I just tried but interestingly the search engine appears to be hosed... even looking for swg in the subject line gets nothing. I am pretty sure there have been some posts with SWG in the subject line in this forum, lol. At any rate, step through old topic pages and you'll see other posts and polls about this.
personally i would love to play SWG pre CU again and i wouldnt hesitate to pay 30 USD for the oppertunity, but i would love it even more if a company / team would take the core gameplay mechanics of SWG (points based skill leveling system, crafted item economy, bounty hunting, player housing, lots of non combat professions, many different landscapes to adventure in) i dont care what the IP would be, as long as the gameplay was smooth (looking back the gameplay of swg wasnt all that polished) and there wasn't any massive imbalances (such as snipers 1 shotting a mind pool) and we would have a winner imho, and i wouldnt unsubscribe till the servers closed of old age lol.
looking at it now, there are a couple of mmo's on the horizons that sound like almost all of the SWG vet's wet dreams come true, and they would be earthrise and fallen earth, i dont think darkfall is going to be anywhere close to what people want out of it tbh, but my hopes remain on earthrise and hope that it can capture some of that which made SWG such a good game
I would absolutely pay $30 for it, as I am already paying for a couple subs on other games that will never engender the feeling of "home" that SWG Pre-CU gave me. The problem is... SOE has already said they did not keep any of the Pre-CU code. which if you've worked in a software development arena you know is a baldfaced lie. They cannot now cough it up though and still retain any kind of credibility (not that we feel they have any left). It all boils down to a real shame, too. I brielfly worked with the swgprecu emulation team (now merged with (SWG: ANH) and recreating the backend server is a monumental task that is years in the doing with a group of coders that are spread out all over North America and work in their spare time for no more than the hope of recreating what never should have been lost in the first place.
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
As it is well known outside of the Emu community I would imagine that it likely is in written format from Smed sometime in the past, but that is not my source of the comment.
So in other words you have no proof this was ever said by anyone.
I'm not your personal wikipedia. If you want proof of something feel free to Google to your heart's content. I'm satisfied with what I've seen and heard concerning Pre-CU code. That Smed is a notorious liar is hardly in doubt anymore to anyone that has bothered to pay attention to the countless statements he has released on behalf of SOE.
I have googled it. I am trying to ascertain whether this is something that has been said publicly, or something they only say privately.
I can find no place anywhere on the internet, and I can't recall, any time where anyone from SOE admitting what you are saying they have said.
No need to get testy when someone doubts your information.
I would absolutely pay $30 for it, as I am already paying for a couple subs on other games that will never engender the feeling of "home" that SWG Pre-CU gave me. The problem is... SOE has already said they did not keep any of the Pre-CU code. which if you've worked in a software development arena you know is a baldfaced lie. They cannot now cough it up though and still retain any kind of credibility (not that we feel they have any left). It all boils down to a real shame, too. I brielfly worked with the swgprecu emulation team (now merged with (SWG: ANH) and recreating the backend server is a monumental task that is years in the doing with a group of coders that are spread out all over North America and work in their spare time for no more than the hope of recreating what never should have been lost in the first place.
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
As it is well known outside of the Emu community I would imagine that it likely is in written format from Smed sometime in the past, but that is not my source of the comment.
So in other words you have no proof this was ever said by anyone.
I'm not your personal wikipedia. If you want proof of something feel free to Google to your heart's content. I'm satisfied with what I've seen and heard concerning Pre-CU code. That Smed is a notorious liar is hardly in doubt anymore to anyone that has bothered to pay attention to the countless statements he has released on behalf of SOE.
That's kind of how I feel about this issue. I've quoted the LEC rep that said pre-cu was not technically possible, and the SOE dev that said they no longer had an understanding of the JTL code. Others have posted things they were told by SOE devs directly re. SOE being unable to work with the pre-cu code for some reason. It has all been quoted and properly cited, but probably years ago now. Digging that all up again really isn't worth the effort to me. If some folks choose not to believe it, that's fine. Skepticism doesn't usually lead to serious injury or loss of life . Maybe it does in some circumstances, but probably not in this case.
That;s plenty of evidence that they don't have notes for or don't have the talent to deal with the old code, but not evidence for what perilous is saying -- that they do not have the old code at all.
Completely different things.
Obviously I know all the things you are saying, but for me, those things don't prove what HE is saying in the least.
I would absolutely pay $30 for it, as I am already paying for a couple subs on other games that will never engender the feeling of "home" that SWG Pre-CU gave me. The problem is... SOE has already said they did not keep any of the Pre-CU code. which if you've worked in a software development arena you know is a baldfaced lie. They cannot now cough it up though and still retain any kind of credibility (not that we feel they have any left). It all boils down to a real shame, too. I brielfly worked with the swgprecu emulation team (now merged with (SWG: ANH) and recreating the backend server is a monumental task that is years in the doing with a group of coders that are spread out all over North America and work in their spare time for no more than the hope of recreating what never should have been lost in the first place.
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
As it is well known outside of the Emu community I would imagine that it likely is in written format from Smed sometime in the past, but that is not my source of the comment.
So in other words you have no proof this was ever said by anyone.
I'm not your personal wikipedia. If you want proof of something feel free to Google to your heart's content. I'm satisfied with what I've seen and heard concerning Pre-CU code. That Smed is a notorious liar is hardly in doubt anymore to anyone that has bothered to pay attention to the countless statements he has released on behalf of SOE.
I have googled it. I am trying to ascertain whether this is something that has been said publicly, or something they only say privately.
I can find no place anywhere on the internet, and I can't recall, any time where anyone from SOE admitting what you are saying they have said.
No need to get testy when someone doubts your information.
lol. I am not testy about being questioned as to my sources, I am satisifed as to the veracity of the information myself. You seem to expect me to link where I read this when I've already explained how I came by the information. Again, if you desire a confirmation of some sort then find it for yourself. Dragging out this one Reply with endless quoting is only ruining this thread. But then, that may well be your intention. Who can know?
I would absolutely pay $30 for it, as I am already paying for a couple subs on other games that will never engender the feeling of "home" that SWG Pre-CU gave me. The problem is... SOE has already said they did not keep any of the Pre-CU code. which if you've worked in a software development arena you know is a baldfaced lie. They cannot now cough it up though and still retain any kind of credibility (not that we feel they have any left). It all boils down to a real shame, too. I brielfly worked with the swgprecu emulation team (now merged with (SWG: ANH) and recreating the backend server is a monumental task that is years in the doing with a group of coders that are spread out all over North America and work in their spare time for no more than the hope of recreating what never should have been lost in the first place.
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
As it is well known outside of the Emu community I would imagine that it likely is in written format from Smed sometime in the past, but that is not my source of the comment.
So in other words you have no proof this was ever said by anyone.
I'm not your personal wikipedia. If you want proof of something feel free to Google to your heart's content. I'm satisfied with what I've seen and heard concerning Pre-CU code. That Smed is a notorious liar is hardly in doubt anymore to anyone that has bothered to pay attention to the countless statements he has released on behalf of SOE.
I have googled it. I am trying to ascertain whether this is something that has been said publicly, or something they only say privately.
I can find no place anywhere on the internet, and I can't recall, any time where anyone from SOE admitting what you are saying they have said.
No need to get testy when someone doubts your information.
lol. I am not testy about being questioned as to my sources, I am satisifed as to the veracity of the information myself. You seem to expect me to link where I read this when I've already explained how I came by the information. Again, if you desire a confirmation of some sort then find it for yourself. Dragging out this one Reply with endless quoting is only ruining this thread. But then, that may well be your intention. Who can know?
I can't find it for myself, and you can't provide it for me.
Feel free to speculate on the gross number of subs a revamp and relaunch might net. (At a $30 sub) Discuss....
No.
$30 a month? $360 a year? For a game? That's just silly.
PreCU was barely worth 15 bucks a month, no way at double that. There are too many better games at less cost. If you think preCU was worth 30 bucks, you are remembering a different game, my friend.
You want speculation? The majority of gamers who are not hanging out here just to look for something to argue about won't even consider such a thing.
Feel free to speculate on the gross number of subs a revamp and relaunch might net. (At a $30 sub) Discuss....
No.
$30 a month? $360 a year? For a game? That's just silly.
PreCU was barely worth 15 bucks a month, no way at double that. There are too many better games at less cost. If you think preCU was worth 30 bucks, you are remembering a different game, my friend.
You want speculation? The majority of gamers who are not hanging out here just to look for something to argue about won't even consider such a thing.
Too many better games? Name them, please. I've played nearly everything out there and while playing each and every one I found myself pining away for Pre-CU SWG. I've found no other game that got so much "right". Without a doubt Pre-CU had it's bugs and irregularities, but so do all games. I made peace with it's faults and I still yearn to play it again.
To pay a $30 sub? If SOE/LA would sell the rights to the Pre-CU to an independent developer for a revamp and relaunch? Arn't the EMU's trying that already? I, for one would be willing to pay. Not me, been there, done that, had a amazing time, in fact the best time ever in a MMORPG, even resubbed in 2007 and enjoyed it for 8 months, of course not as much as I did with pre-cu, but then again didn't expect that at all due to how the majority of people playing these games have changed, but for me the only SWG that would get me back would be a SWG2, updated graphics/animations well everything just updated/upgraded to a true next gen. lvl, would a independent developer be able to creat that, sorry don't think so, would love to see it happening, but if it does it won't be anytime soon...........SW:TOR.....nah........ might turn out to be a enjoyeble GAME, not so much MMORPG as I would like it to be, but then again I do very much enjoy Bioware games, and must admit pretty curious in how their first MMO will turn out but more in a game way then seeing it in a MMORPG way. This question has been stewing in my mind for months....Am I alone? I am sure you're not alone, but I aint with you on this Feel free to speculate on the gross number of subs a revamp and relaunch might net. (At a $30 sub) In these day's don't really think it it will get that many subs, I am sure many will try it but will many stick?....unsure about that because so many things have changed, not only these games but also the people playing them, I know of people who really loved SWG but they moved on to other games or MMORPG's and started to like those games even more, many of them would not even consider going back at all. Discuss.... Just did.
Feel free to speculate on the gross number of subs a revamp and relaunch might net. (At a $30 sub) Discuss....
No.
$30 a month? $360 a year? For a game? That's just silly.
PreCU was barely worth 15 bucks a month, no way at double that. There are too many better games at less cost. If you think preCU was worth 30 bucks, you are remembering a different game, my friend.
You want speculation? The majority of gamers who are not hanging out here just to look for something to argue about won't even consider such a thing.
Better games..? Anyway....
As I stated before I set up SWG as example..nothing more.
I would be willing to pay $30 USD/per month for ANY IP launched by any independent developer that was a radical and welcomed departure from the current popular MMORPG paradigm.(That will actually launch and not stay in development for over half a decade)
I was curious to see what consensus I would draw on the topic. Because....
It is my firm belief that if a indy publisher/developer is going to develop and launch a AAA game in a timely manner (that is worth a damn)that will draw a certain niche playerbase they are going to have to make up for the sheer lack of volume somehow....and I for one would be willing to do my part in supporting this hypothetical project.
Many will cite EvE O as an example of the fact that it has been done and for $15 USD. Um no...EvE launched nearly 6 years ago and has been slowly ramping up since then...if launched today I sincerly doubt EvE would survive for long let alone thrive...niche or not.
The rabid loyalty of the playerbase and the developers are the main reasons that have kept EvE O afloat in the turbulent storm of this market.
As for $360 dollars a year to play a game comment..come on man.. you probably spend more in vending machines every year. You wouldn't pay a lousy dollar a day to enjoy an innovative and well implemented game??
Perhaps..? this attitude is contributing factor as to why the genre has been in the doldrums for so long?
No need for $OE /LA anymore ..community can bring it on on themselves...We will give these suckers nothing ..
But we will support the ones giving us back what $OE/LA broke and don't deserve anymore ...
Starwars is now i the hands of the fans and belongs to the world and not to the shtty moneygrabbing and sucking $OE or LA
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
I, for one, think the People at SWGEMU are doing a Great job of remaking the Pre CU - NGE game that we all loved. They've come a long way and are redoing the code from scratch...
I would absolutely pay $30 for it, as I am already paying for a couple subs on other games that will never engender the feeling of "home" that SWG Pre-CU gave me. The problem is... SOE has already said they did not keep any of the Pre-CU code. which if you've worked in a software development arena you know is a baldfaced lie. They cannot now cough it up though and still retain any kind of credibility (not that we feel they have any left). It all boils down to a real shame, too. I brielfly worked with the swgprecu emulation team (now merged with (SWG: ANH) and recreating the backend server is a monumental task that is years in the doing with a group of coders that are spread out all over North America and work in their spare time for no more than the hope of recreating what never should have been lost in the first place.
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
Smedly has stated it on SWG forums that the pre-cu code was gone and it was no longer possible to roll back to it. I believe a few devs have repeated this as well.
There were several posts immediately after the NGE launched demanding a roll back. I personally read Smedley's post saying it was not technically possible to roll back to pre-nge because the code was gone.
Of course they are big fat stinkin liars. Many people called into question that statement because they surely would have backup servers and could easily just go back. Not to mention a lot of the old code is still clearly in the game with the NGE merely tacked on
As far as finding those old posts, I believe SOE purged their forums a few times since then. So unless someone archived them, I doubt you'l find it
I wouldn't pay $30 for the privilege of playing pre-CU. Actually, i wouldn't pay $5. Broken classes and didn't like the game mechanics......... group 'solo' hunting? Wtf was that?
I wouldn't pay $30 for the privilege of playing pre-CU. Actually, i wouldn't pay $5. Broken classes and didn't like the game mechanics......... group 'solo' hunting? Wtf was that?
I'd recommend going back and re-reading the OP, I think you missed something.
BTW solo groups were kind of weird of course, but they were sort of fun as well. I had many great conversations with people I'd likely not have met otherwise. They didn't do much for gameplay but they did a great deal for community.
I wouldn't pay $30 for the privilege of playing pre-CU. Actually, i wouldn't pay $5. Broken classes and didn't like the game mechanics......... group 'solo' hunting? Wtf was that?
I'd recommend going back and re-reading the OP, I think you missed something.
BTW solo groups were kind of weird of course, but they were sort of fun as well. I had many great conversations with people I'd likely not have met otherwise. They didn't do much for gameplay but they did a great deal for community.
I reread the OP. He did say "revamp." I assume this means a complete polish and reworking of the game to WoW standards - generally cited as the standard by which game completeness should be judged.
So we imagine preCU gameplay, without any of the bugs or broken gameplay, reasonably balanced, content in addition to open gameplay. In otherwords, the sandbox paradise we all imagined and wished for. Would I pay $30 a month for that?
For $30, I would expect the game to be totally supported, continual rebalancing where needed, additional expansions added regularly, the inclusion of new content fully tested and the proper implementation of all the old dynamics - unlockable jedi, TEFs, complex crafting, BF, three-bar HAM etc.
But if they could do that then, sure, I'd sign up in an instant.
Six months ago: yes. Now with The Old Republic on its way? No.
The Old Republic won't be the MMO you are looking for.
It will be mostly a Single Player story driven experience, heavily instanced with a chatbox slapped on top of it so it at least appears to be a online game.
The Old Reublic will mostly appeal to the KOTOR fans and console fans.... not the MMO fans that look for more then just solo story content.
I think that even SWG NGE today will still be a lot better then what SW:TOR is going to be... from a MMO point of view.
well if the majority of my guild returns too, then i would say yes. Ells i would say no, to late.... Especially when earthrise is so close to beta (yea sure, we dont know if earthrise will be good, or another dnl but i have hope)...
Six months ago: yes. Now with The Old Republic on its way? No.
The Old Republic won't be the MMO you are looking for.
It will be mostly a Single Player story driven experience, heavily instanced with a chatbox slapped on top of it so it at least appears to be a online game.
The Old Reublic will mostly appeal to the KOTOR fans and console fans.... not the MMO fans that look for more then just solo story content.
I think that even SWG NGE today will still be a lot better then what SW:TOR is going to be... from a MMO point of view.
I agree. The Old Republic sounds like it will be the best game in its class but everything released so far suggests that it will be a linear, story-led game not an open, experience-led game. As such, however good it is, I really think its success will be relatively limited. And it will not - simply because it is such a smaller game in scope - offer anything like the variety and depth of the experiences of the old SWG sandbox.
I would absolutely pay $30 for it, as I am already paying for a couple subs on other games that will never engender the feeling of "home" that SWG Pre-CU gave me. The problem is... SOE has already said they did not keep any of the Pre-CU code. which if you've worked in a software development arena you know is a baldfaced lie. They cannot now cough it up though and still retain any kind of credibility (not that we feel they have any left). It all boils down to a real shame, too. I brielfly worked with the swgprecu emulation team (now merged with (SWG: ANH) and recreating the backend server is a monumental task that is years in the doing with a group of coders that are spread out all over North America and work in their spare time for no more than the hope of recreating what never should have been lost in the first place.
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
Smedly has stated it on SWG forums that the pre-cu code was gone and it was no longer possible to roll back to it. I believe a few devs have repeated this as well.
There were several posts immediately after the NGE launched demanding a roll back. I personally read Smedley's post saying it was not technically possible to roll back to pre-nge because the code was gone.
Of course they are big fat stinkin liars. Many people called into question that statement because they surely would have backup servers and could easily just go back. Not to mention a lot of the old code is still clearly in the game with the NGE merely tacked on
As far as finding those old posts, I believe SOE purged their forums a few times since then. So unless someone archived them, I doubt you'l find it
I don't remember seeing any of that -- and I know I read everything. No one saved them? I saved the Freeman ones, the Rubenfield one, the Brenlo one -- everyone I thought was important in the interest of history, so have many others. I have NEVER seen anyone reproduce what you guys are saying.
You'd think someone would have saved the statement. When did he say it? When did the other DEVs repeat it? Do you remember which DEVs? again I don't remember seeing any of that, and I have been a consistent read of the O-Boards, these boards, and other forums since the CU.
All I have ever seen is people SAY they said it -- and no one has ever been able to furnish me a direct quote or a real context.
Comments
This has got to be the 1 millionth time this topic has been posted. Shouldn't we celebrate?
Really?
I wouldn't mind reading some musings and speculation from the past on this particular topic.
Please sir,if you don't mind can you point the way?
I just tried but interestingly the search engine appears to be hosed... even looking for swg in the subject line gets nothing. I am pretty sure there have been some posts with SWG in the subject line in this forum, lol. At any rate, step through old topic pages and you'll see other posts and polls about this.
personally i would love to play SWG pre CU again and i wouldnt hesitate to pay 30 USD for the oppertunity, but i would love it even more if a company / team would take the core gameplay mechanics of SWG (points based skill leveling system, crafted item economy, bounty hunting, player housing, lots of non combat professions, many different landscapes to adventure in) i dont care what the IP would be, as long as the gameplay was smooth (looking back the gameplay of swg wasnt all that polished) and there wasn't any massive imbalances (such as snipers 1 shotting a mind pool) and we would have a winner imho, and i wouldnt unsubscribe till the servers closed of old age lol.
looking at it now, there are a couple of mmo's on the horizons that sound like almost all of the SWG vet's wet dreams come true, and they would be earthrise and fallen earth, i dont think darkfall is going to be anywhere close to what people want out of it tbh, but my hopes remain on earthrise and hope that it can capture some of that which made SWG such a good game
If and I say if $OE had nothing to do with running it or content in it, along with the starwars folks having no say in it, then yes I would play it.
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
As it is well known outside of the Emu community I would imagine that it likely is in written format from Smed sometime in the past, but that is not my source of the comment.
So in other words you have no proof this was ever said by anyone.
I'm not your personal wikipedia. If you want proof of something feel free to Google to your heart's content. I'm satisfied with what I've seen and heard concerning Pre-CU code. That Smed is a notorious liar is hardly in doubt anymore to anyone that has bothered to pay attention to the countless statements he has released on behalf of SOE.
I have googled it. I am trying to ascertain whether this is something that has been said publicly, or something they only say privately.
I can find no place anywhere on the internet, and I can't recall, any time where anyone from SOE admitting what you are saying they have said.
No need to get testy when someone doubts your information.
fishermage.blogspot.com
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
As it is well known outside of the Emu community I would imagine that it likely is in written format from Smed sometime in the past, but that is not my source of the comment.
So in other words you have no proof this was ever said by anyone.
I'm not your personal wikipedia. If you want proof of something feel free to Google to your heart's content. I'm satisfied with what I've seen and heard concerning Pre-CU code. That Smed is a notorious liar is hardly in doubt anymore to anyone that has bothered to pay attention to the countless statements he has released on behalf of SOE.
That's kind of how I feel about this issue. I've quoted the LEC rep that said pre-cu was not technically possible, and the SOE dev that said they no longer had an understanding of the JTL code. Others have posted things they were told by SOE devs directly re. SOE being unable to work with the pre-cu code for some reason. It has all been quoted and properly cited, but probably years ago now. Digging that all up again really isn't worth the effort to me. If some folks choose not to believe it, that's fine. Skepticism doesn't usually lead to serious injury or loss of life
. Maybe it does in some circumstances, but probably not in this case.
That;s plenty of evidence that they don't have notes for or don't have the talent to deal with the old code, but not evidence for what perilous is saying -- that they do not have the old code at all.
Completely different things.
Obviously I know all the things you are saying, but for me, those things don't prove what HE is saying in the least.
fishermage.blogspot.com
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
As it is well known outside of the Emu community I would imagine that it likely is in written format from Smed sometime in the past, but that is not my source of the comment.
So in other words you have no proof this was ever said by anyone.
I'm not your personal wikipedia. If you want proof of something feel free to Google to your heart's content. I'm satisfied with what I've seen and heard concerning Pre-CU code. That Smed is a notorious liar is hardly in doubt anymore to anyone that has bothered to pay attention to the countless statements he has released on behalf of SOE.
I have googled it. I am trying to ascertain whether this is something that has been said publicly, or something they only say privately.
I can find no place anywhere on the internet, and I can't recall, any time where anyone from SOE admitting what you are saying they have said.
No need to get testy when someone doubts your information.
lol. I am not testy about being questioned as to my sources, I am satisifed as to the veracity of the information myself. You seem to expect me to link where I read this when I've already explained how I came by the information. Again, if you desire a confirmation of some sort then find it for yourself. Dragging out this one Reply with endless quoting is only ruining this thread. But then, that may well be your intention. Who can know?
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
As it is well known outside of the Emu community I would imagine that it likely is in written format from Smed sometime in the past, but that is not my source of the comment.
So in other words you have no proof this was ever said by anyone.
I'm not your personal wikipedia. If you want proof of something feel free to Google to your heart's content. I'm satisfied with what I've seen and heard concerning Pre-CU code. That Smed is a notorious liar is hardly in doubt anymore to anyone that has bothered to pay attention to the countless statements he has released on behalf of SOE.
I have googled it. I am trying to ascertain whether this is something that has been said publicly, or something they only say privately.
I can find no place anywhere on the internet, and I can't recall, any time where anyone from SOE admitting what you are saying they have said.
No need to get testy when someone doubts your information.
lol. I am not testy about being questioned as to my sources, I am satisifed as to the veracity of the information myself. You seem to expect me to link where I read this when I've already explained how I came by the information. Again, if you desire a confirmation of some sort then find it for yourself. Dragging out this one Reply with endless quoting is only ruining this thread. But then, that may well be your intention. Who can know?
I can't find it for myself, and you can't provide it for me.
fishermage.blogspot.com
No.
$30 a month? $360 a year? For a game? That's just silly.
PreCU was barely worth 15 bucks a month, no way at double that. There are too many better games at less cost. If you think preCU was worth 30 bucks, you are remembering a different game, my friend.
You want speculation? The majority of gamers who are not hanging out here just to look for something to argue about won't even consider such a thing.
No.
$30 a month? $360 a year? For a game? That's just silly.
PreCU was barely worth 15 bucks a month, no way at double that. There are too many better games at less cost. If you think preCU was worth 30 bucks, you are remembering a different game, my friend.
You want speculation? The majority of gamers who are not hanging out here just to look for something to argue about won't even consider such a thing.
Too many better games? Name them, please. I've played nearly everything out there and while playing each and every one I found myself pining away for Pre-CU SWG. I've found no other game that got so much "right". Without a doubt Pre-CU had it's bugs and irregularities, but so do all games. I made peace with it's faults and I still yearn to play it again.
No.
$30 a month? $360 a year? For a game? That's just silly.
PreCU was barely worth 15 bucks a month, no way at double that. There are too many better games at less cost. If you think preCU was worth 30 bucks, you are remembering a different game, my friend.
You want speculation? The majority of gamers who are not hanging out here just to look for something to argue about won't even consider such a thing.
Better games..? Anyway....
As I stated before I set up SWG as example..nothing more.
I would be willing to pay $30 USD/per month for ANY IP launched by any independent developer that was a radical and welcomed departure from the current popular MMORPG paradigm.(That will actually launch and not stay in development for over half a decade)
I was curious to see what consensus I would draw on the topic. Because....
It is my firm belief that if a indy publisher/developer is going to develop and launch a AAA game in a timely manner (that is worth a damn)that will draw a certain niche playerbase they are going to have to make up for the sheer lack of volume somehow....and I for one would be willing to do my part in supporting this hypothetical project.
Many will cite EvE O as an example of the fact that it has been done and for $15 USD. Um no...EvE launched nearly 6 years ago and has been slowly ramping up since then...if launched today I sincerly doubt EvE would survive for long let alone thrive...niche or not.
The rabid loyalty of the playerbase and the developers are the main reasons that have kept EvE O afloat in the turbulent storm of this market.
As for $360 dollars a year to play a game comment..come on man.. you probably spend more in vending machines every year. You wouldn't pay a lousy dollar a day to enjoy an innovative and well implemented game??
Perhaps..? this attitude is contributing factor as to why the genre has been in the doldrums for so long?
No need for $OE /LA anymore ..community can bring it on on themselves...We will give these suckers nothing ..
But we will support the ones giving us back what $OE/LA broke and don't deserve anymore ...
Starwars is now i the hands of the fans and belongs to the world and not to the shtty moneygrabbing and sucking $OE or LA
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
I, for one, think the People at SWGEMU are doing a Great job of remaking the Pre CU - NGE game that we all loved. They've come a long way and are redoing the code from scratch...
Check it out at: http://www.swgemu.com/
Its Free to Play and they have a New front end to login, you just need your old SWG disc's to install with...
Talk U later...
Timby
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
Smedly has stated it on SWG forums that the pre-cu code was gone and it was no longer possible to roll back to it. I believe a few devs have repeated this as well.
There were several posts immediately after the NGE launched demanding a roll back. I personally read Smedley's post saying it was not technically possible to roll back to pre-nge because the code was gone.
Of course they are big fat stinkin liars. Many people called into question that statement because they surely would have backup servers and could easily just go back. Not to mention a lot of the old code is still clearly in the game with the NGE merely tacked on
As far as finding those old posts, I believe SOE purged their forums a few times since then. So unless someone archived them, I doubt you'l find it
Dont beleive a word soe say. When one of hteir big shots makes a statement, hes lying (cash shop anyone?)
I'm not a no life that sits in front of his computer all day long, I'm an intern that sits in front of his computer all day long.
I wouldn't pay $30 for the privilege of playing pre-CU. Actually, i wouldn't pay $5. Broken classes and didn't like the game mechanics......... group 'solo' hunting? Wtf was that?
I'd recommend going back and re-reading the OP, I think you missed something.
BTW solo groups were kind of weird of course, but they were sort of fun as well. I had many great conversations with people I'd likely not have met otherwise. They didn't do much for gameplay but they did a great deal for community.
I'd recommend going back and re-reading the OP, I think you missed something.
BTW solo groups were kind of weird of course, but they were sort of fun as well. I had many great conversations with people I'd likely not have met otherwise. They didn't do much for gameplay but they did a great deal for community.
I reread the OP. He did say "revamp." I assume this means a complete polish and reworking of the game to WoW standards - generally cited as the standard by which game completeness should be judged.
So we imagine preCU gameplay, without any of the bugs or broken gameplay, reasonably balanced, content in addition to open gameplay. In otherwords, the sandbox paradise we all imagined and wished for. Would I pay $30 a month for that?
Very possibly. Show it to me and then we'll talk.
For $30, I would expect the game to be totally supported, continual rebalancing where needed, additional expansions added regularly, the inclusion of new content fully tested and the proper implementation of all the old dynamics - unlockable jedi, TEFs, complex crafting, BF, three-bar HAM etc.
But if they could do that then, sure, I'd sign up in an instant.
The Old Republic won't be the MMO you are looking for.
It will be mostly a Single Player story driven experience, heavily instanced with a chatbox slapped on top of it so it at least appears to be a online game.
The Old Reublic will mostly appeal to the KOTOR fans and console fans.... not the MMO fans that look for more then just solo story content.
I think that even SWG NGE today will still be a lot better then what SW:TOR is going to be... from a MMO point of view.
well if the majority of my guild returns too, then i would say yes. Ells i would say no, to late....
Especially when earthrise is so close to beta (yea sure, we dont know if earthrise will be good, or another dnl but i have hope)...
The Old Republic won't be the MMO you are looking for.
It will be mostly a Single Player story driven experience, heavily instanced with a chatbox slapped on top of it so it at least appears to be a online game.
The Old Reublic will mostly appeal to the KOTOR fans and console fans.... not the MMO fans that look for more then just solo story content.
I think that even SWG NGE today will still be a lot better then what SW:TOR is going to be... from a MMO point of view.
I agree. The Old Republic sounds like it will be the best game in its class but everything released so far suggests that it will be a linear, story-led game not an open, experience-led game. As such, however good it is, I really think its success will be relatively limited. And it will not - simply because it is such a smaller game in scope - offer anything like the variety and depth of the experiences of the old SWG sandbox.
Can you show me where they said they did not keep the code? I don't remember seeing that. I have seen people say that they said this, but never seen it backed up with a link or proper citing.
When the Emu team first got together there was an effort to get all their ducks in a row legally. To that end they had a conference call with SOE, and yes Smedley chimed in on the lack of existing Pre-CU code. He also was amusingly skeptical of any private coding group's chances of recreating a backend server without that original code. His parting words were along the lines of, "Knock yourselves out trying."
So you personally took part in this conference call and you personally heard Smedley say they no longer had the code?
When I joined the team I asked about the legality of what we were doing and was then told about the conference call. The call was recorded and I got to listen to it. I couldn't imagine anyone going to the trouble of engineering a false recording just to soothe the fears of a few guys worried about the legality of what they were attempting, so I have no reason to doubt what I heard.
So they have never admitted this publicly? Just to the EMU team via conference call?
Smedly has stated it on SWG forums that the pre-cu code was gone and it was no longer possible to roll back to it. I believe a few devs have repeated this as well.
There were several posts immediately after the NGE launched demanding a roll back. I personally read Smedley's post saying it was not technically possible to roll back to pre-nge because the code was gone.
Of course they are big fat stinkin liars. Many people called into question that statement because they surely would have backup servers and could easily just go back. Not to mention a lot of the old code is still clearly in the game with the NGE merely tacked on
As far as finding those old posts, I believe SOE purged their forums a few times since then. So unless someone archived them, I doubt you'l find it
I don't remember seeing any of that -- and I know I read everything. No one saved them? I saved the Freeman ones, the Rubenfield one, the Brenlo one -- everyone I thought was important in the interest of history, so have many others. I have NEVER seen anyone reproduce what you guys are saying.
You'd think someone would have saved the statement. When did he say it? When did the other DEVs repeat it? Do you remember which DEVs? again I don't remember seeing any of that, and I have been a consistent read of the O-Boards, these boards, and other forums since the CU.
All I have ever seen is people SAY they said it -- and no one has ever been able to furnish me a direct quote or a real context.
fishermage.blogspot.com