Financial pressure from investors is probably THE biggest influence that was exerted on getting AOC launched. The same happened with other games. That's Life. Sometimes there just is no other choice. So, when that happens all the devs can do is hope to whichever diety they pray to, that there is enough time, money and resources available to pick up the pieces after launch and polish the game as quickly as possible. And just like WoW, FC's devs have the chance of doing that. Only time will tell. It's pointless clinging to the past, pointing fingers, placing blame and therefore writing off a product that has yet a chance to live. Only doomsayers, scaremongers and the stubborn who refuse to admit they could be wrong do that.
You can't blame the investors. They were told AoC would be launched, what.. 2006? What would you do if it was your money? Keep paying them delay after delay? Of course they want some return to their investment.
Number one reason for AoC early launch was BAD PROJECT MANAGEMENT. It is because of bad project management that investors pressured FC and we got that unfinished pile of crap. This is a problem with not only FC but with 99% of MMO developers out there. They are inexperienced and are too optimistic about how fast they get things done. That's why we always have delay after delay.
The golden rule of project management is to estimate how long something is going to take and then double that time.
I'm sorry but to completely exonerate investors of any blame is a little naive to say the least. Yes, they want a return on their investment. But no, they don't always listen to reason and want it sooner than you could achieve. Ever had a boss who didn't have a clue what YOU did and HOW you did it but nevertheless made inaccurate deadlines for you to meet, no matter how many times you told him/her that it couldn't be done in that timescale?
Sometimes you don't have the luxury of doubling any estimates. Sometimes its a case of "Get it done now or you're out of a job tomorrow" attitude. Which is a wrong attitude to have, but it exists all the same.
As I mentioned before, I think it's a little bit of many reasons. The investors are a part of the blame (a major reason), but I wouldn't count it as the most likely top reason they decided upon keeping their date. You are right, with all people, investors become impatient. However, you do have to put some blame on FC for poor knowledge of progress and information on releases, numbers, and the etc. Hell, their financial report hickups that have been going on more then twice are enough of an example. If I was an investor and false numbers were being thrown all over the place on release dates, finance reports, progress updates, and the likewise, I'd be getting worried and impatient. Overall, not just for how they treated their money, I'd put blame on poor management as the top reason as well. And I don't mean to say this as a pessimist, but someone that has been thoroughly viewing the history of this game since pre-launch to now and most likely until it's downfall (whenever that may be, a year from now or a decade from now).
I'm sorry but to completely exonerate investors of any blame is a little naive to say the least. Yes, they want a return on their investment. But no, they don't always listen to reason and want it sooner than you could achieve. Ever had a boss who didn't have a clue what YOU did and HOW you did it but nevertheless made inaccurate deadlines for you to meet, no matter how many times you told him/her that it couldn't be done in that timescale? Sometimes you don't have the luxury of doubling any estimates. Sometimes its a case of "Get it done now or you're out of a job tomorrow" attitude. Which is a wrong attitude to have, but it exists all the same.
I think it's really naive to blame investors. Sure they don't know how the MMO development works and don't know how long it takes to do something but guess what? FC told them AoC was going to launch in 2006!
AoC launch was delayed how many times? 5 times? Now think yourself as an investor. You've given FC a lot of money and every time launch date is getting close, Gaute feeds you some bs story on how they need 6 more months. Now what would you do? Keep on paying them delay after delay, year after year?
It's investors job to give money. It's developers job to develop the game like they promised. Like I said it's all about project management. Sure 1 or 2 delays can happen with any project but 5 times?! All the blame goes to FC management.
Pressure from investors was a REASON why we had unfinished product but you cannot BLAME them for wanting a return to their investment.
People who blame investors for FC's failures are crazy people who don't live in the real world.
----------------------------- Originally posted by Frobner "Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
What really amazed me at launch was that even with pressure to release early some of the most most basic things were not very well done. Anyone remember trying to see where your group was at on the map? The chat function was bad( WAR kind of had problems with this too as far as regional chat went which also baffles me)
When the basics that should have been taken care of months ago are bad it is just a really big indication that there are bigger problems. FC fixed many of the basic things that werent done very well within the first month but then you are left wondering why they should have even had to mess with such a basic mechanism. They could have instead have had more people working on Ymirs so it could launch by the August date they mentioned.
I'm sorry but to completely exonerate investors of any blame is a little naive to say the least. Yes, they want a return on their investment. But no, they don't always listen to reason and want it sooner than you could achieve. Ever had a boss who didn't have a clue what YOU did and HOW you did it but nevertheless made inaccurate deadlines for you to meet, no matter how many times you told him/her that it couldn't be done in that timescale? Sometimes you don't have the luxury of doubling any estimates. Sometimes its a case of "Get it done now or you're out of a job tomorrow" attitude. Which is a wrong attitude to have, but it exists all the same.
I think it's really naive to blame investors. Sure they don't know how the MMO development works and don't know how long it takes to do something but guess what? FC told them AoC was going to launch in 2006!
AoC launch was delayed how many times? 5 times? Now think yourself as an investor. You've given FC a lot of money and every time launch date is getting close, Gaute feeds you some bs story on how they need 6 more months. Now what would you do? Keep on paying them delay after delay, year after year?
It's investors job to give money. It's developers job to develop the game like they promised. Like I said it's all about project management. Sure 1 or 2 delays can happen with any project but 5 times?! All the blame goes to FC management.
Pressure from investors was a REASON why we had unfinished product but you cannot BLAME them for wanting a return to their investment.
People who blame investors for FC's failures are crazy people who don't live in the real world.
Then it looks like you're in agreement with my original post that financial pressure from investors is probably THE biggest influence that was exerted on getting AOC launched. Besides, I think it's pointless dwelling on the past. What's done is done. Its the future that has yet to be written. And personally, I think AOC has a good future ahead of it, IF the dev team can produce what they say is going to happen in the next couple of months. That will be the benchmark for AOC's future.
If this hyped poor pice of a game is doing so well why are up to 70% of its us staff and coustmer support folks being layed off. Of course there is a perfect reason the fanbois will come up with. The game is in deep trouble.
" Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Those Who Would Threaten It " MAGA
If this hyped poor pice of a game is doing so well why are up to 70% of its us staff and coustmer support folks being layed off. Of course there is a perfect reason the fanbois will come up with. The game is in deep trouble.
And one could say that no matter what the reason is, the doomsayers will always discredit it, whether it's the truth or not.
No one is saying that AOC is doing well both in populations or financially. The world is in an economic recession. AOC hasn't done as well as it should. It's natural for a company to make cut backs. This happens all the time in EVERY industry. CS and QA testers are easy to lay off because they're relatively easier to replace later on (when compared to having to train up much more expensive and qualified staff) and the reductions in CS and QA testing staff causes the least amount of disruption to the business needs.
If this hyped poor pice of a game is doing so well why are up to 70% of its us staff and coustmer support folks being layed off. Of course there is a perfect reason the fanbois will come up with. The game is in deep trouble.
And one could say that no matter what the reason is, the doomsayers will always discredit it, whether it's the truth or not.
No one is saying that AOC is doing well both in populations or financially. The world is in an economic recession. AOC hasn't done as well as it should. It's natural for a company to make cut backs. This happens all the time in EVERY industry. CS and QA testers are easy to lay off because they're relatively easier to replace later on (when compared to having to train up much more expensive and qualified staff) and the reductions in CS and QA testing staff causes the least amount of disruption to the business needs.
Actually many people on these forums are saying exatly that. Just look at the post history of some of our regular visitors. Try a forum search using the words "10/10" or "Emissions". If a person read only their posts, he would think AoC in doing better than WoW.
----------------------------- Originally posted by Frobner "Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
If this hyped poor pice of a game is doing so well why are up to 70% of its us staff and coustmer support folks being layed off. Of course there is a perfect reason the fanbois will come up with. The game is in deep trouble.
And one could say that no matter what the reason is, the doomsayers will always discredit it, whether it's the truth or not.
No one is saying that AOC is doing well both in populations or financially. The world is in an economic recession. AOC hasn't done as well as it should. It's natural for a company to make cut backs. This happens all the time in EVERY industry. CS and QA testers are easy to lay off because they're relatively easier to replace later on (when compared to having to train up much more expensive and qualified staff) and the reductions in CS and QA testing staff causes the least amount of disruption to the business needs.
Actually many people on these forums are saying exatly that. Just look at the post history of some of our regular visitors. Try a forum search using the words "10/10" or "Emissions". If a person read only their posts, he would think AoC in doing better than WoW.
Just because someone thinks that in HIS opinion the game is wonderful, this by no means is a good indication of the population or the financial stability of a product. Besides, I think that perhaps you're not giving people enough credit. Anyone who reads the posts in MMORPG.com knows full well to take the extreme views of people on this site with a "pinch of salt". That goes for the "bois" and the doomsayers for whatever game. Common sense tells us that it's good to hear what people say, but its better to take that information and then find out for yourself.
Just wait for next uppdate it will be massive ! Conan is a good game but still not 100% finished, but when next big patch will come this game will rock !
It may well 'rock', but the only people that will know about it will be the high levels still playing the game. This game is utterly dead at the low levels and if you can't get new people in, then it's not going to survive. That's the price you pay for releasing a game that wasn't finished...
It may well 'rock', but the only people that will know about it will be the high levels still playing the game. This game is utterly dead at the low levels and if you can't get new people in, then it's not going to survive. That's the price you pay for releasing a game that wasn't finished...
This entirely depends on which server you start on. Quite a few servers have very healthy population and a continous stream of new players, while others don't. To counter the need of having to search through them all, some of the more healthy servers have been set up as recommended in the server selection screen.
It may well 'rock', but the only people that will know about it will be the high levels still playing the game. This game is utterly dead at the low levels and if you can't get new people in, then it's not going to survive. That's the price you pay for releasing a game that wasn't finished...
This entirely depends on which server you start on. Quite a few servers have very healthy population and a continous stream of new players, while others don't. To counter the need of having to search through them all, some of the more healthy servers have been set up as recommended in the server selection screen.
Agreed, whilst the influx of new players isn't exactly a stampede, there is nevertheless a small stream of new players entering the game. It's quietly growing as well.
The game may be getting better. The first 20 levels werent too bad when it released in May. There were even some different quests for classes. From day 1 until 2 months later the game actually got a lot worse, not better.
The problem for me is that there was little after level 20 and the fact that many abilities didn't even work, and stats did pretty much nothing, and classes weren't even balanced at all, and you couldn't even respec out of broken abilities without spending all your money, it was all garbage. Then the PVP just crashed everyone's computer if there were more than 20 people in the area. WTF?
And talk about linear game play. The Monopoly board game isn't any more linear than AOC except Monopoly had something for you to do all the way around the board. They didn't leave out whole sections and then promise to release them soon, and then fail to do so, and then promise another date and fail at that too.
Funcom had already screwed up one MMO release and their BIG promise was that they had learned their lesson from that release and were doing it right this time.
Funcom had already screwed up one MMO release and their BIG promise was that they had learned their lesson from that release and were doing it right this time.
This is one of the reasons why I believed in FC at launch. I saw many warning signs before the launch but I was just thinking to myself: "They failed with AO and they have learned. There is NO WAY they can fail again!".
Unfortunately I was wrong and AoC became the worst AAA MMO launch in the history. I still can't understand what happened.
----------------------------- Originally posted by Frobner "Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
LOL at the people who still support Funcom. The game may be getting better. The first 20 levels werent too bad when it released in May. There were even some different quests for classes. From day 1 until 2 months later the game actually got a lot worse, not better. The problem for me is that there was little after level 20 and the fact that many abilities didn't even work, and stats did pretty much nothing, and classes weren't even balanced at all, and you couldn't even respec out of broken abilities without spending all your money, it was all garbage. Then the PVP just crashed everyone's computer if there were more than 20 people in the area. WTF? And talk about linear game play. The Monopoly board game isn't any more linear than AOC except Monopoly had something for you to do all the way around the board. They didn't leave out whole sections and then promise to release them soon, and then fail to do so, and then promise another date and fail at that too. Funcom had already screwed up one MMO release and their BIG promise was that they had learned their lesson from that release and were doing it right this time.
I don't think it's entirely fair to still be discussing the situation at start-up, a lot has been achieved since then. But the game still has major problems, not least a lack of new subscribers. It may well go the way of Tabula Rasa before long...
It may well 'rock', but the only people that will know about it will be the high levels still playing the game. This game is utterly dead at the low levels and if you can't get new people in, then it's not going to survive. That's the price you pay for releasing a game that wasn't finished...
This entirely depends on which server you start on. Quite a few servers have very healthy population and a continous stream of new players, while others don't. To counter the need of having to search through them all, some of the more healthy servers have been set up as recommended in the server selection screen.
Agreed, whilst the influx of new players isn't exactly a stampede, there is nevertheless a small stream of new players entering the game. It's quietly growing as well.
Just as there is a small stream of people leaving the game as well....
The game is starting to reach its equilibrium - a few new people coming on board, while a few people leave to go elsewhere. Until they merge servers, I believe they are probably still losing more than they gain by at least a small amount.
It's been a little amusing watching the faithful turn every "I've just resubscribed" post on the AoC forum into hundreds of thousands of people returning to the game in their minds. Just as one "I quit" thread doesn't mean that there are only 12 people left subscribing.
AoC is becoming a game with a playerbase its design can attract. It's not a world beater - it's a niche game. Given the IP, number of servers, and the advertising, I think they planned on a much larger playerbase, but the game as designed just doesn't appeal to as many people as they would have liked. It's a poor MMORPG.
I don't think it's entirely fair to still be discussing the situation at start-up, a lot has been achieved since then. But the game still has major problems, not least a lack of new subscribers. It may well go the way of Tabula Rasa before long...
It's more than fair when the closest FC came to admitting that fact was saying "launch could have gone better, but every MMO starts out bumpy"
I can't muster much sympathy with statements like "A few things didn't make it into launch" when it is obvious they hadn't even gone father than concepts on paper.
As long as the Spinning continues, they will be getting called out on it every time.
Just as there is a small stream of people leaving the game as well.... The game is starting to reach its equilibrium - a few new people coming on board, while a few people leave to go elsewhere. Until they merge servers, I believe they are probably still losing more than they gain by at least a small amount. It's been a little amusing watching the faithful turn every "I've just resubscribed" post on the AoC forum into hundreds of thousands of people returning to the game in their minds. Just as one "I quit" thread doesn't mean that there are only 12 people left subscribing. AoC is becoming a game with a playerbase its design can attract. It's not a world beater - it's a niche game. Given the IP, number of servers, and the advertising, I think they planned on a much larger playerbase, but the game as designed just doesn't appeal to as many people as they would have liked. It's a poor MMORPG.
Going by what you are saying there are only WoW, Lineage 2 and a couple f2p mmorpgs and that's it. All of the other games - Loto, EQ2, EVE, VG, etc... - with their 100k to 300k players are all poor mmorpgs.
Just as there is a small stream of people leaving the game as well.... The game is starting to reach its equilibrium - a few new people coming on board, while a few people leave to go elsewhere. Until they merge servers, I believe they are probably still losing more than they gain by at least a small amount. It's been a little amusing watching the faithful turn every "I've just resubscribed" post on the AoC forum into hundreds of thousands of people returning to the game in their minds. Just as one "I quit" thread doesn't mean that there are only 12 people left subscribing. AoC is becoming a game with a playerbase its design can attract. It's not a world beater - it's a niche game. Given the IP, number of servers, and the advertising, I think they planned on a much larger playerbase, but the game as designed just doesn't appeal to as many people as they would have liked. It's a poor MMORPG.
Going by what you are saying there are only WoW, Lineage 2 and a couple f2p mmorpgs and that's it. All of the other games - Loto, EQ2, EVE, VG, etc... - with their 100k to 300k players are all poor mmorpgs.
AoC isnt a poor game because it has fewer than 100k paying subs. It has fewer than 100k paying subs because it is a poor game.
I don't care how fun this game may become down the road once it is released.....it shocks me that people are still willing to support this company by giving them money after what they did to the community.
"The monsters are tough. I was looking for a challenge, but these things are just too damn smart." -DF Beta Tester
"If people were dismissing it, then they wouldn't be talking about it. The well-meaning gamers root for efforts that try to raise the bar. So who's left? It's so easy being a skeptic." -Tasos
In danger of sounding like a fanboi, AoC has really dominated my gaming time for the last 2 months and I have been playing since launch. I have zero bugs or any major issues plus the new content and changes have really changed the game. I joined an active guild and there is tons to do. Population has dramatically risen on our server and another sign is seeing multiple posts in global chat LFG in noob areas. Plus a lot new questions and guild applications coming through not to mention the market being very active. So like or not like the game is really coming of age and doing well imo. The mere fact the game is doing a load better should not be offensive.
Next week our guild is attacking an enemy guild keep next week and large scale combat is something else in this game. total carnage
In danger of sounding like a fanboi, AoC has really dominated my gaming time for the last 2 months and I have been playing since launch... ... Population has dramatically risen on our server and another sign is seeing multiple posts in global chat LFG in noob areas... ... Next week our guild is attacking an enemy guild keep next week and large scale combat is something else in this game. total carnage
You do not sound like a "fanboi" to me just because you like the game. Saying that AoC has dominated your gaming time for the last 2 months just sound like you express your own feelings/opinion - A "fanboi" would probably have expressed that as: AoC has dominated the entire MMO-scene for the past 2 months - FACT!!!111!!!. (There is a subtle difference that seems to escape a few posters here )
However: When you talk about a dramatic rise in population it does sound like a >100% rise which I find hard to believe. Global chat just came with the latest patch didnt it?
I am trying not to joke about the patience of AoC subscribers. I really am... But you make the attack on an enemy keep sound like something you have to book a week in advance? Is that really how it works?
We dont need casuals in our games!!! Errm... Well we DO need casuals to fund and populate our games - But the games should be all about "hardcore" because: We dont need casuals in our games!!! (repeat ad infinitum)
AoC isnt a poor game because it has fewer than 100k paying subs. It has fewer than 100k paying subs because it is a poor game.
Post some proof of the less than 100k subs or stop trolling.
Ok at the time the game launched and shortly there after the stock price was about 55$/share.
At 800 units sold give or take a few either way, the stock was near 55$/share.
800,000 / 55 = 14545.454545454545454545454545455
Today the stock closed at 3.25$/share.
SO :
3.25 x 14545.454545454545454545454545455 = 47272.727
Add a few subs, even though we know the trend in AoC is a sub bleed not a base building one.
Simplistic? Sure, but there is more effort here than any of the other AOC HAS 200K + PEOPLE posts I've seen recently.
IF, as you would have us believe, FUNCOM is doing great and so is AOC, why doesnt Funcom just release this information and be done with it????
I'm not great with this stuff but with the global economics it would seem that everyone's stock is falling. I'd would venture a guess that you can't base subs purely from a viewpoint of the stocks. Obviously, stocks falling would most likely indicate a loss in subs but i doubt its a simple stock price * x to get sub numbers.
------------------ Playing:LotRO Waiting for: anything better than whats out now.
Comments
You can't blame the investors. They were told AoC would be launched, what.. 2006? What would you do if it was your money? Keep paying them delay after delay? Of course they want some return to their investment.
Number one reason for AoC early launch was BAD PROJECT MANAGEMENT. It is because of bad project management that investors pressured FC and we got that unfinished pile of crap. This is a problem with not only FC but with 99% of MMO developers out there. They are inexperienced and are too optimistic about how fast they get things done. That's why we always have delay after delay.
The golden rule of project management is to estimate how long something is going to take and then double that time.
I'm sorry but to completely exonerate investors of any blame is a little naive to say the least. Yes, they want a return on their investment. But no, they don't always listen to reason and want it sooner than you could achieve. Ever had a boss who didn't have a clue what YOU did and HOW you did it but nevertheless made inaccurate deadlines for you to meet, no matter how many times you told him/her that it couldn't be done in that timescale?
Sometimes you don't have the luxury of doubling any estimates. Sometimes its a case of "Get it done now or you're out of a job tomorrow" attitude. Which is a wrong attitude to have, but it exists all the same.
As I mentioned before, I think it's a little bit of many reasons. The investors are a part of the blame (a major reason), but I wouldn't count it as the most likely top reason they decided upon keeping their date. You are right, with all people, investors become impatient. However, you do have to put some blame on FC for poor knowledge of progress and information on releases, numbers, and the etc. Hell, their financial report hickups that have been going on more then twice are enough of an example. If I was an investor and false numbers were being thrown all over the place on release dates, finance reports, progress updates, and the likewise, I'd be getting worried and impatient. Overall, not just for how they treated their money, I'd put blame on poor management as the top reason as well. And I don't mean to say this as a pessimist, but someone that has been thoroughly viewing the history of this game since pre-launch to now and most likely until it's downfall (whenever that may be, a year from now or a decade from now).
I think it's really naive to blame investors. Sure they don't know how the MMO development works and don't know how long it takes to do something but guess what? FC told them AoC was going to launch in 2006!
AoC launch was delayed how many times? 5 times? Now think yourself as an investor. You've given FC a lot of money and every time launch date is getting close, Gaute feeds you some bs story on how they need 6 more months. Now what would you do? Keep on paying them delay after delay, year after year?
It's investors job to give money. It's developers job to develop the game like they promised. Like I said it's all about project management. Sure 1 or 2 delays can happen with any project but 5 times?! All the blame goes to FC management.
Pressure from investors was a REASON why we had unfinished product but you cannot BLAME them for wanting a return to their investment.
People who blame investors for FC's failures are crazy people who don't live in the real world.
-----------------------------
Originally posted by Frobner
"Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
What really amazed me at launch was that even with pressure to release early some of the most most basic things were not very well done. Anyone remember trying to see where your group was at on the map? The chat function was bad( WAR kind of had problems with this too as far as regional chat went which also baffles me)
When the basics that should have been taken care of months ago are bad it is just a really big indication that there are bigger problems. FC fixed many of the basic things that werent done very well within the first month but then you are left wondering why they should have even had to mess with such a basic mechanism. They could have instead have had more people working on Ymirs so it could launch by the August date they mentioned.
I think it's really naive to blame investors. Sure they don't know how the MMO development works and don't know how long it takes to do something but guess what? FC told them AoC was going to launch in 2006!
AoC launch was delayed how many times? 5 times? Now think yourself as an investor. You've given FC a lot of money and every time launch date is getting close, Gaute feeds you some bs story on how they need 6 more months. Now what would you do? Keep on paying them delay after delay, year after year?
It's investors job to give money. It's developers job to develop the game like they promised. Like I said it's all about project management. Sure 1 or 2 delays can happen with any project but 5 times?! All the blame goes to FC management.
Pressure from investors was a REASON why we had unfinished product but you cannot BLAME them for wanting a return to their investment.
People who blame investors for FC's failures are crazy people who don't live in the real world.
Then it looks like you're in agreement with my original post that financial pressure from investors is probably THE biggest influence that was exerted on getting AOC launched. Besides, I think it's pointless dwelling on the past. What's done is done. Its the future that has yet to be written. And personally, I think AOC has a good future ahead of it, IF the dev team can produce what they say is going to happen in the next couple of months. That will be the benchmark for AOC's future.
Top 10 Most Misused Words in MMO's
If this hyped poor pice of a game is doing so well why are up to 70% of its us staff and coustmer support folks being layed off. Of course there is a perfect reason the fanbois will come up with. The game is in deep trouble.
MAGA
And one could say that no matter what the reason is, the doomsayers will always discredit it, whether it's the truth or not.
No one is saying that AOC is doing well both in populations or financially. The world is in an economic recession. AOC hasn't done as well as it should. It's natural for a company to make cut backs. This happens all the time in EVERY industry. CS and QA testers are easy to lay off because they're relatively easier to replace later on (when compared to having to train up much more expensive and qualified staff) and the reductions in CS and QA testing staff causes the least amount of disruption to the business needs.
Top 10 Most Misused Words in MMO's
And one could say that no matter what the reason is, the doomsayers will always discredit it, whether it's the truth or not.
No one is saying that AOC is doing well both in populations or financially. The world is in an economic recession. AOC hasn't done as well as it should. It's natural for a company to make cut backs. This happens all the time in EVERY industry. CS and QA testers are easy to lay off because they're relatively easier to replace later on (when compared to having to train up much more expensive and qualified staff) and the reductions in CS and QA testing staff causes the least amount of disruption to the business needs.
Actually many people on these forums are saying exatly that. Just look at the post history of some of our regular visitors. Try a forum search using the words "10/10" or "Emissions". If a person read only their posts, he would think AoC in doing better than WoW.
-----------------------------
Originally posted by Frobner
"Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
And one could say that no matter what the reason is, the doomsayers will always discredit it, whether it's the truth or not.
No one is saying that AOC is doing well both in populations or financially. The world is in an economic recession. AOC hasn't done as well as it should. It's natural for a company to make cut backs. This happens all the time in EVERY industry. CS and QA testers are easy to lay off because they're relatively easier to replace later on (when compared to having to train up much more expensive and qualified staff) and the reductions in CS and QA testing staff causes the least amount of disruption to the business needs.
Actually many people on these forums are saying exatly that. Just look at the post history of some of our regular visitors. Try a forum search using the words "10/10" or "Emissions". If a person read only their posts, he would think AoC in doing better than WoW.
Just because someone thinks that in HIS opinion the game is wonderful, this by no means is a good indication of the population or the financial stability of a product. Besides, I think that perhaps you're not giving people enough credit. Anyone who reads the posts in MMORPG.com knows full well to take the extreme views of people on this site with a "pinch of salt". That goes for the "bois" and the doomsayers for whatever game. Common sense tells us that it's good to hear what people say, but its better to take that information and then find out for yourself.
Top 10 Most Misused Words in MMO's
It may well 'rock', but the only people that will know about it will be the high levels still playing the game. This game is utterly dead at the low levels and if you can't get new people in, then it's not going to survive. That's the price you pay for releasing a game that wasn't finished...
This entirely depends on which server you start on. Quite a few servers have very healthy population and a continous stream of new players, while others don't. To counter the need of having to search through them all, some of the more healthy servers have been set up as recommended in the server selection screen.
This entirely depends on which server you start on. Quite a few servers have very healthy population and a continous stream of new players, while others don't. To counter the need of having to search through them all, some of the more healthy servers have been set up as recommended in the server selection screen.
Agreed, whilst the influx of new players isn't exactly a stampede, there is nevertheless a small stream of new players entering the game. It's quietly growing as well.
Top 10 Most Misused Words in MMO's
LOL at the people who still support Funcom.
The game may be getting better. The first 20 levels werent too bad when it released in May. There were even some different quests for classes. From day 1 until 2 months later the game actually got a lot worse, not better.
The problem for me is that there was little after level 20 and the fact that many abilities didn't even work, and stats did pretty much nothing, and classes weren't even balanced at all, and you couldn't even respec out of broken abilities without spending all your money, it was all garbage. Then the PVP just crashed everyone's computer if there were more than 20 people in the area. WTF?
And talk about linear game play. The Monopoly board game isn't any more linear than AOC except Monopoly had something for you to do all the way around the board. They didn't leave out whole sections and then promise to release them soon, and then fail to do so, and then promise another date and fail at that too.
Funcom had already screwed up one MMO release and their BIG promise was that they had learned their lesson from that release and were doing it right this time.
This is one of the reasons why I believed in FC at launch. I saw many warning signs before the launch but I was just thinking to myself: "They failed with AO and they have learned. There is NO WAY they can fail again!".
Unfortunately I was wrong and AoC became the worst AAA MMO launch in the history. I still can't understand what happened.
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Originally posted by Frobner
"Massive sieges" "mounted combat" and "spellweaving" are just few words that spring to mind when I hear the word AOC.... But the word FAILURE will always top the list.
I don't think it's entirely fair to still be discussing the situation at start-up, a lot has been achieved since then. But the game still has major problems, not least a lack of new subscribers. It may well go the way of Tabula Rasa before long...
This entirely depends on which server you start on. Quite a few servers have very healthy population and a continous stream of new players, while others don't. To counter the need of having to search through them all, some of the more healthy servers have been set up as recommended in the server selection screen.
Agreed, whilst the influx of new players isn't exactly a stampede, there is nevertheless a small stream of new players entering the game. It's quietly growing as well.
Just as there is a small stream of people leaving the game as well....
The game is starting to reach its equilibrium - a few new people coming on board, while a few people leave to go elsewhere. Until they merge servers, I believe they are probably still losing more than they gain by at least a small amount.
It's been a little amusing watching the faithful turn every "I've just resubscribed" post on the AoC forum into hundreds of thousands of people returning to the game in their minds. Just as one "I quit" thread doesn't mean that there are only 12 people left subscribing.
AoC is becoming a game with a playerbase its design can attract. It's not a world beater - it's a niche game. Given the IP, number of servers, and the advertising, I think they planned on a much larger playerbase, but the game as designed just doesn't appeal to as many people as they would have liked. It's a poor MMORPG.
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.
It's more than fair when the closest FC came to admitting that fact was saying "launch could have gone better, but every MMO starts out bumpy"
I can't muster much sympathy with statements like "A few things didn't make it into launch" when it is obvious they hadn't even gone father than concepts on paper.
As long as the Spinning continues, they will be getting called out on it every time.
Going by what you are saying there are only WoW, Lineage 2 and a couple f2p mmorpgs and that's it. All of the other games - Loto, EQ2, EVE, VG, etc... - with their 100k to 300k players are all poor mmorpgs.
Going by what you are saying there are only WoW, Lineage 2 and a couple f2p mmorpgs and that's it. All of the other games - Loto, EQ2, EVE, VG, etc... - with their 100k to 300k players are all poor mmorpgs.
AoC isnt a poor game because it has fewer than 100k paying subs. It has fewer than 100k paying subs because it is a poor game.
Post some proof of the less than 100k subs or stop trolling.
Post some proof of the less than 100k subs or stop trolling.
70% of U.S. Devs and support staff layed off.
MAGA
I don't care how fun this game may become down the road once it is released.....it shocks me that people are still willing to support this company by giving them money after what they did to the community.
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Darkfall Releases on: February 25th, 2009
Darkfall Recap of everything that has happened the last 3 months: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/213296
"The monsters are tough. I was looking for a challenge, but these things are just too damn smart." -DF Beta Tester
"If people were dismissing it, then they wouldn't be talking about it. The well-meaning gamers root for efforts that try to raise the bar. So who's left? It's so easy being a skeptic." -Tasos
In danger of sounding like a fanboi, AoC has really dominated my gaming time for the last 2 months and I have been playing since launch. I have zero bugs or any major issues plus the new content and changes have really changed the game. I joined an active guild and there is tons to do. Population has dramatically risen on our server and another sign is seeing multiple posts in global chat LFG in noob areas. Plus a lot new questions and guild applications coming through not to mention the market being very active. So like or not like the game is really coming of age and doing well imo. The mere fact the game is doing a load better should not be offensive.
Next week our guild is attacking an enemy guild keep next week and large scale combat is something else in this game. total carnage
You do not sound like a "fanboi" to me just because you like the game. Saying that AoC has dominated your gaming time for the last 2 months just sound like you express your own feelings/opinion - A "fanboi" would probably have expressed that as: AoC has dominated the entire MMO-scene for the past 2 months - FACT!!!111!!!. (There is a subtle difference that seems to escape a few posters here
)
However: When you talk about a dramatic rise in population it does sound like a >100% rise which I find hard to believe. Global chat just came with the latest patch didnt it?
I am trying not to joke about the patience of AoC subscribers. I really am... But you make the attack on an enemy keep sound like something you have to book a week in advance? Is that really how it works?
We dont need casuals in our games!!! Errm... Well we DO need casuals to fund and populate our games - But the games should be all about "hardcore" because: We dont need casuals in our games!!!
(repeat ad infinitum)
Post some proof of the less than 100k subs or stop trolling.
Ok at the time the game launched and shortly there after the stock price was about 55$/share.
At 800 units sold give or take a few either way, the stock was near 55$/share.
800,000 / 55 = 14545.454545454545454545454545455
Today the stock closed at 3.25$/share.
SO :
3.25 x 14545.454545454545454545454545455 = 47272.727
Add a few subs, even though we know the trend in AoC is a sub bleed not a base building one.
Simplistic? Sure, but there is more effort here than any of the other AOC HAS 200K + PEOPLE posts I've seen recently.
IF, as you would have us believe, FUNCOM is doing great and so is AOC, why doesnt Funcom just release this information and be done with it????
Post some proof of the less than 100k subs or stop trolling.
Ok at the time the game launched and shortly there after the stock price was about 55$/share.
At 800 units sold give or take a few either way, the stock was near 55$/share.
800,000 / 55 = 14545.454545454545454545454545455
Today the stock closed at 3.25$/share.
SO :
3.25 x 14545.454545454545454545454545455 = 47272.727
Add a few subs, even though we know the trend in AoC is a sub bleed not a base building one.
Simplistic? Sure, but there is more effort here than any of the other AOC HAS 200K + PEOPLE posts I've seen recently.
IF, as you would have us believe, FUNCOM is doing great and so is AOC, why doesnt Funcom just release this information and be done with it????
I'm not great with this stuff but with the global economics it would seem that everyone's stock is falling. I'd would venture a guess that you can't base subs purely from a viewpoint of the stocks. Obviously, stocks falling would most likely indicate a loss in subs but i doubt its a simple stock price * x to get sub numbers.
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Playing:LotRO
Waiting for: anything better than whats out now.