence, you'll be flamed as well. You're either with them, or against them; they can't accept that people are in the middle ground.
I am a firm believer that the community has done far more damage for this game's future than Sigil could ever do with bugs, nerfs, patches, etc etc. The word of mouth is out; people know what sort of people are playing this game, and they don't like it. Word of mouth is more powerful advertising than any ad-campaign or PR Statement, period.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
It is Vanbois that kept me away from this game.. not the haters...
Honestly.. Barrens chat in WoW is more civil and mature then most of the posts made by people who "love" this game..
Maybe ST:Online will have a decent fanbase.. (shrugs) cause I really needs me a new game.. and sadly Vanguard will not be it.. due to the "community"
Vanbois will eventually make the best haters
it just takes a little longer to crush the dream.
Now, I know that this will get me flamed, but if you want to look at class changes done right, look no further than Blizzard. For WoW, they announce a couple months in advance that they are going to adjust a particular class in the next patch. Then, about a month before the patch, they release the changes and allow players to play with a "talent calculator." Plus, they have a beta server to test them on. Finally, when they do release the changes, they usually tweak or improve the class, never really nerfing.
All MMOs need to constantly alter their classes, balancing them as the players find inconsistancies. I believe MMO developers should take a page from how Blizzard handles this aspect of the genre.
As much as we hate to admit it, this is true, and a good way to handle class changes.
Sigil's method is to stealth-nerf a class during a prime time emergency fix and offer no stat reset whatsoever or even acknowledgement of how badly they nerfed the class.
I am not endorsing WoW, but you have to admit that even they handled this better.
Gaming? That's not gaming!
That's just people sat 'round in costumes drinking...
In my opinion Vanguard attracts the most ignorant, rude and losers you can imagine. You want to enjoy the game? ignore 90% of the community. Have fun and don't let haters bring you down.
Good luck ignoring the community in a game that is pretty much trying to force you to group to finish your newbie quests.
Gaming? That's not gaming!
That's just people sat 'round in costumes drinking...
Heh, Now their tech support forums are down. Nice!
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Nice.
Gaming? That's not gaming!
That's just people sat 'round in costumes drinking...
Now, I know that this will get me flamed, but if you want to look at class changes done right, look no further than Blizzard. For WoW, they announce a couple months in advance that they are going to adjust a particular class in the next patch. Then, about a month before the patch, they release the changes and allow players to play with a "talent calculator." Plus, they have a beta server to test them on. Finally, when they do release the changes, they usually tweak or improve the class, never really nerfing.
All MMOs need to constantly alter their classes, balancing them as the players find inconsistancies. I believe MMO developers should take a page from how Blizzard handles this aspect of the genre.
And thats the reason that they have over 8 million players, and soon To get to 10I'll agree that just saying something like "I hate this game; it sux." is a waste, but when you've got a legitimate complaint, you have every right to voice it without being told to shut up. Some people can't seem to handle the fact that the game has faults. They want to sweep them under the rug instead of discussing them out in the open. These people are no better than the ones with the "it sux" posts.
Welcome to the "Haters" world.
It's been stated for MONTHS that Vanboi's can't accept any criticism or any kind. Now that you're on the other side of the fence, you'll be flamed as well. You're either with them, or against them; they can't accept that people are in the middle ground.
I am a firm believer that the community has done far more damage for this game's future than Sigil could ever do with bugs, nerfs, patches, etc etc. The word of mouth is out; people know what sort of people are playing this game, and they don't like it. Word of mouth is more powerful advertising than any ad-campaign or PR Statement, period. Vanbois were as rabid in all of the betas aswell, ingame, and on the forums. They literally destroyed the community before it began to blossom. Yes, the Vanboi intolerance follows suite ingame. I have never been told numerous times to STFU, go play WoW, we hate you too, loser, like I have been in VG. That, and the lack luster performance are the reasons I have yet to buy this game. Little do they comprehend the more they scream STFU, the more they are hurting the game in the long run. They have turned this once fence sitter into an avid, vocal "hater".
On a bright note, Cymdai has given me hope that not all of the MMO press has been sold down the river. Atleast he has the balls to voice his opinion even if it isn't rosey.
I'm particularly interested in the comment "They didn't let you post.." "...and they still won't let you post.." Hmm... I don't recall this event. Exactly how did that work? I seem to remember and still see plenty of comments from both sides of the fence. So, exactly when did this "didn't" and "won't" happen?
Heh, yeah I've seen plenty of posts with the "Go back to WoW" brilliant response. But, then are you telling me you haven't seen an equal amount of the "Vanguard SUX" responses as well? If not, you may want to refresh your screen more often because those are there in plenty as well.
Considering that this a forum dedicated for Vanguard, exactly where would you have those that are adamant about Vanguard post? Oh sure, we can agree that they aren't exactly rhodes scholar prospects, but they are at least in the correct forum. Can the same be said of those that come up with such superb comments like "VANGUARD SUX!" or "I HOPE THIS GAME DIES!" ? Really?