Too little, too late for FC. It's best opportunity for AoC has long since left.
To little to late for what ?
Too little to late for... SUCCESS.
You only get ONE launch day.
You only get ONE chance for first impressions.
Failcom had their chance after the veil was removed from the ugly bride to fix things. But after 4 months, it hasn't happened, so alot left.
Failcom had a chance to really do something with AoC. There was no denying the number of players in-game when it went live. The enthusiasm was there.
But the wrappings of Tortage were peeled back. Players progressed further. Then players began to see fully how messy a game it was.
And how Failcom took very few steps in fixing it. Not only that, broke a couple more things with their patches.
Opportunity and success are finicky women. They may very likely only give you that window once, and only once. And if you don't perform right, don't make the most of it, well... too bad.
Failcom had their chance to swing for success, but whiffed like an uncoordinated fool.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
Funcom did a great job, levels 20-80, we all enjoyed playing it, then level 80 hit, and he were all logging in, "What to do now"?
Gaute, being the elitist he was didnt realize when we all hit 80, there was nothing to do. The game would have been great if there was end game content. I for one enjoyed the leveling with guildies. Funcom really screwed themselves when they had no end-game content a month after launch. Great, we had 3 raid bosses, but that was it......
Well its pointless to say to late in general, yea its to late for 1st impressions however is never to late to turn game around. Iam not saying AoC will do it neither that they have good chance to do it.
However the fact is if the game got bunch of good end game content, with few new features, with some annoying bugs gone, with better itemization etc... they could easily became mainstream MMO with massive player base. ( I for one as AoC player hope that does not happen and they will stay some niche MMO )
Players are like sheep's, its funny to see posts now OMG Funcom sux, I will never buy any game from Funcom anymore .. yea sure the same players that told the same shit when AO was released were there at AoC launch and iam talking about true haters. The actual % of players that would not buy a game from Funcom is so small thats is not worth to mention regardless what they say now.
Well its pointless to say to late in general, yea its to late for 1st impressions however is never to late to turn game around. Iam not saying AoC will do it neither that they have good chance to do it.
However the fact is if the game got bunch of good end game content, with few new features, with some annoying bugs gone, with better itemization etc... they could easily became mainstream MMO with massive player base. ( I for one as AoC player hope that does not happen and they will stay some niche MMO )
Players are like sheep's, its funny to see posts now OMG Funcom sux, I will never buy any game from Funcom anymore .. yea sure the same players that told the same shit when AO was released were there at AoC launch and iam talking about true haters. The actual % of players that would not buy a game from Funcom is so small thats is not worth to mention regardless what they say now.
What good end game content? Because it's not there... working, that is.
Failcom can fix the game, but honestly, how long do you think it will take to even resemble a stable game with the content that was promised and hoped for at launch, not to mention the serious issues in gameplay and technical that need to be fixed?
It will take a while to take care of those things.
All during this time that the MMO competition improves themselves. New titles to come out. WAR is out. WoW's WotLK is due. Time for the competition to improve themselves also.
So, Failcom can fix things, but it will take a while if at all. But by then people won't be looking back anymore.
That's why it's so important to get things right at launch, or if it's problematic, you better damn well be fixing major issues ASAP.
MMO players do understand that there can be some big issues at release. But they can tolerate it up to a certain amount, and only for so long.
Myself, I'm not falling for any "Carrot On A Stick" tactic by a company. I'm not falling for grandoise plans laid out on messages or interviews on how these upcoming changes will "blow you away!"
I'm F**king Doubting Thomas. I'm not believing it until I freakin' see it for live (or live patches).
As far as the stomach of not doing business with a company that has wronged you, well there's people who do keep that, like myself. In MMO terms, I've refused to do business at all with SOE after their final debacle (or series of it, really) with Star Wars Galaxies in late 2005. I've never touched a product of theirs since that time. At one time I was curious about Vanguard. Then I saw SOE was going to take the helm of that product. Well, that's a big no-no for me, so I never touched it. Good thing I didn't!
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
As a victim of Gaute's "vision" for AO's first expansion which turned a stunning sci-fi game into a very poor EQ clone, it warms my heart to read that Gaute has been driven out of the gaming industry. One of my last posts on the official AOC forums was a call for his resignation. I am sad to hear that AO will now suffer the loss of Silirrion, but even if he had stayed and seen the graphics update to completion I would not have gone back to try it due to Funcom's unethical behavior with Age of Conan. At any rate, what happy news this is! Hopefully you remaining AoC customers will get to see what a competent game director who listens to his players can accomplish. He did a good job with AO.
Funny thing is, as a founder, Funcom couldn't really fire him. Wonder how bad the pressure was to make him resign. Wonder if investors perhaps had a say in his decision. I'm betting those stocks the fanbois kept saying didn't matter did indeed. He hasn't just left Funcom, he's been run out of the entire industry.
I was wondering about this myself. As a founder, he should be immune to this. Usually people have to leave after doing something wrong. As there weren't any news the last few days that I am aware of, , I'm guessing some bad news are coming...
Well its pointless to say to late in general, yea its to late for 1st impressions however is never to late to turn game around. Iam not saying AoC will do it neither that they have good chance to do it.
However the fact is if the game got bunch of good end game content, with few new features, with some annoying bugs gone, with better itemization etc... they could easily became mainstream MMO with massive player base. ( I for one as AoC player hope that does not happen and they will stay some niche MMO )
Players are like sheep's, its funny to see posts now OMG Funcom sux, I will never buy any game from Funcom anymore .. yea sure the same players that told the same shit when AO was released were there at AoC launch and iam talking about true haters. The actual % of players that would not buy a game from Funcom is so small thats is not worth to mention regardless what they say now.
What good end game content? Because it's not there... working, that is.
Failcom can fix the game, but honestly, how long do you think it will take to even resemble a stable game with the content that was promised and hoped for at launch, not to mention the serious issues in gameplay and technical that need to be fixed?
It will take a while to take care of those things.
All during this time that the MMO competition improves themselves. New titles to come out. WAR is out. WoW's WotLK is due. Time for the competition to improve themselves also.
So, Failcom can fix things, but it will take a while if at all. But by then people won't be looking back anymore.
That's why it's so important to get things right at launch, or if it's problematic, you better damn well be fixing major issues ASAP.
MMO players do understand that there can be some big issues at release. But they can tolerate it up to a certain amount, and only for so long.
Myself, I'm not falling for any "Carrot On A Stick" tactic by a company. I'm not falling for grandoise plans laid out on messages or interviews on how these upcoming changes will "blow you away!"
I'm F**king Doubting Thomas. I'm not believing it until I freakin' see it for live (or live patches).
As far as the stomach of not doing business with a company that has wronged you, well there's people who do keep that, like myself. In MMO terms, I've refused to do business at all with SOE after their final debacle (or series of it, really) with Star Wars Galaxies in late 2005. I've never touched a product of theirs since that time. At one time I was curious about Vanguard. Then I saw SOE was going to take the helm of that product. Well, that's a big no-no for me, so I never touched it. Good thing I didn't!
I thought I read recently, or not so recently, that SOE is having its license for SWG yanked by Lucas in Jan 09?
Too late, only so much. Gaute hasn't even managed to make two broken games. It's about time, but I am serious when I say time's been lost and not seriously is a primary enemy of Age of Conan. Word of mouth and me and you can make it so that it never recovers even with much higher resourses.
Gaute killed bigger games, so what if he carried a born-dead Age of Conan. It's a franchise after all. I know of people who are eager to shoot him at sight, and they're pretty loyal citizens of totalitarian Russian Federation.
Age of Conan untimely death will be forgotten. But Anarchy Online community, mainly Storm, Redemption, Molotoff Cocktail guys are too see him guttered at very least. This guy is like a waste-made a-bomb to anything he touches, I hope he does touch his chair so he can die as painful a death.
What good end game content? Because it's not there... working, that is. Failcom can fix the game, but honestly, how long do you think it will take to even resemble a stable game with the content that was promised and hoped for at launch, not to mention the serious issues in gameplay and technical that need to be fixed?
Maybe by next year, maybe never who knows.
My point was if game ever turns out to be great people will come back and that applies for every game.
OK those people who never liked the core mehanics and hated the game from day 1 those wont be back, those who played for a while and like it but started to hate it due bugs and unfinished game those well majority of those would try it again.
Its really never to late for anything in the big picture.
Its to late for Funcom to make good 1st impression and thats basically it.
I thought I read recently, or not so recently, that SOE is having its license for SWG yanked by Lucas in Jan 09?
You mean like they were getting it yanked in 2008? 2007? 2006?
If you listen to the idiots in the Veteran Refuge section, your brain will melt from all the stupidity and misinformation there. Do yourself a favor, and tune them out.
What good end game content? Because it's not there... working, that is. Failcom can fix the game, but honestly, how long do you think it will take to even resemble a stable game with the content that was promised and hoped for at launch, not to mention the serious issues in gameplay and technical that need to be fixed?
Maybe by next year, maybe never who knows.
My point was if game ever turns out to be great people will come back and that applies for every game.
I don't think this game can be fixed.
I played in beta. A lot of people, even during beta, liked the game at first. They liked the combat system, they liked the Tortage area from level 1 through level 20. Most people thought the game was going to be fairly bug free because Tortage was fairly bug free (for a beta anyway). I never liked any of that. I didn't quit because of bugs or because of a lack of content beyond Tortage. I quit because I just plain didn't like ANYTHING about the game.
The combat system is stupid. I still can't beleive anyone likes it. Its button mashing in the extreme. Funcom acted like this combat system was going to change the world because it doesn't come with an auto attack option. Thats absurd. MANY other games have been around for a lot longer than AoC has without using an auto attack feature. City of Heroes is a great example of this. Their combat system has no auto attack feature and its a hell of a lot better than AoC because the combat there is actually fun and interesting, rather then just spamming pointless attacks over and over. The AoC devs promised me their combat system was going to be great but it was a huge let down.
I didn't care for Tortage either. Yes, it had voice acting. Yes, it had a story. I don't need or want either of those things in an MMO. The point of an MMO is for the player to create a unique character and develop their own unique adventure for that character by joining guilds, making friends and fighting enemies in PvP. If I wanted to trudge through a linear storyline with no choices of my own to make then I would go play a single player game, not an MMO. And there are a lot of vastly better single player RPGs that do a better job of telling a story than AoC does.
And of course once you leave tortage things don't get any better. The rest of the game is made up of instanced zones and invisible walls. Character development is a joke. Plus you have to grind all the way to level 70. With these kinds of game mechanics you might as well be playing the original Everquest all over again. Nothing about this game is as new or as innovative as the developers claimed.
So if IF (and thats a big if) the developers could "fix" this game by getting rid of bugs and adding content, I still don't think it would be worth playing. The whole premise of the game is flawed at its very core. The only way to fix it would be to start over from scratch with a whole new engine, whole new developers and a whole new company producing it. And even then the chances still aren't that great.
I thought I read recently, or not so recently, that SOE is having its license for SWG yanked by Lucas in Jan 09?
I haven't heard such a thing. Especially since BioWare's Star Wars MMO will still be a ways out.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
I thought I read recently, or not so recently, that SOE is having its license for SWG yanked by Lucas in Jan 09?
I haven't heard such a thing. Especially since BioWare's Star Wars MMO will still be a ways out.
1) It's still not confirmed that BioWare's MMO is Star Wars. XD (Just nitpicking here).
2) (and this is really my point), BioWare have announced the title for 2009 back in the day. They started working on it in 2005, maybe earlier. That gives them 4 years Dev Time and ocnsidering they are licensing an engine, not creating one themselves, that is a lot of time.
What good end game content? Because it's not there... working, that is. Failcom can fix the game, but honestly, how long do you think it will take to even resemble a stable game with the content that was promised and hoped for at launch, not to mention the serious issues in gameplay and technical that need to be fixed?
Maybe by next year, maybe never who knows.
My point was if game ever turns out to be great people will come back and that applies for every game.
OK those people who never liked the core mehanics and hated the game from day 1 those wont be back, those who played for a while and like it but started to hate it due bugs and unfinished game those well majority of those would try it again.
Its really never to late for anything in the big picture.
Its to late for Funcom to make good 1st impression and thats basically it.
The first impression is damn important, or how things are handled in the first few months.
Why?
People get driven off for whatever reason. Bugs. Incompleteness of the game. Not liking the gameplay. Etc.
So, you bungle things up at release and not handle things like they should have been and drove off customers.
You drive them away and time goes on and on.
If you take too long in fixing your game's issues, those that have left and had a possible thought on coming back will have moved on for good. There are other MMOs out there. Thoughts on it would have taken the back seat or have been forgotten altogether.
Maybe if Failcom takes their collective heads out of the holes in the ground and fix their game, some will come back.
But the further down the road this "fixed AoC like it should be" is down the road, the fewer people you'll draw back in.
Your "fixed MMO" won't have a second launch. It won't draw the people like it initially did when it went gold.
That is why first impressions and fixing the game like madmen in the first few months is important. You have the attention. You have, especially in AoC's case, the good initial number of people to work with.
If you don't handle it right just like Failcom did, congradulations! You just drove your customers and their regular payments away!
Edit to add: Again, opportunity is finicky. You may only get that one shot to have great success, and for AoC's case, it is undeniably on launch day when it had tremendous momentum.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
I thought I read recently, or not so recently, that SOE is having its license for SWG yanked by Lucas in Jan 09?
I haven't heard such a thing. Especially since BioWare's Star Wars MMO will still be a ways out.
1) It's still not confirmed that BioWare's MMO is Star Wars. XD (Just nitpicking here).
2) (and this is really my point), BioWare have announced the title for 2009 back in the day. They started working on it in 2005, maybe earlier. That gives them 4 years Dev Time and ocnsidering they are licensing an engine, not creating one themselves, that is a lot of time.
Cheers.
That's not true. One of the owners of Bioware (one of the dr's) let is slip that the new MMORPG was based off of Kotor during some show... he basically said ' our new KOTOR mmorpg'. There were video links on the forums for awhile which is why every 'knows' without it being official yet.
Interesting... the news of Gaute leaving resulted in a brief increase of stock price as investors prayed for positive changes, but its reverted back to freefall again as the reality of the situation has sunk in.
Who else from funcom should be fired to buy them a few more days?
Waiting for: A skill-based MMO with Freedom and Consequence. Woe to thee, the pierce-ed.
This Bioware discussion seems a little off topic... but if we are going to throw down on that subject then I've got a beef with them that just happened today.
I saw this ad on TV for a new Sonic the Hedgehog game. This wasn't a big suprise to me considering how quick to whore out Sega has been ever since they became a third party developer. What was a big suprise is that its apparently being developed by Bioware... or published by them or something. I don't know the details, only that the Bioware logo was all over that ad.
So I have to wonder... what the hell is going on over at Bioware these days? It used to be a solid company that made high quailty PC RPGs. But then they started co-developing their games for both PC and console at the same time. And now I catch them red-handed making a Sonic game of all things! It seems like they will develop any game these days if there is a profit in it. Its like they have become the mercenary of game developers!
So this MMO of theirs... we still don't know anything about it and as another person pointed out, its been in development forever already. At this point I wouldn't be suprised if it was planned for co-release on PC, Xbox, Gameboy and the Sega Dreamcast all at the same time. And it will be about rapping dinosaurs with lightsabers trying to stop some bad guy from Neverwinter Nights who has a scheme to vandalize wikipedia entries about Nike shoes.
This Bioware discussion seems a little off topic... but if we are going to throw down on that subject then I've got a beef with them that just happened today. I saw this ad on TV for a new Sonic the Hedgehog game. This wasn't a big suprise to me considering how quick to whore out Sega has been ever since they became a third party developer. What was a big suprise is that its apparently being developed by Bioware... or published by them or something. I don't know the details, only that the Bioware logo was all over that ad. So I have to wonder... what the hell is going on over at Bioware these days? It used to be a solid company that made high quailty PC RPGs. But then they started co-developing their games for both PC and console at the same time. And now I catch them red-handed making a Sonic game of all things! It seems like they will develop any game these days if there is a profit in it. Its like they have become the mercenary of game developers! So this MMO of theirs... we still don't know anything about it and as another person pointed out, its been in development forever already. At this point I wouldn't be suprised if it was planned for co-release on PC, Xbox, Gameboy and the Sega Dreamcast all at the same time. And it will be about rapping dinosaurs with lightsabers trying to stop some bad guy from Neverwinter Nights who has a scheme to vandalize wikipedia entries about Nike shoes.
More like a last ditch effort on the part of Funcom via this clever scheme, which most people seem to believe is a real situation.
Gaute Godager basically volunteered to be a scapegoat for AoC's problems. He's trying to save his game by giving Funcom someone to blame, i.e. "Alright, now that he's gone we can actually make a decent game! It's safe now, everyone, come buy it!" I'd wager Gaute picked up a little extra with his "resignation".
Spoils of War - The quickest way of ending a war is to lose it.
More like a last ditch effort on the part of Funcom via this clever scheme, which most people seem to believe is a real situation. Gaute Godager basically volunteered to be a scapegoat for AoC's problems. He's trying to save his game by giving Funcom someone to blame, i.e. "Alright, now that he's gone we can actually make a decent game! It's safe now, everyone, come buy it!" I'd wager Gaute picked up a little extra with his "resignation".
Exactly my opinion. Gaute happened to be the one most people know, so he's an easy one to blame.
it's not Gaute's fault that the game was buggy as hell, it's the fault of the technical lead. It isn't his fault that he was only allowed to make tortage great, but leave the rest of the game half assed. It isn't his fault that Funcom has the most lying and disrespectful customer service... It's all of Funcom management that's responsible for this mess, and the way they have treated Gaute, who is the one that's responsible for the potential the game really had, just shows how little morals this company's management has.
Exactly my opinion. Gaute happened to be the one most people know, so he's an easy one to blame. it's not Gaute's fault that the game was buggy as hell, it's the fault of the technical lead. It isn't his fault that he was only allowed to make tortage great, but leave the rest of the game half assed. It isn't his fault that Funcom has the most lying and disrespectful customer service... It's all of Funcom management that's responsible for this mess, and the way they have treated Gaute, who is the one that's responsible for the potential the game really had, just shows how little morals this company's management has.
I agree. Most people here think Gaute was evil and now that he's gone, and we have a new awesome game director, everything is perfect!
Leadership is important but you have to realize that the same incompetent coders who did the game in the first place, still work for FC. No amount of leadership can make the FC devs instantly better at what they do. Honestly, I think they just lack the skills to do a good AAA MMO. Many design aspects of AoC are so amateurish it's unbeliavable. And right now it's difficult for FC to hire competent devs because competent devs don't want to work for sinking ship, that is FC.
Removing Gaute was a smart PR move but won't change things as much as people think.
Exactly my opinion. Gaute happened to be the one most people know, so he's an easy one to blame. it's not Gaute's fault that the game was buggy as hell, it's the fault of the technical lead. It isn't his fault that he was only allowed to make tortage great, but leave the rest of the game half assed. It isn't his fault that Funcom has the most lying and disrespectful customer service... It's all of Funcom management that's responsible for this mess, and the way they have treated Gaute, who is the one that's responsible for the potential the game really had, just shows how little morals this company's management has.
I agree. Most people here think Gaute was evil and now that he's gone, and we have a new awesome game director, everything is perfect!
Leadership is important but you have to realize that the same incompetent coders who did the game in the first place, still work for FC. No amount of leadership can make the FC devs instantly better at what they do. Honestly, I think they just lack the skills to do a good AAA MMO. Many design aspects of AoC are so amateurish it's unbeliavable. And right now it's difficult for FC to hire competent devs because competent devs don't want to work for sinking ship, that is FC.
Removing Gaute was a smart PR move but won't change things as much as people think.
I do think it was mostly management, because IMHO it was mostly bad decision making that made Age of Conan fail so hard. It's not that the actual programmers or designers weren't able to do it, because there's more then enough stuff that shows that they are more than talented enough to do their job, it's just that on the bigger scale, too many parts were left unfinished, or badly integrated with each other. And even though Gaute is probably responsible for that, I'm pretty sure he isn't the only one.
I do think Gaute was mostly responsible for is the actual concept of the game, which is great IMHO. Also, in Tortage his views seemed to work very well, it's really just that they didn't get enough time to do the same thing for the rest of the game as well.
And the decision to release the game this early was most likely made by either marketing, or some of the financial guru's, so that's not Gaute's fault either.
And about bad (non management) employees, sure, the game was buggy, but that's usually not the fault of bad employees, but just the result of a bad techinical director, who doesn't provide the team with the process to write bug free code.
Comments
To little to late for what ?
Too little to late for... SUCCESS.
You only get ONE launch day.
You only get ONE chance for first impressions.
Failcom had their chance after the veil was removed from the ugly bride to fix things. But after 4 months, it hasn't happened, so alot left.
Failcom had a chance to really do something with AoC. There was no denying the number of players in-game when it went live. The enthusiasm was there.
But the wrappings of Tortage were peeled back. Players progressed further. Then players began to see fully how messy a game it was.
And how Failcom took very few steps in fixing it. Not only that, broke a couple more things with their patches.
Opportunity and success are finicky women. They may very likely only give you that window once, and only once. And if you don't perform right, don't make the most of it, well... too bad.
Failcom had their chance to swing for success, but whiffed like an uncoordinated fool.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
Funcom did a great job, levels 20-80, we all enjoyed playing it, then level 80 hit, and he were all logging in, "What to do now"?
Gaute, being the elitist he was didnt realize when we all hit 80, there was nothing to do. The game would have been great if there was end game content. I for one enjoyed the leveling with guildies. Funcom really screwed themselves when they had no end-game content a month after launch. Great, we had 3 raid bosses, but that was it......
Well its pointless to say to late in general, yea its to late for 1st impressions however is never to late to turn game around. Iam not saying AoC will do it neither that they have good chance to do it.
However the fact is if the game got bunch of good end game content, with few new features, with some annoying bugs gone, with better itemization etc... they could easily became mainstream MMO with massive player base. ( I for one as AoC player hope that does not happen and they will stay some niche MMO )
Players are like sheep's, its funny to see posts now OMG Funcom sux, I will never buy any game from Funcom anymore .. yea sure the same players that told the same shit when AO was released were there at AoC launch and iam talking about true haters. The actual % of players that would not buy a game from Funcom is so small thats is not worth to mention regardless what they say now.
Futilez[Do You Have What It Takes ?]
What good end game content? Because it's not there... working, that is.
Failcom can fix the game, but honestly, how long do you think it will take to even resemble a stable game with the content that was promised and hoped for at launch, not to mention the serious issues in gameplay and technical that need to be fixed?
It will take a while to take care of those things.
All during this time that the MMO competition improves themselves. New titles to come out. WAR is out. WoW's WotLK is due. Time for the competition to improve themselves also.
So, Failcom can fix things, but it will take a while if at all. But by then people won't be looking back anymore.
That's why it's so important to get things right at launch, or if it's problematic, you better damn well be fixing major issues ASAP.
MMO players do understand that there can be some big issues at release. But they can tolerate it up to a certain amount, and only for so long.
Myself, I'm not falling for any "Carrot On A Stick" tactic by a company. I'm not falling for grandoise plans laid out on messages or interviews on how these upcoming changes will "blow you away!"
I'm F**king Doubting Thomas. I'm not believing it until I freakin' see it for live (or live patches).
As far as the stomach of not doing business with a company that has wronged you, well there's people who do keep that, like myself. In MMO terms, I've refused to do business at all with SOE after their final debacle (or series of it, really) with Star Wars Galaxies in late 2005. I've never touched a product of theirs since that time. At one time I was curious about Vanguard. Then I saw SOE was going to take the helm of that product. Well, that's a big no-no for me, so I never touched it. Good thing I didn't!
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
As a victim of Gaute's "vision" for AO's first expansion which turned a stunning sci-fi game into a very poor EQ clone, it warms my heart to read that Gaute has been driven out of the gaming industry. One of my last posts on the official AOC forums was a call for his resignation. I am sad to hear that AO will now suffer the loss of Silirrion, but even if he had stayed and seen the graphics update to completion I would not have gone back to try it due to Funcom's unethical behavior with Age of Conan. At any rate, what happy news this is! Hopefully you remaining AoC customers will get to see what a competent game director who listens to his players can accomplish. He did a good job with AO.
I was wondering about this myself. As a founder, he should be immune to this. Usually people have to leave after doing something wrong. As there weren't any news the last few days that I am aware of, , I'm guessing some bad news are coming...
Why would a founder be immune to that?
What good end game content? Because it's not there... working, that is.
Failcom can fix the game, but honestly, how long do you think it will take to even resemble a stable game with the content that was promised and hoped for at launch, not to mention the serious issues in gameplay and technical that need to be fixed?
It will take a while to take care of those things.
All during this time that the MMO competition improves themselves. New titles to come out. WAR is out. WoW's WotLK is due. Time for the competition to improve themselves also.
So, Failcom can fix things, but it will take a while if at all. But by then people won't be looking back anymore.
That's why it's so important to get things right at launch, or if it's problematic, you better damn well be fixing major issues ASAP.
MMO players do understand that there can be some big issues at release. But they can tolerate it up to a certain amount, and only for so long.
Myself, I'm not falling for any "Carrot On A Stick" tactic by a company. I'm not falling for grandoise plans laid out on messages or interviews on how these upcoming changes will "blow you away!"
I'm F**king Doubting Thomas. I'm not believing it until I freakin' see it for live (or live patches).
As far as the stomach of not doing business with a company that has wronged you, well there's people who do keep that, like myself. In MMO terms, I've refused to do business at all with SOE after their final debacle (or series of it, really) with Star Wars Galaxies in late 2005. I've never touched a product of theirs since that time. At one time I was curious about Vanguard. Then I saw SOE was going to take the helm of that product. Well, that's a big no-no for me, so I never touched it. Good thing I didn't!
I thought I read recently, or not so recently, that SOE is having its license for SWG yanked by Lucas in Jan 09?
Too late, only so much. Gaute hasn't even managed to make two broken games. It's about time, but I am serious when I say time's been lost and not seriously is a primary enemy of Age of Conan. Word of mouth and me and you can make it so that it never recovers even with much higher resourses.
Gaute killed bigger games, so what if he carried a born-dead Age of Conan. It's a franchise after all. I know of people who are eager to shoot him at sight, and they're pretty loyal citizens of totalitarian Russian Federation.
Age of Conan untimely death will be forgotten. But Anarchy Online community, mainly Storm, Redemption, Molotoff Cocktail guys are too see him guttered at very least. This guy is like a waste-made a-bomb to anything he touches, I hope he does touch his chair so he can die as painful a death.
Maybe by next year, maybe never who knows.
My point was if game ever turns out to be great people will come back and that applies for every game.
OK those people who never liked the core mehanics and hated the game from day 1 those wont be back, those who played for a while and like it but started to hate it due bugs and unfinished game those well majority of those would try it again.
Its really never to late for anything in the big picture.
Its to late for Funcom to make good 1st impression and thats basically it.
Futilez[Do You Have What It Takes ?]
You mean like they were getting it yanked in 2008? 2007? 2006?
If you listen to the idiots in the Veteran Refuge section, your brain will melt from all the stupidity and misinformation there. Do yourself a favor, and tune them out.
Maybe by next year, maybe never who knows.
My point was if game ever turns out to be great people will come back and that applies for every game.
I don't think this game can be fixed.
I played in beta. A lot of people, even during beta, liked the game at first. They liked the combat system, they liked the Tortage area from level 1 through level 20. Most people thought the game was going to be fairly bug free because Tortage was fairly bug free (for a beta anyway). I never liked any of that. I didn't quit because of bugs or because of a lack of content beyond Tortage. I quit because I just plain didn't like ANYTHING about the game.
The combat system is stupid. I still can't beleive anyone likes it. Its button mashing in the extreme. Funcom acted like this combat system was going to change the world because it doesn't come with an auto attack option. Thats absurd. MANY other games have been around for a lot longer than AoC has without using an auto attack feature. City of Heroes is a great example of this. Their combat system has no auto attack feature and its a hell of a lot better than AoC because the combat there is actually fun and interesting, rather then just spamming pointless attacks over and over. The AoC devs promised me their combat system was going to be great but it was a huge let down.
I didn't care for Tortage either. Yes, it had voice acting. Yes, it had a story. I don't need or want either of those things in an MMO. The point of an MMO is for the player to create a unique character and develop their own unique adventure for that character by joining guilds, making friends and fighting enemies in PvP. If I wanted to trudge through a linear storyline with no choices of my own to make then I would go play a single player game, not an MMO. And there are a lot of vastly better single player RPGs that do a better job of telling a story than AoC does.
And of course once you leave tortage things don't get any better. The rest of the game is made up of instanced zones and invisible walls. Character development is a joke. Plus you have to grind all the way to level 70. With these kinds of game mechanics you might as well be playing the original Everquest all over again. Nothing about this game is as new or as innovative as the developers claimed.
So if IF (and thats a big if) the developers could "fix" this game by getting rid of bugs and adding content, I still don't think it would be worth playing. The whole premise of the game is flawed at its very core. The only way to fix it would be to start over from scratch with a whole new engine, whole new developers and a whole new company producing it. And even then the chances still aren't that great.
The History of the Order of The Golden Shields
I haven't heard such a thing. Especially since BioWare's Star Wars MMO will still be a ways out.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
I haven't heard such a thing. Especially since BioWare's Star Wars MMO will still be a ways out.
1) It's still not confirmed that BioWare's MMO is Star Wars. XD (Just nitpicking here).
2) (and this is really my point), BioWare have announced the title for 2009 back in the day. They started working on it in 2005, maybe earlier. That gives them 4 years Dev Time and ocnsidering they are licensing an engine, not creating one themselves, that is a lot of time.
Cheers.
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
Maybe by next year, maybe never who knows.
My point was if game ever turns out to be great people will come back and that applies for every game.
OK those people who never liked the core mehanics and hated the game from day 1 those wont be back, those who played for a while and like it but started to hate it due bugs and unfinished game those well majority of those would try it again.
Its really never to late for anything in the big picture.
Its to late for Funcom to make good 1st impression and thats basically it.
The first impression is damn important, or how things are handled in the first few months.
Why?
People get driven off for whatever reason. Bugs. Incompleteness of the game. Not liking the gameplay. Etc.
So, you bungle things up at release and not handle things like they should have been and drove off customers.
You drive them away and time goes on and on.
If you take too long in fixing your game's issues, those that have left and had a possible thought on coming back will have moved on for good. There are other MMOs out there. Thoughts on it would have taken the back seat or have been forgotten altogether.
Maybe if Failcom takes their collective heads out of the holes in the ground and fix their game, some will come back.
But the further down the road this "fixed AoC like it should be" is down the road, the fewer people you'll draw back in.
Your "fixed MMO" won't have a second launch. It won't draw the people like it initially did when it went gold.
That is why first impressions and fixing the game like madmen in the first few months is important. You have the attention. You have, especially in AoC's case, the good initial number of people to work with.
If you don't handle it right just like Failcom did, congradulations! You just drove your customers and their regular payments away!
Edit to add: Again, opportunity is finicky. You may only get that one shot to have great success, and for AoC's case, it is undeniably on launch day when it had tremendous momentum.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
I haven't heard such a thing. Especially since BioWare's Star Wars MMO will still be a ways out.
1) It's still not confirmed that BioWare's MMO is Star Wars. XD (Just nitpicking here).
2) (and this is really my point), BioWare have announced the title for 2009 back in the day. They started working on it in 2005, maybe earlier. That gives them 4 years Dev Time and ocnsidering they are licensing an engine, not creating one themselves, that is a lot of time.
Cheers.
That's not true. One of the owners of Bioware (one of the dr's) let is slip that the new MMORPG was based off of Kotor during some show... he basically said ' our new KOTOR mmorpg'. There were video links on the forums for awhile which is why every 'knows' without it being official yet.
Interesting... the news of Gaute leaving resulted in a brief increase of stock price as investors prayed for positive changes, but its reverted back to freefall again as the reality of the situation has sunk in.
Who else from funcom should be fired to buy them a few more days?
Waiting for: A skill-based MMO with Freedom and Consequence.
Woe to thee, the pierce-ed.
This Bioware discussion seems a little off topic... but if we are going to throw down on that subject then I've got a beef with them that just happened today.
I saw this ad on TV for a new Sonic the Hedgehog game. This wasn't a big suprise to me considering how quick to whore out Sega has been ever since they became a third party developer. What was a big suprise is that its apparently being developed by Bioware... or published by them or something. I don't know the details, only that the Bioware logo was all over that ad.
So I have to wonder... what the hell is going on over at Bioware these days? It used to be a solid company that made high quailty PC RPGs. But then they started co-developing their games for both PC and console at the same time. And now I catch them red-handed making a Sonic game of all things! It seems like they will develop any game these days if there is a profit in it. Its like they have become the mercenary of game developers!
So this MMO of theirs... we still don't know anything about it and as another person pointed out, its been in development forever already. At this point I wouldn't be suprised if it was planned for co-release on PC, Xbox, Gameboy and the Sega Dreamcast all at the same time. And it will be about rapping dinosaurs with lightsabers trying to stop some bad guy from Neverwinter Nights who has a scheme to vandalize wikipedia entries about Nike shoes.
The History of the Order of The Golden Shields
http://www.lucasartsbioware.com/ was what I found searching for about 30 seconds.
More like a last ditch effort on the part of Funcom via this clever scheme, which most people seem to believe is a real situation.
Gaute Godager basically volunteered to be a scapegoat for AoC's problems. He's trying to save his game by giving Funcom someone to blame, i.e. "Alright, now that he's gone we can actually make a decent game! It's safe now, everyone, come buy it!" I'd wager Gaute picked up a little extra with his "resignation".
Spoils of War - The quickest way of ending a war is to lose it.
Exactly my opinion. Gaute happened to be the one most people know, so he's an easy one to blame.
it's not Gaute's fault that the game was buggy as hell, it's the fault of the technical lead. It isn't his fault that he was only allowed to make tortage great, but leave the rest of the game half assed. It isn't his fault that Funcom has the most lying and disrespectful customer service... It's all of Funcom management that's responsible for this mess, and the way they have treated Gaute, who is the one that's responsible for the potential the game really had, just shows how little morals this company's management has.
I agree. Most people here think Gaute was evil and now that he's gone, and we have a new awesome game director, everything is perfect!
Leadership is important but you have to realize that the same incompetent coders who did the game in the first place, still work for FC. No amount of leadership can make the FC devs instantly better at what they do. Honestly, I think they just lack the skills to do a good AAA MMO. Many design aspects of AoC are so amateurish it's unbeliavable. And right now it's difficult for FC to hire competent devs because competent devs don't want to work for sinking ship, that is FC.
Removing Gaute was a smart PR move but won't change things as much as people think.
I agree. Most people here think Gaute was evil and now that he's gone, and we have a new awesome game director, everything is perfect!
Leadership is important but you have to realize that the same incompetent coders who did the game in the first place, still work for FC. No amount of leadership can make the FC devs instantly better at what they do. Honestly, I think they just lack the skills to do a good AAA MMO. Many design aspects of AoC are so amateurish it's unbeliavable. And right now it's difficult for FC to hire competent devs because competent devs don't want to work for sinking ship, that is FC.
Removing Gaute was a smart PR move but won't change things as much as people think.
I do think it was mostly management, because IMHO it was mostly bad decision making that made Age of Conan fail so hard. It's not that the actual programmers or designers weren't able to do it, because there's more then enough stuff that shows that they are more than talented enough to do their job, it's just that on the bigger scale, too many parts were left unfinished, or badly integrated with each other. And even though Gaute is probably responsible for that, I'm pretty sure he isn't the only one.
I do think Gaute was mostly responsible for is the actual concept of the game, which is great IMHO. Also, in Tortage his views seemed to work very well, it's really just that they didn't get enough time to do the same thing for the rest of the game as well.
And the decision to release the game this early was most likely made by either marketing, or some of the financial guru's, so that's not Gaute's fault either.
And about bad (non management) employees, sure, the game was buggy, but that's usually not the fault of bad employees, but just the result of a bad techinical director, who doesn't provide the team with the process to write bug free code.