I dont think you can, I've looked for something similar since seeing one in EQoA and this was the closest i got to it.
So then the item shop does give an advantage over playing. Anything in an item mall should also be obtainable through playing the game normally. Still trying to find where we can loot those XP potions, also.
Do you even play EQ2? If you do then you know you can not loot those potions. If you do you know you get them as veteran rewards I got a bunch of them sitting in my bank. You do know you get the same effect for time not in combat? It is called vitality bonus and it does not stack with the potions. At level 80 your experience is converted to achivement experience and the exp bonus potions work for your AA exp. then. So while there is not an actual AA potion, your veteran reward exp potions work to enhance AA experience.
You see people are trying to make a case against SOE mainly due to the NGE. They are making a mountian out of a mole hill in order to further their theroy SOE is scamming you or involved in some kind of fraud. Now someone will respond with Smeds quote about not putting RMT in EQ/EQ2. Some even have that quote as their signature. Seen it a dozen times, means nothing to many of us. EQ2 is a great game and the item mall has done absolutely nothing to change that in the slightest. However someone will respond yea but in the future they will add more. As if they work for SOE and know what they are going to do. I do not live by what if's or what were's.
If you like EQ2 and left or did not try it because of the item mall then you made a mistake. The item mall does absolutely nothing to alter your game experience except add a few fun item. Do not listen to the SOE conspiracy theorists. EQ2 is a fun game worth your attention.
Why? Because he had the money to spend? I don't play this game anymore, quit long before the expansion came out. But seriously, so what they have an item shop ontop of p2p. If people want to play the game they will. If they want to buy items, they have every right to. If you hate the game for those reasons thats fine also. But nobody is getting ripped off. SOE is trying to make an extra buck. Should they have made it clear awhile back, YES. Does it matter now that it's implemented, NO. Can you change that fact, NO. With that being said, SOE, a failing company is trying to make extra cash and generate profit. Is this common, YES. So now, with that being said, things should be clear. The OP wanted to show the bright side of the debate and he did. Looks sweet if you ask me. Will it get me to come back, NO. I just don't dig the game anymore. Would it be a rip-off if I or anyone did, NO. It's your money. Spend it how you like, who cares about the rest. It's not like we live forever.
Outside of SOE being described as a failing company, well said. I think SOE is a company trying to redefine itself in today's more competitive mmo market place. They have not found their stride yet but when they do I think great things maybe on the horizon.
How in the world is the cash shop going to make their games more competitive?
It isn't like people have been waiting anxiously for RMT to be thrust on the populace without any consideration to their opinions. As if there has been more people just waiting to spend extra money for the same amount of content has been what is holding them back from playing?
This whole attitude of anything is justifable as long as it the results show some profit for SOE in their future games just shows a lack of compassion for current players. This whole concept that everything is fine, because SOE needs to figure out who they are is just soft selling the fact the SOE has little regard for its current players again, because they hold little value to the future of SOE as a company. It is just another example of how unethical this company is. There is no way to dismiss that.
If SOE wanted to be competitve they should clean up their image, put some real effort into their games instead of letting them dry rot and try to win over player confindence through action, not words.
Why? Because he had the money to spend? I don't play this game anymore, quit long before the expansion came out. But seriously, so what they have an item shop ontop of p2p. If people want to play the game they will. If they want to buy items, they have every right to. If you hate the game for those reasons thats fine also. But nobody is getting ripped off. SOE is trying to make an extra buck. Should they have made it clear awhile back, YES. Does it matter now that it's implemented, NO. Can you change that fact, NO. With that being said, SOE, a failing company is trying to make extra cash and generate profit. Is this common, YES. So now, with that being said, things should be clear. The OP wanted to show the bright side of the debate and he did. Looks sweet if you ask me. Will it get me to come back, NO. I just don't dig the game anymore. Would it be a rip-off if I or anyone did, NO. It's your money. Spend it how you like, who cares about the rest. It's not like we live forever.
Outside of SOE being described as a failing company, well said. I think SOE is a company trying to redefine itself in today's more competitive mmo market place. They have not found their stride yet but when they do I think great things maybe on the horizon.
How in the world is the cash shop going to make their games more competitive?
It isn't like people have been waiting anxiously for RMT to be thrust on the populace without any consideration to their opinions. As if there has been more people just waiting to spend extra money for the same amount of content has been what is holding them back from playing?
This whole attitude of anything is justifable as long as it the results show some profit for SOE in their future games just shows a lack of compassion for current players. This whole concept that everything is fine, because SOE needs to figure out who they are is just soft selling the fact the SOE has little regard for its current players again, because they hold little value to the future of SOE as a company. It is just another example of how unethical this company is. There is no way to dismiss that.
If SOE wanted to be competitve they should clean up their image, put some real effort into their games instead of letting them dry rot and try to win over player confindence through action, not words.
You obviuosly did not read all the posts here. Try reading all of them and you will understand what I was talking about. The cash station is one tiny thing among bigger things SOE is trying to redifine themselves. Here, I will help you out and paste what I was talking about. You see Home is all done with RMT, infact they actually have a mall with different stores in it, all items are based on real cash.
No I am not kidding. If you notice I said "redefine". You see SOE is going a new possible different direction and that is taking mmos to console. They defined mmos as we know them today, when EQ was released march 16th 1999. SOE lead the industry for a number of years after that, really until the NGE problems. Since then they have been trying to figure out who they are in the post WOW release market. The last two year SOE has been changing and the direction appears to be console. Do not disconnect SOE from SONY and PS3. Home for the PS3 was released a couple weeks ago. Home is a new way to look at online interaction. SONY is trying new directions in the mmo world. Not the old school pc only mmo world but the larger multi-platform world. That is why I made that comment because they are just figuring out their direction for the future and despite the hope many have for them to burn in hell I think they are positioned to be leading the industry again in a few years.
How does any of that relate to EQ2/EQ players and what is happening here? For any of that to be relevant, everyone playing these two games would have to be vested in SOEs efforts in the PS3 and whatever else they do in the future.
It isn't somehow ok for SOE to do whatever they want here in an ethical sense. These are still paying customers and SOE is not acting in their interests at all. They are being treated like test subjects. All this talk about SOE listening to their customers has gone right out the window once again and it is back to business of SOE doing whatever they want to regardless of how players feel.
Talking about there efforts in mmos on some other platform just obfuscates what is happening here. Do you think people who feel betrayed and had their trust broken for the last time will somehow feel better when they realize SOE is just trying to figure itself out and is testing their new direction?
How does any of that relate to EQ2/EQ players and what is happening here? For any of that to be relevant, everyone playing these two games would have to be vested in SOEs efforts in the PS3 and whatever else they do in the future.
It isn't somehow ok for SOE to do whatever they want here in an ethical sense. These are still paying customers and SOE is not acting in their interests at all. They are being treated like test subjects. All this talk about SOE listening to their customers has gone right out the window once again and it is back to business of SOE doing whatever they want to regardless of how players feel.
Talking about there efforts in mmos on some other platform just obfuscates what is happening here. Do you think people who feel betrayed and had their trust broken for the last time will somehow feel better when they realize SOE is just trying to figure itself out and is testing their new direction?
You are 100% correct, no it will not make them feel better. I see it as a reality, SOE is changing that is all I have been trying to say. I have also been saying that I do not find these changes as bad as others do. They are not game breaking issues for me in EQ2. I have been defending EQ2 as a game not SOE. I am simply trying to explain why I think these things happen.
I never said SOE listened to their customers. I have personnel experience to know they do not at times. I was a totally committed 3 account holding SWG player, Master Jedi, Mayor of a player city, founder and leader of a large top guild on corbantis. However many keep responding to my posts as if I am some SOE fanboi who is blinded by them. Regardless of what I have invested in my mmo experience I still view them as games and entertainment. I do not invest that much emotion in a game even an mmo. So while I was angry I simply left SWG. I do not view all of this as some sort of scam.
I have been trying to explain SOE reasoning based on how I follow and experience the MMO industry. EQ2 is not Smed. Recently I watched a video of the artists and writers of EQ2 talking about the game. Their sincerity and honest love of what they have created in EQ2 is very heart felt. The honest commitment and pride they have for the game is authentic. That is who I buy the game from not Smed. I defend EQ2 and all the hard working artist not Smed and SOE. However, I also do not think Smed and SOE are the devils. I simply do not believe their waffled decisions on RMT in EQ2 is that big of a deal. To me it is business, not necessarily good business but definitely not a scam in my opinion.
I must say the doomsaying here is hilarious, and bitching about the insane lies they told us lol.
Him lying about there never being RMT is minor since what is offered is dumb. To be clear the pets, including the drake mentioned, is NOT a COMBAT pet, IE it gives no advantage unless your doing a costume contest.
RMT raid equipment? Every RMT based MMO I've seen doesnt offer high end equipment in their stores, yet for some reason with no indication of offering raid equipment, people assume they will, good job drawing a 100% bullshit conclusion.
Again, either people will use it and it will expand and make money, or people won't and it will fade away. And in its current form, anyone who says it gives people an unfair advantage has no fucking idea what their talking about.
I think Smed is incompitent not the devil..but someone loves him at sony thats for sure.
Like it or not SOE involvement now with the PS3 means that this is the way they moving now,RMT seems to be thier plan on making money..time will tell if its the right move or not.
Do you even play EQ2? If you do then you know you can not loot those potions.
I do indeed. Antonia Bayle server. And I enjoy the game.Perhaps you should adjust your sarcasm detector. Of course I know you cannot loot those XP potions. Just like you cannot loot those drakes. Now while the drake may be fluff, a potion allowing you to level faster than everyone else IS NOT fluff. It is an advantage.
As I said, if it is in the shop, it should be available ingame. And the fact that they are making vet rewards available for purchase by newbies makes me wonder. what's the point of being a vet? Vet rewards and pre-order bonus items are supposed to be items to make those who got them stand out a little bit. If everyone can just buy them, then what's the point?
If vet rewards can be item shop sellable, then just take away the vet rewards, kill the pre-order items, and drop the price on the expansions.
When was the last time you stopped going to McDonalds because they stopped serving the McRib? Did you stop paying taxes because the government raised the percentage? Maybe you left your wife because she decided to grill the bacon instead of frying it. I pity you. Meanwhile, lots of us are enjoying SOE games and having fun
SOE lied.
And as usual the players like you seem to have missed that point or dont care. Sad reflection on your generation really when lying is accepted as business as usual
Why? Because he had the money to spend? I don't play this game anymore, quit long before the expansion came out. But seriously, so what they have an item shop ontop of p2p. If people want to play the game they will. If they want to buy items, they have every right to. If you hate the game for those reasons thats fine also. But nobody is getting ripped off. SOE is trying to make an extra buck. Should they have made it clear awhile back, YES. Does it matter now that it's implemented, NO. Can you change that fact, NO. With that being said, SOE, a failing company is trying to make extra cash and generate profit. Is this common, YES. So now, with that being said, things should be clear. The OP wanted to show the bright side of the debate and he did. Looks sweet if you ask me. Will it get me to come back, NO. I just don't dig the game anymore. Would it be a rip-off if I or anyone did, NO. It's your money. Spend it how you like, who cares about the rest. It's not like we live forever.
Outside of SOE being described as a failing company, well said. I think SOE is a company trying to redefine itself in today's more competitive mmo market place. They have not found their stride yet but when they do I think great things maybe on the horizon.
How in the world is the cash shop going to make their games more competitive?
It isn't like people have been waiting anxiously for RMT to be thrust on the populace without any consideration to their opinions. As if there has been more people just waiting to spend extra money for the same amount of content has been what is holding them back from playing?
This whole attitude of anything is justifable as long as it the results show some profit for SOE in their future games just shows a lack of compassion for current players. This whole concept that everything is fine, because SOE needs to figure out who they are is just soft selling the fact the SOE has little regard for its current players again, because they hold little value to the future of SOE as a company. It is just another example of how unethical this company is. There is no way to dismiss that.
If SOE wanted to be competitve they should clean up their image, put some real effort into their games instead of letting them dry rot and try to win over player confindence through action, not words.
You obviuosly did not read all the posts here. Try reading all of them and you will understand what I was talking about. The cash station is one tiny thing among bigger things SOE is trying to redifine themselves. Here, I will help you out and paste what I was talking about. You see Home is all done with RMT, infact they actually have a mall with different stores in it, all items are based on real cash.
No I am not kidding. If you notice I said "redefine". You see SOE is going a new possible different direction and that is taking mmos to console. They defined mmos as we know them today, when EQ was released march 16th 1999. SOE lead the industry for a number of years after that, really until the NGE problems. Since then they have been trying to figure out who they are in the post WOW release market. The last two year SOE has been changing and the direction appears to be console. Do not disconnect SOE from SONY and PS3. Home for the PS3 was released a couple weeks ago. Home is a new way to look at online interaction. SONY is trying new directions in the mmo world. Not the old school pc only mmo world but the larger multi-platform world. That is why I made that comment because they are just figuring out their direction for the future and despite the hope many have for them to burn in hell I think they are positioned to be leading the industry again in a few years.
rofl, SOE leading the industry again. Man you really must love SOE to make a statement like that. SOE is done, finished, over and out, dead.
Picking their console is even sillier move. Lets move our dying MMO's to the PS3 that has a much smaller market than PC's because nobody bought the junky overpriced heap.
FYI, theyve been saying they are going to move to consoles for years and years now. When exactly is this supposed to happen ? Answer, it wont happen. Its a PR move. consoles have no future anyway. 10 years from now all homes will have a wireless receiver with access to all our entertainment needs. Boxes are dead
And as usual the players like you seem to have missed that point or dont care. Sad reflection on your generation really when lying is accepted as business as usual
My generation happens to be the same as yours unless your profile lies.
It's a sad reflection on your mentality that you would make such an assumption as that and yet consider it remotely relevant. Why make it personal?
It really is time that you learned to move on. Dwelling on negative experiences is not a healthy pastime. There is a world of difference between lying and adapting to change. In your ignorance, you cannot see this and wish to discourage others from trying things out for themselves.
I see there's no point in trying to get you to see anything past your own hatred, and frankly, you're not important enough for me to care.
rofl, SOE leading the industry again. Man you really must love SOE to make a statement like that. SOE is done, finished, over and out, dead. Picking their console is even sillier move. Lets move our dying MMO's to the PS3 that has a much smaller market than PC's because nobody bought the junky overpriced heap. FYI, theyve been saying they are going to move to consoles for years and years now. When exactly is this supposed to happen ? Answer, it wont happen. Its a PR move. consoles have no future anyway. 10 years from now all homes will have a wireless receiver with access to all our entertainment needs. Boxes are dead
No I do not love SOE did you read my posts saying that I do not? Might be nice if people actually read all the posts in a thread before responding. For you information They are moving to consoles with their mmos. You might do a bit of research before you rofl at my comments. Have you heard of The Agency, DC Universe, and their huge project the family mmo Free Realms? Now you may disagree with this concept of SOE but it is the direction SOE is going
You may think the PS3 is dead and does not sell but many others do not. SOE has a lot of reason to believe 2009 will be their year. Do not under estimate SOE as people did with the ps2. You do know the ps2 is the best selling console of all time with 140 million sold? Number two is the game boy with only 118 million sold. While the Xbox 360 is a head of the PS3 with 28 million sold. The PS3 is not in it's dust either with 17 million sold. With 17 million current PS3 owners it makes sense they are going to the console market.
Sony America VP of sales Ian Jackson: "We've had a solid holiday season and have delivered consistent growth throughout this year. 2008 was a pivotal year for PlayStation with the best software line up in the industry, a dramatic expansion of PlayStation Network including the launches of the video delivery service and the beta of the PlayStation Home," said Jackson in a statement (via Cnet). "Early internal data points to an increase of more than 130 percent of PS3 hardware sales for the holiday season--since Black Friday--and we're also seeing a growth of nearly 40 percent in total PS3 hardware sales for the calendar year. We remain confident this momentum will continue into the new year."
You see I do not love SOE I simply follow the industry both as a hobby and as a profession. I am a college art instructor I teach traditional studio art and teach a drawing class for our game simulation program. I am no fanboi I simply enjoy following mmo development and playing mmos but I do my research before making my comments.
from QJ.net:
Sony Online Entertainment (SOE) hasn't exactly had a smooth-sailing history, suffering numerous subscriber losses in the past few years. Maybe that's part of the reason they're starting to turn their attention towards PS3 MMOs instead of the traditional PC-based ones.
Speaking to GameDaily, SOE president John Smedley said he believes that MMO gaming on the PS3 will bring in a lot of new players ("a lot of the people who play PS3 games right now aren't the same people playing MMOs"), and these players will in turn account for up to 50% of SOE's business:
from ars technica arstechnica.com
Sony Online Entertainment has been increasingly vocal about its MMO plans on the PlayStation 3 and PlayStation Portable. And while most of its current titles, including The Agency and DC Universe Online, are still being kept under lock and key, the company has declared that all of its future MMO projects will be coming to consoles as part of a plan to make the company the leader in console-based MMOs.
from ps3fanboy.com
Smed: "Console online gaming in general I think is going to be one of the next huge phases of growth in the online gaming space," said Smeldey. With SOE currently working on PS3 versions of The Agency, a DC universe MMO, and Free Realms, there's no doubt the company is putting action to words. However, could any of you see any one of these titles possibly going toe-to-toe with the king of MMOs? Console MMOs as World of Warcraft beaters, perhaps not yet. Better console MMOs soon? Most likely.
from shacknews.com
Sony Online Entertainment president John Smedley has confirmed his company's commitment to console MMOs, stating that all future SOE MMO titles will see console releases.
"I would say that we would be one of the early adopters on [bringing MMOs to consoles], and we plan on becoming one of the dominant players in the MMO space on consoles," said Smedley to MTV. "We see that marketing coming; we think it's there now, so we want to get a good market share there."
SOE's upcoming MMOs The Agency and DC Universe Online will both see simultaneous release on PlayStation 3 and PC.
"I think what's going to happen is you're going to see a whole new generation of players that have been playing 'Resistance' now start getting introduced to MMOs," added Smedley. "I think it's going to be a cool way for them to experience games that have been on the PC for a while, but have a totally different kind of gameplay on the console."
Ecco, people do read your posts and that is why they respond with what they do. You may not realize it, but your posts tend to come off as appologetic and dismissive of the effects SOEs actions are having or their behavior as a whole. You do tend to skirt around the heart to arrive at some neutral area of rationalization.
When you say things like SOE has made bad choices we are really talking about a company that has often completely disregarded and often disrespected its paying customers as if it is company policy. That is in addition to the normal mistakes a company makes with changes and and additions. These "bad choices" were not mistakes or just some accidents, because they were deliberate and intended actions. On top of that they never seem to really show remorse for their actions or care for what effects it has on players.
There are a lot of people here whos posts read as nothing more than rationalization of rewarding a company with a rather large disdain for their customers with subscription dollars. Your posts tend to border right along those lines, so you catch some flak for things your shouldn't, but at the same time much of the response you get is in direct reaction to what you have posted. It isn't that people don't understand what you are saying.
I hope this doesn't come off as me trashing you, because that isn't my intent and hope it goes beyond that.
Edit: to elaborate a little bit. If SOE wasn't behind EQ2, maybe some other company (any company), I would be playing it right now. If the retail box has SOE on it, I wouldn't touch it if you had a gun to my head.
FYI, theyve been saying they are going to move to consoles for years and years now. When exactly is this supposed to happen ? Answer, it wont happen. Its a PR move.
maybe you never knew or forgot
it was announced 18 months ago that NCsoft is making mmos for the PS3
Fluff Cash Shops dont ruin games, Constant Doomsaying does.
I'd like to see you repeat that statement when actual usefull items, like raid level equipment, etc. are added to the cash shop!
I'd like to see you buy raid level equipment for $5 a piece, Out of a cash shop. It's a FLUFF cash shop, Not a raid gear vendor machine.
Also the EXP pots have been handed out as veteran rewards, and sold from merchants for the past 4 years.
Now if we could all get back on topic, Oh nvm... This is the topic. :P
WE CAN BUY STUFF WITH MONEYS! THE SKY IS FALLING, Ahhhhhhh Eclipse, Ahhhhhhh Save the O-zone! Protectz teh magicz!
Note that I said WHEN it will happen! And yes, knowing SOE all to well I'm sure there eventually will be cash shop only items that are more or less required for in-game activities.
Just don't spend all of your money on the current trash in the shop, you will need every penny you got later on...(if you are going to keep on playing EQ2 that is.).
General city merchant sells EXP pots for every level up to 70.
Now you know, I did not know this. I pretty much hit the broker for most things, I don't even think I've used a merchant other than the provisioner.
Are these the same as the ones in the Station Cash shop? If so, then I'll relax a little on that area. I've just been under the impression they were SC only.
General city merchant sells EXP pots for every level up to 70.
Now you know, I did not know this. I pretty much hit the broker for most things, I don't even think I've used a merchant other than the provisioner.
Are these the same as the ones in the Station Cash shop? If so, then I'll relax a little on that area. I've just been under the impression they were SC only.
Yes, they are the same. But that argument falls apart, once examined.
The difference is in the specifics of HOW you can access the +exp pots.
As I understand it (and someone please correct me if I am wrong) in order to buy from the city merchant, you must have and spend a specific number of faction points with that city. That means you must use the game mechanics, ie. "work for it" (a choice every single other player in the game has) in order to earn those points. Once you have earned enough points by playing the game, you may spend in-game money (which was also earned at some point) to buy the potions.
Where the RMT +exp potions stick in the craw of some is the simple fact that SOE has taken that mechanic, ie. the prerequisite of "earning" it, out of the equation. You can, simply by giving SOE more money, buy the potions and improve your character at a faster rate and with a lot less effort than someone who cannot afford to do so. This is rightly seen as unfair, by those who view the game as a competition between players (a view that SOE encourages).
For my part, I am not one who sees the game as a competition, so this whole thing affects me very little. However, I am not so much a fanboi that I cannot see why other paying customers are upset that SOE would extend their RMT program outside the realm of "fluff" (ie, non game-affecting items) and into items that certainly DO provide an edge for those players who enrich the coffers at SOE.
On the other hand, I cannot work up enough indignation to be a doomsayer, either, so I doubt that this will cause much of a difference in EQ2's future, other than to simply help it down the path that all MMO's eventually tread - into quasi-obscurity as they are buried beneath each subsequent years "hot, new MMO".
To my mind, while the anti-RMT people have a very valid point, it is my opinion that in the end, none of this will matter a bit. SOE and the EQ line will have its successes and its failures and in ten years Richard Garriot will still be shooting himself into space and we will all most likely be playing another game.
General city merchant sells EXP pots for every level up to 70.
Now you know, I did not know this. I pretty much hit the broker for most things, I don't even think I've used a merchant other than the provisioner.
Are these the same as the ones in the Station Cash shop? If so, then I'll relax a little on that area. I've just been under the impression they were SC only.
Yes, they are the same. But that argument falls apart, once examined.
The difference is in the specifics of HOW you can access the +exp pots.
As I understand it (and someone please correct me if I am wrong) in order to buy from the city merchant, you must have and spend a specific number of faction points with that city. That means you must use the game mechanics, ie. "work for it" (a choice every single other player in the game has) in order to earn those points. Once you have earned enough points by playing the game, you may spend in-game money (which was also earned at some point) to buy the potions.
Where the RMT +exp potions stick in the craw of some is the simple fact that SOE has taken that mechanic, ie. the prerequisite of "earning" it, out of the equation. You can, simply by giving SOE more money, buy the potions and improve your character at a faster rate and with a lot less effort than someone who cannot afford to do so. This is rightly seen as unfair, by those who view the game as a competition between players (a view that SOE encourages).
For my part, I am not one who sees the game as a competition, so this whole thing affects me very little. However, I am not so much a fanboi that I cannot see why other paying customers are upset that SOE would extend their RMT program outside the realm of "fluff" (ie, non game-affecting items) and into items that certainly DO provide an edge for those players who enrich the coffers at SOE.
On the other hand, I cannot work up enough indignation to be a doomsayer, either, so I doubt that this will cause much of a difference in EQ2's future, other than to simply help it down the path that all MMO's eventually tread - into quasi-obscurity as they are buried beneath each subsequent years "hot, new MMO".
To my mind, while the anti-RMT people have a very valid point, it is my opinion that in the end, none of this will matter a bit. SOE and the EQ line will have its successes and its failures and in ten years Richard Garriot will still be shooting himself into space and we will all most likely be playing another game.
Best to you.
Until you stop seeing it as you have to be a fanboi in order to be ok with the RMT then you will never really understand someone with my position on this issue.
Richard "Lord Space Cadet" Garriot will not be shooting himself into space anytime soon. He went through most of his money to go into space this time. He also announced that he will be making another game and suprise, it will be a fantasy based mmorpg. Why would he leave the sci-fi genre? He did so well with his first attempt Tabula Rasa "blank slate". Turns out Tabula Rasa was a good name for that blank piece of creativity. I think the pressure from his take-off into to space drove his brain out his ass. It is still floating somewhere around the International Space Station.
Comments
So then the item shop does give an advantage over playing. Anything in an item mall should also be obtainable through playing the game normally. Still trying to find where we can loot those XP potions, also.
Do you even play EQ2? If you do then you know you can not loot those potions. If you do you know you get them as veteran rewards I got a bunch of them sitting in my bank. You do know you get the same effect for time not in combat? It is called vitality bonus and it does not stack with the potions. At level 80 your experience is converted to achivement experience and the exp bonus potions work for your AA exp. then. So while there is not an actual AA potion, your veteran reward exp potions work to enhance AA experience.
You see people are trying to make a case against SOE mainly due to the NGE. They are making a mountian out of a mole hill in order to further their theroy SOE is scamming you or involved in some kind of fraud. Now someone will respond with Smeds quote about not putting RMT in EQ/EQ2. Some even have that quote as their signature. Seen it a dozen times, means nothing to many of us. EQ2 is a great game and the item mall has done absolutely nothing to change that in the slightest. However someone will respond yea but in the future they will add more. As if they work for SOE and know what they are going to do. I do not live by what if's or what were's.
If you like EQ2 and left or did not try it because of the item mall then you made a mistake. The item mall does absolutely nothing to alter your game experience except add a few fun item. Do not listen to the SOE conspiracy theorists. EQ2 is a fun game worth your attention.
I'd like to see you repeat that statement when actual usefull items, like raid level equipment, etc. are added to the cash shop!
Why? Because he had the money to spend? I don't play this game anymore, quit long before the expansion came out. But seriously, so what they have an item shop ontop of p2p. If people want to play the game they will. If they want to buy items, they have every right to. If you hate the game for those reasons thats fine also. But nobody is getting ripped off. SOE is trying to make an extra buck. Should they have made it clear awhile back, YES. Does it matter now that it's implemented, NO. Can you change that fact, NO. With that being said, SOE, a failing company is trying to make extra cash and generate profit. Is this common, YES. So now, with that being said, things should be clear. The OP wanted to show the bright side of the debate and he did. Looks sweet if you ask me. Will it get me to come back, NO. I just don't dig the game anymore. Would it be a rip-off if I or anyone did, NO. It's your money. Spend it how you like, who cares about the rest. It's not like we live forever.
How in the world is the cash shop going to make their games more competitive?
It isn't like people have been waiting anxiously for RMT to be thrust on the populace without any consideration to their opinions. As if there has been more people just waiting to spend extra money for the same amount of content has been what is holding them back from playing?
This whole attitude of anything is justifable as long as it the results show some profit for SOE in their future games just shows a lack of compassion for current players. This whole concept that everything is fine, because SOE needs to figure out who they are is just soft selling the fact the SOE has little regard for its current players again, because they hold little value to the future of SOE as a company. It is just another example of how unethical this company is. There is no way to dismiss that.
If SOE wanted to be competitve they should clean up their image, put some real effort into their games instead of letting them dry rot and try to win over player confindence through action, not words.
I'd like to see you repeat that statement when actual usefull items, like raid level equipment, etc. are added to the cash shop!
I'd like to see you buy raid level equipment for $5 a piece, Out of a cash shop. It's a FLUFF cash shop, Not a raid gear vendor machine.
Also the EXP pots have been handed out as veteran rewards, and sold from merchants for the past 4 years.
Now if we could all get back on topic, Oh nvm... This is the topic. :P
WE CAN BUY STUFF WITH MONEYS! THE SKY IS FALLING, Ahhhhhhh Eclipse, Ahhhhhhh Save the O-zone! Protectz teh magicz!
youtube.com/deraged1
Why? Because he had the money to spend? I don't play this game anymore, quit long before the expansion came out. But seriously, so what they have an item shop ontop of p2p. If people want to play the game they will. If they want to buy items, they have every right to. If you hate the game for those reasons thats fine also. But nobody is getting ripped off. SOE is trying to make an extra buck. Should they have made it clear awhile back, YES. Does it matter now that it's implemented, NO. Can you change that fact, NO. With that being said, SOE, a failing company is trying to make extra cash and generate profit. Is this common, YES. So now, with that being said, things should be clear. The OP wanted to show the bright side of the debate and he did. Looks sweet if you ask me. Will it get me to come back, NO. I just don't dig the game anymore. Would it be a rip-off if I or anyone did, NO. It's your money. Spend it how you like, who cares about the rest. It's not like we live forever.
How in the world is the cash shop going to make their games more competitive?
It isn't like people have been waiting anxiously for RMT to be thrust on the populace without any consideration to their opinions. As if there has been more people just waiting to spend extra money for the same amount of content has been what is holding them back from playing?
This whole attitude of anything is justifable as long as it the results show some profit for SOE in their future games just shows a lack of compassion for current players. This whole concept that everything is fine, because SOE needs to figure out who they are is just soft selling the fact the SOE has little regard for its current players again, because they hold little value to the future of SOE as a company. It is just another example of how unethical this company is. There is no way to dismiss that.
If SOE wanted to be competitve they should clean up their image, put some real effort into their games instead of letting them dry rot and try to win over player confindence through action, not words.
You obviuosly did not read all the posts here. Try reading all of them and you will understand what I was talking about. The cash station is one tiny thing among bigger things SOE is trying to redifine themselves. Here, I will help you out and paste what I was talking about. You see Home is all done with RMT, infact they actually have a mall with different stores in it, all items are based on real cash.
No I am not kidding. If you notice I said "redefine". You see SOE is going a new possible different direction and that is taking mmos to console. They defined mmos as we know them today, when EQ was released march 16th 1999. SOE lead the industry for a number of years after that, really until the NGE problems. Since then they have been trying to figure out who they are in the post WOW release market. The last two year SOE has been changing and the direction appears to be console. Do not disconnect SOE from SONY and PS3. Home for the PS3 was released a couple weeks ago. Home is a new way to look at online interaction. SONY is trying new directions in the mmo world. Not the old school pc only mmo world but the larger multi-platform world. That is why I made that comment because they are just figuring out their direction for the future and despite the hope many have for them to burn in hell I think they are positioned to be leading the industry again in a few years.
How does any of that relate to EQ2/EQ players and what is happening here? For any of that to be relevant, everyone playing these two games would have to be vested in SOEs efforts in the PS3 and whatever else they do in the future.
It isn't somehow ok for SOE to do whatever they want here in an ethical sense. These are still paying customers and SOE is not acting in their interests at all. They are being treated like test subjects. All this talk about SOE listening to their customers has gone right out the window once again and it is back to business of SOE doing whatever they want to regardless of how players feel.
Talking about there efforts in mmos on some other platform just obfuscates what is happening here. Do you think people who feel betrayed and had their trust broken for the last time will somehow feel better when they realize SOE is just trying to figure itself out and is testing their new direction?
When was the last time you stopped going to McDonalds because they stopped serving the McRib?
Did you stop paying taxes because the government raised the percentage?
Maybe you left your wife because she decided to grill the bacon instead of frying it.
I pity you.
Meanwhile, lots of us are enjoying SOE games and having fun
You are 100% correct, no it will not make them feel better. I see it as a reality, SOE is changing that is all I have been trying to say. I have also been saying that I do not find these changes as bad as others do. They are not game breaking issues for me in EQ2. I have been defending EQ2 as a game not SOE. I am simply trying to explain why I think these things happen.
I never said SOE listened to their customers. I have personnel experience to know they do not at times. I was a totally committed 3 account holding SWG player, Master Jedi, Mayor of a player city, founder and leader of a large top guild on corbantis. However many keep responding to my posts as if I am some SOE fanboi who is blinded by them. Regardless of what I have invested in my mmo experience I still view them as games and entertainment. I do not invest that much emotion in a game even an mmo. So while I was angry I simply left SWG. I do not view all of this as some sort of scam.
I have been trying to explain SOE reasoning based on how I follow and experience the MMO industry. EQ2 is not Smed. Recently I watched a video of the artists and writers of EQ2 talking about the game. Their sincerity and honest love of what they have created in EQ2 is very heart felt. The honest commitment and pride they have for the game is authentic. That is who I buy the game from not Smed. I defend EQ2 and all the hard working artist not Smed and SOE. However, I also do not think Smed and SOE are the devils. I simply do not believe their waffled decisions on RMT in EQ2 is that big of a deal. To me it is business, not necessarily good business but definitely not a scam in my opinion.
I must say the doomsaying here is hilarious, and bitching about the insane lies they told us lol.
Him lying about there never being RMT is minor since what is offered is dumb. To be clear the pets, including the drake mentioned, is NOT a COMBAT pet, IE it gives no advantage unless your doing a costume contest.
RMT raid equipment? Every RMT based MMO I've seen doesnt offer high end equipment in their stores, yet for some reason with no indication of offering raid equipment, people assume they will, good job drawing a 100% bullshit conclusion.
Again, either people will use it and it will expand and make money, or people won't and it will fade away. And in its current form, anyone who says it gives people an unfair advantage has no fucking idea what their talking about.
GD people at mmorpg.com are dumb.
I think Smed is incompitent not the devil..but someone loves him at sony thats for sure.
Like it or not SOE involvement now with the PS3 means that this is the way they moving now,RMT seems to be thier plan on making money..time will tell if its the right move or not.
I do indeed. Antonia Bayle server. And I enjoy the game.Perhaps you should adjust your sarcasm detector. Of course I know you cannot loot those XP potions. Just like you cannot loot those drakes. Now while the drake may be fluff, a potion allowing you to level faster than everyone else IS NOT fluff. It is an advantage.
As I said, if it is in the shop, it should be available ingame. And the fact that they are making vet rewards available for purchase by newbies makes me wonder. what's the point of being a vet? Vet rewards and pre-order bonus items are supposed to be items to make those who got them stand out a little bit. If everyone can just buy them, then what's the point?
If vet rewards can be item shop sellable, then just take away the vet rewards, kill the pre-order items, and drop the price on the expansions.
SOE lied.
And as usual the players like you seem to have missed that point or dont care. Sad reflection on your generation really when lying is accepted as business as usual
Why? Because he had the money to spend? I don't play this game anymore, quit long before the expansion came out. But seriously, so what they have an item shop ontop of p2p. If people want to play the game they will. If they want to buy items, they have every right to. If you hate the game for those reasons thats fine also. But nobody is getting ripped off. SOE is trying to make an extra buck. Should they have made it clear awhile back, YES. Does it matter now that it's implemented, NO. Can you change that fact, NO. With that being said, SOE, a failing company is trying to make extra cash and generate profit. Is this common, YES. So now, with that being said, things should be clear. The OP wanted to show the bright side of the debate and he did. Looks sweet if you ask me. Will it get me to come back, NO. I just don't dig the game anymore. Would it be a rip-off if I or anyone did, NO. It's your money. Spend it how you like, who cares about the rest. It's not like we live forever.
How in the world is the cash shop going to make their games more competitive?
It isn't like people have been waiting anxiously for RMT to be thrust on the populace without any consideration to their opinions. As if there has been more people just waiting to spend extra money for the same amount of content has been what is holding them back from playing?
This whole attitude of anything is justifable as long as it the results show some profit for SOE in their future games just shows a lack of compassion for current players. This whole concept that everything is fine, because SOE needs to figure out who they are is just soft selling the fact the SOE has little regard for its current players again, because they hold little value to the future of SOE as a company. It is just another example of how unethical this company is. There is no way to dismiss that.
If SOE wanted to be competitve they should clean up their image, put some real effort into their games instead of letting them dry rot and try to win over player confindence through action, not words.
You obviuosly did not read all the posts here. Try reading all of them and you will understand what I was talking about. The cash station is one tiny thing among bigger things SOE is trying to redifine themselves. Here, I will help you out and paste what I was talking about. You see Home is all done with RMT, infact they actually have a mall with different stores in it, all items are based on real cash.
No I am not kidding. If you notice I said "redefine". You see SOE is going a new possible different direction and that is taking mmos to console. They defined mmos as we know them today, when EQ was released march 16th 1999. SOE lead the industry for a number of years after that, really until the NGE problems. Since then they have been trying to figure out who they are in the post WOW release market. The last two year SOE has been changing and the direction appears to be console. Do not disconnect SOE from SONY and PS3. Home for the PS3 was released a couple weeks ago. Home is a new way to look at online interaction. SONY is trying new directions in the mmo world. Not the old school pc only mmo world but the larger multi-platform world. That is why I made that comment because they are just figuring out their direction for the future and despite the hope many have for them to burn in hell I think they are positioned to be leading the industry again in a few years.
rofl, SOE leading the industry again. Man you really must love SOE to make a statement like that. SOE is done, finished, over and out, dead.
Picking their console is even sillier move. Lets move our dying MMO's to the PS3 that has a much smaller market than PC's because nobody bought the junky overpriced heap.
FYI, theyve been saying they are going to move to consoles for years and years now. When exactly is this supposed to happen ? Answer, it wont happen. Its a PR move. consoles have no future anyway. 10 years from now all homes will have a wireless receiver with access to all our entertainment needs. Boxes are dead
SOE lied.
And as usual the players like you seem to have missed that point or dont care. Sad reflection on your generation really when lying is accepted as business as usual
My generation happens to be the same as yours unless your profile lies.
It's a sad reflection on your mentality that you would make such an assumption as that and yet consider it remotely relevant. Why make it personal?
It really is time that you learned to move on. Dwelling on negative experiences is not a healthy pastime. There is a world of difference between lying and adapting to change. In your ignorance, you cannot see this and wish to discourage others from trying things out for themselves.
I see there's no point in trying to get you to see anything past your own hatred, and frankly, you're not important enough for me to care.
No I do not love SOE did you read my posts saying that I do not? Might be nice if people actually read all the posts in a thread before responding. For you information They are moving to consoles with their mmos. You might do a bit of research before you rofl at my comments. Have you heard of The Agency, DC Universe, and their huge project the family mmo Free Realms? Now you may disagree with this concept of SOE but it is the direction SOE is going
You may think the PS3 is dead and does not sell but many others do not. SOE has a lot of reason to believe 2009 will be their year. Do not under estimate SOE as people did with the ps2. You do know the ps2 is the best selling console of all time with 140 million sold? Number two is the game boy with only 118 million sold. While the Xbox 360 is a head of the PS3 with 28 million sold. The PS3 is not in it's dust either with 17 million sold. With 17 million current PS3 owners it makes sense they are going to the console market.
Sony America VP of sales Ian Jackson: "We've had a solid holiday season and have delivered consistent growth throughout this year. 2008 was a pivotal year for PlayStation with the best software line up in the industry, a dramatic expansion of PlayStation Network including the launches of the video delivery service and the beta of the PlayStation Home," said Jackson in a statement (via Cnet). "Early internal data points to an increase of more than 130 percent of PS3 hardware sales for the holiday season--since Black Friday--and we're also seeing a growth of nearly 40 percent in total PS3 hardware sales for the calendar year. We remain confident this momentum will continue into the new year."
You see I do not love SOE I simply follow the industry both as a hobby and as a profession. I am a college art instructor I teach traditional studio art and teach a drawing class for our game simulation program. I am no fanboi I simply enjoy following mmo development and playing mmos but I do my research before making my comments.
from QJ.net:
Sony Online Entertainment (SOE) hasn't exactly had a smooth-sailing history, suffering numerous subscriber losses in the past few years. Maybe that's part of the reason they're starting to turn their attention towards PS3 MMOs instead of the traditional PC-based ones.
Speaking to GameDaily, SOE president John Smedley said he believes that MMO gaming on the PS3 will bring in a lot of new players ("a lot of the people who play PS3 games right now aren't the same people playing MMOs"), and these players will in turn account for up to 50% of SOE's business:
from ars technica arstechnica.com
Sony Online Entertainment has been increasingly vocal about its MMO plans on the PlayStation 3 and PlayStation Portable. And while most of its current titles, including The Agency and DC Universe Online, are still being kept under lock and key, the company has declared that all of its future MMO projects will be coming to consoles as part of a plan to make the company the leader in console-based MMOs.
from ps3fanboy.com
Smed: "Console online gaming in general I think is going to be one of the next huge phases of growth in the online gaming space," said Smeldey. With SOE currently working on PS3 versions of The Agency, a DC universe MMO, and Free Realms, there's no doubt the company is putting action to words. However, could any of you see any one of these titles possibly going toe-to-toe with the king of MMOs? Console MMOs as World of Warcraft beaters, perhaps not yet. Better console MMOs soon? Most likely.
from shacknews.com
Sony Online Entertainment president John Smedley has confirmed his company's commitment to console MMOs, stating that all future SOE MMO titles will see console releases.
"I would say that we would be one of the early adopters on [bringing MMOs to consoles], and we plan on becoming one of the dominant players in the MMO space on consoles," said Smedley to MTV. "We see that marketing coming; we think it's there now, so we want to get a good market share there."
SOE's upcoming MMOs The Agency and DC Universe Online will both see simultaneous release on PlayStation 3 and PC.
"I think what's going to happen is you're going to see a whole new generation of players that have been playing 'Resistance' now start getting introduced to MMOs," added Smedley. "I think it's going to be a cool way for them to experience games that have been on the PC for a while, but have a totally different kind of gameplay on the console."
Ecco, people do read your posts and that is why they respond with what they do. You may not realize it, but your posts tend to come off as appologetic and dismissive of the effects SOEs actions are having or their behavior as a whole. You do tend to skirt around the heart to arrive at some neutral area of rationalization.
When you say things like SOE has made bad choices we are really talking about a company that has often completely disregarded and often disrespected its paying customers as if it is company policy. That is in addition to the normal mistakes a company makes with changes and and additions. These "bad choices" were not mistakes or just some accidents, because they were deliberate and intended actions. On top of that they never seem to really show remorse for their actions or care for what effects it has on players.
There are a lot of people here whos posts read as nothing more than rationalization of rewarding a company with a rather large disdain for their customers with subscription dollars. Your posts tend to border right along those lines, so you catch some flak for things your shouldn't, but at the same time much of the response you get is in direct reaction to what you have posted. It isn't that people don't understand what you are saying.
I hope this doesn't come off as me trashing you, because that isn't my intent and hope it goes beyond that.
Sony will be Sony...
Overpriced Console
Overpriced Games
Overrated Products
Underrated Stupidity
Edit: to elaborate a little bit. If SOE wasn't behind EQ2, maybe some other company (any company), I would be playing it right now. If the retail box has SOE on it, I wouldn't touch it if you had a gun to my head.
maybe you never knew or forgot
it was announced 18 months ago that NCsoft is making mmos for the PS3
www.joystiq.com/2007/07/11/ncsoft-pledges-sony-support-exclusive-ps3-online-games/
NCsoft Chooses ProFX for PC, PS3 MMO
www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php
EQ2 fan sites
I'd like to see you repeat that statement when actual usefull items, like raid level equipment, etc. are added to the cash shop!
I'd like to see you buy raid level equipment for $5 a piece, Out of a cash shop. It's a FLUFF cash shop, Not a raid gear vendor machine.
Also the EXP pots have been handed out as veteran rewards, and sold from merchants for the past 4 years.
Now if we could all get back on topic, Oh nvm... This is the topic. :P
WE CAN BUY STUFF WITH MONEYS! THE SKY IS FALLING, Ahhhhhhh Eclipse, Ahhhhhhh Save the O-zone! Protectz teh magicz!
Note that I said WHEN it will happen! And yes, knowing SOE all to well I'm sure there eventually will be cash shop only items that are more or less required for in-game activities.
Just don't spend all of your money on the current trash in the shop, you will need every penny you got later on...(if you are going to keep on playing EQ2 that is.).
I'd like to see you repeat that statement when actual usefull items, like raid level equipment, etc. are added to the cash shop!
I'd like to see you buy raid level equipment for $5 a piece, Out of a cash shop. It's a FLUFF cash shop, Not a raid gear vendor machine.
Also the EXP pots have been handed out as veteran rewards, and sold from merchants for the past 4 years.
Now if we could all get back on topic, Oh nvm... This is the topic. :P
WE CAN BUY STUFF WITH MONEYS! THE SKY IS FALLING, Ahhhhhhh Eclipse, Ahhhhhhh Save the O-zone! Protectz teh magicz!
Okay, which merchant ingame can I buy the xp potions from?
General city merchant sells EXP pots for every level up to 70.
youtube.com/deraged1
Now you know, I did not know this. I pretty much hit the broker for most things, I don't even think I've used a merchant other than the provisioner.
Are these the same as the ones in the Station Cash shop? If so, then I'll relax a little on that area. I've just been under the impression they were SC only.
It's pretty much the same thing exceptthe veteran/shop ones dont have level limit, these are one type for every 10 levels. And cost status.
youtube.com/deraged1
Now you know, I did not know this. I pretty much hit the broker for most things, I don't even think I've used a merchant other than the provisioner.
Are these the same as the ones in the Station Cash shop? If so, then I'll relax a little on that area. I've just been under the impression they were SC only.
Yes, they are the same. But that argument falls apart, once examined.
The difference is in the specifics of HOW you can access the +exp pots.
As I understand it (and someone please correct me if I am wrong) in order to buy from the city merchant, you must have and spend a specific number of faction points with that city. That means you must use the game mechanics, ie. "work for it" (a choice every single other player in the game has) in order to earn those points. Once you have earned enough points by playing the game, you may spend in-game money (which was also earned at some point) to buy the potions.
Where the RMT +exp potions stick in the craw of some is the simple fact that SOE has taken that mechanic, ie. the prerequisite of "earning" it, out of the equation. You can, simply by giving SOE more money, buy the potions and improve your character at a faster rate and with a lot less effort than someone who cannot afford to do so. This is rightly seen as unfair, by those who view the game as a competition between players (a view that SOE encourages).
For my part, I am not one who sees the game as a competition, so this whole thing affects me very little. However, I am not so much a fanboi that I cannot see why other paying customers are upset that SOE would extend their RMT program outside the realm of "fluff" (ie, non game-affecting items) and into items that certainly DO provide an edge for those players who enrich the coffers at SOE.
On the other hand, I cannot work up enough indignation to be a doomsayer, either, so I doubt that this will cause much of a difference in EQ2's future, other than to simply help it down the path that all MMO's eventually tread - into quasi-obscurity as they are buried beneath each subsequent years "hot, new MMO".
To my mind, while the anti-RMT people have a very valid point, it is my opinion that in the end, none of this will matter a bit. SOE and the EQ line will have its successes and its failures and in ten years Richard Garriot will still be shooting himself into space and we will all most likely be playing another game.
Best to you.
Now you know, I did not know this. I pretty much hit the broker for most things, I don't even think I've used a merchant other than the provisioner.
Are these the same as the ones in the Station Cash shop? If so, then I'll relax a little on that area. I've just been under the impression they were SC only.
Yes, they are the same. But that argument falls apart, once examined.
The difference is in the specifics of HOW you can access the +exp pots.
As I understand it (and someone please correct me if I am wrong) in order to buy from the city merchant, you must have and spend a specific number of faction points with that city. That means you must use the game mechanics, ie. "work for it" (a choice every single other player in the game has) in order to earn those points. Once you have earned enough points by playing the game, you may spend in-game money (which was also earned at some point) to buy the potions.
Where the RMT +exp potions stick in the craw of some is the simple fact that SOE has taken that mechanic, ie. the prerequisite of "earning" it, out of the equation. You can, simply by giving SOE more money, buy the potions and improve your character at a faster rate and with a lot less effort than someone who cannot afford to do so. This is rightly seen as unfair, by those who view the game as a competition between players (a view that SOE encourages).
For my part, I am not one who sees the game as a competition, so this whole thing affects me very little. However, I am not so much a fanboi that I cannot see why other paying customers are upset that SOE would extend their RMT program outside the realm of "fluff" (ie, non game-affecting items) and into items that certainly DO provide an edge for those players who enrich the coffers at SOE.
On the other hand, I cannot work up enough indignation to be a doomsayer, either, so I doubt that this will cause much of a difference in EQ2's future, other than to simply help it down the path that all MMO's eventually tread - into quasi-obscurity as they are buried beneath each subsequent years "hot, new MMO".
To my mind, while the anti-RMT people have a very valid point, it is my opinion that in the end, none of this will matter a bit. SOE and the EQ line will have its successes and its failures and in ten years Richard Garriot will still be shooting himself into space and we will all most likely be playing another game.
Best to you.
Until you stop seeing it as you have to be a fanboi in order to be ok with the RMT then you will never really understand someone with my position on this issue.
Richard "Lord Space Cadet" Garriot will not be shooting himself into space anytime soon. He went through most of his money to go into space this time. He also announced that he will be making another game and suprise, it will be a fantasy based mmorpg. Why would he leave the sci-fi genre? He did so well with his first attempt Tabula Rasa "blank slate". Turns out Tabula Rasa was a good name for that blank piece of creativity. I think the pressure from his take-off into to space drove his brain out his ass. It is still floating somewhere around the International Space Station.