The only marketing SOE has are the current players who swear the game is now better, with more players then ever.
Find me one person that actually insists that there are more people now than there were pre-CU. ONE.
So I started to walk into the water. I won't lie to you boys...I was terrified. But I pressed on, and as I made my way past the breakers, a strange calm came over me. I don't know if it was divine intervention or the kinship of all living things, but I tell you, Jerry, at that moment ... I was a marine biologist.
Musta hurt them some allright, since the Smeddler has all but given up on subscription based model.. Cuz according to him, it dun work, and the money lies in koreangrinder models. Ofcourse, he fails to see that subscription model don't work for em cuz they f*ck their games up....Making em not worth a subscription.
I think Smed was trying to pitch the subscription model is dead b.s. to cover his disastrous track record tbh. Tell Blizzard that subs don't work. Tell Smed they don't work when your game is busted to hell, you lie to your customers, and toss out everything they've worked for. He seems to miss important details like that, A LOT.
SWG PRE-CU Slappy Reporting In: We didn't "kill" swg:nge or make it bomb. SOE's aweful development did. We didn't kill swg:nge. SOE's two weeks of BETA Testing Did We didn't kill swg. John Smedley did.
and we refused to hide the body for him...
I agree with Daffid, it's one of those combination of things working together. Like I was sayin' many factors contributed to the NGE failure I think, not "one or the other" so to speak. When I read the comments I posted from Freeman though, I began to understand why there may have been so much hostility and censorship directed towards veteran players. Positive marketting was the basket SOE and LEC seemed to put their hope for success in. Too bad that in order to be positive you'd actually have to lie, and try to keep others from telling the truth. Obviously the strategy didn't work, and I'm glad. The MMO world would be a darker place if you really could hose all your players and bust your game, and then actually gain subs in the process. It's nice to see that this is not the case.
The bad word of mouth SWG currently 'enjoys' does keep people from trying it. Several of those people who respond negatively to any mention of SWG in the various MMORPGs have never played SWG since the NGE changes. Many of them are people who have heard about how bad the game is from others.
On the other hand, the primary reason the current player population is so dismal is because the game is just not any fun, except for the obsessive compulsive Star Wars fanatics that play solely due to the fact that the game has "Star Wars" in its name and there are Stormtroopers in the game. The "Star Wars" part may attract the curious Star Wars fan, but the gigantic amount of suck repels all but those without any sort of self control where Star Wars is concerned.
SWG PRE-CU Slappy Reporting In: We didn't "kill" swg:nge or make it bomb. SOE's aweful development did. We didn't kill swg:nge. SOE's two weeks of BETA Testing Did We didn't kill swg. John Smedley did.
and we refused to hide the body for him...
I agree with Daffid, it's one of those combination of things working together. Like I was sayin' many factors contributed to the NGE failure I think, not "one or the other" so to speak. When I read the comments I posted from Freeman though, I began to understand why there may have been so much hostility and censorship directed towards veteran players. Positive marketting was the basket SOE and LEC seemed to put their hope for success in. Too bad that in order to be positive you'd actually have to lie, and try to keep others from telling the truth. Obviously the strategy didn't work, and I'm glad. The MMO world would be a darker place if you really could hose all your players and bust your game, and then actually gain subs in the process. It's nice to see that this is not the case.
I honestly just think it was a failure to follow documented procedures for developing video game code that doomed every iteration of SWG since patch 9. You have a history of putting out busted code to live servers at gun point by marketing and management to met deadlines of development that somehow got unrealistically set for the talent and staff onhand. You then had marketing pushing harder on content and additions never going back and fixing the problems that where in place from the last rushed patch. You had little to no source code controls inplace. You had high turnover rate start occurring in the back of the house.
I blame the guy with a marketing masters degree running a development house whose repeatedly shown absolute ignorance on the rules of software development. It is 100% obvious to me John Smedley belongs as a Vice President of Marketing. He is completely inept at the operational issues that a development house faces.
As for Mr. Freeman, I respect him and his attempt to clear the air but honestly, he's not fully accepted that the NGE's entire "Plan" never could have worked. It is the fundamental lack of time given to such a thing as a complete game overhaul by Freeman and company that appauls me as a consumer and an IT professional.
The CU and NGE conceptually where great ideas. The problem is not one person took implementing those ideas seriously. Then an effort was made to square off against the "vocal" minority or whatever SOE called disgruntled veterans.
Fatally flawed from concept-launch was SOE's development plans. They must have some talented coders there. To be able to work under those laux conditions and produce anything that functions is surprising to me.
It is abundantly obvious no direction exists at SOE except when a marketing guy gets some idea for a grand promo scheme that will draw in 1000's and get himself promoted.
It is obvious that it is a cultural problem at the division. How Smedley remains CEO of that division miffs me. Although I should talk. I see all sorts of incomptence at work go ignored.
The bad word of mouth SWG currently 'enjoys' does keep people from trying it. Several of those people who respond negatively to any mention of SWG in the various MMORPGs have never played SWG since the NGE changes. Many of them are people who have heard about how bad the game is from others. On the other hand, the primary reason the current player population is so dismal is because the game is just not any fun, except for the obsessive compulsive Star Wars fanatics that play solely due to the fact that the game has "Star Wars" in its name and there are Stormtroopers in the game. The "Star Wars" part may attract the curious Star Wars fan, but the gigantic amount of suck repels all but those without any sort of self control where Star Wars is concerned.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I agree to an extent. I read this board and others because I was HEAVILY invested in a community of people whom I enjoyed gaming with and enjoyed my other hobby of star wars with. It was not uncomfortable or lame enjoying star wars. I have no place to go to get that back and no remedy can combine those two unique things I enjoyed about my time in the game.
So If I vent or get upset its because I have no where else to go as the NGE is something I basically refuse to take part in on the principle of the game. So I read here on occassion to see if a Pre-CU server opened up. I rip SOE employees who basically are dumb. It makes me feel better.
Originally posted by Malickiebloo
Originally posted by Obee
The bad word of mouth SWG currently 'enjoys' does keep people from trying it. Several of those people who respond negatively to any mention of SWG in the various MMORPGs have never played SWG since the NGE changes. Many of them are people who have heard about how bad the game is from others. On the other hand, the primary reason the current player population is so dismal is because the game is just not any fun, except for the obsessive compulsive Star Wars fanatics that play solely due to the fact that the game has "Star Wars" in its name and there are Stormtroopers in the game. The "Star Wars" part may attract the curious Star Wars fan, but the gigantic amount of suck repels all but those without any sort of self control where Star Wars is concerned.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
I agree to an extent. I read this board and others because I was HEAVILY invested in a community of people whom I enjoyed gaming with and enjoyed my other hobby of star wars with. It was not uncomfortable or lame enjoying star wars. I have no place to go to get that back and no remedy can combine those two unique things I enjoyed about my time in the game. So If I vent or get upset its because I have no where else to go as the NGE is something I basically refuse to take part in on the principle of the game. So I read here on occassion to see if a Pre-CU server opened up. I rip SOE employees who basically are dumb. It makes me feel better.
I can defintely agree with you in what you said, about longing for what we all once had. At this point it seems most will never find that again.Which is sad I must confess, And I feel for those poeple .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
The bad word of mouth SWG currently 'enjoys' does keep people from trying it. Several of those people who respond negatively to any mention of SWG in the various MMORPGs have never played SWG since the NGE changes. Many of them are people who have heard about how bad the game is from others. On the other hand, the primary reason the current player population is so dismal is because the game is just not any fun, except for the obsessive compulsive Star Wars fanatics that play solely due to the fact that the game has "Star Wars" in its name and there are Stormtroopers in the game. The "Star Wars" part may attract the curious Star Wars fan, but the gigantic amount of suck repels all but those without any sort of self control where Star Wars is concerned.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
What things about the current version of SWG would make you recommend it to anyone? What other than the fact that it is a Star Wars game do you think would make anyone want to play it? what does SWG currently off that cannot be found in a better form somewhere else?
Both EQ2 and WoW are far superior to SWG. SWG currently boasts a horrible combat system, whether you choose the pseudo-FPS version or the badly implemented target lock version), a crafting system that does offer depth, but is unfortunately gimped due to design decisions (Loot, Rinse, Repeat), a Class system that was so poorly conceived that the developers decided to add WoW's talent system to it, and are currently in the process of revamping again, for the third time, a decent housing system, a decent space game, a repetitive collection system, based off a mishmash of EQ2's collections and LotRO's Deeds, a horrible by any standards central quest line (the Legacy quests are flat out bad), NPCs that can attack you but you cannot attack back (even if the NPC is standing right in front of you), and a future of cookie cutter instanced 'raids'.
I wouldn't recommend SWG to anyone I didn't outright hate. There is a reason the "Complete Online Adventures" box didn't sell very well. There is a reason the game is no longer available anywhere but SOE's online direct download store. There is a reason why most threads about what people like about the game on the OBoard are primarily filled with 'Because it's Star Wars' responses. It isn't because the current game is so much fun.
When the NGE hit, I quit playing, occasionally looking at the forums to see if they realised their mistake and hoping that they would undo it. Uptill now, they haven't, obviously.
So I say: Stop with the discussion already. They screwed up. Turn around and walk away. They deserve no less. I grow tired of this hippie " Fight the power" crap. Star Wars is dying. That should suffice. I, for one, am happy it is.
The bad word of mouth SWG currently 'enjoys' does keep people from trying it. Several of those people who respond negatively to any mention of SWG in the various MMORPGs have never played SWG since the NGE changes. Many of them are people who have heard about how bad the game is from others. On the other hand, the primary reason the current player population is so dismal is because the game is just not any fun, except for the obsessive compulsive Star Wars fanatics that play solely due to the fact that the game has "Star Wars" in its name and there are Stormtroopers in the game. The "Star Wars" part may attract the curious Star Wars fan, but the gigantic amount of suck repels all but those without any sort of self control where Star Wars is concerned.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
What things about the current version of SWG would make you recommend it to anyone? What other than the fact that it is a Star Wars game do you think would make anyone want to play it? what does SWG currently off that cannot be found in a better form somewhere else?
Both EQ2 and WoW are far superior to SWG. SWG currently boasts a horrible combat system, whether you choose the pseudo-FPS version or the badly implemented target lock version), a crafting system that does offer depth, but is unfortunately gimped due to design decisions (Loot, Rinse, Repeat), a Class system that was so poorly conceived that the developers decided to add WoW's talent system to it, and are currently in the process of revamping again, for the third time, a decent housing system, a decent space game, a repetitive collection system, based off a mishmash of EQ2's collections and LotRO's Deeds, a horrible by any standards central quest line (the Legacy quests are flat out bad), NPCs that can attack you but you cannot attack back (even if the NPC is standing right in front of you), and a future of cookie cutter instanced 'raids'.
I wouldn't recommend SWG to anyone I didn't outright hate. There is a reason the "Complete Online Adventures" box didn't sell very well. There is a reason the game is no longer available anywhere but SOE's online direct download store. There is a reason why most threads about what people like about the game on the OBoard are primarily filled with 'Because it's Star Wars' responses. It isn't because the current game is so much fun.
SO your answer is you do believe what you post .
As an answer to your question , I wouldn't out right recommend it to someone as a first choice by any means. However if I were asked something along the lines of . Does SWG give me the opportunity to take part in quests with story lines based on a sci fi world ? Does swg offer me ground and space based game play ,also is it VOID of orcs and elves and high fantasy element in general ? Does SWg have classes like WOW ? Does SWG have mounts and instant travel ? Does SWG have an open world you can build on ? I could go on here but I think thats enough .
Now if someone thinks something in that list sounds fun , And hadn't ever played SWG I would say try the trial . There is no risk in that . But don't turn my post into a pro SWG stance , that wasn't my point . I haven't even played it enough to make a judgement in detail ..
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
$OE and the fanbois and fanbots do not wish to hear the truth. the truth is that the pre-cu was one of the greatest worlds ever made it was a living breathing world but $OE wanted that warcraft pie. that is why we got the lame cu and $OE turning swg into the nge. the fact is $OE knows that we the vet player base are right. we have done everything in our power to show mmo players that they should not touch any mmo by $OE. look at all they have now 2 games on the ps3 and that is it. but yet $OE does not wish to hear the truth that if they even came out with 1 pre-cu swg server they would have tons of players in no time. if not more as most gamers are sick of the level based games that plauge our market. that is why they have their fanbois and fanbots go on forums claiming the game is good or that something is fun. know when the game was fun fanbois? post pub-9 and before those action gamers came in with jtl. that is when swg got reviews of 5/5 10/10 5 stars and had every gaming mag and reviewer talking about how great swg was. not only that $OE and their friends over at funCON now see who runs games. we do. we have killed swg and are just waiting for $OE to shut it down or roll it back. we have killed age of CONan and players are leaving CONan enmass. gaming is going back to the way it should be our way. mark my words by next year you will see consoles like the xbox and wii dieing off. you will see a return of old school pc gaming and the end of games like warcraft and the like. and mark my words bioware when kotor online comes out will be a pre-cu game as they now see that pre-cu is the only way to go with an mmo. we won $OE give us our world back.
Doom! Doom!
But seriously, I would go back to SWG in an instant if they made a pre-cu server. They won't and the rest of this post is common knowledge, except the doom-saying. Which is most of it.
are you sure? because you know they would just pull the rug out from under you again. i will never play another soe/lucas arts game ever.
The bad word of mouth SWG currently 'enjoys' does keep people from trying it. Several of those people who respond negatively to any mention of SWG in the various MMORPGs have never played SWG since the NGE changes. Many of them are people who have heard about how bad the game is from others. On the other hand, the primary reason the current player population is so dismal is because the game is just not any fun, except for the obsessive compulsive Star Wars fanatics that play solely due to the fact that the game has "Star Wars" in its name and there are Stormtroopers in the game. The "Star Wars" part may attract the curious Star Wars fan, but the gigantic amount of suck repels all but those without any sort of self control where Star Wars is concerned.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
You may be unaware of some of the things disgruntled vets respond to. To say that they are having an imaginary dialogue may just be an indication that you've joined a conversation part way through. If you've ever done that in a social setting, you'll know how awkward that can be.
To illustrate, here's a post I found in about two minutes time claiming that the NGE is the "messiah" of SWG, and that the game is now better than it ever was:
"However, despite all this, I really do believe NGE is the savior messiah of SWG. Was it wrong the way it was ninja on its playerbase ? Absolutely. If i was mr john smed I would have made a pre nge server (unsupported by further development) and make it free for old veterans. Obviously they didnt make such server, and made core modifcations to the game, so as they couldn;t make a pre nge server now even if they wanted.
I was already thinking about canceling BEFORE NGE was annoucned, due mainly to huge class imbalanced, the fact that CH completely sucked in pvp, ect. Though with this massive restructruing of the game I held out a few more weeks until I decided to quit due to the fact that the nge (at first) seemed very horrible , as in, more broken and buggy than the already broken and buggy CU game.
But, slowly, over time , the game has gotten better. Its like funcomm with anarchy online all over again.And for an yone that played ao in its early days you know what I am talking about. Granted they broke it again with shadowlands, but thats a thread for another debate.
I know they changed the SWG game, but really, it was probably for the better."
If you've read some promotional ads for the game, you'd see similar claims made by SOE or LEC reps. In fact one article referred to the NGE at its release as a "more elegant" ground combat game. The NGE was deemed the saviour of dwindling server populations by SOE and LEC at one of their damage control dev chats, and players who have complained have systematically been labelled the vocal minority. The response to the NGE, according to the marketing hype, was overwhelmingling positive etc. etc..
Imaginary dialogue? No I think not. Countering outrageous claims that fly in the face of reason and our collective experience? Certainly.
Only recently has the marketing strategy changed slightly to say, "the new NGE isn't all that bad." To suggest that this has been the approach all along though would be another in a long history of offensive misrepresentations made regarding the money trap called SWG.
The bad word of mouth SWG currently 'enjoys' does keep people from trying it. Several of those people who respond negatively to any mention of SWG in the various MMORPGs have never played SWG since the NGE changes. Many of them are people who have heard about how bad the game is from others. On the other hand, the primary reason the current player population is so dismal is because the game is just not any fun, except for the obsessive compulsive Star Wars fanatics that play solely due to the fact that the game has "Star Wars" in its name and there are Stormtroopers in the game. The "Star Wars" part may attract the curious Star Wars fan, but the gigantic amount of suck repels all but those without any sort of self control where Star Wars is concerned.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
You may be unaware of some of the things disgruntled vets respond to. To say that they are having an imaginary dialogue may just be an indication that you've joined a conversation part way through. If you've ever done that in a social setting, you'll know how awkward that can be.
To illustrate, here's a post I found in about two minutes time claiming that the NGE is the "messiah" of SWG, and that the game is now better than it ever was:
"However, despite all this, I really do believe NGE is the savior messiah of SWG. Was it wrong the way it was ninja on its playerbase ? Absolutely. If i was mr john smed I would have made a pre nge server (unsupported by further development) and make it free for old veterans. Obviously they didnt make such server, and made core modifcations to the game, so as they couldn;t make a pre nge server now even if they wanted.
I was already thinking about canceling BEFORE NGE was annoucned, due mainly to huge class imbalanced, the fact that CH completely sucked in pvp, ect. Though with this massive restructruing of the game I held out a few more weeks until I decided to quit due to the fact that the nge (at first) seemed very horrible , as in, more broken and buggy than the already broken and buggy CU game.
But, slowly, over time , the game has gotten better. Its like funcomm with anarchy online all over again.And for an yone that played ao in its early days you know what I am talking about. Granted they broke it again with shadowlands, but thats a thread for another debate.
I know they changed the SWG game, but really, it was probably for the better."
If you've read some promotional ads for the game, you'd see similar claims made by SOE or LEC reps. In fact one article referred to the NGE at its release as a "more elegant" ground combat game. The NGE was deemed the saviour of dwindling server populations by SOE and LEC at one of their damage control dev chats, and players who have complained have systematically been labelled the vocal minority. The response to the NGE, according to the marketing hype, was overwhelmingling positive etc. etc..
Imaginary dialogue? No I think not. Countering outrageous claims that fly in the face of reason and our collective experience? Certainly.
Only recently has the marketing strategy changed slightly to say, "the new NGE isn't all that bad." To suggest that this has been the approach all along though would be another in a long history of offensive misrepresentations made regarding the money trap called SWG.
I could understand responding to those posters, But responding to them in other threads that have nothing to do with the subject makes no sense to me .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
The bad word of mouth SWG currently 'enjoys' does keep people from trying it. Several of those people who respond negatively to any mention of SWG in the various MMORPGs have never played SWG since the NGE changes. Many of them are people who have heard about how bad the game is from others. On the other hand, the primary reason the current player population is so dismal is because the game is just not any fun, except for the obsessive compulsive Star Wars fanatics that play solely due to the fact that the game has "Star Wars" in its name and there are Stormtroopers in the game. The "Star Wars" part may attract the curious Star Wars fan, but the gigantic amount of suck repels all but those without any sort of self control where Star Wars is concerned.
I have come across a bunch of former SWG players in MMOs that I have moved onto, namely LotRO and AoC. Heck, there's several threads solely about the old SWG in AoC's Off-Topic Forum.
They miss the Pre-CU days of the game. The feeling is almost universal. In-game or on the forums, whenever the subject of SWG ever comes up. Usually something like:
"SWG kicked a**, until SOE f****d it up."
Whenever a curious player asks about SWG and what happened to it (since he heard whispers), there's usually a vet there ready to lay a short version of what once was, and what happened. Some of us, like myself, will provide long versions if they're that interested.
Laslty, the ONLY good thing to come out of the NGE and its associated debacle? It is the shining example of what NOT to do with your game and playerbase. SWG may not have the millions of WoW, but it's a real life example of what can happen if you tell your current fans / players to go f**k themselves since they're replaceable.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
The bad word of mouth SWG currently 'enjoys' does keep people from trying it. Several of those people who respond negatively to any mention of SWG in the various MMORPGs have never played SWG since the NGE changes. Many of them are people who have heard about how bad the game is from others. On the other hand, the primary reason the current player population is so dismal is because the game is just not any fun, except for the obsessive compulsive Star Wars fanatics that play solely due to the fact that the game has "Star Wars" in its name and there are Stormtroopers in the game. The "Star Wars" part may attract the curious Star Wars fan, but the gigantic amount of suck repels all but those without any sort of self control where Star Wars is concerned.
I have come across a bunch of former SWG players in MMOs that I have moved onto, namely LotRO and AoC. Heck, there's several threads solely about the old SWG in AoC's Off-Topic Forum.
They miss the Pre-CU days of the game. The feeling is almost universal. In-game or on the forums, whenever the subject of SWG ever comes up. Usually something like:
"SWG kicked a**, until SOE f****d it up."
Whenever a curious player asks about SWG and what happened to it (since he heard whispers), there's usually a vet there ready to lay a short version of what once was, and what happened. Some of us, like myself, will provide long versions if they're that interested.
Laslty, the ONLY good thing to come out of the NGE and its associated debacle? It is the shining example of what NOT to do with your game and playerbase. SWG may not have the millions of WoW, but it's a real life example of what can happen if you tell your current fans / players to go f**k themselves since they're replaceable.
That's the thing, you just need to mention SWG in any other MMO and you'll start a discussion about how bad it is now, and how SOE screwed it up. The word of mouth on SWG is very bd, which keeps many people from trying it. That is due to people who used to play the game but now don't find the current version any fun, ie., the "Disgruntled Vets". There are plenty of them that don't post on these, or other, forums, but they will give their opinion on SWG if the subject comes up in another game.
When I quit SWG, I played EQ2 (until Chris Cao had his little outburst, compounded by Thundehart's responses to players who took Mr. Cao's post in the manner it was intended, final straw and all that). I mentioned SWG in one of the global chat thingamajigs, and it resulted in a two and a half hour discussion about how SOE screwed up SWG. I made a Star Wars reference in the guild chat for the guild I was in, and again, it resulted in an hour or so long discussion about how much SWG sucked after the NGE. When I first played LotRO, there were several hour or so long discussions about how bad SWG is now. When I resubbed for a month, a couple months ago, the same thing happened when someone mentioned SWG in the Breeland chat. I've seen similar chats in CoX, WoW, Voyage Century of all things, AoC, Tabula Rasa, and even the one person I ran into when I logged into the free vet trial for EQ about a month ago. There have been other games where it happened, but I don't remember all the MMOs I've tried at the moment. I can say that the twenty minutes I've spent in Dungeon Runners were SWG discussion free.
I'll disagree with the one good thing you point out. I honestly don't think any other company would have done what SOE did. I think they have a bit more sense, and a bit more respect for their customers, or at least their customer's money. Had the NGE not failed as spectacularly as it did, other companies might have considered it.
I just wore out playing the game. I didn't get the ongoing excitement of change. To me it seemed that the updates were just that and the overall content just kept going on with no suprises. I have found that with a few games as of late as well.
I have come across a bunch of former SWG players in MMOs that I have moved onto, namely LotRO and AoC. Heck, there's several threads solely about the old SWG in AoC's Off-Topic Forum. They miss the Pre-CU days of the game. The feeling is almost universal. In-game or on the forums, whenever the subject of SWG ever comes up. Usually something like: "SWG kicked a**, until SOE f****d it up." Whenever a curious player asks about SWG and what happened to it (since he heard whispers), there's usually a vet there ready to lay a short version of what once was, and what happened. Some of us, like myself, will provide long versions if they're that interested. Laslty, the ONLY good thing to come out of the NGE and its associated debacle? It is the shining example of what NOT to do with your game and playerbase. SWG may not have the millions of WoW, but it's a real life example of what can happen if you tell your current fans / players to go f**k themselves since they're replaceable.
That's the thing, you just need to mention SWG in any other MMO and you'll start a discussion about how bad it is now, and how SOE screwed it up. The word of mouth on SWG is very bd, which keeps many people from trying it. That is due to people who used to play the game but now don't find the current version any fun, ie., the "Disgruntled Vets". There are plenty of them that don't post on these, or other, forums, but they will give their opinion on SWG if the subject comes up in another game.
When I quit SWG, I played EQ2 (until Chris Cao had his little outburst, compounded by Thundehart's responses to players who took Mr. Cao's post in the manner it was intended, final straw and all that). I mentioned SWG in one of the global chat thingamajigs, and it resulted in a two and a half hour discussion about how SOE screwed up SWG. I made a Star Wars reference in the guild chat for the guild I was in, and again, it resulted in an hour or so long discussion about how much SWG sucked after the NGE. When I first played LotRO, there were several hour or so long discussions about how bad SWG is now. When I resubbed for a month, a couple months ago, the same thing happened when someone mentioned SWG in the Breeland chat. I've seen similar chats in CoX, WoW, Voyage Century of all things, AoC, Tabula Rasa, and even the one person I ran into when I logged into the free vet trial for EQ about a month ago. There have been other games where it happened, but I don't remember all the MMOs I've tried at the moment. I can say that the twenty minutes I've spent in Dungeon Runners were SWG discussion free.
I'll disagree with the one good thing you point out. I honestly don't think any other company would have done what SOE did. I think they have a bit more sense, and a bit more respect for their customers, or at least their customer's money. Had the NGE not failed as spectacularly as it did, other companies might have considered it.
Developers read these and other forums. They also play all these games that are released hell, some of them even go so far as to covertly join different guilds to see and hear what is going on. Well, SOE apparently joins em and helps guilds exploit (EQ2 for example) but that is neither here nor there, just a chance to take another shot at em So I would say that there is little to no chance of any other devteam pulling what the hacks at SOE did.
I have come across a bunch of former SWG players in MMOs that I have moved onto, namely LotRO and AoC. Heck, there's several threads solely about the old SWG in AoC's Off-Topic Forum. They miss the Pre-CU days of the game. The feeling is almost universal. In-game or on the forums, whenever the subject of SWG ever comes up. Usually something like: "SWG kicked a**, until SOE f****d it up." Whenever a curious player asks about SWG and what happened to it (since he heard whispers), there's usually a vet there ready to lay a short version of what once was, and what happened. Some of us, like myself, will provide long versions if they're that interested. Laslty, the ONLY good thing to come out of the NGE and its associated debacle? It is the shining example of what NOT to do with your game and playerbase. SWG may not have the millions of WoW, but it's a real life example of what can happen if you tell your current fans / players to go f**k themselves since they're replaceable.
Just about every MMO I've moved onto I've made it a point to find out where other members of my old community are (Bloodfin) .Which usually isn't hard ,it's players have a wide network of forums and Sites available to help us stay together .I really don't know many other games out there that have such a community based on friendships , Even between Rival guilds and opposite factions.
I think a lot of it has to do with the premature death that community was dealt , None of us were ready to stop playing , however SOE had different plans .I don't think they ever factored in the strong community they had in their grasp , I know they didn't actually.
However sadly , Most games outside of wow have not been able to hold a majority of those from bloodfin , So a large portion are still floating around from game to game trying to find that spark again .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
SWG sucked BEFORE CU/NGE. Sorry, but a reskinned EQ1 doesn't make some epic and fun game.
The only thing all the thrashing and wailing has done is make most of the "vets" look the fool. If you think the game would be in better shape NOW if it didn't have NGE you're delusional. It would be in the same state it is now.
So all you've really done is wasted a lot of time moaning about something that doesn't matter.
SWG sucked BEFORE CU/NGE. Sorry, but a reskinned EQ1 doesn't make some epic and fun game. The only thing all the thrashing and wailing has done is make most of the "vets" look the fool. If you think the game would be in better shape NOW if it didn't have NGE you're delusional. It would be in the same state it is now. So all you've really done is wasted a lot of time moaning about something that doesn't matter.
Please explain the similarities between SWG pre-cu and EQ ?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Comments
Find me one person that actually insists that there are more people now than there were pre-CU. ONE.
So I started to walk into the water. I won't lie to you boys...I was terrified. But I pressed on, and as I made my way past the breakers, a strange calm came over me. I don't know if it was divine intervention or the kinship of all living things, but I tell you, Jerry, at that moment ... I was a marine biologist.
I think Smed was trying to pitch the subscription model is dead b.s. to cover his disastrous track record tbh. Tell Blizzard that subs don't work. Tell Smed they don't work when your game is busted to hell, you lie to your customers, and toss out everything they've worked for. He seems to miss important details like that, A LOT.
and we refused to hide the body for him...
I agree with Daffid, it's one of those combination of things working together. Like I was sayin' many factors contributed to the NGE failure I think, not "one or the other" so to speak. When I read the comments I posted from Freeman though, I began to understand why there may have been so much hostility and censorship directed towards veteran players. Positive marketting was the basket SOE and LEC seemed to put their hope for success in. Too bad that in order to be positive you'd actually have to lie, and try to keep others from telling the truth. Obviously the strategy didn't work, and I'm glad. The MMO world would be a darker place if you really could hose all your players and bust your game, and then actually gain subs in the process. It's nice to see that this is not the case.
The bad word of mouth SWG currently 'enjoys' does keep people from trying it. Several of those people who respond negatively to any mention of SWG in the various MMORPGs have never played SWG since the NGE changes. Many of them are people who have heard about how bad the game is from others.
On the other hand, the primary reason the current player population is so dismal is because the game is just not any fun, except for the obsessive compulsive Star Wars fanatics that play solely due to the fact that the game has "Star Wars" in its name and there are Stormtroopers in the game. The "Star Wars" part may attract the curious Star Wars fan, but the gigantic amount of suck repels all but those without any sort of self control where Star Wars is concerned.
and we refused to hide the body for him...
I agree with Daffid, it's one of those combination of things working together. Like I was sayin' many factors contributed to the NGE failure I think, not "one or the other" so to speak. When I read the comments I posted from Freeman though, I began to understand why there may have been so much hostility and censorship directed towards veteran players. Positive marketting was the basket SOE and LEC seemed to put their hope for success in. Too bad that in order to be positive you'd actually have to lie, and try to keep others from telling the truth. Obviously the strategy didn't work, and I'm glad. The MMO world would be a darker place if you really could hose all your players and bust your game, and then actually gain subs in the process. It's nice to see that this is not the case.
I honestly just think it was a failure to follow documented procedures for developing video game code that doomed every iteration of SWG since patch 9. You have a history of putting out busted code to live servers at gun point by marketing and management to met deadlines of development that somehow got unrealistically set for the talent and staff onhand. You then had marketing pushing harder on content and additions never going back and fixing the problems that where in place from the last rushed patch. You had little to no source code controls inplace. You had high turnover rate start occurring in the back of the house.
I blame the guy with a marketing masters degree running a development house whose repeatedly shown absolute ignorance on the rules of software development. It is 100% obvious to me John Smedley belongs as a Vice President of Marketing. He is completely inept at the operational issues that a development house faces.
As for Mr. Freeman, I respect him and his attempt to clear the air but honestly, he's not fully accepted that the NGE's entire "Plan" never could have worked. It is the fundamental lack of time given to such a thing as a complete game overhaul by Freeman and company that appauls me as a consumer and an IT professional.
The CU and NGE conceptually where great ideas. The problem is not one person took implementing those ideas seriously. Then an effort was made to square off against the "vocal" minority or whatever SOE called disgruntled veterans.
Fatally flawed from concept-launch was SOE's development plans. They must have some talented coders there. To be able to work under those laux conditions and produce anything that functions is surprising to me.
It is abundantly obvious no direction exists at SOE except when a marketing guy gets some idea for a grand promo scheme that will draw in 1000's and get himself promoted.
It is obvious that it is a cultural problem at the division. How Smedley remains CEO of that division miffs me. Although I should talk. I see all sorts of incomptence at work go ignored.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I agree to an extent. I read this board and others because I was HEAVILY invested in a community of people whom I enjoyed gaming with and enjoyed my other hobby of star wars with. It was not uncomfortable or lame enjoying star wars. I have no place to go to get that back and no remedy can combine those two unique things I enjoyed about my time in the game.
So If I vent or get upset its because I have no where else to go as the NGE is something I basically refuse to take part in on the principle of the game. So I read here on occassion to see if a Pre-CU server opened up. I rip SOE employees who basically are dumb. It makes me feel better.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
I can defintely agree with you in what you said, about longing for what we all once had. At this point it seems most will never find that again.Which is sad I must confess, And I feel for those poeple .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
What things about the current version of SWG would make you recommend it to anyone? What other than the fact that it is a Star Wars game do you think would make anyone want to play it? what does SWG currently off that cannot be found in a better form somewhere else?
Both EQ2 and WoW are far superior to SWG. SWG currently boasts a horrible combat system, whether you choose the pseudo-FPS version or the badly implemented target lock version), a crafting system that does offer depth, but is unfortunately gimped due to design decisions (Loot, Rinse, Repeat), a Class system that was so poorly conceived that the developers decided to add WoW's talent system to it, and are currently in the process of revamping again, for the third time, a decent housing system, a decent space game, a repetitive collection system, based off a mishmash of EQ2's collections and LotRO's Deeds, a horrible by any standards central quest line (the Legacy quests are flat out bad), NPCs that can attack you but you cannot attack back (even if the NPC is standing right in front of you), and a future of cookie cutter instanced 'raids'.
I wouldn't recommend SWG to anyone I didn't outright hate. There is a reason the "Complete Online Adventures" box didn't sell very well. There is a reason the game is no longer available anywhere but SOE's online direct download store. There is a reason why most threads about what people like about the game on the OBoard are primarily filled with 'Because it's Star Wars' responses. It isn't because the current game is so much fun.
Thanks for the thread...been about 5 minutes since the same stuff was posted...
That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!
Get over yourselves already.
When the NGE hit, I quit playing, occasionally looking at the forums to see if they realised their mistake and hoping that they would undo it. Uptill now, they haven't, obviously.
So I say: Stop with the discussion already. They screwed up. Turn around and walk away. They deserve no less. I grow tired of this hippie " Fight the power" crap. Star Wars is dying. That should suffice. I, for one, am happy it is.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
What things about the current version of SWG would make you recommend it to anyone? What other than the fact that it is a Star Wars game do you think would make anyone want to play it? what does SWG currently off that cannot be found in a better form somewhere else?
Both EQ2 and WoW are far superior to SWG. SWG currently boasts a horrible combat system, whether you choose the pseudo-FPS version or the badly implemented target lock version), a crafting system that does offer depth, but is unfortunately gimped due to design decisions (Loot, Rinse, Repeat), a Class system that was so poorly conceived that the developers decided to add WoW's talent system to it, and are currently in the process of revamping again, for the third time, a decent housing system, a decent space game, a repetitive collection system, based off a mishmash of EQ2's collections and LotRO's Deeds, a horrible by any standards central quest line (the Legacy quests are flat out bad), NPCs that can attack you but you cannot attack back (even if the NPC is standing right in front of you), and a future of cookie cutter instanced 'raids'.
I wouldn't recommend SWG to anyone I didn't outright hate. There is a reason the "Complete Online Adventures" box didn't sell very well. There is a reason the game is no longer available anywhere but SOE's online direct download store. There is a reason why most threads about what people like about the game on the OBoard are primarily filled with 'Because it's Star Wars' responses. It isn't because the current game is so much fun.
SO your answer is you do believe what you post .
As an answer to your question , I wouldn't out right recommend it to someone as a first choice by any means. However if I were asked something along the lines of . Does SWG give me the opportunity to take part in quests with story lines based on a sci fi world ? Does swg offer me ground and space based game play ,also is it VOID of orcs and elves and high fantasy element in general ? Does SWg have classes like WOW ? Does SWG have mounts and instant travel ? Does SWG have an open world you can build on ? I could go on here but I think thats enough .
Now if someone thinks something in that list sounds fun , And hadn't ever played SWG I would say try the trial . There is no risk in that . But don't turn my post into a pro SWG stance , that wasn't my point . I haven't even played it enough to make a judgement in detail ..
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Gamespot: 75% http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/starwarsgalaxiesaned/index.html?tag=result;title;0
IGN: 80% http://pc.ign.com/articles/428/428431p1.html
PCGamer gave it a 77%
Jump to Lightspeed scores were lower.
Don't get me wrong, what SOE did was foolish but let's not say things that aren't true. SWG hardly got 10 out of 10s.
Doom! Doom!
But seriously, I would go back to SWG in an instant if they made a pre-cu server. They won't and the rest of this post is common knowledge, except the doom-saying. Which is most of it.
are you sure? because you know they would just pull the rug out from under you again. i will never play another soe/lucas arts game ever.
I typically tell those folks to step away from the bong.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
You may be unaware of some of the things disgruntled vets respond to. To say that they are having an imaginary dialogue may just be an indication that you've joined a conversation part way through. If you've ever done that in a social setting, you'll know how awkward that can be.
To illustrate, here's a post I found in about two minutes time claiming that the NGE is the "messiah" of SWG, and that the game is now better than it ever was:
"However, despite all this, I really do believe NGE is the savior messiah of SWG. Was it wrong the way it was ninja on its playerbase ? Absolutely. If i was mr john smed I would have made a pre nge server (unsupported by further development) and make it free for old veterans. Obviously they didnt make such server, and made core modifcations to the game, so as they couldn;t make a pre nge server now even if they wanted.
I was already thinking about canceling BEFORE NGE was annoucned, due mainly to huge class imbalanced, the fact that CH completely sucked in pvp, ect. Though with this massive restructruing of the game I held out a few more weeks until I decided to quit due to the fact that the nge (at first) seemed very horrible , as in, more broken and buggy than the already broken and buggy CU game.
But, slowly, over time , the game has gotten better. Its like funcomm with anarchy online all over again.And for an yone that played ao in its early days you know what I am talking about. Granted they broke it again with shadowlands, but thats a thread for another debate.
I know they changed the SWG game, but really, it was probably for the better."
If you've read some promotional ads for the game, you'd see similar claims made by SOE or LEC reps. In fact one article referred to the NGE at its release as a "more elegant" ground combat game. The NGE was deemed the saviour of dwindling server populations by SOE and LEC at one of their damage control dev chats, and players who have complained have systematically been labelled the vocal minority. The response to the NGE, according to the marketing hype, was overwhelmingling positive etc. etc..
Imaginary dialogue? No I think not. Countering outrageous claims that fly in the face of reason and our collective experience? Certainly.
Only recently has the marketing strategy changed slightly to say, "the new NGE isn't all that bad." To suggest that this has been the approach all along though would be another in a long history of offensive misrepresentations made regarding the money trap called SWG.
How can you sit here and speak for hundreds or even thousands of people ? There is a line between guessing and factual information your posts seem to totally ignore .
A lot of Vets seem to buy into their own hype . I don't know if they have developed an online persona they can't escape , or if they really believe their thoughts they express in posts. One thing's for sure it can be quite mind boggling to read.
Some even seem to have imaginary dialogue floating around in their head (people posting the game is healthier than ever ? where?) , (Everyone who enjoys the game says they only do because it's Star Wars? What?) I like Conan < But that's not the only thing to like about AOC (Which has as many naysayers as SWG at this point , if not more) And justifiably so. If you can find fun ,good for you. If you can't Oh well ,no big deal .
I don't mean this as a personal attack or anything. I just really don't understand the logic in these posts or the rambling any more.
SWG as it was pre-cu is gone, most who played are gone . On my server (bloodfin) just about everyone is new or a transfer (I came across 6 people I Knew from 03 in game).The game is nothing at all like it was at any stage I have tried it or played it during . Some aspects are positive as compared to other MMO's available at present ,Other features fall behind in comparison. Just like every other run of the mill MMO I've tried and I've tried them all.
i'm not saying SWg is a game I would recommend to a Pre-cu fan or a EVE fan . But A wow fan might enjoy it , or even an EQ2 fan. It's not much different at all.
You may be unaware of some of the things disgruntled vets respond to. To say that they are having an imaginary dialogue may just be an indication that you've joined a conversation part way through. If you've ever done that in a social setting, you'll know how awkward that can be.
To illustrate, here's a post I found in about two minutes time claiming that the NGE is the "messiah" of SWG, and that the game is now better than it ever was:
"However, despite all this, I really do believe NGE is the savior messiah of SWG. Was it wrong the way it was ninja on its playerbase ? Absolutely. If i was mr john smed I would have made a pre nge server (unsupported by further development) and make it free for old veterans. Obviously they didnt make such server, and made core modifcations to the game, so as they couldn;t make a pre nge server now even if they wanted.
I was already thinking about canceling BEFORE NGE was annoucned, due mainly to huge class imbalanced, the fact that CH completely sucked in pvp, ect. Though with this massive restructruing of the game I held out a few more weeks until I decided to quit due to the fact that the nge (at first) seemed very horrible , as in, more broken and buggy than the already broken and buggy CU game.
But, slowly, over time , the game has gotten better. Its like funcomm with anarchy online all over again.And for an yone that played ao in its early days you know what I am talking about. Granted they broke it again with shadowlands, but thats a thread for another debate.
I know they changed the SWG game, but really, it was probably for the better."
If you've read some promotional ads for the game, you'd see similar claims made by SOE or LEC reps. In fact one article referred to the NGE at its release as a "more elegant" ground combat game. The NGE was deemed the saviour of dwindling server populations by SOE and LEC at one of their damage control dev chats, and players who have complained have systematically been labelled the vocal minority. The response to the NGE, according to the marketing hype, was overwhelmingling positive etc. etc..
Imaginary dialogue? No I think not. Countering outrageous claims that fly in the face of reason and our collective experience? Certainly.
Only recently has the marketing strategy changed slightly to say, "the new NGE isn't all that bad." To suggest that this has been the approach all along though would be another in a long history of offensive misrepresentations made regarding the money trap called SWG.
I could understand responding to those posters, But responding to them in other threads that have nothing to do with the subject makes no sense to me .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
$OE after the CUNGE thats them saying why dont they like the game we do lol lol
But anyways they will do what they have to to save face..
and show it as positive as they can..
I have come across a bunch of former SWG players in MMOs that I have moved onto, namely LotRO and AoC. Heck, there's several threads solely about the old SWG in AoC's Off-Topic Forum.
They miss the Pre-CU days of the game. The feeling is almost universal. In-game or on the forums, whenever the subject of SWG ever comes up. Usually something like:
"SWG kicked a**, until SOE f****d it up."
Whenever a curious player asks about SWG and what happened to it (since he heard whispers), there's usually a vet there ready to lay a short version of what once was, and what happened. Some of us, like myself, will provide long versions if they're that interested.
Laslty, the ONLY good thing to come out of the NGE and its associated debacle? It is the shining example of what NOT to do with your game and playerbase. SWG may not have the millions of WoW, but it's a real life example of what can happen if you tell your current fans / players to go f**k themselves since they're replaceable.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
I have come across a bunch of former SWG players in MMOs that I have moved onto, namely LotRO and AoC. Heck, there's several threads solely about the old SWG in AoC's Off-Topic Forum.
They miss the Pre-CU days of the game. The feeling is almost universal. In-game or on the forums, whenever the subject of SWG ever comes up. Usually something like:
"SWG kicked a**, until SOE f****d it up."
Whenever a curious player asks about SWG and what happened to it (since he heard whispers), there's usually a vet there ready to lay a short version of what once was, and what happened. Some of us, like myself, will provide long versions if they're that interested.
Laslty, the ONLY good thing to come out of the NGE and its associated debacle? It is the shining example of what NOT to do with your game and playerbase. SWG may not have the millions of WoW, but it's a real life example of what can happen if you tell your current fans / players to go f**k themselves since they're replaceable.
That's the thing, you just need to mention SWG in any other MMO and you'll start a discussion about how bad it is now, and how SOE screwed it up. The word of mouth on SWG is very bd, which keeps many people from trying it. That is due to people who used to play the game but now don't find the current version any fun, ie., the "Disgruntled Vets". There are plenty of them that don't post on these, or other, forums, but they will give their opinion on SWG if the subject comes up in another game.
When I quit SWG, I played EQ2 (until Chris Cao had his little outburst, compounded by Thundehart's responses to players who took Mr. Cao's post in the manner it was intended, final straw and all that). I mentioned SWG in one of the global chat thingamajigs, and it resulted in a two and a half hour discussion about how SOE screwed up SWG. I made a Star Wars reference in the guild chat for the guild I was in, and again, it resulted in an hour or so long discussion about how much SWG sucked after the NGE. When I first played LotRO, there were several hour or so long discussions about how bad SWG is now. When I resubbed for a month, a couple months ago, the same thing happened when someone mentioned SWG in the Breeland chat. I've seen similar chats in CoX, WoW, Voyage Century of all things, AoC, Tabula Rasa, and even the one person I ran into when I logged into the free vet trial for EQ about a month ago. There have been other games where it happened, but I don't remember all the MMOs I've tried at the moment. I can say that the twenty minutes I've spent in Dungeon Runners were SWG discussion free.
I'll disagree with the one good thing you point out. I honestly don't think any other company would have done what SOE did. I think they have a bit more sense, and a bit more respect for their customers, or at least their customer's money. Had the NGE not failed as spectacularly as it did, other companies might have considered it.
I just wore out playing the game. I didn't get the ongoing excitement of change. To me it seemed that the updates were just that and the overall content just kept going on with no suprises. I have found that with a few games as of late as well.
I think I need to make my own for a while.
That's the thing, you just need to mention SWG in any other MMO and you'll start a discussion about how bad it is now, and how SOE screwed it up. The word of mouth on SWG is very bd, which keeps many people from trying it. That is due to people who used to play the game but now don't find the current version any fun, ie., the "Disgruntled Vets". There are plenty of them that don't post on these, or other, forums, but they will give their opinion on SWG if the subject comes up in another game.
When I quit SWG, I played EQ2 (until Chris Cao had his little outburst, compounded by Thundehart's responses to players who took Mr. Cao's post in the manner it was intended, final straw and all that). I mentioned SWG in one of the global chat thingamajigs, and it resulted in a two and a half hour discussion about how SOE screwed up SWG. I made a Star Wars reference in the guild chat for the guild I was in, and again, it resulted in an hour or so long discussion about how much SWG sucked after the NGE. When I first played LotRO, there were several hour or so long discussions about how bad SWG is now. When I resubbed for a month, a couple months ago, the same thing happened when someone mentioned SWG in the Breeland chat. I've seen similar chats in CoX, WoW, Voyage Century of all things, AoC, Tabula Rasa, and even the one person I ran into when I logged into the free vet trial for EQ about a month ago. There have been other games where it happened, but I don't remember all the MMOs I've tried at the moment. I can say that the twenty minutes I've spent in Dungeon Runners were SWG discussion free.
I'll disagree with the one good thing you point out. I honestly don't think any other company would have done what SOE did. I think they have a bit more sense, and a bit more respect for their customers, or at least their customer's money. Had the NGE not failed as spectacularly as it did, other companies might have considered it.
Developers read these and other forums. They also play all these games that are released hell, some of them even go so far as to covertly join different guilds to see and hear what is going on. Well, SOE apparently joins em and helps guilds exploit (EQ2 for example) but that is neither here nor there, just a chance to take another shot at em So I would say that there is little to no chance of any other devteam pulling what the hacks at SOE did.
http://www.speedtest.net/result/7300033012
Just about every MMO I've moved onto I've made it a point to find out where other members of my old community are (Bloodfin) .Which usually isn't hard ,it's players have a wide network of forums and Sites available to help us stay together .I really don't know many other games out there that have such a community based on friendships , Even between Rival guilds and opposite factions.
I think a lot of it has to do with the premature death that community was dealt , None of us were ready to stop playing , however SOE had different plans .I don't think they ever factored in the strong community they had in their grasp , I know they didn't actually.
However sadly , Most games outside of wow have not been able to hold a majority of those from bloodfin , So a large portion are still floating around from game to game trying to find that spark again .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
SWG sucked BEFORE CU/NGE. Sorry, but a reskinned EQ1 doesn't make some epic and fun game.
The only thing all the thrashing and wailing has done is make most of the "vets" look the fool. If you think the game would be in better shape NOW if it didn't have NGE you're delusional. It would be in the same state it is now.
So all you've really done is wasted a lot of time moaning about something that doesn't matter.
http://www.greycouncil.org/
Please explain the similarities between SWG pre-cu and EQ ?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson