I got a chance to play the weekend preview of WAR and so far I am very very impressed with this game. I thought for sure this game was gonna suck, but I was wrong. This game is still in BETA and everything ran smoothly, not even a hint of lag, for me anyways and it was fun, the graphics aren't 1/2 bad, pretty much like WOW graphics, but maybe a notch or 2 better. The combat system pretty much mirrors that of WOW and the PVP definately outdoes WOW in many aspects, but mainly for me it was about the balance in PVP and there was definately balance and it was fun. I payed close attention to chat and what others were saying and I can't even remember seeing 1 bad comment about this game. Im not going to call this a WOW killer, not yet anyways, but it is off to a very very good start and I think it will def snatch up some subs from many of the other mmo's.
Looks like some people got their wheaties pissed in. Anywho, WoW is a borefest. It's occupied with nothing but braindead fanatic r-tards who's only benefit in life is getting that beautiful purple item to look at, because you do realize it is purely useless in the video game, right? PvP is a joke beyond belief. However, I do not see WAR hurting the subs too much, mainly because their subscribers are what we call "The Infested". In my opinion, they do not count as an actual subscriber; more in so at the level of a gold farmer. The rest of them that had a chance to evacuate in time, will be able to enjoy newer and much more mature MMORPGS whilest the breath of fresh air outside of their home, not Azeroth.
How can I put this into better terms? Subscribers of WoW are the leper gnomes.
Bring on the actual MMORPG'ers (EQ, EQ2, DAOC, UO, AO). Muhahaha!
I got a chance to play the weekend preview of WAR and so far I am very very impressed with this game. I thought for sure this game was gonna suck, but I was wrong. This game is still in BETA and everything ran smoothly, not even a hint of lag, for me anyways and it was fun, the graphics aren't 1/2 bad, pretty much like WOW graphics, but maybe a notch or 2 better. The combat system pretty much mirrors that of WOW and the PVP definately outdoes WOW in many aspects, but mainly for me it was about the balance in PVP and there was definately balance and it was fun. I payed close attention to chat and what others were saying and I can't even remember seeing 1 bad comment about this game. Im not going to call this a WOW killer, not yet anyways, but it is off to a very very good start and I think it will def snatch up some subs from many of the other mmo's.
WoW subs are not in trouble.
But everyone else's are.
AoC's shitty ass got 40% of wow to bounce, granted, they all came back becuase AoC was terrible. But think about it, warhammer IS NOT that terrible game, the public tried it, loved it, and is begging for more. WoW players out of mere curiosity will check it out and i'm sure they will gather more than AoC's 40%, and when that happens, the 6 million subscribers that are asian gold sellers will dissapear.
People all say the same shit "10 million subscribers" it's not 10 million U.S. Subs morons, 75% of those subs are asians, and who knows how many of them are gold sellers.
it won't kill wow, nothing will kill it, but it's numbers will take a plunge, look at star wars galaxies, it's still around and it's barely an MMO...
if there is no market for selling gold on wow, the asian market will dissapear too.
-- Games are never as fun as their hype. It's still doing the same things as 90% of the MMOs ever since EQ1 wrote the template for 3D MMOs.
-- You can't ever be that newbie again. Not Warhammer, not WoW, not AoC, or any other MMO out there claiming originality.
-- You, I, and many other people won't be satisfied until once again we can be immersed,as newbs once more, into a mysterious realm of which we know nothing.
When eleven million people unsubscribe WoWs numbers will be in trouble. Short of that they're still going to be a 1200 pound gorilla in a cage full of monkeys.
That's not entirely true. When a few million of WoW subscribers (especially from the western world) quit playing WoW, the other people will follow. It's the "sheep" psychology. One quits, three others follow.
That's why WoW has 10-11 million subscribers at the moment (4.5 million in the western hemisphere). One joins, three others follow.
Besides raiding and endless faction grinds, sadly WoW has nothing new to offer after 3+ years.
----------------------------- Osbourne Cox: You are the guy from the gym.
Ted Treffon: I don't represent Hardbodies.
Osbourne Cox: I know very well what you represent. You represent the idiocy of today.
Ted Treffon: No, I don't represent that either.
Osbourne Cox: You are part of a league of morons. Oh, yes. You see you're one of the morons I've been fighting my whole life. But guess what. Today, I win.
I got a chance to play the weekend preview of WAR and so far I am very very impressed with this game. I thought for sure this game was gonna suck, but I was wrong. This game is still in BETA and everything ran smoothly, not even a hint of lag, for me anyways and it was fun, the graphics aren't 1/2 bad, pretty much like WOW graphics, but maybe a notch or 2 better. The combat system pretty much mirrors that of WOW and the PVP definately outdoes WOW in many aspects, but mainly for me it was about the balance in PVP and there was definately balance and it was fun. I payed close attention to chat and what others were saying and I can't even remember seeing 1 bad comment about this game. Im not going to call this a WOW killer, not yet anyways, but it is off to a very very good start and I think it will def snatch up some subs from many of the other mmo's.
lol, the "terrible mob pathing" was a new bug introduced in the preview weekend. and to the OP, why did you post this here you know you are going to upset everyone and start a flame WAR. anyone who played WAR during the preview weekend knows the game owns, was this post really neccessary?
I got a chance to play the weekend preview of WAR and so far I am very very impressed with this game. I thought for sure this game was gonna suck, but I was wrong. This game is still in BETA and everything ran smoothly, not even a hint of lag, for me anyways and it was fun, the graphics aren't 1/2 bad, pretty much like WOW graphics, but maybe a notch or 2 better. The combat system pretty much mirrors that of WOW and the PVP definately outdoes WOW in many aspects, but mainly for me it was about the balance in PVP and there was definately balance and it was fun. I payed close attention to chat and what others were saying and I can't even remember seeing 1 bad comment about this game. Im not going to call this a WOW killer, not yet anyways, but it is off to a very very good start and I think it will def snatch up some subs from many of the other mmo's.
After the AoC fiasco I won't be jumping ship too fast. I'm already hearing bad reports about WAR from beta testers, and please, don' t start with the "it's only beta" defense like they did with AoC. I spent alot of time and effort in AoC, only to see it go down the drain, I won't be doing that again.
If rave reviews keep coming and coming about WAR, months later even, then I'll check it out, but only then.
AoC's shitty ass got 40% of wow to bounce, granted, they all came back becuase AoC was terrible. But think about it, warhammer IS NOT that terrible game, the public tried it, loved it, and is begging for more. WoW players out of mere curiosity will check it out and i'm sure they will gather more than AoC's 40%, and when that happens, the 6 million subscribers that are asian gold sellers will dissapear. People all say the same shit "10 million subscribers" it's not 10 million U.S. Subs morons, 75% of those subs are asians, and who knows how many of them are gold sellers. it won't kill wow, nothing will kill it, but it's numbers will take a plunge, look at star wars galaxies, it's still around and it's barely an MMO... if there is no market for selling gold on wow, the asian market will dissapear too.
Where do you get your information from?!?!?!
First, 40% of WoWs population did not try AoC. AoC has sold at max 1 million copies, hardly 40% of WoW. What you are quoting is a Blizzard executive stated 40% of people that left WoW for AoC have already returned to WoW and that was a while ago.
Second, WoW has at last count 4.5 million subs in the US/Europe. Asia has 5.5 million. Hardly the 75% of the games population being Asian as you imply. There is another 700,000 as of last press release that has not been put into either Asia or US/Europre.
Also you are an idiot if you think gold sellers are just going to disappear. They will simply buy/steal/hack accounts for whatever game gets a decent population and start spamming gold sales there.
Eventually someone will release a game that is decent enough for people to move on from WoW. Perhaps that game is Warhammer, time will tell. I sure hope so, because the MMO genre as a whole could use a checkmark in the win column after the long string of dogshit releases over the past 5 years.
Seriously, one game should not be this dominant over the rest of the market.
WoW has several things against it right now. The game is over 4 years old, people are looking for something new. WoW's PvP is the worse implemented I've ever seen in an online game. WoTLK is just another BC expansion. More rep grind, more gear grind, more level grind, more gold grind.
WoW will definately lose a lot of it's pvp'ers to War, there's no doubt about it. WoW will still continue to be a success with the PvE crowd but they have lost steam and the game's subscribers have been going down for 2 years now. You can't expect WoW to be on top forever...look at EQ 1 now? Remember how huge it was?
Let me remind you too that WoW's biggest playerbase is China. They're going to keep those folks for sure but their American and European subscriptions will suffer.
Games lose the fun factor after many years, and new games come out to take their place, it happens to all online games.
Blizzard knows WAR is one game that can take a few million subscribers from them but they know they'll keep millions of hardcore PvE people to keep WoW going for years to come.
Blizz isn't afraid of War but they know it's a true contender and they will lose millions to War within a year.
I got a chance to play the weekend preview of WAR and so far I am very very impressed with this game. I thought for sure this game was gonna suck, but I was wrong. This game is still in BETA and everything ran smoothly, not even a hint of lag, for me anyways and it was fun, the graphics aren't 1/2 bad, pretty much like WOW graphics, but maybe a notch or 2 better. The combat system pretty much mirrors that of WOW and the PVP definately outdoes WOW in many aspects, but mainly for me it was about the balance in PVP and there was definately balance and it was fun. I payed close attention to chat and what others were saying and I can't even remember seeing 1 bad comment about this game.
the game is unfinshed, terrible mob pathing, awkward combat, at least 6 months away from being in good shape
Non-fanboi reponse:
Issues with mob pathing/behavior = true. The dev team admitted it and they are fixing it. I saw it first hand. It may depend on the mobs you were fighting or even how you attacked them (ranged vs melee).
Not sure about 'awkward combat'. I mean, it's different from WoW. So, is different = awkward? As I've stated elsewhere, the thing I didn't get in WAR combat is a sense of being really 'in' the combat... so to speak. I mean, maybe there were a lot of things still turned off within the game like animations, gore, and such that would've made combat more violent, brutal, or 'WAR'ish'? I believe the dev's did state that there were a lot of animations they were about to roll into the next patch and they were fixing a CD timer.
Is the game unfinished? Maybe. It's also not officially released either. Open BETA hasn't started. I know it's a tight window from start of Open BETA to launch, but the game isn't officially launched. I would be more likely to say that the game isn't as polished as I had hoped it would be during the preview weekend more than anything else.
WoW has several things against it right now. The game is over 4 years old, people are looking for something new. WoW's PvP is the worse implemented I've ever seen in an online game. WoTLK is just another BC expansion. More rep grind, more gear grind, more level grind, more gold grind.
WoW will definately lose a lot of it's pvp'ers to War, there's no doubt about it. WoW will still continue to be a success with the PvE crowd but they have lost steam and the game's subscribers have been going down for 2 years now. You can't expect WoW to be on top forever...look at EQ 1 now? Remember how huge it was? Let me remind you too that WoW's biggest playerbase is China. They're going to keep those folks for sure but their American and European subscriptions will suffer. Games lose the fun factor after many years, and new games come out to take their place, it happens to all online games. Blizzard knows WAR is one game that can take a few million subscribers from them but they know they'll keep millions of hardcore PvE people to keep WoW going for years to come. Blizz isn't afraid of War but they know it's a true contender and they will lose millions to War within a year.
This just isn't true. The vast majority of players are not ' pvp only' players. Warhammer has almost 0 pve content... about 20% of their mobs don't even fight back, they just stand there and die. There are very few quests that players can do alone.. almost all the quests are global, which is great if you want your entire playtime to be about advancing your side, without advancing your own character. The vast majority of players are not pvpers, they are not into 'realm goals'.
As far as Warhammers pvp... again, it is overrated. There is simply no strategy except to zerg (die, and rush forward full speed). There are no CC's, no interrupts.. nothing that is 'tactical' about a fight, you just cast your highest dps spells as fast as possible. The winning side is ALWAYS the side with the most players because that is all that matters.
The majority of wow-type players will be bored within a month of Warhammer. If the 3.0 patch comes out before Warhammer, not that many people will try Warhammer except for the old Doac players (ie..200k tops).
Warhammer is just too 'niche' to get over 500k subscribers. It's all about pvp, and all about 'global' accomplishments. WOW reached 11M subscribers because it caters to all different playstyles, but caters mainly to what most people want ( solo questing pve with a good mix of dungeons and pvp).
What kind of MMORPG doesen't let you put your weopons to your side and out of fighting pose right there it's a fail i'm sorry WAR will never even break 1 million subs away from WoW.
WoW has several things against it right now. The game is over 4 years old, people are looking for something new. WoW's PvP is the worse implemented I've ever seen in an online game. WoTLK is just another BC expansion. More rep grind, more gear grind, more level grind, more gold grind.
WoW will definately lose a lot of it's pvp'ers to War, there's no doubt about it. WoW will still continue to be a success with the PvE crowd but they have lost steam and the game's subscribers have been going down for 2 years now. You can't expect WoW to be on top forever...look at EQ 1 now? Remember how huge it was? Let me remind you too that WoW's biggest playerbase is China. They're going to keep those folks for sure but their American and European subscriptions will suffer. Games lose the fun factor after many years, and new games come out to take their place, it happens to all online games. Blizzard knows WAR is one game that can take a few million subscribers from them but they know they'll keep millions of hardcore PvE people to keep WoW going for years to come. Blizz isn't afraid of War but they know it's a true contender and they will lose millions to War within a year.
This just isn't true. The vast majority of players are not ' pvp only' players. Warhammer has almost 0 pve content... about 20% of their mobs don't even fight back, they just stand there and die. There are very few quests that players can do alone.. almost all the quests are global, which is great if you want your entire playtime to be about advancing your side, without advancing your own character. The vast majority of players are not pvpers, they are not into 'realm goals'.
As far as Warhammers pvp... again, it is overrated. There is simply no strategy except to zerg (die, and rush forward full speed). There are no CC's, no interrupts.. nothing that is 'tactical' about a fight, you just cast your highest dps spells as fast as possible. The winning side is ALWAYS the side with the most players because that is all that matters.
The majority of wow-type players will be bored within a month of Warhammer. If the 3.0 patch comes out before Warhammer, not that many people will try Warhammer except for the old Doac players (ie..200k tops).
Warhammer is just too 'niche' to get over 500k subscribers. It's all about pvp, and all about 'global' accomplishments. WOW reached 11M subscribers because it caters to all different playstyles, but caters mainly to what most people want ( solo questing pve with a good mix of dungeons and pvp).
It's funny that you enjoy making comments saying "this just isn't true" and then basing your facts off of nothing as well. Warhammer has a lot more PvE content than you probably can imagine, and it certainly isn't "mostly global quests" LOL. There are so many quests you can level from 1-40 without having to pvp, but the game is a pvp game, and will promote it indefinitely. oh, and the monster's not attacking thing, its a bug that developers have allready PUBLICLY admitted a problem and will be fixed before open beta.
As far as warhammers pvp goes, again it's NOT overrated, it's everything it said it would be and more. You can't honestly expect to believe there are no cc's, no interupts, nothing that is tactical in a pvp based game. I had two characters that both either had some form of silence, hold, entangle, kick, slow, hamstring, aoe silence, and so on, and if they didn't get it by the "20 levels I was allowed to play" if you reviewed the character notes on all their abilities, nearly EVERY class in the game gets some form of CC. This game has more strategy in one finger than wow has ever considered dreaming up. Stop basing your silly opinions off of a preview weekend where not even 1/4 the content was allowed. Stop comparing a 4 year old game that has had massive improvements from it's release to a game that is STILL IN BETA LOLOL. Give me a break, compare WoW beta to War Beta... The release alone will be more successful.
You say warhammer is to "'niche" to get over 500k subs, but it's allready there, and will grow much faster once the word is around that it's a great game. DAoC was heavily based on pvp RVR, and was a massive success, and guess what, warhammer will be too. When Blizzard first released wow, it lacked so much content, there were a few 5 man instances (UBRS) lawl, and so forth. Blizzard slowly released content at a time to retain customers. not becuase it was "well rounded with content that catered to all" don't give me that bullshit, no MMO has released with fully working pve and pvp that catered to all.
You base half your arguements on the few you-tube video's and fanboi's opinions you've read over, and remember, your 11 million subscribers have no-where near the number of "US/EU" subs as you think, majority of your subs are asian. And only god knows how many of those are gold sellers.
Not even you can deny that after four years, people get a bit tired of the game, shit I know I did, I have almost 7 70's with 2 that attained gladiator status, but the deal was, I was done. I wanted something new, something fun, something that wasn't wow. Guess what, Preview weekend alone was more than enough to deliver just that, and TONS of people feel the same way. You've probably noticed the amount of people claiming they have allready dropped their accounts on wow, with promises of "coming back to check out wotlk."
The reality is, Wrath of the lich king is going to release, and become another TBC, all gear that people have spent endless hours collecting will be rendered useless within minutes of release, from that point it's race to get your guild to 80 or a race to get a dark knight to 80 and after that hype dies down. It will be the same old tired game with average pvp, and PvE that turns into a grind-fest once a guild learns the fight. I've been there, black-temple provided our guild with good deal of challenge, but once we mastered ever mob in there, it was over. It was on farm status and then became a grind-fest. Which is exactly what level 80 will be all about.
The pvp fanbase is much larger than you clearly comprehend, and due to that you will fail to see just how successful warhammer will be. I was an avid WoW player both pve and pvp alike, but I was tired of the game, quitting and rejoining, each season becoming another giant /sigh when I realized that I had to grind AV for another 75,000 honor and team up with the same people to get to 2200+ just to finish my set of gear. It was old, it was boring. Wratch of the lich King is just an extension of all that, once everyone reaches their 80, gets their new shiny gear, they will quickly realize the game hasn't changed, all it did was eliminate the prior 70 levels of content from having a purpose.
-- Games are never as fun as their hype. It's still doing the same things as 90% of the MMOs ever since EQ1 wrote the template for 3D MMOs.
-- You can't ever be that newbie again. Not Warhammer, not WoW, not AoC, or any other MMO out there claiming originality.
-- You, I, and many other people won't be satisfied until once again we can be immersed,as newbs once more, into a mysterious realm of which we know nothing.
WoW has several things against it right now. The game is over 4 years old, people are looking for something new. WoW's PvP is the worse implemented I've ever seen in an online game. WoTLK is just another BC expansion. More rep grind, more gear grind, more level grind, more gold grind.
WoW will definately lose a lot of it's pvp'ers to War, there's no doubt about it. WoW will still continue to be a success with the PvE crowd but they have lost steam and the game's subscribers have been going down for 2 years now. You can't expect WoW to be on top forever...look at EQ 1 now? Remember how huge it was? Let me remind you too that WoW's biggest playerbase is China. They're going to keep those folks for sure but their American and European subscriptions will suffer. Games lose the fun factor after many years, and new games come out to take their place, it happens to all online games. Blizzard knows WAR is one game that can take a few million subscribers from them but they know they'll keep millions of hardcore PvE people to keep WoW going for years to come. Blizz isn't afraid of War but they know it's a true contender and they will lose millions to War within a year.
This just isn't true. The vast majority of players are not ' pvp only' players. Warhammer has almost 0 pve content... about 20% of their mobs don't even fight back, they just stand there and die. There are very few quests that players can do alone.. almost all the quests are global, which is great if you want your entire playtime to be about advancing your side, without advancing your own character. The vast majority of players are not pvpers, they are not into 'realm goals'.
As far as Warhammers pvp... again, it is overrated. There is simply no strategy except to zerg (die, and rush forward full speed). There are no CC's, no interrupts.. nothing that is 'tactical' about a fight, you just cast your highest dps spells as fast as possible. The winning side is ALWAYS the side with the most players because that is all that matters.
The majority of wow-type players will be bored within a month of Warhammer. If the 3.0 patch comes out before Warhammer, not that many people will try Warhammer except for the old Doac players (ie..200k tops).
Warhammer is just too 'niche' to get over 500k subscribers. It's all about pvp, and all about 'global' accomplishments. WOW reached 11M subscribers because it caters to all different playstyles, but caters mainly to what most people want ( solo questing pve with a good mix of dungeons and pvp).
As good as a read this thread has been for me...I happened to glance over this uninformed post and had to comment.
I spent a good MANY hours this weekend PvE'g and Questing ALONE...SOLO...UNO...SINGULAR...you obviously haven't laid your stubbly fingers on the keyboard to test it out this preview weekend...so, I'll leave the stupidity of your posting to the review of other WAR pw'rs who found their time mixed between PvE and PvP.
Friday to Monday folks....PLENTY of pve and soloability...in fact...I joined up in Scenarios and PQ's just so I had some feeling of belonging. Mainly, I wanted to learn the concepts myself without group, guild and party members screaming through my chat box. I found a great combination of the two and from a PvE person...(and not a hater of WoW)...this was and will be my 'new' game.
WoW has several things against it right now. The game is over 4 years old, people are looking for something new. WoW's PvP is the worse implemented I've ever seen in an online game. WoTLK is just another BC expansion. More rep grind, more gear grind, more level grind, more gold grind.
WoW will definately lose a lot of it's pvp'ers to War, there's no doubt about it. WoW will still continue to be a success with the PvE crowd but they have lost steam and the game's subscribers have been going down for 2 years now. You can't expect WoW to be on top forever...look at EQ 1 now? Remember how huge it was? Let me remind you too that WoW's biggest playerbase is China. They're going to keep those folks for sure but their American and European subscriptions will suffer. Games lose the fun factor after many years, and new games come out to take their place, it happens to all online games. Blizzard knows WAR is one game that can take a few million subscribers from them but they know they'll keep millions of hardcore PvE people to keep WoW going for years to come. Blizz isn't afraid of War but they know it's a true contender and they will lose millions to War within a year.
This just isn't true. The vast majority of players are not ' pvp only' players. Warhammer has almost 0 pve content... about 20% of their mobs don't even fight back, they just stand there and die. There are very few quests that players can do alone.. almost all the quests are global, which is great if you want your entire playtime to be about advancing your side, without advancing your own character. The vast majority of players are not pvpers, they are not into 'realm goals'.
As far as Warhammers pvp... again, it is overrated. There is simply no strategy except to zerg (die, and rush forward full speed). There are no CC's, no interrupts.. nothing that is 'tactical' about a fight, you just cast your highest dps spells as fast as possible. The winning side is ALWAYS the side with the most players because that is all that matters.
The majority of wow-type players will be bored within a month of Warhammer. If the 3.0 patch comes out before Warhammer, not that many people will try Warhammer except for the old Doac players (ie..200k tops).
Warhammer is just too 'niche' to get over 500k subscribers. It's all about pvp, and all about 'global' accomplishments. WOW reached 11M subscribers because it caters to all different playstyles, but caters mainly to what most people want ( solo questing pve with a good mix of dungeons and pvp).
As good as a read this thread has been for me...I happened to glance over this uninformed post and had to comment.
I spent a good MANY hours this weekend PvE'g and Questing ALONE...SOLO...UNO...SINGULAR...you obviously haven't laid your stubbly fingers on the keyboard to test it out this preview weekend...so, I'll leave the stupidity of your posting to the review of other WAR pw'rs who found their time mixed between PvE and PvP.
Friday to Monday folks....PLENTY of pve and soloability...in fact...I joined up in Scenarios and PQ's just so I had some feeling of belonging. Mainly, I wanted to learn the concepts myself without group, guild and party members screaming through my chat box. I found a great combination of the two and from a PvE person...(and not a hater of WoW)...this was and will be my 'new' game.
Really cause i played mostly PVE, because i perfer it so i won't be playing this long term most likely, but its slow as all hell. Because the combat is that much slower, because the leveling is that much slower, and because the i thought the PQs (while nice at first) where all pretty much the same (fight a buncha soloable guys, fight a bunch of champions, then fight a boss.) and repitive as well if you wanted the only useful influence rewards.
Another part of pve, IMO, is actually exploring the towns (oh wait there where only little camps dotted down the road) dungeons (i know there are some but i didn't see any in the maps i checked out which was about 5 of them.) and world (The map feels strangely disconnected from my actually experience when zoomed out even one space and there doesn't FEEL like there is anything passed the PQs (which were a lttle bit out of the way from the one set path the quests are on, but not by much.)
Now, some of this is subjective but when in comparsion to the pve experience of huge cities and towns loads of dungeons, a seamless world, and quests that either have to be traveled down for a long ways to get the completed goal and rewards, or require a rare drop to even be started, i.e. you have to go off the beaten path to even see close to everything there is to explore. How can you compare, nay, claim that you want to leave one pve experience for one that has so little to offer.
NOTE: You say you are a PVEr, but if you are going to WAR then you are going to the wrong mmo. If not please stick with WOW or go play LOTRO or vanguard they all have better PVE to offer than WAR has at this point in time.
2nd Note: if you are Borehammer fanboy please go back to hyping your game on the any of the many WAR forums out there cause i am tired of WAR invading this section of MMORPGs forums.
3rd Note: Borehammer is in refrence to the phrase borecraft and i thought it would be nice to sling it back at the fanboys. WAR itself is a game i think that has a very nice pvp system and a good general feel to it as well, its just not my thing.
Hype is my nemesis. i will fight it til the day i die whether i take it down or it takes me down. So depressing, Yes?
I got a chance to play the weekend preview of WAR and so far I am very very impressed with this game. I thought for sure this game was gonna suck, but I was wrong. This game is still in BETA and everything ran smoothly, not even a hint of lag, for me anyways and it was fun, the graphics aren't 1/2 bad, pretty much like WOW graphics, but maybe a notch or 2 better. The combat system pretty much mirrors that of WOW and the PVP definately outdoes WOW in many aspects, but mainly for me it was about the balance in PVP and there was definately balance and it was fun. I payed close attention to chat and what others were saying and I can't even remember seeing 1 bad comment about this game.
the game is unfinshed, terrible mob pathing, awkward combat, at least 6 months away from being in good shape
WoW has several things against it right now. The game is over 4 years old, people are looking for something new. WoW's PvP is the worse implemented I've ever seen in an online game. WoTLK is just another BC expansion. More rep grind, more gear grind, more level grind, more gold grind.
WoW will definately lose a lot of it's pvp'ers to War, there's no doubt about it. WoW will still continue to be a success with the PvE crowd but they have lost steam and the game's subscribers have been going down for 2 years now. You can't expect WoW to be on top forever...look at EQ 1 now? Remember how huge it was? Let me remind you too that WoW's biggest playerbase is China. They're going to keep those folks for sure but their American and European subscriptions will suffer. Games lose the fun factor after many years, and new games come out to take their place, it happens to all online games. Blizzard knows WAR is one game that can take a few million subscribers from them but they know they'll keep millions of hardcore PvE people to keep WoW going for years to come. Blizz isn't afraid of War but they know it's a true contender and they will lose millions to War within a year.
This just isn't true. The vast majority of players are not ' pvp only' players. Warhammer has almost 0 pve content... about 20% of their mobs don't even fight back, they just stand there and die. There are very few quests that players can do alone.. almost all the quests are global, which is great if you want your entire playtime to be about advancing your side, without advancing your own character. The vast majority of players are not pvpers, they are not into 'realm goals'.
As far as Warhammers pvp... again, it is overrated. There is simply no strategy except to zerg (die, and rush forward full speed). There are no CC's, no interrupts.. nothing that is 'tactical' about a fight, you just cast your highest dps spells as fast as possible. The winning side is ALWAYS the side with the most players because that is all that matters.
The majority of wow-type players will be bored within a month of Warhammer. If the 3.0 patch comes out before Warhammer, not that many people will try Warhammer except for the old Doac players (ie..200k tops).
Warhammer is just too 'niche' to get over 500k subscribers. It's all about pvp, and all about 'global' accomplishments. WOW reached 11M subscribers because it caters to all different playstyles, but caters mainly to what most people want ( solo questing pve with a good mix of dungeons and pvp).
As good as a read this thread has been for me...I happened to glance over this uninformed post and had to comment.
I spent a good MANY hours this weekend PvE'g and Questing ALONE...SOLO...UNO...SINGULAR...you obviously haven't laid your stubbly fingers on the keyboard to test it out this preview weekend...so, I'll leave the stupidity of your posting to the review of other WAR pw'rs who found their time mixed between PvE and PvP.
Friday to Monday folks....PLENTY of pve and soloability...in fact...I joined up in Scenarios and PQ's just so I had some feeling of belonging. Mainly, I wanted to learn the concepts myself without group, guild and party members screaming through my chat box. I found a great combination of the two and from a PvE person...(and not a hater of WoW)...this was and will be my 'new' game.
Really cause i played mostly PVE, because i perfer it so i won't be playing this long term most likely, but its slow as all hell. Because the combat is that much slower, because the leveling is that much slower, and because the i thought the PQs (while nice at first) where all pretty much the same (fight a buncha soloable guys, fight a bunch of champions, then fight a boss.) and repitive as well if you wanted the only useful influence rewards.
Another part of pve, IMO, is actually exploring the towns (oh wait there where only little camps dotted down the road) dungeons (i know there are some but i didn't see any in the maps i checked out which was about 5 of them.) and world (The map feels strangely disconnected from my actually experience when zoomed out even one space and there doesn't FEEL like there is anything passed the PQs (which were a lttle bit out of the way from the one set path the quests are on, but not by much.)
Now, some of this is subjective but when in comparsion to the pve experience of huge cities and towns loads of dungeons, a seamless world, and quests that either have to be traveled down for a long ways to get the completed goal and rewards, or require a rare drop to even be started, i.e. you have to go off the beaten path to even see close to everything there is to explore. How can you compare, nay, claim that you want to leave one pve experience for one that has so little to offer.
NOTE: You say you are a PVEr, but if you are going to WAR then you are going to the wrong mmo. If not please stick with WOW or go play LOTRO or vanguard they all have better PVE to offer than WAR has at this point in time.
2nd Note: if you are Borehammer fanboy please go back to hyping your game on the any of the many WAR forums out there cause i am tired of WAR invading this section of MMORPGs forums.
3rd Note: Borehammer is in refrence to the phrase borecraft and i thought it would be nice to sling it back at the fanboys. WAR itself is a game i think that has a very nice pvp system and a good general feel to it as well, its just not my thing.
You're quite wrong, sir. I'm certain you weren't able to experience the PW as a whole or spent much time trying. There were towns..and groups and a city....PvE wasn't hidden or scarce...it was integral (at least in my experience from rank 1 to 15). I won't leave a PvE experience for one that doesn't have at least a plethura of opportunity for PvE...I will be leaving an older game for a newer one...with some of the same loves I had from the prior.
Yes, I am a PvE'r and I love PvE...but there are aspects to a combination of both PvE and PvP that I enjoy. There are countless quests (sure, I didn't explore them all) and there are still countless things being introduced once this goes live that have yet to be illuminated thus far.
I understand completely WAR is more geared toward the PvP aspect of gaming...but understand this...there will be aspects of both loves...and though one might shine a bit more than the other does not mean it will not appeal to both PvE'rs and PvP'rs alike.
You said it yourself. So if war isn't a wow-killer, and it isn't, even by a long-shot, then why are you so worried about wow subs. Put it this way, if mythic doesn't get the subs they need mythic is over with. EA took mythic on because they wanted their wow and they'd better deliver. If wow loses even 100's of 1000's blizz will be fine. They still have plenty of loyal players. They also have s2, d3, a new mmo, wrath, future wow expansions, a new IP in the works. And all is well with the world.
The people who are raiding for gear that will become obselete the next patch will continue raiding.
The people who loves PvE (new dungeons, public quests, not being dedicated to daily 24 men raiding) combined with PvP/RvR will play War.
The real PvPers who care about realm proud, common goal will play War.
The gear maniacs, who wants to do arenas over and over every week to get on top of charts will play WoW.
You see, the target audience is completely different for either game. I fail to understand WoW vs. War comparison. If you love WoW, stick to WoW. If you want to taste the fruits of RvR, new and relaxed PvEing, try War. So simple to decide.
----------------------------- Osbourne Cox: You are the guy from the gym.
Ted Treffon: I don't represent Hardbodies.
Osbourne Cox: I know very well what you represent. You represent the idiocy of today.
Ted Treffon: No, I don't represent that either.
Osbourne Cox: You are part of a league of morons. Oh, yes. You see you're one of the morons I've been fighting my whole life. But guess what. Today, I win.
I am very certain that the overwhelming majority of players who try Warhammer are people who have also played WoW. Same people, same target audience, same players.
If you think Warhammer wont have people chasing gear upgrades, grinding realm points, daily "raids", reputation or whatever other new flavor it introduces you are in for a large surprise. While I am no expert on Warhammer by a long shot, I think most MMO share the same characteristics and mechanics.
Why are people acting like Warhammer will get all these ficticious people that never played WoW or this game will rid the MMO world of grinds, gear upgrades or anything else that is commonplace in MMOs?
I am very certain that the overwhelming majority of players who try Warhammer are people who have also played WoW. Same people, same target audience, same players. If you think Warhammer wont have people chasing gear upgrades, grinding realm points, daily "raids", reputation or whatever other new flavor it introduces you are in for a large surprise. While I am no expert on Warhammer by a long shot, I think most MMO share the same characteristics and mechanics.
Why are people acting like Warhammer will get all these ficticious people that never played WoW or this game will rid the MMO world of grinds, gear upgrades or anything else that is commonplace in MMOs? People will play War if it is a good game.
Of course people who have played previous MMOs (including WoW) will be playing War. Some of them just come from DAOC, Guild Wars or Planetside etc. but the majority will be coming from the mainstream MMOs.
However there are various things I wished WoW had that. Like RvR, I wanted to kill the elf king for example, after 1-2 months of release it was never possible. Stuck in instanced BGs or Arenas was not a good thing for me.
War has definitely tons of stuff that WoW does not have and probably will not have. I am excited about War to be honest. Achievements, tome of knowledge, PQs, siege weapons (WoW would have it too soon I guess), realm proud, non-instanced RvR, balanced gear/skill ratio, renown points (taking more than a year to get to RR80) etc.
----------------------------- Osbourne Cox: You are the guy from the gym.
Ted Treffon: I don't represent Hardbodies.
Osbourne Cox: I know very well what you represent. You represent the idiocy of today.
Ted Treffon: No, I don't represent that either.
Osbourne Cox: You are part of a league of morons. Oh, yes. You see you're one of the morons I've been fighting my whole life. But guess what. Today, I win.
Comments
WoW subs are not in trouble.
But everyone else's are.
Looks like some people got their wheaties pissed in. Anywho, WoW is a borefest. It's occupied with nothing but braindead fanatic r-tards who's only benefit in life is getting that beautiful purple item to look at, because you do realize it is purely useless in the video game, right? PvP is a joke beyond belief. However, I do not see WAR hurting the subs too much, mainly because their subscribers are what we call "The Infested". In my opinion, they do not count as an actual subscriber; more in so at the level of a gold farmer. The rest of them that had a chance to evacuate in time, will be able to enjoy newer and much more mature MMORPGS whilest the breath of fresh air outside of their home, not Azeroth.
How can I put this into better terms? Subscribers of WoW are the leper gnomes.
Bring on the actual MMORPG'ers (EQ, EQ2, DAOC, UO, AO). Muhahaha!
WoW subs are not in trouble.
But everyone else's are.
AoC's shitty ass got 40% of wow to bounce, granted, they all came back becuase AoC was terrible. But think about it, warhammer IS NOT that terrible game, the public tried it, loved it, and is begging for more. WoW players out of mere curiosity will check it out and i'm sure they will gather more than AoC's 40%, and when that happens, the 6 million subscribers that are asian gold sellers will dissapear.
People all say the same shit "10 million subscribers" it's not 10 million U.S. Subs morons, 75% of those subs are asians, and who knows how many of them are gold sellers.
it won't kill wow, nothing will kill it, but it's numbers will take a plunge, look at star wars galaxies, it's still around and it's barely an MMO...
if there is no market for selling gold on wow, the asian market will dissapear too.
-- Games are never as fun as their hype. It's still doing the same things as 90% of the MMOs ever since EQ1 wrote the template for 3D MMOs.
-- You can't ever be that newbie again. Not Warhammer, not WoW, not AoC, or any other MMO out there claiming originality.
-- You, I, and many other people won't be satisfied until once again we can be immersed,as newbs once more, into a mysterious realm of which we know nothing.
That's not entirely true. When a few million of WoW subscribers (especially from the western world) quit playing WoW, the other people will follow. It's the "sheep" psychology. One quits, three others follow.
That's why WoW has 10-11 million subscribers at the moment (4.5 million in the western hemisphere). One joins, three others follow.
Besides raiding and endless faction grinds, sadly WoW has nothing new to offer after 3+ years.
-----------------------------
Osbourne Cox: You are the guy from the gym.
Ted Treffon: I don't represent Hardbodies.
Osbourne Cox: I know very well what you represent. You represent the idiocy of today.
Ted Treffon: No, I don't represent that either.
Osbourne Cox: You are part of a league of morons. Oh, yes. You see you're one of the morons I've been fighting my whole life. But guess what. Today, I win.
lol, the "terrible mob pathing" was a new bug introduced in the preview weekend. and to the OP, why did you post this here you know you are going to upset everyone and start a flame WAR. anyone who played WAR during the preview weekend knows the game owns, was this post really neccessary?
After the AoC fiasco I won't be jumping ship too fast. I'm already hearing bad reports about WAR from beta testers, and please, don' t start with the "it's only beta" defense like they did with AoC. I spent alot of time and effort in AoC, only to see it go down the drain, I won't be doing that again.
If rave reviews keep coming and coming about WAR, months later even, then I'll check it out, but only then.
Where do you get your information from?!?!?!
First, 40% of WoWs population did not try AoC. AoC has sold at max 1 million copies, hardly 40% of WoW. What you are quoting is a Blizzard executive stated 40% of people that left WoW for AoC have already returned to WoW and that was a while ago.
Second, WoW has at last count 4.5 million subs in the US/Europe. Asia has 5.5 million. Hardly the 75% of the games population being Asian as you imply. There is another 700,000 as of last press release that has not been put into either Asia or US/Europre.
Also you are an idiot if you think gold sellers are just going to disappear. They will simply buy/steal/hack accounts for whatever game gets a decent population and start spamming gold sales there.
Eventually someone will release a game that is decent enough for people to move on from WoW. Perhaps that game is Warhammer, time will tell. I sure hope so, because the MMO genre as a whole could use a checkmark in the win column after the long string of dogshit releases over the past 5 years.
Seriously, one game should not be this dominant over the rest of the market.
10 million subscribers might turn into 9 million... OH NOES CALL THE WHAMBULANCE lololol man this post made me laugh.
WoW has several things against it right now. The game is over 4 years old, people are looking for something new. WoW's PvP is the worse implemented I've ever seen in an online game. WoTLK is just another BC expansion. More rep grind, more gear grind, more level grind, more gold grind.
WoW will definately lose a lot of it's pvp'ers to War, there's no doubt about it. WoW will still continue to be a success with the PvE crowd but they have lost steam and the game's subscribers have been going down for 2 years now. You can't expect WoW to be on top forever...look at EQ 1 now? Remember how huge it was?
Let me remind you too that WoW's biggest playerbase is China. They're going to keep those folks for sure but their American and European subscriptions will suffer.
Games lose the fun factor after many years, and new games come out to take their place, it happens to all online games.
Blizzard knows WAR is one game that can take a few million subscribers from them but they know they'll keep millions of hardcore PvE people to keep WoW going for years to come.
Blizz isn't afraid of War but they know it's a true contender and they will lose millions to War within a year.
What happens when you log off your characters????.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFQhfhnjYMk
Dark Age of Camelot
its all a matter of play style.
I closed my wow accounts a few days after I got into the war closed beta.
the game is unfinshed, terrible mob pathing, awkward combat, at least 6 months away from being in good shape
Non-fanboi reponse:
Issues with mob pathing/behavior = true. The dev team admitted it and they are fixing it. I saw it first hand. It may depend on the mobs you were fighting or even how you attacked them (ranged vs melee).
Not sure about 'awkward combat'. I mean, it's different from WoW. So, is different = awkward? As I've stated elsewhere, the thing I didn't get in WAR combat is a sense of being really 'in' the combat... so to speak. I mean, maybe there were a lot of things still turned off within the game like animations, gore, and such that would've made combat more violent, brutal, or 'WAR'ish'? I believe the dev's did state that there were a lot of animations they were about to roll into the next patch and they were fixing a CD timer.
Is the game unfinished? Maybe. It's also not officially released either. Open BETA hasn't started. I know it's a tight window from start of Open BETA to launch, but the game isn't officially launched. I would be more likely to say that the game isn't as polished as I had hoped it would be during the preview weekend more than anything else.
This just isn't true. The vast majority of players are not ' pvp only' players. Warhammer has almost 0 pve content... about 20% of their mobs don't even fight back, they just stand there and die. There are very few quests that players can do alone.. almost all the quests are global, which is great if you want your entire playtime to be about advancing your side, without advancing your own character. The vast majority of players are not pvpers, they are not into 'realm goals'.
As far as Warhammers pvp... again, it is overrated. There is simply no strategy except to zerg (die, and rush forward full speed). There are no CC's, no interrupts.. nothing that is 'tactical' about a fight, you just cast your highest dps spells as fast as possible. The winning side is ALWAYS the side with the most players because that is all that matters.
The majority of wow-type players will be bored within a month of Warhammer. If the 3.0 patch comes out before Warhammer, not that many people will try Warhammer except for the old Doac players (ie..200k tops).
Warhammer is just too 'niche' to get over 500k subscribers. It's all about pvp, and all about 'global' accomplishments. WOW reached 11M subscribers because it caters to all different playstyles, but caters mainly to what most people want ( solo questing pve with a good mix of dungeons and pvp).
What kind of MMORPG doesen't let you put your weopons to your side and out of fighting pose right there it's a fail i'm sorry WAR will never even break 1 million subs away from WoW.
This just isn't true. The vast majority of players are not ' pvp only' players. Warhammer has almost 0 pve content... about 20% of their mobs don't even fight back, they just stand there and die. There are very few quests that players can do alone.. almost all the quests are global, which is great if you want your entire playtime to be about advancing your side, without advancing your own character. The vast majority of players are not pvpers, they are not into 'realm goals'.
As far as Warhammers pvp... again, it is overrated. There is simply no strategy except to zerg (die, and rush forward full speed). There are no CC's, no interrupts.. nothing that is 'tactical' about a fight, you just cast your highest dps spells as fast as possible. The winning side is ALWAYS the side with the most players because that is all that matters.
The majority of wow-type players will be bored within a month of Warhammer. If the 3.0 patch comes out before Warhammer, not that many people will try Warhammer except for the old Doac players (ie..200k tops).
Warhammer is just too 'niche' to get over 500k subscribers. It's all about pvp, and all about 'global' accomplishments. WOW reached 11M subscribers because it caters to all different playstyles, but caters mainly to what most people want ( solo questing pve with a good mix of dungeons and pvp).
It's funny that you enjoy making comments saying "this just isn't true" and then basing your facts off of nothing as well. Warhammer has a lot more PvE content than you probably can imagine, and it certainly isn't "mostly global quests" LOL. There are so many quests you can level from 1-40 without having to pvp, but the game is a pvp game, and will promote it indefinitely. oh, and the monster's not attacking thing, its a bug that developers have allready PUBLICLY admitted a problem and will be fixed before open beta.
As far as warhammers pvp goes, again it's NOT overrated, it's everything it said it would be and more. You can't honestly expect to believe there are no cc's, no interupts, nothing that is tactical in a pvp based game. I had two characters that both either had some form of silence, hold, entangle, kick, slow, hamstring, aoe silence, and so on, and if they didn't get it by the "20 levels I was allowed to play" if you reviewed the character notes on all their abilities, nearly EVERY class in the game gets some form of CC. This game has more strategy in one finger than wow has ever considered dreaming up. Stop basing your silly opinions off of a preview weekend where not even 1/4 the content was allowed. Stop comparing a 4 year old game that has had massive improvements from it's release to a game that is STILL IN BETA LOLOL. Give me a break, compare WoW beta to War Beta... The release alone will be more successful.
You say warhammer is to "'niche" to get over 500k subs, but it's allready there, and will grow much faster once the word is around that it's a great game. DAoC was heavily based on pvp RVR, and was a massive success, and guess what, warhammer will be too. When Blizzard first released wow, it lacked so much content, there were a few 5 man instances (UBRS) lawl, and so forth. Blizzard slowly released content at a time to retain customers. not becuase it was "well rounded with content that catered to all" don't give me that bullshit, no MMO has released with fully working pve and pvp that catered to all.
You base half your arguements on the few you-tube video's and fanboi's opinions you've read over, and remember, your 11 million subscribers have no-where near the number of "US/EU" subs as you think, majority of your subs are asian. And only god knows how many of those are gold sellers.
Not even you can deny that after four years, people get a bit tired of the game, shit I know I did, I have almost 7 70's with 2 that attained gladiator status, but the deal was, I was done. I wanted something new, something fun, something that wasn't wow. Guess what, Preview weekend alone was more than enough to deliver just that, and TONS of people feel the same way. You've probably noticed the amount of people claiming they have allready dropped their accounts on wow, with promises of "coming back to check out wotlk."
The reality is, Wrath of the lich king is going to release, and become another TBC, all gear that people have spent endless hours collecting will be rendered useless within minutes of release, from that point it's race to get your guild to 80 or a race to get a dark knight to 80 and after that hype dies down. It will be the same old tired game with average pvp, and PvE that turns into a grind-fest once a guild learns the fight. I've been there, black-temple provided our guild with good deal of challenge, but once we mastered ever mob in there, it was over. It was on farm status and then became a grind-fest. Which is exactly what level 80 will be all about.
The pvp fanbase is much larger than you clearly comprehend, and due to that you will fail to see just how successful warhammer will be. I was an avid WoW player both pve and pvp alike, but I was tired of the game, quitting and rejoining, each season becoming another giant /sigh when I realized that I had to grind AV for another 75,000 honor and team up with the same people to get to 2200+ just to finish my set of gear. It was old, it was boring. Wratch of the lich King is just an extension of all that, once everyone reaches their 80, gets their new shiny gear, they will quickly realize the game hasn't changed, all it did was eliminate the prior 70 levels of content from having a purpose.
-- Games are never as fun as their hype. It's still doing the same things as 90% of the MMOs ever since EQ1 wrote the template for 3D MMOs.
-- You can't ever be that newbie again. Not Warhammer, not WoW, not AoC, or any other MMO out there claiming originality.
-- You, I, and many other people won't be satisfied until once again we can be immersed,as newbs once more, into a mysterious realm of which we know nothing.
i really could'nt care less about sub numbers.. if a game have 10 million or 100 subs, i don't really care, it simply dosnt effect me.
only thing i care about is that the server never get full, so i dont have to wait in 2 hours que, like wow in 2005..
Want to play: Lego Universe
This just isn't true. The vast majority of players are not ' pvp only' players. Warhammer has almost 0 pve content... about 20% of their mobs don't even fight back, they just stand there and die. There are very few quests that players can do alone.. almost all the quests are global, which is great if you want your entire playtime to be about advancing your side, without advancing your own character. The vast majority of players are not pvpers, they are not into 'realm goals'.
As far as Warhammers pvp... again, it is overrated. There is simply no strategy except to zerg (die, and rush forward full speed). There are no CC's, no interrupts.. nothing that is 'tactical' about a fight, you just cast your highest dps spells as fast as possible. The winning side is ALWAYS the side with the most players because that is all that matters.
The majority of wow-type players will be bored within a month of Warhammer. If the 3.0 patch comes out before Warhammer, not that many people will try Warhammer except for the old Doac players (ie..200k tops).
Warhammer is just too 'niche' to get over 500k subscribers. It's all about pvp, and all about 'global' accomplishments. WOW reached 11M subscribers because it caters to all different playstyles, but caters mainly to what most people want ( solo questing pve with a good mix of dungeons and pvp).
As good as a read this thread has been for me...I happened to glance over this uninformed post and had to comment.
I spent a good MANY hours this weekend PvE'g and Questing ALONE...SOLO...UNO...SINGULAR...you obviously haven't laid your stubbly fingers on the keyboard to test it out this preview weekend...so, I'll leave the stupidity of your posting to the review of other WAR pw'rs who found their time mixed between PvE and PvP.
Friday to Monday folks....PLENTY of pve and soloability...in fact...I joined up in Scenarios and PQ's just so I had some feeling of belonging. Mainly, I wanted to learn the concepts myself without group, guild and party members screaming through my chat box. I found a great combination of the two and from a PvE person...(and not a hater of WoW)...this was and will be my 'new' game.
This just isn't true. The vast majority of players are not ' pvp only' players. Warhammer has almost 0 pve content... about 20% of their mobs don't even fight back, they just stand there and die. There are very few quests that players can do alone.. almost all the quests are global, which is great if you want your entire playtime to be about advancing your side, without advancing your own character. The vast majority of players are not pvpers, they are not into 'realm goals'.
As far as Warhammers pvp... again, it is overrated. There is simply no strategy except to zerg (die, and rush forward full speed). There are no CC's, no interrupts.. nothing that is 'tactical' about a fight, you just cast your highest dps spells as fast as possible. The winning side is ALWAYS the side with the most players because that is all that matters.
The majority of wow-type players will be bored within a month of Warhammer. If the 3.0 patch comes out before Warhammer, not that many people will try Warhammer except for the old Doac players (ie..200k tops).
Warhammer is just too 'niche' to get over 500k subscribers. It's all about pvp, and all about 'global' accomplishments. WOW reached 11M subscribers because it caters to all different playstyles, but caters mainly to what most people want ( solo questing pve with a good mix of dungeons and pvp).
As good as a read this thread has been for me...I happened to glance over this uninformed post and had to comment.
I spent a good MANY hours this weekend PvE'g and Questing ALONE...SOLO...UNO...SINGULAR...you obviously haven't laid your stubbly fingers on the keyboard to test it out this preview weekend...so, I'll leave the stupidity of your posting to the review of other WAR pw'rs who found their time mixed between PvE and PvP.
Friday to Monday folks....PLENTY of pve and soloability...in fact...I joined up in Scenarios and PQ's just so I had some feeling of belonging. Mainly, I wanted to learn the concepts myself without group, guild and party members screaming through my chat box. I found a great combination of the two and from a PvE person...(and not a hater of WoW)...this was and will be my 'new' game.
Really cause i played mostly PVE, because i perfer it so i won't be playing this long term most likely, but its slow as all hell. Because the combat is that much slower, because the leveling is that much slower, and because the i thought the PQs (while nice at first) where all pretty much the same (fight a buncha soloable guys, fight a bunch of champions, then fight a boss.) and repitive as well if you wanted the only useful influence rewards.
Another part of pve, IMO, is actually exploring the towns (oh wait there where only little camps dotted down the road) dungeons (i know there are some but i didn't see any in the maps i checked out which was about 5 of them.) and world (The map feels strangely disconnected from my actually experience when zoomed out even one space and there doesn't FEEL like there is anything passed the PQs (which were a lttle bit out of the way from the one set path the quests are on, but not by much.)
Now, some of this is subjective but when in comparsion to the pve experience of huge cities and towns loads of dungeons, a seamless world, and quests that either have to be traveled down for a long ways to get the completed goal and rewards, or require a rare drop to even be started, i.e. you have to go off the beaten path to even see close to everything there is to explore. How can you compare, nay, claim that you want to leave one pve experience for one that has so little to offer.
NOTE: You say you are a PVEr, but if you are going to WAR then you are going to the wrong mmo. If not please stick with WOW or go play LOTRO or vanguard they all have better PVE to offer than WAR has at this point in time.
2nd Note: if you are Borehammer fanboy please go back to hyping your game on the any of the many WAR forums out there cause i am tired of WAR invading this section of MMORPGs forums.
3rd Note: Borehammer is in refrence to the phrase borecraft and i thought it would be nice to sling it back at the fanboys. WAR itself is a game i think that has a very nice pvp system and a good general feel to it as well, its just not my thing.
Hype is my nemesis. i will fight it til the day i die whether i take it down or it takes me down. So depressing, Yes?
the game is unfinshed, terrible mob pathing, awkward combat, at least 6 months away from being in good shape
here go suck on this a little while...
http://www.warhammeralliance.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63427
This just isn't true. The vast majority of players are not ' pvp only' players. Warhammer has almost 0 pve content... about 20% of their mobs don't even fight back, they just stand there and die. There are very few quests that players can do alone.. almost all the quests are global, which is great if you want your entire playtime to be about advancing your side, without advancing your own character. The vast majority of players are not pvpers, they are not into 'realm goals'.
As far as Warhammers pvp... again, it is overrated. There is simply no strategy except to zerg (die, and rush forward full speed). There are no CC's, no interrupts.. nothing that is 'tactical' about a fight, you just cast your highest dps spells as fast as possible. The winning side is ALWAYS the side with the most players because that is all that matters.
The majority of wow-type players will be bored within a month of Warhammer. If the 3.0 patch comes out before Warhammer, not that many people will try Warhammer except for the old Doac players (ie..200k tops).
Warhammer is just too 'niche' to get over 500k subscribers. It's all about pvp, and all about 'global' accomplishments. WOW reached 11M subscribers because it caters to all different playstyles, but caters mainly to what most people want ( solo questing pve with a good mix of dungeons and pvp).
As good as a read this thread has been for me...I happened to glance over this uninformed post and had to comment.
I spent a good MANY hours this weekend PvE'g and Questing ALONE...SOLO...UNO...SINGULAR...you obviously haven't laid your stubbly fingers on the keyboard to test it out this preview weekend...so, I'll leave the stupidity of your posting to the review of other WAR pw'rs who found their time mixed between PvE and PvP.
Friday to Monday folks....PLENTY of pve and soloability...in fact...I joined up in Scenarios and PQ's just so I had some feeling of belonging. Mainly, I wanted to learn the concepts myself without group, guild and party members screaming through my chat box. I found a great combination of the two and from a PvE person...(and not a hater of WoW)...this was and will be my 'new' game.
Really cause i played mostly PVE, because i perfer it so i won't be playing this long term most likely, but its slow as all hell. Because the combat is that much slower, because the leveling is that much slower, and because the i thought the PQs (while nice at first) where all pretty much the same (fight a buncha soloable guys, fight a bunch of champions, then fight a boss.) and repitive as well if you wanted the only useful influence rewards.
Another part of pve, IMO, is actually exploring the towns (oh wait there where only little camps dotted down the road) dungeons (i know there are some but i didn't see any in the maps i checked out which was about 5 of them.) and world (The map feels strangely disconnected from my actually experience when zoomed out even one space and there doesn't FEEL like there is anything passed the PQs (which were a lttle bit out of the way from the one set path the quests are on, but not by much.)
Now, some of this is subjective but when in comparsion to the pve experience of huge cities and towns loads of dungeons, a seamless world, and quests that either have to be traveled down for a long ways to get the completed goal and rewards, or require a rare drop to even be started, i.e. you have to go off the beaten path to even see close to everything there is to explore. How can you compare, nay, claim that you want to leave one pve experience for one that has so little to offer.
NOTE: You say you are a PVEr, but if you are going to WAR then you are going to the wrong mmo. If not please stick with WOW or go play LOTRO or vanguard they all have better PVE to offer than WAR has at this point in time.
2nd Note: if you are Borehammer fanboy please go back to hyping your game on the any of the many WAR forums out there cause i am tired of WAR invading this section of MMORPGs forums.
3rd Note: Borehammer is in refrence to the phrase borecraft and i thought it would be nice to sling it back at the fanboys. WAR itself is a game i think that has a very nice pvp system and a good general feel to it as well, its just not my thing.
You're quite wrong, sir. I'm certain you weren't able to experience the PW as a whole or spent much time trying. There were towns..and groups and a city....PvE wasn't hidden or scarce...it was integral (at least in my experience from rank 1 to 15). I won't leave a PvE experience for one that doesn't have at least a plethura of opportunity for PvE...I will be leaving an older game for a newer one...with some of the same loves I had from the prior.
Yes, I am a PvE'r and I love PvE...but there are aspects to a combination of both PvE and PvP that I enjoy. There are countless quests (sure, I didn't explore them all) and there are still countless things being introduced once this goes live that have yet to be illuminated thus far.
I understand completely WAR is more geared toward the PvP aspect of gaming...but understand this...there will be aspects of both loves...and though one might shine a bit more than the other does not mean it will not appeal to both PvE'rs and PvP'rs alike.
You said it yourself. So if war isn't a wow-killer, and it isn't, even by a long-shot, then why are you so worried about wow subs. Put it this way, if mythic doesn't get the subs they need mythic is over with. EA took mythic on because they wanted their wow and they'd better deliver. If wow loses even 100's of 1000's blizz will be fine. They still have plenty of loyal players. They also have s2, d3, a new mmo, wrath, future wow expansions, a new IP in the works. And all is well with the world.
War is not WoW killer, never was, never will be.
The people who are raiding for gear that will become obselete the next patch will continue raiding.
The people who loves PvE (new dungeons, public quests, not being dedicated to daily 24 men raiding) combined with PvP/RvR will play War.
The real PvPers who care about realm proud, common goal will play War.
The gear maniacs, who wants to do arenas over and over every week to get on top of charts will play WoW.
You see, the target audience is completely different for either game. I fail to understand WoW vs. War comparison. If you love WoW, stick to WoW. If you want to taste the fruits of RvR, new and relaxed PvEing, try War. So simple to decide.
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Osbourne Cox: You are the guy from the gym.
Ted Treffon: I don't represent Hardbodies.
Osbourne Cox: I know very well what you represent. You represent the idiocy of today.
Ted Treffon: No, I don't represent that either.
Osbourne Cox: You are part of a league of morons. Oh, yes. You see you're one of the morons I've been fighting my whole life. But guess what. Today, I win.
I am very certain that the overwhelming majority of players who try Warhammer are people who have also played WoW. Same people, same target audience, same players.
If you think Warhammer wont have people chasing gear upgrades, grinding realm points, daily "raids", reputation or whatever other new flavor it introduces you are in for a large surprise. While I am no expert on Warhammer by a long shot, I think most MMO share the same characteristics and mechanics.
Why are people acting like Warhammer will get all these ficticious people that never played WoW or this game will rid the MMO world of grinds, gear upgrades or anything else that is commonplace in MMOs?
People will play War if it is a good game.
Of course people who have played previous MMOs (including WoW) will be playing War. Some of them just come from DAOC, Guild Wars or Planetside etc. but the majority will be coming from the mainstream MMOs.
However there are various things I wished WoW had that. Like RvR, I wanted to kill the elf king for example, after 1-2 months of release it was never possible. Stuck in instanced BGs or Arenas was not a good thing for me.
War has definitely tons of stuff that WoW does not have and probably will not have. I am excited about War to be honest. Achievements, tome of knowledge, PQs, siege weapons (WoW would have it too soon I guess), realm proud, non-instanced RvR, balanced gear/skill ratio, renown points (taking more than a year to get to RR80) etc.
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Osbourne Cox: You are the guy from the gym.
Ted Treffon: I don't represent Hardbodies.
Osbourne Cox: I know very well what you represent. You represent the idiocy of today.
Ted Treffon: No, I don't represent that either.
Osbourne Cox: You are part of a league of morons. Oh, yes. You see you're one of the morons I've been fighting my whole life. But guess what. Today, I win.