I would be inclined to think they are stuck in a viscious cycle now. I'm sure Eurogamer was about as happy with the Tasos reply as he was with the review.
Would be interesting to see a 1/10 to keep the "DRAMA" going.......
~Hairysun~
Actually considering the increased traffic boost that EuroGamer got as a result of all the advertising that Tasos did for them... I'd say they were VERY happy with the results. Quite a bit happier than Tasos was with a 2/10 review it would seem anyway.
I would expect them to play up the "Re-Review" as well.
It makes very little personal difference to them what the score is, or even what the words in the review are.
They are a site that generates it's revenue from the number of hits the site gets. All this "drama" did for them was increase their revenue... what incentive would they have to try and make the "drama" go away?
The best outcome for EuroGamer would be a "Re-review" score on one end of the spectrum or the other. So, a 1-2, or a 9-10. All of the scores in the middle will have varying degrees of less impact. The absolute worst from them would be scores in the 5-6 range.
Regardless of how the next score comes out... there are a lot more people that know of EuroGamer now than did before Tasos' rant.
Hmmmm ....... some valid points as usual Xzyax. I had honestly never heard of Eurogamer or Ed Zitron prior to the review so someone apparently did their job. Perhaps it was Tasos.
You mention the next review potentially being on one end of the spectrum or the other. With that logic don't you think it would actually be more advantageous for Eurogamer to give another 1-2. I'm sure Tasos would comment on an excessively high (9-10) score, but there is nothing like a dev showing his ass. Another excessively low one, lol, would certainly bring out his best.
~Hairysun~
It would be one thing if he gave a legitimate review and gave the game a 2/10, but he didn't even play the game which is obvious from reading the review to anyone who has played it, but if you already played it what use would a REVIEW do for you? The guy obviously hates indie niche games, especially ffa pvp/full loot ones, and lied out his ass throughout the entire review. If he had talked shit about legitimate things instead of flat out lieing or making things up it would be one thing, but he didn't.
Originally posted by MrHubbell Everyone who has actually played the game knows it takes .5seconds if that to switch weapons, 1-2seconds to go through unsheathing animation at most and that's with a polearm. He claims the UI randomly turns off and you can't manually do it, even though it DOES NOT randomly turn off and you CAN manually do it via ALT + H. He obviously has no hand eye coordination as he claimed that hitting people was based on pure luck even though you get a crosshair on your screen for where your swings will be centered or archery/magic will be aimed. I'd have to imagine that for once Tasos IS NOT lying, and this guy made up his entire review from forumtroll postings, as in one of the screenshots you can even see him saying in chat HOW DO I PLAY or something similar.
He didn't even try, he merely said oh, full loot ffa pvp game, fuck that shit it must suck and made up a shitton of lies about it.
I've mentioned this in other threads, but you've oversimplified things greatly. A new player doesn't know that it takes .5 seconds to switch weapons Weapon switching can be a pain, even if you know what you're doing. Also, there are players that have reported issues with the G-series gaming keyboards (ilke the game taking up to 60 seconds to change modes from UI to action), which can compound problems. From another thread:
Originally posted by xecollons
Changing weapons is as easy as pressing a button. If you have a pole in '1', and have a staff equiped, just press '1' and you will equip the pole. Of course, to know that, you have to play the game.
Someday most people will stop muttering about those things that don't know.
Unfortunately, it's not always quite that easy. At a high level, you're right, but there are exceptions and extra keystrokes required, depending on the situation. Here are some examples:
If you have a melee weapon equipped and unsheathed, then switch to a staff, that staff is worthess to you until you also slot a spell. As such, it's two keystrokes, not 1, unless you use a macro.
If you're using a a bow and run out of arrows, it sheathes the bow. So, even if you hit the hotkey for a melee weapon, you also have to unsheathe it. Once again, that's two keystrokes instead of one, unless you use a macro.
It's not always clear when you have a bow or staff equipped and unsheathed - the icon showing they're equipped and ready is tiny and easy to miss in the midst of battle and you're not in 3rd person when you use either a bow or staff. If you're not actively using the bow or staff, even when they're unsheathed, you might not notice them.
By default, the hotkeys to change hotbars are shift+1 - 9. Unfortunately, shift is also the sprint key, so if you make the mistake of attempting to change weapons while sprinting, you'll inadvertently change hotbars and screw yourself
A player will get used to these foibles and/or change hotkeys away from default, but the interface is overly cumbersome. Regarding the G-series keyboard issues, here's the workaround players have to use (if they know about it - apparenlty, the problem has been around since beta?!?):
Originally posted by Klobius
Weird it may seem, but I know back in beta people had this same problem. The solution was simple if you had a G15, G11, or another G** keyboard. Unplug your keyboard before you turn your comp on and load up DF when your keyboard is unplugged. Try to load the game that way and it could help. Also, after you type your password in, unplug it again and then plug it in when the game is loaded...Hope this helps.
Regarding the reviewer making stuff up, his review did seem biased and antagonistic, but he had some valid points mixed in with the negative hyperbole. Most notably, Ed Zitron basically says the same thing as King Manus - the leader of the Hyperion Alliance:
In his ".. Accepts Terms of Surrender..." post, King Manus states: "I would say, other than the obvious stacking of the numerical odds against us, (one's conquered enemies are never dead - they just join new enemies!) it would be the attritive effect of the grind of Darkfall itself, which has slowly snuffed out the lights in the leadership of Hyperion, leaving too few new sparks to keep the torch burning."
I think this is an incredibly important quote, because it mirrors what Ed Zitron wrote about Darkfall in his Eurogamer review): "You see, everything in Darkfall is based on attrition. You slowly but surely gain stats in everything as you do it, ranging from running to wood-chopping to sword-fighting to spell-casting. This sounds as if it would make for an incredibly individual and adaptable experience, but the lacklustre presentation of the game melds with the tortoise-slow skill-up speed to make the experience quintessentially painful." So, we have the leader of the huge Hyperion Alliance, who's played Darkfall extensively (obviously), basically saying the same thing as Ed Zitron, who played only a few hours and wrote what appears to be a biased and overly-aggresive review: Darkfall has an attrition-based grind and it's responsible for driving players away....
So, did King Manus say "fuck that shit" and make up "a shitton of lies about it." He's put a ton of time into Darkfall, whereas Ed Zitron put in somewhere between 2 and 9+ hours, but they both reach the same conclusion regarding this aspect of the game and, more importantly, King Manus considers this aspect of the game as being the major reason behind the demise of the Hyperion Alliance.
Well... Kieron is a cool dude, and a professional. The type of guy you respect solelly because his quality. If where your boss, you would be happy.
But no, I don't want a new review about Darkfall, and much less a eurogamer one. Let the time talk, like with EVE. We live in a world where the stupid, and Quick Time Event games are like the norm, and Darkfall break that norm.
Yes because after reading the Zitron zero journalistic integrity Train Wreck of a review, I would like to think that a respected game journalist of Kieron Gillens stature , would have a really solid undisputable reason for giving Darkfall 2/10 , so hence the "maybe" .
Why would he need, as you say, journalistic integrity? He's a critic, not a journalist. Critics are barely writers.
I'm sorry but I disagree, Eurogamer certainly aims at a mass audience dont you think ?.
jour·nal·ist
Pronunciation: -n?-list
Function: noun
Date: 1693
1 a: a person engaged in journalism ; especially : a writer or editor for a news medium b: a writer who aims at a mass audience.
*sigh*
crit·ic
Pronunciation:
?kri-tik
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin criticus, from Greek kritikos, from kritikos able to discern or judge, from krinein
Date: 1588
1 a: one who expresses a reasoned opinion on any matter especially involving a judgment of its value, truth, righteousness, beauty, or technique b: one who engages often professionally in the analysis, evaluation, or appreciation of works of art or artistic performances
2: one given to harsh or captious judgment.
See what's highlighted in RED. Journalists who do those things ultimately LOSE THEIR CREDIBILITY and usually THEIR JOBS.
And for additional reference...in RED again.
jour·nal·ism
Pronunciation: ?j?r-n?-?li-z?m
Function: noun
Date: 1828
1 a: the collection and editing of news for presentation through the media b: the public press c: an academic study concerned with the collection and editing of news or the management of a news medium2 a: writing designed for publication in a newspaper or magazine b: writing characterized by a direct presentation of facts or description of events without an attempt at interpretation c: writing designed to appeal to current popular taste or public interest
Journalists and Critics are polar opposites of each other in what they communicate.
EDIT: spelling error.
"sigh"
the part thats highlighted in yellow is for your information ... its not rocket science now is it .
But now I guess you'll try and tell me that Game Reviewers/Journalists/Critics and sites like Eurogamer are not aimed at a mass audience .. so yeah "sigh" to you too .
I would be inclined to think they are stuck in a viscious cycle now. I'm sure Eurogamer was about as happy with the Tasos reply as he was with the review.
Would be interesting to see a 1/10 to keep the "DRAMA" going.......
~Hairysun~
Actually considering the increased traffic boost that EuroGamer got as a result of all the advertising that Tasos did for them... I'd say they were VERY happy with the results. Quite a bit happier than Tasos was with a 2/10 review it would seem anyway.
I would expect them to play up the "Re-Review" as well.
It makes very little personal difference to them what the score is, or even what the words in the review are.
They are a site that generates it's revenue from the number of hits the site gets. All this "drama" did for them was increase their revenue... what incentive would they have to try and make the "drama" go away?
The best outcome for EuroGamer would be a "Re-review" score on one end of the spectrum or the other. So, a 1-2, or a 9-10. All of the scores in the middle will have varying degrees of less impact. The absolute worst from them would be scores in the 5-6 range.
Regardless of how the next score comes out... there are a lot more people that know of EuroGamer now than did before Tasos' rant.
Hmmmm ....... some valid points as usual Xzyax. I had honestly never heard of Eurogamer or Ed Zitron prior to the review so someone apparently did their job. Perhaps it was Tasos.
You mention the next review potentially being on one end of the spectrum or the other. With that logic don't you think it would actually be more advantageous for Eurogamer to give another 1-2. I'm sure Tasos would comment on an excessively high (9-10) score, but there is nothing like a dev showing his ass. Another excessively low one, lol, would certainly bring out his best.
~Hairysun~
Heh... yeah, I am in the same boat.
Never heard of EuroGamer or visited their site until Tasos started talking about it, and the review being linked a hundred times on the official boards.
While I think a really high or really low score would serve about the same purposes for EuroGamer and their increased traffic... I do agree that a lower score would probably give the most mileage.
Not that I am suggesting a traffic-driven site would ever think of trying to artificially create drama.
I would be inclined to think they are stuck in a viscious cycle now. I'm sure Eurogamer was about as happy with the Tasos reply as he was with the review.
Would be interesting to see a 1/10 to keep the "DRAMA" going.......
~Hairysun~
Actually considering the increased traffic boost that EuroGamer got as a result of all the advertising that Tasos did for them... I'd say they were VERY happy with the results. Quite a bit happier than Tasos was with a 2/10 review it would seem anyway.
I would expect them to play up the "Re-Review" as well.
It makes very little personal difference to them what the score is, or even what the words in the review are.
They are a site that generates it's revenue from the number of hits the site gets. All this "drama" did for them was increase their revenue... what incentive would they have to try and make the "drama" go away?
The best outcome for EuroGamer would be a "Re-review" score on one end of the spectrum or the other. So, a 1-2, or a 9-10. All of the scores in the middle will have varying degrees of less impact. The absolute worst from them would be scores in the 5-6 range.
Regardless of how the next score comes out... there are a lot more people that know of EuroGamer now than did before Tasos' rant.
Hmmmm ....... some valid points as usual Xzyax. I had honestly never heard of Eurogamer or Ed Zitron prior to the review so someone apparently did their job. Perhaps it was Tasos.
You mention the next review potentially being on one end of the spectrum or the other. With that logic don't you think it would actually be more advantageous for Eurogamer to give another 1-2. I'm sure Tasos would comment on an excessively high (9-10) score, but there is nothing like a dev showing his ass. Another excessively low one, lol, would certainly bring out his best.
~Hairysun~
It would be one thing if he gave a legitimate review and gave the game a 2/10, but he didn't even play the game which is obvious from reading the review to anyone who has played it, but if you already played it what use would a REVIEW do for you? The guy obviously hates indie niche games, especially ffa pvp/full loot ones, and lied out his ass throughout the entire review. If he had talked shit about legitimate things instead of flat out lieing or making things up it would be one thing, but he didn't.
Ah whatever this review will just sparkle another DF drama incident. If its low I am sure Tasos will be on his broom stick and QQ'ing to all. If its high then god help us all. DF aint worth higher than a six.
I think Eurogamer will give it a 5 or 6 and say some nice things somewhere in the text. Will Tasos QQ still at this rating?Gods knows with that man. Maybe Eurogamer wont bother and just send Tasos a 'nice' GTFO and STFU email ?
Ah DF... I never understood the power of PR untill Tasos showed us how to faff it all up... (Well that and game development)
Yes because after reading the Zitron zero journalistic integrity Train Wreck of a review, I would like to think that a respected game journalist of Kieron Gillens stature , would have a really solid undisputable reason for giving Darkfall 2/10 , so hence the "maybe" .
Why would he need, as you say, journalistic integrity? He's a critic, not a journalist. Critics are barely writers.
I'm sorry but I disagree, Eurogamer certainly aims at a mass audience dont you think ?.
jour·nal·ist
Pronunciation: -n?-list
Function: noun
Date: 1693
1 a: a person engaged in journalism ; especially : a writer or editor for a news medium b: a writer who aims at a mass audience.
*sigh*
crit·ic
Pronunciation:
?kri-tik
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin criticus, from Greek kritikos, from kritikos able to discern or judge, from krinein
Date: 1588
1 a: one who expresses a reasoned opinion on any matter especially involving a judgment of its value, truth, righteousness, beauty, or technique b: one who engages often professionally in the analysis, evaluation, or appreciation of works of art or artistic performances
2: one given to harsh or captious judgment.
See what's highlighted in RED. Journalists who do those things ultimately LOSE THEIR CREDIBILITY and usually THEIR JOBS.
And for additional reference...in RED again.
jour·nal·ism
Pronunciation: ?j?r-n?-?li-z?m
Function: noun
Date: 1828
1 a: the collection and editing of news for presentation through the media b: the public press c: an academic study concerned with the collection and editing of news or the management of a news medium2 a: writing designed for publication in a newspaper or magazine b: writing characterized by a direct presentation of facts or description of events without an attempt at interpretation c: writing designed to appeal to current popular taste or public interest
Journalists and Critics are polar opposites of each other in what they communicate.
EDIT: spelling error.
"sigh"
the part thats highlighted in yellow is for your information ... its not rocket science now is it .
But now I guess you'll try and tell me that Game Reviewers/Journalists/Critics and sites like Eurogamer are not aimed at a mass audience .. so yeah "sigh" to you too .
No, because the second definition doesn't supersede the first. A person is NOT a journalist if they don't follow the tenets of journalism, regardless of what audience they cater to or its size. What the hell do you think journalist means.
"A person who practices journalism."
Critics, by their very nature, are "unethical" because opinion, no matter how much it is based on facts, cannot fit into the ethical and professional rules required of journalists. I suggest you read the Journalist's Code of Ethics for a clearer understanding of the expectations of the profession.
I know this because I am a professional writer -- 23 years in total, and 14 of those years as a journalist. What I mean by professional is that I am not some IT geek who happened to get a book deal and now somehow thinks he is a writer. Or a blogger who fancies himself a writer because he can regurgitate a few paragraphs into Wordpress each day. I mean a person who makes 100% of his living as a successful writer and provides for his family, maintains our two homes, a car, and a boat on that profession, and has done so for over two decades.
So please don't lecture me about some arcane, myopic definition of a journalist. You know not what you speak.
Yes because after reading the Zitron zero journalistic integrity Train Wreck of a review, I would like to think that a respected game journalist of Kieron Gillens stature , would have a really solid undisputable reason for giving Darkfall 2/10 , so hence the "maybe" .
Why would he need, as you say, journalistic integrity? He's a critic, not a journalist. Critics are barely writers.
I'm sorry but I disagree, Eurogamer certainly aims at a mass audience dont you think ?.
jour·nal·ist
Pronunciation: -n?-list
Function: noun
Date: 1693
1 a: a person engaged in journalism ; especially : a writer or editor for a news medium b: a writer who aims at a mass audience.
*sigh*
crit·ic
Pronunciation:
?kri-tik
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin criticus, from Greek kritikos, from kritikos able to discern or judge, from krinein
Date: 1588
1 a: one who expresses a reasoned opinion on any matter especially involving a judgment of its value, truth, righteousness, beauty, or technique b: one who engages often professionally in the analysis, evaluation, or appreciation of works of art or artistic performances
2: one given to harsh or captious judgment.
See what's highlighted in RED. Journalists who do those things ultimately LOSE THEIR CREDIBILITY and usually THEIR JOBS.
And for additional reference...in RED again.
jour·nal·ism
Pronunciation: ?j?r-n?-?li-z?m
Function: noun
Date: 1828
1 a: the collection and editing of news for presentation through the media b: the public press c: an academic study concerned with the collection and editing of news or the management of a news medium2 a: writing designed for publication in a newspaper or magazine b: writing characterized by a direct presentation of facts or description of events without an attempt at interpretation c: writing designed to appeal to current popular taste or public interest
Journalists and Critics are polar opposites of each other in what they communicate.
EDIT: spelling error.
"sigh"
the part thats highlighted in yellow is for your information ... its not rocket science now is it .
But now I guess you'll try and tell me that Game Reviewers/Journalists/Critics and sites like Eurogamer are not aimed at a mass audience .. so yeah "sigh" to you too .
No, because the second definition doesn't supersede the first. A person is NOT a journalist if they don't follow the tenets of journalism, regardless of what audience they cater to or its size. What the hell do you think journalist means.
"A person who practices journalism."
Critics, by their very nature, are "unethical" because opinion, no matter how much it is based on facts, cannot fit into the ethical and professional rules required of journalists. I suggest you read the Journalist's Code of Ethics for a clearer understanding of the expectations of the profession.
I know this because I am a professional writer -- 23 years in total, and 14 of those years as a journalist. What I mean by professional is that I am not some IT geek who happened to get a book deal and now somehow thinks he is a writer. Or a blogger who fancies himself a writer because he can regurgitate a few paragraphs into Wordpress each day. I mean a person who makes 100% of his living as a successful writer and provides for his family, maintains our two homes, a car, and a boat on that profession, and has done so for over two decades.
So please don't lecture me about some arcane, myopic definition of a journalist. You know not what you speak.
Yeah ok you win I lose ... there happy now , feel better ?
If he gives it 10/10 it will be deemed fair and unbiased. If he gives it 1/10 it will be deemed unfair and biased. Isn't it obvious?
Ahh yes but you forgot the middle ground or grey areas .. what if if gives it "6 or 7" or "4 or 5 "or even" 6.5" or "4.5 ? "
wont be so obvious then would it ?
If he gave MxO a 5/10 after launch, I think Tasos batter brace himself for the new review. He may be sorry he made such a demand. The score may be a *bit* higher, but my guess is it will still be pretty insulting to his ego. Plus this review will be by a guy that is being vaulted to the highest degree of honestly and integrity by the people on the boards.
I think this is gonna backfire on Darkfall, and I am gonna laugh...hard...
Well as I said in my OP I checked out Kieron Gillens other Mmo reviews on Eurogamer and read them all , I have played all the games he reviewed including the Matrix Online , I do think he's a very honest reviewer although as some have pointed "maybe " sometimes a little harsher than others, but thats fine for people that use reviews as a guide to buy or sub to game or not, because it seems he tells it like it is without really any frills.
As for the Matrix Online review I perhaps would have given maybe 1 point higher because it tried to be different and was quite fun although as he stated the parts did'nt quite work together as a whole.
I am playing Darkfall as we speak and as someone relativley new to PVP, I have to say I am really enjoying it and I am enjoying it far more than I did the Matrix Online ... yes it has issues and there are a heap of changes that need to be made for it to settle down and become successful.
So I for one ( and its just my opinion) would quite probably expect Keiron Gillen not to give Darkfall a high score and I would predict it will be around the middle point , however if he gives it any lower tha the Matrix Online I think it would make me a little suspicious because without a shadow of a doubt its much better than the Matrix Online was and I'm convinced alot of people who have played both games would agree.
As for Tasos having to Brace Himself ... well the Movie Perfect Storm comes to mind for me.
I cant wait for the new review because I find all this quite fascinating !
I actually played MxO for a few months non-stop. I really liked the atmosphere, the graphic, and the story, and I got a big charge out of the constructs. It also helped to have the radio streams from MxO fans running in the background. It gave it somewhat of a GTA feel for a while. The two things that really killed it for me in the end were the clunky combat system and the repetitive missions. I think I left around level 31 or something like that. In retrospect, it deserved a 5, but I also have to say the CSR team was top notch, I especially appreciated having Walrus around.
I am not too sure how this will turn out for DF. I do think Tasos could have brought the re-review about in private contact with Eurogamer. Especially if the logs he sites are truthful accounts (which I do question), to bring to their attention. The public spectacle was pretty unprofessional on both sides, but that is only my opinion.
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
Even though I personally dont really take any notice of reviews ( If I want to see what a game is like there is no better reviewer than yourself ) I have been interested to see how this all turns out . I have been reading some of Kieran Gillens Previous Mmo reviews and to all intensive purposes the guy certainly does seem to have a great journalistic integrity and fairness. here's a list of some of his Mmo reviews , I chose these because they were done for Eurogamer.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/r_CoV_pc So I'm wondering .. what do you guys think , have you played any of the games he has reviewed for Eurogamer ? And if so do you agree with his reviews and scores ? I've played all the games he's reviewed here and have to say after reading them he seemed pretty spot on.
does it matter? will the review change the awful state and broken game mechanics plaguing DF at this point?
shouldn't people be flaming that new review that only gives 4/10?
i guess i'm just spoiled with playing quality games that you can easily tell will evolve and be even better after a few months post-release. there is so much broken, from the insane amount of clipping to the overly large and clumsy ui/windows/etc, to the "oh we need realism HERE, but to hell with realism in those 8 areas", to insanely broken city siege mechanics, to mobs you can snip from rooftops with no fear of danger or even fear of taking damage, to macroing being the only way to gain skills to be competitive, to exploiters having an insane headstart as it becomes harder to level (have to hit something to gain skill, misses don't count, can't aim at nonvalid targets for skill gain), to retarded cli commands to do items that REALLY ARE point and click in all other mmos released this century, yeah, the list goes on for a couple of pages of broken and retarded "stuff" in this game.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Comments
Actually considering the increased traffic boost that EuroGamer got as a result of all the advertising that Tasos did for them... I'd say they were VERY happy with the results. Quite a bit happier than Tasos was with a 2/10 review it would seem anyway.
I would expect them to play up the "Re-Review" as well.
It makes very little personal difference to them what the score is, or even what the words in the review are.
They are a site that generates it's revenue from the number of hits the site gets. All this "drama" did for them was increase their revenue... what incentive would they have to try and make the "drama" go away?
The best outcome for EuroGamer would be a "Re-review" score on one end of the spectrum or the other. So, a 1-2, or a 9-10. All of the scores in the middle will have varying degrees of less impact. The absolute worst from them would be scores in the 5-6 range.
Regardless of how the next score comes out... there are a lot more people that know of EuroGamer now than did before Tasos' rant.
Hmmmm ....... some valid points as usual Xzyax. I had honestly never heard of Eurogamer or Ed Zitron prior to the review so someone apparently did their job. Perhaps it was Tasos.
You mention the next review potentially being on one end of the spectrum or the other. With that logic don't you think it would actually be more advantageous for Eurogamer to give another 1-2. I'm sure Tasos would comment on an excessively high (9-10) score, but there is nothing like a dev showing his ass. Another excessively low one, lol, would certainly bring out his best.
~Hairysun~
It would be one thing if he gave a legitimate review and gave the game a 2/10, but he didn't even play the game which is obvious from reading the review to anyone who has played it, but if you already played it what use would a REVIEW do for you? The guy obviously hates indie niche games, especially ffa pvp/full loot ones, and lied out his ass throughout the entire review. If he had talked shit about legitimate things instead of flat out lieing or making things up it would be one thing, but he didn't.
I've mentioned this in other threads, but you've oversimplified things greatly. A new player doesn't know that it takes .5 seconds to switch weapons Weapon switching can be a pain, even if you know what you're doing. Also, there are players that have reported issues with the G-series gaming keyboards (ilke the game taking up to 60 seconds to change modes from UI to action), which can compound problems. From another thread:
Unfortunately, it's not always quite that easy. At a high level, you're right, but there are exceptions and extra keystrokes required, depending on the situation. Here are some examples:
A player will get used to these foibles and/or change hotkeys away from default, but the interface is overly cumbersome. Regarding the G-series keyboard issues, here's the workaround players have to use (if they know about it - apparenlty, the problem has been around since beta?!?):
Originally posted by Klobius
Weird it may seem, but I know back in beta people had this same problem. The solution was simple if you had a G15, G11, or another G** keyboard. Unplug your keyboard before you turn your comp on and load up DF when your keyboard is unplugged. Try to load the game that way and it could help. Also, after you type your password in, unplug it again and then plug it in when the game is loaded...Hope this helps.
Regarding the reviewer making stuff up, his review did seem biased and antagonistic, but he had some valid points mixed in with the negative hyperbole. Most notably, Ed Zitron basically says the same thing as King Manus - the leader of the Hyperion Alliance:
In his ".. Accepts Terms of Surrender..." post, King Manus states: "I would say, other than the obvious stacking of the numerical odds against us, (one's conquered enemies are never dead - they just join new enemies!) it would be the attritive effect of the grind of Darkfall itself, which has slowly snuffed out the lights in the leadership of Hyperion, leaving too few new sparks to keep the torch burning."
So, did King Manus say "fuck that shit" and make up "a shitton of lies about it." He's put a ton of time into Darkfall, whereas Ed Zitron put in somewhere between 2 and 9+ hours, but they both reach the same conclusion regarding this aspect of the game and, more importantly, King Manus considers this aspect of the game as being the major reason behind the demise of the Hyperion Alliance.
~Ripper
Manus never even played darkfall. He played forumfall and macroed on top of the wessex bank 24/7
Red Amber irony alert
http://1heckofaguy.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/ironyadvisorylevels.jpg
Quoting people doesn't make you clever, in fact, it makes you all the more stupid for not bothering to read the quotes you post in the first place.
Well... Kieron is a cool dude, and a professional. The type of guy you respect solelly because his quality. If where your boss, you would be happy.
But no, I don't want a new review about Darkfall, and much less a eurogamer one. Let the time talk, like with EVE. We live in a world where the stupid, and Quick Time Event games are like the norm, and Darkfall break that norm.
Why would he need, as you say, journalistic integrity? He's a critic, not a journalist. Critics are barely writers.
I'm sorry but I disagree, Eurogamer certainly aims at a mass audience dont you think ?.
jour·nal·ist
Pronunciation: -n?-list
Function: noun
Date: 1693
1 a: a person engaged in journalism ; especially : a writer or editor for a news medium b: a writer who aims at a mass audience.
*sigh*
crit·ic
Pronunciation:
?kri-tik
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin criticus, from Greek kritikos, from kritikos able to discern or judge, from krinein
Date: 1588
1 a: one who expresses a reasoned opinion on any matter especially involving a judgment of its value, truth, righteousness, beauty, or technique b: one who engages often professionally in the analysis, evaluation, or appreciation of works of art or artistic performances
2: one given to harsh or captious judgment.
See what's highlighted in RED. Journalists who do those things ultimately LOSE THEIR CREDIBILITY and usually THEIR JOBS.
And for additional reference...in RED again.
jour·nal·ism
Pronunciation: ?j?r-n?-?li-z?m
Function: noun
Date: 1828
1 a: the collection and editing of news for presentation through the media b: the public press c: an academic study concerned with the collection and editing of news or the management of a news medium2 a: writing designed for publication in a newspaper or magazine b: writing characterized by a direct presentation of facts or description of events without an attempt at interpretation c: writing designed to appeal to current popular taste or public interest
Journalists and Critics are polar opposites of each other in what they communicate.
EDIT: spelling error.
"sigh"
the part thats highlighted in yellow is for your information ... its not rocket science now is it .
But now I guess you'll try and tell me that Game Reviewers/Journalists/Critics and sites like Eurogamer are not aimed at a mass audience .. so yeah "sigh" to you too .
Actually considering the increased traffic boost that EuroGamer got as a result of all the advertising that Tasos did for them... I'd say they were VERY happy with the results. Quite a bit happier than Tasos was with a 2/10 review it would seem anyway.
I would expect them to play up the "Re-Review" as well.
It makes very little personal difference to them what the score is, or even what the words in the review are.
They are a site that generates it's revenue from the number of hits the site gets. All this "drama" did for them was increase their revenue... what incentive would they have to try and make the "drama" go away?
The best outcome for EuroGamer would be a "Re-review" score on one end of the spectrum or the other. So, a 1-2, or a 9-10. All of the scores in the middle will have varying degrees of less impact. The absolute worst from them would be scores in the 5-6 range.
Regardless of how the next score comes out... there are a lot more people that know of EuroGamer now than did before Tasos' rant.
Hmmmm ....... some valid points as usual Xzyax. I had honestly never heard of Eurogamer or Ed Zitron prior to the review so someone apparently did their job. Perhaps it was Tasos.
You mention the next review potentially being on one end of the spectrum or the other. With that logic don't you think it would actually be more advantageous for Eurogamer to give another 1-2. I'm sure Tasos would comment on an excessively high (9-10) score, but there is nothing like a dev showing his ass. Another excessively low one, lol, would certainly bring out his best.
~Hairysun~
Heh... yeah, I am in the same boat.
Never heard of EuroGamer or visited their site until Tasos started talking about it, and the review being linked a hundred times on the official boards.
While I think a really high or really low score would serve about the same purposes for EuroGamer and their increased traffic... I do agree that a lower score would probably give the most mileage.
Not that I am suggesting a traffic-driven site would ever think of trying to artificially create drama.
Actually considering the increased traffic boost that EuroGamer got as a result of all the advertising that Tasos did for them... I'd say they were VERY happy with the results. Quite a bit happier than Tasos was with a 2/10 review it would seem anyway.
I would expect them to play up the "Re-Review" as well.
It makes very little personal difference to them what the score is, or even what the words in the review are.
They are a site that generates it's revenue from the number of hits the site gets. All this "drama" did for them was increase their revenue... what incentive would they have to try and make the "drama" go away?
The best outcome for EuroGamer would be a "Re-review" score on one end of the spectrum or the other. So, a 1-2, or a 9-10. All of the scores in the middle will have varying degrees of less impact. The absolute worst from them would be scores in the 5-6 range.
Regardless of how the next score comes out... there are a lot more people that know of EuroGamer now than did before Tasos' rant.
Hmmmm ....... some valid points as usual Xzyax. I had honestly never heard of Eurogamer or Ed Zitron prior to the review so someone apparently did their job. Perhaps it was Tasos.
You mention the next review potentially being on one end of the spectrum or the other. With that logic don't you think it would actually be more advantageous for Eurogamer to give another 1-2. I'm sure Tasos would comment on an excessively high (9-10) score, but there is nothing like a dev showing his ass. Another excessively low one, lol, would certainly bring out his best.
~Hairysun~
It would be one thing if he gave a legitimate review and gave the game a 2/10, but he didn't even play the game which is obvious from reading the review to anyone who has played it, but if you already played it what use would a REVIEW do for you? The guy obviously hates indie niche games, especially ffa pvp/full loot ones, and lied out his ass throughout the entire review. If he had talked shit about legitimate things instead of flat out lieing or making things up it would be one thing, but he didn't.
Check out this site:
www.keenandgraev.com/
Here is Keen's statement on the review:
"...the gist of what he is saying is true."
So if the review was so full of "lied out his ass throughout the entire review" and "flat out lieing or making things up"...
Then why did Keen say the gist of it is true?
Hmm...
So who are we to believe?
A random poster on the forum who just created an account today?
Or, Keen. Who has a ton of blogs to back up his play-time and his experiences in the game?
Doesn't matter if Eurogamer's review is fair or not. Their credibility is shot.
Ah whatever this review will just sparkle another DF drama incident. If its low I am sure Tasos will be on his broom stick and QQ'ing to all. If its high then god help us all. DF aint worth higher than a six.
I think Eurogamer will give it a 5 or 6 and say some nice things somewhere in the text. Will Tasos QQ still at this rating?Gods knows with that man. Maybe Eurogamer wont bother and just send Tasos a 'nice' GTFO and STFU email ?
Ah DF... I never understood the power of PR untill Tasos showed us how to faff it all up... (Well that and game development)
Bah, who cares about fairness. I hope he stomps it into the ground, and we are entertained by a good mud-slinging!
muahaha XD
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Why would he need, as you say, journalistic integrity? He's a critic, not a journalist. Critics are barely writers.
I'm sorry but I disagree, Eurogamer certainly aims at a mass audience dont you think ?.
jour·nal·ist
Pronunciation: -n?-list
Function: noun
Date: 1693
1 a: a person engaged in journalism ; especially : a writer or editor for a news medium b: a writer who aims at a mass audience.
*sigh*
crit·ic
Pronunciation:
?kri-tik
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin criticus, from Greek kritikos, from kritikos able to discern or judge, from krinein
Date: 1588
1 a: one who expresses a reasoned opinion on any matter especially involving a judgment of its value, truth, righteousness, beauty, or technique b: one who engages often professionally in the analysis, evaluation, or appreciation of works of art or artistic performances
2: one given to harsh or captious judgment.
See what's highlighted in RED. Journalists who do those things ultimately LOSE THEIR CREDIBILITY and usually THEIR JOBS.
And for additional reference...in RED again.
jour·nal·ism
Pronunciation: ?j?r-n?-?li-z?m
Function: noun
Date: 1828
1 a: the collection and editing of news for presentation through the media b: the public press c: an academic study concerned with the collection and editing of news or the management of a news medium2 a: writing designed for publication in a newspaper or magazine b: writing characterized by a direct presentation of facts or description of events without an attempt at interpretation c: writing designed to appeal to current popular taste or public interest
Journalists and Critics are polar opposites of each other in what they communicate.
EDIT: spelling error.
"sigh"
the part thats highlighted in yellow is for your information ... its not rocket science now is it .
But now I guess you'll try and tell me that Game Reviewers/Journalists/Critics and sites like Eurogamer are not aimed at a mass audience .. so yeah "sigh" to you too .
No, because the second definition doesn't supersede the first. A person is NOT a journalist if they don't follow the tenets of journalism, regardless of what audience they cater to or its size. What the hell do you think journalist means.
"A person who practices journalism."
Critics, by their very nature, are "unethical" because opinion, no matter how much it is based on facts, cannot fit into the ethical and professional rules required of journalists. I suggest you read the Journalist's Code of Ethics for a clearer understanding of the expectations of the profession.
I know this because I am a professional writer -- 23 years in total, and 14 of those years as a journalist. What I mean by professional is that I am not some IT geek who happened to get a book deal and now somehow thinks he is a writer. Or a blogger who fancies himself a writer because he can regurgitate a few paragraphs into Wordpress each day. I mean a person who makes 100% of his living as a successful writer and provides for his family, maintains our two homes, a car, and a boat on that profession, and has done so for over two decades.
So please don't lecture me about some arcane, myopic definition of a journalist. You know not what you speak.
Why would he need, as you say, journalistic integrity? He's a critic, not a journalist. Critics are barely writers.
I'm sorry but I disagree, Eurogamer certainly aims at a mass audience dont you think ?.
jour·nal·ist
Pronunciation: -n?-list
Function: noun
Date: 1693
1 a: a person engaged in journalism ; especially : a writer or editor for a news medium b: a writer who aims at a mass audience.
*sigh*
crit·ic
Pronunciation:
?kri-tik
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin criticus, from Greek kritikos, from kritikos able to discern or judge, from krinein
Date: 1588
1 a: one who expresses a reasoned opinion on any matter especially involving a judgment of its value, truth, righteousness, beauty, or technique b: one who engages often professionally in the analysis, evaluation, or appreciation of works of art or artistic performances
2: one given to harsh or captious judgment.
See what's highlighted in RED. Journalists who do those things ultimately LOSE THEIR CREDIBILITY and usually THEIR JOBS.
And for additional reference...in RED again.
jour·nal·ism
Pronunciation: ?j?r-n?-?li-z?m
Function: noun
Date: 1828
1 a: the collection and editing of news for presentation through the media b: the public press c: an academic study concerned with the collection and editing of news or the management of a news medium2 a: writing designed for publication in a newspaper or magazine b: writing characterized by a direct presentation of facts or description of events without an attempt at interpretation c: writing designed to appeal to current popular taste or public interest
Journalists and Critics are polar opposites of each other in what they communicate.
EDIT: spelling error.
"sigh"
the part thats highlighted in yellow is for your information ... its not rocket science now is it .
But now I guess you'll try and tell me that Game Reviewers/Journalists/Critics and sites like Eurogamer are not aimed at a mass audience .. so yeah "sigh" to you too .
No, because the second definition doesn't supersede the first. A person is NOT a journalist if they don't follow the tenets of journalism, regardless of what audience they cater to or its size. What the hell do you think journalist means.
"A person who practices journalism."
Critics, by their very nature, are "unethical" because opinion, no matter how much it is based on facts, cannot fit into the ethical and professional rules required of journalists. I suggest you read the Journalist's Code of Ethics for a clearer understanding of the expectations of the profession.
I know this because I am a professional writer -- 23 years in total, and 14 of those years as a journalist. What I mean by professional is that I am not some IT geek who happened to get a book deal and now somehow thinks he is a writer. Or a blogger who fancies himself a writer because he can regurgitate a few paragraphs into Wordpress each day. I mean a person who makes 100% of his living as a successful writer and provides for his family, maintains our two homes, a car, and a boat on that profession, and has done so for over two decades.
So please don't lecture me about some arcane, myopic definition of a journalist. You know not what you speak.
Yeah ok you win I lose ... there happy now , feel better ?
Ahh yes but you forgot the middle ground or grey areas .. what if if gives it "6 or 7" or "4 or 5 "or even" 6.5" or "4.5 ? "
wont be so obvious then would it ?
If he gave MxO a 5/10 after launch, I think Tasos batter brace himself for the new review. He may be sorry he made such a demand. The score may be a *bit* higher, but my guess is it will still be pretty insulting to his ego. Plus this review will be by a guy that is being vaulted to the highest degree of honestly and integrity by the people on the boards.
I think this is gonna backfire on Darkfall, and I am gonna laugh...hard...
Well as I said in my OP I checked out Kieron Gillens other Mmo reviews on Eurogamer and read them all , I have played all the games he reviewed including the Matrix Online , I do think he's a very honest reviewer although as some have pointed "maybe " sometimes a little harsher than others, but thats fine for people that use reviews as a guide to buy or sub to game or not, because it seems he tells it like it is without really any frills.
As for the Matrix Online review I perhaps would have given maybe 1 point higher because it tried to be different and was quite fun although as he stated the parts did'nt quite work together as a whole.
I am playing Darkfall as we speak and as someone relativley new to PVP, I have to say I am really enjoying it and I am enjoying it far more than I did the Matrix Online ... yes it has issues and there are a heap of changes that need to be made for it to settle down and become successful.
So I for one ( and its just my opinion) would quite probably expect Keiron Gillen not to give Darkfall a high score and I would predict it will be around the middle point , however if he gives it any lower tha the Matrix Online I think it would make me a little suspicious because without a shadow of a doubt its much better than the Matrix Online was and I'm convinced alot of people who have played both games would agree.
As for Tasos having to Brace Himself ... well the Movie Perfect Storm comes to mind for me.
I cant wait for the new review because I find all this quite fascinating !
I actually played MxO for a few months non-stop. I really liked the atmosphere, the graphic, and the story, and I got a big charge out of the constructs. It also helped to have the radio streams from MxO fans running in the background. It gave it somewhat of a GTA feel for a while. The two things that really killed it for me in the end were the clunky combat system and the repetitive missions. I think I left around level 31 or something like that. In retrospect, it deserved a 5, but I also have to say the CSR team was top notch, I especially appreciated having Walrus around.
I am not too sure how this will turn out for DF. I do think Tasos could have brought the re-review about in private contact with Eurogamer. Especially if the logs he sites are truthful accounts (which I do question), to bring to their attention. The public spectacle was pretty unprofessional on both sides, but that is only my opinion.
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
Tried: WoW, Shadowbane, Anarchy Online, Everquest, WWII Online, Planetside
Beta: Lotro, Tabula Rasa, WAR.
does it matter? will the review change the awful state and broken game mechanics plaguing DF at this point?
shouldn't people be flaming that new review that only gives 4/10?
i guess i'm just spoiled with playing quality games that you can easily tell will evolve and be even better after a few months post-release. there is so much broken, from the insane amount of clipping to the overly large and clumsy ui/windows/etc, to the "oh we need realism HERE, but to hell with realism in those 8 areas", to insanely broken city siege mechanics, to mobs you can snip from rooftops with no fear of danger or even fear of taking damage, to macroing being the only way to gain skills to be competitive, to exploiters having an insane headstart as it becomes harder to level (have to hit something to gain skill, misses don't count, can't aim at nonvalid targets for skill gain), to retarded cli commands to do items that REALLY ARE point and click in all other mmos released this century, yeah, the list goes on for a couple of pages of broken and retarded "stuff" in this game.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?