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If I dont like PvP, is this game for me ?
admriker4
Member Posts: 1,070
To be honest, I hate PvP. I get no pleasure in killing a real player's avatar. In nearly all MMO's Ive played, there was zero point in PvP except for some minor buff, gear that only was useful for more PvP, or ego points.
There was one game where I enjoyed PvP and that was Star Wars Galaxies (before the changes). As a jedi, it was thrilling to be constantly looking over my shoulder for a Bounty Hunter. There were no safe zones or any place to hide. There wasnt another instance that I could switch to if I was about to lose (age of conan). I was hunted like an animal and it was awesome.
From what Ive read, Warhammer is focusing its content on realm vs realm. Will there be any reason for someone like me to buy this game ? I like PvE sandbox play with the occasional non-forced quest to break up the boredom. I also love crafting and being a dominant force in the economy. Every game Ive played Ive ended up as one of the best-known crafters on that server. If I had my choice, I would strictly be a crafter like my alt was in SWG.
Warhammer looks pretty good on the cover but I wonder if it will have anything for me
Comments
Most likely only people in beta can give you the answer you are looking for. However, they aren't allowed to yet. The question I would ask myself is, "Does it look good enough to shell out $50 to give it a try?", since that's really the only way to know if you personally will enjoy the game.
Much of the PvP crowd would have you believe that PvP is the core focus of the game, but that would be misleading. PvP only makes up one aspect of the whole Realm vs. Realm (RvR) experience. Mythic have stated in interviews that you will be able to level from 1-40 without ever setting foot into a PvP zone if you choose not to. Throw the Tome of Knowledge and crafting into the mix, and you have a a robust gaming experience. The tools are there for everyone to get out of RvR (both PvP/PvE) what they put into it.
Well I don't like PvP much either cause it mainly targeted at just advancing yourself and showing others u can piss further than them!
Now RvR is where its different, yeah you still gain renown and points to advance yourself but on the big picture everything you do is for your realm and faction! Everytime u kill another player you're helping your realm. There is a very good point for it!
Anyway if your interested, check out my guild forums, as they might be right up your alley since my guild is gonna focus on PvE, Exploration, the Tome of Knowledge and of course Crafting! Still plan to RvR and stuff just not as much as most other guilds will be!
Short answer: NO !
Games I've played/tried out:WAR, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, AoC, EQ1, EQ2, WoW, Vangaurd, FFXI, D&DO, Lineage 2, Saga Of Ryzom, EvE Online, DAoC, Guild Wars,Star Wars Galaxies, Hell Gate London, Auto Assault, Grando Espada ( AKA SoTNW ), Archlord, CoV/H, Star Trek Online, APB, Champions Online, FFXIV, Rift Online, GW2.
Game(s) I Am Currently Playing:
GW2 (+LoL and BF3)
You will be able to play PvE content and explore the world freely just as you would in any other game.
For PvE content you have the Tome of Knowledge, Crafting, Dungeons, Public Quests, Storyline Quests, Exploration quests, and much more. You can also contribute points to the Realm vs. Realm war effort by doing non PvP oriented tasks such a quests in your PvE zone.
STOP WHINING!
PVE is a small part of this game. The PVE content is mainly leveling, and then doing end game encounters after a very long PVP battle like the King of Aldorf.
PVE end game will not be a part of this game. You won't have big raids for gear. You can't get Renown for anything other then PVP. The best gear i the game is awarded via RVR'ing (PVPing). Yes PVE helps each relam fight for control, but thats the PVE that is going on while leveling.
If you are a PVE fan, this game will not be a game you stick with in the long run. No matter what anyone tells you. I have been in beta for over a year now, and the most PVE I ever did was leveling and even then, you have to PVP to level without grinding off mobs.
No, play AoC, PvE server.
You only gain renown by playing a scenario or fighting in an RVR area.
If you don't like PvP, WAR probably isn't the game for you. Age of Conan is probably a better choice IN HALF A YEAR when they've finished making the content. WoW is a PvE god that WAR will never compare to in amount of content, as WAR's focus primarily is PvP.
End game offers PvE - not much, but what there is will be important. For instance if your Realm's PvP efforts allow them to conquer the enemy territories and sack their city, your ultimate goal is to defeat the enemy faction leaders, which are short 24-man PvE raid encounters.
It seems to me that alot of the RVR is really just heavily laden PVE quests in the guise of PVP.
It reads to me like: "Oh wow we're attacking the city!", when in reality you're completing an NPC quest chain.
So that when you're done destroying the city, you get to ??go into their dungeon?? Why, for epic lewts? I smell a rat. Sounds like PVE to me.
The open world keep sieges sound legit, and I'm sure there's plenty of open world PVP in general, but it seems like there's a high percentage of PVE tom-foolery going on.
Good for you OP maybe, bad for me.
We'll find out when it comes out, who knows.
Attacking a city i can say without a doubt it s not a pve quest series:). After your realm takes over a city many pve oppurtunities open up for your realm. One is a 24 man raid for some good loot. Many other group instances open up and if i remember correctly the higher the cities rank is the more instances available there are. Anyways no the city siege isn t pve at all until you ve captured it
I tried Age of Conan. In 6 months its still going to be heavily instanced and linear. I wont touch that game again.
You should look at Vanguard if you want crafting etc. You can play that game almost solely as a crafter and its pretty challenging. I played at launch and it was lagged to hell but the crafting kept me going for 6 months. Hundreds of items to make but because you can add better material and items to it, it becomes unique so in my time I was the first person to make around 6 unique items that no one else had. Plus the graghics really looks amazing and takes into account the small changes. I would play on a PvE server since the FFA have too many gankers stabbing crafters in the back. Plus crafting quests are cool and open up new items to build etc. On top of all that there is a mini game and besides being a complete bitch at times you get your head around it and its cool. Crafting quests give special clothing that help with crafting etc etc. I found it a nice meeting spot to. If you get into a good guild with TS / Vent then you can chat away while you all make items in the same hall. Plus in a group you can see what each other person makes. I stopped playing after 6 months due to the bugs and lag. However that is a while ago now and I read a review just today saying they have it pretty solid right now and its been improved massively. My friend is still playing since launch because of the crafting + social aspect of it. I hope to see a similar system in another MMO as it meant I could craft for a 2-5 days and not even think about combat. Long post but I think as a crafter its the game for you....
RVR and PVP are chalf and cheese for me.
PVP is who has the larger E-Peen often being gank fest's and spawn camps.
RVR you are fighting for your realm not just yourself you rareley find yourself massiveley outnumbered and with it requiring more tactics and group based play then generally you have a less smack talk more mature experience.
If you hate PvP you really shouldn't buy this game. Even the normal servers are still heavily dependant on PvP, there's no avoiding it.
If you really, really dislike PvP at its core then WAR isn't for you.
However if you actually don't like the way PvP was done before then WAR might be your thing.
You mentioned "pointlessness" as your main gripe about PvP. I agree with this wholeheartedly and this is why WoW world PvP is broken - if there is no in-game motive for PvP then it becomes pure griefing. Why did this guy just kill me while I'm doing my stuff? No other reason but to spoil my day. Bad game design leads to bad player behavior.
WAR will have a global purpose to PvP, so by killing someone you're not doing it hurt him. Quite the opposite - you're providing meaningful content and fun. I'm sure we'll get a lot of friendly rivalry rather than murderous hate in WAR. Just like in sports and online FPSs.
That being said, you'll get quite a lot of PvE content in WAR although I don't think crafting might appeal that much to you. From what I gathered, crafting will deal mostly with consumables - no crafted armor or weapons but you'll be able to improve existing gear wih it and make potions and stuff.
As for linearity...
No it is not a linear game. And no, it is not a sandbox game. It is what I like to think of as a "playground" game. Endgame starts right at the beginning (you can join city sieges from lvl 7) and there is no ultimate goal to accomplish. It is configured more like a hobby than a game - games always imply some kind of ending (when you "beat the game" or see all the content or get the best gear) while hobbies can last forever.
Imagine it as a huge persistent online FPS world (or a WoW battleground, heh) with 2 warring sides, a lot of different PvP and PvE modes all contributing to global war, character progression and a slew of negative-feedback mechanisms ensuring war never ends.
I find this hard to justify given what we know. To me it's a themepark with an *extremely* clear ultimate goal (capturing your opponents main city) and a whole game that pushes you towards that as areas lock behind you when you conquer it and everyone moves on to the next.
I agree there are *plenty* of small things to do to keep you busy but in the end, from a birds eye view, the game design is very linear and very much laid out for you.
If you want to get to that Capitol you will *have* to take that keep, you will *have* to take that zone, you will *have* to win that scenario to get enough points. You can't skip it, you have no choice to take something else and reach the same goal. Therefor the design is extremely linear and the only diversity comes from mixing it up which front you like to progress/defend on but the way it progresses will always be the same.
If you just want to stand around and do nothing you can do it. In SWG pre-cu/nge you HAD to kill things to level up any combat skill.
You HAD to craft to level up crafting. You HAD to kill kryt dragons (spelt right?) to get their skin for better buffs/items.
Theres always a thing you HAVE to do. And by skipping something like your saying, you HAVE To get to this capitol you have to win this point. If people didnt have to do that then they would just get there with out fighting anything?
Your looking way too into things. And If you want a game to have no focus then wait for darkfall. It will eat up all your sandbox desiers. If it ever comes out.
I find this hard to justify given what we know. To me it's a themepark with an *extremely* clear ultimate goal (capturing your opponents main city) and a whole game that pushes you towards that as areas lock behind you when you conquer it and everyone moves on to the next.
I agree there are *plenty* of small things to do to keep you busy but in the end, from a birds eye view, the game design is very linear and very much laid out for you.
If you want to get to that Capitol you will *have* to take that keep, you will *have* to take that zone, you will *have* to win that scenario to get enough points. You can't skip it, you have no choice to take something else and reach the same goal. Therefor the design is extremely linear and the only diversity comes from mixing it up which front you like to progress/defend on but the way it progresses will always be the same.
You mentioned "birds eye view" .. I'm looking at it from one level higher - and that is the opportunity for strategic level of play that really sets this game apart.
Ofc the game is linear if you look only at the schematic of a single T4 front. However take into account that there are three different fronts that are in play simultaneously. On each of those the frontline will be at a different relative position with different capital city levels. In addition T3 areas are in game as well since the chicken rule does not apply there.
Then take into account that there is a bunch of equally valid gameplay modes contributing to victory conditions. One day it may be most profitable for your faction to do siege open world tug-of-war, the other it may be smarter to grind up instance PvP or dungeon PvE victory points, while the third day may be perfect to break the deadlock by suddenly zerg rushing a completely different weakly guarded front.
Don't forget that it'll take months to get a capital under siege.. It is not like we repeat a single linear instanced battle again and again. It is war - a huge thing with a myriad of battles, scirmishes and all kinds of things going on simultaneously.
As a board game buff and amateur designer I can testify that WAR endgame would be awesome as a 2-player strategic board game. The situation and winning strategies will constantly shift and I suppose you'll never get the same global situation. This is what I mean by non-linearity.
A linear game always tells you (or at least strongly implies) what you should do next. A non-linear game presents you with an array of different choices and strategies. Non-linearity does not mean that there are no goals, it means that it is your choice on how to accomplish them.
While you could argue that the game does indeed feature PvE content you must realize that just because you added some PvE doesn't make that good game; and certainly not for a person who wants to play it only. This game is focused mainly at PvP and therefore you should enjoy PvP if you want to fully enjoy this, you could want to PvE now and then but your main goal should of course be PvP. You could probably try the game but if you if you don't like PvP then you will not like a major part of the content; thus making other more PvE focused games (LOTRO) a better choice.
Why not give it a try? There is a free trial.
I don't really know the state of the game today and it can never be what it was in the past again but its still a good game I would imagine.
Get on the most populated server, grind up to 50, do some BG's on the way, then cut loose into the RvR with a guild, do some raids, craft, build a house, help capture a castle or relic.... you get the idea. You should be able to get a very good taste by the end of summer if you start now.
Forever Midgard!!!!
Plenty of ppl who dont like pvp love rvr, they aint the same.
How true this is. As well the game is definately RVR centric , but there is ALOT of PVE for people to do, more then i think people think. Besides when you try RVR you ll love it:) I couldn t get my girlfriend to play any MMO that had pvp in it ever. Finally she tried L2 and hated it theni said ok try faction pvp(RVR)? She was dead against it , played it , loved it , and now is looking forward to WAR more then me i think
I find myself comparing this to a real war, like WWII. That's a good thing! There were the soldiers who fought in Europe and the Pacific; think of them as the actual PvPers. But just as important were the people back home who worked in the factories and helped with supplies. I think of them as the PvErs. Not saying you'll make supplies though. But even if you do PvE things, it'll contribute to the RvR effort...which is why PvErs need PvPers to open up new PvE areas to explore, and PvPers need PvErs to help them reach the enemy's capital. It simulates a real war where people can contribute no matter what they do. There's going to be a fair share of PvE content too, so I think you'll enjoy it even if you don't like PvP/RvR.
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A human and an Elf get captured by Skaven. The rat-men are getting ready to shoot the first hostage with Dwarf-made guns when he yells, "Earthquake!" The naturally nervous Skaven run and hide from the imaginary threat. He escapes. The Skaven regroup and bring out the Elf. Being very smart, the Elf has figured out what to do. When the Skaven get ready to shoot, the Elf, in order to scare them, yells, "Fire!"
Order of the White Border.