So, how was your trip to Norway? Now let's be frank this has to skew your otherwise unbiased opinions greatly. I was wondering why I kept constantly seeing Acolyte guild banners in the sigs of all these people who were so quick to defend legitmate concerns with AoC. As Lord Acton said .... "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men." - Lord Acton
Actually mate, Norway was this January just gone and was pretty good thanks.
How is anything in my postal response here biased? Its FACT. Unless you want to tell the developers they are lying and you know more about the game? Im just quoting them and your just quoting me quoting them thats all no spin.
Dam right legitimate concerns for some especially Neaderthal as you can see from the thread above, (a poster who posted the IGN article a few weeks bad too, and an avid hater of raids). But you know what? these concerns have been shot down time and time and time again over the last 3 yrs. I wish www.bymitra.com was back up to be honest. Everything that has ever been said about raiding has lead to those people who keep an eye on the game more than the regular joe passer by, leads to interpret and postal clarification from developers (pretty blunt) that raiding is not forced. There are no public raid reports yet even - its all assumption - for the worst when it comes to a touchy subject for a vocal minority of very vocal detestation stance on raids.
I can definately agree with concerns, sure I can, I dont want to waste my life in dungeons for gear. At the same time I have the capacity and read alot of info to get a clearer image of the bigger picture. Hundreds and hundreds of dev posts dont lie.
Funcoms aim all along for AoC has been mainstream, pc and console-based, casual gameplay. If a lot of the 'hardcore' people are expecting asherons call or ultima online or something like that freedom and pvp wise then stop reading the forums here and just go away because that is not Funcoms aim.
I hate to say it but Funcom has really been aiming for a WoW-like mainstream for AoC of variety of gameplay options and casual fun gameplay. Why wouldnt they? Why wouldnt they want millions of subscribers?
raiding...mainstream... less than one half of one percent of wow's players actually raid. (which is why wow is slowly, but steadily, moving away from the stupidity that is raiding).
10,000,000. let's see, 1% of that is um, 100,000? half of one percent is 50,000. so, by mainstream, funcom is shooting to hit the massive less-than-50,000-raider-playerbase which is in wow?
sounds rather idiotic.
Because around 60% of the wow players are non-lifers, they will continue their game no matter what. MMORPG addiction has become far too widespread to be ignored. It seems that Funcom will support this, because they focus a lot on raiding and instances.
If you say so.. I got the 4 year vet reward about 2 months ago
EQ2 was released in Nov 2004! Thats 3.5 yrs...Sony once again can't do anything right if they're giving out 4 yr vet rewards almost a yr in advance...LOL
had to double check.. I got time credit for buying the expansions.. thats why
I thought this game was about pvp, when they say to get the best gear you have to raid i hope not.This game was suppose to be about massive pvp battles when did it change?
as for what the OP is saying, yes I do agree that you have to raid to get the best gear is a load of BS... I don't want to spend 24 hours in an "epic" dungeon just for a chance to get "epic" gear.
If this is the case then I'm just going to have to live with what the PvP gear has to offer... because I really don't care enough about getting the best gear if I have to waste thousands of hours raiding. I hope FC learns of people's concerns with this and eventually does something to appeal to us regular joes.
Ok, let me get this straight...ppl are QQ-ing over having to raid (at lvl 80 to boot) for great gear, or PvP like Thor himself to get some also?!
Hmm...Maybe they'd like to have a lottery for bad-ass gear once a week, good for a limited time, then disappear into oblivion a week after so as to make it fair for the next draw.
I mean, come on...you can't expect any game to be as fair for the casual player, not investing the time and effort needed to acquire these items. There will always be hardcore players, and just like life...he works harder with dedication will (and rightfully so) gwt better stuff.
I don't see why players who play alot with a guild for items should penalized, or 'on par' with those casual players who feel they deserve the same rewards. Live with it or either 1)Play more or 2)go play Toontown or something.
I'm not a hardcore player, and even though I look upon envy at nice gear on higher players that play 'x' time more than me because I can't play as often as them...I still applaud their effort and time. It'd be degrading to those players and to the game itself if I could get the same thing by lazily going to a vendor, hand him a bag of money and say 'I'll buy that".
I personally hate the word 'Carebear' but in some instances, it is aptly used in certain situations. This may be one of those situations. Personal opinion is one thing, but unrealistic expectations is quite another entirely.
Ok, let me get this straight...ppl are QQ-ing over having to raid (at lvl 80 to boot) for great gear, or PvP like Thor himself to get some also?! Hmm...Maybe they'd like to have a lottery for bad-ass gear once a week, good for a limited time, then disappear into oblivion a week after so as to make it fair for the next draw. I mean, come on...you can't expect any game to be as fair for the casual player, not investing the time and effort needed to acquire these items. There will always be hardcore players, and just like life...he works harder with dedication will (and rightfully so) gwt better stuff. I don't see why players who play alot with a guild for items should penalized, or 'on par' with those casual players who feel they deserve the same rewards. Live with it or either 1)Play more or 2)go play Toontown or something. I'm not a hardcore player, and even though I look upon envy at nice gear on higher players that play 'x' time more than me because I can't play as often as them...I still applaud their effort and time. It'd be degrading to those players and to the game itself if I could get the same thing by lazily going to a vendor, hand him a bag of money and say 'I'll buy that". I personally hate the word 'Carebear' but in some instances, it is aptly used in certain situations. This may be one of those situations. Personal opinion is one thing, but unrealistic expectations is quite another entirely.
I don't know what you are all upset about. They have made very clear for a long time what their intentions are with this game. You all want an mmo like battlefield, or halo.. I really don't see that happening because they want to create a living world not a mass chaotic war zone.
No they want to create a heavily story-driven RPG based MMO. Hence the end game raiding
What does end game raiding have to do with it? I think it's just there as an option. You don't HAVE to participate in raiding. I've played EQ2 for over 4 years and have never been on a raid..
I guess I'm just not understanding what you're getting at.
Well, just think about it. Every good story has an epic ending, right? If you follow it all the way to the end, then it leaves you hanging, that's pretty lame. Raiding is a great way to put in the climax, such as fighting the main antagonist(s). You've heard about him in the lore...now fight him for real...it's got an appeal to it. You don't HAVE to, yes, but where most companies make the mistake is putting the best gear in those raids. Fanbois say crafted gear that's used for PvP will be just as good; there's no way to determine that now. If indeed they're wrong and it turns out raiding gear is better, people will feel like they HAVE to raid if they want to be the best. Honestly, if there was a way raids could change...once you cleared it, those guys are gone; maybe more bad guys move in and spice things up a little...I'd enjoy it 100% more.
Raiding isn't epic. Its boring. Assembly lines aren't epic.
Raids suck.
The thing that gets me about this topic is how even reasonable people fall for the "Raiders won't affect PvP gear" mem.
Typical political BS, when asked about whether or not they affect other PvEers who won't raid which will almost certainly be like 80% they just restate that it won't affect PvP and avoid the question.
And when finally cornered on that point even the Dev just resort to "Why do you care what other people get?". If they really believed that had any merit then they would not even bother to rewards raiers better.
The AoC Devs have been nothing but hypocrites and political douchebags in this regard.
I don't know what you are all upset about. They have made very clear for a long time what their intentions are with this game. You all want an mmo like battlefield, or halo.. I really don't see that happening because they want to create a living world not a mass chaotic war zone.
No they want to create a heavily story-driven RPG based MMO. Hence the end game raiding
What does end game raiding have to do with it? I think it's just there as an option. You don't HAVE to participate in raiding. I've played EQ2 for over 4 years and have never been on a raid..
I guess I'm just not understanding what you're getting at.
Well, just think about it. Every good story has an epic ending, right? If you follow it all the way to the end, then it leaves you hanging, that's pretty lame. Raiding is a great way to put in the climax, such as fighting the main antagonist(s). You've heard about him in the lore...now fight him for real...it's got an appeal to it. You don't HAVE to, yes, but where most companies make the mistake is putting the best gear in those raids. Fanbois say crafted gear that's used for PvP will be just as good; there's no way to determine that now. If indeed they're wrong and it turns out raiding gear is better, people will feel like they HAVE to raid if they want to be the best. Honestly, if there was a way raids could change...once you cleared it, those guys are gone; maybe more bad guys move in and spice things up a little...I'd enjoy it 100% more.
Raiding isn't epic. Its boring. Assembly lines aren't epic.
Raids suck.
The thing that gets me about this topic is how even reasonable people fall for the "Raiders won't affect PvP gear" mem.
Typical political BS, when asked about whether or not they affect other PvEers who won't raid which will almost certainly be like 80% they just restate that it won't affect PvP and avoid the question.
And when finally cornered on that point even the Dev just resort to "Why do you care what other people get?". If they really believed that had any merit then they would not even bother to rewards raiers better.
The AoC Devs have been nothing but hypocrites and political douchebags in this regard.
Gesalt11, you have been going on about this raiding issue since at least Aug 6, 2006, http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/88725. Why don't you give it a rest? Why not just move on to some other game and forum.
Comments
Actually mate, Norway was this January just gone and was pretty good thanks.
Here is something for you to chew on from nearly a year ago: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/134590/page/1
How is anything in my postal response here biased? Its FACT. Unless you want to tell the developers they are lying and you know more about the game? Im just quoting them and your just quoting me quoting them thats all no spin.
Dam right legitimate concerns for some especially Neaderthal as you can see from the thread above, (a poster who posted the IGN article a few weeks bad too, and an avid hater of raids). But you know what? these concerns have been shot down time and time and time again over the last 3 yrs. I wish www.bymitra.com was back up to be honest. Everything that has ever been said about raiding has lead to those people who keep an eye on the game more than the regular joe passer by, leads to interpret and postal clarification from developers (pretty blunt) that raiding is not forced. There are no public raid reports yet even - its all assumption - for the worst when it comes to a touchy subject for a vocal minority of very vocal detestation stance on raids.
I can definately agree with concerns, sure I can, I dont want to waste my life in dungeons for gear. At the same time I have the capacity and read alot of info to get a clearer image of the bigger picture. Hundreds and hundreds of dev posts dont lie.
raiding...mainstream... less than one half of one percent of wow's players actually raid. (which is why wow is slowly, but steadily, moving away from the stupidity that is raiding).
10,000,000. let's see, 1% of that is um, 100,000? half of one percent is 50,000. so, by mainstream, funcom is shooting to hit the massive less-than-50,000-raider-playerbase which is in wow?
sounds rather idiotic.
Because around 60% of the wow players are non-lifers, they will continue their game no matter what. MMORPG addiction has become far too widespread to be ignored. It seems that Funcom will support this, because they focus a lot on raiding and instances.
Sounds like you don't want to play an MMO, maybe I suggest console rpgs?
Yet its only been out for 3.5! Lovely...
If you say so.. I got the 4 year vet reward about 2 months ago
EQ2 was released in Nov 2004! Thats 3.5 yrs...Sony once again can't do anything right if they're giving out 4 yr vet rewards almost a yr in advance...LOL
had to double check.. I got time credit for buying the expansions.. thats why
I thought this game was about pvp, when they say to get the best gear you have to raid i hope not.This game was suppose to be about massive pvp battles when did it change?
as for what the OP is saying, yes I do agree that you have to raid to get the best gear is a load of BS... I don't want to spend 24 hours in an "epic" dungeon just for a chance to get "epic" gear.
If this is the case then I'm just going to have to live with what the PvP gear has to offer... because I really don't care enough about getting the best gear if I have to waste thousands of hours raiding. I hope FC learns of people's concerns with this and eventually does something to appeal to us regular joes.
Ok, let me get this straight...ppl are QQ-ing over having to raid (at lvl 80 to boot) for great gear, or PvP like Thor himself to get some also?!
Hmm...Maybe they'd like to have a lottery for bad-ass gear once a week, good for a limited time, then disappear into oblivion a week after so as to make it fair for the next draw.
I mean, come on...you can't expect any game to be as fair for the casual player, not investing the time and effort needed to acquire these items. There will always be hardcore players, and just like life...he works harder with dedication will (and rightfully so) gwt better stuff.
I don't see why players who play alot with a guild for items should penalized, or 'on par' with those casual players who feel they deserve the same rewards. Live with it or either 1)Play more or 2)go play Toontown or something.
I'm not a hardcore player, and even though I look upon envy at nice gear on higher players that play 'x' time more than me because I can't play as often as them...I still applaud their effort and time. It'd be degrading to those players and to the game itself if I could get the same thing by lazily going to a vendor, hand him a bag of money and say 'I'll buy that".
I personally hate the word 'Carebear' but in some instances, it is aptly used in certain situations. This may be one of those situations. Personal opinion is one thing, but unrealistic expectations is quite another entirely.
Good post... I approve and give two thumbs up!
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A work in progress: (Update: 08/09/10)Easily find your favorite type of MMO
No they want to create a heavily story-driven RPG based MMO. Hence the end game raiding
What does end game raiding have to do with it? I think it's just there as an option. You don't HAVE to participate in raiding. I've played EQ2 for over 4 years and have never been on a raid..I guess I'm just not understanding what you're getting at.
Well, just think about it. Every good story has an epic ending, right? If you follow it all the way to the end, then it leaves you hanging, that's pretty lame. Raiding is a great way to put in the climax, such as fighting the main antagonist(s). You've heard about him in the lore...now fight him for real...it's got an appeal to it. You don't HAVE to, yes, but where most companies make the mistake is putting the best gear in those raids. Fanbois say crafted gear that's used for PvP will be just as good; there's no way to determine that now. If indeed they're wrong and it turns out raiding gear is better, people will feel like they HAVE to raid if they want to be the best. Honestly, if there was a way raids could change...once you cleared it, those guys are gone; maybe more bad guys move in and spice things up a little...I'd enjoy it 100% more.
Raiding isn't epic. Its boring. Assembly lines aren't epic.Raids suck.
The thing that gets me about this topic is how even reasonable people fall for the "Raiders won't affect PvP gear" mem.
Typical political BS, when asked about whether or not they affect other PvEers who won't raid which will almost certainly be like 80% they just restate that it won't affect PvP and avoid the question.
And when finally cornered on that point even the Dev just resort to "Why do you care what other people get?". If they really believed that had any merit then they would not even bother to rewards raiers better.
The AoC Devs have been nothing but hypocrites and political douchebags in this regard.
No they want to create a heavily story-driven RPG based MMO. Hence the end game raiding
What does end game raiding have to do with it? I think it's just there as an option. You don't HAVE to participate in raiding. I've played EQ2 for over 4 years and have never been on a raid..I guess I'm just not understanding what you're getting at.
Well, just think about it. Every good story has an epic ending, right? If you follow it all the way to the end, then it leaves you hanging, that's pretty lame. Raiding is a great way to put in the climax, such as fighting the main antagonist(s). You've heard about him in the lore...now fight him for real...it's got an appeal to it. You don't HAVE to, yes, but where most companies make the mistake is putting the best gear in those raids. Fanbois say crafted gear that's used for PvP will be just as good; there's no way to determine that now. If indeed they're wrong and it turns out raiding gear is better, people will feel like they HAVE to raid if they want to be the best. Honestly, if there was a way raids could change...once you cleared it, those guys are gone; maybe more bad guys move in and spice things up a little...I'd enjoy it 100% more.
Raiding isn't epic. Its boring. Assembly lines aren't epic.Raids suck.
The thing that gets me about this topic is how even reasonable people fall for the "Raiders won't affect PvP gear" mem.
Typical political BS, when asked about whether or not they affect other PvEers who won't raid which will almost certainly be like 80% they just restate that it won't affect PvP and avoid the question.
And when finally cornered on that point even the Dev just resort to "Why do you care what other people get?". If they really believed that had any merit then they would not even bother to rewards raiers better.
The AoC Devs have been nothing but hypocrites and political douchebags in this regard.
Gesalt11, you have been going on about this raiding issue since at least Aug 6, 2006, http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/88725. Why don't you give it a rest? Why not just move on to some other game and forum.
To address the second part...
so there's a death penalty. Cry me a f------- river. Shesh, it's a carebear death penalty, and people still boo-hoo over it.
i never knew MMORPGS were for the casual player...