well then all I am getting out of any of this is that BoB is cheating...
but if I was to read the frist post and just reply to that I would say...
no, CCP will not be using viral marketing. As cool as it would be to hang up rifters in downtown boston and have the whole state think it was a terrisort attack :P
also I'm just glad that the next thing being put into EvE is anti-blob weapons, and the abilty to hurt a POS with only 9 ships.
Now think about it for a moment. If 9 ships can take out a POS.
Then using blob as defence would be silly, because now the 1000 man fleet will be attack not one POS, but 50 of them with 30 men on each.
and with anti-blob tech in place, using a bolb as def would make your other POSes defenceless AND get your lrage number of units owned.
I'm thinking they might do some kinda of star craft massive anti-zerg defences.
plus soon I believe it will be less blob and more send wave after of wave of units at the PoS. Storing them up inside a titan or 2. and have the untis use the titan as an undocking station, and as a jump clone bay. now send out 3 titans, and 30 attack fleets. each capible for taking out a POS.
and I'm sure sending in 300 units to defend will still be useful. but with 30 of your POSes being attacked. you better be damn well sure you got 30 300 man fleets, and the POSes to defend.
also I'm just glad that the next thing being put into EvE is anti-blob weapons, and the abilty to hurt a POS with only 9 ships.
Now think about it for a moment. If 9 ships can take out a POS.
Then using blob as defence would be silly, because now the 1000 man fleet will be attack not one POS, but 50 of them with 30 men on each.
and with anti-blob tech in place, using a bolb as def would make your other POSes defenceless AND get your lrage number of units owned.
I'm thinking they might do some kinda of star craft massive anti-zerg defences.
plus soon I believe it will be less blob and more send wave after of wave of units at the PoS. Storing them up inside a titan or 2. and have the untis use the titan as an undocking station, and as a jump clone bay. now send out 3 titans, and 30 attack fleets. each capible for taking out a POS.
and I'm sure sending in 300 units to defend will still be useful. but with 30 of your POSes being attacked. you better be damn well sure you got 30 300 man fleets, and the POSes to defend.
anti blob weapons? but the weapons will take out a large group, but not a small group? with what three titans?
i don't keep up with all the dev blogs, am i missing a huge content patch teaser?
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Do you hate blobs? We hate blobs. We’re working on some cool ways of countering them. We think they’re good. We think you might too. Also, there may be explosions.
If you think rts, sometimes you get really happy when all of the other army are in the same spot. so you nuke them. If they were speard out, it wouldn't of been as effetive...
I don't know what I'm talking about.
maybe smart bomb revamp?
or t3 ships that specilize in rending large groups of ships ina effevtive
Do you hate blobs? We hate blobs. We’re working on some cool ways of countering them. We think they’re good. We think you might too. Also, there may be explosions.
If you think rts, sometimes you get really happy when all of the other army are in the same spot. so you nuke them. If they were speard out, it wouldn't of been as effetive...
I don't know what I'm talking about.
link?
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Do you hate blobs? We hate blobs. We’re working on some cool ways of countering them. We think they’re good. We think you might too. Also, there may be explosions.
where's the "small groups only vs pos" thing? blob wars aren't just about pos', a lot of blob wars are just that - huge fleets taking each other on in a lagfest of insanity.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
sorry, I didn't mean to say just for defending POSes.
the idea is that CCP doesn't want gaint 700 vs 700 battles.
how? no idea
check out that other link I edited in.
"
We'd also like to see tactical starbase structures and modules, which deploy their effects remotely. No, this isn't a miniature Doomsday device, there is more than damage to deal out. Also on this line of thought, think "anti-blob" weapon, something which is bad for your fleet if you are all bunched up somewhere in one place.
Wait, you said anti-blob!?
Yes, quite right. The direction combat has been moving in the last year is a direction we don't like. It's becoming more and more important that you rack up 50+ ships to be able to do anything meaningful, preferably with 10 or more capital ships and astro-glide to get them into the solar system (what a suitable name for the space universe btw).
This isn't only hard on your real-life schedule (Well, I wouldn't know, I don't have one any more) but it's also affecting your gameplay. Who wan's to wait for 3 hours while a fleet is assembled?"
Lets face it, wether you love the game or hate it we all have a choice to play the game or not. If you truly believe CCP keeps cheating to help their buds or w/e then you can simply cancel and walk away. If this sort of thing doesnt matter then youll simply keep playing.
But when it comes down to all of this theories (and lets face it thats all they are, because at the end of the day all we have concrete evidence of is the T20 incident) make no difference. People will always create their own relities and the momment they recieve information contradicting such reality they will discard it or will take much longer to accept it as true. Thats fact for every human being in every aspect of life. There are theories here and there, a complex to help BoB a system cap for help BoB etc etc etc. Becauyse it happened once it doesnt mean itl ahppen again, but the opposite remains true as well. Speculating doesnt make a difference and thats evident when you see EvEs subscription increase.
The best possible course of action is to take in as much information and come to your own conclusions, driving down other peoples own conclusion because you think is wrong makes you an idiot because there is not concrete evidence to point to one particular direction. All there is out there is circumstancial at best. Everyone has the right to their own beliefs until the concrete truth is revealed, for now there is no such thing so just fuking drop it and move along. If your so convinced that CCP cheats etc etc....you have your reasons, asnd if you believe otherwise you have your reasons as well.
We all know CCP mishandled the situation w T20, and they have given their explanation as to why it was so and what they will do to address the matter. We can take it as true and accept it, or simply take it as useless words and bach CCP further. W/e the case it doesnt matter, the game is still moving ahead regardless of what people are saying on these forums.
If you look at how player infrastructure is built, there are intermediate goals already in place. You need Starbases to build an Outpost. The problem is, that there aren't that many of them, especially not combat-wise. There aren't really any goals to achieve against the larger player infrastructure when you are a part of a roaming 5-man fleet. We want that to happen, there should be goals for smaller fleets. Note that this is specifically about "fixed" goals, not taking out industrials or camping a gate.
Small fleets are fun. Roaming around, no need to wait for people, just gather some friends and start some skirmishes, deep infiltrations, war of attrition, mischief, mayhem and soap. This is achieved by adding more ways to affect player infrastructure, not just the only option of full destruction.
We'd like to give you the ability to upgrade individual parts of an Outpost but likewise allow your opponents to disable that specific part. If it's a factory, it might put all jobs on hold until you repair the facility. Don't worry, there would also be defenses at the Outpost, but I think you get the idea. More goals and more stuff for smaller groups to achieve.
Sure, big fleet encounters are still in there, but there should be a more natural escalation towards the fleet encounter, it shouldn't be the only option. A large fleet encounter should also span multiple solar systems, have tactical and strategic goals, it should be worth something to flank your opponents constellation, right? Right.
making a 5 man team a useful part of PvP
which mean you need to make your blob
and your 30 small man teams
and some day your anti-blob fleets
now that to me, sounds like real PvP, because right now a POS won't feal anythign without 200 people attacking it. well at least it seems that way.
sorry, I didn't mean to say just for defending POSes.
the idea is that CCP doesn't want gaint 700 vs 700 battles.
how? no idea
check out that other link I edited in.
" We'd also like to see tactical starbase structures and modules, which deploy their effects remotely. No, this isn't a miniature Doomsday device, there is more than damage to deal out. Also on this line of thought, think "anti-blob" weapon, something which is bad for your fleet if you are all bunched up somewhere in one place. Wait, you said anti-blob!? Yes, quite right. The direction combat has been moving in the last year is a direction we don't like. It's becoming more and more important that you rack up 50+ ships to be able to do anything meaningful, preferably with 10 or more capital ships and astro-glide to get them into the solar system (what a suitable name for the space universe btw). This isn't only hard on your real-life schedule (Well, I wouldn't know, I don't have one any more) but it's also affecting your gameplay. Who wan's to wait for 3 hours while a fleet is assembled?"
i know this is way off topic of the fanboy thing, but that coupled with all the starbase changes/upgrades, and starbase-type objects that they're talking about putting ingame... that REALLY makes it sound like it could be fun, instead of the blob-lag stupidity.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
WTS tin foil hats 1b isk pst!!! Lets face it, wether you love the game or hate it we all have a choice to play the game or not. If you truly believe CCP keeps cheating to help their buds or w/e then you can simply cancel and walk away. If this sort of thing doesnt matter then youll simply keep playing. But when it comes down to all of this theories (and lets face it thats all they are, because at the end of the day all we have concrete evidence of is the T20 incident) make no difference. People will always create their own relities and the momment they recieve information contradicting such reality they will discard it or will take much longer to accept it as true. Thats fact for every human being in every aspect of life. There are theories here and there, a complex to help BoB a system cap for help BoB etc etc etc. Becauyse it happened once it doesnt mean itl ahppen again, but the opposite remains true as well. Speculating doesnt make a difference and thats evident when you see EvEs subscription increase. The best possible course of action is to take in as much information and come to your own conclusions, driving down other peoples own conclusion because you think is wrong makes you an idiot because there is not concrete evidence to point to one particular direction. All there is out there is circumstancial at best. Everyone has the right to their own beliefs until the concrete truth is revealed, for now there is no such thing so just fuking drop it and move along. If your so convinced that CCP cheats etc etc....you have your reasons, asnd if you believe otherwise you have your reasons as well. We all know CCP mishandled the situation w T20, and they have given their explanation as to why it was so and what they will do to address the matter. We can take it as true and accept it, or simply take it as useless words and bach CCP further. W/e the case it doesnt matter, the game is still moving ahead regardless of what people are saying on these forums.
so what you're saying is that it's a theory that a GM appeared and put a max-ship/player limit on the system for the bod-cap-yard attack? it can't be proven that it happened, it's merely a theory?
just like it's a theory that it's the first time that's ever happened? it's also a theory that bob and bob-allies have used the lag/crash node tactic in the past? none of this can be proven?
again, another theory is that those complexes were spawning every hour? can't actually prove they were, or that ccp did/didn't fix anything?
you do realize that a theory is something that can not be concretely proven, correct?
so fanboi viralism, ftl, again.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
WTS tin foil hats 1b isk pst!!! Lets face it, wether you love the game or hate it we all have a choice to play the game or not. If you truly believe CCP keeps cheating to help their buds or w/e then you can simply cancel and walk away. If this sort of thing doesnt matter then youll simply keep playing. But when it comes down to all of this theories (and lets face it thats all they are, because at the end of the day all we have concrete evidence of is the T20 incident) make no difference. People will always create their own relities and the momment they recieve information contradicting such reality they will discard it or will take much longer to accept it as true. Thats fact for every human being in every aspect of life. There are theories here and there, a complex to help BoB a system cap for help BoB etc etc etc. Becauyse it happened once it doesnt mean itl ahppen again, but the opposite remains true as well. Speculating doesnt make a difference and thats evident when you see EvEs subscription increase. The best possible course of action is to take in as much information and come to your own conclusions, driving down other peoples own conclusion because you think is wrong makes you an idiot because there is not concrete evidence to point to one particular direction. All there is out there is circumstancial at best. Everyone has the right to their own beliefs until the concrete truth is revealed, for now there is no such thing so just fuking drop it and move along. If your so convinced that CCP cheats etc etc....you have your reasons, asnd if you believe otherwise you have your reasons as well. We all know CCP mishandled the situation w T20, and they have given their explanation as to why it was so and what they will do to address the matter. We can take it as true and accept it, or simply take it as useless words and bach CCP further. W/e the case it doesnt matter, the game is still moving ahead regardless of what people are saying on these forums.
so what you're saying is that it's a theory that a GM appeared and put a max-ship/player limit on the system for the bod-cap-yard attack? it can't be proven that it happened, it's merely a theory?
just like it's a theory that it's the first time that's ever happened? it's also a theory that bob and bob-allies have used the lag/crash node tactic in the past? none of this can be proven?
again, another theory is that those complexes were spawning every hour? can't actually prove they were, or that ccp did/didn't fix anything?
you do realize that a theory is something that can not be concretely proven, correct?
so fanboi viralism, ftl, again.
...alright lemme clarify so there is less confusion
What i meant by theory is this: though it is true that a GM lowered the cap for the pvp fight it is only a theory that it was made just to please BoB.
Now i realize many (not only BoB) alliances have used the node crash to their advantages, it is also true that CCP has been hinting that its beginning to take a stance on blob warfare. Though the tools may not yet been available (as they are still in production) it isnt farfetched to think that this is the beginning of GMs intervening in such fights to control the nodes, i think itl happene again in other fights. At the same time it can also be true that they did it to help BoB.....but like i said its not the fact that a GM came out to cut the cap thats a theory, its the speculation as to why he did it.
As far as complexes go ive been in some that have been glitched and are not within BoB space. while it may be true that the complex within BoB could have been made the way it was to benefit BoB the opposite can still be true, we simply dont have concrete evidence supporting either agruement.
I am far from a fanboi, i play many games and if i find something i dont like ill say it. I think if you look at my past posts youll see i am usually a very impartial person as far as making comments about ANY game. EvE has its good side and the bad...the list is long for both...
EDIT: i know what i theory is: my major is International Relations.....i sure as hell know what that means. And just to let you know a theory is used to explain why certain things happen and can be disproven by a another theory. At the same time multiple theories can explain one specific event or behavior w/o either of them being completely wrong.
that's up there with the EvE TV final batle when the power went out and they were still airing live. when they started drawing what was happening on paper :P
WTS tin foil hats 1b isk pst!!! Lets face it, wether you love the game or hate it we all have a choice to play the game or not. If you truly believe CCP keeps cheating to help their buds or w/e then you can simply cancel and walk away. If this sort of thing doesnt matter then youll simply keep playing. But when it comes down to all of this theories (and lets face it thats all they are, because at the end of the day all we have concrete evidence of is the T20 incident) make no difference. People will always create their own relities and the momment they recieve information contradicting such reality they will discard it or will take much longer to accept it as true. Thats fact for every human being in every aspect of life. There are theories here and there, a complex to help BoB a system cap for help BoB etc etc etc. Becauyse it happened once it doesnt mean itl ahppen again, but the opposite remains true as well. Speculating doesnt make a difference and thats evident when you see EvEs subscription increase. The best possible course of action is to take in as much information and come to your own conclusions, driving down other peoples own conclusion because you think is wrong makes you an idiot because there is not concrete evidence to point to one particular direction. All there is out there is circumstancial at best. Everyone has the right to their own beliefs until the concrete truth is revealed, for now there is no such thing so just fuking drop it and move along. If your so convinced that CCP cheats etc etc....you have your reasons, asnd if you believe otherwise you have your reasons as well. We all know CCP mishandled the situation w T20, and they have given their explanation as to why it was so and what they will do to address the matter. We can take it as true and accept it, or simply take it as useless words and bach CCP further. W/e the case it doesnt matter, the game is still moving ahead regardless of what people are saying on these forums.
so what you're saying is that it's a theory that a GM appeared and put a max-ship/player limit on the system for the bod-cap-yard attack? it can't be proven that it happened, it's merely a theory?
just like it's a theory that it's the first time that's ever happened? it's also a theory that bob and bob-allies have used the lag/crash node tactic in the past? none of this can be proven?
again, another theory is that those complexes were spawning every hour? can't actually prove they were, or that ccp did/didn't fix anything?
you do realize that a theory is something that can not be concretely proven, correct?
so fanboi viralism, ftl, again.
...alright lemme clarify so there is less confusion
What i meant by theory is this: though it is true that a GM lowered the cap for the pvp fight it is only a theory that it was made just to please BoB.
Now i realize many (not only BoB) alliances have used the node crash to their advantages, it is also true that CCP has been hinting that its beginning to take a stance on blob warfare. Though the tools may not yet been available (as they are still in production) it isnt farfetched to think that this is the beginning of GMs intervening in such fights to control the nodes, i think itl happene again in other fights. At the same time it can also be true that they did it to help BoB.....but like i said its not the fact that a GM came out to cut the cap thats a theory, its the speculation as to why he did it.
As far as complexes go ive been in some that have been glitched and are not within BoB space. while it may be true that the complex within BoB could have been made the way it was to benefit BoB the opposite can still be true, we simply dont have concrete evidence supporting either agruement.
I am far from a fanboi, i play many games and if i find something i dont like ill say it. I think if you look at my past posts youll see i am usually a very impartial person as far as making comments about ANY game. EvE has its good side and the bad...the list is long for both...
EDIT: i know what i theory is: my major is International Relations.....i sure as hell know what that means. And just to let you know a theory is used to explain why certain things happen and can be disproven by a another theory. At the same time multiple theories can explain one specific event or behavior w/o either of them being completely wrong.
um, it's true that something kinda unblanced happen but... neither side cares. I mean they've pointed it out but. The only people making up these GM's helping bob things are the random forum people.
Red swarm has never said any of this. If they the people that were effected don't think what you do. then your words are backing up no one.
EDIT: i know what i theory is: my major is International Relations..... i sure as hell know what that means. And just to let you know a theory is used to explain why certain things happen and can be disproven by a another theory. At the same time multiple theories can explain one specific event or behavior w/o either of them being completely wrong.
if you have to resort to this tactic.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
um, it's true that something kinda unblanced happen but... neither side cares. I mean they've pointed it out but. The only people making up these GM's helping bob things are the random forum people.
Red swarm has never said any of this. If they the people that were effected don't think what you do. then your words are backing up no one.
there's certain things that get deleted from eve-o forums, and certain things you won't post on your public boards (unless you want bad things to happen).
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
um, it's true that something kinda unblanced happen but... neither side cares. I mean they've pointed it out but. The only people making up these GM's helping bob things are the random forum people.
Red swarm has never said any of this. If they the people that were effected don't think what you do. then your words are backing up no one.
there's certain things that get deleted from eve-o forums, and certain things you won't post on your public boards (unless you want bad things to happen).
Exactly. And you think anti-Vanguard posts on sites get deleted fast? You should meet the EVE community managers. Basically they're paid CCP employees who do the following
A)Answer questions with more questions or impossibly ambiguous responses
Contribute so little to posts that it could actually be considered "de-railing". Turning serious questions and real in-game issues sometimes 50+ pages long into joke threads before locking them for random reasons.
C)Lock any thread they consider unsatisfactory and 95% of the time give no reason other than "Thread locked for X". X of course being a cookie-cutter copy-paste non related response.
1 - node crashes happen in wars. sometimes intentionally, perhaps other times not. this has gone on for a long time. the only time a GM has taken it upon him/herself to do something about it is during this incident where a bod shipyard was involved, which allegedly was building a titan.
2 - i believe it was sirmolle who posted kug's name/phone number and encouraged/demanded people call and get him fired/harrassed at his job. did sirmolle get anything other than maybe a day or two suspension from eve-o forums?
3- 10/10 complexes. this can probably be an aside, but it's out there.
kind of hard to get more strikes after the first three, but here they go with 5&6 both.
4 - t20 gets caught, everyone (including him) is in denial about it, publicly, until it gets to the point that they CAN'T deny it any longer. --strike one, two and three against ccp being trustworthy, imo
5 - after HAVING to admit to wrong doing, he ONLY admits to what he was caught doing.
6 - everyone else, who also "play tests" and works for CCP, has no idea any of this was going on and they certainly didn't participate. see my story about playing in the same room with other folks and how it's kind of hard to NOT know what a couple of other people are doing who are sitting in the same room with you. ESPECIALLY if you're all working towards the same goal.
7- kug is the whistle blower. his accounts get banned. the information he gives ASIDE from t20 - is ignored. it's not denied, it's IGNORED. so bob is allowed to continue cheating ingame, the cheating they had done (outside of t20 spawning things) which t20 had full knowledge of, and ran the cap ship department which was engaged in the cheating, i believe. i could be wrong on part of this. but, if t20 is such an outstanding, trustworthy type, then why weren't all the bob'ers who were cheating and account sharing and everything else - banned? surely t20 confessed to EVERYTHING wrong he was in knowledge of, correct?
8- bpcs and profits from the bpos were not removed. how many individuals profited greatly from these bpos?
9 - there's a ton of things you can LOGICALLY infer from the above. not a tinfoil hat conspiracy, but logically, rationally, intelligently infer. if it looks like a goat, smells like a goat, and acts like a goat, i'm pretty darned sure it's not Tara Reid. well, unless she's REALLY hammered and vomiting all over, and she'd still look a whole lot better than any goat i've ever seen.
the fanboi, or viralist, if you will, will ignore logic and facts. they will also tend to focus upon one statement or a single aspect of the argument/discussion, and attempt to put logical-SOUNDING spin upon it. which, does indeed sound logical, if you ignore the FACTS.
i.e. there's a wait to get into jita because there's a player/ship limit. OBVIOUSLY there's always been player/ship limits in 0.0 areas and what happened at the bob shipyard was just a result of the normal limits.
sounds VERY logical. except you find that this argument ignores two crucial elements -
1) crashing nodes has become part of the game in the big wars, and especially something like this, there's never been a player/ship limit that has prevented this previously.
2) no one on any side of the battle disputes that a GM actively, deliberately, and consciously imposed an artificial player/ship limit in this system which prevented it from crashing.
so, having an opinion is great. having an opinion you can back with examples is even better. one isolated incident, perhaps two, can be ignored and labeled as tinhat tomfoolery. but if you have a string of said coincedences, and they always seem to tie back into an alliance/corp that yet another staff/dev nooblet is in... then you have THAT, a history of a certain type of behaviour. and i'm sure there are a number of other items i could add to the list. again the complexes thing is a happy aside, which just "by the way" also benefits bob and as stated, could be the source of trillions of iskies.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
If you have a point of view different that the OP your a fanboi, if you think alike then your right.
I for one dont give much thought into the issues at hand tbh, when it comes down to it its all about fun. We pay for entertainment and the moment it is no longer fun we stop doing it. A real fanboi would simply remain in denial as everything comes crashing down. I am well aware that EvE is far from perfect, no game really is and we have all come to accept it. I pay for EvE, as well as Lineage 2. I love to play them and from time to time i quit the games to take a break from the politics involved in both games.
In those breaks i venture into other games and get to see what other companies have to offer. During the time the T20 scandal came to light i was away from the game for 2 months already, i got to read all about it through here and some other sources. I admit it sucked but we all moved on. I understand if i was at the other end of BoBs guns id be pissed but i havent been....i belong to a small corp and have fun w many of my rl friends.
There really isnt a point to being a fanboi/obsessed person cuz it doesnt let you appreciate things beyond your scope, and it also clouds perception when things are wrong with the game your playing. I for one am perfectly aware of the wrongs that CCP commited, but i chose to believe that they will be resposible form now on, if in another point in time it is perfectly evident that CCP has once more cheated then ill make a decision then. But atm im having fun w my friends, and nothing on this forum has impacted anything on the world of EvE.
Only reason i posted was because the things being raised as a problem dont seem to be a real issue in my eyes. I can honestly say that those issues have little substance on both sides of the arguement so i see no point in blowing whistles as if EvE was about to collapse. All i gotta say to the OP (and itl be the last post ill make on this thread) is to just move on....if you feel cheated by CCP and you honestly feel they havent changed then vote with your right to withhold money from them. After all thats the only power you really have. Just because other people arent concerned by your repeated alarms or simlpy disagree doesnt necessarily make em a fanboi (though some are). People can disagree and thats normal there no reason to go out of your way to label someone just because you feel like it. If you feel there really is a problem and you want to inform the rest of us about it, i suggest you do some serious diggin for concrete evidence that CCP is up to no good again rather that bringing us some circumstancial evidence and call it proof. You may be right, but you may also be wrong.....as someone who is trying to inform other you should try to be impartial and let people come to their own conclusions rather than force feed them what you believe in; cuz after all, all you got is circumstancial at best. Take care man and enjoy w/e game you are playing.
If i remember right one of the ideas ive heard from the devs to Break up blobs is to make stealth bombers actually usefull by giving them what is essentially a mini doomsday device [think a relly big smartbomb]. The idea being is the Bomber cloaks and aproaches a big groupe of ships then he activates the smartbomb, whether he will need to uncloak to do this is not known nor whether the damage will be really massive or not or what form it takes.
As to the main topic of this thread i feel This viral thing is just an excuse people use to batter down peoples views [ mainly those who like in this case EvE]. And using the Viral claim as a reason to not take someones views seriously is just a sign of lazyness on the part of the Critic. Tho from what i have been told SOE does seem to use this tactic which i find a is a tactic very similar to the type of tactics that say Stalin would have used in his day.
As to whethere eve uses such tactics? I highly doubt it after all EvE is growing and has no competitors so using Viral advertising would not really be needed when you take those fact into consideration.
this game, like all others, has it's fanboy base. which, it cannot be denied, is incredibly detrimental to a game actually getting better, on any level, ever.
that aside... especially with soe coming out in the open and SAYING they're going to actively engage in viral marketing...
how many companies do that, and have been doing that for a long time, and we just assumed they were idiotic fanboys?
when/where do you think ccp does/has been doing/will soon do viral marketing?
i mean, why else would someone blindly follow anyone/thing, unless well, they've got the mind of a goldfish and are um, not so bright.
I think your point has merit, and your bait has hooked a few fishies...
is ccp low enough to use viral marketing (to evade spending real cash to advertise properly, and honestly...)??
I think we all know that answer.
ccp the "we cheat for our buddies and are proud of it" company...
If i remember right one of the ideas ive heard from the devs to Break up blobs is to make stealth bombers actually usefull by giving them what is essentially a mini doomsday device [think a relly big smartbomb]. The idea being is the Bomber cloaks and aproaches a big groupe of ships then he activates the smartbomb, whether he will need to uncloak to do this is not known nor whether the damage will be really massive or not or what form it takes.
As to the main topic of this thread i feel This viral thing is just an excuse people use to batter down peoples views [ mainly those who like in this case EvE]. And using the Viral claim as a reason to not take someones views seriously is just a sign of lazyness on the part of the Critic. Tho from what i have been told SOE does seem to use this tactic which i find a is a tactic very similar to the type of tactics that say Stalin would have used in his day.
As to whethere eve uses such tactics? I highly doubt it after all EvE is growing and has no competitors so using Viral advertising would not really be needed when you take those fact into consideration.
All they lean on is word of mouth. Which is how I got here on the first place, someone told me it was the ultimate game. And that it can run in a computer with poor performance.
I love this 'viral marketing' way of accusing people of being secret employees of a company. It's just sad.
Just because someone really enjoys a game is not a reason to bash them. I've seen plenty of the folks posting negatively on this forum wear blinders of their own when it came to other MMORPG's on these forums. There are also those on these forums that don't seem to be happy with ANY MMORPG and just bash any game they come across. Then there are the people who play other games, know nothing about a game at all other than they 'don't like it' for some unknown reason, and bash it based on things they read on forums rather than personal in-game experience.
Personally I'd rather read the reports of a fanboi than the last of the above. I really don't care. I value all opinions, hater and fan alike. And mimimalizing anyone's viewpoint is immature. CIAO.
QFT, these would be the hateboi's mentioned above.
The problem is that the fanboi's can look at something like this and not see the problem. It is a problem for two reasions;
1. EVE seems to be drawing more and more players that are trying every thing they can to use game mecanics to make their battles safe and have no risk (RVR).
2. This just provides more fuel for the hateboi's who read this type of activity and because they never played the game do not understand all of the options, only seeing is as yet another example of how EVE promotes griefing (unfair avantage).
Comments
but if I was to read the frist post and just reply to that I would say...
no, CCP will not be using viral marketing. As cool as it would be to hang up rifters in downtown boston and have the whole state think it was a terrisort attack :P
that should change up the topic pretty quick :P
Now think about it for a moment. If 9 ships can take out a POS.
Then using blob as defence would be silly, because now the 1000 man fleet will be attack not one POS, but 50 of them with 30 men on each.
and with anti-blob tech in place, using a bolb as def would make your other POSes defenceless AND get your lrage number of units owned.
I'm thinking they might do some kinda of star craft massive anti-zerg defences.
plus soon I believe it will be less blob and more send wave after of wave of units at the PoS. Storing them up inside a titan or 2. and have the untis use the titan as an undocking station, and as a jump clone bay. now send out 3 titans, and 30 attack fleets. each capible for taking out a POS.
and I'm sure sending in 300 units to defend will still be useful. but with 30 of your POSes being attacked. you better be damn well sure you got 30 300 man fleets, and the POSes to defend.
anti blob weapons? but the weapons will take out a large group, but not a small group? with what three titans?
i don't keep up with all the dev blogs, am i missing a huge content patch teaser?
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Blob-Slaying Tools
If you think rts, sometimes you get really happy when all of the other army are in the same spot. so you nuke them. If they were speard out, it wouldn't of been as effetive...
I don't know what I'm talking about.
maybe smart bomb revamp?
or t3 ships that specilize in rending large groups of ships ina effevtive
more smaller doomdays like weapons?
link?
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
someone on the eve forums had an idea of missle type weapons that reach out and then have a huge explosion radius, 10km
long range big smart bomb
someone else was talking about station mods that limit.. something
http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=412
the link makes me log in, which brings me to an in-development page:
http://myeve.eve-online.com/updates/indevelopment.asp?sid=1049257170
Blob-Slaying Tools
where's the "small groups only vs pos" thing? blob wars aren't just about pos', a lot of blob wars are just that - huge fleets taking each other on in a lagfest of insanity.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
the idea is that CCP doesn't want gaint 700 vs 700 battles.
how? no idea
check out that other link I edited in.
"
We'd also like to see tactical starbase structures and modules, which deploy their effects remotely. No, this isn't a miniature Doomsday device, there is more than damage to deal out. Also on this line of thought, think "anti-blob" weapon, something which is bad for your fleet if you are all bunched up somewhere in one place.
Wait, you said anti-blob!?
Yes, quite right. The direction combat has been moving in the last year is a direction we don't like. It's becoming more and more important that you rack up 50+ ships to be able to do anything meaningful, preferably with 10 or more capital ships and astro-glide to get them into the solar system (what a suitable name for the space universe btw).
This isn't only hard on your real-life schedule (Well, I wouldn't know, I don't have one any more) but it's also affecting your gameplay. Who wan's to wait for 3 hours while a fleet is assembled?"
WTS tin foil hats 1b isk pst!!!
Lets face it, wether you love the game or hate it we all have a choice to play the game or not. If you truly believe CCP keeps cheating to help their buds or w/e then you can simply cancel and walk away. If this sort of thing doesnt matter then youll simply keep playing.
But when it comes down to all of this theories (and lets face it thats all they are, because at the end of the day all we have concrete evidence of is the T20 incident) make no difference. People will always create their own relities and the momment they recieve information contradicting such reality they will discard it or will take much longer to accept it as true. Thats fact for every human being in every aspect of life. There are theories here and there, a complex to help BoB a system cap for help BoB etc etc etc. Becauyse it happened once it doesnt mean itl ahppen again, but the opposite remains true as well. Speculating doesnt make a difference and thats evident when you see EvEs subscription increase.
The best possible course of action is to take in as much information and come to your own conclusions, driving down other peoples own conclusion because you think is wrong makes you an idiot because there is not concrete evidence to point to one particular direction. All there is out there is circumstancial at best. Everyone has the right to their own beliefs until the concrete truth is revealed, for now there is no such thing so just fuking drop it and move along. If your so convinced that CCP cheats etc etc....you have your reasons, asnd if you believe otherwise you have your reasons as well.
We all know CCP mishandled the situation w T20, and they have given their explanation as to why it was so and what they will do to address the matter. We can take it as true and accept it, or simply take it as useless words and bach CCP further. W/e the case it doesnt matter, the game is still moving ahead regardless of what people are saying on these forums.
Intermediate goals to the rescue
If you look at how player infrastructure is built, there are intermediate goals already in place. You need Starbases to build an Outpost. The problem is, that there aren't that many of them, especially not combat-wise. There aren't really any goals to achieve against the larger player infrastructure when you are a part of a roaming 5-man fleet. We want that to happen, there should be goals for smaller fleets. Note that this is specifically about "fixed" goals, not taking out industrials or camping a gate.
Small fleets are fun. Roaming around, no need to wait for people, just gather some friends and start some skirmishes, deep infiltrations, war of attrition, mischief, mayhem and soap. This is achieved by adding more ways to affect player infrastructure, not just the only option of full destruction.
We'd like to give you the ability to upgrade individual parts of an Outpost but likewise allow your opponents to disable that specific part. If it's a factory, it might put all jobs on hold until you repair the facility. Don't worry, there would also be defenses at the Outpost, but I think you get the idea. More goals and more stuff for smaller groups to achieve.
Sure, big fleet encounters are still in there, but there should be a more natural escalation towards the fleet encounter, it shouldn't be the only option. A large fleet encounter should also span multiple solar systems, have tactical and strategic goals, it should be worth something to flank your opponents constellation, right? Right.
making a 5 man team a useful part of PvP
which mean you need to make your blob
and your 30 small man teams
and some day your anti-blob fleets
now that to me, sounds like real PvP, because right now a POS won't feal anythign without 200 people attacking it. well at least it seems that way.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
so what you're saying is that it's a theory that a GM appeared and put a max-ship/player limit on the system for the bod-cap-yard attack? it can't be proven that it happened, it's merely a theory?
just like it's a theory that it's the first time that's ever happened? it's also a theory that bob and bob-allies have used the lag/crash node tactic in the past? none of this can be proven?
again, another theory is that those complexes were spawning every hour? can't actually prove they were, or that ccp did/didn't fix anything?
you do realize that a theory is something that can not be concretely proven, correct?
so fanboi viralism, ftl, again.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
so what you're saying is that it's a theory that a GM appeared and put a max-ship/player limit on the system for the bod-cap-yard attack? it can't be proven that it happened, it's merely a theory?
just like it's a theory that it's the first time that's ever happened? it's also a theory that bob and bob-allies have used the lag/crash node tactic in the past? none of this can be proven?
again, another theory is that those complexes were spawning every hour? can't actually prove they were, or that ccp did/didn't fix anything?
you do realize that a theory is something that can not be concretely proven, correct?
so fanboi viralism, ftl, again.
...alright lemme clarify so there is less confusion
What i meant by theory is this: though it is true that a GM lowered the cap for the pvp fight it is only a theory that it was made just to please BoB.
Now i realize many (not only BoB) alliances have used the node crash to their advantages, it is also true that CCP has been hinting that its beginning to take a stance on blob warfare. Though the tools may not yet been available (as they are still in production) it isnt farfetched to think that this is the beginning of GMs intervening in such fights to control the nodes, i think itl happene again in other fights. At the same time it can also be true that they did it to help BoB.....but like i said its not the fact that a GM came out to cut the cap thats a theory, its the speculation as to why he did it.
As far as complexes go ive been in some that have been glitched and are not within BoB space. while it may be true that the complex within BoB could have been made the way it was to benefit BoB the opposite can still be true, we simply dont have concrete evidence supporting either agruement.
I am far from a fanboi, i play many games and if i find something i dont like ill say it. I think if you look at my past posts youll see i am usually a very impartial person as far as making comments about ANY game. EvE has its good side and the bad...the list is long for both...
EDIT: i know what i theory is: my major is International Relations.....i sure as hell know what that means. And just to let you know a theory is used to explain why certain things happen and can be disproven by a another theory. At the same time multiple theories can explain one specific event or behavior w/o either of them being completely wrong.
that's up there with the EvE TV final batle when the power went out and they were still airing live. when they started drawing what was happening on paper :P
"boom hullshot"
so what you're saying is that it's a theory that a GM appeared and put a max-ship/player limit on the system for the bod-cap-yard attack? it can't be proven that it happened, it's merely a theory?
just like it's a theory that it's the first time that's ever happened? it's also a theory that bob and bob-allies have used the lag/crash node tactic in the past? none of this can be proven?
again, another theory is that those complexes were spawning every hour? can't actually prove they were, or that ccp did/didn't fix anything?
you do realize that a theory is something that can not be concretely proven, correct?
so fanboi viralism, ftl, again.
...alright lemme clarify so there is less confusion
What i meant by theory is this: though it is true that a GM lowered the cap for the pvp fight it is only a theory that it was made just to please BoB.
Now i realize many (not only BoB) alliances have used the node crash to their advantages, it is also true that CCP has been hinting that its beginning to take a stance on blob warfare. Though the tools may not yet been available (as they are still in production) it isnt farfetched to think that this is the beginning of GMs intervening in such fights to control the nodes, i think itl happene again in other fights. At the same time it can also be true that they did it to help BoB.....but like i said its not the fact that a GM came out to cut the cap thats a theory, its the speculation as to why he did it.
As far as complexes go ive been in some that have been glitched and are not within BoB space. while it may be true that the complex within BoB could have been made the way it was to benefit BoB the opposite can still be true, we simply dont have concrete evidence supporting either agruement.
I am far from a fanboi, i play many games and if i find something i dont like ill say it. I think if you look at my past posts youll see i am usually a very impartial person as far as making comments about ANY game. EvE has its good side and the bad...the list is long for both...
EDIT: i know what i theory is: my major is International Relations.....i sure as hell know what that means. And just to let you know a theory is used to explain why certain things happen and can be disproven by a another theory. At the same time multiple theories can explain one specific event or behavior w/o either of them being completely wrong.
um, it's true that something kinda unblanced happen but... neither side cares. I mean they've pointed it out but. The only people making up these GM's helping bob things are the random forum people.Red swarm has never said any of this. If they the people that were effected don't think what you do. then your words are backing up no one.
if you have to resort to this tactic.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Exactly. And you think anti-Vanguard posts on sites get deleted fast? You should meet the EVE community managers. Basically they're paid CCP employees who do the following
A)Answer questions with more questions or impossibly ambiguous responses
C)Lock any thread they consider unsatisfactory and 95% of the time give no reason other than "Thread locked for X". X of course being a cookie-cutter copy-paste non related response.
1 - node crashes happen in wars. sometimes intentionally, perhaps other times not. this has gone on for a long time. the only time a GM has taken it upon him/herself to do something about it is during this incident where a bod shipyard was involved, which allegedly was building a titan.
2 - i believe it was sirmolle who posted kug's name/phone number and encouraged/demanded people call and get him fired/harrassed at his job. did sirmolle get anything other than maybe a day or two suspension from eve-o forums?
3- 10/10 complexes. this can probably be an aside, but it's out there.
kind of hard to get more strikes after the first three, but here they go with 5&6 both.
4 - t20 gets caught, everyone (including him) is in denial about it, publicly, until it gets to the point that they CAN'T deny it any longer. --strike one, two and three against ccp being trustworthy, imo
5 - after HAVING to admit to wrong doing, he ONLY admits to what he was caught doing.
6 - everyone else, who also "play tests" and works for CCP, has no idea any of this was going on and they certainly didn't participate. see my story about playing in the same room with other folks and how it's kind of hard to NOT know what a couple of other people are doing who are sitting in the same room with you. ESPECIALLY if you're all working towards the same goal.
7- kug is the whistle blower. his accounts get banned. the information he gives ASIDE from t20 - is ignored. it's not denied, it's IGNORED. so bob is allowed to continue cheating ingame, the cheating they had done (outside of t20 spawning things) which t20 had full knowledge of, and ran the cap ship department which was engaged in the cheating, i believe. i could be wrong on part of this. but, if t20 is such an outstanding, trustworthy type, then why weren't all the bob'ers who were cheating and account sharing and everything else - banned? surely t20 confessed to EVERYTHING wrong he was in knowledge of, correct?
8- bpcs and profits from the bpos were not removed. how many individuals profited greatly from these bpos?
9 - there's a ton of things you can LOGICALLY infer from the above. not a tinfoil hat conspiracy, but logically, rationally, intelligently infer. if it looks like a goat, smells like a goat, and acts like a goat, i'm pretty darned sure it's not Tara Reid. well, unless she's REALLY hammered and vomiting all over, and she'd still look a whole lot better than any goat i've ever seen.
the fanboi, or viralist, if you will, will ignore logic and facts. they will also tend to focus upon one statement or a single aspect of the argument/discussion, and attempt to put logical-SOUNDING spin upon it. which, does indeed sound logical, if you ignore the FACTS.
i.e. there's a wait to get into jita because there's a player/ship limit. OBVIOUSLY there's always been player/ship limits in 0.0 areas and what happened at the bob shipyard was just a result of the normal limits.
sounds VERY logical. except you find that this argument ignores two crucial elements -
1) crashing nodes has become part of the game in the big wars, and especially something like this, there's never been a player/ship limit that has prevented this previously.
2) no one on any side of the battle disputes that a GM actively, deliberately, and consciously imposed an artificial player/ship limit in this system which prevented it from crashing.
so, having an opinion is great. having an opinion you can back with examples is even better. one isolated incident, perhaps two, can be ignored and labeled as tinhat tomfoolery. but if you have a string of said coincedences, and they always seem to tie back into an alliance/corp that yet another staff/dev nooblet is in... then you have THAT, a history of a certain type of behaviour. and i'm sure there are a number of other items i could add to the list. again the complexes thing is a happy aside, which just "by the way" also benefits bob and as stated, could be the source of trillions of iskies.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
To sunm up this thread:
If you have a point of view different that the OP your a fanboi, if you think alike then your right.
I for one dont give much thought into the issues at hand tbh, when it comes down to it its all about fun. We pay for entertainment and the moment it is no longer fun we stop doing it. A real fanboi would simply remain in denial as everything comes crashing down. I am well aware that EvE is far from perfect, no game really is and we have all come to accept it. I pay for EvE, as well as Lineage 2. I love to play them and from time to time i quit the games to take a break from the politics involved in both games.
In those breaks i venture into other games and get to see what other companies have to offer. During the time the T20 scandal came to light i was away from the game for 2 months already, i got to read all about it through here and some other sources. I admit it sucked but we all moved on. I understand if i was at the other end of BoBs guns id be pissed but i havent been....i belong to a small corp and have fun w many of my rl friends.
There really isnt a point to being a fanboi/obsessed person cuz it doesnt let you appreciate things beyond your scope, and it also clouds perception when things are wrong with the game your playing. I for one am perfectly aware of the wrongs that CCP commited, but i chose to believe that they will be resposible form now on, if in another point in time it is perfectly evident that CCP has once more cheated then ill make a decision then. But atm im having fun w my friends, and nothing on this forum has impacted anything on the world of EvE.
Only reason i posted was because the things being raised as a problem dont seem to be a real issue in my eyes. I can honestly say that those issues have little substance on both sides of the arguement so i see no point in blowing whistles as if EvE was about to collapse. All i gotta say to the OP (and itl be the last post ill make on this thread) is to just move on....if you feel cheated by CCP and you honestly feel they havent changed then vote with your right to withhold money from them. After all thats the only power you really have. Just because other people arent concerned by your repeated alarms or simlpy disagree doesnt necessarily make em a fanboi (though some are). People can disagree and thats normal there no reason to go out of your way to label someone just because you feel like it. If you feel there really is a problem and you want to inform the rest of us about it, i suggest you do some serious diggin for concrete evidence that CCP is up to no good again rather that bringing us some circumstancial evidence and call it proof. You may be right, but you may also be wrong.....as someone who is trying to inform other you should try to be impartial and let people come to their own conclusions rather than force feed them what you believe in; cuz after all, all you got is circumstancial at best. Take care man and enjoy w/e game you are playing.
If i remember right one of the ideas ive heard from the devs to Break up blobs is to make stealth bombers actually usefull by giving them what is essentially a mini doomsday device [think a relly big smartbomb]. The idea being is the Bomber cloaks and aproaches a big groupe of ships then he activates the smartbomb, whether he will need to uncloak to do this is not known nor whether the damage will be really massive or not or what form it takes.
As to the main topic of this thread i feel This viral thing is just an excuse people use to batter down peoples views [ mainly those who like in this case EvE]. And using the Viral claim as a reason to not take someones views seriously is just a sign of lazyness on the part of the Critic. Tho from what i have been told SOE does seem to use this tactic which i find a is a tactic very similar to the type of tactics that say Stalin would have used in his day.
As to whethere eve uses such tactics? I highly doubt it after all EvE is growing and has no competitors so using Viral advertising would not really be needed when you take those fact into consideration.
or anti-zerg weapons
is ccp low enough to use viral marketing (to evade spending real cash to advertise properly, and honestly...)??
I think we all know that answer.
ccp the "we cheat for our buddies and are proud of it" company...
QFT, these would be the hateboi's mentioned above.
The problem is that the fanboi's can look at something like this and not see the problem. It is a problem for two reasions;
1. EVE seems to be drawing more and more players that are trying every thing they can to use game mecanics to make their battles safe and have no risk (RVR).
2. This just provides more fuel for the hateboi's who read this type of activity and because they never played the game do not understand all of the options, only seeing is as yet another example of how EVE promotes griefing (unfair avantage).
An so it begins
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