We planned to be on this forum and many others so we can explain this stuff. That's what we always do -- engage and inform as best we can. If you visit our site, you'll see that our devs are on our forums all the time talking to the community, not just when there's news. And yeah, it really is better than I expected. For example, a lot more people clearly understand SOE's role in regards to Matrix Online and Vanguard than I thought.
Your forums are filled with locked threads, it seems discussion is taking place... only if you like what is being said.
Originally posted by johntynes
SOE means our game will be in retail stores across the country and that we can launch simultaneously in North America and Europe. SOE means a very large marketing budget to reach gamers who think playing pirates sounds fun. SOE means we don't have to learn how to do secure credit card processing. SOE means we don't have to sign away ownership of the game and that we keep most of the revenues. That's what they're bringing to the table. Neither going it alone nor any other publisher we talked to could give us all of that.
So, you are going with a company with a horrible track record for billing and distribution (check the BBB listings, they are worse than walmart.com) as a solution to billing & distribution?
Originally posted by johntynes
We've been talking to publishers for three years now. I've gone to meeting after meeting with these folks, flying all over the country. Hands down, SOE had the best offer and has the expertise in distribution and marketing that we needed.
They've botched the distribution of their own expansions for EQ2, what makes you think they will do a better job with a competitor's product?
Originally posted by johntynes
I don't expect to convince you that we made the right decision. We've lost you as a customer and that's the way it goes. But I am here explaining this stuff for the benefit of others reading these forums who are interested in our game and want to know what we're up to.
Yep... that is the way it goes. Every bad decision will cost you clients. Unfortunately, you are so star-struck with SOE's big name that you are forgetting something here. You need every sub you can get. SOE's own games are hemoraging players, and there is a growing number of people like me who are so fed up with them that we will never play another SOE title, or title associated with SOE.
If this ends up tanking, and you have to lay people off, remember what you said here... "That's the way it goes."
Some interesting points in this post, and whilst i think most of us understand the point of view you have, and for the most part a point of view we all have. Most of us having played every mmo ever released and been sorely disappointed by them for the most part.
There are some issues you seem to misunderstand. The failure of vanguard is really a failure of the people playing, not of the game. People expect too much of a game, they want everything to be easy. And because vg isn't easy they all quit and went running back to wow.
so what.. pirates looks like a interesting game, and regardless of soe being a part of publishing it or not, i for one will buy it and play it. If it sucks, i'll quit and come running back to vanguard...
I would like to pull up on some of your points tho,
""So, you are going with a company with a horrible track record for billing and distribution (check the BBB listings, they are worse than walmart.com) as a solution to billing & distribution?""
Since when has Soe ever had a poor track record for distrubution? You can download the game via the web, you can buy it from almost any shop in almost any part of the world. They have gamecards available for most mmo and multiplayer games name one company which is the equal.. blizzard certainly isn't blizz has the singularly worst patcher on the planet and patches that dont even run in cinq, if you have to do a reinstall, chances are you'll be waiting 6 hours for the patcher.. this doesnt happen with soe games. If anything Soe distrubution is the best of any pc game publishing company.
""Your forums are filled with locked threads, it seems discussion is taking place... only if you like what is being said.""
If the basic reply to the avg thread is "you suxxors" what can you expect of devs and mods to do others than lock them, personally i'd delete them and ban the trolls. Whilst it is often misunderstood that someone says something seen as negative because they're trying to point out an issue they'd like fixed is often locked..this doesnt mean the mod is in the wrong, but that the poster needs to spend longer in school to learn how to post.
LTP no, not learn to play, learn to post... hehe
As to Pirates losing you as a customer... i don't think they will, like the rest of us, i think you'll buy it, play it and make a final decision later on. You can't go through life hating Soe because you think they botched everything they ever released. You can hope that finally they won't. Lets see the game and make our decision. If not, you can come kill rats with me in Vanguard.. i haven't grouped with another player there for nearly 3 weeks.. mainly because i haven't "seen" another player in vg for that amount of time...
Everquest was the greatest game ever released. Nothing of that magnitude has been released since wow and it definately beat Eq hands down. But wow was too easy. Next time we want something to beat wow and for it to be a challenge. Lets wait and see. I like sailing in real life, i like old ships.. i like sinking pirates.. i'll be buying this.
Life is about Living, Sleep is about Dreaming, Games are about Strategy!
Actually your misinformed. You say business model being harmful to the industry. Then by your comparision or logic you should be a MONK right now living in TIBET, having nothing to do with any company. Everywhere you look a company is out to do 1 thing, and thats make money. Being misinformed that SOE is so bad for you and other people then why hasn't the Government stoped SOE from selling games in USA?? Do you smoke crack? Do you even know what your talking about? ...snip....
Okay, back to the real problems...one I am not in beta, this is a games first downfall, not one MMO has succeded with out my beta input. <this doesn't mean those that collected my beta input actually read it, but they still got it.>
Second true problem, again there are no Ninjas in your game. I can fix this too. give me a beta key and a little time in the game.
Third problem, well the collectors edition needs to come with a keg tap.
What you guys are discussing is all illegit crapola. Yes, every game SOE has taken on eventually ..what was the term? Suxxors? but is that all the fault of SOE? Ultima Online kicked butt for a few years...did SOE have a hand in it? no, and it still went ...suxxor? DAoC...did SOE kill it? nope, Anarchy? Lineage? WOW? M59? The Realm?
Point is, while there have been a lot of MMOs that have come and gone, they all eventually sucked, or we would still be playing them right? So is it really SOE that kills them, or is it Time? A game becomes boring eventually. Can you imagine trying to keep a game interesting for 10 years? No damn way! EQ went strong for well over 6 years, I know because that's when I quit playing. Did a particular exspansion ruin it, like so many claim? No..the last few exspansions did, they were all the same thing with a few new loot items, and new skins on some old mobs. Woopity fricking doo!
Same goes for every game, how long can one team make a single game go on for? Most of us are bored with life and that is why we play these games, for change, well eventually it gets to be the same old daily routine too. So what does a team do? write a whole new game every couple of years? hire new blood? then you change the whole dynamics of the game to some degree and tick off a certain class/race.
SOE has ahad it's problems, it's actually done more good then bad in my opinion. If I still had time to play like I used to, I would so pay for the all access pass from SOE, and get to play whatever I feel like that day.
Here is the real problem for games today. : you can't stop. Your wife/husband/daughter/son/aunt/uncle whatever gets sick, and you need to help take care of them...you are off the game for three days. In that three days, your usual group of friends has gaind 5 to 20 levels over you <depending on the game> now you are useless to them, they can either take the time to help level you up <again depending on the game> or they can keep going and hope you catch up.
Well unless everyone else takes a break..you aren't going to catch up.
Another problem is skills/equipment/spells/etc... the whole reason for your leveling frenzy....hmmmm level 6 ahhh look at this cool spell! I can't wait untill level 8 to see what I get next.
Well crapola, now every game is pretty much the same, so you hit level 6 and go oh cool I loved this spell when I got it in <insert game name here> oh wait this version sucks!
You want to win me over for awhile, give me a game with all new races, no high elves/wood elves/ dark elves/ humans/ dwarves/ barbarians/ gnomes/ etc... Give me 30 races to choose from, and 80 new classes to choose from, sure it's a lot to ask, but you figure rogues a lone you can do cutpurse/assasin/informant/cutthroat/backstabber/trickster/rogue/pickpocket/scout/cat burgular....got the idea? sure most seem like they would be the same thing, but give each one a set of skills or spells that are thiers alone. I can asure you, pick and 6 geeks from these forums and ask them to brainstorm a class build up/ skill set, spell set for 80 classes and we could do it in a weekend...some of them in a day. Give me a story setting, not FF12 type story, but tell me what has happend thus far in my life and why I am who I am, or give me a really creative outlet to tell my own story. not just a paper doll that I can write a bio in, but something that other people will notice and ask about. Last that I will go into for now....equipment, look at the D&D mmo and how they did equipment, and go even more individual I think armor, shields, weapons should be very personal, I want someone to ask me the story of where I got my +8 kite shield of life, but not have him be able to go out and get it the next day.
Won't these people ever learn anything SOE touches turns to shit. Look at every game in SOE's stable including Vanguard and that will tell you all you need to know about this new game coming out. It will either be unfinished, unpolished, bugged to the hilt or any number of negative things wrong with it.
Yes, it's a new game and many people will go check it out but don't be surprised if it turns out to be another Vanguard. Players know enough by now to know SoE's grubby dirty hands are all over this one and judging by their track record this one is sure to bomb too.
Another game handled by SOE? Won't these people ever learn anything SOE touches turns to shit. Look at every game in SOE's stable including Vanguard and that will tell you all you need to know about this new game coming out. It will either be unfinished, unpolished, bugged to the hilt or any number of negative things wrong with it. Yes, it's a new game and many people will go check it out but don't be surprised if it turns out to be another Vanguard. Players know enough by now to know SoE's grubby dirty hands are all over this one and judging by their track record this one is sure to bomb too.
agreed, but they wont listen bro. let them get screwed over liek the millions of the other SOE customers..
i meanr seriously if SOE was a reputable company..then guess what.. there would not be such a huge stigma on them and any company that: "oh they doing our billing servers etc" type deals, which lead to vanguardesque situations.
Other then world of warcraft name one still highly populated non-SOE game.........
WOW= blizzard not SOE..
and um SOE i guess would be EQ just b/c that was a pioneer of MMO's.
eq2 is a failure imho, tried it but they screwed over players, changed the game many times, the whole gameplay and public dupe ruined economy...
um I really cannot think of a atm successful SOE game
Read my post again...it says other then WOW name one NON-SOE game, as in name one game not ran by SOE that is still running strong other the WOW.
MMOs come and go like a monthly period these days, and none of them can hold a persons attention longer then a couple months, because none of it is new. Its all the same old crud over and over again. Imagine standing in line to watch a great new ground breaking fantasy movie and all you get is a movie about a bunch of hobnobits that have to take a bracelet to the ocean of brightwaters to dispose of it forever with the aid of thier friends lego-lass and brandolf the not so wise.
Other then world of warcraft name one still highly populated non-SOE game.........
WOW= blizzard not SOE..
and um SOE i guess would be EQ just b/c that was a pioneer of MMO's.
eq2 is a failure imho, tried it but they screwed over players, changed the game many times, the whole gameplay and public dupe ruined economy...
um I really cannot think of a atm successful SOE game
Read my post again...it says other then WOW name one NON-SOE game, as in name one game not ran by SOE that is still running strong other the WOW.
MMOs come and go like a monthly period these days, and none of them can hold a persons attention longer then a couple months, because none of it is new. Its all the same old crud over and over again. Imagine standing in line to watch a great new ground breaking fantasy movie and all you get is a movie about a bunch of hobnobits that have to take a bracelet to the ocean of brightwaters to dispose of it forever with the aid of thier friends lego-lass and brandolf the not so wise.
I do agree SOE is great at selling games, just not maintaining them. If the developers are going to actually run and moderate the game and SOE is as hands off as everyone says then this deal really maybe ok.
Some words of caution with SOE about their billing system though, many people have been continued to be billed after subscriptions cancelled (in both EQ2 and The Matrix Online, had several guild members including myself experience this problem). Also if you except a free trial from any SOE game, DO NOT enter your credit card information, as in says in very small print on an unrelated screen, that when you do so you forgo the free trial and begin pay 2 play immedieatly. The matrix online actually had a sticky thread about how this is a known issue in their system and would be resolved soon, but it was never resolved and no one who unintenially entered thier CC info got refunds, even after pointing out it was a known issue. Just some of my personal experience with SOE, and for those reasons I cant say that I would ever be thrilled to play an SOE game again.
I understand we're all human, and companies make mistakes, but Ive spoken with a lot of SOE customer service agents over the years and have never found any to be helpful or polite even when they post in their own forums its a mistake they know about and are trying to fix. I hope the developers factored that into their equations when they decided to publish with SOE, but my guess is theyve never had to deal with a complaint with SOE from the customer's point of view.
I do wanna thank the developer though for taking the time to post in this forum to stay in touch with thier community, and defend their actions. After signing with SOE, that takes a lot of balls. Sounds like a good game, please try to keep it that way.
I do agree SOE is great at selling games, just not maintaining them. If the developers are going to actually run and moderate the game and SOE is as hands off as everyone says then this deal really maybe ok. Some words of caution with SOE about their billing system though, many people have been continued to be billed after subscriptions cancelled (in both EQ2 and The Matrix Online, had several guild members including myself experience this problem). Also if you except a free trial from any SOE game, DO NOT enter your credit card information, as in says in very small print on an unrelated screen, that when you do so you forgo the free trial and begin pay 2 play immedieatly. The matrix online actually had a sticky thread about how this is a known issue in their system and would be resolved soon, but it was never resolved and no one who unintenially entered thier CC info got refunds, even after pointing out it was a known issue. Just some of my personal experience with SOE, and for those reasons I cant say that I would ever be thrilled to play an SOE game again. I understand we're all human, and companies make mistakes, but Ive spoken with a lot of SOE customer service agents over the years and have never found any to be helpful or polite even when they post in their own forums its a mistake they know about and are trying to fix. I hope the developers factored that into their equations when they decided to publish with SOE, but my guess is theyve never had to deal with a complaint with SOE from the customer's point of view. I do wanna thank the developer though for taking the time to post in this forum to stay in touch with thier community, and defend their actions. After signing with SOE, that takes a lot of balls. Sounds like a good game, please try to keep it that way.
Yeah I have heard that SOE's customer survice has got better, not that, that mattters as customer sevice is being done by FLS with help from a 3rd party.
POTBS username:yohorumrunner Guild:St George Squadron
Gonna play this one boys, can't say it will be good tho .. but it looks good enough to try.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
I am quite excited to have another game on the Acesses pass, makes the price that much more appealing.
Ah yes... the access pass. SOE's version of walmart business tactics. Swallow as many games as possible to pull as many players away from independent or smaller game studios. But I suppose in this day and age, I shouldn't be surprised how little people care about that sort of thing.
Let's see what's exactly on the Access Pass shall we? Everquest 1 - Old, extremely top heavy game that only the vets generally enjoy. Station pass is keeping it alive (as well as two, three boxers and gold farm accounts). Everquest 2- The only truely worthwhile game, the anchor game for SOE right now. SWG - Could still be great but they botched it with NGE. Actually the game is good, could use some more updating on graphics. Matrix Online - Boring ass game, all but dead, station pass keeping it on life support. Planetside - Game should be free by now, old, sad. Vanguard - Awesome game, premier content, wasn't finished due to Microsoft pulling the plug, SOE rescued it, might still be a A+ game in the future. Station Pass keeping some blood flowing to the veins. EQOA - PS2 game, nice addition there for cross-platform players, actually a good game. Station Access Games - little mini-games, stupid freebees added in.
And NOW Pirates of the Burning Sea. One of the FEW games I am looking forward to for 2007!
If SOE decides to add The Agency as well that will be a HUGE value!
Everquest 1 used to have the Legends server which would be a premium server, more GM events, etc. And people paid nearly $25.00 for it. For ONE game. With Station All Access you at least can try other games for variety. Let me tell you SOE does some stupid things sometimes, but they also do some things VERY VERY WELL! And honestly they have charted some new waters for the industry to follow and in doing so made some mistakes, but they are a good company.
I own Station Pass and I find it a better value every month.
Can't agree more. I have been personally undergoing SOE's way of customer satisfaction (feel the irony) and told myself "no more, ever". Same applies to EA, for that matter.
It's about personal pride, it's about never ever giving them one dime of my money ever again. So they have improved you say? Too bad, they had their chance(s) and they blew it, a few times.
For the record, i do that with every company that treats me like i don't matter. Be it the grocery shop, my bank, or a game company. I can only hope there will be more customers like me, because then it WILL have influence on how they need to fight to get and hold on to customers.
Currently playing browser games. Waiting for Albion Online, Citadel of Sorcery and Camelot Unchained. Played: almost all MMO pre 2007
Other then world of warcraft name one still highly populated non-SOE game.........
WOW= blizzard not SOE..
and um SOE i guess would be EQ just b/c that was a pioneer of MMO's.
eq2 is a failure imho, tried it but they screwed over players, changed the game many times, the whole gameplay and public dupe ruined economy...
um I really cannot think of a atm successful SOE game
Read my post again...it says other then WOW name one NON-SOE game, as in name one game not ran by SOE that is still running strong other the WOW.
MMOs come and go like a monthly period these days, and none of them can hold a persons attention longer then a couple months, because none of it is new. Its all the same old crud over and over again. Imagine standing in line to watch a great new ground breaking fantasy movie and all you get is a movie about a bunch of hobnobits that have to take a bracelet to the ocean of brightwaters to dispose of it forever with the aid of thier friends lego-lass and brandolf the not so wise.
entropia
Anarchy Online
Ultima Online
EVE Online
Ummm, Entropia has never been, and never will be successful. Anarchy online was so successful they had to make it all free to keep people playing, and even then the game looks so bad no one wants to play. Ultima was a good game a long time ago but most people that still play play on the illegal emulated servers. Eve online I have not played, but from what I understand is a great game, so I will agree with that one, but untill recently I wouldn't have considered it main stream, which most of SOEs game are.
"If your hatred for SOE comes from what happened to SWG you really should start to put your blame on Lucas Arts, SOE just did what they were told"
That statement is so blantantly untrue it is pathetic. Smedley made the call on NGE, noone else. Yes Lucas Arts wanted some changes, but Smedley was the facilitator. Go read Ralph Koster's site, it explains Smedley's complicity in some detail.
SOE ? Thats all I i had to read. Sorry but i'm passing on this game as well. Too bad, I was looking forward to trying it out, now i have no desire. Call me a hater blah blah blah.....SOE is not good for MMORPGS. I wish developers would stop using them.
"So aside from that, how did you enjoy the play Mrs. Lincoln?"
I totally understand that some people are just not going to play our game because of SOE. I have some hope that if we have a good launch and good word of mouth, that eventually maybe you'll give us a shot. If not, I wish you good gaming anyway.
John Tynes Producer, Pirates of the Burning Sea Flying Lab Software
"So aside from that, how did you enjoy the play Mrs. Lincoln?"
I totally understand that some people are just not going to play our game because of SOE. I have some hope that if we have a good launch and good word of mouth, that eventually maybe you'll give us a shot. If not, I wish you good gaming anyway.
John Scott Tynes
Producer
Flying Lab Software
I can assure you Mr. Tynes. I beta tested Vanguard, then played 2 months into the release. I left the game because it didn't fit me as well as I had hoped, it wasn't as unique as McQuaid had sold it to us. But I will tell you even with all the "I hate SOE" thread, and "I am not going to play this game if SOE is involved" threads, Vanguard still had a very worthwhile release. I was there. I saw it with my own eyes.
I don't think SOE is the problem with these games, I think the games are the problems with todays MMO. Trying to keep a game fresh and new feeling for several years is a challenge. Give me diversity, let my charachter be unique from everyone else, not only in looks, but skills, make sure I will have things to do even with out a group, my time to play is limited, and for me to miss a week of play and come back and the players have surpassed me by several levels, here I am all alone in the noob areas with nothing to do? this is what can kill a game.
I want to be able to log in when I want, fo however long I want and not be at the bottom of the food chain.
Originally posted by johntynes "So aside from that, how did you enjoy the play Mrs. Lincoln?"I totally understand that some people are just not going to play our game because of SOE. I have some hope that if we have a good launch and good word of mouth, that eventually maybe you'll give us a shot. If not, I wish you good gaming anyway.
"So aside from that, how did you enjoy the play Mrs. Lincoln?" I totally understand that some people are just not going to play our game because of SOE. I have some hope that if we have a good launch and good word of mouth, that eventually maybe you'll give us a shot. If not, I wish you good gaming anyway.
Good reply. Thx for wishing me well with my gaming . Enjoying LOTRO at the moment. I just dont like SOE being involved. I"m glad you understand where some of us are coming from. SOE has just done us wrong in the past and we don't trust them anymore. I don't care how people describe SOE's involvment etc. I just dont want to see SOE anywhere near my game. Simple as that. I hope you guys enjoy the game and have a blast. Arg me mateys !
Comments
Your forums are filled with locked threads, it seems discussion is taking place... only if you like what is being said.
So, you are going with a company with a horrible track record for billing and distribution (check the BBB listings, they are worse than walmart.com) as a solution to billing & distribution?
They've botched the distribution of their own expansions for EQ2, what makes you think they will do a better job with a competitor's product?
Yep... that is the way it goes. Every bad decision will cost you clients. Unfortunately, you are so star-struck with SOE's big name that you are forgetting something here. You need every sub you can get. SOE's own games are hemoraging players, and there is a growing number of people like me who are so fed up with them that we will never play another SOE title, or title associated with SOE.
If this ends up tanking, and you have to lay people off, remember what you said here... "That's the way it goes."
Some interesting points in this post, and whilst i think most of us understand the point of view you have, and for the most part a point of view we all have. Most of us having played every mmo ever released and been sorely disappointed by them for the most part.
There are some issues you seem to misunderstand. The failure of vanguard is really a failure of the people playing, not of the game. People expect too much of a game, they want everything to be easy. And because vg isn't easy they all quit and went running back to wow.
so what.. pirates looks like a interesting game, and regardless of soe being a part of publishing it or not, i for one will buy it and play it. If it sucks, i'll quit and come running back to vanguard...
I would like to pull up on some of your points tho,
""So, you are going with a company with a horrible track record for billing and distribution (check the BBB listings, they are worse than walmart.com) as a solution to billing & distribution?""
Since when has Soe ever had a poor track record for distrubution? You can download the game via the web, you can buy it from almost any shop in almost any part of the world. They have gamecards available for most mmo and multiplayer games name one company which is the equal.. blizzard certainly isn't blizz has the singularly worst patcher on the planet and patches that dont even run in cinq, if you have to do a reinstall, chances are you'll be waiting 6 hours for the patcher.. this doesnt happen with soe games. If anything Soe distrubution is the best of any pc game publishing company.
""Your forums are filled with locked threads, it seems discussion is taking place... only if you like what is being said.""
If the basic reply to the avg thread is "you suxxors" what can you expect of devs and mods to do others than lock them, personally i'd delete them and ban the trolls. Whilst it is often misunderstood that someone says something seen as negative because they're trying to point out an issue they'd like fixed is often locked..this doesnt mean the mod is in the wrong, but that the poster needs to spend longer in school to learn how to post.
LTP no, not learn to play, learn to post... hehe
As to Pirates losing you as a customer... i don't think they will, like the rest of us, i think you'll buy it, play it and make a final decision later on. You can't go through life hating Soe because you think they botched everything they ever released. You can hope that finally they won't. Lets see the game and make our decision. If not, you can come kill rats with me in Vanguard.. i haven't grouped with another player there for nearly 3 weeks.. mainly because i haven't "seen" another player in vg for that amount of time...
Everquest was the greatest game ever released. Nothing of that magnitude has been released since wow and it definately beat Eq hands down. But wow was too easy. Next time we want something to beat wow and for it to be a challenge. Lets wait and see. I like sailing in real life, i like old ships.. i like sinking pirates.. i'll be buying this.
Life is about Living, Sleep is about Dreaming, Games are about Strategy!
That would be cool.. everyone sneakin about assassinating each other...like rogue wars in wow...only problem tho, is ninjas make poor sailors..
Life is about Living, Sleep is about Dreaming, Games are about Strategy!
Uh, wait that wasn't the question, right?
Okay, back to the real problems...one I am not in beta, this is a games first downfall, not one MMO has succeded with out my beta input. <this doesn't mean those that collected my beta input actually read it, but they still got it.>
Second true problem, again there are no Ninjas in your game. I can fix this too. give me a beta key and a little time in the game.
Third problem, well the collectors edition needs to come with a keg tap.
What you guys are discussing is all illegit crapola. Yes, every game SOE has taken on eventually ..what was the term? Suxxors? but is that all the fault of SOE? Ultima Online kicked butt for a few years...did SOE have a hand in it? no, and it still went ...suxxor? DAoC...did SOE kill it? nope, Anarchy? Lineage? WOW? M59? The Realm?
Point is, while there have been a lot of MMOs that have come and gone, they all eventually sucked, or we would still be playing them right? So is it really SOE that kills them, or is it Time? A game becomes boring eventually. Can you imagine trying to keep a game interesting for 10 years? No damn way! EQ went strong for well over 6 years, I know because that's when I quit playing. Did a particular exspansion ruin it, like so many claim? No..the last few exspansions did, they were all the same thing with a few new loot items, and new skins on some old mobs. Woopity fricking doo!
Same goes for every game, how long can one team make a single game go on for? Most of us are bored with life and that is why we play these games, for change, well eventually it gets to be the same old daily routine too. So what does a team do? write a whole new game every couple of years? hire new blood? then you change the whole dynamics of the game to some degree and tick off a certain class/race.
SOE has ahad it's problems, it's actually done more good then bad in my opinion. If I still had time to play like I used to, I would so pay for the all access pass from SOE, and get to play whatever I feel like that day.
Here is the real problem for games today. : you can't stop. Your wife/husband/daughter/son/aunt/uncle whatever gets sick, and you need to help take care of them...you are off the game for three days. In that three days, your usual group of friends has gaind 5 to 20 levels over you <depending on the game> now you are useless to them, they can either take the time to help level you up <again depending on the game> or they can keep going and hope you catch up.
Well unless everyone else takes a break..you aren't going to catch up.
Another problem is skills/equipment/spells/etc... the whole reason for your leveling frenzy....hmmmm level 6 ahhh look at this cool spell! I can't wait untill level 8 to see what I get next.
Well crapola, now every game is pretty much the same, so you hit level 6 and go oh cool I loved this spell when I got it in <insert game name here> oh wait this version sucks!
You want to win me over for awhile, give me a game with all new races, no high elves/wood elves/ dark elves/ humans/ dwarves/ barbarians/ gnomes/ etc... Give me 30 races to choose from, and 80 new classes to choose from, sure it's a lot to ask, but you figure rogues a lone you can do cutpurse/assasin/informant/cutthroat/backstabber/trickster/rogue/pickpocket/scout/cat burgular....got the idea? sure most seem like they would be the same thing, but give each one a set of skills or spells that are thiers alone. I can asure you, pick and 6 geeks from these forums and ask them to brainstorm a class build up/ skill set, spell set for 80 classes and we could do it in a weekend...some of them in a day. Give me a story setting, not FF12 type story, but tell me what has happend thus far in my life and why I am who I am, or give me a really creative outlet to tell my own story. not just a paper doll that I can write a bio in, but something that other people will notice and ask about. Last that I will go into for now....equipment, look at the D&D mmo and how they did equipment, and go even more individual I think armor, shields, weapons should be very personal, I want someone to ask me the story of where I got my +8 kite shield of life, but not have him be able to go out and get it the next day.
Not so nice guy!
Another game handled by SOE?
Won't these people ever learn anything SOE touches turns to shit. Look at every game in SOE's stable including Vanguard and that will tell you all you need to know about this new game coming out. It will either be unfinished, unpolished, bugged to the hilt or any number of negative things wrong with it.
Yes, it's a new game and many people will go check it out but don't be surprised if it turns out to be another Vanguard. Players know enough by now to know SoE's grubby dirty hands are all over this one and judging by their track record this one is sure to bomb too.
i meanr seriously if SOE was a reputable company..then guess what.. there would not be such a huge stigma on them and any company that: "oh they doing our billing servers etc" type deals, which lead to vanguardesque situations.
Other then world of warcraft name one still highly populated non-SOE game.........
Not so nice guy!
and um SOE i guess would be EQ just b/c that was a pioneer of MMO's.
eq2 is a failure imho, tried it but they screwed over players, changed the game many times, the whole gameplay and public dupe ruined economy...
um I really cannot think of a atm successful SOE game
and um SOE i guess would be EQ just b/c that was a pioneer of MMO's.
eq2 is a failure imho, tried it but they screwed over players, changed the game many times, the whole gameplay and public dupe ruined economy...
um I really cannot think of a atm successful SOE game
Read my post again...it says other then WOW name one NON-SOE game, as in name one game not ran by SOE that is still running strong other the WOW.MMOs come and go like a monthly period these days, and none of them can hold a persons attention longer then a couple months, because none of it is new. Its all the same old crud over and over again. Imagine standing in line to watch a great new ground breaking fantasy movie and all you get is a movie about a bunch of hobnobits that have to take a bracelet to the ocean of brightwaters to dispose of it forever with the aid of thier friends lego-lass and brandolf the not so wise.
Not so nice guy!
and um SOE i guess would be EQ just b/c that was a pioneer of MMO's.
eq2 is a failure imho, tried it but they screwed over players, changed the game many times, the whole gameplay and public dupe ruined economy...
um I really cannot think of a atm successful SOE game
Read my post again...it says other then WOW name one NON-SOE game, as in name one game not ran by SOE that is still running strong other the WOW.MMOs come and go like a monthly period these days, and none of them can hold a persons attention longer then a couple months, because none of it is new. Its all the same old crud over and over again. Imagine standing in line to watch a great new ground breaking fantasy movie and all you get is a movie about a bunch of hobnobits that have to take a bracelet to the ocean of brightwaters to dispose of it forever with the aid of thier friends lego-lass and brandolf the not so wise.
entropia
Anarchy Online
Ultima Online
EVE Online
I do agree SOE is great at selling games, just not maintaining them. If the developers are going to actually run and moderate the game and SOE is as hands off as everyone says then this deal really maybe ok.
Some words of caution with SOE about their billing system though, many people have been continued to be billed after subscriptions cancelled (in both EQ2 and The Matrix Online, had several guild members including myself experience this problem). Also if you except a free trial from any SOE game, DO NOT enter your credit card information, as in says in very small print on an unrelated screen, that when you do so you forgo the free trial and begin pay 2 play immedieatly. The matrix online actually had a sticky thread about how this is a known issue in their system and would be resolved soon, but it was never resolved and no one who unintenially entered thier CC info got refunds, even after pointing out it was a known issue. Just some of my personal experience with SOE, and for those reasons I cant say that I would ever be thrilled to play an SOE game again.
I understand we're all human, and companies make mistakes, but Ive spoken with a lot of SOE customer service agents over the years and have never found any to be helpful or polite even when they post in their own forums its a mistake they know about and are trying to fix. I hope the developers factored that into their equations when they decided to publish with SOE, but my guess is theyve never had to deal with a complaint with SOE from the customer's point of view.
I do wanna thank the developer though for taking the time to post in this forum to stay in touch with thier community, and defend their actions. After signing with SOE, that takes a lot of balls. Sounds like a good game, please try to keep it that way.
Yeah I have heard that SOE's customer survice has got better, not that, that mattters as customer sevice is being done by FLS with help from a 3rd party.
POTBS username:yohorumrunner
Guild:St George Squadron
Gonna play this one boys, can't say it will be good tho .. but it looks good enough to try.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Ah yes... the access pass. SOE's version of walmart business tactics. Swallow as many games as possible to pull as many players away from independent or smaller game studios. But I suppose in this day and age, I shouldn't be surprised how little people care about that sort of thing.
Let's see what's exactly on the Access Pass shall we? Everquest 1 - Old, extremely top heavy game that only the vets generally enjoy. Station pass is keeping it alive (as well as two, three boxers and gold farm accounts). Everquest 2 - The only truely worthwhile game, the anchor game for SOE right now. SWG - Could still be great but they botched it with NGE. Actually the game is good, could use some more updating on graphics. Matrix Online - Boring ass game, all but dead, station pass keeping it on life support. Planetside - Game should be free by now, old, sad. Vanguard - Awesome game, premier content, wasn't finished due to Microsoft pulling the plug, SOE rescued it, might still be a A+ game in the future. Station Pass keeping some blood flowing to the veins. EQOA - PS2 game, nice addition there for cross-platform players, actually a good game. Station Access Games - little mini-games, stupid freebees added in.
And NOW Pirates of the Burning Sea. One of the FEW games I am looking forward to for 2007!
If SOE decides to add The Agency as well that will be a HUGE value!
Everquest 1 used to have the Legends server which would be a premium server, more GM events, etc. And people paid nearly $25.00 for it. For ONE game. With Station All Access you at least can try other games for variety. Let me tell you SOE does some stupid things sometimes, but they also do some things VERY VERY WELL! And honestly they have charted some new waters for the industry to follow and in doing so made some mistakes, but they are a good company.
I own Station Pass and I find it a better value every month.
I
SOE , i even have a SOE coffee cup! GO Sony go! 
Can't agree more. I have been personally undergoing SOE's way of customer satisfaction (feel the irony) and told myself "no more, ever". Same applies to EA, for that matter.
It's about personal pride, it's about never ever giving them one dime of my money ever again. So they have improved you say? Too bad, they had their chance(s) and they blew it, a few times.
For the record, i do that with every company that treats me like i don't matter. Be it the grocery shop, my bank, or a game company. I can only hope there will be more customers like me, because then it WILL have influence on how they need to fight to get and hold on to customers.
Currently playing browser games. Waiting for Albion Online, Citadel of Sorcery and Camelot Unchained.
Played: almost all MMO pre 2007
and um SOE i guess would be EQ just b/c that was a pioneer of MMO's.
eq2 is a failure imho, tried it but they screwed over players, changed the game many times, the whole gameplay and public dupe ruined economy...
um I really cannot think of a atm successful SOE game
Read my post again...it says other then WOW name one NON-SOE game, as in name one game not ran by SOE that is still running strong other the WOW.MMOs come and go like a monthly period these days, and none of them can hold a persons attention longer then a couple months, because none of it is new. Its all the same old crud over and over again. Imagine standing in line to watch a great new ground breaking fantasy movie and all you get is a movie about a bunch of hobnobits that have to take a bracelet to the ocean of brightwaters to dispose of it forever with the aid of thier friends lego-lass and brandolf the not so wise.
entropia
Anarchy Online
Ultima Online
EVE Online
Ummm, Entropia has never been, and never will be successful. Anarchy online was so successful they had to make it all free to keep people playing, and even then the game looks so bad no one wants to play. Ultima was a good game a long time ago but most people that still play play on the illegal emulated servers. Eve online I have not played, but from what I understand is a great game, so I will agree with that one, but untill recently I wouldn't have considered it main stream, which most of SOEs game are.
Not so nice guy!
"If your hatred for SOE comes from what happened to SWG you really should start to put your blame on Lucas Arts, SOE just did what they were told"
That statement is so blantantly untrue it is pathetic. Smedley made the call on NGE, noone else. Yes Lucas Arts wanted some changes, but Smedley was the facilitator. Go read Ralph Koster's site, it explains Smedley's complicity in some detail.
SOE ? Thats all I i had to read. Sorry but i'm passing on this game as well. Too bad, I was looking forward to trying it out, now i have no desire. Call me a hater blah blah blah.....SOE is not good for MMORPGS. I wish developers would stop using them.
"So aside from that, how did you enjoy the play Mrs. Lincoln?"
I totally understand that some people are just not going to play our game because of SOE. I have some hope that if we have a good launch and good word of mouth, that eventually maybe you'll give us a shot. If not, I wish you good gaming anyway.
John Tynes
Producer, Pirates of the Burning Sea
Flying Lab Software
I don't think SOE is the problem with these games, I think the games are the problems with todays MMO. Trying to keep a game fresh and new feeling for several years is a challenge. Give me diversity, let my charachter be unique from everyone else, not only in looks, but skills, make sure I will have things to do even with out a group, my time to play is limited, and for me to miss a week of play and come back and the players have surpassed me by several levels, here I am all alone in the noob areas with nothing to do? this is what can kill a game.
I want to be able to log in when I want, fo however long I want and not be at the bottom of the food chain.
Not so nice guy!
per aspera ad astra.
Gimme a good game and I ´ll play it.
So much couth. Again, you guys rule.
so...
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Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Good reply. Thx for wishing me well with my gaming
. Enjoying LOTRO at the moment. I just dont like SOE being involved. I"m glad you understand where some of us are coming from. SOE has just done us wrong in the past and we don't trust them anymore. I don't care how people describe SOE's involvment etc. I just dont want to see SOE anywhere near my game. Simple as that. I hope you guys enjoy the game and have a blast. Arg me mateys !