EQII is still pretty much the same game that was released 3 years ago as far as the gameplay goes other than the raise the level cap
EQ2 has seen *many many* changes in the last 3 years
well they dumbed down the original craft system and made the game more solo friendly, added AA points but that is about all I can think of as far as core game play. Care to educate me?
***edit** I really liked the crafting system better before they dumbed it down. It was one of the best features of the game imho.
EQII is still pretty much the same game that was released 3 years ago as far as the gameplay goes other than the raise the level cap
EQ2 has seen *many many* changes in the last 3 years
go back to LOTR
agreed 100%. i played for 1.5 years starting at launch and there was many changes in the game itself in just that time period alone. i wish i could find that post about all the changes and additions they made to the game since launch its pretty impressive.
Depends, I guess, what one considers "core". Although some did (ie. starting class needs to be quested for, etc.) much of what most might consider the "core" game did not change, I suspect, because there was no need.
Now, I doubt (nor honestly am I very interested if) Jackdog will ever be moved by the facts presented, but for the rest of you who might be wondering, here are some changes/updates to consider that I managed to grab from just one sticky post here. Most of these changes were very successful, some certainly less than others (arena) but all have been made available and can affect/impact game play.
Arena Champions: Take the form of exotic creatures or fight as yourself in battles for glory against other creatures or players.
New movement: Search for treasure and find adventure in new areas by climbing up and down cliffs and walls.
Voice-over emotes: Express yourself in a battle or expand your social circle with new voice emotes.
Guild vaults: Share the loot of a hard won battle with the rest of your guild members.
Level range increase: Now play up to level 60 as both an Adventurer and Artisan!
New land: Discover over a dozen new zones and epic encounters.
New creatures: Test your combat skills in battles with over 30 new fearsome creatures.
Higher Level Advancement - Now reach level 70 as an Adventurer or Artisan
All-new Achievement System to further specialize your character’s abilities
Guild Advancement Expanded to Level 50
Brand New Pieces of Armor, such as Profession Hats, Helmets and Pauldrons, will make your character look more distinct!
Four New Arena Champions and Two New Arenas
New Heritage Quests allow players to gain amazingly powerful items, personal status, adventure experience and even a reward made famous in the original EverQuest or EverQuest Online Adventures!
Signature Quests which reward large experience bonuses, personal status, entirely new items, and advance the lore of EverQuest II!
New playable race - The Fae
New starting location - Kelethin
Over 350 all-new quests
Content and zones available for players of all levels (1 - 70)
Cloaks that can be worn by your player character
All-new Profession Hats and Armor
Over 20 new adventure zones
Over 40 new types of creatures
New rewards for PvP (Player vs. Player) combat
New player housing, items, equipment, spells and tradeskill recipes
Levels for Guilds raised from 50 to 60
(Coming November 13th, 2007)
All-New Player Race – Start up a brand new Sarnak – the classic dragon-like humanoid creature that now inhabits Timorous Deep. Exiled from your homeland and magically altered, discover how your new breed came to be, and eventually return home to help your race triumph over the evil Iksar.
New Starting Area – Begin your adventure from the new starting area in the islands of Timorous Deep. Conclude your day of epic quests and retire to new housing within the Village of Gorowyn.
Level Cap Raised – Continue your adventures on your existing character in Kunark, expanding on your achievements as Adventure, Tradeskill and Guild levels all increase to 80.
More Unique Zones – Advance your way through new massive regions, containing many zones filled with nostalgia and danger, such as The Emerald Jungle, Skyfire Mountains, Sebilis, and Karnor’s Castle.
Hundreds of New Quests – The tale of Kunark is told through hundreds of new quests, aimed at gameplay of all types: solo, group, and raid.
More Weapons & Armor – New Epic Weapon quests for all 24 classes, with new weapons for both those who raid and those who choose not to. Battle through the opposition and acquire additional fabled and legendary armor sets as well.
New Mount – Explore the world on the shoulders of a new rampaging beast - The Kunarkian Rhinoceros.
New Deities – Recent activities on Norrath have again attracted the attention of the gods. Bertoxxulous The Plaguebringer, Karana The Rain Keeper, and the mysterious Tribunal return to exert their influences on planet. As with the existing gods of Norrath, players may pledge to these new deities to gain access to their Blessings and Miracles.
Dozens of New NPCs – Encounter and engage a wide variety of new enemies that inhabit the menacing lands of Kunark.
A new playable race, the Arasai, are now available for players who have Echoes of Faydwer.
New characters created for Neriak will start in Hate's Envy, an outpost in the Darklight Wood.
A whole new LFG system is available. Find friends, slaughter foes!
House moves just became less of a chore!
PvP players can no longer use zoning to escape combat!
An additional character slot has been added to all accounts & two for Station Access subscribers!
Legends of Norrath Card Game Legends of Norrath is an online-only trading card game, based on the richly-detailed sword-and-sorcery world of Norrath from the massively multiplayer online role-playing games EverQuest and EverQuest II. Playable from within the MMOs and separately, Oathbound, the first set for Legends of Norrath features over 375 digital cards and is available in both a 55-card digital starter deck and 15-card digital booster packs. Play as one of many Oathbound avatars and decide your own fate as you choose between the paths of good or evil.
No game is perfect, of course, but there are a lot of people (old and new to the game) posting here who can attest to the fact that EQ2 is a heckuva lot of fun to play. And really, that is the point of it all.
Originally posted by URMAKER agreed 100%. i played for 1.5 years starting at launch and there was many changes in the game itself in just that time period alone. i wish i could find that post about all the changes and additions they made to the game since launch its pretty impressive.
Many people would say that the amount of changes to the game and the amount of things that needed changing in that time period were not an overall good thing. Had SOE not rushed the game to market and then scrambled to make major changes that first year EQ2 would be a game in much better situation.
So many of the changes with EQ2 had to do with the success of WoW. A couple of examples would be 1) Soloability and 2) Quest finding.
When EQ2 was first released, it wasn`t nearly as solo friendly. I remember how there were groups of Heroic ^^^ everywhere when the game first released. This is how the game was developed, much like EQ1 that wasn`t solo friendly. The other example I gave was quest finding. The quest giver icons make finding quests so much easier and that idea was borrowed from WoW. There use to be no icon over the quest givers like in EQ1.
I don`t believe the game was so rushed to market. It ran pretty good from the start, although it did have some bugs here and there just like all MMO`s. SOE was just making EQ2 from their experience with EQ1 but WoW really took over and SOE had to adapt and learn from Blizzard.
I think EQ2 is a better game than WoW now. All of the changes have been for the better IMHO. I`m just glad that SOE was willing to adapt and change instead of insisting to keep things like they were at launch.
I just returned a couple of weeks ago as well, and was impressed with all the changes. I started in Neriak on the Nag server and it was packed to the point that it was difficult to level. - which was a blast. The old Freeport noob areas where ghost towns though - not a sole there.
So many of the changes with EQ2 had to do with the success of WoW. A couple of examples would be 1) Soloability and 2) Quest finding. When EQ2 was first released, it wasn`t nearly as solo friendly. I remember how there were groups of Heroic ^^^ everywhere when the game first released. This is how the game was developed, much like EQ1 that wasn`t solo friendly. The other example I gave was quest finding. The quest giver icons make finding quests so much easier and that idea was borrowed from WoW. There use to be no icon over the quest givers like in EQ1. I don`t believe the game was so rushed to market. It ran pretty good from the start, although it did have some bugs here and there just like all MMO`s. SOE was just making EQ2 from their experience with EQ1 but WoW really took over and SOE had to adapt and learn from Blizzard. I think EQ2 is a better game than WoW now. All of the changes have been for the better IMHO. I`m just glad that SOE was willing to adapt and change instead of insisting to keep things like they were at launch.
Most MMORPGs have learned a great deal from WoW. People with any sort of life have no time for camping mobs for days on end, spending hours retrieving corpses etc. The hardcore EQ1 style still has its niche, that's why the game is still relatively popular after all these years but the majority of people just want to log in for a couple of hours, achieve something worthwhile then log off.
What is great about EQ2 today is that the game has become more accessible while still maintaining a depth of gameplay that WoW has never had. There is no 'easymode' but at the same time there is no mindless timesinks and frustrations.
Originally posted by URMAKER agreed 100%. i played for 1.5 years starting at launch and there was many changes in the game itself in just that time period alone. i wish i could find that post about all the changes and additions they made to the game since launch its pretty impressive.
Many people would say that the amount of changes to the game and the amount of things that needed changing in that time period were not an overall good thing. Had SOE not rushed the game to market and then scrambled to make major changes that first year EQ2 would be a game in much better situation.
Its the nature of the beast. MMOs are constantly changing and evolving based on what the player base wants and is willing to pay for. EQ2 is so much better now because SoE actually listened to the customers and implemented things that they wanted. Before release its hard to judge what the vast majority of people will respond to, even with extensive Beta programs. EQ2 was a lot deeper than WoW. But EQ2 has now borrowed some of the better aspects of WoW, such as armor sets and more user friendly functions (like easy to see quest icons and solo quest lines).
Now if only they would borrow the Battlegrounds :P Would make a nice distraction from PvE without constantly being in PvP mode.
From John Smedleys "NGE apology interview at warcry
"[We're] refocusing SOE on high quality and not rushing releases," said of his coming crop of games. They learned many valuable lessons from EverQuest II and its head-to-head competition against World of Warcraft. Fact was, while both games did rather well, WoW had the budget, time and polish that EverQuest II did not. What's more, EQII was the first attempt at an MMO sequel, a mistake Smedley readily admits.
Even Smedley admits that the game was rushed. There were numerous problems with the game that had a very drastic effect on people choosing to cancel. Some were just outright terrible game design choices like shared xp debt and so many keyed zones that required everyone to get rare drop keys to progress through common dungeons. Some where oversights in Q/A like level 30 boss mobs dropping level 20 items (anyone else recall the over abundance of round shields only rogues would use even though they were a duel wield class?) or "solo" quest chains that had group encounter right in the middle of the chain. The game had memory leaks and serious lag issues caused by the game engine wanting to draw everything in view distance even if it wasn't to be displayed on the screen. The quest system, craft system and class system all saw massive "revamps" the first year or so. Everyone looked the same from level 10+ due to lack of customization (from the uni skeleton design). Even the first few adventure packs and expansion were rushed out unfinished (I beta tested them with the devs and saw first hand).
The game had some good elements and it was playable for the most part, but it was plagued with problems that touched just about every aspect of the game. The game wasn't vanguard bad, but it missed on many levels which is why people left. I played on the test server full time and got to interact with devs for a long time. They are very passionate about making the game fun and I honestly believe they have good intentions. It was very obvious when they were being forced to put an update out or making a sweeping change that they didn't believe in just by the way they would interact with us or have no comments on certain changes. I truely believe the devs want to listen to the players, but it is also obvious that someone else is calling shots on major aspects. Especially time release timeframs of patches and expansions.
Anyhow, thats all the past, but it was the final straw for me with SOE. EQ2 could be top notch now or just the same as it was as far as I know. I have drank the kool aid and bought their apologies and PR spin to many times to give them a blind faith trial again. I am not criticising anyone who plays the game, just that had SOE managed their products better they would be in an overall better state and position than they are now.
One thing is for sure though, Smed and Brad were better off making games than running companies.
I have tried many times to get into this game and just cannot do it.The game design was never very player friendly.Forced grouping when the game was first introduced said it all about the arrogance)and ignorance) of the people making the design decisions.Blizzard saw that and did the exact opposite with great solo options and and more player friendly crafting system.But some designers never learn. (we all saw how the original designers of EQ had not learned a thing when the designed the flop called Vanguard with its forced grouping and crafting system from H%&@.
Eq2 is a decent game but its missing a lot of what other games like wow offer. For example:
wow allows high levels to group with low levels without much of a xp hit or mentoring.
Wow allows high levels to grind low level instances for loot which goes to make money or outfit alts. (eq2 toons cant unless mentoring)
Wow has 100x better world design and layout.
Wow has on the spot pvp and flagging system. (almost like old swg TEF's)
Wow has a much more fun crafting system.
Soloing is way better in wow, aside from drinking after every pull or two..
Eq2 has better models and realistic weapons and armor.
Eq2 has better grouping dynamics.
Eq2 has better combat mechanics.
Eq2 is somewhat harder/complex twinking your toon. (getting masters)
Eq2 has better npc agro range and group encounters so you can easily pull the mobs you want without the whole room coming too.. (wow lacks here bigtime)
Eq2 has 24 combat classes.
Some downfalls to eq2 is a drab world design, uninteresting use of colours and textures, a particle system that bogs a decent pc down like nothing, overall generally more laggy. It has a lot of loading from one city zone to the next.. Eq2 is run by sony which think timesinks are fun. Timesinks in finding gear, and masters. Although timesinks are necessary, sony over does it I think. Eq2 also has a lot on uninteresting loot.. No real way to mod your toon out so your different from one class to the next except via legendary or fabled gear.. No rare imbueable items or rare items to craft, just the standard crafting imbues which are rather boring and have a feeling of linear design and implementation.
I've played eq2 off and on since launch, made a 70 defiler (main raider 6 days a week) ,70 assassin, 70 sk .. I can attest more to eq2 than wow since I only played wow for 2 month on a shaman to lvl 46. The problems i find in wow are boring and slow combat. Same spells every 2 levels just new ranks. Im pretty much canceling my wow account because the combat is uninteresting to me. Its really too slow and I hate having to drink after every mob I kill. Wows has no group dynamics at all.. I like fast paced combat and action with little downtime. Don't tell me to go play another game.. Theres no hardcore rpg mmo's out there with a real mmo world design or payment option out there.
In a nutshell, I would take wows world design, layout, particle system, and slap eq2 mechanics right over top of it for a pretty decent and fun game. And when I say wows world design I don't mean azeroth, I mean the actual layout and use of colours, placement, etc.. Call the world or game whatever you want.. Im not giddy over either wow or eq2s theme or lore... In fact I find them both boring.. Im strictly referring to design and mechanics.
And I know theres more pro's to WoW than I listed.. Bare with my lack of knowledge about WoW since Im basically a 2 month old noob.
I also wanted to mention one last thing I totally despise about eq2. In eq2 at level 70, theres really not much to do outside of grouping and raiding. The lockout timers are retarded imo. The only really solo friendly place for a level 70 is poets palace.. And you can run it once a day basically. Eq2 needs more solo friendly zones with no timers. A larger more diverse loot table. So for example, I should be able to go solo some zone over and over again for 8 hrs a day and not get bored of the loot. I would have fabled recipe drops for each crafter/class, I would have legendary gear recipes for all levels and varying mods to appeal to each class.
Wow does something to this effect and allows crafters to craft some decent items. Plus by removing the lockouts you don't restrict players.. Which equates to forming groups easier if people can just pickup and do whatever others are advertising to do.
Yeah I like the way EQ2 did mentoring so you can play with friends who just started the game. CoH was brilliant for coming up with the idea though I don't like how they did it.
Metatrinox, shaman is an ugly class to level. Neither of the "offensive" trees have much variety until you go to dungeons/raids. Only a few classes have mana issues while leveling and most of those can get around it with proper gearing/talents builds. But like EQ2, WoW is mostly about the 60-70 levels now. Next month they are vastly increasing XP gained and lower the amoung of XP neede for levels 20-60. Smart move overall.
its funny to see jackdog talk about how eq2 is dumbed down , when he is playing the most dumbed down game out there LOTRO
I enjoyed the irony as well. I've read posts here pretty often, and it seems Jackdog just comes here to bash this game and boast the garbage that is LOTRO.
funny but 2 or 3 years ago the WoW fans were bashing me as a SOE fanboy Just aused I moved on now I am a SOE troll.
I stand by my statements, the game was and still is pretty good. It is just way too top heavy and has not done much as far as innovative development over the years. The game is just over the hill and on a steady downhill slide, like the OP said stick a fork in it. Even when SOE comes up with a good idea such as SWG and EQII they seem to just hose it up more and more as time passes.
Eq2 is a decent game but its missing a lot of what other games like wow offer. For example:
wow allows high levels to group with low levels without much of a xp hit or mentoring. This is a terrible design flaw in WoW. Wow allows high levels to grind low level instances for loot which goes to make money or outfit alts. (eq2 toons cant unless mentoring)This is even worse. I was a low level toon fighting my ass off to get to a named. Working my way through the trash, cleaning the area when a 40 something rides in, kills everything, including named, GETS A DROP, and rides off. Totally ruining my chance, my experience, and my playtime. I immediately camped, canceled, and never came back. This is a HUGE moronic oversight on the part of Blizzard. And this is just one of them, I could name MANY more design flaws like this. Wow has 100x better world design and layout. Purely opinion. WoW's design and colors truly give me a headache. I can't stand them. The colors are not even natural looking in any way shape or form. I just don't like playing in toon town. Wow has on the spot pvp and flagging system. (almost like old swg TEF's) Duels? Wow has a much more fun crafting system. You mean WoW's NON-EXISTENT crafting system. Crafting in WoW is the laughing stock of all MMO's, and for good reason. Soloing is way better in wow, aside from drinking after every pull or two.. Um, no... Eq2 has better models and realistic weapons and armor. Eq2 has better grouping dynamics. Eq2 has better combat mechanics. Wait till you see RoK, ZOMG!! Eq2 is somewhat harder/complex twinking your toon. (getting masters) Eq2 has better npc agro range and group encounters so you can easily pull the mobs you want without the whole room coming too.. (wow lacks here bigtime) Eq2 has 24 combat classes. AND you can be anything you want, literally. Dwarf Wizard, Ogre Druid, Troll Illusionist, whatever.
Some downfalls to eq2 is a drab world design, uninteresting use of colours and textures, a particle system that bogs a decent pc down like nothing, overall generally more laggy. It has a lot of loading from one city zone to the next.. Eq2 is run by sony which think timesinks are fun. Timesinks in finding gear, and masters. Although timesinks are necessary, sony over does it I think. Eq2 also has a lot on uninteresting loot.. No real way to mod your toon out so your different from one class to the next except via legendary or fabled gear.. AND AA's, and appearance tabs, and titles, and mounts... etc. etc. No rare imbueable items or rare items to craft, just the standard crafting imbues which are rather boring and have a feeling of linear design and implementation. What?!?! You play(ed) this game, really? Never heard of ADORNMENTS, or Fabled crafted items, or even Mastercrafted items? I've played eq2 off and on since launch, made a 70 defiler (main raider 6 days a week) ,70 assassin, 70 sk .. Highly suspect... but I'll take your word for it... And I know theres more pro's to WoW than I listed.. Bare with my lack of knowledge about WoW since Im basically a 2 month old noob. Only a few I can think of are movements, some raid variety, and seemless world. I also wanted to mention one last thing I totally despise about eq2. In eq2 at level 70, theres really not much to do outside of grouping and raiding. The lockout timers are retarded imo. Absolutely a must. They are completely needed and if they were removed, the EQ2 economy would go right out the crapper. The only really solo friendly place for a level 70 is poets palace.. And you can run it once a day basically. Like Nest, Acadechism, Sanctum of Scaleborn, Kaladim, however, with all that said, I do think it would be cool for a couple solo dungeons to show up, WITH lockouts, no lockouts is a bad idea. Eq2 needs more solo friendly zones with no timers. A larger more diverse loot table. So for example, I should be able to go solo some zone over and over again for 8 hrs a day and not get bored of the loot. I would have fabled recipe drops for each crafter/class, They already do. I would have legendary gear recipes for all levels and varying mods to appeal to each class. Which are already in the game. Wow does something to this effect and allows crafters to craft some decent items. Plus by removing the lockouts you don't restrict players.. Which equates to farming groups (that will farm the instances over and over and gut the economy within a week, which is ANOTHER huge problem in WoW) easier if people can just pickup and do whatever others are advertising to do.
"Granted thinking for yourself could be considered a timesink of shorter or longer duration depending on how smart..or how dumb you are."
So, I start this thread with good intentions and I put forth ideas that spawn pages of very thoughtful replies, addressing many likes and dislikes of the game.
But then there's this one person who wants to make a personal attack:
I did not read the rest of your post.
FOR A T T E N T I O N. You lied, misled, and stirred people up for attention.
Of course he didn't read the rest of my post. That would imply a desire to know what he's talking about.
Why is there always that one guy like this?
I did, however, research my problem and found that I was mistaken. I had originally set out to roll on the AB server but I'd actually rolled on a different one altogether, where the new player area was empty. Sorry, my mistake. I've admitted it and corrected it. You just read it.
For the record, I really don't need the attention. I obviously get a lot of attention, and I don't use caps lock. But thank you for stopping by to contribute nothing meaningful whatsoever. I hope it gained for you whatever it was you were looking for. I'd look forward to never again running into a backwards little cuss like this again in any facet of life, but I get the feeling I'd be dissappointed sometime going to sleep and getting in rush hour traffic and, if not then, certainly by the end of the day.
Wow allows high levels to grind low level instances for loot which goes to make money or outfit alts. (eq2 toons cant unless mentoring)This is even worse. I was a low level toon fighting my ass off to get to a named. Working my way through the trash, cleaning the area when a 40 something rides in, kills everything, including named, GETS A DROP, and rides off. Totally ruining my chance, my experience, and my playtime. I immediately camped, canceled, and never came back. This is a HUGE moronic oversight on the part of Blizzard. And this is just one of them, I could name MANY more design flaws like this.
Very few "named" mobs actually drop loot outside of dungeons and even those that do drop the same items as the unnamed mob right next to them. Items like that are so plentiful it isn't even worth breaking a sweat over. Inside dungeons you get your own personal instance so no level 40 rode up and killed your mob there. You can farm low level dungeons to your hears content without running into other players. Get gear for your alt or to sell on the auction it is up to you. If that was all it took for you to quit that is pretty thin.
Because the devs don't put an artificial cap on what you can benefit from and not everything in the game remains of value. That isn't so in the case of EQ2 which has disposable content because of this. Not to mention there are many instances of players leaving someone mentored at the zone in and farming the dungeon with their high level character. Plenty of EQ2 stories of kill stealing dungeons from low level characters. I'm not sure if that has been fixed, but it was an ugly side to the sunshine community of EQ2.
And, yet, many other games, including EVE, WOW, CoV and even SWG have very busy starting areas and zones full of players. And I'll tell you why you should be thankful people don't just quit without complaining -- because, if they did, the reasons for which they're quitting wouldn't get fixed. Believe it or not, SOE, Blizzard, NCSoft, all of them read these forums, reviews, all of it. And, as they plan future games, they take into account the loudest public complaints. That's why newer MMORPGs have less grind now, more balanced PVP, fewer time sinks, faster customer service response time, less lag, and adjustments, though often slight, to most major problems that people typically flamed up forums with for years. The truth, in-game and in real life, is that if nobody complains, things don't get done. There is no incentive to fix something that everyone seems at least complacent with.
I started 2 months ago and never moved too much without seeing people...so I am unsure of where your playing...as Antonia is fine
Maybe you were actually playing another game and just did not know it..
" No real way to mod your toon out so your different from one class to the next except via legendary or fabled gear.. AND AA's, and appearance tabs, and titles, and mounts... etc. etc. No rare imbueable items or rare items to craft, just the standard crafting imbues which are rather boring and have a feeling of linear design and implementation. What?!?! You play(ed) this game, really? Never heard of ADORNMENTS, or Fabled crafted items, or even Mastercrafted items?"
I just wanted to reply to this part, yes I am aware of adornments.. My overall point was that even though there is AA's and adornments; there is always a best mod or aa line to pick. Which in the end offers no real varying difference from one assassin to the next.. Or one defiler to the next because they all have the same adornments and mostly the same AA's. The AA's will vary a bit from one player to the next but there is a best build for a raid defiler, and I guarantee any raid defiler with half a brain uses the same lines or similar lines because 2 out of 5 shaman lines are useless.
My overall point is, there is always a best way to build a toon for a set situation. And by saying aa's and adornments offer variety is somewhat misleading because there is always a best adornment for a specific healer item that every healer uses.. Or there is always a best AA build for maximizing your raid healer etc.. The only real difference between players is what loot they have equipped. And even end game raiders all end up in 95% of the same gear as the next end game raider, with the same adornments and same aa build..
When I mentioned crafting imbues, I meant something along the lines of adding lets say we take the 6 main resist types of magic, heat, cold, mental, poison,disease and allow crafters to imbue weapons that do added damage of one of the types of resists to add variance from one player to the next.
Ok so joe assassin has 2 weapons, both do piercing damage as a base dmg type, he then gets an imbue to add heat damage. His weapons now appear to drip fire and glow with a flame effect.
Another assassin has the exact same weapons that do piercing damage, he instead adds cold damage imbues to his weapons. His weapons now look frosted and iced over etc to let others know what hes done to his weapons.
You then take all your mobs in the game and make them so some are more resistant to certain damage types than others making players then think about what kinda elemental damage they would do count as part of their strategy. To me this adds a great deal of thinking and knowing what will work best on what mob. This also adds another layer of thinking in pvp as you well know each armor piece offers varying resistance etc..
I didn't go into too much detail though because I honestly didn't expect any replies directly, nor did I think anyone would read 15 paragraphs of details and explanations.
Wow allows high levels to grind low level instances for loot which goes to make money or outfit alts. (eq2 toons cant unless mentoring)This is even worse. I was a low level toon fighting my ass off to get to a named. Working my way through the trash, cleaning the area when a 40 something rides in, kills everything, including named, GETS A DROP, and rides off. Totally ruining my chance, my experience, and my playtime. I immediately camped, canceled, and never came back. This is a HUGE moronic oversight on the part of Blizzard. And this is just one of them, I could name MANY more design flaws like this.
Very few "named" mobs actually drop loot outside of dungeons and even those that do drop the same items as the unnamed mob right next to them. Items like that are so plentiful it isn't even worth breaking a sweat over. Inside dungeons you get your own personal instance so no level 40 rode up and killed your mob there. You can farm low level dungeons to your hears content without running into other players. Get gear for your alt or to sell on the auction it is up to you. If that was all it took for you to quit that is pretty thin.
Because the devs don't put an artificial cap on what you can benefit from and not everything in the game remains of value. That isn't so in the case of EQ2 which has disposable content because of this. Not to mention there are many instances of players leaving someone mentored at the zone in and farming the dungeon with their high level character. Plenty of EQ2 stories of kill stealing dungeons from low level characters. I'm not sure if that has been fixed, but it was an ugly side to the sunshine community of EQ2.
"Because the devs don't put an artificial cap on what you can benefit from and not everything in the game remains of value."
Yes exactly, replay value is higher in wow because of this. Its little things like this blizzard has done better imo than sony. I think sony's overall thinking was that for someone to grind low level areas as a mentored high level, you need a 2nd account.. Which means 30/month and not 15/month.. Because in wow you could just go to a lower level dungeon on your main, farm the loot and mail it off to your alt. The only issues that I seen arise in wow, was bind on pickup blue items which is basically vendor trash. Other than that though farming green items was a replay value to me which eq2 lacked except if you had multiple accounts.
Comments
go back to LOTR
EQ2 fan sites
well they dumbed down the original craft system and made the game more solo friendly, added AA points but that is about all I can think of as far as core game play. Care to educate me?
***edit** I really liked the crafting system better before they dumbed it down. It was one of the best features of the game imho.
I miss DAoC
go back to LOTR
agreed 100%. i played for 1.5 years starting at launch and there was many changes in the game itself in just that time period alone. i wish i could find that post about all the changes and additions they made to the game since launch its pretty impressive.
Depends, I guess, what one considers "core". Although some did (ie. starting class needs to be quested for, etc.) much of what most might consider the "core" game did not change, I suspect, because there was no need.
Now, I doubt (nor honestly am I very interested if) Jackdog will ever be moved by the facts presented, but for the rest of you who might be wondering, here are some changes/updates to consider that I managed to grab from just one sticky post here. Most of these changes were very successful, some certainly less than others (arena) but all have been made available and can affect/impact game play.
Legends of Norrath is an online-only trading card game, based on the richly-detailed sword-and-sorcery world of Norrath from the massively multiplayer online role-playing games EverQuest and EverQuest II. Playable from within the MMOs and separately, Oathbound, the first set for Legends of Norrath features over 375 digital cards and is available in both a 55-card digital starter deck and 15-card digital booster packs. Play as one of many Oathbound avatars and decide your own fate as you choose between the paths of good or evil.
No game is perfect, of course, but there are a lot of people (old and new to the game) posting here who can attest to the fact that EQ2 is a heckuva lot of fun to play. And really, that is the point of it all.
yea i play on a lgiht rp/pvp serevr and i see people but i know theres alot else where
im only in the starting areas
So many of the changes with EQ2 had to do with the success of WoW. A couple of examples would be 1) Soloability and 2) Quest finding.
When EQ2 was first released, it wasn`t nearly as solo friendly. I remember how there were groups of Heroic ^^^ everywhere when the game first released. This is how the game was developed, much like EQ1 that wasn`t solo friendly. The other example I gave was quest finding. The quest giver icons make finding quests so much easier and that idea was borrowed from WoW. There use to be no icon over the quest givers like in EQ1.
I don`t believe the game was so rushed to market. It ran pretty good from the start, although it did have some bugs here and there just like all MMO`s. SOE was just making EQ2 from their experience with EQ1 but WoW really took over and SOE had to adapt and learn from Blizzard.
I think EQ2 is a better game than WoW now. All of the changes have been for the better IMHO. I`m just glad that SOE was willing to adapt and change instead of insisting to keep things like they were at launch.
Neriak is a free download.
Most MMORPGs have learned a great deal from WoW. People with any sort of life have no time for camping mobs for days on end, spending hours retrieving corpses etc. The hardcore EQ1 style still has its niche, that's why the game is still relatively popular after all these years but the majority of people just want to log in for a couple of hours, achieve something worthwhile then log off.
What is great about EQ2 today is that the game has become more accessible while still maintaining a depth of gameplay that WoW has never had. There is no 'easymode' but at the same time there is no mindless timesinks and frustrations.
Its the nature of the beast. MMOs are constantly changing and evolving based on what the player base wants and is willing to pay for. EQ2 is so much better now because SoE actually listened to the customers and implemented things that they wanted. Before release its hard to judge what the vast majority of people will respond to, even with extensive Beta programs. EQ2 was a lot deeper than WoW. But EQ2 has now borrowed some of the better aspects of WoW, such as armor sets and more user friendly functions (like easy to see quest icons and solo quest lines).
Now if only they would borrow the Battlegrounds :P Would make a nice distraction from PvE without constantly being in PvP mode.
From John Smedleys "NGE apology interview at warcry
"[We're] refocusing SOE on high quality and not rushing releases," said of his coming crop of games. They learned many valuable lessons from EverQuest II and its head-to-head competition against World of Warcraft. Fact was, while both games did rather well, WoW had the budget, time and polish that EverQuest II did not. What's more, EQII was the first attempt at an MMO sequel, a mistake Smedley readily admits.
Even Smedley admits that the game was rushed. There were numerous problems with the game that had a very drastic effect on people choosing to cancel. Some were just outright terrible game design choices like shared xp debt and so many keyed zones that required everyone to get rare drop keys to progress through common dungeons. Some where oversights in Q/A like level 30 boss mobs dropping level 20 items (anyone else recall the over abundance of round shields only rogues would use even though they were a duel wield class?) or "solo" quest chains that had group encounter right in the middle of the chain. The game had memory leaks and serious lag issues caused by the game engine wanting to draw everything in view distance even if it wasn't to be displayed on the screen. The quest system, craft system and class system all saw massive "revamps" the first year or so. Everyone looked the same from level 10+ due to lack of customization (from the uni skeleton design). Even the first few adventure packs and expansion were rushed out unfinished (I beta tested them with the devs and saw first hand).
The game had some good elements and it was playable for the most part, but it was plagued with problems that touched just about every aspect of the game. The game wasn't vanguard bad, but it missed on many levels which is why people left. I played on the test server full time and got to interact with devs for a long time. They are very passionate about making the game fun and I honestly believe they have good intentions. It was very obvious when they were being forced to put an update out or making a sweeping change that they didn't believe in just by the way they would interact with us or have no comments on certain changes. I truely believe the devs want to listen to the players, but it is also obvious that someone else is calling shots on major aspects. Especially time release timeframs of patches and expansions.
Anyhow, thats all the past, but it was the final straw for me with SOE. EQ2 could be top notch now or just the same as it was as far as I know. I have drank the kool aid and bought their apologies and PR spin to many times to give them a blind faith trial again. I am not criticising anyone who plays the game, just that had SOE managed their products better they would be in an overall better state and position than they are now.
One thing is for sure though, Smed and Brad were better off making games than running companies.
I have tried many times to get into this game and just cannot do it.The game design was never very player friendly.Forced grouping when the game was first introduced said it all about the arrogance)and ignorance) of the people making the design decisions.Blizzard saw that and did the exact opposite with great solo options and and more player friendly crafting system.But some designers never learn. (we all saw how the original designers of EQ had not learned a thing when the designed the flop called Vanguard with its forced grouping and crafting system from H%&@.
Eq2 is a decent game but its missing a lot of what other games like wow offer. For example:
Some downfalls to eq2 is a drab world design, uninteresting use of colours and textures, a particle system that bogs a decent pc down like nothing, overall generally more laggy. It has a lot of loading from one city zone to the next.. Eq2 is run by sony which think timesinks are fun. Timesinks in finding gear, and masters. Although timesinks are necessary, sony over does it I think. Eq2 also has a lot on uninteresting loot.. No real way to mod your toon out so your different from one class to the next except via legendary or fabled gear.. No rare imbueable items or rare items to craft, just the standard crafting imbues which are rather boring and have a feeling of linear design and implementation.
I've played eq2 off and on since launch, made a 70 defiler (main raider 6 days a week) ,70 assassin, 70 sk .. I can attest more to eq2 than wow since I only played wow for 2 month on a shaman to lvl 46. The problems i find in wow are boring and slow combat. Same spells every 2 levels just new ranks. Im pretty much canceling my wow account because the combat is uninteresting to me. Its really too slow and I hate having to drink after every mob I kill. Wows has no group dynamics at all.. I like fast paced combat and action with little downtime. Don't tell me to go play another game.. Theres no hardcore rpg mmo's out there with a real mmo world design or payment option out there.
In a nutshell, I would take wows world design, layout, particle system, and slap eq2 mechanics right over top of it for a pretty decent and fun game. And when I say wows world design I don't mean azeroth, I mean the actual layout and use of colours, placement, etc.. Call the world or game whatever you want.. Im not giddy over either wow or eq2s theme or lore... In fact I find them both boring.. Im strictly referring to design and mechanics.
And I know theres more pro's to WoW than I listed.. Bare with my lack of knowledge about WoW since Im basically a 2 month old noob.
I also wanted to mention one last thing I totally despise about eq2. In eq2 at level 70, theres really not much to do outside of grouping and raiding. The lockout timers are retarded imo. The only really solo friendly place for a level 70 is poets palace.. And you can run it once a day basically. Eq2 needs more solo friendly zones with no timers. A larger more diverse loot table. So for example, I should be able to go solo some zone over and over again for 8 hrs a day and not get bored of the loot. I would have fabled recipe drops for each crafter/class, I would have legendary gear recipes for all levels and varying mods to appeal to each class.
Wow does something to this effect and allows crafters to craft some decent items. Plus by removing the lockouts you don't restrict players.. Which equates to forming groups easier if people can just pickup and do whatever others are advertising to do.
its funny to see jackdog talk about how eq2 is dumbed down , when he is playing the most dumbed down game out there LOTRO
Maybe you enjoy killing greys in WoW but i dont
I'll take the EQ2 mentor system or COH sidekick system anytime - over killing WoW greys.
As a 70, grouping with a lvl 30,
I want to have fun too and not just destroy some instance in "GOD mode"
Mentor system also allows you to do old grey quests - at the level they were intended for.
EQ2 fan sites
Yeah I like the way EQ2 did mentoring so you can play with friends who just started the game. CoH was brilliant for coming up with the idea though I don't like how they did it.
Metatrinox, shaman is an ugly class to level. Neither of the "offensive" trees have much variety until you go to dungeons/raids. Only a few classes have mana issues while leveling and most of those can get around it with proper gearing/talents builds. But like EQ2, WoW is mostly about the 60-70 levels now. Next month they are vastly increasing XP gained and lower the amoung of XP neede for levels 20-60. Smart move overall.
I enjoyed the irony as well. I've read posts here pretty often, and it seems Jackdog just comes here to bash this game and boast the garbage that is LOTRO.
funny but 2 or 3 years ago the WoW fans were bashing me as a SOE fanboy
Just aused I moved on now I am a SOE troll.
I stand by my statements, the game was and still is pretty good. It is just way too top heavy and has not done much as far as innovative development over the years. The game is just over the hill and on a steady downhill slide, like the OP said stick a fork in it. Even when SOE comes up with a good idea such as SWG and EQII they seem to just hose it up more and more as time passes.
I miss DAoC
"Granted thinking for yourself could be considered a timesink of shorter or longer duration depending on how smart..or how dumb you are."
So, I start this thread with good intentions and I put forth ideas that spawn pages of very thoughtful replies, addressing many likes and dislikes of the game.
But then there's this one person who wants to make a personal attack:
I did not read the rest of your post.
FOR A T T E N T I O N. You lied, misled, and stirred people up for attention.
Of course he didn't read the rest of my post. That would imply a desire to know what he's talking about.
Why is there always that one guy like this?
I did, however, research my problem and found that I was mistaken. I had originally set out to roll on the AB server but I'd actually rolled on a different one altogether, where the new player area was empty. Sorry, my mistake. I've admitted it and corrected it. You just read it.
For the record, I really don't need the attention. I obviously get a lot of attention, and I don't use caps lock. But thank you for stopping by to contribute nothing meaningful whatsoever. I hope it gained for you whatever it was you were looking for. I'd look forward to never again running into a backwards little cuss like this again in any facet of life, but I get the feeling I'd be dissappointed sometime going to sleep and getting in rush hour traffic and, if not then, certainly by the end of the day.
...
Very few "named" mobs actually drop loot outside of dungeons and even those that do drop the same items as the unnamed mob right next to them. Items like that are so plentiful it isn't even worth breaking a sweat over. Inside dungeons you get your own personal instance so no level 40 rode up and killed your mob there. You can farm low level dungeons to your hears content without running into other players. Get gear for your alt or to sell on the auction it is up to you. If that was all it took for you to quit that is pretty thin.Because the devs don't put an artificial cap on what you can benefit from and not everything in the game remains of value. That isn't so in the case of EQ2 which has disposable content because of this. Not to mention there are many instances of players leaving someone mentored at the zone in and farming the dungeon with their high level character. Plenty of EQ2 stories of kill stealing dungeons from low level characters. I'm not sure if that has been fixed, but it was an ugly side to the sunshine community of EQ2.
Maybe you were actually playing another game and just did not know it..
Cheers!
" No real way to mod your toon out so your different from one class to the next except via legendary or fabled gear.. AND AA's, and appearance tabs, and titles, and mounts... etc. etc. No rare imbueable items or rare items to craft, just the standard crafting imbues which are rather boring and have a feeling of linear design and implementation. What?!?! You play(ed) this game, really? Never heard of ADORNMENTS, or Fabled crafted items, or even Mastercrafted items?"
I just wanted to reply to this part, yes I am aware of adornments.. My overall point was that even though there is AA's and adornments; there is always a best mod or aa line to pick. Which in the end offers no real varying difference from one assassin to the next.. Or one defiler to the next because they all have the same adornments and mostly the same AA's. The AA's will vary a bit from one player to the next but there is a best build for a raid defiler, and I guarantee any raid defiler with half a brain uses the same lines or similar lines because 2 out of 5 shaman lines are useless.
My overall point is, there is always a best way to build a toon for a set situation. And by saying aa's and adornments offer variety is somewhat misleading because there is always a best adornment for a specific healer item that every healer uses.. Or there is always a best AA build for maximizing your raid healer etc.. The only real difference between players is what loot they have equipped. And even end game raiders all end up in 95% of the same gear as the next end game raider, with the same adornments and same aa build..
When I mentioned crafting imbues, I meant something along the lines of adding lets say we take the 6 main resist types of magic, heat, cold, mental, poison,disease and allow crafters to imbue weapons that do added damage of one of the types of resists to add variance from one player to the next.
Ok so joe assassin has 2 weapons, both do piercing damage as a base dmg type, he then gets an imbue to add heat damage. His weapons now appear to drip fire and glow with a flame effect.
Another assassin has the exact same weapons that do piercing damage, he instead adds cold damage imbues to his weapons. His weapons now look frosted and iced over etc to let others know what hes done to his weapons.
You then take all your mobs in the game and make them so some are more resistant to certain damage types than others making players then think about what kinda elemental damage they would do count as part of their strategy. To me this adds a great deal of thinking and knowing what will work best on what mob. This also adds another layer of thinking in pvp as you well know each armor piece offers varying resistance etc..
I didn't go into too much detail though because I honestly didn't expect any replies directly, nor did I think anyone would read 15 paragraphs of details and explanations.
Very few "named" mobs actually drop loot outside of dungeons and even those that do drop the same items as the unnamed mob right next to them. Items like that are so plentiful it isn't even worth breaking a sweat over. Inside dungeons you get your own personal instance so no level 40 rode up and killed your mob there. You can farm low level dungeons to your hears content without running into other players. Get gear for your alt or to sell on the auction it is up to you. If that was all it took for you to quit that is pretty thin.Because the devs don't put an artificial cap on what you can benefit from and not everything in the game remains of value. That isn't so in the case of EQ2 which has disposable content because of this. Not to mention there are many instances of players leaving someone mentored at the zone in and farming the dungeon with their high level character. Plenty of EQ2 stories of kill stealing dungeons from low level characters. I'm not sure if that has been fixed, but it was an ugly side to the sunshine community of EQ2.
"Because the devs don't put an artificial cap on what you can benefit from and not everything in the game remains of value."Yes exactly, replay value is higher in wow because of this. Its little things like this blizzard has done better imo than sony. I think sony's overall thinking was that for someone to grind low level areas as a mentored high level, you need a 2nd account.. Which means 30/month and not 15/month.. Because in wow you could just go to a lower level dungeon on your main, farm the loot and mail it off to your alt. The only issues that I seen arise in wow, was bind on pickup blue items which is basically vendor trash. Other than that though farming green items was a replay value to me which eq2 lacked except if you had multiple accounts.