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what is wrong with some players?
madtheblind
Member Posts: 3
hi all, never posted on forums before ,but something really bugged me yesterday . I was questing in Moria and saw a fellow player ( shadowbourn ) fighting a mob. As i thought he could use a hand i waded in and kick the mobs butt. Then in IMS came a massage from the player i helped....was it ty m8?..cheers friend?...no it was this...."before you go charging in to help why dont you take the time out to ask i its needed?"..Asking what i did wrong i got the reply that i was stealing his xp???...Now if that was the case he couldve just said ty but i dont need help..I politely told him what i thought of his manners :P, so then he tells me im reporting you m8 and your in my ignore list (ill miss him:(..lol)..so in OOC i told him he was the most ungrateful rudest player ive ever met..this was met with no less than 12 other players telling me he has been rude to them for helping too? and lecturing them on respect??hmmmm..so if you ever see that mentionedplayer dont help him let him die and pay him the respect he so rightly has earned.BTW his comments have only stregthened my beliefs ,that 99.9% of players of lotro are great and funny and play to enjoy not to become smeagal..
Comments
This has been a bit of debate on Lotro for a while , he shouldn't have been rude about it's not the norm imo.However as far as I know he would lose some XP as he has had assistance with the mob.Even if he reports you I can't see anything coming of it , you'd have to be harrassing him for that.
The player in question should just go on your ignore list and if you see him again just let him die lol . sounds like a pratt anyhow.
Sadly, this is an inditement of life in general. No matter how good an online community is, you are always going to get rude and unpleasent people. It's a shame, but I doubt that things will change in our lifetime.
However, this has prompted me to think of another question, and so I'll make a post for it, so as not to de-rail this one.
If it helps, you can try out the role-play specific European server called Laurelin, which I have found to have a more pleasent community. In particular you could check out our kin; Order of the Free Souls, which promotes a close-knit, family-orientated feeling, with kin mates always willing to help out others. My main toon is called Turkonan by the way, just in case you want to drop by and send me a tell.
Well its pretty anoying when someone "helps" you when you clearly dont need any help and you just loose xp from it but his behavior is still not ok and was very rude.
But I think its far worse to name and shame people in OOC or in this forum...
If WoW = The Beatles
and WAR = Led Zeppelin
Then LotrO = Pink Floyd
I can vouch for EU Laurelin , best server out there
Well unfortunately some people have not been raised very well.
You know what? It's 1 or 2 mobs, the difference in xp loss is minimal to nil when you consider that this entire game oozes xp. And quite frankly, I've done the same thing in Moria several times when I've seen that someone obviously needed help and they've thanked me.
I have also had an add or two "too much" and have had people do the same. All the person had to do was say "thanks, but I really didn't need the help, but I appreciate the gesture".
People have no manners anymore.
OP, you can help me whenever you want, I appreciate there are people like you still out there. Don't lose heart.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I'm on EU Laurelin and I've never encountered anything quite as rude as that. Fair enough he'd lose a wee bit of XP but the mines are replete with XP. This Shadowbourn character is a downright cad for treating you like that.
You fail to mention which server you are on OP. If it's Laurelin (which I doubt) I'll be having words with the ungrateful sod should I see him.
I had a similar incident when I was new to the game and level 40. I had no idea that hitting another player's mob halved their xp. They were quite rude about it. Then the same rude player deliberately jumped in and killed the named mob I needed for a quest and I had just spent 5 minutes clearing the nearby mobs.
On the other hand, in Moria, I have had numerous players halve my xp by hitting a mob that had next to no hitpoints left while I had nearly full hitpoints. It was even more frustrating on my guardian who has low dps and takes a long time to kill a mob. Given Moria is for experienced players (L50+) who know this halved xp, it was quite annoying.
Things seem to have settled down now that players have spread out into other areas in Moria.
I remember the similar threads in the forum long time ago.
First, we do not know the motive to help the other players. But the debate ended up with results.
1. Without communication in advance to attack the other player's target, especially when the other player do not have any difficulty to kill his/her target, if you attacked the target, it don't matter what you call it, your help is not necessary.
2. If you seen the other player almost get killed by his/her target, and you have no time to chat, you have to attack the target to save the player at once, usually, he/she may give a thank to you.
3. If the other player are higher level than you then it is difficult for anyone to accept from a lower level help.
4. In odd situation, higher damage player may hijacked the kill from the other player. And you don't want it happen if you helped the others. So, do not overkilled.
5. A group of people run by and slash everything on their way, and you'd doubt for their motive to help you.
It's not conduct of behavior, enjoy your gameplay.
I think the simple remedy for this would be if Turbine mentioned something about this xp loss in the rules. I've been playing Lotro for several months now, and I was not aware that this happened until I read this post.
Even so, anyone with half a brain would realise that the motive for another player helping to kill a mob is not for the pittance they would thus receive for xp, but because they were trying to be kind and help them. Rather than acting like a total dick, and sending a tell complaining about them trying to ninja a few poxy xp, they should send a tell explaining to the person that their intervention has unduly cost them some xp.
This would then enlighten much of the cummunity to this issue. I think I can be fairly sure that nobody is really intending to 'poach' a few xp points by helping someone kill a mob!
I remember something like this happening to me,I had a minstrel and thought the guy needed a hand after we were done he gave me some abuse....and ok I gve him some back,I just couldnt understand that I had helped him and he was upset,I checked the forums and found that(something of the quote i can remember) "it is always polite to ask 1st if the person would like you too help them before you help"
I found this insane in a mmo game and 1 of the reasons I left,some guy is getting mauled but before I can help I should whisper him 1st to ask and hope before he dies he can say yes and then hope I can still help him?
Not exactly a mmo game when you cant help another player.
If someone had came up to me in 1980 when I was on my Atari 2600 and said we will be playing games with thousands of people at the same time.I guess my response would have been,"but I only have 2 joysticks"
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/235780/page/8
XP loss on one mob due to assist is really not getting worked up over unless the person was intentionally stealing your kill, but then it's the act that is aggravating, not the penalty. Personally, I do a lot of solo play and it really bugs me when someone comes along and joins in assuming I need help or something, especially when it's obvious I don't. If I'm by myself and need or want help, I will yell "help" or I will deal with it and suffer the loss. I appreciate the gesture, but any reasonable player that pays attention to the battle should be able to tell whether the person needs help or not short of them asking for it. If I think someone else needs help, I will usually watch for a few to see if the person really looks like they need it or not; otherwise, they can ask for it.
That said, I do agree that he didn't have to be so rude about the issue. As much as is bugs me when someone does it, I'm not going to get all butthurt and go reporting them. I'll just give a quick thx and move on. I mean come on people, it's just a freaking game.
It's been very crowded in Moria and there have been many situations like this. The other day I was taking on an easy mob and had almost full health. Buddy steps in the give me a hand. I'm thinking wtf and was pretty annoyed. Then I reminded myself that he was just trying to help and probably only cost me 80 XP. Not exactly something to get upset about.
Moria is a hard place and I see people running around with "I just died" dread icons all the time. There are people who do not help. I try to avoid helping people in case they don't want help but if i think someone is in trouble I'll stay a few seconds to watch what happens. I'm a captain so I can always buff without reducing their XP, or can pop a heal if they are in trouble.
sorry my post was pre-moria,infact it wasnt long after the game got released,I think maybe a month or 2,it really did put me off the fact I couldnt just "help" someone,as a healer that is 1 thing I like in a mmo.
If someone had came up to me in 1980 when I was on my Atari 2600 and said we will be playing games with thousands of people at the same time.I guess my response would have been,"but I only have 2 joysticks"
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/235780/page/8
I like LOTRO, and I like Turbine as a company but some of the bone head rules they implement achives nothing but Grief for the community. Some one wacks a mob first the mob, loot and the XP is thiers Why is that so complicated?
Just to be clear, some folks above me seem to be confused on this point:
If you attack a mob that someone else has already tagged, it will be gray to you and you will get 0 XP. They will get most of the XP from a regular kill, all of the loot, and full kill credit for deeds or quests.
I haven't noticed any drop in legendary item XP when someone tags something I've engaged, but then I haven't been paying very close attention. When I have to kill 100 animals to level my bow I don't really pay much attention to any single kill. I certainly don't lose my shit if someone happens to tag a mob while I'm on it.
I don't want to write this, and you don't want to read it. But now it's too late for both of us.
I have a kinmate who is like that, he does not work and spends probably 12 hours a day ingame and he is scared he will lose 50 xp or something. Don't understand it myself. <boggled> He got all po'ed when I laughed at him about it but he still does it as far as I know. If you see me fighting and want to help it does not bother me in the least, some people are just weird about it though.
By the way I do "drive by" heals all the time witrh my minstrel, never had anyone complain about that.
I miss DAoC
I don't quite understand what this shadowbourne player did wrong. How is saying, "before you go charging in to help why don't you take the time out to ask if its needed?" rude? It seems completely logical to me. If he didn't need help, and he would lose xp from you lending assistance, it's rude FOR YOU to help.
You must remember that many games have assholes that run around kill-stealing others, and it's not uncommon for someone to respond in a manner that isn't exactly kind when this happens. It's normal, and it's not necessarily a reflection of "how the person was raised" or any of that shit.
OP, get a grip and stop defacing others on OCC. You decided to play hero, and since you didn't get the response you yearned for, you now deface the player on a forum?
And you call him rude...
yea you know i dont feel sorry for these idiots that are like that, i tell you what in sometime down the road in the future when he is fighting again and you come upon him and he actually does need help, you say to the guy, F off i dont want to steal your xp LOL that will teach his immature little punk a$$.
It's a judgment call in the moment. Look, if you are fighting a mob and you look like you are in trouble, it seems a bit ridiculous to have to stop and ask. The loss of xp is so minimal in a game where xp oozes out of every pore that if the fighting player put it in perspective then he should at least understand that it was to help.
Now, if you have just started fighting a mob, and someone mows it down, well sure, that is rude on the part of the "helper".
Because then what's going to happen? You are going to pass someone by and they are going to look like you they need help, you are going to pass by and they are going to give you the "what the heck, you could have helped" speech.
It's situational as it should be. People are just going to have to give a bit on both ends. And in the end, in a story sense, it makes sense to be helping the people on your side fight the "enemy".
But since I've not noticed any loss of xp from someone helping me, I welcome it when I need it. Have some people gone overboard and essentially offered help when I didn't need it? Sure, but I just move on and no harm no foul.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
It depends on the player and the game.
Back in the old games kill stealing was a problem and proper ettiquet was to ask first before jumping in and helping otherwise it was view as griefing.
Now in LotR, if I recall, if you jump in and "help" someone, they don't lose any XP so no real harm BUT there are older players who just don't like that because that's how they were "brought up" in MMO's so to speak.
Personally I hate it when someone jumps in on my mob. I played several MMO where that was basically a taunt and a challenge. I have to "tone done" in PvE games where the other player probably doesn't mean anything by it and thinks they are just being helpful vs a game like L2 where the other player is being a d*ckhead and trying to provoke me into a fight.
And that's exactly it. In a game like L2, for the most part, every mob means you are one (lol.. who am I kidding.. .01 after about 4) percent closer to getting your next lvl. Someone messes with your mobs and it's a good ol' fight or even a war.
but games like LOTRO really are more about story and not about pvp competiton in any form.
Problem is that there are a whole lot'o dickheads running around who would like nothing better than to attack everything you attack and laugh while doing it. But I find that though LOTRO has them, it seems that for the most part there are really people who just want to help. And as there isn't any xp loss for the person "in trouble" for the most part it can be taken at face value.
I mean, I have helped many people who were over run by mobs but sometimes I waited a bit too long to see if they were in trouble only to take out the last mob about .5 seconds after he was defeated. Of course I could ask but in reality when you are trying to juggle several mobs, are you really going to take your hands off of everything only to hit "enter" and type "yes please help".
And of course the nice thing about L2 was that you could click to some far off place on the map and then type "help", where in a game like LOTRO the best you can do is hope you are facing in a decent direction, hit autorun and hope that you just don't run into a wall ; )
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
It's shocking how many people don't understand that even if you buff someone while passing them in LOTRO you take away their experience, you gain NOTHING, that includes healing them, debuffing their mob or attacking it, all you did was grief them, period, no 2 ways around it. You want to save someone? Go find a friend... leave strangers to do what they like, even if it is to die.
http://lorebook.lotro.com/wiki/Mechanics:"Assist"_Exp_Penalty
"So, if you're solo and another solo player "assists" you, then you get exactly 50% of the experience you would have normally gotten."
I actually can't stand people helping me that aren't with me. I am about ready t go off next time someone cuts in on my mob. I understand an accidental aoe but I'm not seeing that - I'm seeing people totally oblivious to what they are doing that stand around waiting on a thank you. You don't deserve any thanks for being an ass.
#1 reason the xp loss
Ok, at max level we could all help each other but now - you cut into my xp - we aren't going to be pals afterward.
#2 done at the wrong time
If I am no where near even half morale, GET AWAY, this is my mob and my class - I will do it - just because I don't kill as fast as you expect me to, I am going to be fine.
#3 messes up testing
I can't count how many times tonight I was working on a mob to test my new pet or to see what these vague legendary skill alter and some nimbleboy comes along with his wee bow and just "has" to help me. I didn't ask you to help and you just mess up my testing - thanks, now I have to start over, ass.
#4 groups are the worst
What makes a group think it's admirable to run past my mob, dot/melee it up on their way thru. Once again - if I don't ask you - don't get involved.
#5 WHAT MAKES YOU THINK SOMEONE NEEDS YOU !!
STAY OUT OF BUSINESS THAT IS NOT YOURS, I WONT THANK YOU AND IM TIRED OF YOUR FLIPPANT ATTITUDE THAT
I SHOULD BE THANKFUL THAT YOU ARE NOT LETTING ME SOLO, THE THING THAT I HAVE CHOSEN TO DO AT THIS MOMENT.
I decided earlier that the next time someone tags my mob I'll follow them around and tag theirs also. Im really annoyed by this if you can't tell.
Be real happy you don't touch my mob, I may decide to ruin your whole week and get banned
In my opinion, is a good idea to ask before you help. Maybe he wanted to beat the mob alone and you ruined his figh. I always ask before I help someone. You should think that, what you see like an Aid, someother may see it as an interrupt.
this points out a problem on pve-designed games. there is no option for revenge. if it were UO, that guy, instead of being rude, would have just started attacking the OP, setting the topic on a much more fair manner.
the other way is also possible, if someone is rude to you, instead of adding him to the "ignore" list, you can pursue and hunt him and then steal his belongings. to me, that is the best way to settle discussions on online games.
WoW, LoTRO, EQ, etc, have not this option, and that means you must bear with idiots without providing any valid tool to counter attack.