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Still waiting
Mischiff
Member Posts: 169
Ive been following this game since 05 and each vague release date goes by with no release. Its now the middle of 07 and there is no way that HJ is going to be released this year. WAR is already talking about beta's and they have an 08 release date, HJ hasnt even talked beta, or gotten their webpage finished yet ..
I am so looking forward to this game and am willing to wait for a finished product, but would really appreciate them being a lot more realistic when announcing a release date.
Comments
Thats why companies don't like to use release dates but players whine and whine and whine for a release date. So they give one and then the game gets pushed back and players whine and whine some more. It's really a loose / loose situation for the game companies.
-Currently looking forward to FFXIV
-Currently playing EvE and Global Agenda
We also know where in the development cycle they are. They just sold off there engine to several companies and said the next few months would be quite as they got back to fulltime work on the actually game. Not that it ever came to a stand still. Apparently they just
sold the engine to another company as well. Just saw that on the frontpage
Simu has been fairly transparent as to how things are going and I appreciate that
Just to add a one liner, it is also probable that the Beta for HJ will not be like many others due to the GM mechanism. I am expecting that due to the way in which areas are created with a lot of care and effort the content will be A ok and need no Beta other than load tests.
Roll on HJ comon!!
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Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
I don't understand why you think a game that has taken so long and progressed so little in that time is a sign of care in its production? I would think it will need a longer beta than most.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Since BioWare pick their engine, I have a total confidence this MMO will be very interesting and it will release...eventually.
I don't follow it developpment much, since I don't feel confident in the immediate release. We may be assisting to the longest developped game ever. It will at the very least be interesting when it hit the market, maybe it will be extremely good and nice, but at worst, it will be quite interesting to experience it, and maybe open a few minds on some stuff.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
I don't know that it's the longest developed game ever. WoW took 5 years to develop, I don't know about any other game, and HJ is now on it's 5th year of development I believe. Some will say that this has been in development longer but that is incorrect. Simu was working on another project called HJ and scrapped it. Same name but different game.
So let's say that this game comes out next year and thus takes 6 years to develop. I don't think that's too bad when you consider that again, WoW took 5 years to develop and it doesn't have anywhere close to the depth or detail that HJ will. Not to mention that Simu created their own engine and Blizzard just used the same engine that was used for EQ. There is a lot more work going into this game, and well worth it I might add, than most MMO's on the market. However long it takes it will be worth the wait.
I don't understand why you think a game that has taken so long and progressed so little in that time is a sign of care in its production? I would think it will need a longer beta than most.
No not at all, the modular way in which this is being developed lends itself to a lesser test cycle. The Hero Engine has been tested and is robust to the extent that this lends to more acurate implimentation content when created via the Engine. Just look at the Engine to see how far this has progressed, Simutronics are doing the right thing no pandering and getting on with their job which is to recruit more content developers writers and GMs'.
With the companys expansion new offices and additional licenceing of the H Engine I would say things are moving along just fine. The concept of HJ in a MMORPG has been around a while but all the major development hav been over the last 2 yrs.
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Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
The GM corps and modularity might reduce some of the need for an extensive Beta, but if they are foolish enough to go with a minimal beta as you are suggesting, they're going to deserve the flop that the game will be. No software, no matter how well built, can be adequately tested "in house" -- there are just too many things that the populace will do to it, when thousands and thousands of people hammer on the software, that the developers and GMs would never think to even try. That exposure to a large group, and giving that large group the time to really pound on the software, is the difference between buggy and bug-free code.
Not to mention, you need thousands of people to test your game on lots of different hardware configs... you don't want it just tested on a few hardware configs, because there is such a potential for conflict.
I'm sorry but if they don't seriously beta test this thing, it will go the way of Vanguard.
C
You can't be serious. WoW had a more tha $80 million budget. I would be surprised if HJ has more than a few million. WoW was a complete world that had a ton of content, enough to keep 9 million people happy. We haven't seen enough of HJ to fill up an index card. Heck, they can't even fill up their own website.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Thats supposition of course Amathe. We do know from there tech demos that they had some rather large regions done. Obviously there lousy at putting information about there game out though. Then again Simutronics has always been tight lipped. I think its also a bit deceptive to say this games been in development for as long as some people suppose. Since the first version was scrapped entirely the game we see is part of another development cycle.
In anycase I don't seriously know if this game will make it out or not. Its certainly no less possible then many other games. Also as others mentioned if the engine is being used then obviously they have something concrete to work with. Lets just hope they open up again with more information. Last I heard was it would be 3 or 4 months before we heard more. That was 2 months ago though.. still trying to dig up that post though..
Saying budget doesn't help a case on "it taking too long" either. Lower budget equals longer time to take because of less resources. However! It is not as if Simutronics has no income, and it does have plenty of free help. The only problem with the free help system is that you can't quite force those people to work harder than they want. At least the free help is skilled as they all have to pass tests and interviews.
Information and updates would be nice.. Simutronics really does need to work on its pr, but as is it is non-existent.
Screaming "it's never coming" or "stop it, it is" wont help anyone. Why don't we all just wait and let time tell? If it bugs someone waiting, then move on to another game and come back later.
I know I switched around a bit there. Mind seems to always move from one statement to another!
The game will be fantastic, I have a friend who is associated with SImu. The slow development pace doesn't bother me but from what I am told people will be very impressed.If he didn't live over the Ocean I'd be able to see for myself
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Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
You can't be serious. WoW had a more tha $80 million budget. I would be surprised if HJ has more than a few million. WoW was a complete world that had a ton of content, enough to keep 9 million people happy. We haven't seen enough of HJ to fill up an index card. Heck, they can't even fill up their own website.
You're the one that can't be serious. Budget doesn't equal greatness. Remember the movie Waterworld? A 200 million dollar budget and was a bomb of a movie. Yet a movie like The Blair Witch Project that had a minscule budget won numerous awards. So don't use budget as an example.
And what kind of content in WoW are you talking about? You mean the same meaningless quests in every area. Kill X number of baddies. Gather Y number of Z items. Go to the next area, rinse lather repeat. That's not content, that's boredom. The structures are bland. Every night elf building looks the same no matter what location it's in. Same for the structures for every other race. The character creation is among the worst in the business. That's not going to be the case in HJ. There is more depth in the HJ demo at E3 from two years ago than there is in WoW. The character creation, the battle system(specifically the spell system) and the interactive enviorments in the demo alone far exceed what's in WoW. I can't wait to see the finished product.
You can't be serious. WoW had a more tha $80 million budget. I would be surprised if HJ has more than a few million. WoW was a complete world that had a ton of content, enough to keep 9 million people happy. We haven't seen enough of HJ to fill up an index card. Heck, they can't even fill up their own website.
You're the one that can't be serious. Budget doesn't equal greatness. Remember the movie Waterworld? A 200 million dollar budget and was a bomb of a movie. Yet a movie like The Blair Witch Project that had a minscule budget won numerous awards. So don't use budget as an example.
And what kind of content in WoW are you talking about? You mean the same meaningless quests in every area. Kill X number of baddies. Gather Y number of Z items. Go to the next area, rinse lather repeat. That's not content, that's boredom. The structures are bland. Every night elf building looks the same no matter what location it's in. Same for the structures for every other race. The character creation is among the worst in the business. That's not going to be the case in HJ. There is more depth in the HJ demo at E3 from two years ago than there is in WoW. The character creation, the battle system(specifically the spell system) and the interactive enviorments in the demo alone far exceed what's in WoW. I can't wait to see the finished product.
This is rather funny. I point to the most successful mmo in history, that has 9 million players, and you say it's complete crap (not to mention totally misrepresenting its features). Then you say that a game that isn't made yet will be perfect and superior in every way. Ok, I admit I can't point to a real game that is better than the one in your imagination.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
How am I misrepresenting it's features Amathe? The quests are the same boring crap no matter what area you're in and the structures are repetitive. That's a fact. Not opinion. Care to prove me wrong? Then give some examples which you never ever do in any post about any topic. I've never ever said that HJ will be perfect but if you don't think it's going to far exceed games like WoW in terms of depth and detail then you obviously don't know anything about the game. All you have to do is look at the video from E3 to see how much depth is going to be in the game.
As for beta, they will have a standard beta. Why waste GMs on testing the game when they could be fixing the problems the actual beta team finds?
When they were doing the upgrade to Gemstone IV, they still had a standard open and closed beta. I don't see any reason why they wouldn't have one with HJ. With GS's beta, you would log in, and a GM would come down and put you where he wanted you to test and you would test what he wanted. He would just have 3-4 people testing the same things with all the ingridents needed on the ground, a sign for instructions, and watch for any problems. 20 GMs doing that at once with 200 beta testers gets a lot done.
Personally, I am looking forward to the came, but not 'on the edge of one's sear' so to speak, and it doesn't especially bother me that the release date is a while off (even though they haven't actually given one yet).
I do not think that the game is just not going to release - from what I know of Simu, it will - but I also think that they are the type of company that aren't really going to say something until they are pretty sure that it is going to happen, and I respect that. After all, complaining about it isn't going to help
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"Friends may come and go, but enemies accumulate"
Looking forward to: Aion
Played: WoW, Guild Wars
It's alright to dislike a game. It's alright to want HJ more than any other game. The fact is though that insulting another game with exaggerated facts wont make anyone listen to the fans of Hero's Journey. It will just get he partially justified stigma of "they are a bunch of blind sheep" into people's heads.
This is rather funny. I point to the most successful mmo in history, that has 9 million players, and you say it's complete crap (not to mention totally misrepresenting its features). Then you say that a game that isn't made yet will be perfect and superior in every way. Ok, I admit I can't point to a real game that is better than the one in your imagination.It's alright to dislike a game. It's alright to want HJ more than any other game. The fact is though that insulting another game with exaggerated facts wont make anyone listen to the fans of Hero's Journey. It will just get he partially justified stigma of "they are a bunch of blind sheep" into people's heads.
Amathes' reputation regarding HJ is trashy to say the best so any post from that source is pretty much a waste of space. Regarding HJ well it will be a little more refined than WOW just in the respect of the company that has produced it.
I know the the majority of any population is not that blessed with intelect to the level of the minority or put another way a minority is a lot more inteligent than the majority. WOW falls into the majority category, easy to play ... mindless stress free ... other than the End Game RAID which is full of muppets fighting over loot.(And yes I did Max a Hunter out and raid for a few weeks and then quit , damn did i just admit that). WOW is designed to a model and acheived a goal of making lots and lots of cash but not a lot more it shows no inovation whatsoever and panders to all that is bad withion current MMOs (anything released in the last 3 yrs).
So what the poster says above is pretty accurate regarding WOW and not detrimental to him in any way. It fits a demographic that is generally short of the brain cells required to entertain anything bordering on complex!!!
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Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
It's alright to dislike a game. It's alright to want HJ more than any other game. The fact is though that insulting another game with exaggerated facts wont make anyone listen to the fans of Hero's Journey. It will just get he partially justified stigma of "they are a bunch of blind sheep" into people's heads.
If WoW's character creation isn't among the worst then it shows how bad the genre really is right now. I've played FFXI so I have to disagree with you. WoW's character creation isn't any better. WoW is like the Super Mario Brothers of MMORPG's. Both are popular but neither are great games. The only difference is that console developers actually try to make better games instead of copying Super Mario Brothers. Unfortunately for the MMORPG genre there have been too many companies trying to copy WoW and that's been horrible for the genre. All they care about is making money instead of making great games. Fortunately Simu is actually putting some effort into their game and making an original game instead of putting out yet another clone.
Whats funny is they arent copying wow, they are copying EQ which is what WoW did.....
And so far i have never been disapointed with any Simu game, DR and GS3 and even Hurc&Xena were all very fun complex innovative games. Though i do admit i love GS3 cause i think the rolemaster system is awesome
In terms of ability to make your character look different form everyone else's, WoW's character creation is better than FFXI's. I'm talking about at the character screen, looks wise when I say that. If someone considers jobs and such, I suppose they get more evened up with FFXI having multiclassing and WoW having talents. Personal preferences would say which is better at that point, but WoW has more character look combinations at the character creation screen than Final Fantasy XI.
But we aren't here to talk about a game that has nothing to do with HJ. They're not alike in any way I can think of so there isn't a reason. Different company structure, different engines, different starts, different thinking.. They will attract different people (and no, I'm not sorting out the human population by brain cell count). Who they attract doesn't make anyone bad or anything, it means people, thankfully, think differently and want different things. It's what keeps niche things alive and viable and I will continue to talk to game design classmates about WoW and HJ on equal but unique terms.
Now! I know all these people are getting antsy because of no Hero's Journey coming out and other games saying they will be soon... But I have this strange feeling some of these other games will be getting delayed to next year and they'll all be released around HJ closer than people think. Maybe I'm wrong, but my intuition says it.
I'm not here to defend WoW, or promote WoW over HJ. WoW is the king of the hill in the mmo market and doesn't need me to defend it.
But I do make this one observation. When Sigil fell apart, one of their employees said something insightful. To paraphrase, he said that Sigil spent too much time distancing themselves from WoW and trying to be the anti-WoW, when what they should have been doing is learning from its popularity and functionality. Personally, if Simu actually makes this game, I think they will be smarter than Sigil and not make the same mistake. But if they do make that mistake - and it would be a HUGE mistake - that's on them.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Frankly I think that's rubbish, no personal offence meant. WoW is an average game (some would argue below average and frankly after level 40 I'd agree), but it does two things right. One it's basic with a fun level 1 to 40 "My First MMO" start which it needs to be because of it's main selling point number two, it's Warcraft. Millions on millions of b.net players joined the MMORPG market because of Warcraft, if WoW hadn't have been Warcraft they would never ever have played ever, just about all of them thought that WoW was either the first MMORPG or that it was original in it's gameplay (like Blizzard could ever be original in their gameplay). Yes, lots of MMORPG players played WoW but that isn't where WoW got its playerbase, if this had been the case there wouldn't be any other MMORPGs other than WoW to play because WoWs numbers grew so massive all the other games would have shut down.
It doesn't matter how much like WoW they made Vanguard, it would never have been a massive hit. Think about what you're saying Amathe, WoW didn't do anything new and making a game that's anything like WoW will not bring you a massive WoW size player base. LOTRO is proof of that, I believe it's healthy but it can't even come close to WoW for numbers. It just doesn't have that "mustz playz teh computer gamez to deth and pnwz the noobz" b.net following that Warcraft has, off the top of my head I really can't think of any other non-Blizzard IP that does. Not even Warhammer.
Forgive any spelling etc, it's late here