With over 9 mill subs it is obvious you will run into all kinds of people, and while I do agree that there is immaturity and idots running around in WoW they are irl too, you wouldnt get along with everyone irl either, its like saying theres so many younglings and kids tv shows life sucks! In the long run all you got to do is find a guild of people who you get along with, there are plenty of mature guilds in WoW who treat one another with respect, and handle things in a mature way. If you are in a Mickey Mouse guild thats Chuck Norris infested and dont like it, what can I tell you dont blame wow for that, you just didnt look hard enough to find your guild. Also the ignore feature works really well, and its done wonders for me
A man dies daily, only to be reborn in the morning, bigger, better and wiser.
-Playing AoC -Playing WoW -Retired- SWG -Retired- EVE -Retired- LotR
Computer (- Phenom 9600 Black Edition @ 2.81 Ghz (Quad Core CPU)- Gigabyte MA790FX-DS5 - 4 Gigs of PC 8500 ram (1066)- EVGA GeForce 8800 GTS PCI Express 2.0 - WD 500GB 7500RPM - Zalman CPU cooler (air cooled) - 24" Widescreen 1080P HD display).
I have 4 level 70's in WoW and 0 level 70's in EQ2... Guess which game I like better? Not all reviews are biased in the way the OP describes, atleast not mine. Personally, my reviews are only biased, if anything, by the community surrounding and found in the game.
Well wait till you get to 70 and maybe you'll be in a position to judge both games fairly. If EQ2 keeps your attention for 879+ hours (taken from your Xfire sig), then you'll have a solid base of comparison. But like Kyleran and others before you, you've SPENT A METRIC CRAPTON OF TIME IN WOW (even though, that's not a lot of time for many players tbh), and now that you've exhausted the fun from it, you're bitter. I honestly don't see you spending the same amount of time in another MMO.
This is the big irony of many people that bash WoW. They've probably played it more than anything else.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Since there is no way to see the number of people who tried WoW and found it lacking, how do you know that they are the minority????
Plus, im one of those "9 Million" active accounts and i dont like the game that much (I think it is far from the best), i keep the account open so my daughter can play (rarely). And for her it is more of a chat room with graphics. God im wasting my money.
Because we didnt know that there were 9 million people who played MMOs up until now, not to mention all the other people who play other MMOs who combined dont even add up anywhere close to 9 million, so therefore an educated assumption is made that it is the minority who doesnt play and if you think about it, it does make sense. And dont expect to get anything thats a fact from this site either, compared to WoW this site only has 7% or so as far as members go, and from what I have noticed most people here are burned out from their MMO and come here to talk about games and alot of the times even bash the game they once enjoyed because it is not fun for them anymore. Clearly not every game is for every player. even though wow is a very succesful MMO which I do like I do believe that some people dont like it because it doesnt fit their style of play, and thats perfectly fine, thats why we live in a World of choices, so we can pick the ones that suit us best.
A man dies daily, only to be reborn in the morning, bigger, better and wiser.
-Playing AoC -Playing WoW -Retired- SWG -Retired- EVE -Retired- LotR
Computer (- Phenom 9600 Black Edition @ 2.81 Ghz (Quad Core CPU)- Gigabyte MA790FX-DS5 - 4 Gigs of PC 8500 ram (1066)- EVGA GeForce 8800 GTS PCI Express 2.0 - WD 500GB 7500RPM - Zalman CPU cooler (air cooled) - 24" Widescreen 1080P HD display).
Here is a question for you: Since there is no way to see the number of people who tried WoW and found it lacking, how do you know that they are the minority????
Plus, im one of those "9 Million" active accounts and i dont like the game that much (I think it is far from the best), i keep the account open so my daughter can play (rarely). And for her it is more of a chat room with graphics. God im wasting my money.
So.... you want to tell me there are 9 million+ people that tried wow and did not like it?
Well, then where are they? how come none of the other mmorpg got such a huge influx of people? they all went back to single player games and never came back?
do you think there are 10 millions of bitter wow haters out there? if you answer "yes!" I think Smedly will want you on board at SoE at marketing.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
i can only say that WoW does NOT HAVE anymore 9 mil player's , Blizz lied from the start they had like allmost 8 mil or something like that and about the majority playing WoW .. please don't make me laugh , everyone know's the best gamers from the world are asian ppl , and WoW is allmost dead there . Why not ppl dosen't admit that WoW is a very simple game but when you first look at it it give's you the impresion that is some uber complexe .. neah .. it's crap .. what is WoW all about ? farm and runing around with some flag on your back in some BG.Great PvE / PvP .. yeah .. it's Unreal Tournament or Quake with bow's / dagger's / sword's / etc.
But i whant to thank Blizz for keeping all the kindergarden kid's in this game !
Here is a question for you: Since there is no way to see the number of people who tried WoW and found it lacking, how do you know that they are the minority????
Plus, im one of those "9 Million" active accounts and i dont like the game that much (I think it is far from the best), i keep the account open so my daughter can play (rarely). And for her it is more of a chat room with graphics. God im wasting my money.
So.... you want to tell me there are 9 million+ people that tried wow and did not like it?
Well, then where are they? how come none of the other mmorpg got such a huge influx of people? they all went back to single player games and never came back?
do you think there are 10 millions of bitter wow haters out there? if you answer "yes!" I think Smedly will want you on board at SoE at marketing.
1. No, i dont know if there are 9 million people who tried WoW and dont like it, probably not. But neither you, or anyone else knows that there isnt. Which is my point. I have seen the 9 million subscribers number, i have also seen the numbers that state that 8 million of those are from Asia. I have no idea how many asians are upset with WoW and if they are what game they are playing.
2. SOE doesnt do marketing so i probably wont be getting the job.
i can only say that WoW does NOT HAVE anymore 9 mil player's , Blizz lied from the start they had like allmost 8 mil or something like that and about the majority playing WoW .. please don't make me laugh , everyone know's the best gamers from the world are asian ppl , and WoW is allmost dead there . Why not ppl dosen't admit that WoW is a very simple game but when you first look at it it give's you the impresion that is some uber complexe .. neah .. it's crap .. what is WoW all about ? farm and runing around with some flag on your back in some BG.Great PvE / PvP .. yeah .. it's Unreal Tournament or Quake with bow's / dagger's / sword's / etc.
But i whant to thank Blizz for keeping all the kindergarden kid's in this game !
yea yea Blizzard lied, please people stop with the conspiracy theories, thats retarded. Those are proven facts no one can claim something like that without showing for it.
A man dies daily, only to be reborn in the morning, bigger, better and wiser.
-Playing AoC -Playing WoW -Retired- SWG -Retired- EVE -Retired- LotR
Computer (- Phenom 9600 Black Edition @ 2.81 Ghz (Quad Core CPU)- Gigabyte MA790FX-DS5 - 4 Gigs of PC 8500 ram (1066)- EVGA GeForce 8800 GTS PCI Express 2.0 - WD 500GB 7500RPM - Zalman CPU cooler (air cooled) - 24" Widescreen 1080P HD display).
So in order for us to actually have what you call a 'proper' game we must have put in several years into world of warcraft and levelled up ot seventy before we even can comment even though at sixty you've pretty much experienced the whole game already?.... What a joke, this is why I don't bother responding to fanbois of this game anymore, they're as bad as some NGErs I come across and there's only ONE in that game that I actually respected because even he admitted that he thinks the game needs a lot of work. World of Warcraft won't go down easy I'll admit, but it'll still go down, naming a couple, Vanguard was supposed to be big but never got picked up properly in development, Star Wars Galaxies was ruined because the developer was an arse who ignored the playerbase entirely ended up running the game on the skeleton crew.
In my opinion, Blizzard is going the way of SOE, they're ignoring the playerbase entirely, giving no responses at all and putting themselves in a position where they are hard to reach by putting idiot Gamemasters and Community Managers who's job is only to lock threads and write smart arse comments forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html which basically just point players in the direction as if they're a problem they're not willing to deal with.
If you can't accept that, then it's your own damn fault, the games just going to stay the way it is because the majority of the fanbase is just a bunch of "Yes please bring in that patch" people not only that I believe the player base was actually planning on bringing in guild halls and housing or something of a similar nature, they were boasting that that's what the instance portals in Stormwind were going to be used for, but that never came into the expansion like I had hoped it would and they had promised "If it doesn't come in the expansion then we will add it in a later content patch"... biggest load of bollocks ever.
Quoting people doesn't make you clever, in fact, it makes you all the more stupid for not bothering to read the quotes you post in the first place.
So in order for us to actually have what you call a 'proper' game we must have put in several years into world of warcraft and levelled up ot seventy before we even can comment even though at sixty you've pretty much experienced the whole game already?.... What a joke, this is why I don't bother responding to fanbois of this game anymore, they're as bad as some NGErs I come across and there's only ONE in that game that I actually respected because even he admitted that he thinks the game needs a lot of work. World of Warcraft won't go down easy I'll admit, but it'll still go down, naming a couple, Vanguard was supposed to be big but never got picked up properly in development, Star Wars Galaxies was ruined because the developer was an arse who ignored the playerbase entirely ended up running the game on the skeleton crew. In my opinion, Blizzard is going the way of SOE, they're ignoring the playerbase entirely, giving no responses at all and putting themselves in a position where they are hard to reach by putting idiot Gamemasters and Community Managers who's job is only to lock threads and write smart arse comments forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html which basically just point players in the direction as if they're a problem they're not willing to deal with. If you can't accept that, then it's your own damn fault, the games just going to stay the way it is because the majority of the fanbase is just a bunch of "Yes please bring in that patch" people.
Oh come on, at least get your reading comprehension up to scratch before going into diatribes about my posts. If you had read and understood properly what I said, you will know that I was talking to the poster who said he had 4 level 70 characters in WoW, and had not yet made level 70 in EQ2, and was saying EQ2 was a better game. I told him he was burned out in WoW and that he should play the same amount of time in EQ2 to make a fair comparison) Mmmmk?
It's really quite simple and I'm amazed at the tangent you've gone off on.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
i can only say that WoW does NOT HAVE anymore 9 mil player's , Blizz lied from the start they had like allmost 8 mil or something like that and about the majority playing WoW .. please don't make me laugh , everyone know's the best gamers from the world are asian ppl , and WoW is allmost dead there . Why not ppl dosen't admit that WoW is a very simple game but when you first look at it it give's you the impresion that is some uber complexe .. neah .. it's crap .. what is WoW all about ? farm and runing around with some flag on your back in some BG.Great PvE / PvP .. yeah .. it's Unreal Tournament or Quake with bow's / dagger's / sword's / etc.
But i whant to thank Blizz for keeping all the kindergarden kid's in this game !
Ok... Enough with the Blizz conspiracy theories... seriously... More than half of WoW's playerbase are from Asia, if i'm not mistaken. And about WoW seeming as "uber complexe"? Umm... I don't know how anyone can think of it as complex. That's one of the biggest reasons for it's popularity. Being easy. I mean, when I return home from school after some test or something, I don't want to play anything complicated, I want my brain to rest (no matter how allmighty my wonderous brain is).
Kyleran, I know you're a very intelligent person. I've always agreed with you, and been impressed by your intelligent, coherent post. To say a game that you played for 1.75 years, leveled 6 toons to max, got them nicely geared, is a game that lacks depth and complexity reeks of bitterness. There is no game that I have ever played that long. Even EQ and DAoC which I love with all my heart I didn't play that long. Maybe all the time added together in EQ was that long. I only played DAoC for about 1 year. You're right, though, no game can hold the average person forever. 1.75 years playing is a heck of a testament to a game's greatness.
Well now, at first glance you might be correct. But consider the chronology... I played from launch until about 10 months later...leveling a Priest/Pally/Mage to 60.... (and a Rogue to 44), cleared MC, was grinding through BWL..and suddenly said...what in the world am I doing? This couldn't be any more boring and annoying.... no matter what class I leveled up, the end game always had the same result, boring raiding......so I quit for about 4 months... playing GW and COV in the interim.
I restarted on a new server at the requests of friends, leveled a Hunter to 30....only to have said friends decide to reroll on another server, so I rerolled and leveled a Druid/Warlock up to 60. I then joined a raid guild who had MC on recent farm status, so I fought with them through BWL and AQ 40...and once again found myself asking.... what in the world am I doing? Same stuff, different day. Nothing is any different...I'm grinding faction, healing/buffing in raids, and not having any fun.
Then I took a close look as what TBC promised....gaaah... more of the same. Only first it was going to invalidate my hard work in getting my Tier 2/2.5 gear, require me to level up more (OK, I like leveling), grind more faction (I hate this) and acquire all new resistance sets, keys and raid supplies. As a side note the new 10 man raid instances assured the destruction of the raid guilds I had come to know and respect..... thanks Blizzard
So am I bit bitter? Yeah I guess so, I spent a lot of time playing WOW..and should have realized much sooner that it would never provide the in depth gaming experience that I was looking for. Things like meaningful crafting, cities to build, control, and destroy, no more painful leveling, faction grinding etc..... it was either raid or perish.......... so I retired from the game.
As to DAOC... I played that game 2.5 years, leveling 6 characters to 50, (3 to Realm Rank 5+) across both MLF-2 and Mordred - 4 (I so loved the FFA PVP there), had the 4th highest Spell crafter on Mordred (and I despise crafting, but it was worth it in Dark Age), and loved both the Battlegrounds and the Big Boy RVR. I only left when they decided that the game needed a solid PVE element and added the TOA expansion...(Mordred was able to dodge the full impact of that expansion for about a year)
I also went back at the end of 2006 on the Classic servers for about 4 months, managed to level 4 characters to 50 (the game is in total easy mode now), and had a decent enough time....but it just didn't have the same appeal that Mordred used to.... so I moved on to VG, LotRO, and am now enjoying myself in EVE.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I have never understood why people write essays on this. Its a waste of time. No one ever reads them.
Hey, I read four words.
CLUE: Several people have read it, and responded to it.
So neeerrrrrr. Now who wasted their time? Looks like I won on teh internets. As a prize, I claim the right to further mock your logic:
I never never understood why people post on threads for the purpose of expressing their disinterest. Is this some twist on the Nirvana generation's tendancy to feign indifference because they think it's cool? It's like walking into Macdonalds and saying: "I am neither hungry nor thirsty, your products are of no interest to me, and I don't want you to serve me." And then walk out.
Now go read a book!
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
I've played since the game came out. I've never liked it, but my girlfriend does. Some of my friends and brothers play, so it's a way for us to keep in contact. May not be a good enough reason for most people to play, but for $15 a month, I save a lot on phone calls (my friends and brothers live in different states). I leveled up to 60 on my warrior in less than 2 months of playing (before TBC), and was stuck not raiding because of school and RL events. I went through each instance once or twice, but never really liked it. It wasn't fun. You go into the instance, you kill monsters, you may or may not get gear. People rarely talk, other than to talk about where you're going or what stratagy to use. If i want to get something "accomplished" without having fun or not talking to anyone, I'll stay at work and get overtime. What's the point of playing an MMO if you don't talk with people or interact with them in any other way than raiding? The pvp in the game is pointless, but could have been good if they implemented something along the lines of taking over towns. I've given it more than a fair chance, had decent luck in the game, but haven't had much fun.
The community was nice and polite at first, but not so any more. People used to buff and say thanks when buffed, now they don't. You're more likely to get a superior item to drop than you are to get a buff without asking/paying for it. Rarely do you see people joking and laughing anymore in the general chat in major cities. And when you do, people complain about it. WoW isn't the best game ever. With their projections of how many people "play" WoW, do they include those people that have multiple accounts? Is their counting method similar to McDonald's? You know, that they count EACH visit as a customer? If that's the case, then that would make it 9 million people have tried it, not 9 million people hold active accounts. I'm not sure because I haven't done any research on it. Not because I'm lasy, but because I don't really care how many people play the game. Saying that because x number people play the game, it must be good. That's like saying because x number of people smoke, it must not be that bad for you. It's also like saying that sagging is cool because everyone does it. People need to pull their damn pants up and think for themselves. Most people that play WoW have nothing to compare it to. It is their first journey into the MMO realm. Most people don't like change. This is a key factor to why people continue to play WoW, it doesn't change. Nor do the players really want change. They just want more of the same.
Blizzard really seems to not like to actually update the game with new content. I think this is because they know that if they trickle it out, people won't be likely to leave. So what if they lose a few hundred, a couple thousand, a mere hundred thousand, subscribers, they have "millions". Why spend valuable resources and money to introduce new content consistently when you can do it sporadically and make much more money? This mentality will work for them now, but not in the long run. It seems that everytime they put in a patch to fix things, they cause something else to break. I don't really have any faith in them as a company because of their "tactics". They are trying to milk the cow for as much as they can before it falls over dead. Don't deny it, it will fall over dead at some point.
For those of you who may say that I am bitter, well I am. Why not admit it? People would have pointed it out anyway. People feel like they have to "protect" the game that they like. Is this a sign of a lack of confidence? Maybe, but it doesn't matter. Defending it is pointless. The only thing you can do is tell people about your good experiences, what you liked and disliked about it (much like I am doing about why I dislike the game) and then let them decide for themselves. Bashing people about their opinions is stupid. We all have our own opinions. The reasons behind our opinions are what just as important as the opinion itself.
I do not like the game, but I continue to "play" it to keep in contact with friends. Sure I could use the phone, instant messaging, or e-mail, but I have a better chance of getting a response when we're on the game together. Also, there's just something about doing something, even if it's grinding, with a friend that makes the long distance relationship seem more like it's what it used to be. If my friends and brothers went to a different game, bet your ass I'd go to it as well. I don't like the game, but I do like spending time with the people I care about. It sucks that they happen to like this particular game. It's a sacrifice I'm willing to make to keep our relationships strong, and keep them happy. Flame on if you must, but consider what you like about the game first.
On a side note, be careful what you say in the game. I had a friend who got divorced and they pulled his transcripts from the game to try and show that he was "cheating" on his wife. It seems strange to me that they would allow a subpoena for a civil matter to expose a person's personal conversations. I could understand if it was for a criminal offense, such as people soliciting sex or trying to that whole child stalking thing, but civil matters are entirely different. I'm sure this could happen in any game, but I know of it occurring in this game. I saw the transcripts. Everything was in it, even the time it occurred.
I have 4 level 70's in WoW and 0 level 70's in EQ2... Guess which game I like better? Not all reviews are biased in the way the OP describes, atleast not mine. Personally, my reviews are only biased, if anything, by the community surrounding and found in the game.
Well wait till you get to 70 and maybe you'll be in a position to judge both games fairly. If EQ2 keeps your attention for 879+ hours (taken from your Xfire sig), then you'll have a solid base of comparison. But like Kyleran and others before you, you've SPENT A METRIC CRAPTON OF TIME IN WOW (even though, that's not a lot of time for many players tbh), and now that you've exhausted the fun from it, you're bitter. I honestly don't see you spending the same amount of time in another MMO.
This is the big irony of many people that bash WoW. They've probably played it more than anything else.
I have been REAL lucky in WOW and have done great. So my reasons for thinking subpar have nothing to do with the game. Wow just isnt my cup of tea because:
Too easy, the agem treats you like a 5 year old leading you by the nose, which is why 7mil of that 9mil playerbase probably is 5
MEaningless pvp
gearbased and dare I say it NOT skill based pvp
Instanced battlegrounds
the list goes on and on, anyone who thinks people hate wow cuz there unlucky is a moron. Thats like saying anyone who DOES liek it only got lucky
WoW's PvP may be "meaningless" , but it's a lot better than many other games. EVE and other hardcore games might have more "meaning" (I loathe that term in this context) but that doesn't mean it's any more fun or interesting. I mean you spend a lot of the time just waiting for PvP in other games. In WoW you can join a battleground and have a Warcraft-style battle in first/third person - constantly - which is the cool thing about WoW. So you don't like Warcraft battlegrounds or the ganking outsidee - boo hoo, that doesn't mean they're not good.
Also something you might want to consider that a game with harsh penalties for dying in PvP means that combat is opportunistic, meaning that a lot of people will spend most of the time avoiding a fight unless they have a lot to gain. Sure the fight is a thrill, but they're few and far between. I work, I don't want to pay to wait to PvP, I want to play the game now. It doesn't matter if a level takes a long time to reach, or a prize takes many days of work, as long as I'm not spending most of my time doing nothing waiting for it.
In case you hadn't noticed, PvP means that you are fighting against a human opponent. That means you're fighting against an intelligence and if they can use their tools at their disposal better than you can, then they're more skilled than you are. Gear plays a part but I'd take a skilled player in blues than a crap player in epics any day.
Kids and students have more spare time. Hence more time for MMOs that take longer to reach the level cap. Hence more casual-friendly games = better suited to adults.
Get a job, get some responsibilities, and then meet the millions of other people just like you in WoW.
Hardcore games = kids games. WoW = adult game.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Sounds like you're "looking" for something that doesn't exist.
Ahh so we finally agree on something. You hit the nail on the head, no good MMO's exist. None have since the OLD UO days before they screwed that up.
No, they exist. You're just trying to recapture your first MMO experiences like one might an old girlfriend. Sure I wish all women were the same as her, but there's no going back now - doesn't mean I'm going to become gay just because noone else compares.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
There's nothing wrong with wanting something different. If you're bored with all MMOs, with the EQ/WoW formula, there's nothing wrong with that - it happens to a lot of people. I say it's a good thing really, playing an MMO for your entire lifetime isn't something I would consider to be healthy or anything you will look back on in years to come with any pride.
When I speak of the unhappy minority I'm really talking about those who think there are 18 MMOs better than World of Warcraft. It simply goes against all the evidence and common sense. It's the result of MMORPG.com's negativity - perhaps because they're tired of the genre - but it's probably just the nerd in us that shuns perfection and embraces imperfection and obscurity. I'm not saying WoW's perfect, it's a long way from it - but no further away than other MMOs, in fact probably closer.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Recant - looking at your post history, all I see is you defending WoW. Does it really matter what a lot of us think about the game you currently play? Take a break and do something else. It just isn't worth arguing about. Some of us have played the game more than you, and some of us less. We get the point, you like it and it's deep. End of story.
Ummm, no. The "unhappy minority" are veteran MMO players who see through WoWs simplicity as an MMO. The 9million happy people are the new mainstream MMO players, people that before WoW probably didnt even play any games. Thats how society works...when things become mainstream, they become dumbed down, easy for everyone to like. Things lose there speciality and soul and become just another product for people to consume.
Ummm, no. The "unhappy minority" are veteran MMO players who see through WoWs simplicity as an MMO. The 9million happy people are the new mainstream MMO players, people that before WoW probably didnt even play any games. Thats how society works...when things become mainstream, they become dumbed down, easy for everyone to like. Things lose there speciality and soul and become just another product for people to consume.
Do you know how many CD's Justin Timberlake sells? He's probably the best artist to ever exist. If he had subscriptions he'd be #1 for sure.
Uuh yea and his music sucks, thanks for proving my point. Its all popular culture, easy listening, easy to look at, easy to play. Watered down, no depth.
No matter how many times you post this it won't change anything I personally dislike WoW. I found it well... just kinda bored the sh1t out of me. I had a lvl 70 druid.PLUS Burning Crusade was horrible it was like a big grind fest just so you could get into the dungeons it was like get 20k honor to get into SC and sitting at my computer grinding naga etc is not exactly my definition of fun
You dislike WoW? It bores the **** out of you? The expansion was horrible?
And yet you STILL went and levelled up to level 70 anyway? It amazes how many people continually say how bad they think the game is, yet carry on playing it regardless.
I don't think you should be amazed at all. How many people live in places that they hate or with people they don't like or in situations they wish they could be out of. Its not because they have not found the better situation. It is in fact the final out come for them. No matter where they go they will be miserable. This is just the current place.
My favorite thing about all of these posts (as a new member I get to experience them for the first time) is that almost all of them are completely devoid of the person actually doing anything to change their experience. They are victims to the game, the players, or the world. This thread started with a diatribe about how Mileage varries with the situation of the game. It was a complete mental masterbation (IMO.) It basically fed all of the same false beliefs that lead people to be victims in the first place. That something outside of yourself is driving your life.
So in response here are a few suggestions for those who find themselves in situations they don't like, playing games they think suck, or any other victimy place. DO something about it, right now!
Find someone to schedule time to play with. Get a RL Friend to commit to playing with you at a precise time to do a precise activity. Be it WoW or anything else. If you have a negative experience with your current guild, character, or whatever. Delete the character and re-roll on a different server or in a different place. Do whatever it takes to reboot your thinking. Your current character is a record in a database and if it is the reason you are miserable or unhappy delete it and go do what is going to make you happy.
RULE 1: Do not let the past define your future.
I play WoW nearly every day. I play it with my wife, my RL best friend and a guild of folks that I mostly can tolerate nearly all of the time. My character is a priest. I am one of a group of great healers in our guild. But the number one thing I talk about related to my character is how good his hair is.
We are not role players. My guild thinks role playing is stupid in MMOs and there is almost no roleplaying. But I consistently interject comments about my chacter's hair becuase it improves the game and play. The jokes about my hair and my vainity are endless source of fun.
FULE 2: Do not let the features of the game engine or system define your character, their abilities, or their personality. We are in much more control than you we give ourselves credit for.
Maybe it was always this way for me but ever since I started playing paper based D&D I realized that the rules where there to support my playing fun and not hinder it. So many of the things that we use to constrain ourselves are actually in our control. Take control.
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With over 9 mill subs it is obvious you will run into all kinds of people, and while I do agree that there is immaturity and idots running around in WoW they are irl too, you wouldnt get along with everyone irl either, its like saying theres so many younglings and kids tv shows life sucks! In the long run all you got to do is find a guild of people who you get along with, there are plenty of mature guilds in WoW who treat one another with respect, and handle things in a mature way. If you are in a Mickey Mouse guild thats Chuck Norris infested and dont like it, what can I tell you dont blame wow for that, you just didnt look hard enough to find your guild. Also the ignore feature works really well, and its done wonders for me
A man dies daily, only to be reborn in the morning, bigger, better and wiser.
-Playing AoC
-Playing WoW
-Retired- SWG
-Retired- EVE
-Retired- LotR
Computer (- Phenom 9600 Black Edition @ 2.81 Ghz (Quad Core CPU)- Gigabyte MA790FX-DS5 - 4 Gigs of PC 8500 ram (1066)- EVGA GeForce 8800 GTS PCI Express 2.0 - WD 500GB 7500RPM - Zalman CPU cooler (air cooled)
- 24" Widescreen 1080P HD display).
Well wait till you get to 70 and maybe you'll be in a position to judge both games fairly. If EQ2 keeps your attention for 879+ hours (taken from your Xfire sig), then you'll have a solid base of comparison. But like Kyleran and others before you, you've SPENT A METRIC CRAPTON OF TIME IN WOW (even though, that's not a lot of time for many players tbh), and now that you've exhausted the fun from it, you're bitter. I honestly don't see you spending the same amount of time in another MMO.
This is the big irony of many people that bash WoW. They've probably played it more than anything else.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Here is a question for you:
Since there is no way to see the number of people who tried WoW and found it lacking, how do you know that they are the minority????
Plus, im one of those "9 Million" active accounts and i dont like the game that much (I think it is far from the best), i keep the account open so my daughter can play (rarely). And for her it is more of a chat room with graphics. God im wasting my money.
Because we didnt know that there were 9 million people who played MMOs up until now, not to mention all the other people who play other MMOs who combined dont even add up anywhere close to 9 million, so therefore an educated assumption is made that it is the minority who doesnt play and if you think about it, it does make sense. And dont expect to get anything thats a fact from this site either, compared to WoW this site only has 7% or so as far as members go, and from what I have noticed most people here are burned out from their MMO and come here to talk about games and alot of the times even bash the game they once enjoyed because it is not fun for them anymore. Clearly not every game is for every player. even though wow is a very succesful MMO which I do like I do believe that some people dont like it because it doesnt fit their style of play, and thats perfectly fine, thats why we live in a World of choices, so we can pick the ones that suit us best.
A man dies daily, only to be reborn in the morning, bigger, better and wiser.
-Playing AoC
-Playing WoW
-Retired- SWG
-Retired- EVE
-Retired- LotR
Computer (- Phenom 9600 Black Edition @ 2.81 Ghz (Quad Core CPU)- Gigabyte MA790FX-DS5 - 4 Gigs of PC 8500 ram (1066)- EVGA GeForce 8800 GTS PCI Express 2.0 - WD 500GB 7500RPM - Zalman CPU cooler (air cooled)
- 24" Widescreen 1080P HD display).
Well, then where are they? how come none of the other mmorpg got such a huge influx of people? they all went back to single player games and never came back?
do you think there are 10 millions of bitter wow haters out there? if you answer "yes!" I think Smedly will want you on board at SoE at marketing.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
i can only say that WoW does NOT HAVE anymore 9 mil player's , Blizz lied from the start they had like allmost 8 mil or something like that and about the majority playing WoW .. please don't make me laugh , everyone know's the best gamers from the world are asian ppl , and WoW is allmost dead there . Why not ppl dosen't admit that WoW is a very simple game but when you first look at it it give's you the impresion that is some uber complexe .. neah .. it's crap .. what is WoW all about ? farm and runing around with some flag on your back in some BG.Great PvE / PvP .. yeah .. it's Unreal Tournament or Quake with bow's / dagger's / sword's / etc.
But i whant to thank Blizz for keeping all the kindergarden kid's in this game !
Well, then where are they? how come none of the other mmorpg got such a huge influx of people? they all went back to single player games and never came back?
do you think there are 10 millions of bitter wow haters out there? if you answer "yes!" I think Smedly will want you on board at SoE at marketing.
1. No, i dont know if there are 9 million people who tried WoW and dont like it, probably not. But neither you, or anyone else knows that there isnt. Which is my point. I have seen the 9 million subscribers number, i have also seen the numbers that state that 8 million of those are from Asia. I have no idea how many asians are upset with WoW and if they are what game they are playing.2. SOE doesnt do marketing so i probably wont be getting the job.
yea yea Blizzard lied, please people stop with the conspiracy theories, thats retarded. Those are proven facts no one can claim something like that without showing for it.
A man dies daily, only to be reborn in the morning, bigger, better and wiser.
-Playing AoC
-Playing WoW
-Retired- SWG
-Retired- EVE
-Retired- LotR
Computer (- Phenom 9600 Black Edition @ 2.81 Ghz (Quad Core CPU)- Gigabyte MA790FX-DS5 - 4 Gigs of PC 8500 ram (1066)- EVGA GeForce 8800 GTS PCI Express 2.0 - WD 500GB 7500RPM - Zalman CPU cooler (air cooled)
- 24" Widescreen 1080P HD display).
So in order for us to actually have what you call a 'proper' game we must have put in several years into world of warcraft and levelled up ot seventy before we even can comment even though at sixty you've pretty much experienced the whole game already?.... What a joke, this is why I don't bother responding to fanbois of this game anymore, they're as bad as some NGErs I come across and there's only ONE in that game that I actually respected because even he admitted that he thinks the game needs a lot of work. World of Warcraft won't go down easy I'll admit, but it'll still go down, naming a couple, Vanguard was supposed to be big but never got picked up properly in development, Star Wars Galaxies was ruined because the developer was an arse who ignored the playerbase entirely ended up running the game on the skeleton crew.
In my opinion, Blizzard is going the way of SOE, they're ignoring the playerbase entirely, giving no responses at all and putting themselves in a position where they are hard to reach by putting idiot Gamemasters and Community Managers who's job is only to lock threads and write smart arse comments forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html which basically just point players in the direction as if they're a problem they're not willing to deal with.
If you can't accept that, then it's your own damn fault, the games just going to stay the way it is because the majority of the fanbase is just a bunch of "Yes please bring in that patch" people not only that I believe the player base was actually planning on bringing in guild halls and housing or something of a similar nature, they were boasting that that's what the instance portals in Stormwind were going to be used for, but that never came into the expansion like I had hoped it would and they had promised "If it doesn't come in the expansion then we will add it in a later content patch"... biggest load of bollocks ever.
Quoting people doesn't make you clever, in fact, it makes you all the more stupid for not bothering to read the quotes you post in the first place.
It's really quite simple and I'm amazed at the tangent you've gone off on.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
THE TOMATO IS NOT A FRUIT, DAMN IT!!!
Well now, at first glance you might be correct. But consider the chronology... I played from launch until about 10 months later...leveling a Priest/Pally/Mage to 60.... (and a Rogue to 44), cleared MC, was grinding through BWL..and suddenly said...what in the world am I doing? This couldn't be any more boring and annoying.... no matter what class I leveled up, the end game always had the same result, boring raiding......so I quit for about 4 months... playing GW and COV in the interim.
I restarted on a new server at the requests of friends, leveled a Hunter to 30....only to have said friends decide to reroll on another server, so I rerolled and leveled a Druid/Warlock up to 60. I then joined a raid guild who had MC on recent farm status, so I fought with them through BWL and AQ 40...and once again found myself asking.... what in the world am I doing? Same stuff, different day. Nothing is any different...I'm grinding faction, healing/buffing in raids, and not having any fun.
Then I took a close look as what TBC promised....gaaah... more of the same. Only first it was going to invalidate my hard work in getting my Tier 2/2.5 gear, require me to level up more (OK, I like leveling), grind more faction (I hate this) and acquire all new resistance sets, keys and raid supplies. As a side note the new 10 man raid instances assured the destruction of the raid guilds I had come to know and respect..... thanks Blizzard
So am I bit bitter? Yeah I guess so, I spent a lot of time playing WOW..and should have realized much sooner that it would never provide the in depth gaming experience that I was looking for. Things like meaningful crafting, cities to build, control, and destroy, no more painful leveling, faction grinding etc..... it was either raid or perish.......... so I retired from the game.
As to DAOC... I played that game 2.5 years, leveling 6 characters to 50, (3 to Realm Rank 5+) across both MLF-2 and Mordred - 4 (I so loved the FFA PVP there), had the 4th highest Spell crafter on Mordred (and I despise crafting, but it was worth it in Dark Age), and loved both the Battlegrounds and the Big Boy RVR. I only left when they decided that the game needed a solid PVE element and added the TOA expansion...(Mordred was able to dodge the full impact of that expansion for about a year)
I also went back at the end of 2006 on the Classic servers for about 4 months, managed to level 4 characters to 50 (the game is in total easy mode now), and had a decent enough time....but it just didn't have the same appeal that Mordred used to.... so I moved on to VG, LotRO, and am now enjoying myself in EVE.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Hey, I read four words.
Though we have heard of stupid haste in war, cleverness has never been seen associated with long delays.
-Sun Tzu, the Art of War
Hey, I read four words.
CLUE: Several people have read it, and responded to it.
So neeerrrrrr. Now who wasted their time? Looks like I won on teh internets. As a prize, I claim the right to further mock your logic:
I never never understood why people post on threads for the purpose of expressing their disinterest. Is this some twist on the Nirvana generation's tendancy to feign indifference because they think it's cool? It's like walking into Macdonalds and saying: "I am neither hungry nor thirsty, your products are of no interest to me, and I don't want you to serve me." And then walk out.
Now go read a book!
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
I've played since the game came out. I've never liked it, but my girlfriend does. Some of my friends and brothers play, so it's a way for us to keep in contact. May not be a good enough reason for most people to play, but for $15 a month, I save a lot on phone calls (my friends and brothers live in different states). I leveled up to 60 on my warrior in less than 2 months of playing (before TBC), and was stuck not raiding because of school and RL events. I went through each instance once or twice, but never really liked it. It wasn't fun. You go into the instance, you kill monsters, you may or may not get gear. People rarely talk, other than to talk about where you're going or what stratagy to use. If i want to get something "accomplished" without having fun or not talking to anyone, I'll stay at work and get overtime. What's the point of playing an MMO if you don't talk with people or interact with them in any other way than raiding? The pvp in the game is pointless, but could have been good if they implemented something along the lines of taking over towns. I've given it more than a fair chance, had decent luck in the game, but haven't had much fun.
The community was nice and polite at first, but not so any more. People used to buff and say thanks when buffed, now they don't. You're more likely to get a superior item to drop than you are to get a buff without asking/paying for it. Rarely do you see people joking and laughing anymore in the general chat in major cities. And when you do, people complain about it. WoW isn't the best game ever. With their projections of how many people "play" WoW, do they include those people that have multiple accounts? Is their counting method similar to McDonald's? You know, that they count EACH visit as a customer? If that's the case, then that would make it 9 million people have tried it, not 9 million people hold active accounts. I'm not sure because I haven't done any research on it. Not because I'm lasy, but because I don't really care how many people play the game. Saying that because x number people play the game, it must be good. That's like saying because x number of people smoke, it must not be that bad for you. It's also like saying that sagging is cool because everyone does it. People need to pull their damn pants up and think for themselves. Most people that play WoW have nothing to compare it to. It is their first journey into the MMO realm. Most people don't like change. This is a key factor to why people continue to play WoW, it doesn't change. Nor do the players really want change. They just want more of the same.
Blizzard really seems to not like to actually update the game with new content. I think this is because they know that if they trickle it out, people won't be likely to leave. So what if they lose a few hundred, a couple thousand, a mere hundred thousand, subscribers, they have "millions". Why spend valuable resources and money to introduce new content consistently when you can do it sporadically and make much more money? This mentality will work for them now, but not in the long run. It seems that everytime they put in a patch to fix things, they cause something else to break. I don't really have any faith in them as a company because of their "tactics". They are trying to milk the cow for as much as they can before it falls over dead. Don't deny it, it will fall over dead at some point.
For those of you who may say that I am bitter, well I am. Why not admit it? People would have pointed it out anyway. People feel like they have to "protect" the game that they like. Is this a sign of a lack of confidence? Maybe, but it doesn't matter. Defending it is pointless. The only thing you can do is tell people about your good experiences, what you liked and disliked about it (much like I am doing about why I dislike the game) and then let them decide for themselves. Bashing people about their opinions is stupid. We all have our own opinions. The reasons behind our opinions are what just as important as the opinion itself.
I do not like the game, but I continue to "play" it to keep in contact with friends. Sure I could use the phone, instant messaging, or e-mail, but I have a better chance of getting a response when we're on the game together. Also, there's just something about doing something, even if it's grinding, with a friend that makes the long distance relationship seem more like it's what it used to be. If my friends and brothers went to a different game, bet your ass I'd go to it as well. I don't like the game, but I do like spending time with the people I care about. It sucks that they happen to like this particular game. It's a sacrifice I'm willing to make to keep our relationships strong, and keep them happy. Flame on if you must, but consider what you like about the game first.
On a side note, be careful what you say in the game. I had a friend who got divorced and they pulled his transcripts from the game to try and show that he was "cheating" on his wife. It seems strange to me that they would allow a subpoena for a civil matter to expose a person's personal conversations. I could understand if it was for a criminal offense, such as people soliciting sex or trying to that whole child stalking thing, but civil matters are entirely different. I'm sure this could happen in any game, but I know of it occurring in this game. I saw the transcripts. Everything was in it, even the time it occurred.
Well wait till you get to 70 and maybe you'll be in a position to judge both games fairly. If EQ2 keeps your attention for 879+ hours (taken from your Xfire sig), then you'll have a solid base of comparison. But like Kyleran and others before you, you've SPENT A METRIC CRAPTON OF TIME IN WOW (even though, that's not a lot of time for many players tbh), and now that you've exhausted the fun from it, you're bitter. I honestly don't see you spending the same amount of time in another MMO.
This is the big irony of many people that bash WoW. They've probably played it more than anything else.
I have been REAL lucky in WOW and have done great. So my reasons for thinking subpar have nothing to do with the game. Wow just isnt my cup of tea because:Too easy, the agem treats you like a 5 year old leading you by the nose, which is why 7mil of that 9mil playerbase probably is 5
MEaningless pvp
gearbased and dare I say it NOT skill based pvp
Instanced battlegrounds
the list goes on and on, anyone who thinks people hate wow cuz there unlucky is a moron. Thats like saying anyone who DOES liek it only got lucky
WoW's PvP may be "meaningless" , but it's a lot better than many other games. EVE and other hardcore games might have more "meaning" (I loathe that term in this context) but that doesn't mean it's any more fun or interesting. I mean you spend a lot of the time just waiting for PvP in other games. In WoW you can join a battleground and have a Warcraft-style battle in first/third person - constantly - which is the cool thing about WoW. So you don't like Warcraft battlegrounds or the ganking outsidee - boo hoo, that doesn't mean they're not good.
Also something you might want to consider that a game with harsh penalties for dying in PvP means that combat is opportunistic, meaning that a lot of people will spend most of the time avoiding a fight unless they have a lot to gain. Sure the fight is a thrill, but they're few and far between. I work, I don't want to pay to wait to PvP, I want to play the game now. It doesn't matter if a level takes a long time to reach, or a prize takes many days of work, as long as I'm not spending most of my time doing nothing waiting for it.
In case you hadn't noticed, PvP means that you are fighting against a human opponent. That means you're fighting against an intelligence and if they can use their tools at their disposal better than you can, then they're more skilled than you are. Gear plays a part but I'd take a skilled player in blues than a crap player in epics any day.
Kids and students have more spare time. Hence more time for MMOs that take longer to reach the level cap. Hence more casual-friendly games = better suited to adults.
Get a job, get some responsibilities, and then meet the millions of other people just like you in WoW.
Hardcore games = kids games. WoW = adult game.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Sounds like you're "looking" for something that doesn't exist.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Ahh so we finally agree on something. You hit the nail on the head, no good MMO's exist. None have since the OLD UO days before they screwed that up.
Ahh so we finally agree on something. You hit the nail on the head, no good MMO's exist. None have since the OLD UO days before they screwed that up.
No, they exist. You're just trying to recapture your first MMO experiences like one might an old girlfriend. Sure I wish all women were the same as her, but there's no going back now - doesn't mean I'm going to become gay just because noone else compares.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
There's nothing wrong with wanting something different. If you're bored with all MMOs, with the EQ/WoW formula, there's nothing wrong with that - it happens to a lot of people. I say it's a good thing really, playing an MMO for your entire lifetime isn't something I would consider to be healthy or anything you will look back on in years to come with any pride.
When I speak of the unhappy minority I'm really talking about those who think there are 18 MMOs better than World of Warcraft. It simply goes against all the evidence and common sense. It's the result of MMORPG.com's negativity - perhaps because they're tired of the genre - but it's probably just the nerd in us that shuns perfection and embraces imperfection and obscurity. I'm not saying WoW's perfect, it's a long way from it - but no further away than other MMOs, in fact probably closer.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Recant - looking at your post history, all I see is you defending WoW. Does it really matter what a lot of us think about the game you currently play? Take a break and do something else. It just isn't worth arguing about. Some of us have played the game more than you, and some of us less. We get the point, you like it and it's deep. End of story.
Ummm, no. The "unhappy minority" are veteran MMO players who see through WoWs simplicity as an MMO. The 9million happy people are the new mainstream MMO players, people that before WoW probably didnt even play any games. Thats how society works...when things become mainstream, they become dumbed down, easy for everyone to like. Things lose there speciality and soul and become just another product for people to consume.
Do you know how many CD's Justin Timberlake sells? He's probably the best artist to ever exist. If he had subscriptions he'd be #1 for sure.
Uuh yea and his music sucks, thanks for proving my point. Its all popular culture, easy listening, easy to look at, easy to play. Watered down, no depth.
You dislike WoW? It bores the **** out of you? The expansion was horrible?
And yet you STILL went and levelled up to level 70 anyway? It amazes how many people continually say how bad they think the game is, yet carry on playing it regardless.
I don't think you should be amazed at all. How many people live in places that they hate or with people they don't like or in situations they wish they could be out of. Its not because they have not found the better situation. It is in fact the final out come for them. No matter where they go they will be miserable. This is just the current place.
My favorite thing about all of these posts (as a new member I get to experience them for the first time) is that almost all of them are completely devoid of the person actually doing anything to change their experience. They are victims to the game, the players, or the world. This thread started with a diatribe about how Mileage varries with the situation of the game. It was a complete mental masterbation (IMO.) It basically fed all of the same false beliefs that lead people to be victims in the first place. That something outside of yourself is driving your life.
So in response here are a few suggestions for those who find themselves in situations they don't like, playing games they think suck, or any other victimy place. DO something about it, right now!
Find someone to schedule time to play with. Get a RL Friend to commit to playing with you at a precise time to do a precise activity. Be it WoW or anything else. If you have a negative experience with your current guild, character, or whatever. Delete the character and re-roll on a different server or in a different place. Do whatever it takes to reboot your thinking. Your current character is a record in a database and if it is the reason you are miserable or unhappy delete it and go do what is going to make you happy.
RULE 1: Do not let the past define your future.
I play WoW nearly every day. I play it with my wife, my RL best friend and a guild of folks that I mostly can tolerate nearly all of the time. My character is a priest. I am one of a group of great healers in our guild. But the number one thing I talk about related to my character is how good his hair is.
We are not role players. My guild thinks role playing is stupid in MMOs and there is almost no roleplaying. But I consistently interject comments about my chacter's hair becuase it improves the game and play. The jokes about my hair and my vainity are endless source of fun.
FULE 2: Do not let the features of the game engine or system define your character, their abilities, or their personality. We are in much more control than you we give ourselves credit for.
Maybe it was always this way for me but ever since I started playing paper based D&D I realized that the rules where there to support my playing fun and not hinder it. So many of the things that we use to constrain ourselves are actually in our control. Take control.