The really imbalanced advantage of stealth is that you are able to chose your target. If you are not in stealth/invisible people will see you and beat craps out of you. Being invisible make you be able to avoid that, e.g. being smashed by a tank, and give you a chance to kill the mage/healer before the tank even reaches you. I think it's really great that there's no stealth in WAR because they said, damage will be low and because of that battles will last longer than in other MMORPGs. Stealth classes would give the ability to pick the important buffer or healer chars with a group of rogues, kill him, and shorten the time of a match very much.
One of the first things to really grab my attention about WAR was when I heard that they would not have any stealth classes.
It's really obvious why they did if if you think about game design. Apart from making PvP balance a nightmare, stealth characters make PvE grouping BORING as heck for everyone else.
'Where's the rogue?'
'Oh he snuck on ahead and is checking out all the cool stuff before everyone else while we get to sit around on our rears. If we're really lucky he may kill some of the mobs before we even get a chance to see them! Let me know when he comes back, I'm going AFK.'
I hated grouping with stealth characters in City of Heroes/Villains, I hated it in WoW.
The lack of stealth means that WAR's PvE grouping will take place as a *group* rather than waiting around while someone gets to play their own game of Metal Gear Solid on your time.
And I also agree that real men don't need stealth in PvP
One of the first things to really grab my attention about WAR was when I heard that they would not have any stealth classes. It's really obvious why they did if if you think about game design. Apart from making PvP balance a nightmare, stealth characters make PvE grouping BORING as heck for everyone else. 'Where's the rogue?' 'Oh he snuck on ahead and is checking out all the cool stuff before everyone else while we get to sit around on our rears. If we're really lucky he may kill some of the mobs before we even get a chance to see them! Let me know when he comes back, I'm going AFK.' I hated grouping with stealth characters in City of Heroes/Villains, I hated it in WoW. The lack of stealth means that WAR's PvE grouping will take place as a *group* rather than waiting around while someone gets to play their own game of Metal Gear Solid on your time. And I also agree that real men don't need stealth in PvP
I agree, when i played a rogue in WoW i thought it was fun but i didnt really do much in a group to help out besides dps now and then. But when i switched to a pally, i realized how much of a pain rogues are in pvp/pve.
Stealth is in games to make u feel comforted when pvping.... and this is WAR, ur not supposed to feel comfortable.
Well, kudos to them for sticking to the lore. How refreshing it is to see a company stay true to the lore rather than comprimising it to please a segment of fans.
Other than signing up for the newsletter quite some time ago, I hadn't really done much following of WAR's development.
The last few weeks, after losing all remaining interest in WoW pvp (which wasn't much to begin with), I've been digging around for more information on WAR's pvp/rvr system.
I've been encouraged by quite a few things, and to date one of the neatest "improvements" over today's pvp implementations to date had to be warrior-types being able to "taunt" in pvp by making themselves more attractive targets rather than simply resorting to taking away player control. That's a nice turnaround from, say, WoW rogues using the ability to "distract" enemies while stealthed so people running full speed in one direction immediately do a 180 or head off in a random direction. Yeah, that's a ton of fun, and clearly an ability being used as intended. "LOL u ran right into my dps blender cuz I distracted u from running away from me!!!"
No stealth, though. That's the new favorite! I could almost handle a class who could just simply be invisible and call it stealth, but the ability to vanish, in broad daylight, in combat, while being a person's combat focus.... that was just stupid. Even when you're finally able to accept the absurdity, it's still just cheap.
It seems the effort is really going into how to make pvp better, or not suck so badly as it has, while adding cool Warhammer looks. I think it may be safer to get excited about this game than most. You know, rather than getting excited about SWG, getting into the beta after years of hearing snippets about this and that cool feature or system, and realizing it was rat hunting in the desert with double-jointed aliens firing rifles at a full sprint directly behind them with 100% accuracy, or something.
I don't see any "revolution in online gameplay" or "deeper and more amazingly complex than anything previously imagined" claims. In fact, it seems more like "Lets all smash heads. You know, for the greater good, or whatever." Keeping the objectives clear and the goals reasonable..... that's wicked game design, at least in the world of MMO's.
Im not arguing for or against stealth in WAR but you fail to realize about the other games you are using to produce reasons why not to have stealth classes used stealth as a way to give the rogue or rogue types their specail ability to be sneaky and move around silently and so forth. Its an attempt to accentuate the rogues special ability to sneak. So stealth made pvp harder.. stop crying as i recall there were a dozen different ways in WoW to stop a rogue... flare. any type of AoE's, pallys had concecrate, mages blink soon as they get hit, hunters trap right away , so sneakers could choose their targets.. big deal, they also usually tend to have pretty much no armor and not too many hit points so once they pop outta stealth they are open targets for everyone.. i belive I read a thread about gettin out of a fight well again rogue or rogue types are historically hit and run types if they are forced to stand toe to toe then they would be called warriors not rouges. a rogues using sneak to get the drop on some one is no different than a mage nuking you from 40 yards away for 4k hp a shot or any other ranged type gettin the drop from 40 or 50 yards away and snaring you while they do it.. remember its all fantasy and they are all games they can only be so real.. the way the other mmos out there designed their games not having stealth in them for the rogue types would have made them completly useless because all their skills depended on them being stealthy. and i dont know why you would not want a class that could scout ahead so your group dont run into a huge mess not having a clue whats comming up, but this is WAR and they can do whatever they want with their game. If they dont want to have stealth in their game then kudos to them i will still play.. if they did put stealth in the game then kudos to them i would still play.. im sure my mage or warrior will be able to deal with it in either case. I applaud them for following the game lore with no stealth classes and i belive if that is their descision then im sure they will find a way to make rogue or rogue types usefull without it.. i just want to caution trying to follow the lore too close could possibly lead to bad things as well.. just look at DDO great concept DnD was an awsome table top but the mmo tried to stick with the lore of the game and make it dungeon crawls and so forth like the table top and it was a desaster for them.. some times you have to go outside the lore box and just give in to the fact this is an mmo and you cant please everyone,, So no stealth no problem im sure rogue types will find thier place... and when they do my Mage will be waiting..
I would rather have no stealthers than the gimped ones like Daoc all stealthers are at the bottom of the food chain right now and u either find no one to play with or u run into stealth zerg how fun is that?
Comments
I think it's really great that there's no stealth in WAR because they said, damage will be low and because of that battles will last longer than in other MMORPGs. Stealth classes would give the ability to pick the important buffer or healer chars with a group of rogues, kill him, and shorten the time of a match very much.
One of the first things to really grab my attention about WAR was when I heard that they would not have any stealth classes.
It's really obvious why they did if if you think about game design. Apart from making PvP balance a nightmare, stealth characters make PvE grouping BORING as heck for everyone else.
'Where's the rogue?'
'Oh he snuck on ahead and is checking out all the cool stuff before everyone else while we get to sit around on our rears. If we're really lucky he may kill some of the mobs before we even get a chance to see them! Let me know when he comes back, I'm going AFK.'
I hated grouping with stealth characters in City of Heroes/Villains, I hated it in WoW.
The lack of stealth means that WAR's PvE grouping will take place as a *group* rather than waiting around while someone gets to play their own game of Metal Gear Solid on your time.
And I also agree that real men don't need stealth in PvP
I agree, when i played a rogue in WoW i thought it was fun but i didnt really do much in a group to help out besides dps now and then. But when i switched to a pally, i realized how much of a pain rogues are in pvp/pve.
Stealth is in games to make u feel comforted when pvping.... and this is WAR, ur not supposed to feel comfortable.
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lvl50Hero~RR4
lvl50Minstrel~RR6
lvl60Pally
Other than signing up for the newsletter quite some time ago, I hadn't really done much following of WAR's development.
The last few weeks, after losing all remaining interest in WoW pvp (which wasn't much to begin with), I've been digging around for more information on WAR's pvp/rvr system.
I've been encouraged by quite a few things, and to date one of the neatest "improvements" over today's pvp implementations to date had to be warrior-types being able to "taunt" in pvp by making themselves more attractive targets rather than simply resorting to taking away player control. That's a nice turnaround from, say, WoW rogues using the ability to "distract" enemies while stealthed so people running full speed in one direction immediately do a 180 or head off in a random direction. Yeah, that's a ton of fun, and clearly an ability being used as intended. "LOL u ran right into my dps blender cuz I distracted u from running away from me!!!"
No stealth, though. That's the new favorite! I could almost handle a class who could just simply be invisible and call it stealth, but the ability to vanish, in broad daylight, in combat, while being a person's combat focus.... that was just stupid. Even when you're finally able to accept the absurdity, it's still just cheap.
It seems the effort is really going into how to make pvp better, or not suck so badly as it has, while adding cool Warhammer looks. I think it may be safer to get excited about this game than most. You know, rather than getting excited about SWG, getting into the beta after years of hearing snippets about this and that cool feature or system, and realizing it was rat hunting in the desert with double-jointed aliens firing rifles at a full sprint directly behind them with 100% accuracy, or something.
I don't see any "revolution in online gameplay" or "deeper and more amazingly complex than anything previously imagined" claims. In fact, it seems more like "Lets all smash heads. You know, for the greater good, or whatever." Keeping the objectives clear and the goals reasonable..... that's wicked game design, at least in the world of MMO's.
Hatetank
I would rather have no stealthers than the gimped ones like Daoc all stealthers are at the bottom of the food chain right now and u either find no one to play with or u run into stealth zerg how fun is that?