If I had to guess is no excuse for being completely wrong when 5 minutes of GOOGLE could have explained it all. Instead of calling me a name, try educating yourself on the topic you want to discuss. I did it, so can you. Now grow a thicker skin and get over it.
I'm sorry. I guess I just expected a 35 year old to be a little more mature and not so quick to flame.
I am sorry I must have missed the part where I was flaming you instead of correcting multiple inaccuracies. You seem to mix up the two things. If telling you to get an education is flaming then you might need that which I pointed out. If you were mature in any way shape or form you would have simply said you were wrong and moved on. Grow up already. You were wrong and instead of learning you are acting butthurt. No one is impressed. Get over it.
I am sorry to have turned this into something more than it had to be. I am over it, Rokurgepta. I think you caught me on a bad day. lol
Sorry for the wasted thread space everyone.
Sadly it might not have been us killing the thread. It is more likely a lack of interest due to Turbines lack of management skills. They have great devs but the people in charge at times seem hell bent on ruining the good work they do. Just check the DDO official forums, the number of posts a day in general are dwindling the longer it takes to get MOD9 out to the players and with it now taking until June more people are floating away for now. The Community relations people spend as little time as possible communicating and when asked about it either make jokes, threaten to cut back communication more(impossible unless they took down the boards they run) or tell you the other parts of their job. My customers do not want to hear those lame excuses when they feel ignored and I would not even think of offering them as they are pathetic excuses.
Sadly it might not have been us killing the thread. It is more likely a lack of interest due to Turbines lack of management skills. They have great devs but the people in charge at times seem hell bent on ruining the good work they do. Just check the DDO official forums, the number of posts a day in general are dwindling the longer it takes to get MOD9 out to the players and with it now taking until June more people are floating away for now. The Community relations people spend as little time as possible communicating and when asked about it either make jokes, threaten to cut back communication more(impossible unless they took down the boards they run) or tell you the other parts of their job. My customers do not want to hear those lame excuses when they feel ignored and I would not even think of offering them as they are pathetic excuses.
So true, my former guildmates told me that when the Community Relations people were asked a question about when the next module was going to be released, they responded with a vague riddle and would not even confirm or deny the answer to that riddle.
Nothing like getting your entire community riled up for hours solving a puzzle to hear the answer "coming soon".
Honestly if they said nothing at all it would have been better than responding in such a way. My guess is that must have been Tolero - the most useless and helpless Community Relations person ever to date. Before I left the game, I sent her a long private message on the forums and challenged her to stand up to Turbine and not play the mouthpiece. Part of her job is to be a customer advocate to the board room meetings. If the community is being consistently shunned (and I'm sorry who could possibly say otherwise), then it is not all to blame on the producers and executives. This is a misappropriation of responsibility.
A customer relations person has a duty and obligation to advocate for the customer. If they fail to do this effectively the result is that the community has no voice. It is not enough to sit at a table and say "the community wants to hear more from us" and leave it at that. If Tolero is not effective at changing the mindset of the producers and executives to be more open, then she is the wrong person for the job.
When you consider what people are asking for, in reality there is not much favor being asked of Turbine. People are simply asking for communication and a simple answer to a basic question, "Is this game worth paying for anymore?" Ultimately, people have to come to their own conclusion (as I have, and gratefully so) about this. I have saved nearly $200 since I left DDO in monthly fees for a game that has only had two (relatively minor) updates since I left.
I can honestly say that the value that I saved from cancelling FAR exceeds anything I could have gained by paying to stay. Even when you consider I played since release and have friends, relatives, etc. who played the game, the cost was too much for too little. I don't need to pay that kind of money to interact with these people. That is something that I can do without the hassle that is Turbine.
Sadly it might not have been us killing the thread. It is more likely a lack of interest due to Turbines lack of management skills. They have great devs but the people in charge at times seem hell bent on ruining the good work they do. Just check the DDO official forums, the number of posts a day in general are dwindling the longer it takes to get MOD9 out to the players and with it now taking until June more people are floating away for now. The Community relations people spend as little time as possible communicating and when asked about it either make jokes, threaten to cut back communication more(impossible unless they took down the boards they run) or tell you the other parts of their job. My customers do not want to hear those lame excuses when they feel ignored and I would not even think of offering them as they are pathetic excuses.
So true, my former guildmates told me that when the Community Relations people were asked a question about when the next module was going to be released, they responded with a vague riddle and would not even confirm or deny the answer to that riddle.
Nothing like getting your entire community riled up for hours solving a puzzle to hear the answer "coming soon".
Honestly if they said nothing at all it would have been better than responding in such a way. My guess is that must have been Tolero - the most useless and helpless Community Relations person ever to date. Before I left the game, I sent her a long private message on the forums and challenged her to stand up to Turbine and not play the mouthpiece. Part of her job is to be a customer advocate to the board room meetings. If the community is being consistently shunned (and I'm sorry who could possibly say otherwise), then it is not all to blame on the producers and executives. This is a misappropriation of responsibility.
A customer relations person has a duty and obligation to advocate for the customer. If they fail to do this effectively the result is that the community has no voice. It is not enough to sit at a table and say "the community wants to hear more from us" and leave it at that. If Tolero is not effective at changing the mindset of the producers and executives to be more open, then she is the wrong person for the job.
When you consider what people are asking for, in reality there is not much favor being asked of Turbine. People are simply asking for communication and a simple answer to a basic question, "Is this game worth paying for anymore?" Ultimately, people have to come to their own conclusion (as I have, and gratefully so) about this. I have saved nearly $200 since I left DDO in monthly fees for a game that has only had two (relatively minor) updates since I left.
I can honestly say that the value that I saved from cancelling FAR exceeds anything I could have gained by paying to stay. Even when you consider I played since release and have friends, relatives, etc. who played the game, the cost was too much for too little. I don't need to pay that kind of money to interact with these people. That is something that I can do without the hassle that is Turbine.
I actually feel bad for Tolero, she was hired as an events coordinator based on the fun events she led in game as a player. Turbine hired her for a strength she had but never used her in that way and instead made her a communit relations person and she seems to not be very good at that. She tends to threaten the players with threats of less communication when she is not happy with the tone of the forums. Well the forums are that way because Turbine has started to moderate much less than 2 years ago and because they have created the atmosphere and cultivate it with their lazy attitudes toward the players.
They made claims they simply have failed to live up to many times and while I am staying until MOD9 I will be gone if it fails to meet my expectations.
Sadly it might not have been us killing the thread. It is more likely a lack of interest due to Turbines lack of management skills. They have great devs but the people in charge at times seem hell bent on ruining the good work they do. Just check the DDO official forums, the number of posts a day in general are dwindling the longer it takes to get MOD9 out to the players and with it now taking until June more people are floating away for now. The Community relations people spend as little time as possible communicating and when asked about it either make jokes, threaten to cut back communication more(impossible unless they took down the boards they run) or tell you the other parts of their job. My customers do not want to hear those lame excuses when they feel ignored and I would not even think of offering them as they are pathetic excuses.
So true, my former guildmates told me that when the Community Relations people were asked a question about when the next module was going to be released, they responded with a vague riddle and would not even confirm or deny the answer to that riddle.
Nothing like getting your entire community riled up for hours solving a puzzle to hear the answer "coming soon".
Honestly if they said nothing at all it would have been better than responding in such a way. My guess is that must have been Tolero - the most useless and helpless Community Relations person ever to date. Before I left the game, I sent her a long private message on the forums and challenged her to stand up to Turbine and not play the mouthpiece. Part of her job is to be a customer advocate to the board room meetings. If the community is being consistently shunned (and I'm sorry who could possibly say otherwise), then it is not all to blame on the producers and executives. This is a misappropriation of responsibility.
A customer relations person has a duty and obligation to advocate for the customer. If they fail to do this effectively the result is that the community has no voice. It is not enough to sit at a table and say "the community wants to hear more from us" and leave it at that. If Tolero is not effective at changing the mindset of the producers and executives to be more open, then she is the wrong person for the job.
When you consider what people are asking for, in reality there is not much favor being asked of Turbine. People are simply asking for communication and a simple answer to a basic question, "Is this game worth paying for anymore?" Ultimately, people have to come to their own conclusion (as I have, and gratefully so) about this. I have saved nearly $200 since I left DDO in monthly fees for a game that has only had two (relatively minor) updates since I left.
I can honestly say that the value that I saved from cancelling FAR exceeds anything I could have gained by paying to stay. Even when you consider I played since release and have friends, relatives, etc. who played the game, the cost was too much for too little. I don't need to pay that kind of money to interact with these people. That is something that I can do without the hassle that is Turbine.
My opinion, speculation:
The funnies part about this is all is that those who are complaining (vets) will leave in coming months, and the game will be reborn, free of tiring rants. Face it vets, you're bored with the game. And hoping for Turbine to work faster... well, do you people hope for it? Or even believe it?
Sure, I think DDO will get much richer and get much more players, but it may boost the speed of development over a year or two, not over next few months.
At the same time, newcomers will have great time with the game which is now quite big in my opinion. Lots of things to do, if didn't play for last 3 years, that is. Let it go, for the good of us all. Maybe a year later you'll be happy to return.
I'm sure Turbine is doing everything they can, and I'm happy there's no more release dates. I hope there will be no release dates ever, I'd prefer to be surprised with new updates. Deadlines in DDO are too easy to miss. Read these articles for some knowledge, and keep in mind that those people speak about games so simple as WAR or GW, and comparing to DDO...
I mean, DDO interactive environment isn't matched by any other MMO to date, not to mention skills, feats and other D&D mechanics, which you can't just "change" to fit the game code better.
I'd also encourage to read Sanya's blog posts, and forum posts here. Ranting without an idea of how things are in reality is very easy, you know. But mature thing, wise thing and constructive thing is trying to understand "why" first. Only then you can tell if there's any point in repeating myths which we all would love to be true - we pay them, after all, so we don't like to understand anything, we just want to get everything. Is there any sense in such approach? I'm afraid, there's none. But it will take years until MMO players will understand how MMO development works, why delays, why silence, etc.
PS: Please treat it as my own subjective opinion, and really out of good will. I try not to answer to rants / accusations / offenses ever again, that's pointless.
Sadly it might not have been us killing the thread. It is more likely a lack of interest due to Turbines lack of management skills. They have great devs but the people in charge at times seem hell bent on ruining the good work they do. Just check the DDO official forums, the number of posts a day in general are dwindling the longer it takes to get MOD9 out to the players and with it now taking until June more people are floating away for now. The Community relations people spend as little time as possible communicating and when asked about it either make jokes, threaten to cut back communication more(impossible unless they took down the boards they run) or tell you the other parts of their job. My customers do not want to hear those lame excuses when they feel ignored and I would not even think of offering them as they are pathetic excuses.
So true, my former guildmates told me that when the Community Relations people were asked a question about when the next module was going to be released, they responded with a vague riddle and would not even confirm or deny the answer to that riddle.
Nothing like getting your entire community riled up for hours solving a puzzle to hear the answer "coming soon".
Honestly if they said nothing at all it would have been better than responding in such a way. My guess is that must have been Tolero - the most useless and helpless Community Relations person ever to date. Before I left the game, I sent her a long private message on the forums and challenged her to stand up to Turbine and not play the mouthpiece. Part of her job is to be a customer advocate to the board room meetings. If the community is being consistently shunned (and I'm sorry who could possibly say otherwise), then it is not all to blame on the producers and executives. This is a misappropriation of responsibility.
A customer relations person has a duty and obligation to advocate for the customer. If they fail to do this effectively the result is that the community has no voice. It is not enough to sit at a table and say "the community wants to hear more from us" and leave it at that. If Tolero is not effective at changing the mindset of the producers and executives to be more open, then she is the wrong person for the job.
When you consider what people are asking for, in reality there is not much favor being asked of Turbine. People are simply asking for communication and a simple answer to a basic question, "Is this game worth paying for anymore?" Ultimately, people have to come to their own conclusion (as I have, and gratefully so) about this. I have saved nearly $200 since I left DDO in monthly fees for a game that has only had two (relatively minor) updates since I left.
I can honestly say that the value that I saved from cancelling FAR exceeds anything I could have gained by paying to stay. Even when you consider I played since release and have friends, relatives, etc. who played the game, the cost was too much for too little. I don't need to pay that kind of money to interact with these people. That is something that I can do without the hassle that is Turbine.
My opinion, speculation:
The funnies part about this is all is that those who are complaining (vets) will leave in coming months, and the game will be reborn, free of tiring rants. Face it vets, you're bored with the game. And hoping for Turbine to work faster... well, do you people hope for it? Or even believe it?
At the same time, newcomers will have great time with the game which is now quite big in my opinion. Lots of things to do, if didn't play for last 3 years, that is. Let it go, for the good of us all. Maybe a year later you'll be happy to return.
I'm sure Turbine is doing everything they can, and I'm happy there's no more release dates. I hope there will be no release dates ever, I'd prefer to be surprised with new updates. Deadlines in DDO are too easy to miss. Read these articles for some knowledge, and keep in mind that those people speak about games so simple as WAR or GW, and comparing to DDO...
I mean, DDO interactive environment isn't matched by any other MMO to date, not to mention skills, feats and other D&D mechanics, which you can't just "change" to fit the game code better.
I'd also encourage to read Sanya's blog posts, and forum posts here. Ranting without an idea of how things are in reality is very easy, you know. But mature thing, wise thing and constructive thing is trying to understand "why" first. Only then you can tell if there's any point in repeating myths which we all would love to be true - we pay them, after all, so we don't like to understand anything, we just want to get everything. Is there any sense in such approach? I'm afraid, there's none. But it will take years until MMO players will understand how MMO development works, why delays, why silence, etc.
You talk about people having no knowledge yet you make the claim that WAR and GW are simple. Maybe you should get more knowledge before posting things you fail to understand. No one is saying making games is simple, people are pointing out that failure to be close to target dates and no communication are a failed business plan no matter your product.
How do you expect the Vets leaving to allow DDO to be reborn? Do you see lots of advertising that would attract new players? Sarr do you read what you post? You live in fantasyland when it comes to Turbine and DDO. You need to make an effort to attract newcomers before you chase off the people who have supported this game for 3 years. It is not people like you, you think you are more important but the truth is the people who have paid 15 a month for 36 months are. I am not one of them either. But when you see on the boards former fanboys like you who defended everything now saying goodbye it makes you understand how bad Turbine is screwing up with this. Sorry if your rose colored glasses do not allow you to see this.
You seem to think people have no right to complain andf to that I say please give it a rest fanboy.
They have changed D&D mechanics to fit the game world not to mention invented things they needed to make D7D into an MMORPG. Do you even know the game you claim to play? You make ridiculous comments that make me wonder if you play DDO the online game by Turbine. The actual enviroment is not interactive in DDO, the NPCs do nothing there is little in the game world that you can interact with. The combat is great and that is about the only thing DDO has on other MMOs. There is not much outside of combat to do in DDO.
You seem to be the one ranting with no basis in reality. Your Turbine love blinds you to reality and facts.
Honestly if they said nothing at all it would have been better than responding in such a way. My guess is that must have been Tolero - the most useless and helpless Community Relations person ever to date. Before I left the game, I sent her a long private message on the forums and challenged her to stand up to Turbine and not play the mouthpiece. Part of her job is to be a customer advocate to the board room meetings. If the community is being consistently shunned (and I'm sorry who could possibly say otherwise), then it is not all to blame on the producers and executives. This is a misappropriation of responsibility. A customer relations person has a duty and obligation to advocate for the customer. If they fail to do this effectively the result is that the community has no voice. It is not enough to sit at a table and say "the community wants to hear more from us" and leave it at that. If Tolero is not effective at changing the mindset of the producers and executives to be more open, then she is the wrong person for the job.
With all due respect that's not how it works at all.
At all.
they are not hired on your behalf. They are hired on the behalf of the company.
It is not their job to stand up to their employers. It is their job to act as a mediator between customer and the company but always with the company's interests at heart.
That's how it works in my current company and my last company.
Companies do not hire customer service people or even client reps to essentially give away the farm.
they do want happy customers but within the confines of what the company is wiling to give/provide.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Honestly if they said nothing at all it would have been better than responding in such a way. My guess is that must have been Tolero - the most useless and helpless Community Relations person ever to date. Before I left the game, I sent her a long private message on the forums and challenged her to stand up to Turbine and not play the mouthpiece. Part of her job is to be a customer advocate to the board room meetings. If the community is being consistently shunned (and I'm sorry who could possibly say otherwise), then it is not all to blame on the producers and executives. This is a misappropriation of responsibility. A customer relations person has a duty and obligation to advocate for the customer. If they fail to do this effectively the result is that the community has no voice. It is not enough to sit at a table and say "the community wants to hear more from us" and leave it at that. If Tolero is not effective at changing the mindset of the producers and executives to be more open, then she is the wrong person for the job.
With all due respect that's not how it works at all.
At all.
they are not hired on your behalf. They are hired on the behalf of the company.
It is not their job to stand up to their employers. It is their job to act as a mediator between customer and the company but always with the company's interests at heart.
That's how it works in my current company and my last company.
Companies do not hire customer service people or even client reps to essentially give away the farm.
they do want happy customers but within the confines of what the company is wiling to give/provide.
Tolero is not really Customer Service her title is community relations and as such she does take player concerns to the next level, but there is no way in hell her job is to stand up for the players in meetings. Her job is to relay information she has gathered and put it into understandable forms.
Customer service people have one goal, deal with you as little as possible while retaining your business. If they do it well enough some companies pay a bonus.
With all due respect that's not how it works at all.
At all.
they are not hired on your behalf. They are hired on the behalf of the company.
It is not their job to stand up to their employers. It is their job to act as a mediator between customer and the company but always with the company's interests at heart.
That's how it works in my current company and my last company.
Companies do not hire customer service people or even client reps to essentially give away the farm.
they do want happy customers but within the confines of what the company is wiling to give/provide.
While working for a company is admirable, until you own one and run it your view will always be limited to how your "company" operates. So I have a little assignment for you: go run a business for 5 years, come back and tell me if you don't look at the value of your customers a little differently. That is, with all due respect.
Turbine is a privately held company that is regarded as the "small business" of MMO's. While they have some big titles, they are still an extremely small shop. They are mom + pop all the way. No corporate setting would allow a husband and wife to lead a division of their company, ever. That's just absurd to even think about and I won't bother delving into that any further. Anyways, what this tells you about Turbine is how they run their company. They run it with an emphasis on their own little "family" more than their customers. To them, their achievements are about them... not about the customer. They can offer lip service about how they are in this business to provide entertainment for others, but the reality is they are more concerned with the "tone" of the forums, and making sure everyone is "playing nicely" despite the fact that they put tacks in the sandbox. No wonder people can feel little sharp stings while "playing" in Turbine's world.
This is why they respond to harsh criticism with bans, thread deletes and downright temper tantrums. Previous community persons such as Samera and Quarion were absolute amateur's at communicating with people. Samera had a meltdown once on the forums that basically insulted the entire community for not being nice to her. Quarion was no better. His rants with "Kommunity Kobold" absolutely banning people left and right. It got so bad at one point, I had a conversation with Meghan Rodberg, aka Patience, that led to Kommunity Kobold's retirement and assurances that Quarion would act with an even keel next time.
If you ever, and I mean ever, go into a restaurant, or a retail store or any other establishment, they have a duty and obligation to provide honest service. If you are ever discriminated against while in a store, or denied service based on a number of things such as sex, race, religion, even arrest record or sexual preference - the rules of a business running things 'their way' do NOT apply. What this tells you is that there is a bright line test for companies that run a business in this country (USA). There are more obligations that they have than you think. Acting in good faith is another one. Not engaging in fraudulent billing practices is another. Arguably, Turbine has struggled with both of these. For almost 6 months, people were getting double-billed due to an accounting problem which took Turbine a long time to fix. Accidental or not, for a long time this went on, where Turbine remedied simply by having customers call in and request a refund (repeatedly in some cases). Acting in good faith has come under question with their lack of communication, especially as it relates to announcing "announcements" to occur a day or two after billing cycles, only to find out they are announcing cutbacks in development, or that expected patches would be delayed.
When you really look at Turbine in the prism of customer-first... they have done a terrible job. It is asbolutely indefensible at best, and unethical at worst. You wouldn't be able to tell me that Turbine knows anything about customer service, and with all "due" respect, neither do you.
With all due respect that's not how it works at all.
At all.
they are not hired on your behalf. They are hired on the behalf of the company.
It is not their job to stand up to their employers. It is their job to act as a mediator between customer and the company but always with the company's interests at heart.
That's how it works in my current company and my last company.
Companies do not hire customer service people or even client reps to essentially give away the farm.
they do want happy customers but within the confines of what the company is wiling to give/provide.
While working for a company is admirable, until you own one and run it your view will always be limited to how your "company" operates. So I have a little assignment for you: go run a business for 5 years, come back and tell me if you don't look at the value of your customers a little differently. That is, with all due respect.
Turbine is a privately held company that is regarded as the "small business" of MMO's. While they have some big titles, they are still an extremely small shop. They are mom + pop all the way. No corporate setting would allow a husband and wife to lead a division of their company, ever. That's just absurd to even think about and I won't bother delving into that any further. Anyways, what this tells you about Turbine is how they run their company. They run it with an emphasis on their own little "family" more than their customers. To them, their achievements are about them... not about the customer. They can offer lip service about how they are in this business to provide entertainment for others, but the reality is they are more concerned with the "tone" of the forums, and making sure everyone is "playing nicely" despite the fact that they put tacks in the sandbox. No wonder people can feel little sharp stings while "playing" in Turbine's world.
This is why they respond to harsh criticism with bans, thread deletes and downright temper tantrums. Previous community persons such as Samera and Quarion were absolute amateur's at communicating with people. Samera had a meltdown once on the forums that basically insulted the entire community for not being nice to her. Quarion was no better. His rants with "Kommunity Kobold" absolutely banning people left and right. It got so bad at one point, I had a conversation with Meghan Rodberg, aka Patience, that led to Kommunity Kobold's retirement and assurances that Quarion would act with an even keel next time.
If you ever, and I mean ever, go into a restaurant, or a retail store or any other establishment, they have a duty and obligation to provide honest service. If you are ever discriminated against while in a store, or denied service based on a number of things such as sex, race, religion, even arrest record or sexual preference - the rules of a business running things 'their way' do NOT apply. What this tells you is that there is a bright line test for companies that run a business in this country (USA). There are more obligations that they have than you think. Acting in good faith is another one. Not engaging in fraudulent billing practices is another. Arguably, Turbine has struggled with both of these. For almost 6 months, people were getting double-billed due to an accounting problem which took Turbine a long time to fix. Accidental or not, for a long time this went on, where Turbine remedied simply by having customers call in and request a refund (repeatedly in some cases). Acting in good faith has come under question with their lack of communication, especially as it relates to announcing "announcements" to occur a day or two after billing cycles, only to find out they are announcing cutbacks in development, or that expected patches would be delayed.
When you really look at Turbine in the prism of customer-first... they have done a terrible job. It is asbolutely indefensible at best, and unethical at worst. You wouldn't be able to tell me that Turbine knows anything about customer service, and with all "due" respect, neither do you.
I think you missed the point of his post completely. I did not see him defending Turbine at all. He was simply stating the truth, it is not the CSRs or customer releations peoples job to fight for the customer. Their job is to help the customer or relay information but no should expect them to risk getting fired to argue with the bosses.
You completely missed what he said and your rant was so offbase as to be almost humorous. I think all non fanboys agree Turbine sucks at customer treatment and runs their business in what looks to be pretty poor fashion. In many other markets they would have closed up long ago, but for some reason way too many MMO players seem to think they pay $15 a month for whatever they get and no one should want or expect more.
I am only on the fifth day but so far not all bad.
It has a great community where I have met nothing but friendly helpful people to run dungeons with. Sadly, thats all it seems to be is a dungeon runner. I mean I know the name of the game is DUNGEONS & Dragons but come on. lol. That has nothing to do with what the game of D&D is at its core.
Roleplaying ( another huge aspect of the original D&D ) is almost non-existant. With all the "Yo" and "Sup" and voice chat kills any kind of immersion a true roleplayer would hope to have.
I am having a pretty good time with my dwarf ranger. Nice damage and moves through a dungeon pretty well, even if she may have to "muscle it" through any traps she may stumble across.
A big disappointment is my favorite class, the rogue, is almost a practical joke. The "hiding" and "move silently" skills have little effect due to every dungeon containing some monsters that are programmed to attack you as soon as your enter a room, or open a door. Its pretty disappointing that with sky high move silently skills I still get spotted by pety spiders and rats.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
I am only on the fifth day but so far not all bad.
It has a great community where I have met nothing but friendly helpful people to run dungeons with. Sadly, thats all it seems to be is a dungeon runner. I mean I know the name of the game is DUNGEONS & Dragons but come on. lol. That has nothing to do with what the game of D&D is at its core.
Roleplaying ( another huge aspect of the original D&D ) is almost non-existant. With all the "Yo" and "Sup" and voice chat kills any kind of immersion a true roleplayer would hope to have.
I am having a pretty good time with my dwarf ranger. Nice damage and moves through a dungeon pretty well, even if she may have to "muscle it" through any traps she may stumble across.
A big disappointment is my favorite class, the rogue, is almost a practical joke. The "hiding" and "move silently" skills have little effect due to every dungeon containing some monsters that are programmed to attack you as soon as your enter a room, or open a door. Its pretty disappointing that with sky high move silently skills I still get spotted by pety spiders and rats.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
Don't feel bad, most of the MMO world felt disappointed with the game in some way or another. Far beyond the typical "all new MMO's suck", DDO really bit it (**NOT hit-it) big with the community at large. For many different reasons, DDO failed to capture the interest of even a modest number of gamers. Not to say that it wasn't a novel idea to try a D&D MMO, but I think everyone will agree if you took the same game and gave it to a different development studio, they would have done much better with it.
Mix in a mediocre game, with a slow development cycle and bad customer service and you've got one helluva flop.
big disappointment is my favorite class, the rogue, is almost a practical joke. The "hiding" and "move silently" skills have little effect due to every dungeon containing some monsters that are programmed to attack you as soon as your enter a room, or open a door. Its pretty disappointing that with sky high move silently skills I still get spotted by pety spiders and rats.
The stealth in DDO is actually an excellent tool, you just have to learn how to use it. Some creatures like oozes and vermin (spiders, scorpions) can find you when in stealth mode because they don't see you... they feel you moving. At higher levels some creatures have the See Invisibility spell. Targeting them and pressing Z will show you any buffs they might have up.
In order to sneak you have to toggle the stealth feat, the Hide and Move Silently skills are not passive. I've got a rogue built for stealth and sneak attack that is a blast to solo, it just takes time to get used to how it works.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
You get all martial weapon proficiencies when you take a fighter level, but you lose your monk centered bonuses when you use a non-monk weapon. The monk special attacks for example will only work with monk weapons (kama, quarterstaff, handwraps). (you keep your wisdom bonus to AC and evasion as long as you don't wear a shield or armor no matter what weapon you use).
Be sure to check the official forums for a dungeon crawling or roleplaying guild and run in a few groups before your trial is over. Running dungeons with a group is the focus of DDO. Try to stear clear of veteran groups zerging through the low level content though, it will ruin a lot of quests for a new player.
I am only on the fifth day but so far not all bad.
It has a great community where I have met nothing but friendly helpful people to run dungeons with. Sadly, thats all it seems to be is a dungeon runner. I mean I know the name of the game is DUNGEONS & Dragons but come on. lol. That has nothing to do with what the game of D&D is at its core.
It is very quest heavy, personally I wouldn't mind other distractions as well. Just not big open areas and random spawns that annoys me too much. Community is very good, the forum community lets the in game community down at least in my experience.
Roleplaying ( another huge aspect of the original D&D ) is almost non-existant. With all the "Yo" and "Sup" and voice chat kills any kind of immersion a true roleplayer would hope to have.
You need to find yourself a roleplaying guild. I am not a MMO roleplayer I find the graphics too limiting on imagination, but I will sometime group with a roleplaying guild and the right people can create some good roleplaying especially as the quest backdrops are pretty neat.
I am having a pretty good time with my dwarf ranger. Nice damage and moves through a dungeon pretty well, even if she may have to "muscle it" through any traps she may stumble across.
Traps really bite on Elite, especially as you get higher in the game.
A big disappointment is my favorite class, the rogue, is almost a practical joke. The "hiding" and "move silently" skills have little effect due to every dungeon containing some monsters that are programmed to attack you as soon as your enter a room, or open a door. Its pretty disappointing that with sky high move silently skills I still get spotted by pety spiders and rats.
Spiders have tremorsense "A spider can detect and pinpoint any creature or object within 60 ft in contact with the ground....". Apart from them and a few others you can stealth quite well almost touching mobs as you move past, and even cause noises to distract them so they look away and you can use an object. Stealthy Repossession is a good quest for trying out your stealth as it requires you not to kill certain mobs.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am sure someone can explain why?
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
Well at least you gave it a try.
Might be worth trying some grouping with some friends as dungeons play a lot better with people you know and don't know the quests. Also try Irestone Inlet if you want to do something not in a dungeon for a change, I quite like it, although without spoiling it an explosion would have finished it off nicely.
I am only on the fifth day but so far not all bad.
It has a great community where I have met nothing but friendly helpful people to run dungeons with. Sadly, thats all it seems to be is a dungeon runner. I mean I know the name of the game is DUNGEONS & Dragons but come on. lol. That has nothing to do with what the game of D&D is at its core.
Roleplaying ( another huge aspect of the original D&D ) is almost non-existant. With all the "Yo" and "Sup" and voice chat kills any kind of immersion a true roleplayer would hope to have.
I am having a pretty good time with my dwarf ranger. Nice damage and moves through a dungeon pretty well, even if she may have to "muscle it" through any traps she may stumble across.
A big disappointment is my favorite class, the rogue, is almost a practical joke. The "hiding" and "move silently" skills have little effect due to every dungeon containing some monsters that are programmed to attack you as soon as your enter a room, or open a door. Its pretty disappointing that with sky high move silently skills I still get spotted by pety spiders and rats.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
After you took the fighter level what weapons did you use? Did you start to dual weild? Were you sword and board? Did you go with a two handed weapon like a greataxe?
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
After you took the fighter level what weapons did you use? Did you start to dual weild? Were you sword and board? Did you go with a two handed weapon like a greataxe?
I used a short sword and a dagger, trying to dual-wield ... what I didnt know was i zoomed through creation because I was so anxious to play my monk, and when I chose his supposed "Two Weapon Fighting" feat it was, in actuality, "Two-handed fighting".
So yeah I was trying to dual-wield with a monk meant to swing polearms, lol. Might have something to do with all those negatives.
I have gone back and played with the same monk using a great axe. Yep, the penalties were not as harsh and kicks a lot more @$$.
Even so, I cant see myself subscribing, even if it is a dirt cheap subscription.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
After you took the fighter level what weapons did you use? Did you start to dual weild? Were you sword and board? Did you go with a two handed weapon like a greataxe?
I used a short sword and a dagger, trying to dual-wield ... what I didnt know was i zoomed through creation because I was so anxious to play my monk, and when I chose his supposed "Two Weapon Fighting" feat it was, in actuality, "Two-handed fighting".
So yeah I was trying to dual-wield with a monk meant to swing polearms, lol. Might have something to do with all those negatives.
I have gone back and played with the same monk using a great axe. Yep, the penalties were not as harsh and kicks a lot more @$$.
Even so, I cant see myself subscribing, even if it is a dirt cheap subscription.
It is 15 a month which is the standard at this time for most MMOs.
Even so, I cant see myself subscribing, even if it is a dirt cheap subscription.
It is 15 a month which is the standard at this time for most MMOs.
LMAO. Ok then... I guess I won't be subscribing. Its definitely not a game worthy of $15 every month.
Thanks for letting me know.
This is one of those games that's probably best as a secondary MMO. To be played once or twice a week with a set group of friends just like the PnP version. Try running a dungeon or 2 with a group and see how it works for you. Heck set up your own group and note you want to RP and do a slow newbie run. Being on Kothos you may find those that are thinking like you.
Because of the way the game is set up; lack of outside (of a dungeon) content it's never going to be any kind of sand box game and I don't really see any RP'er's doing like they do in SWG and RP'ing as a NPC cities government.
I play with my son a few times a week, no power gaming, just picking quests we can do and then we go through slow, busting up everything we can. He's only 10 so there won't ever be a lot of repeat dungeon play and somewhere down the road we'll tap out all we can do.
Even so, I cant see myself subscribing, even if it is a dirt cheap subscription.
It is 15 a month which is the standard at this time for most MMOs.
LMAO. Ok then... I guess I won't be subscribing. Its definitely not a game worthy of $15 every month.
Thanks for letting me know.
This is one of those games that's probably best as a secondary MMO. To be played once or twice a week with a set group of friends just like the PnP version. Try running a dungeon or 2 with a group and see how it works for you. Heck set up your own group and note you want to RP and do a slow newbie run. Being on Kothos you may find those that are thinking like you.
Because of the way the game is set up; lack of outside (of a dungeon) content it's never going to be any kind of sand box game and I don't really see any RP'er's doing like they do in SWG and RP'ing as a NPC cities government.
I play with my son a few times a week, no power gaming, just picking quests we can do and then we go through slow, busting up everything we can. He's only 10 so there won't ever be a lot of repeat dungeon play and somewhere down the road we'll tap out all we can do.
But until then we'll have fun.
I can see DDO being played in this fashion, it might even work well on a casual basis. I just don't see how they can justify the price tag any longer. In your case, $30 a month may seem like pennies, compared to the "number of hours of enterainment" but clearly they are overpriced compared to today's standard in MMO's. Especially for "casual play", you are definitely overpaying.
1 or 2 updates per year just cannot possibly justify the $14.95 fee. No matter how good the content from last year, or the year before is. Which, come to think of it, may in fact be DDO's saving grace. Make the game free, bump the game price to $49.95 and sell modules in the form of expansion packs (one big annual update @ $29.95) and you MIGHT be able to resurrect the potential of this game.
If LOTRO is going to subsidize (and it always has) DDO's development, then let it fully subsidize it because at $14.95 per month for 5-10 hours of quests per year is just absurd.
This is one of those games that's probably best as a secondary MMO. To be played once or twice a week with a set group of friends just like the PnP version. Try running a dungeon or 2 with a group and see how it works for you. Heck set up your own group and note you want to RP and do a slow newbie run. Being on Kothos you may find those that are thinking like you.
Because of the way the game is set up; lack of outside (of a dungeon) content it's never going to be any kind of sand box game and I don't really see any RP'er's doing like they do in SWG and RP'ing as a NPC cities government. I play with my son a few times a week, no power gaming, just picking quests we can do and then we go through slow, busting up everything we can. He's only 10 so there won't ever be a lot of repeat dungeon play and somewhere down the road we'll tap out all we can do. But until then we'll have fun.
I can see DDO being played in this fashion, it might even work well on a casual basis. I just don't see how they can justify the price tag any longer. In your case, $30 a month may seem like pennies, compared to the "number of hours of enterainment" but clearly they are overpriced compared to today's standard in MMO's. Especially for "casual play", you are definitely overpaying.
1 or 2 updates per year just cannot possibly justify the $14.95 fee. No matter how good the content from last year, or the year before is. Which, come to think of it, may in fact be DDO's saving grace. Make the game free, bump the game price to $49.95 and sell modules in the form of expansion packs (one big annual update @ $29.95) and you MIGHT be able to resurrect the potential of this game.
If LOTRO is going to subsidize (and it always has) DDO's development, then let it fully subsidize it because at $14.95 per month for 5-10 hours of quests per year is just absurd.
Totally agreee the price should come down. It's a nice, entertaining little game. Now if I was still PnP it, then we'd have to balance the price of gas, away from the family time etc... etc... and try to compare it that way, plus my kid wouldn't be able to come with me and play. Add in the fact that just buying him one of those 4 3/4" action figures runs close to $10.00 a pop and I just may be making out after all. $30.00 a month hurts no doubt about it, but weighed against the fun time ........... well might not be so bad after all.
I'd like to see it lowered, doesn't have to go to f2p level, but there are other games out there for $5.00 to $10.00 a month. I know 1 even has a $30.00 a year cost.
I'm kind of wondering about all the 3+ yr people who are waiting for the next big mod and just how long will it take them to burn through it. I'm thinking 4/5? more levels won't be nothing for some of them and then what?
This is one of those games that's probably best as a secondary MMO. To be played once or twice a week with a set group of friends just like the PnP version. Try running a dungeon or 2 with a group and see how it works for you. Heck set up your own group and note you want to RP and do a slow newbie run. Being on Kothos you may find those that are thinking like you.
Because of the way the game is set up; lack of outside (of a dungeon) content it's never going to be any kind of sand box game and I don't really see any RP'er's doing like they do in SWG and RP'ing as a NPC cities government. I play with my son a few times a week, no power gaming, just picking quests we can do and then we go through slow, busting up everything we can. He's only 10 so there won't ever be a lot of repeat dungeon play and somewhere down the road we'll tap out all we can do. But until then we'll have fun.
I can see DDO being played in this fashion, it might even work well on a casual basis. I just don't see how they can justify the price tag any longer. In your case, $30 a month may seem like pennies, compared to the "number of hours of enterainment" but clearly they are overpriced compared to today's standard in MMO's. Especially for "casual play", you are definitely overpaying.
1 or 2 updates per year just cannot possibly justify the $14.95 fee. No matter how good the content from last year, or the year before is. Which, come to think of it, may in fact be DDO's saving grace. Make the game free, bump the game price to $49.95 and sell modules in the form of expansion packs (one big annual update @ $29.95) and you MIGHT be able to resurrect the potential of this game.
If LOTRO is going to subsidize (and it always has) DDO's development, then let it fully subsidize it because at $14.95 per month for 5-10 hours of quests per year is just absurd.
Totally agreee the price should come down. It's a nice, entertaining little game. Now if I was still PnP it, then we'd have to balance the price of gas, away from the family time etc... etc... and try to compare it that way, plus my kid wouldn't be able to come with me and play. Add in the fact that just buying him one of those 4 3/4" action figures runs close to $10.00 a pop and I just may be making out after all. $30.00 a month hurts no doubt about it, but weighed against the fun time ........... well might not be so bad after all.
I'd like to see it lowered, doesn't have to go to f2p level, but there are other games out there for $5.00 to $10.00 a month. I know 1 even has a $30.00 a year cost.
I'm kind of wondering about all the 3+ yr people who are waiting for the next big mod and just how long will it take them to burn through it. I'm thinking 4/5? more levels won't be nothing for some of them and then what?
If the Mod has 4 quests and a raid it will not take long, but it will take longer to level with so little new content that you will not lose EXP due to running before you hit the cap. If you are capped you only need EXP for 3 levels really as 1 EXP will take you to 17 then you have 18, 19 and 20. If Turbine cranks out content then the need for more levels is lessened. But when you have very few quests at high level and have run numerous characters through the low stuff you tend to get bored. Turbine needs to provide more content and soon.
Comments
I'm sorry. I guess I just expected a 35 year old to be a little more mature and not so quick to flame.
I am sorry I must have missed the part where I was flaming you instead of correcting multiple inaccuracies. You seem to mix up the two things. If telling you to get an education is flaming then you might need that which I pointed out. If you were mature in any way shape or form you would have simply said you were wrong and moved on. Grow up already. You were wrong and instead of learning you are acting butthurt. No one is impressed. Get over it.
Look... our little spat killed this thread.
I am sorry to have turned this into something more than it had to be. I am over it, Rokurgepta. I think you caught me on a bad day. lol
Sorry for the wasted thread space everyone.
Sadly it might not have been us killing the thread. It is more likely a lack of interest due to Turbines lack of management skills. They have great devs but the people in charge at times seem hell bent on ruining the good work they do. Just check the DDO official forums, the number of posts a day in general are dwindling the longer it takes to get MOD9 out to the players and with it now taking until June more people are floating away for now. The Community relations people spend as little time as possible communicating and when asked about it either make jokes, threaten to cut back communication more(impossible unless they took down the boards they run) or tell you the other parts of their job. My customers do not want to hear those lame excuses when they feel ignored and I would not even think of offering them as they are pathetic excuses.
Out of interest how is the trial going jefaw?
Sadly it might not have been us killing the thread. It is more likely a lack of interest due to Turbines lack of management skills. They have great devs but the people in charge at times seem hell bent on ruining the good work they do. Just check the DDO official forums, the number of posts a day in general are dwindling the longer it takes to get MOD9 out to the players and with it now taking until June more people are floating away for now. The Community relations people spend as little time as possible communicating and when asked about it either make jokes, threaten to cut back communication more(impossible unless they took down the boards they run) or tell you the other parts of their job. My customers do not want to hear those lame excuses when they feel ignored and I would not even think of offering them as they are pathetic excuses.
So true, my former guildmates told me that when the Community Relations people were asked a question about when the next module was going to be released, they responded with a vague riddle and would not even confirm or deny the answer to that riddle.
Nothing like getting your entire community riled up for hours solving a puzzle to hear the answer "coming soon".
Honestly if they said nothing at all it would have been better than responding in such a way. My guess is that must have been Tolero - the most useless and helpless Community Relations person ever to date. Before I left the game, I sent her a long private message on the forums and challenged her to stand up to Turbine and not play the mouthpiece. Part of her job is to be a customer advocate to the board room meetings. If the community is being consistently shunned (and I'm sorry who could possibly say otherwise), then it is not all to blame on the producers and executives. This is a misappropriation of responsibility.
A customer relations person has a duty and obligation to advocate for the customer. If they fail to do this effectively the result is that the community has no voice. It is not enough to sit at a table and say "the community wants to hear more from us" and leave it at that. If Tolero is not effective at changing the mindset of the producers and executives to be more open, then she is the wrong person for the job.
When you consider what people are asking for, in reality there is not much favor being asked of Turbine. People are simply asking for communication and a simple answer to a basic question, "Is this game worth paying for anymore?" Ultimately, people have to come to their own conclusion (as I have, and gratefully so) about this. I have saved nearly $200 since I left DDO in monthly fees for a game that has only had two (relatively minor) updates since I left.
I can honestly say that the value that I saved from cancelling FAR exceeds anything I could have gained by paying to stay. Even when you consider I played since release and have friends, relatives, etc. who played the game, the cost was too much for too little. I don't need to pay that kind of money to interact with these people. That is something that I can do without the hassle that is Turbine.
Sadly it might not have been us killing the thread. It is more likely a lack of interest due to Turbines lack of management skills. They have great devs but the people in charge at times seem hell bent on ruining the good work they do. Just check the DDO official forums, the number of posts a day in general are dwindling the longer it takes to get MOD9 out to the players and with it now taking until June more people are floating away for now. The Community relations people spend as little time as possible communicating and when asked about it either make jokes, threaten to cut back communication more(impossible unless they took down the boards they run) or tell you the other parts of their job. My customers do not want to hear those lame excuses when they feel ignored and I would not even think of offering them as they are pathetic excuses.
So true, my former guildmates told me that when the Community Relations people were asked a question about when the next module was going to be released, they responded with a vague riddle and would not even confirm or deny the answer to that riddle.
Nothing like getting your entire community riled up for hours solving a puzzle to hear the answer "coming soon".
Honestly if they said nothing at all it would have been better than responding in such a way. My guess is that must have been Tolero - the most useless and helpless Community Relations person ever to date. Before I left the game, I sent her a long private message on the forums and challenged her to stand up to Turbine and not play the mouthpiece. Part of her job is to be a customer advocate to the board room meetings. If the community is being consistently shunned (and I'm sorry who could possibly say otherwise), then it is not all to blame on the producers and executives. This is a misappropriation of responsibility.
A customer relations person has a duty and obligation to advocate for the customer. If they fail to do this effectively the result is that the community has no voice. It is not enough to sit at a table and say "the community wants to hear more from us" and leave it at that. If Tolero is not effective at changing the mindset of the producers and executives to be more open, then she is the wrong person for the job.
When you consider what people are asking for, in reality there is not much favor being asked of Turbine. People are simply asking for communication and a simple answer to a basic question, "Is this game worth paying for anymore?" Ultimately, people have to come to their own conclusion (as I have, and gratefully so) about this. I have saved nearly $200 since I left DDO in monthly fees for a game that has only had two (relatively minor) updates since I left.
I can honestly say that the value that I saved from cancelling FAR exceeds anything I could have gained by paying to stay. Even when you consider I played since release and have friends, relatives, etc. who played the game, the cost was too much for too little. I don't need to pay that kind of money to interact with these people. That is something that I can do without the hassle that is Turbine.
I actually feel bad for Tolero, she was hired as an events coordinator based on the fun events she led in game as a player. Turbine hired her for a strength she had but never used her in that way and instead made her a communit relations person and she seems to not be very good at that. She tends to threaten the players with threats of less communication when she is not happy with the tone of the forums. Well the forums are that way because Turbine has started to moderate much less than 2 years ago and because they have created the atmosphere and cultivate it with their lazy attitudes toward the players.
They made claims they simply have failed to live up to many times and while I am staying until MOD9 I will be gone if it fails to meet my expectations.
Sadly it might not have been us killing the thread. It is more likely a lack of interest due to Turbines lack of management skills. They have great devs but the people in charge at times seem hell bent on ruining the good work they do. Just check the DDO official forums, the number of posts a day in general are dwindling the longer it takes to get MOD9 out to the players and with it now taking until June more people are floating away for now. The Community relations people spend as little time as possible communicating and when asked about it either make jokes, threaten to cut back communication more(impossible unless they took down the boards they run) or tell you the other parts of their job. My customers do not want to hear those lame excuses when they feel ignored and I would not even think of offering them as they are pathetic excuses.
So true, my former guildmates told me that when the Community Relations people were asked a question about when the next module was going to be released, they responded with a vague riddle and would not even confirm or deny the answer to that riddle.
Nothing like getting your entire community riled up for hours solving a puzzle to hear the answer "coming soon".
Honestly if they said nothing at all it would have been better than responding in such a way. My guess is that must have been Tolero - the most useless and helpless Community Relations person ever to date. Before I left the game, I sent her a long private message on the forums and challenged her to stand up to Turbine and not play the mouthpiece. Part of her job is to be a customer advocate to the board room meetings. If the community is being consistently shunned (and I'm sorry who could possibly say otherwise), then it is not all to blame on the producers and executives. This is a misappropriation of responsibility.
A customer relations person has a duty and obligation to advocate for the customer. If they fail to do this effectively the result is that the community has no voice. It is not enough to sit at a table and say "the community wants to hear more from us" and leave it at that. If Tolero is not effective at changing the mindset of the producers and executives to be more open, then she is the wrong person for the job.
When you consider what people are asking for, in reality there is not much favor being asked of Turbine. People are simply asking for communication and a simple answer to a basic question, "Is this game worth paying for anymore?" Ultimately, people have to come to their own conclusion (as I have, and gratefully so) about this. I have saved nearly $200 since I left DDO in monthly fees for a game that has only had two (relatively minor) updates since I left.
I can honestly say that the value that I saved from cancelling FAR exceeds anything I could have gained by paying to stay. Even when you consider I played since release and have friends, relatives, etc. who played the game, the cost was too much for too little. I don't need to pay that kind of money to interact with these people. That is something that I can do without the hassle that is Turbine.
My opinion, speculation:
The funnies part about this is all is that those who are complaining (vets) will leave in coming months, and the game will be reborn, free of tiring rants. Face it vets, you're bored with the game. And hoping for Turbine to work faster... well, do you people hope for it? Or even believe it?
Sure, I think DDO will get much richer and get much more players, but it may boost the speed of development over a year or two, not over next few months.
At the same time, newcomers will have great time with the game which is now quite big in my opinion. Lots of things to do, if didn't play for last 3 years, that is. Let it go, for the good of us all. Maybe a year later you'll be happy to return.
I'm sure Turbine is doing everything they can, and I'm happy there's no more release dates. I hope there will be no release dates ever, I'd prefer to be surprised with new updates. Deadlines in DDO are too easy to miss. Read these articles for some knowledge, and keep in mind that those people speak about games so simple as WAR or GW, and comparing to DDO...
www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/2997/Server-Stability-Blues.html
www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/3020/Tech-Talk-With-Andrew.html
www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/3013/Design-By-Bug.html
I mean, DDO interactive environment isn't matched by any other MMO to date, not to mention skills, feats and other D&D mechanics, which you can't just "change" to fit the game code better.
I'd also encourage to read Sanya's blog posts, and forum posts here. Ranting without an idea of how things are in reality is very easy, you know. But mature thing, wise thing and constructive thing is trying to understand "why" first. Only then you can tell if there's any point in repeating myths which we all would love to be true - we pay them, after all, so we don't like to understand anything, we just want to get everything. Is there any sense in such approach? I'm afraid, there's none. But it will take years until MMO players will understand how MMO development works, why delays, why silence, etc.
PS: Please treat it as my own subjective opinion, and really out of good will. I try not to answer to rants / accusations / offenses ever again, that's pointless.
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Sadly it might not have been us killing the thread. It is more likely a lack of interest due to Turbines lack of management skills. They have great devs but the people in charge at times seem hell bent on ruining the good work they do. Just check the DDO official forums, the number of posts a day in general are dwindling the longer it takes to get MOD9 out to the players and with it now taking until June more people are floating away for now. The Community relations people spend as little time as possible communicating and when asked about it either make jokes, threaten to cut back communication more(impossible unless they took down the boards they run) or tell you the other parts of their job. My customers do not want to hear those lame excuses when they feel ignored and I would not even think of offering them as they are pathetic excuses.
So true, my former guildmates told me that when the Community Relations people were asked a question about when the next module was going to be released, they responded with a vague riddle and would not even confirm or deny the answer to that riddle.
Nothing like getting your entire community riled up for hours solving a puzzle to hear the answer "coming soon".
Honestly if they said nothing at all it would have been better than responding in such a way. My guess is that must have been Tolero - the most useless and helpless Community Relations person ever to date. Before I left the game, I sent her a long private message on the forums and challenged her to stand up to Turbine and not play the mouthpiece. Part of her job is to be a customer advocate to the board room meetings. If the community is being consistently shunned (and I'm sorry who could possibly say otherwise), then it is not all to blame on the producers and executives. This is a misappropriation of responsibility.
A customer relations person has a duty and obligation to advocate for the customer. If they fail to do this effectively the result is that the community has no voice. It is not enough to sit at a table and say "the community wants to hear more from us" and leave it at that. If Tolero is not effective at changing the mindset of the producers and executives to be more open, then she is the wrong person for the job.
When you consider what people are asking for, in reality there is not much favor being asked of Turbine. People are simply asking for communication and a simple answer to a basic question, "Is this game worth paying for anymore?" Ultimately, people have to come to their own conclusion (as I have, and gratefully so) about this. I have saved nearly $200 since I left DDO in monthly fees for a game that has only had two (relatively minor) updates since I left.
I can honestly say that the value that I saved from cancelling FAR exceeds anything I could have gained by paying to stay. Even when you consider I played since release and have friends, relatives, etc. who played the game, the cost was too much for too little. I don't need to pay that kind of money to interact with these people. That is something that I can do without the hassle that is Turbine.
My opinion, speculation:
The funnies part about this is all is that those who are complaining (vets) will leave in coming months, and the game will be reborn, free of tiring rants. Face it vets, you're bored with the game. And hoping for Turbine to work faster... well, do you people hope for it? Or even believe it?
At the same time, newcomers will have great time with the game which is now quite big in my opinion. Lots of things to do, if didn't play for last 3 years, that is. Let it go, for the good of us all. Maybe a year later you'll be happy to return.
I'm sure Turbine is doing everything they can, and I'm happy there's no more release dates. I hope there will be no release dates ever, I'd prefer to be surprised with new updates. Deadlines in DDO are too easy to miss. Read these articles for some knowledge, and keep in mind that those people speak about games so simple as WAR or GW, and comparing to DDO...
www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/2997/Server-Stability-Blues.html
www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/3020/Tech-Talk-With-Andrew.html
www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/3013/Design-By-Bug.html
I mean, DDO interactive environment isn't matched by any other MMO to date, not to mention skills, feats and other D&D mechanics, which you can't just "change" to fit the game code better.
I'd also encourage to read Sanya's blog posts, and forum posts here. Ranting without an idea of how things are in reality is very easy, you know. But mature thing, wise thing and constructive thing is trying to understand "why" first. Only then you can tell if there's any point in repeating myths which we all would love to be true - we pay them, after all, so we don't like to understand anything, we just want to get everything. Is there any sense in such approach? I'm afraid, there's none. But it will take years until MMO players will understand how MMO development works, why delays, why silence, etc.
You talk about people having no knowledge yet you make the claim that WAR and GW are simple. Maybe you should get more knowledge before posting things you fail to understand. No one is saying making games is simple, people are pointing out that failure to be close to target dates and no communication are a failed business plan no matter your product.
How do you expect the Vets leaving to allow DDO to be reborn? Do you see lots of advertising that would attract new players? Sarr do you read what you post? You live in fantasyland when it comes to Turbine and DDO. You need to make an effort to attract newcomers before you chase off the people who have supported this game for 3 years. It is not people like you, you think you are more important but the truth is the people who have paid 15 a month for 36 months are. I am not one of them either. But when you see on the boards former fanboys like you who defended everything now saying goodbye it makes you understand how bad Turbine is screwing up with this. Sorry if your rose colored glasses do not allow you to see this.
You seem to think people have no right to complain andf to that I say please give it a rest fanboy.
They have changed D&D mechanics to fit the game world not to mention invented things they needed to make D7D into an MMORPG. Do you even know the game you claim to play? You make ridiculous comments that make me wonder if you play DDO the online game by Turbine. The actual enviroment is not interactive in DDO, the NPCs do nothing there is little in the game world that you can interact with. The combat is great and that is about the only thing DDO has on other MMOs. There is not much outside of combat to do in DDO.
You seem to be the one ranting with no basis in reality. Your Turbine love blinds you to reality and facts.
With all due respect that's not how it works at all.
At all.
they are not hired on your behalf. They are hired on the behalf of the company.
It is not their job to stand up to their employers. It is their job to act as a mediator between customer and the company but always with the company's interests at heart.
That's how it works in my current company and my last company.
Companies do not hire customer service people or even client reps to essentially give away the farm.
they do want happy customers but within the confines of what the company is wiling to give/provide.
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With all due respect that's not how it works at all.
At all.
they are not hired on your behalf. They are hired on the behalf of the company.
It is not their job to stand up to their employers. It is their job to act as a mediator between customer and the company but always with the company's interests at heart.
That's how it works in my current company and my last company.
Companies do not hire customer service people or even client reps to essentially give away the farm.
they do want happy customers but within the confines of what the company is wiling to give/provide.
Tolero is not really Customer Service her title is community relations and as such she does take player concerns to the next level, but there is no way in hell her job is to stand up for the players in meetings. Her job is to relay information she has gathered and put it into understandable forms.
Customer service people have one goal, deal with you as little as possible while retaining your business. If they do it well enough some companies pay a bonus.
With all due respect that's not how it works at all.
At all.
they are not hired on your behalf. They are hired on the behalf of the company.
It is not their job to stand up to their employers. It is their job to act as a mediator between customer and the company but always with the company's interests at heart.
That's how it works in my current company and my last company.
Companies do not hire customer service people or even client reps to essentially give away the farm.
they do want happy customers but within the confines of what the company is wiling to give/provide.
While working for a company is admirable, until you own one and run it your view will always be limited to how your "company" operates. So I have a little assignment for you: go run a business for 5 years, come back and tell me if you don't look at the value of your customers a little differently. That is, with all due respect.
Turbine is a privately held company that is regarded as the "small business" of MMO's. While they have some big titles, they are still an extremely small shop. They are mom + pop all the way. No corporate setting would allow a husband and wife to lead a division of their company, ever. That's just absurd to even think about and I won't bother delving into that any further. Anyways, what this tells you about Turbine is how they run their company. They run it with an emphasis on their own little "family" more than their customers. To them, their achievements are about them... not about the customer. They can offer lip service about how they are in this business to provide entertainment for others, but the reality is they are more concerned with the "tone" of the forums, and making sure everyone is "playing nicely" despite the fact that they put tacks in the sandbox. No wonder people can feel little sharp stings while "playing" in Turbine's world.
This is why they respond to harsh criticism with bans, thread deletes and downright temper tantrums. Previous community persons such as Samera and Quarion were absolute amateur's at communicating with people. Samera had a meltdown once on the forums that basically insulted the entire community for not being nice to her. Quarion was no better. His rants with "Kommunity Kobold" absolutely banning people left and right. It got so bad at one point, I had a conversation with Meghan Rodberg, aka Patience, that led to Kommunity Kobold's retirement and assurances that Quarion would act with an even keel next time.
If you ever, and I mean ever, go into a restaurant, or a retail store or any other establishment, they have a duty and obligation to provide honest service. If you are ever discriminated against while in a store, or denied service based on a number of things such as sex, race, religion, even arrest record or sexual preference - the rules of a business running things 'their way' do NOT apply. What this tells you is that there is a bright line test for companies that run a business in this country (USA). There are more obligations that they have than you think. Acting in good faith is another one. Not engaging in fraudulent billing practices is another. Arguably, Turbine has struggled with both of these. For almost 6 months, people were getting double-billed due to an accounting problem which took Turbine a long time to fix. Accidental or not, for a long time this went on, where Turbine remedied simply by having customers call in and request a refund (repeatedly in some cases). Acting in good faith has come under question with their lack of communication, especially as it relates to announcing "announcements" to occur a day or two after billing cycles, only to find out they are announcing cutbacks in development, or that expected patches would be delayed.
When you really look at Turbine in the prism of customer-first... they have done a terrible job. It is asbolutely indefensible at best, and unethical at worst. You wouldn't be able to tell me that Turbine knows anything about customer service, and with all "due" respect, neither do you.
With all due respect that's not how it works at all.
At all.
they are not hired on your behalf. They are hired on the behalf of the company.
It is not their job to stand up to their employers. It is their job to act as a mediator between customer and the company but always with the company's interests at heart.
That's how it works in my current company and my last company.
Companies do not hire customer service people or even client reps to essentially give away the farm.
they do want happy customers but within the confines of what the company is wiling to give/provide.
While working for a company is admirable, until you own one and run it your view will always be limited to how your "company" operates. So I have a little assignment for you: go run a business for 5 years, come back and tell me if you don't look at the value of your customers a little differently. That is, with all due respect.
Turbine is a privately held company that is regarded as the "small business" of MMO's. While they have some big titles, they are still an extremely small shop. They are mom + pop all the way. No corporate setting would allow a husband and wife to lead a division of their company, ever. That's just absurd to even think about and I won't bother delving into that any further. Anyways, what this tells you about Turbine is how they run their company. They run it with an emphasis on their own little "family" more than their customers. To them, their achievements are about them... not about the customer. They can offer lip service about how they are in this business to provide entertainment for others, but the reality is they are more concerned with the "tone" of the forums, and making sure everyone is "playing nicely" despite the fact that they put tacks in the sandbox. No wonder people can feel little sharp stings while "playing" in Turbine's world.
This is why they respond to harsh criticism with bans, thread deletes and downright temper tantrums. Previous community persons such as Samera and Quarion were absolute amateur's at communicating with people. Samera had a meltdown once on the forums that basically insulted the entire community for not being nice to her. Quarion was no better. His rants with "Kommunity Kobold" absolutely banning people left and right. It got so bad at one point, I had a conversation with Meghan Rodberg, aka Patience, that led to Kommunity Kobold's retirement and assurances that Quarion would act with an even keel next time.
If you ever, and I mean ever, go into a restaurant, or a retail store or any other establishment, they have a duty and obligation to provide honest service. If you are ever discriminated against while in a store, or denied service based on a number of things such as sex, race, religion, even arrest record or sexual preference - the rules of a business running things 'their way' do NOT apply. What this tells you is that there is a bright line test for companies that run a business in this country (USA). There are more obligations that they have than you think. Acting in good faith is another one. Not engaging in fraudulent billing practices is another. Arguably, Turbine has struggled with both of these. For almost 6 months, people were getting double-billed due to an accounting problem which took Turbine a long time to fix. Accidental or not, for a long time this went on, where Turbine remedied simply by having customers call in and request a refund (repeatedly in some cases). Acting in good faith has come under question with their lack of communication, especially as it relates to announcing "announcements" to occur a day or two after billing cycles, only to find out they are announcing cutbacks in development, or that expected patches would be delayed.
When you really look at Turbine in the prism of customer-first... they have done a terrible job. It is asbolutely indefensible at best, and unethical at worst. You wouldn't be able to tell me that Turbine knows anything about customer service, and with all "due" respect, neither do you.
I think you missed the point of his post completely. I did not see him defending Turbine at all. He was simply stating the truth, it is not the CSRs or customer releations peoples job to fight for the customer. Their job is to help the customer or relay information but no should expect them to risk getting fired to argue with the bosses.
You completely missed what he said and your rant was so offbase as to be almost humorous. I think all non fanboys agree Turbine sucks at customer treatment and runs their business in what looks to be pretty poor fashion. In many other markets they would have closed up long ago, but for some reason way too many MMO players seem to think they pay $15 a month for whatever they get and no one should want or expect more.
I am only on the fifth day but so far not all bad.
It has a great community where I have met nothing but friendly helpful people to run dungeons with. Sadly, thats all it seems to be is a dungeon runner. I mean I know the name of the game is DUNGEONS & Dragons but come on. lol. That has nothing to do with what the game of D&D is at its core.
Roleplaying ( another huge aspect of the original D&D ) is almost non-existant. With all the "Yo" and "Sup" and voice chat kills any kind of immersion a true roleplayer would hope to have.
I am having a pretty good time with my dwarf ranger. Nice damage and moves through a dungeon pretty well, even if she may have to "muscle it" through any traps she may stumble across.
A big disappointment is my favorite class, the rogue, is almost a practical joke. The "hiding" and "move silently" skills have little effect due to every dungeon containing some monsters that are programmed to attack you as soon as your enter a room, or open a door. Its pretty disappointing that with sky high move silently skills I still get spotted by pety spiders and rats.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
I am only on the fifth day but so far not all bad.
It has a great community where I have met nothing but friendly helpful people to run dungeons with. Sadly, thats all it seems to be is a dungeon runner. I mean I know the name of the game is DUNGEONS & Dragons but come on. lol. That has nothing to do with what the game of D&D is at its core.
Roleplaying ( another huge aspect of the original D&D ) is almost non-existant. With all the "Yo" and "Sup" and voice chat kills any kind of immersion a true roleplayer would hope to have.
I am having a pretty good time with my dwarf ranger. Nice damage and moves through a dungeon pretty well, even if she may have to "muscle it" through any traps she may stumble across.
A big disappointment is my favorite class, the rogue, is almost a practical joke. The "hiding" and "move silently" skills have little effect due to every dungeon containing some monsters that are programmed to attack you as soon as your enter a room, or open a door. Its pretty disappointing that with sky high move silently skills I still get spotted by pety spiders and rats.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
Don't feel bad, most of the MMO world felt disappointed with the game in some way or another. Far beyond the typical "all new MMO's suck", DDO really bit it (**NOT hit-it) big with the community at large. For many different reasons, DDO failed to capture the interest of even a modest number of gamers. Not to say that it wasn't a novel idea to try a D&D MMO, but I think everyone will agree if you took the same game and gave it to a different development studio, they would have done much better with it.
Mix in a mediocre game, with a slow development cycle and bad customer service and you've got one helluva flop.
big disappointment is my favorite class, the rogue, is almost a practical joke. The "hiding" and "move silently" skills have little effect due to every dungeon containing some monsters that are programmed to attack you as soon as your enter a room, or open a door. Its pretty disappointing that with sky high move silently skills I still get spotted by pety spiders and rats.
The stealth in DDO is actually an excellent tool, you just have to learn how to use it. Some creatures like oozes and vermin (spiders, scorpions) can find you when in stealth mode because they don't see you... they feel you moving. At higher levels some creatures have the See Invisibility spell. Targeting them and pressing Z will show you any buffs they might have up.
In order to sneak you have to toggle the stealth feat, the Hide and Move Silently skills are not passive. I've got a rogue built for stealth and sneak attack that is a blast to solo, it just takes time to get used to how it works.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
You get all martial weapon proficiencies when you take a fighter level, but you lose your monk centered bonuses when you use a non-monk weapon. The monk special attacks for example will only work with monk weapons (kama, quarterstaff, handwraps). (you keep your wisdom bonus to AC and evasion as long as you don't wear a shield or armor no matter what weapon you use).
Be sure to check the official forums for a dungeon crawling or roleplaying guild and run in a few groups before your trial is over. Running dungeons with a group is the focus of DDO. Try to stear clear of veteran groups zerging through the low level content though, it will ruin a lot of quests for a new player.
Official Rogue class Forum: http://forums.ddo.com/forumdisplay.php?f=28
Official Monk class forum: http://forums.ddo.com/forumdisplay.php?f=159
Guild Matchup forum: http://forums.ddo.com/forumdisplay.php?f=39
Permadeath & Static Groups forum: http://forums.ddo.com/forumdisplay.php?f=48
--
DDO Permadeath guilds
I am only on the fifth day but so far not all bad.
It has a great community where I have met nothing but friendly helpful people to run dungeons with. Sadly, thats all it seems to be is a dungeon runner. I mean I know the name of the game is DUNGEONS & Dragons but come on. lol. That has nothing to do with what the game of D&D is at its core.
It is very quest heavy, personally I wouldn't mind other distractions as well. Just not big open areas and random spawns that annoys me too much. Community is very good, the forum community lets the in game community down at least in my experience.
Roleplaying ( another huge aspect of the original D&D ) is almost non-existant. With all the "Yo" and "Sup" and voice chat kills any kind of immersion a true roleplayer would hope to have.
You need to find yourself a roleplaying guild. I am not a MMO roleplayer I find the graphics too limiting on imagination, but I will sometime group with a roleplaying guild and the right people can create some good roleplaying especially as the quest backdrops are pretty neat.
I am having a pretty good time with my dwarf ranger. Nice damage and moves through a dungeon pretty well, even if she may have to "muscle it" through any traps she may stumble across.
Traps really bite on Elite, especially as you get higher in the game.
A big disappointment is my favorite class, the rogue, is almost a practical joke. The "hiding" and "move silently" skills have little effect due to every dungeon containing some monsters that are programmed to attack you as soon as your enter a room, or open a door. Its pretty disappointing that with sky high move silently skills I still get spotted by pety spiders and rats.
Spiders have tremorsense "A spider can detect and pinpoint any creature or object within 60 ft in contact with the ground....". Apart from them and a few others you can stealth quite well almost touching mobs as you move past, and even cause noises to distract them so they look away and you can use an object. Stealthy Repossession is a good quest for trying out your stealth as it requires you not to kill certain mobs.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am sure someone can explain why?
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
Well at least you gave it a try.
Might be worth trying some grouping with some friends as dungeons play a lot better with people you know and don't know the quests. Also try Irestone Inlet if you want to do something not in a dungeon for a change, I quite like it, although without spoiling it an explosion would have finished it off nicely.
I am only on the fifth day but so far not all bad.
It has a great community where I have met nothing but friendly helpful people to run dungeons with. Sadly, thats all it seems to be is a dungeon runner. I mean I know the name of the game is DUNGEONS & Dragons but come on. lol. That has nothing to do with what the game of D&D is at its core.
Roleplaying ( another huge aspect of the original D&D ) is almost non-existant. With all the "Yo" and "Sup" and voice chat kills any kind of immersion a true roleplayer would hope to have.
I am having a pretty good time with my dwarf ranger. Nice damage and moves through a dungeon pretty well, even if she may have to "muscle it" through any traps she may stumble across.
A big disappointment is my favorite class, the rogue, is almost a practical joke. The "hiding" and "move silently" skills have little effect due to every dungeon containing some monsters that are programmed to attack you as soon as your enter a room, or open a door. Its pretty disappointing that with sky high move silently skills I still get spotted by pety spiders and rats.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
After you took the fighter level what weapons did you use? Did you start to dual weild? Were you sword and board? Did you go with a two handed weapon like a greataxe?
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
After you took the fighter level what weapons did you use? Did you start to dual weild? Were you sword and board? Did you go with a two handed weapon like a greataxe?
I used a short sword and a dagger, trying to dual-wield ... what I didnt know was i zoomed through creation because I was so anxious to play my monk, and when I chose his supposed "Two Weapon Fighting" feat it was, in actuality, "Two-handed fighting".
So yeah I was trying to dual-wield with a monk meant to swing polearms, lol. Might have something to do with all those negatives.
I have gone back and played with the same monk using a great axe. Yep, the penalties were not as harsh and kicks a lot more @$$.
Even so, I cant see myself subscribing, even if it is a dirt cheap subscription.
Another let down was when I was finally able to dual-class my Monk with fighter skills... I didnt gain the fighter weapon proficiencies which is the only reason to dual a fighter, and suffered huge negatives to my attack rolls.
I am still going to finish out the trial, but if I gave you a decision right now I would be leaning more towards "nay". I still prefer the actual PnP game and am kind of sad that no MMORPG will likely ever mimic an actual " dining room table gaming session ".
After you took the fighter level what weapons did you use? Did you start to dual weild? Were you sword and board? Did you go with a two handed weapon like a greataxe?
I used a short sword and a dagger, trying to dual-wield ... what I didnt know was i zoomed through creation because I was so anxious to play my monk, and when I chose his supposed "Two Weapon Fighting" feat it was, in actuality, "Two-handed fighting".
So yeah I was trying to dual-wield with a monk meant to swing polearms, lol. Might have something to do with all those negatives.
I have gone back and played with the same monk using a great axe. Yep, the penalties were not as harsh and kicks a lot more @$$.
Even so, I cant see myself subscribing, even if it is a dirt cheap subscription.
It is 15 a month which is the standard at this time for most MMOs.
It is 15 a month which is the standard at this time for most MMOs.
LMAO. Ok then... I guess I won't be subscribing. Its definitely not a game worthy of $15 every month.
Thanks for letting me know.
Same engine, they even use the same sound effects from D&D in LOTRO for many things.
It is 15 a month which is the standard at this time for most MMOs.
LMAO. Ok then... I guess I won't be subscribing. Its definitely not a game worthy of $15 every month.
Thanks for letting me know.
This is one of those games that's probably best as a secondary MMO. To be played once or twice a week with a set group of friends just like the PnP version. Try running a dungeon or 2 with a group and see how it works for you. Heck set up your own group and note you want to RP and do a slow newbie run. Being on Kothos you may find those that are thinking like you.
Because of the way the game is set up; lack of outside (of a dungeon) content it's never going to be any kind of sand box game and I don't really see any RP'er's doing like they do in SWG and RP'ing as a NPC cities government.
I play with my son a few times a week, no power gaming, just picking quests we can do and then we go through slow, busting up everything we can. He's only 10 so there won't ever be a lot of repeat dungeon play and somewhere down the road we'll tap out all we can do.
But until then we'll have fun.
SWG (pre-cu) - AoC (pre-f2p) - PotBS (pre-boarder) - DDO - LotRO (pre-f2p) - STO (pre-f2p) - GnH (beta tester) - SWTOR - Neverwinter
It is 15 a month which is the standard at this time for most MMOs.
LMAO. Ok then... I guess I won't be subscribing. Its definitely not a game worthy of $15 every month.
Thanks for letting me know.
This is one of those games that's probably best as a secondary MMO. To be played once or twice a week with a set group of friends just like the PnP version. Try running a dungeon or 2 with a group and see how it works for you. Heck set up your own group and note you want to RP and do a slow newbie run. Being on Kothos you may find those that are thinking like you.
Because of the way the game is set up; lack of outside (of a dungeon) content it's never going to be any kind of sand box game and I don't really see any RP'er's doing like they do in SWG and RP'ing as a NPC cities government.
I play with my son a few times a week, no power gaming, just picking quests we can do and then we go through slow, busting up everything we can. He's only 10 so there won't ever be a lot of repeat dungeon play and somewhere down the road we'll tap out all we can do.
But until then we'll have fun.
I can see DDO being played in this fashion, it might even work well on a casual basis. I just don't see how they can justify the price tag any longer. In your case, $30 a month may seem like pennies, compared to the "number of hours of enterainment" but clearly they are overpriced compared to today's standard in MMO's. Especially for "casual play", you are definitely overpaying.
1 or 2 updates per year just cannot possibly justify the $14.95 fee. No matter how good the content from last year, or the year before is. Which, come to think of it, may in fact be DDO's saving grace. Make the game free, bump the game price to $49.95 and sell modules in the form of expansion packs (one big annual update @ $29.95) and you MIGHT be able to resurrect the potential of this game.
If LOTRO is going to subsidize (and it always has) DDO's development, then let it fully subsidize it because at $14.95 per month for 5-10 hours of quests per year is just absurd.
I can see DDO being played in this fashion, it might even work well on a casual basis. I just don't see how they can justify the price tag any longer. In your case, $30 a month may seem like pennies, compared to the "number of hours of enterainment" but clearly they are overpriced compared to today's standard in MMO's. Especially for "casual play", you are definitely overpaying.
1 or 2 updates per year just cannot possibly justify the $14.95 fee. No matter how good the content from last year, or the year before is. Which, come to think of it, may in fact be DDO's saving grace. Make the game free, bump the game price to $49.95 and sell modules in the form of expansion packs (one big annual update @ $29.95) and you MIGHT be able to resurrect the potential of this game.
If LOTRO is going to subsidize (and it always has) DDO's development, then let it fully subsidize it because at $14.95 per month for 5-10 hours of quests per year is just absurd.
Totally agreee the price should come down. It's a nice, entertaining little game. Now if I was still PnP it, then we'd have to balance the price of gas, away from the family time etc... etc... and try to compare it that way, plus my kid wouldn't be able to come with me and play. Add in the fact that just buying him one of those 4 3/4" action figures runs close to $10.00 a pop and I just may be making out after all. $30.00 a month hurts no doubt about it, but weighed against the fun time ........... well might not be so bad after all.
I'd like to see it lowered, doesn't have to go to f2p level, but there are other games out there for $5.00 to $10.00 a month. I know 1 even has a $30.00 a year cost.
I'm kind of wondering about all the 3+ yr people who are waiting for the next big mod and just how long will it take them to burn through it. I'm thinking 4/5? more levels won't be nothing for some of them and then what?
SWG (pre-cu) - AoC (pre-f2p) - PotBS (pre-boarder) - DDO - LotRO (pre-f2p) - STO (pre-f2p) - GnH (beta tester) - SWTOR - Neverwinter
I can see DDO being played in this fashion, it might even work well on a casual basis. I just don't see how they can justify the price tag any longer. In your case, $30 a month may seem like pennies, compared to the "number of hours of enterainment" but clearly they are overpriced compared to today's standard in MMO's. Especially for "casual play", you are definitely overpaying.
1 or 2 updates per year just cannot possibly justify the $14.95 fee. No matter how good the content from last year, or the year before is. Which, come to think of it, may in fact be DDO's saving grace. Make the game free, bump the game price to $49.95 and sell modules in the form of expansion packs (one big annual update @ $29.95) and you MIGHT be able to resurrect the potential of this game.
If LOTRO is going to subsidize (and it always has) DDO's development, then let it fully subsidize it because at $14.95 per month for 5-10 hours of quests per year is just absurd.
Totally agreee the price should come down. It's a nice, entertaining little game. Now if I was still PnP it, then we'd have to balance the price of gas, away from the family time etc... etc... and try to compare it that way, plus my kid wouldn't be able to come with me and play. Add in the fact that just buying him one of those 4 3/4" action figures runs close to $10.00 a pop and I just may be making out after all. $30.00 a month hurts no doubt about it, but weighed against the fun time ........... well might not be so bad after all.
I'd like to see it lowered, doesn't have to go to f2p level, but there are other games out there for $5.00 to $10.00 a month. I know 1 even has a $30.00 a year cost.
I'm kind of wondering about all the 3+ yr people who are waiting for the next big mod and just how long will it take them to burn through it. I'm thinking 4/5? more levels won't be nothing for some of them and then what?
If the Mod has 4 quests and a raid it will not take long, but it will take longer to level with so little new content that you will not lose EXP due to running before you hit the cap. If you are capped you only need EXP for 3 levels really as 1 EXP will take you to 17 then you have 18, 19 and 20. If Turbine cranks out content then the need for more levels is lessened. But when you have very few quests at high level and have run numerous characters through the low stuff you tend to get bored. Turbine needs to provide more content and soon.