The statement was made that Ebay does not affect the in-game economy and does not harm people in a non-pvp game. I have proven that wrong by demonstrateing exactly how ebay affects the in-game economy for the worse and prevents players from getting items they desire.
Yes as said by adding competition and makeing it 'harder'.
Once for City of Heroes I paid $20 for 100k Influence which really made buying Inspirations in-game much easier to get. It added to my overall enjoyment of the game because I didnt have to spend all my time trying to get cash. It was well worth $20 as Ive spent that just going to McDonalds for my kids.
Another time I bought credits for SWG. I had quit previously and had given all my money and items away before. When I returned, I had no interest in spending tons of game hours trying to get going again. No way was I gonna waste time doing delivery missions so I could buy a medium harvester, then more delivery missions to buy power, etc. I think I paid $40 for 5 million credits, well worth it as it gave me enough money to get right back into the game without having to grind needlessly.
I have been sorely tempted to buy a Jedi Account on a few occasions but not willing to spend 1-2k for one. If I were lucky and saw someone selling an account for less than $500 I'd buy it in a second. Same goes for WoW or EQ2 Beta accounts, if one should come along thats reasonably priced I might buy it.
For those that condemn this, me thinks you doth protest too much. Take a look at EBay right now and search under swg jedi... there are 125+ for sale and most are being bid on by tons of people.
Originally posted by admriker444 Same goes for WoW or EQ2 Beta accounts, if one should come along thats reasonably priced I might buy it. For those that condemn this, me thinks you doth protest too much. Take a look at EBay right now and search under swg jedi... there are 125+ for sale and most are being bid on by tons of people.
I dont protest people buying things off of ebay for mmorpg items. My wife and I made 3000 dollars combined for selling 2 Jedi accounts.
HOWEVER
We laughed at the poor guy who bought them from us of all the way to the bank. Well..all the way to the car dealership technically. Why would anyone spend 500 bucks for a Jedi account much less 1500? For bragging rights? Man, I don't know...when someone spends that much money for a make-believe character well..it's just not natural. But like I said...we bought a Ford Focus because of the guy...so I cant complain too much. I just would never do it.
And good lord, why would you spend money on a beta account that will be whiped out in 2 months?!? That's just plain crazy....get into beta for free or wait until release. Buying an account that has a shelf life of 2 months is insanity.
Originally posted by WizGamer Now hear me out, its just an opinion, I don't want yours. .
People who have to create conspiracy and hate threads to further a cause lacks in intellectual comprehension of diversity.
But there are two sides to look at. Let's say I make $25 an hour at work. Now, camping a specific items takes about 4 hours, that is $100. If that item could be bought on eBay for $50, the person who bought it has saved money. Now, there are a lot of people who make a hell of a lot more than $25 an hour. Their time is very valuable, they have lots of expendable cash, and they have little time to be screwing around camping for items."
Well put, not ot only is this actually good for the game itself but it is a healthy democratic view.
"In my opinion, if you have so little time to play that you need to purchase items out of game, then you shouldn't be playing MMORPG's. "
An opinion that would mean the end of all mmorpgs, the majority of players have that small amount of time to spend, the fact that they "need" to buy items does not mean that they actually do it though.
/end quote
To use this example but alter it a bit:
Say 2 players have 16 hours a day to their disposal. One of wich are the one making 25$ an hour and work takes up about 10 hours a day, other things take up say 4 hours wich leaves him with 2 hours a day to spend online.
Another player has no work at all and he can spend 10 hours a day logged in, his income is say 5$ an hour from whatever sources such as unemployment money, student loans or whatever.
Now the working guy spends 25$ buying stuff in game that takes say 4 hours to collect from the other one.
The end result is that the working player do not need to spend 2 days to collect them items, all it takes him is one hour of work. He can spend his online time as he wish doing things he enjoys, this is assuming he do NOT like camping. He will probably not get tired of the game as fast if he can focus on the fun parts and play longer. This is of course good for the game as a whole.
Now player 2 spends 4 hours to collect them items, he probably does this as a part of how he plays the game anyhow, the items or money is surplus from playing. He now gets 25$ for items he really had no plan of using but collected for the sake of collecting. And he just earned 5 hours worth of pay. This fact as well makes him more probable to play the game longer and enjoy it more but it also part of a healthy market economy that money switches hands in this way. So this is good for both society AND the game. Honestly what more can one ask fore? The impact on other players are small if exist at all. NOT counting extremely farming friendly games like L2 and such were the "farmers" utterly destroy the game for people in between the 2 types of players.
I say the the gaming companies should encourage this and if they were smart they should try to get in on the action somehow, but NOT by selling items or money that they can just spawn with a command, but rather take the action away from ebay or whatever.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Originally posted by Jerek_
I wonder if you honestly even believe what you type, or if you live in a made up world of facts. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I like that analogy Umbrood I work myself but it aint $25 an hour, but its more than $5 lol and ive been tempted to start a little item selling business. There are however a couple problems with it
1) Large well organised companies have already dominated many of the most popular MMORPG's. They have many staff at their disposal. Many of them reside in Asia of course....$5 an hour in many countries is damn good money.
2) Its not very good for your health sitting at a computer for 10 hours for such lousy pay
3) There is no guarantee youll actually secure the item/items your after and you must compete with other people trying to make a dollar or heaven forbid, actually "play" the game
Plus side
1) I earn money doing something i love...but it would soon become a choir
2) Being self employed is always liberating, in fact, its one of my prime aims in life...
I played Lineage 2, and i have to say all this huff huff about farmers is for the most part - B.S...THey never really bothered me that much id have to say. What did bother me were the same old problems i encounter on all MMORPG's - balance and grind, nothing to do with farmers or ppl ebaying accounts or cash..
Originally posted by admriker444 I gotta admit Ive used EBAY on a few occasions... I have been sorely tempted to buy a Jedi Account on a few occasions but not willing to spend 1-2k for one. If I were lucky and saw someone selling an account for less than $500 I'd buy it in a second. Same goes for WoW or EQ2 Beta accounts, if one should come along thats reasonably priced I might buy it. For those that condemn this, me thinks you doth protest too much. Take a look at EBay right now and search under swg jedi... there are 125+ for sale and most are being bid on by tons of people.
Just curious, haven't played SWG...what makes the jedi accounts so high in demand?
Jedi accounts in SWG are expensive because they are hard to get. As with anything else supply and demand detrmine price.
Tons of people love star wars...And dammit they want to play a JEDI. Not a bounty hunter or a barroom dancer or any of the 100 other things you can do in that game. Furthermore that you HAVE to do to open a Jedi slot.
Opening a jedi slot in SWG involves doing a lot of grinding with charecters that are NOT Jedi...A lot of people don't like that, playing a game in a way that is not fun for them in order to be allowed to play the fun parts. Some of these people make good money, and are willing to spend it so they can play the parts they enjoy.
That's what Ebay is all about really in relation to MMORPGs, not haveing to do the boreing stuff so you can do the fun stuff.
All in all it can take upwards of 400 hours to open a Jedi slot. Even makeing 5$ an hour if you spent that time working(say at a job you enjoy) you would easily earn enough to buy that Jedi account, as well as other things.
Originally posted by Mattius I like that analogy Umbrood I work myself but it aint $25 an hour, but its more than $5 lol and ive been tempted to start a little item selling business. There are however a couple problems with it 1) Large well organised companies have already dominated many of the most popular MMORPG's. They have many staff at their disposal. Many of them reside in Asia of course....$5 an hour in many countries is damn good money. 2) Its not very good for your health sitting at a computer for 10 hours for such lousy pay 3) There is no guarantee youll actually secure the item/items your after and you must compete with other people trying to make a dollar or heaven forbid, actually "play" the game Plus side 1) I earn money doing something i love...but it would soon become a choir 2) Being self employed is always liberating, in fact, its one of my prime aims in life... I played Lineage 2, and i have to say all this huff huff about farmers is for the most part - B.S...THey never really bothered me that much id have to say. What did bother me were the same old problems i encounter on all MMORPG's - balance and grind, nothing to do with farmers or ppl ebaying accounts or cash..
I agree with your "problems", companies that hog most good farming spots and such destroy the game. My point was really that while I play, or used to play, 10 hours+ a day during that time I collected noth items and money I really did not need, it was merely a bi-product of me playing the game as I would have in any case. Selling of this "surplus", wich was by far more then I could ever use for RL money was a real benefit to me, I did not really put in any extra effort to gain them and whoever got them saved up on a lot of time. It was a true win-win situation, I interfered in a minimal if any way at all with other players.
And yes 10 hours+ day is NOT healthy, basically I played my university education down the drain, something that I now have to redo (education that is). Lets just say I keep a close eye on my online habits now..
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Originally posted by Jerek_
I wonder if you honestly even believe what you type, or if you live in a made up world of facts. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i pretty much agree with the last few posts. Nobody should really be telling anyone else how to spend their money. Let alone some broke-ass people who think $100 is a life savings or something. I'm still amazed at the posts that complain about MMORPG monthlly fee's, these people have the money to afford a decent computer i'm assuming in order to run these games and they dont have the money to afford $13-$15/month? Get a real job or something, hell you can work a minimum wage job and cover that easily. If your a kid begging your parents for money maybe i can understand but a kid shouldnt be telling an adult how to spend their money considering their happy to get a $1 from teh tooth fairy
I'm sure there are some really stupid things some of the ones preaching end up buying that we could all criticize. Fact is if someone wants to spend money on a virtual item or account, you dont even need to make an argument trying to justify it according to time spent in-game acquiring it, since its really nobody's business but the individual. Some people have FU money, some people dont seem to i guess. Dont hate on someone because they can spend more liesurely than you can, get a better job or something~
And regardless of the arguments made here against ebay or selling of virtual items, i dont see it as a problem. I've played various mmorpg's for 6'sh years on and off, and i've never ran into a situation where theres an item i HAVE to have so badly, and automatically blame ebay because i cant get it or it being always camped. Just like i dont whine about not having everything every hardcore powergamer has like so many casual gamers do expecting to be just given all of that for free because they pay the same monthly fee. Some people really need to accept their situation for what it is and make the best of it instead of constantly crying about it
Originally posted by rohbshop i pretty much agree with the last few posts. Nobody should really be telling anyone else how to spend their money. Let alone some broke-ass people who think $100 is a life savings or something. I'm still amazed at the posts that complain about MMORPG monthlly fee's, these people have the money to afford a decent computer i'm assuming in order to run these games and they dont have the money to afford $13-$15/month? Get a real job or something, hell you can work a minimum wage job and cover that easily. If your a kid begging your parents for money maybe i can understand but a kid shouldnt be telling an adult how to spend their money considering their happy to get a $1 from teh tooth fairy I'm sure there are some really stupid things some of the ones preaching end up buying that we could all criticize. Fact is if someone wants to spend money on a virtual item or account, you dont even need to make an argument trying to justify it according to time spent in-game acquiring it, since its really nobody's business but the individual. Some people have FU money, some people dont seem to i guess. Dont hate on someone because they can spend more liesurely than you can, get a better job or something~ And regardless of the arguments made here against ebay or selling of virtual items, i dont see it as a problem. I've played various mmorpg's for 6'sh years on and off, and i've never ran into a situation where theres an item i HAVE to have so badly, and automatically blame ebay because i cant get it or it being always camped. Just like i dont whine about not having everything every hardcore powergamer has like so many casual gamers do expecting to be just given all of that for free because they pay the same monthly fee. Some people really need to accept their situation for what it is and make the best of it instead of constantly crying about it
Originally posted by TaskyZZ This is a hot topic in one of the Suggestions Threads... It is not illegal. No LAWS against it. But many games have RULES against it... I personally wouldn't spend cash to buy an item in a game. If the game isn't fun enough to try to get the item yourself, then why play the game? But, I guess if a person wanted an item bad enough and didn't want to spend 6 (or more) hours in the game just trying to get that item, then they could buy it. And if your time has any value, they will probably have saved money in the end. I don't see it as hurting the game, but some people believe it does.
in some ways it is hurting the game. in lineage2 people bought adena (including myself) so the prices on everything went up. but bought the adena after the prices went up. its actually a good idea. if you dont want to spend 24+ hours trying to get 1 million adena and you have $18 to spare. its a great deal
And that is one major reason why the economy is soo screwed up in L2. On Devianne (where I play) the dragon clan runs everything (well did, their internet shop got all it's IP's banned the other day). It's a well known fact that Finalboss, the leader of dragon also owns an internet shop in China. No big deal the dudes into computers and gaming. However he also runs most of the bots/farmers you see in all the newbie dungeons. You know? the ones that KS you constantly, and then PK you as soon as you stand up for yourself. So your adding to the problem by lining his pockets with american dollars. Also, have you seen the exchange rate? Lord your 18 dollars prob pays his rent for a friggin year.
I have 2 trains of thought on this though. I mentioned in another post that I ride motorcycles. I consider that a hobby, I also have a full time ++ career. Ok, so it's no prob for me to drop 10K on a new bike. What if gaming was my main hobby? Ok, keep all the money I spend on bikes and that stuff and now channel it into my gaming hobby. I work 40+ hours a week, so there is no way I am going to keep up with joe kid, or any other type of gamer that has nothing to do all day but sit and grind. Ok so I hit up IGN, I get myself the uber gear, so that the time I do spend grinding is maximized. Looking at it that way makes sence.
On another point. Buying a high level char I think is a waste of time. As someone pointed out, you will have no clue how to play your char. By the time you get a clue (in L2) you will have been beat down so many times that you prob hate the game. So I think for the hobbiest maybe buy the gear but not the char may be acceptable.
I know I did a real good politician impression here, jumping both sides of the fence, but I can see arguements for and against.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
Originally posted by rohbshop i pretty much agree with the last few posts. Nobody should really be telling anyone else how to spend their money. Let alone some broke-ass people who think $100 is a life savings or something. I'm still amazed at the posts that complain about MMORPG monthlly fee's, these people have the money to afford a decent computer i'm assuming in order to run these games and they dont have the money to afford $13-$15/month? Get a real job or something, hell you can work a minimum wage job and cover that easily. If your a kid begging your parents for money maybe i can understand but a kid shouldnt be telling an adult how to spend their money considering their happy to get a $1 from teh tooth fairy I'm sure there are some really stupid things some of the ones preaching end up buying that we could all criticize. Fact is if someone wants to spend money on a virtual item or account, you dont even need to make an argument trying to justify it according to time spent in-game acquiring it, since its really nobody's business but the individual. Some people have FU money, some people dont seem to i guess. Dont hate on someone because they can spend more liesurely than you can, get a better job or something~ And regardless of the arguments made here against ebay or selling of virtual items, i dont see it as a problem. I've played various mmorpg's for 6'sh years on and off, and i've never ran into a situation where theres an item i HAVE to have so badly, and automatically blame ebay because i cant get it or it being always camped. Just like i dont whine about not having everything every hardcore powergamer has like so many casual gamers do expecting to be just given all of that for free because they pay the same monthly fee. Some people really need to accept their situation for what it is and make the best of it instead of constantly crying about it
Was just about to type basically the same thing!!!
Originally posted by xplororor Only in a PvP game would other players buying items on E-Bay, or with real life money, ever effect you. Even in PvP, a player who plays the game normal will still have an edge over a player who used real life money to purchase his items, character, ingame money, etc... because the regular player has far more experience actually playing his character, learning the game mechanics, etc...
Utter morons, just like you explorer, keep saying this. I periodically stop what I am doing and prove them wrong.
He's a clue. Free. Go read the last 2 pages of this very thread and realize how UTTERLY FRIKKING stupid and wrong you now look.
I agree with almost every point you made,as i have made a similiar post a lil while back.Glad to see i'm the only one who doesnt like the direction mmorpg's are headed for.
IGE is a money making giant off these games.To answer a few of your questions...
i believe members/coders whatever involved with these games are involved with making money off these games.Either by using known exploits of the game or by running subsidiary sites that sell money to or on behalf of giants like IGE.
yes it ruins the game and does prove there is something wrong with the game,when u need outside money.
From my experiences,i would say that joining any mmorpg after a couple mnths of release is a waste of your time.Better to join a game when it it is first released.You have a better chance of avoiding the money making ratrace that way.
You have to wonder why they have made no attempt to stop this money flow?i believe there is alot of hands dipping into the cookie jar...thats why.
imagine knowing every exploit ,spawn time,trick to making mobs drop that special item,know the tricks to achieving the best crafting results, they could make a ton of money off the game,even a person feeling a bit guilty wouldn't turn this down.Who would know all of this?...answer is not needed..i'm sure you figured it out.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Personally I really think you are making a bigger deal out of this than it really is. Most games the buying of items does not directly affect other players as much as you make it out to be. Personally I have made a good thousand dollars off selling my accounts, I don't think its wrong, if they have the money its their money they can do whatever the hell they want.
I agree with Xira how it creates competition. This competition is good, Everquest was the last game I played that I felt it was hard to get any item I wanted, Dark Ages of Camelot coming after that, and both I played end game conditions multiple times. People want such player friendly games these days that there is no competition or challenge left to the game. When it comes to the MMO genre time is generally the only factor you can use to progress. Coming back to the money spending, if someone doesn't have the time to spend progressing in a game and wishes to spend money, who are you to say it's wrong when you may have more freedom in your schedule than that individual does?
Fact is, this does not look like it will ever be controlled fully. Most games are so player friendly these days there is nothing needed, World of Warcraft is a joke of a challenge for example, every item you get has some ultimate use to it or atleast seems to, what is the fun in that? Maybe it will decrease their auctioning of items/money, who knows, only time can tell.
But really my personal conclusion of this issue is that it doesn't hurt communities enough to matter, in a few cases I may see this differently like in the case of Lineage 2, I see that more as a fault by NC Soft than the players, they make it so damn easy to farm it. Just my opinion on it, I may have repeated some or all of it, I'm not sure, just felt I should add what I thought.
yeah i think alot fo these people that are so strongly against it make their argument more out of envy and spite than the actual effect it has on the game. Either that or theyre some very paranoid people. I wouldnt even bother to comment again if i didnt feel the issue wasnt being exxagerated so much.
Blame the internet. Theres a market for everything now and screaming about it sure isnt going to stop it.
Originally posted by holycannoli I think it's ridiculous that people spend lots of money on non existant stuff. Hundreds of dollars at times! This stuff's not real! It's never gonna be yours! It can be taken away at any time for any reason. It's a complete waste of money, like hiring a hooker or throwing your cash down the sewer. If it were small change we were talking about that's different. But this is big money being spent on nothing. It's ludicrous.
I agree...
But there are two sides to look at. Let's say I make $25 an hour at work. Now, camping a specific items takes about 4 hours, that is $100. If that item could be bought on eBay for $50, the person who bought it has saved money. Now, there are a lot of people who make a hell of a lot more than $25 an hour. Their time is very valuable, they have lots of expendable cash, and they have little time to be screwing around camping for items.
In my opinion, if you have so little time to play that you need to purchase items out of game, then you shouldn't be playing MMORPG's.
I disagree because every mmorpg i played caters for all levels.You should play the game for fun and not because you are looking for an item.
So say i have a busy week working 90 hours that week.I then have only 4 hours to play that week.I certainly will not take my overtime money to buy a virtual item and say "oh i worked more this week and could not play much".That extra money will go into a early mortgage payment or something more meaniful .
There is nothing wrong with buying items for or associated with games. The only people that have issues with it are those that dont want to do and because they dont want to spend any extra money on a game, the only way they can justify someone else not doing it is to falsely claim that it hurts game-play. This is the same exact arguement people use for game-play time. . .some can play more and those that dont have that advantage or dont want to put in that time falsely claim that it isnt fair.
Originally posted by hercules I disagree because every mmorpg i played caters for all levels.You should play the game for fun and not because you are looking for an item. So say i have a busy week working 90 hours that week.I then have only 4 hours to play that week.I certainly will not take my overtime money to buy a virtual item and say "oh i worked more this week and could not play much".That extra money will go into a early mortgage payment or something more meaniful .
Responding to the point I bolded
Ah, but this is a matter of opinion. You can't tell someone why they should be playing the game. Each person has a right to play the game the way they want for whatever purposes, to find fun where and how they want to. As long as they don't cheat or infringe on someone else's right to play the game the way they want.
If someone wants to play just to search for a specific item, that is their business. As long as they are not infringing on other poeple's right to play and have fun.
Comments
So, your argument is that it creates more competition?
It makes the game harder for you?
"That is one terrible reason. I don't want the game to be harder, make them stop..."
The truth is, itis the games that are flawed. if the exact same item didn't drop in the exact same place, then there would be no farming at all...
The answer is the game is flawed, not the players.
The statement was made that Ebay does not affect the in-game economy and does not harm people in a non-pvp game. I have proven that wrong by demonstrateing exactly how ebay affects the in-game economy for the worse and prevents players from getting items they desire.
Yes as said by adding competition and makeing it 'harder'.
I gotta admit Ive used EBAY on a few occasions...
Once for City of Heroes I paid $20 for 100k Influence which really made buying Inspirations in-game much easier to get. It added to my overall enjoyment of the game because I didnt have to spend all my time trying to get cash. It was well worth $20 as Ive spent that just going to McDonalds for my kids.
Another time I bought credits for SWG. I had quit previously and had given all my money and items away before. When I returned, I had no interest in spending tons of game hours trying to get going again. No way was I gonna waste time doing delivery missions so I could buy a medium harvester, then more delivery missions to buy power, etc. I think I paid $40 for 5 million credits, well worth it as it gave me enough money to get right back into the game without having to grind needlessly.
I have been sorely tempted to buy a Jedi Account on a few occasions but not willing to spend 1-2k for one. If I were lucky and saw someone selling an account for less than $500 I'd buy it in a second. Same goes for WoW or EQ2 Beta accounts, if one should come along thats reasonably priced I might buy it.
For those that condemn this, me thinks you doth protest too much. Take a look at EBay right now and search under swg jedi... there are 125+ for sale and most are being bid on by tons of people.
I dont protest people buying things off of ebay for mmorpg items. My wife and I made 3000 dollars combined for selling 2 Jedi accounts.
HOWEVER
We laughed at the poor guy who bought them from us of all the way to the bank. Well..all the way to the car dealership technically. Why would anyone spend 500 bucks for a Jedi account much less 1500? For bragging rights? Man, I don't know...when someone spends that much money for a make-believe character well..it's just not natural. But like I said...we bought a Ford Focus because of the guy...so I cant complain too much. I just would never do it.
And good lord, why would you spend money on a beta account that will be whiped out in 2 months?!? That's just plain crazy....get into beta for free or wait until release. Buying an account that has a shelf life of 2 months is insanity.
People who have to create conspiracy and hate threads to further a cause lacks in intellectual comprehension of diversity.
/quote TaskyZZ
"I agree...
But there are two sides to look at. Let's say I make $25 an hour at work. Now, camping a specific items takes about 4 hours, that is $100. If that item could be bought on eBay for $50, the person who bought it has saved money. Now, there are a lot of people who make a hell of a lot more than $25 an hour. Their time is very valuable, they have lots of expendable cash, and they have little time to be screwing around camping for items."
Well put, not ot only is this actually good for the game itself but it is a healthy democratic view.
"In my opinion, if you have so little time to play that you need to purchase items out of game, then you shouldn't be playing MMORPG's.
"
An opinion that would mean the end of all mmorpgs, the majority of players have that small amount of time to spend, the fact that they "need" to buy items does not mean that they actually do it though.
/end quote
To use this example but alter it a bit:
Say 2 players have 16 hours a day to their disposal. One of wich are the one making 25$ an hour and work takes up about 10 hours a day, other things take up say 4 hours wich leaves him with 2 hours a day to spend online.
Another player has no work at all and he can spend 10 hours a day logged in, his income is say 5$ an hour from whatever sources such as unemployment money, student loans or whatever.
Now the working guy spends 25$ buying stuff in game that takes say 4 hours to collect from the other one.
The end result is that the working player do not need to spend 2 days to collect them items, all it takes him is one hour of work. He can spend his online time as he wish doing things he enjoys, this is assuming he do NOT like camping. He will probably not get tired of the game as fast if he can focus on the fun parts and play longer. This is of course good for the game as a whole.
Now player 2 spends 4 hours to collect them items, he probably does this as a part of how he plays the game anyhow, the items or money is surplus from playing. He now gets 25$ for items he really had no plan of using but collected for the sake of collecting. And he just earned 5 hours worth of pay. This fact as well makes him more probable to play the game longer and enjoy it more but it also part of a healthy market economy that money switches hands in this way. So this is good for both society AND the game. Honestly what more can one ask fore? The impact on other players are small if exist at all. NOT counting extremely farming friendly games like L2 and such were the "farmers" utterly destroy the game for people in between the 2 types of players.
I say the the gaming companies should encourage this and if they were smart they should try to get in on the action somehow, but NOT by selling items or money that they can just spawn with a command, but rather take the action away from ebay or whatever.
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Originally posted by Jerek_
I wonder if you honestly even believe what you type, or if you live in a made up world of facts.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I like that analogy Umbrood
I work myself but it aint $25 an hour, but its more than $5 lol and ive been tempted to start a little item selling business. There are however a couple problems with it
1) Large well organised companies have already dominated many of the most popular MMORPG's. They have many staff at their disposal. Many of them reside in Asia of course....$5 an hour in many countries is damn good money.
2) Its not very good for your health sitting at a computer for 10 hours for such lousy pay
3) There is no guarantee youll actually secure the item/items your after and you must compete with other people trying to make a dollar or heaven forbid, actually "play" the game
Plus side
1) I earn money doing something i love...but it would soon become a choir
2) Being self employed is always liberating, in fact, its one of my prime aims in life...
I played Lineage 2, and i have to say all this huff huff about farmers is for the most part - B.S...THey never really bothered me that much id have to say. What did bother me were the same old problems i encounter on all MMORPG's - balance and grind, nothing to do with farmers or ppl ebaying accounts or cash..
Jedi accounts in SWG are expensive because they are hard to get. As with anything else supply and demand detrmine price.
Tons of people love star wars...And dammit they want to play a JEDI. Not a bounty hunter or a barroom dancer or any of the 100 other things you can do in that game.
Furthermore that you HAVE to do to open a Jedi slot.
Opening a jedi slot in SWG involves doing a lot of grinding with charecters that are NOT Jedi...A lot of people don't like that, playing a game in a way that is not fun for them in order to be allowed to play the fun parts. Some of these people make good money, and are willing to spend it so they can play the parts they enjoy.
That's what Ebay is all about really in relation to MMORPGs, not haveing to do the boreing stuff so you can do the fun stuff.
All in all it can take upwards of 400 hours to open a Jedi slot. Even makeing 5$ an hour if you spent that time working(say at a job you enjoy) you would easily earn enough to buy that Jedi account, as well as other things.
I agree with your "problems", companies that hog most good farming spots and such destroy the game. My point was really that while I play, or used to play, 10 hours+ a day during that time I collected noth items and money I really did not need, it was merely a bi-product of me playing the game as I would have in any case. Selling of this "surplus", wich was by far more then I could ever use for RL money was a real benefit to me, I did not really put in any extra effort to gain them and whoever got them saved up on a lot of time. It was a true win-win situation, I interfered in a minimal if any way at all with other players.
And yes 10 hours+ day is NOT healthy, basically I played my university education down the drain, something that I now have to redo (education that is). Lets just say I keep a close eye on my online habits now..
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Originally posted by Jerek_
I wonder if you honestly even believe what you type, or if you live in a made up world of facts.
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i pretty much agree with the last few posts. Nobody should really be telling anyone else how to spend their money. Let alone some broke-ass people who think $100 is a life savings or something. I'm still amazed at the posts that complain about MMORPG monthlly fee's, these people have the money to afford a decent computer i'm assuming in order to run these games and they dont have the money to afford $13-$15/month? Get a real job or something, hell you can work a minimum wage job and cover that easily. If your a kid begging your parents for money maybe i can understand but a kid shouldnt be telling an adult how to spend their money considering their happy to get a $1 from teh tooth fairy
I'm sure there are some really stupid things some of the ones preaching end up buying that we could all criticize. Fact is if someone wants to spend money on a virtual item or account, you dont even need to make an argument trying to justify it according to time spent in-game acquiring it, since its really nobody's business but the individual. Some people have FU money, some people dont seem to i guess. Dont hate on someone because they can spend more liesurely than you can, get a better job or something~
And regardless of the arguments made here against ebay or selling of virtual items, i dont see it as a problem. I've played various mmorpg's for 6'sh years on and off, and i've never ran into a situation where theres an item i HAVE to have so badly, and automatically blame ebay because i cant get it or it being always camped. Just like i dont whine about not having everything every hardcore powergamer has like so many casual gamers do expecting to be just given all of that for free because they pay the same monthly fee. Some people really need to accept their situation for what it is and make the best of it instead of constantly crying about it
Hear, Hear!!
And that is one major reason why the economy is soo screwed up in L2. On Devianne (where I play) the dragon clan runs everything (well did, their internet shop got all it's IP's banned the other day). It's a well known fact that Finalboss, the leader of dragon also owns an internet shop in China. No big deal the dudes into computers and gaming. However he also runs most of the bots/farmers you see in all the newbie dungeons. You know? the ones that KS you constantly, and then PK you as soon as you stand up for yourself. So your adding to the problem by lining his pockets with american dollars. Also, have you seen the exchange rate? Lord your 18 dollars prob pays his rent for a friggin year.
I have 2 trains of thought on this though. I mentioned in another post that I ride motorcycles. I consider that a hobby, I also have a full time ++ career. Ok, so it's no prob for me to drop 10K on a new bike. What if gaming was my main hobby? Ok, keep all the money I spend on bikes and that stuff and now channel it into my gaming hobby. I work 40+ hours a week, so there is no way I am going to keep up with joe kid, or any other type of gamer that has nothing to do all day but sit and grind. Ok so I hit up IGN, I get myself the uber gear, so that the time I do spend grinding is maximized. Looking at it that way makes sence.
On another point. Buying a high level char I think is a waste of time. As someone pointed out, you will have no clue how to play your char. By the time you get a clue (in L2) you will have been beat down so many times that you prob hate the game. So I think for the hobbiest maybe buy the gear but not the char may be acceptable.
I know I did a real good politician impression here, jumping both sides of the fence, but I can see arguements for and against.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
Utter morons, just like you explorer, keep saying this. I periodically stop what I am doing and prove them wrong.
He's a clue. Free. Go read the last 2 pages of this very thread and realize how UTTERLY FRIKKING stupid and wrong you now look.
I agree with almost every point you made,as i have made a similiar post a lil while back.Glad to see i'm the only one who doesnt like the direction mmorpg's are headed for.
IGE is a money making giant off these games.To answer a few of your questions...
i believe members/coders whatever involved with these games are involved with making money off these games.Either by using known exploits of the game or by running subsidiary sites that sell money to or on behalf of giants like IGE.
yes it ruins the game and does prove there is something wrong with the game,when u need outside money.
From my experiences,i would say that joining any mmorpg after a couple mnths of release is a waste of your time.Better to join a game when it it is first released.You have a better chance of avoiding the money making ratrace that way.
You have to wonder why they have made no attempt to stop this money flow?i believe there is alot of hands dipping into the cookie jar...thats why.
imagine knowing every exploit ,spawn time,trick to making mobs drop that special item,know the tricks to achieving the best crafting results, they could make a ton of money off the game,even a person feeling a bit guilty wouldn't turn this down.Who would know all of this?...answer is not needed..i'm sure you figured it out.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
The Best thing about the future is that it comes only one day at a time.
The Best thing about the future is that it comes only one day at a time.
Personally I really think you are making a bigger deal out of this than it really is. Most games the buying of items does not directly affect other players as much as you make it out to be. Personally I have made a good thousand dollars off selling my accounts, I don't think its wrong, if they have the money its their money they can do whatever the hell they want.
I agree with Xira how it creates competition. This competition is good, Everquest was the last game I played that I felt it was hard to get any item I wanted, Dark Ages of Camelot coming after that, and both I played end game conditions multiple times. People want such player friendly games these days that there is no competition or challenge left to the game. When it comes to the MMO genre time is generally the only factor you can use to progress. Coming back to the money spending, if someone doesn't have the time to spend progressing in a game and wishes to spend money, who are you to say it's wrong when you may have more freedom in your schedule than that individual does?
Fact is, this does not look like it will ever be controlled fully. Most games are so player friendly these days there is nothing needed, World of Warcraft is a joke of a challenge for example, every item you get has some ultimate use to it or atleast seems to, what is the fun in that? Maybe it will decrease their auctioning of items/money, who knows, only time can tell.
But really my personal conclusion of this issue is that it doesn't hurt communities enough to matter, in a few cases I may see this differently like in the case of Lineage 2, I see that more as a fault by NC Soft than the players, they make it so damn easy to farm it. Just my opinion on it, I may have repeated some or all of it, I'm not sure, just felt I should add what I thought.
yeah i think alot fo these people that are so strongly against it make their argument more out of envy and spite than the actual effect it has on the game. Either that or theyre some very paranoid people. I wouldnt even bother to comment again if i didnt feel the issue wasnt being exxagerated so much.
Blame the internet. Theres a market for everything now and screaming about it sure isnt going to stop it.
I agree...
But there are two sides to look at. Let's say I make $25 an hour at work. Now, camping a specific items takes about 4 hours, that is $100. If that item could be bought on eBay for $50, the person who bought it has saved money. Now, there are a lot of people who make a hell of a lot more than $25 an hour. Their time is very valuable, they have lots of expendable cash, and they have little time to be screwing around camping for items.
In my opinion, if you have so little time to play that you need to purchase items out of game, then you shouldn't be playing MMORPG's.
I disagree because every mmorpg i played caters for all levels.You should play the game for fun and not because you are looking for an item.
So say i have a busy week working 90 hours that week.I then have only 4 hours to play that week.I certainly will not take my overtime money to buy a virtual item and say "oh i worked more this week and could not play much".That extra money will go into a early mortgage payment or something more meaniful .
Responding to the point I bolded
Ah, but this is a matter of opinion. You can't tell someone why they should be playing the game. Each person has a right to play the game the way they want for whatever purposes, to find fun where and how they want to. As long as they don't cheat or infringe on someone else's right to play the game the way they want.
If someone wants to play just to search for a specific item, that is their business. As long as they are not infringing on other poeple's right to play and have fun.