I have tried the rest - just about every MMO out there.
But I keep coming back to WoW.
Does that mean it's the best? I don't know, you can talk sales figures / servers stats whatever... None of that really matters.
After playing the rest, I find WoW to be the best. And that's all that matters to me.
That being said, comparing WoW to older games I played, classic UO, Earth and Beyond, SWG... it's like comparing apples and oranges. Different games, different themes, different time period in MMOG history...
I'm very happy the genre has gone in the direction it went, but there is still much room for improvement. I hope games like Warhammer can improve on the positive steps forward WoW took.
I have the exact opposite opinion. I beta-tested for EQ and played it for a few years since release. It is a camp-fest that is boring, difficult to advance unless you put in an ungodly amount of time.
WOW fixes all that. It is 100x the game EQ was. It makes grinding more fun by a) eliminating down-time (remember the horrible 10 min sitting regen mana with nothing to do), b) eliminating camping (faster respawn + instances) and c) makes grinding more fun by adding quests. WOW is also a lot more polished and the attention to details is a lot better than EQ.
You are correct WoW is a lot more polished and the gameplay was very grind-based. However, what I'm saying is from my experience the best sense of adventure and memories I had I found in Everquest. WoW to me pales in comparison to that because to me I found WoW and Everquest to be two different games with WoW having more in common with it's battle.net routes of Warcraft and the like(which I am a big fan of incidentally) and Everquest maybe having more in common with a rpg like Morrowind except admittedly with a bit more naff gameplay. WoW is much stronger in gameplay, while to many pre Everquest players Everquest was stronger in immersion and community.
WOW has a very large community so your view may depend on the people you have interacted with. Since I am not you, I won't disagree on this issue.
However, I disagree that EQ is stronger in immersion. EQ is essentially a 3D dikumud and the interaction with the world is very limited. In fact, the only things you can interact with, are the mobs. While WOW is not great in this dept, at least least there are many objectives you can gather, and some you can use to invoke different effects in quests. Furthermore, there are lots of little animations (abate non-interactive) to bring WOW zones alive (like L1 snakes slithering around, NPCs playing catch ....). EQ has none of those (mainly because of technology limitations during its time). And we don't even have to go to the graphics & art direction.
I actually don't see EQ & WOW are that different. WOW seems like a superset, version 2.0 of EQ with some of these other things added in.
That being said, comparing WoW to older games I played, classic UO, Earth and Beyond, SWG... it's like comparing apples and oranges. Different games, different themes, different time period in MMOG history...
Really? UO, SWG are obviously very different. However, I found that WOW and EQ is similar at the core except WOW is a like quest-focused, super set, version 2.0 of EQ (with all its features and some more).
I wonder why people often use "best selling" and the amount of subscriptions as arguments to justify if the game is any good.
The most sheep jumping off a cliff does not equal best in my book. WoW did alot of things right for me. Jack-of-all-trades, introduced me to the genre, VERY easy to get into and a bit of a sandbox. I've outgrown it and so will many more who had WoW as the game that introduced them to the genre.
Seriously, I would have never ever thought that MMORPG was going to be my cup of tea, but it is and now I want more. More difficulty, a better (read: mature) community and better graphics.
Edit: damn, beating a dead topic with a stick.
Add in universal critically acclaim as well. If everything that can define a game as good doesn't make it good, what does? Great reviews, huge sales, loads of happy customers, ect. What more can a game do to make it good?
If having no players, no critical acclaim, and bad reviews can make a MMO great, than just throw it all out the window because nothing matters at that point=)
Be happy. You're one of many that would've found older MMOs a hard pill to swallow. Thats why you never bothered playing them before WOW. Luckily you can easily go back and try them now. Just be prepared for a shock.
Please google the false analogy called "The Bandwagon Appeal". Just because something is popular doesn't mean it's the best.
If success only means if you personally like something, a MMO can have 10k players and be great. For me, if only 10k people think its worth playing its not a good game. Successful and great only matter from 3rd party perspective. WOW has the best critical reviews, the most sales, which means the most happy players. How can a game that appeals to so many people AND all the critics not be considered great. Its certainly the best in those particular areas. Its forced other developer to bail out of the business, cancel production or change their design. What other MMOs have done that? You didn't see everyone copying UO, Eve or AC do you?
Then again, its all personal opinion. A text based MUDD from 20 yrs ago can be considered the best by some people here. It really doesn't matter though. Great games are judged by how many people agree that its great. By all accounts WOW is a great game and the people that disagree frankly don't matter. History has already proven WOW to be one of the best MMOs ever made.
If you think the sky is pink with purple polka dots, but 100 Million other people on the planet think its blue most of the time, what color is the sky? Its blue.
If success only means if you personally like something, a MMO can have 10k players and be great. For me, if only 10k people think its worth playing its not a good game. Successful and great only matter from 3rd party perspective. WOW has the best critical reviews, the most sales, which means the most happy players. How can a game that appeals to so many people AND all the critics not be considered great. Its certainly the best in those particular areas. Its forced other developer to bail out of the business, cancel production or change their design. What other MMOs have done that? You didn't see everyone copying UO, Eve or AC do you? Then again, its all personal opinion. A text based MUDD from 20 yrs ago can be considered the best by some people here. It really doesn't matter though. Great games are judged by how many people agree that its great. By all accounts WOW is a great game and the people that disagree frankly don't matter. History has already proven WOW to be one of the best MMOs ever made. If you think the sky is pink with purple polka dots, but 100 Million other people on the planet think its blue most of the time, what color is the sky? Its blue.
So if everyone else like it, its a good game, else its crap? 1 million trillion flies cant be wrong. Shit is good. Silly little man. The majority of the people on this planet like commercial disco/techno music. That doesnt mean its good music.
Read Heerobyas post. Dont always agree with this person when I read the posts but he/she got a point, and a good one even. Personal taste is all that matters. Not that alot of people like it.
I've played quite a few MMOs but WoW has always been my 'home' for the last 3 years since it's release. I just don't know any other game with so much polish and balance. It's not perfect, but the end game 25man and even the 10man raiding encounters really do introduce a challenge which require a level of skill and communication to nail. No other MMO has these levels of complexity in any encounter, without question.
If success only means if you personally like something, a MMO can have 10k players and be great. For me, if only 10k people think its worth playing its not a good game. Successful and great only matter from 3rd party perspective.
So if everyone else like it, its a good game, else its crap? 1 million trillion flies cant be wrong. Shit is good. Silly little man. The majority of the people on this planet like commercial disco/techno music. That doesnt mean its good music.
Those 1 trillion flies can't be wrong if they think some game is successfull. That's because there is no objective "successfull" or "unsuccessfull" game. "Success" is only determined by each person, or fly, evaluating something, it's only a point of view, and in the end even if all flies had diffirent opinions on wether WoW is successfull or not, none of them would be wrong.
But when we want to talk about something objective, we need to determine some kind of "average opinion", or "general opinion" about success. And use that as our objective definition of "success". And even then, the trillion flies wouldn't be wrong, since they'd be majority. Success would be determined by their opinion, and they'd be right by default no matter what they'd think.
So if you claim that WoW isn't successfull. Either you are wrong (by using the objective definition of majority's opinion), or it is only your subjective opinion wich isn't of any concern to anyone since you are minority anyway.
PS. WoW is good.
EDIT: Slask777 edited his post after I had started writing this /EDIT
Wow was okey had a lot of fun for a year or so, but the best in my book will always be everquest 1, likely cause it was my first mmo back in 2001 but right now i like anarchy online, the only one i currently subscribe to.
Used to have soe all access so could play eq1,eq2,swg,the matrix, vanguard(great game to), also played horizons, eve and of course wow.
My first toon in anarchy online is made in may 2001 and right now i have 3 active accounts having great fun.
If WoW was a MMO game it would have been the best ever. But it's not. It's Diablo3, you can choose to play it solo or choose to team up. Teaming up gives a better chance of better drops, but at the risk that someone might steal those drops.
If WoW's characters had only 30% of the power they do now. If teaming was allways an advantage, instead of a disadvantage. WoW would be great.
I loved making new alts in Anarchy Online, as I allways met new people.
I have a level 70 bm (beast master) spec hunter ..horde faction ..firetree pvp server...Gotmullets..Im not the best player there but i try .. and i have beta tested several mmo games fps games and strat games ..also have played them after the beta tests.. I like wow .. it takes up time .. blizzard keeps the graphics lower than other games so it can play on more systems which is nice ... some servers lag a bit in the more populated areas but most are okay. You can download and make your own mods to help improve game play for your self and or others. some of the community can be annoying but if you play any fps game or any other mmo then its the same as the majority of the others. yes wow does take grinding to level grinding to gain new toys grinding in groups ..and so do A LOT of other mmo games.. Being in a bunch of groups for raiding I have NEVER had some one ninja loot.. I did solo most of the game with my hunter ... its really easy mode with hunter.. I do see alot of people whinning about how there is no rp to wow... lol.. well thats just not blizzards fault its mostly the rp type people out there.. if you have more rp people then they will have made more rp servers and would take better care of them.. plus when the few rp people come to the normal or pvp servers they get made fun of.. which i dont think is too nice but its not wows fault.. thats the people of the world doing that .. I have played since just after beta.. and have experienced the pvp when it was just world pvp WHICH was awesome and still some times is.. I have seen other games where people say the pvp is way way better except its really not lol .. most are not user friendly.. which is another reason why wow is doing so well. But back to the pvp they now have a some what fun arena style pvp which im not that good at but still have some fun in it..and you get some decent gear from.... I would say if you can afford to pay for a game .. try wow for sure.. it is fun .. It does offer stuff for the more hardcore player that wants a challenge ... also wow wouldnt be doing so well right now if they were not good. I have played sims online, runescape, everquest, city of heroes /villains, final fantasy xI, vangaurd, archlord, ultima online, second life, starwars galaxies, eve online, D&D online and alot of the free stuff well runescape falls there lol.. I love to game.
Played Wow- left Wow, tried many others- came back to Wow, left Wow waited for others- tried them, back to Wow. Does this sound familiar? It does? Truth is- Wow gets repetative- can be annoying - is at times DULL, but still unbeaten by other MMORPGs. By design, but probably mostly accident - Blizzard got lots of the game right (not all), but enough to make people want to come back, once they have had a rest. I await War- but something tells me- it wont be long before people who leave Wow for War will be back. You've tried the rest Wow is the best !
However, I disagree that EQ is stronger in immersion
as well you might. You have your opinion and I have mine. Personally any sort of immersion for me in WoW was detracted because of its art style and its community. But as I say gameplay wise WoW is a lot more richer in.
Please google the false analogy called "The Bandwagon Appeal". Just because something is popular doesn't mean it's the best.
I think the problem is you're getting more into a debate of "successful" as opposed to "the best".
I don't think anyone who doesn't like something... will ever concede its the best.
I don't like WoW but I don't like any of the MMO's like it... EQ1 etc etc
UO and SWG Pre-CU for me thanks.
So its hard for me to call it the best.. I can say its probably the best of its "kind" but its certainly the most successful.
If I was benefitting off the money this game is making.. I'd certainly think it was the best.
Actually, it's quite the opposite. If we were talking about how successful WoW was, I would say that it is one of the most successful MMOs of all time, if not the most successful. I'm talking about how people say WoW is the best MMO simply because the number of subscribers it has. This is an extremely ignorant argument.
The truth is that there is no "best" MMO since everyone has higher standards, lower standards, and personal taste. I believe the gamers who came later (maybe after Pre-CU SWG, or even some from Pre-CU SWG) have MUCH lower standards for games today and have a horrible taste in MMOs (my personal oppinion of course). Hence why so many MMO "veterans" hate ever MMO that comes out.
I'll stick with the MMOs that actually had what MMOs were famous for and what made them so fun. Freedom. Something the idiot MMO developers today can never imagine. UO and DAoC baby.
Originally posted by WesKhan1 The truth is that there is no "best" MMO since everyone has higher standards, lower standards, and personal taste. I believe the gamers who came later (maybe after Pre-CU SWG, or even some from Pre-CU SWG) have MUCH lower standards for games today and have a horrible taste in MMOs (my personal oppinion of course). Hence why so many MMO "veterans" hate ever MMO that comes out.
I'll stick with the MMOs that actually had what MMOs were famous for and what made them so fun. Freedom. Something the idiot MMO developers today can never imagine. UO and DAoC baby.
Not *this* MMO veteran.
Furthermore, I beta-tested for UO. It is a pk-fest with boring gathering activities. Freedom is pretty worthless without the right content to go with it.
WoW was the first MMO that i really got into so i would have to say it was my best experience. AC was cool but i really didn't know what was going on. But i feel i've "outgrown" WoW and pretty much any mmo out right now. None of them have been able to hold my attention for longer then a week or so. I'd love a sandbox mmo where things actually have an impact on the world as a whole but doubt we'll see a game do that right for a while so i'll settle for some pvp fun in Warhammer and AOC when they come out.
WoW had a very well known name and Blizzard has a cult-like following from some portion of the gaming world. It combined that will great marketing, but mostly it was right place at the right time.
WoW is still fairly new and the game was so-so, had absolutely no competition and because of this it is still played to this day. That doesn't mean it was all that great. It just fell in to the right time and the right place between the complex, indepth first Tier MMORPGs i.e. EverQuest and Asheron's Call and modern games which all are fairly simplistic and basically bad..
Modern games lost their direction and spend all their time working on silly things and missing the depth and developement of the character which is WHY most of us play these things. WoW added some 'end game' stuff that kept the hardcore gamers around longer and added a little lame PvP for that crowd too.
It is popular because it is popular. When real competition comes around, WoW will fade in to legend. It will set a population standard that will not be touched for a very long time, but population does not make something good and well made. i.e. Nike, Budweisser, ad infinitum.
The best game is now outdated, as all games eventually become, but hands down the single best game ever in the MMORPG world was...
Asheron's Call.
PS Edit to add... WoW also took advantage of the timing of the cheaper computers and internet access that hit at about the time WoW launched. WoW is very much like the simplistic console games from Nintendo and it was a perfect transition from consoles to computer games for the huge number of people that 'discovered' the genre around 2004. It is polished, sort of. But it is still just a simplistic game that caters to the starter-MMO crowd.
"The reality of the poor in America isn't the difference between The Haves and The Have Nots, it is the difference between The Haves and The Have Lots."
While you cannot deny the success of WoW, its quality is wide open for discussion... the 'its the most succesful mmo ever so must be the best' argumentis so weak - just cos Pussycat Dolls hit #1, doesnt mean they are at all musically gifted. Its a case of 'look who you're asking' - free your mind and your ass will follow.
I played pre-BC - maxed at 60 and spent a few months in Molten Core, Blackwing etc.. the PVP was pish, although Alterac Valley was not so bad. But what the hell is a Capture-the-flag style game doing in a fantasy MMO? Yeh, like you'd attack an enemy base to capture a flag. Nope. You'd invade, and slaughter the enemy to a man (or woman), then wipe your backside on aforementioned flag. No, really...
Once BC was announced, and random dropped greens outperformed the kit you'd spent months and months grinding thru endgame for, thus making all your efforts somewhat pointless, that killed it for me. A year of bitterness and hatred built up toward elves, and they stick an elven army amongst the horde ranks. Yeah. Great.
Guildies /gquit and disconnect mid-raid over loot drops endgame. The fact they'd spent their DKP the week before on the Stupid Cloak of Noobs was irrelevant. 'I've been here x weeks, I want that item, it should be mine' - the game seemed to appeal to peoples basic selfishness and greed, as the world was flooded with MMO newbies who aren't used to a guild/team/group/party style environment. Thus don't know how to play nicely with others, apart from casually tossing the occasional, and unemotional 'gratz' at a leveling party member. The game turned into a crappy shopping game at best. Hours spent poring over thotbot to see who dropped what, and how often. 'Today I'm raiding X cos I want Y'. Not something I ever subscribed to.
Graphically, there are better MMORPGS - prettier gameworlds, better quests, better trading and crafting systems. (EQ2's old crafting system - half a day to make a chair, now THATS crafting) The '4 strips of leather, a piece of string - CLICK - Theres your armour' fisher-price style crafting from Wow. Poor. That was one step away from skinning a suit of armour from a wolf. (on sidenote, why would a wolf carry armour? Or coins for that matter?)
So please. Someone kindly explain to me what makes WOW so great. Maybe I've missed the point.
Originally posted by WesKhan1 The truth is that there is no "best" MMO since everyone has higher standards, lower standards, and personal taste. I believe the gamers who came later (maybe after Pre-CU SWG, or even some from Pre-CU SWG) have MUCH lower standards for games today and have a horrible taste in MMOs (my personal oppinion of course). Hence why so many MMO "veterans" hate ever MMO that comes out.
I'll stick with the MMOs that actually had what MMOs were famous for and what made them so fun. Freedom. Something the idiot MMO developers today can never imagine. UO and DAoC baby.
Not *this* MMO veteran.
Furthermore, I beta-tested for UO. It is a pk-fest with boring gathering activities. Freedom is pretty worthless without the right content to go with it.
There are always exceptions. Of course not every veteran will think the same way.
Originally posted by WesKhan1 The truth is that there is no "best" MMO since everyone has higher standards, lower standards, and personal taste. I believe the gamers who came later (maybe after Pre-CU SWG, or even some from Pre-CU SWG) have MUCH lower standards for games today and have a horrible taste in MMOs (my personal oppinion of course). Hence why so many MMO "veterans" hate ever MMO that comes out.
I'll stick with the MMOs that actually had what MMOs were famous for and what made them so fun. Freedom. Something the idiot MMO developers today can never imagine. UO and DAoC baby.
Not *this* MMO veteran.
Furthermore, I beta-tested for UO. It is a pk-fest with boring gathering activities. Freedom is pretty worthless without the right content to go with it.
There are always exceptions. Of course not every veteran will think the same way.
What were your thoughts on DAoC?
To be honest, i ever really played DAoC. I stopped MMORPGing for a while after EQ (for family reasons). However, I was intrigued enough about DAoC to do some research on it (read up on classes, FAQ and what not). I was pretty impressed.
Comments
I have tried the rest - just about every MMO out there.
But I keep coming back to WoW.
Does that mean it's the best? I don't know, you can talk sales figures / servers stats whatever... None of that really matters.
After playing the rest, I find WoW to be the best. And that's all that matters to me.
That being said, comparing WoW to older games I played, classic UO, Earth and Beyond, SWG... it's like comparing apples and oranges. Different games, different themes, different time period in MMOG history...
I'm very happy the genre has gone in the direction it went, but there is still much room for improvement. I hope games like Warhammer can improve on the positive steps forward WoW took.
You are correct WoW is a lot more polished and the gameplay was very grind-based. However, what I'm saying is from my experience the best sense of adventure and memories I had I found in Everquest. WoW to me pales in comparison to that because to me I found WoW and Everquest to be two different games with WoW having more in common with it's battle.net routes of Warcraft and the like(which I am a big fan of incidentally) and Everquest maybe having more in common with a rpg like Morrowind except admittedly with a bit more naff gameplay. WoW is much stronger in gameplay, while to many pre Everquest players Everquest was stronger in immersion and community.
WOW has a very large community so your view may depend on the people you have interacted with. Since I am not you, I won't disagree on this issue.
However, I disagree that EQ is stronger in immersion. EQ is essentially a 3D dikumud and the interaction with the world is very limited. In fact, the only things you can interact with, are the mobs. While WOW is not great in this dept, at least least there are many objectives you can gather, and some you can use to invoke different effects in quests. Furthermore, there are lots of little animations (abate non-interactive) to bring WOW zones alive (like L1 snakes slithering around, NPCs playing catch ....). EQ has none of those (mainly because of technology limitations during its time). And we don't even have to go to the graphics & art direction.
I actually don't see EQ & WOW are that different. WOW seems like a superset, version 2.0 of EQ with some of these other things added in.
Really? UO, SWG are obviously very different. However, I found that WOW and EQ is similar at the core except WOW is a like quest-focused, super set, version 2.0 of EQ (with all its features and some more).
Add in universal critically acclaim as well. If everything that can define a game as good doesn't make it good, what does? Great reviews, huge sales, loads of happy customers, ect. What more can a game do to make it good?
If having no players, no critical acclaim, and bad reviews can make a MMO great, than just throw it all out the window because nothing matters at that point=)
Be happy. You're one of many that would've found older MMOs a hard pill to swallow. Thats why you never bothered playing them before WOW. Luckily you can easily go back and try them now. Just be prepared for a shock.
Please google the false analogy called "The Bandwagon Appeal". Just because something is popular doesn't mean it's the best.
I don't think anyone who doesn't like something... will ever concede its the best.
I don't like WoW but I don't like any of the MMO's like it... EQ1 etc etc
UO and SWG Pre-CU for me thanks.
So its hard for me to call it the best.. I can say its probably the best of its "kind" but its certainly the most successful.
If I was benefitting off the money this game is making.. I'd certainly think it was the best.
If success only means if you personally like something, a MMO can have 10k players and be great. For me, if only 10k people think its worth playing its not a good game. Successful and great only matter from 3rd party perspective. WOW has the best critical reviews, the most sales, which means the most happy players. How can a game that appeals to so many people AND all the critics not be considered great. Its certainly the best in those particular areas. Its forced other developer to bail out of the business, cancel production or change their design. What other MMOs have done that? You didn't see everyone copying UO, Eve or AC do you?
Then again, its all personal opinion. A text based MUDD from 20 yrs ago can be considered the best by some people here. It really doesn't matter though. Great games are judged by how many people agree that its great. By all accounts WOW is a great game and the people that disagree frankly don't matter. History has already proven WOW to be one of the best MMOs ever made.
If you think the sky is pink with purple polka dots, but 100 Million other people on the planet think its blue most of the time, what color is the sky? Its blue.
So if everyone else like it, its a good game, else its crap? 1 million trillion flies cant be wrong. Shit is good. Silly little man. The majority of the people on this planet like commercial disco/techno music. That doesnt mean its good music.
Read Heerobyas post. Dont always agree with this person when I read the posts but he/she got a point, and a good one even. Personal taste is all that matters. Not that alot of people like it.
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Grammar nazi's. This one is for you.
I've played quite a few MMOs but WoW has always been my 'home' for the last 3 years since it's release. I just don't know any other game with so much polish and balance. It's not perfect, but the end game 25man and even the 10man raiding encounters really do introduce a challenge which require a level of skill and communication to nail. No other MMO has these levels of complexity in any encounter, without question.
So if everyone else like it, its a good game, else its crap? 1 million trillion flies cant be wrong. Shit is good. Silly little man. The majority of the people on this planet like commercial disco/techno music. That doesnt mean its good music.
Those 1 trillion flies can't be wrong if they think some game is successfull. That's because there is no objective "successfull" or "unsuccessfull" game. "Success" is only determined by each person, or fly, evaluating something, it's only a point of view, and in the end even if all flies had diffirent opinions on wether WoW is successfull or not, none of them would be wrong.
But when we want to talk about something objective, we need to determine some kind of "average opinion", or "general opinion" about success. And use that as our objective definition of "success". And even then, the trillion flies wouldn't be wrong, since they'd be majority. Success would be determined by their opinion, and they'd be right by default no matter what they'd think.
So if you claim that WoW isn't successfull. Either you are wrong (by using the objective definition of majority's opinion), or it is only your subjective opinion wich isn't of any concern to anyone since you are minority anyway.
PS. WoW is good.
EDIT: Slask777 edited his post after I had started writing this /EDIT
Wow was okey had a lot of fun for a year or so, but the best in my book will always be everquest 1, likely cause it was my first mmo back in 2001 but right now i like anarchy online, the only one i currently subscribe to.
Used to have soe all access so could play eq1,eq2,swg,the matrix, vanguard(great game to), also played horizons, eve and of course wow.
My first toon in anarchy online is made in may 2001 and right now i have 3 active accounts having great fun.
If WoW was a MMO game it would have been the best ever. But it's not. It's Diablo3, you can choose to play it solo or choose to team up. Teaming up gives a better chance of better drops, but at the risk that someone might steal those drops.
If WoW's characters had only 30% of the power they do now. If teaming was allways an advantage, instead of a disadvantage. WoW would be great.
I loved making new alts in Anarchy Online, as I allways met new people.
I have a level 70 bm (beast master) spec hunter ..horde faction ..firetree pvp server...Gotmullets..Im not the best player there but i try .. and i have beta tested several mmo games fps games and strat games ..also have played them after the beta tests.. I like wow .. it takes up time .. blizzard keeps the graphics lower than other games so it can play on more systems which is nice ... some servers lag a bit in the more populated areas but most are okay. You can download and make your own mods to help improve game play for your self and or others. some of the community can be annoying but if you play any fps game or any other mmo then its the same as the majority of the others. yes wow does take grinding to level grinding to gain new toys grinding in groups ..and so do A LOT of other mmo games.. Being in a bunch of groups for raiding I have NEVER had some one ninja loot.. I did solo most of the game with my hunter ... its really easy mode with hunter.. I do see alot of people whinning about how there is no rp to wow... lol.. well thats just not blizzards fault its mostly the rp type people out there.. if you have more rp people then they will have made more rp servers and would take better care of them.. plus when the few rp people come to the normal or pvp servers they get made fun of.. which i dont think is too nice but its not wows fault.. thats the people of the world doing that .. I have played since just after beta.. and have experienced the pvp when it was just world pvp WHICH was awesome and still some times is.. I have seen other games where people say the pvp is way way better except its really not lol .. most are not user friendly.. which is another reason why wow is doing so well. But back to the pvp they now have a some what fun arena style pvp which im not that good at but still have some fun in it..and you get some decent gear from.... I would say if you can afford to pay for a game .. try wow for sure.. it is fun .. It does offer stuff for the more hardcore player that wants a challenge ... also wow wouldnt be doing so well right now if they were not good. I have played sims online, runescape, everquest, city of heroes /villains, final fantasy xI, vangaurd, archlord, ultima online, second life, starwars galaxies, eve online, D&D online and alot of the free stuff well runescape falls there lol.. I love to game.
No, WoW isn't the best.
I think the problem is you're getting more into a debate of "successful" as opposed to "the best".I don't think anyone who doesn't like something... will ever concede its the best.
I don't like WoW but I don't like any of the MMO's like it... EQ1 etc etc
UO and SWG Pre-CU for me thanks.
So its hard for me to call it the best.. I can say its probably the best of its "kind" but its certainly the most successful.
If I was benefitting off the money this game is making.. I'd certainly think it was the best.
Actually, it's quite the opposite. If we were talking about how successful WoW was, I would say that it is one of the most successful MMOs of all time, if not the most successful. I'm talking about how people say WoW is the best MMO simply because the number of subscribers it has. This is an extremely ignorant argument.
The truth is that there is no "best" MMO since everyone has higher standards, lower standards, and personal taste. I believe the gamers who came later (maybe after Pre-CU SWG, or even some from Pre-CU SWG) have MUCH lower standards for games today and have a horrible taste in MMOs (my personal oppinion of course). Hence why so many MMO "veterans" hate ever MMO that comes out.
I'll stick with the MMOs that actually had what MMOs were famous for and what made them so fun. Freedom. Something the idiot MMO developers today can never imagine. UO and DAoC baby.
Not *this* MMO veteran.
Furthermore, I beta-tested for UO. It is a pk-fest with boring gathering activities. Freedom is pretty worthless without the right content to go with it.
WoW was the first MMO that i really got into so i would have to say it was my best experience. AC was cool but i really didn't know what was going on. But i feel i've "outgrown" WoW and pretty much any mmo out right now. None of them have been able to hold my attention for longer then a week or so. I'd love a sandbox mmo where things actually have an impact on the world as a whole but doubt we'll see a game do that right for a while so i'll settle for some pvp fun in Warhammer and AOC when they come out.
Nothing more fun than grinding honor or farming for hours and hours!
WoW sucks. 70 gets boring, even raiding...and the pvp is horrible.
The only reason I'd ever come back is to try a new class, but the thought of questing and grinding and gettin another toon to 70...
WoW = Waiting on Warhammer
"Is WoW the best?"
Nope.
WoW had a very well known name and Blizzard has a cult-like following from some portion of the gaming world. It combined that will great marketing, but mostly it was right place at the right time.
WoW is still fairly new and the game was so-so, had absolutely no competition and because of this it is still played to this day. That doesn't mean it was all that great. It just fell in to the right time and the right place between the complex, indepth first Tier MMORPGs i.e. EverQuest and Asheron's Call and modern games which all are fairly simplistic and basically bad..
Modern games lost their direction and spend all their time working on silly things and missing the depth and developement of the character which is WHY most of us play these things. WoW added some 'end game' stuff that kept the hardcore gamers around longer and added a little lame PvP for that crowd too.
It is popular because it is popular. When real competition comes around, WoW will fade in to legend. It will set a population standard that will not be touched for a very long time, but population does not make something good and well made. i.e. Nike, Budweisser, ad infinitum.
The best game is now outdated, as all games eventually become, but hands down the single best game ever in the MMORPG world was...
Asheron's Call.
PS Edit to add... WoW also took advantage of the timing of the cheaper computers and internet access that hit at about the time WoW launched. WoW is very much like the simplistic console games from Nintendo and it was a perfect transition from consoles to computer games for the huge number of people that 'discovered' the genre around 2004. It is polished, sort of. But it is still just a simplistic game that caters to the starter-MMO crowd.
"The reality of the poor in America isn't the difference between The Haves and The Have Nots, it is the difference between The Haves and The Have Lots."
in answer to the OP....
No.
While you cannot deny the success of WoW, its quality is wide open for discussion... the 'its the most succesful mmo ever so must be the best' argument is so weak - just cos Pussycat Dolls hit #1, doesnt mean they are at all musically gifted. Its a case of 'look who you're asking' - free your mind and your ass will follow.
I played pre-BC - maxed at 60 and spent a few months in Molten Core, Blackwing etc.. the PVP was pish, although Alterac Valley was not so bad. But what the hell is a Capture-the-flag style game doing in a fantasy MMO? Yeh, like you'd attack an enemy base to capture a flag. Nope. You'd invade, and slaughter the enemy to a man (or woman), then wipe your backside on aforementioned flag. No, really...
Once BC was announced, and random dropped greens outperformed the kit you'd spent months and months grinding thru endgame for, thus making all your efforts somewhat pointless, that killed it for me. A year of bitterness and hatred built up toward elves, and they stick an elven army amongst the horde ranks. Yeah. Great.
Guildies /gquit and disconnect mid-raid over loot drops endgame. The fact they'd spent their DKP the week before on the Stupid Cloak of Noobs was irrelevant. 'I've been here x weeks, I want that item, it should be mine' - the game seemed to appeal to peoples basic selfishness and greed, as the world was flooded with MMO newbies who aren't used to a guild/team/group/party style environment. Thus don't know how to play nicely with others, apart from casually tossing the occasional, and unemotional 'gratz' at a leveling party member. The game turned into a crappy shopping game at best. Hours spent poring over thotbot to see who dropped what, and how often. 'Today I'm raiding X cos I want Y'. Not something I ever subscribed to.
Graphically, there are better MMORPGS - prettier gameworlds, better quests, better trading and crafting systems. (EQ2's old crafting system - half a day to make a chair, now THATS crafting) The '4 strips of leather, a piece of string - CLICK - Theres your armour' fisher-price style crafting from Wow. Poor. That was one step away from skinning a suit of armour from a wolf. (on sidenote, why would a wolf carry armour? Or coins for that matter?)
So please. Someone kindly explain to me what makes WOW so great. Maybe I've missed the point.
Not *this* MMO veteran.
Furthermore, I beta-tested for UO. It is a pk-fest with boring gathering activities. Freedom is pretty worthless without the right content to go with it.
There are always exceptions. Of course not every veteran will think the same way.What were your thoughts on DAoC?
Not *this* MMO veteran.
Furthermore, I beta-tested for UO. It is a pk-fest with boring gathering activities. Freedom is pretty worthless without the right content to go with it.
There are always exceptions. Of course not every veteran will think the same way.What were your thoughts on DAoC?
To be honest, i ever really played DAoC. I stopped MMORPGing for a while after EQ (for family reasons). However, I was intrigued enough about DAoC to do some research on it (read up on classes, FAQ and what not). I was pretty impressed.
I tried Wow but it is not the best. I don't know why people like it. Almost all the other MMORPG games are exactly like it.
The sword slasher
Nailed it dude.
God: Repent!
Me: I will not repent.
God: What will you do instead?
Me: Sin.
God: Sounds like a plan.