in fact, none of the games I own are button bashers.
Not even Street Fighter?
What about Bionic Commando, surely that is a must buy game for a console owner? That's a button basher.
Shooters is no exception, I button bashed in Bioshock on the 360 but not on the PC. In fact I button bash just to get through the game menus. "Type in your name". lol!
PC gaming software revenues rose by 18 per cent to USD 12.7 billion in 2008, according to a new report from the PC Gaming Alliance (PCGA).
The non-profit corporation's 2008 Horizon's Report suggests that the overall market value for PC games and games hardware was USD 68 billion in 2008. This figure is expected to rise to USD 143 billion by 2013.
The total installed userbase of PCs that could be used to play games (including both desktops and notepads) was estimated at 228 million. By 2013 this figure is estimated to rise to 600 million, making the PC by far the most prevalent games format in the world.
"PC gaming extends way beyond a dedicated niche of hardcore PC gamers and high-end PC gaming systems," said Bob O'Donnell, IDC vice president for clients and displays. "In fact, surveys of US consumers show that about 60 per cent of all consumers over 18 play some kind of games and about 59 percent of them prefer PCs as their primary platform."
The report suggests that software growth was driven by online sales, particularly in Asia, with online revenue trends closely following changes in broadband penetration.
"In 2008, China became the leading market for PC games and almost all the revenue in China was from online business models that involved no physical retail component," said DFC Intelligence analyst David Cole. "Going forward, we expect China’s business model will be implemented on a global basis."
The full Horizon's Report is available to all PCGA members, further information can be found at the corporation's official website
Does partypoker and solitaire and retro gaming count as playing games on the pc? I would be very very suprised if PCs werent the most common platform of gaming out there since its been around since 1983 and almost every home I go into has either a PC or notebook of some sort. However this isn't the same as playing Farcry 2 or CoD4.
The report also states that that the growth is due to the Asian market. I would expect that to grow steeply over the nest few years. But this is not the North American or European market.
I wouldn't use hardware sales as an indicator of how healthy the PC gaming market is. I think sales of games is a much better indicator than that.
PC is the largest, best selling gaming platform. Always has been.
1 PC game sales alone > all of PS3's combined.
1 PC game sales alone > 1/2 Xbox 360 games sales.
heh talk about flawed logic.
First of all, PC isn't the best selling gaming platform, even if we keep by your ridiculous logic of 1 game being a representive of sales.
The sims, which is the best selling PC game , sold 16 million.
To compare:
Super Mario Bros 1: 30 million
Wii play: 23 million
Wii fit:18.22 million
Super Mario Bros 3: 18 million
Mario Kart Wii: 15 million
Gran Turismo 3: A spec: 14 million
These are only home consoles, handheld console software sales even more ofcourse.
Your numbers are also incorrect (surprise!)
As of June 30 2008, The Playstation 3 sold 94 million software copies, so I'd like to know which game has sold 94 million copies, Minesweeper? haha.
I'm not sure how much the Xbox360 has sold, but as it has more hardware sales and a higher software attachment to the PS3, probably a lot more.
It's funny how you first said that console sales have always outsold PC software, but now it's suddenly the other way around? seems as if you can't keep your story straigth.
Not even Street Fighter?
What about Bionic Commando, surely that is a must buy game for a console owner? That's a button basher.
Shooters is no exception, I button bashed in Bioshock on the 360 but not on the PC. In fact I button bash just to get through the game menus. "Type in your name". lol!
Street fighter? Haha, you're not going to get anywhere with button bashing in Street Fighter.
If you're "button bashing", you're doing something wrong as Bioshock on the 360 is the exact same game as on the PC, so you would have to be "Mouse mashing".
Bionic Commando isn't a must own, the game can barely hold up a 7.0 score on metacritic
South America, Russia, India, Europe and Asia are strong PC gaming markets and the lol console devs are starting to realize this.
Its good to be a PC gamer.
Still in your little fantasy world? South America, Russia, India and most of China don't buy PC games, they buy pirated versions of them. Sorry, but Pedro and Lee don't buy PC games. Console software sell better in Europe than PC software does, we already went over this before and I proved you wrong with hard numbers, stop being in denial.
Console devs are not starting to "realize" this, in the REAL world, more and more developers are moving over to consoles. PC sales are significantly lower than console sales. Sorry bud, thats the hard truth. Your favorite gaming platform is getting raped by consoles in sales.
Arakazi: The vast majority of the "sale increases" these reports are talking about come from asian countries such as Korea and China, where especialy MMORPG's are very popular. Thing is, they play very different games than we do, so it doesn't mean jack for game developers here.
1) ALL consoles vs 1 format (PC) is NOT a fair fight, and I too laugh at this... I mean, how unbalanced a view can you get when you compare at LEAST 3 (and most likely 4-6) platforms TOTAL sales to 1.
2) NPD is crap when it comes to PCs.... simply put it does NOT record digital download sales... which means anything bought on Steam, Impulse, direct2drive, or even any direct download from the developer themelves, are ALL ignored. And UNLIKE consoles, PC gamers seem to have welcomed this medium with open arms.... so where it might not matter so much on console levels, it matters like hell on PC.
Sorry, but because of this alone, no POS stats are going to settle this argument... because no one is really tracking the necessary ones on the PC.
Now that said, can we go back to playing games instead of whining over who is playing on the wrong damn thing? Dammit people!
I doubt that digital downloads would make much of a difference tbh, people prefer hard copies. But I do think that piracy does make a big impact. And your right it is hard not to laugh at.
Concidering even boxed games now mean a download with steam, basically making the discs useless? (Empire, Fear2, Dawn of War 2... not just Valve games anymore.) I would say in PC land, digital is becomming the end-all-be-all... like Gamestop is for the console world.
2) NPD is crap when it comes to PCs.... simply put it does NOT record digital download sales... which means anything bought on Steam, Impulse, direct2drive, or even any direct download from the developer themelves, are ALL ignored. And UNLIKE consoles, PC gamers seem to have welcomed this medium with open arms.... so where it might not matter so much on console levels, it matters like hell on PC. Sorry, but because of this alone, no POS stats are going to settle this argument... because no one is really tracking the necessary ones on the PC. Now that said, can we go back to playing games instead of whining over who is playing on the wrong damn thing? Dammit people!
That's a staw man. If we're going to count download games then we also have to count game sold through the Playstation store and Xbox Live. That's all the casual "arcade" games as well as the classic PSX and original Xbox games. I'm willing to bet that Braid sold better on the XBox than on the PC.
I just dont understand the hostility in this thread. I play games on the PC, I play games on my 360. For me its win/win. I will admit, since I have given up MMOs I do use the 360 considerably more.
I just dont understand the hostility in this thread. I play games on the PC, I play games on my 360. For me its win/win. I will admit, since I have given up MMOs I do use the 360 considerably more.
I feel the same way. This is the ongoing debate between the PC Elitists and the Console players that has been going on since the mid 80's. I used to be one of the PC Elitists myself until the current generation of consoles made me realize how incredibly stupid I was being. I now own a Xbox 360 and most of my casual gaming has moved to that platform as it's just a whole lot easier to use, It just works no matter what the game is and despite how much the Elitists like to disbelieve... the games are every bit as good if not better. I still use my PC for gaming and to access the internet. Most of my PC games these days are MMOs or web based games. I also prefer the PC for a lot of games where point and click gameplay just makes sense(Mostly RTS or TBS type games).
Also I have what is probably a run of the mill PC. It not that old, out dated or cheap but it's not 'state of the art' either. All of the new games coming out will work on it but on most the best I can hope for with any decent playability is medium settings. With the Xbox 360 I get full settings on every game right out of the box. $300 dollars for an Xbox just made a whole lot more sense than over $700 dollars in PC upgrades to be even remotely comparable in my book.
My PC still does everything I want it to do and I now have an Xbox for everything it didn't do. I think I've got the best of both worlds and the 360 purchase saved me hundreds of dollars to do it. It just makes good sense.
I wouldn't use hardware sales as an indicator of how healthy the PC gaming market is. I think sales of games is a much better indicator than that.
PC is the largest, best selling gaming platform. Always has been.
1 PC game sales alone > all of PS3's combined.
1 PC game sales alone > 1/2 Xbox 360 games sales.
heh talk about flawed logic.
First of all, PC isn't the best selling gaming platform, even if we keep by your ridiculous logic of 1 game being a representive of sales.
The sims, which is the best selling PC game , sold 16 million.
To compare:
Super Mario Bros 1: 30 million
Wii play: 23 million
Wii fit:18.22 million
Super Mario Bros 3: 18 million
Mario Kart Wii: 15 million
Gran Turismo 3: A spec: 14 million
These are only home consoles, handheld console software sales even more ofcourse.
Your numbers are also incorrect (surprise!)
As of June 30 2008, The Playstation 3 sold 94 million software copies, so I'd like to know which game has sold 94 million copies, Minesweeper? haha.
I'm not sure how much the Xbox360 has sold, but as it has more hardware sales and a higher software attachment to the PS3, probably a lot more.
It's funny how you first said that console sales have always outsold PC software, but now it's suddenly the other way around? seems as if you can't keep your story straigth.
Xbox 360 has $5.9 billion of standalone software revenues total.
Warcraft of Warcraft alone has $3 billion. PS3 = teh fail.
The PC is the best selling gaming platform. PC>sales than any other platform.
I wouldn't use hardware sales as an indicator of how healthy the PC gaming market is. I think sales of games is a much better indicator than that.
PC is the largest, best selling gaming platform. Always has been.
1 PC game sales alone > all of PS3's combined.
1 PC game sales alone > 1/2 Xbox 360 games sales.
heh talk about flawed logic.
First of all, PC isn't the best selling gaming platform, even if we keep by your ridiculous logic of 1 game being a representive of sales.
The sims, which is the best selling PC game , sold 16 million.
To compare:
Super Mario Bros 1: 30 million
Wii play: 23 million
Wii fit:18.22 million
Super Mario Bros 3: 18 million
Mario Kart Wii: 15 million
Gran Turismo 3: A spec: 14 million
These are only home consoles, handheld console software sales even more ofcourse.
Your numbers are also incorrect (surprise!)
As of June 30 2008, The Playstation 3 sold 94 million software copies, so I'd like to know which game has sold 94 million copies, Minesweeper? haha.
I'm not sure how much the Xbox360 has sold, but as it has more hardware sales and a higher software attachment to the PS3, probably a lot more.
It's funny how you first said that console sales have always outsold PC software, but now it's suddenly the other way around? seems as if you can't keep your story straigth.
Xbox 360 has $5.9 billion of standalone software revenues total.
Warcraft of Warcraft alone has $3 billion. PS3 = teh fail.
The PC is the best selling gaming platform. PC>sales than any other platform.
All other platforms combined >sales than PC.
PC>PS3
PC>Xbox 360
PC> Wii
Consoles >PC.
Sorry Baff, but you're going to have to come with actual sources instead of self made up numbers.I just pointed you towards the PS3 sales which are 94 million copies. There is not a single PC game that has sold 94 million copies, or even 20 million copies. Halo 3 alone made 560 million in revenue, Call of Duty 4 on the 360 outsold Halo 3 so thats probably about 650 million in revenue. 560 million + 650 = more than 1.1 billion, and thats just 2 games. Your numbers probably came from Uranus.
Give me one recently released game on the PC that has sold over 13 million copies. Don't bother: You can't, because none of them has. The closest thing are Sims 2 and World of Warcraft, both released in 2004.
Xbox360 and Wii are currently outselling the PC, PS3 is a bit uncertain atm.
It's just not happening Baff. Pointing towards a single game that's 5 years old isn't an indication of PC game sells.
The total software sales on consoles is much, much higher than PC games, so yes, Xbox360 software sales > PC software sales.
Give me one recently released game on the PC that has sold over 13 million copies. Don't bother: You can't, because none of them has. The closest thing are Sims 2 and World of Warcraft, both released in 2004. It's just not happening Baff. Pointing towards a single game that's 5 years old isn't an indication of PC game sells. The total software sales on consoles is much, much higher than PC games, so yes, Xbox360 software sales > PC software sales.
I didn't realise that money went out of date. That sales stopped being sales if it wasn't a title released this week.
Funny how you are happy to post sales figures for Super Mario's and other old games like the Sims when you thought they were impressive. But when they aren't you are all desperate to ignore older games.
Your console games are here today gone tomorrow. They make a lot of money for 3 months then it's over. How many console titles are still selling 15 years after release? Microsoft Flight made it's first Billion in 2004. It's never once topped the charts. (Every week they release another expansion).
Absolutely no console games are selling better this year than they did last year, let alone significantly better.
Warcraft made over $1 billion last year.
It made over a $1 billion the year before that.
Please show me one Xbox game that has made more than $ 3 Billion dollars.
I don't mind when it was released.
1 PC game has made more money than all those PS 3 games combined.
Just one title.
It doesn't matter how many new titles PS 3 bring out, they can't even compete with one 5 year old PC title. Add them all up together and PC sells more.
It's no good you looking at your little weekly sales charts of printed DVD's sold in shop windows to get a reliable picture of PC game revenues anymore.
Those days are long over.
My sources are Microsoft, Sony and Blizzard.
According to (PCGA) the PC gaming alliance, PC gaming netted $12.7 billion last year. Acccording to Microsoft to date, XBox 360 has netted $5.9 billion in games sales in totality.
[b]PC games sales in one year > 2 x (XBox 360 standalone game sales ever).[/b]
What did you think? A gamer base of 30 million consoles was buying more games than PC users?
Are you totally nuts? They sell 280 million PC's a year worldwide. Every year. That's 9 x (Total X Box platform sales ever) [i]per year[/i].
Xbox. RoflLmao.
How about I don't provide you with any sources for my figures and how about you use a little bit more common sense for yourself instead.
Sorry mate, but your in your in the wrong league. Just under half of all gaming software sold worldwide is on the PC platform. Consoles (including handhelds) make up the other half. (ELSPAa nd NPD figures have demonstrated that year after year too if you still feel you need more sources to tell you something that common sense dictates is obvious anyway). That's actually very impressive sales figures for consoles. I wouldn't knock it or be disappointed.
If you were to calculate it as games sold/platform unit, consoles would suddenly take all the titles. By a long way.
P.S. Lets also ignore the $6.7 billlion Online Poker made last year. Lets not even call that a PC game. Online Poker makes more revenue per year than Xbox 360 games have made ever. It's not listed in the NPD sales figures so lets ignore it.
What was this thread about again? Oh yes the future of gaming, anyone who thinks PC gaming is dieing is an idiot. Continue.
I don't think anyone here thinks it's dieing. Changing yes, evolving into something else maybe but not dieing. The current generation of consoles are almost PCs anyways and in the future they will be even more so. What we are seeing is the logical next step already evolving. The PC and the Console will be totally compatible and interchangeable in the future. The future console will be nothing more than a PC for your TV. Cheaper and more entertainment oriented but a PC just the same. Hell the Xbox 360 is almost at that point already. Just add web browsing to it and you'll basically have an entertainment focused PC. The programming code used for the Xbox is already a PC programming language that has been used for PC games for the last 7-10 years. Say what you will about Microsoft but they are on the right track as far as consoles are concerned. Making the console compatible with the PC was a brilliant move and a logical next step in console evolution. Future consoles will compliment the PCs and not replace them.
Give me one recently released game on the PC that has sold over 13 million copies. Don't bother: You can't, because none of them has. The closest thing are Sims 2 and World of Warcraft, both released in 2004. It's just not happening Baff. Pointing towards a single game that's 5 years old isn't an indication of PC game sells. The total software sales on consoles is much, much higher than PC games, so yes, Xbox360 software sales > PC software sales.
I didn't release that money went out of date. That sales stopped being sales if it wasn't a title released this week.
Funny how you happy to post sales figures for Super Mario's and other old games like the Sims when you thought they were impressive. But they aren't.
Your console games are here today gone to tomorrow. They make a lot of money for 3 months then it's over. How many console titles are still selling 15 years after release? Microsoft Flight made it's first Billion in 2004. It's never once topped the charts.
Warcraft made over $1 billion last year.
It made over a $1 billion the year before that.
Please show me one Xbox game that has made more than $ 3 Billion dollars.
I don't mind when it was released.
1 PC game has made more money than all those PS 3 games combined.
Just one title.
It doesn't matter how many new titles PS 3 bring out, they can't even compete with one 5 year old PC title. Add them all up together and PC sells more.
It's no good you looking at your little weekly sales charts of printed DVD's sold in shop windows to get a reliable picture of PC game revenues anymore.
Those days are long over.
My sources are Microsoft, Sony and Blizzard.
Ah baff, you're so poorly informed it's just funny.
The Playstation 3 sold 96 million software copies (this was back in 2008). Lets say 45 million were sold at 60$., probably a lot more but lets just say it for the sake of arguement, the rest were sold at 30$. Thats A LOT more than 3 billion buddy.
They actually sell a lot longer than 3 months. Go to your local gameshop, you'll see a little system called the Playstation 2, with a whole ton of platinium game collection often dating back with games from 2002 ~ 2003. The Playstation 3 and Xbox360 also launched brand new labels to republish older games. The arguement that only new games sell is a misconception by PC elitist.
These so called "15 year PC games" don't make a difference. Sorry, but a 10 year old PC game being sold for 5$ is not going to make you rich. 13 million copies of a 60$ game, however, does make you rich. Very, very rich.
Your sources are not Sony, Not Microsoft or Blizzard. They are assumptions, nothing more.
My sources are Sony, Microsoft and Blizard and this is "an assumption".
Originally posted by Gameloading
The Playstation 3 sold 96 million software copies (this was back in 2008). Lets say 45 million were sold at 60$., probably a lot more but lets just say it for the sake of arguement, the rest were sold at 30$. Thats A LOT more than 3 billion buddy.
Your sources are not Sony, Not Microsoft or Blizzard. They are assumptions, nothing more.
Please re-read my completed earlier post for more sources and figures.
You should note that while PS 2 was an excellent selling paltform, it didn't outsell the PC either. No console ever has.
It's the same old common mistake mate. Consoles sell more games than PC, but that's all the consoles combined and they don't sell significantly more. 5+ platfroms more or less = 1 very big selling platform.
15 year old games like MS flight might not make a difference to you, but the fans are still playing it. Games designers are still copying it. The dev's are still releasing multiple expansion packs for it per year.
I don't like guitar games. So lets discount them from console sales. lets wipe a $ billion or two off Xbox's sales figures.
Ok hang on a minute, lets not. What sells sells. 15 year old, 5 year old, 6 month old or brand new today. If it's still selling it's still selling.
And I have to say as a customer, if the game I want to buy costs $5 not $60 that is an added bonus. I don't want to pay 12 x as much money for a game that will be out of date in 1 year. How thick would I have to be to think that is an advantage?
As a producer you should realise that although they take less money per unit on older games, it's all profit. The dev's have been paid. The engine license paid. The investors repaid. It's all cream.
You don't just get the big payola on launch, but you get a pension for the next decade after!
My sources are Sony, Microsoft and Blizard and this is "an assumption". Originally posted by Gameloading
The Playstation 3 sold 96 million software copies (this was back in 2008). Lets say 45 million were sold at 60$., probably a lot more but lets just say it for the sake of arguement, the rest were sold at 30$. Thats A LOT more than 3 billion buddy.
Your sources are not Sony, Not Microsoft or Blizzard. They are assumptions, nothing more.
Please re-read my completed earlier post for more sources and figures.
You should note that while PS 2 was an excellent selling paltform, it didn't outsell the PC either. No console ever has.
It's the same old common mistake mate. Consoles sell more games than PC, but that's all the consoles combined and they don't sell significantly more. 5+ platfroms more or less = 1 very big selling platform.
You didn't post any sources, When I asked you for links to your sources you refused to give any.
Your logic is also flawed, 290 million PC's don't mean a damn thing, sorry.
How many of those can actually play modern games? Suddenly that number drops significantly now lets also remove the amount of people who don't actually play games. Yup, that number decreases yet again.
Having a PC does not make you a gamer.
If PC gaming was actually doing so well, where are those big numbers? There are no big selling games on the PC anymore, we have already concluded that. Only WoW and Sims 2 still make those numbers, both nearly 5 years old and by the time Call of Duty 4 is 5 years old, it will probably have outsold them (WoW only counting box sales obviously)
Thats because these big numbers come from casual games and China (which plays completely different kind of games, Ever heard of Fantasy Westward Journey 2?) So the PC gaming industry YOU'RE interested in is in strong decline (Unless you got a suddenly recently discovered interest in Chinese MMO's and web browser games?)
I'll also explain to you why this slow selling of PC gaming is a negative thing.
Lets say Call of Duty 4 sold 13 million copies on the Xbox360 at 60$ a piece in 2 years. Thats 13 million x 60$
Lets take one of those older games you still find in bargain bins, say, Half Life. It's one of the most popular PC games.
According to Valve on report posted on Gamesutra, Half Life sold 8 million copies as of 2004, and 9.3 million had been sold by 2008.
This means that it took Valve 10 years to sell 9 million copies of the game (4 million less then the 360 version of CoD4), and obviously many of them were far below the original retail price of 50$ as the price of these games goes down.
You want common sense? Here is common sense for ya: If PC gaming was doing this well, why did the PC gaming alliance came into existance? get a clue.
Steam, Impulse, D2Drive don't release sales figures for their online sales.
Popcap sells silly amounts of games that console companies could only dream of.
As for PC gaming, there will most likely be a shift back to it. It always happens.
We start out with specialized hardware, then it gets integrated into a uniform platform.
look at computers:
specialized hardware for each company -> a PC with software
Look at graphics cards:
Specalized hardware for each game (see pong) -> Graphics cards for every game
Look at Physics cards:
Seperate -> Integrated into Graphics cards
Look at Consoles:
Seperate -> _________.
give you a hint... people will learn you can hook a controller up to a computer and in 2020-2025 when we hit the photorealistic graphics and we either have to move to VR or instead of improve the graphics improve the price.
Prices of high end gameing technology will get cheaper and cheaper and the one edge specialized hardware (consoles) has will be gone.
PC will be there.
after 6 or so years, I had to change it a little...
In essence the lines between console and pc have been blurring for years, all the next gen systems have large amounts of online content, ten years ago online was the exclusive realm of the pcs. Now, there games that can be console or pc, and every since 1st gen Xbox, consoles have become essentially dumb-downed pcs in terns of what components are stuck inside of them. A little less software, no chance of upgrading, but many of them even offer keyboard perphrials these days. Not to mention the growing selection of games that are released on consoles and pc's, not concurrently but close enough.
If I was asked for my opinion, I'd have to say neither. Sooner or later one will be consumed by the other and there will simply be 'gaming' without the need to pick a specific media. Though that is still some distance in the future, it could be speculated that this debate would be ended by some form of immersive VR technology, or to a lesser extent some direct nueral connection from the brain to digital computing technology.
Comments
Not even Street Fighter?
What about Bionic Commando, surely that is a must buy game for a console owner? That's a button basher.
Shooters is no exception, I button bashed in Bioshock on the 360 but not on the PC. In fact I button bash just to get through the game menus. "Type in your name". lol!
PC games sales up 18 per cent in 2008
www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/pc-games-sales-up-18-per-cent-in-2008
yeah.
PC gaming software revenues rose by 18 per cent to USD 12.7 billion in 2008, according to a new report from the PC Gaming Alliance (PCGA).
The non-profit corporation's 2008 Horizon's Report suggests that the overall market value for PC games and games hardware was USD 68 billion in 2008. This figure is expected to rise to USD 143 billion by 2013.
The total installed userbase of PCs that could be used to play games (including both desktops and notepads) was estimated at 228 million. By 2013 this figure is estimated to rise to 600 million, making the PC by far the most prevalent games format in the world.
"PC gaming extends way beyond a dedicated niche of hardcore PC gamers and high-end PC gaming systems," said Bob O'Donnell, IDC vice president for clients and displays. "In fact, surveys of US consumers show that about 60 per cent of all consumers over 18 play some kind of games and about 59 percent of them prefer PCs as their primary platform."
The report suggests that software growth was driven by online sales, particularly in Asia, with online revenue trends closely following changes in broadband penetration.
"In 2008, China became the leading market for PC games and almost all the revenue in China was from online business models that involved no physical retail component," said DFC Intelligence analyst David Cole. "Going forward, we expect China’s business model will be implemented on a global basis."
The full Horizon's Report is available to all PCGA members, further information can be found at the corporation's official website
Does partypoker and solitaire and retro gaming count as playing games on the pc? I would be very very suprised if PCs werent the most common platform of gaming out there since its been around since 1983 and almost every home I go into has either a PC or notebook of some sort. However this isn't the same as playing Farcry 2 or CoD4.
The report also states that that the growth is due to the Asian market. I would expect that to grow steeply over the nest few years. But this is not the North American or European market.
South America, Russia, India, Europe and Asia are strong PC gaming markets and the lol console devs are starting to realize this.
Its good to be a PC gamer.
PC is the largest, best selling gaming platform. Always has been.
1 PC game sales alone > all of PS3's combined.
1 PC game sales alone > 1/2 Xbox 360 games sales.
heh talk about flawed logic.
First of all, PC isn't the best selling gaming platform, even if we keep by your ridiculous logic of 1 game being a representive of sales.
The sims, which is the best selling PC game , sold 16 million.
To compare:
Super Mario Bros 1: 30 million
Wii play: 23 million
Wii fit:18.22 million
Super Mario Bros 3: 18 million
Mario Kart Wii: 15 million
Gran Turismo 3: A spec: 14 million
These are only home consoles, handheld console software sales even more ofcourse.
Your numbers are also incorrect (surprise!)
As of June 30 2008, The Playstation 3 sold 94 million software copies, so I'd like to know which game has sold 94 million copies, Minesweeper? haha.
I'm not sure how much the Xbox360 has sold, but as it has more hardware sales and a higher software attachment to the PS3, probably a lot more.
It's funny how you first said that console sales have always outsold PC software, but now it's suddenly the other way around? seems as if you can't keep your story straigth.
Not even Street Fighter?
What about Bionic Commando, surely that is a must buy game for a console owner? That's a button basher.
Shooters is no exception, I button bashed in Bioshock on the 360 but not on the PC. In fact I button bash just to get through the game menus. "Type in your name". lol!
Street fighter? Haha, you're not going to get anywhere with button bashing in Street Fighter.
If you're "button bashing", you're doing something wrong as Bioshock on the 360 is the exact same game as on the PC, so you would have to be "Mouse mashing".
Bionic Commando isn't a must own, the game can barely hold up a 7.0 score on metacritic
South America, Russia, India, Europe and Asia are strong PC gaming markets and the lol console devs are starting to realize this.
Its good to be a PC gamer.
Still in your little fantasy world? South America, Russia, India and most of China don't buy PC games, they buy pirated versions of them. Sorry, but Pedro and Lee don't buy PC games. Console software sell better in Europe than PC software does, we already went over this before and I proved you wrong with hard numbers, stop being in denial.
Console devs are not starting to "realize" this, in the REAL world, more and more developers are moving over to consoles. PC sales are significantly lower than console sales. Sorry bud, thats the hard truth. Your favorite gaming platform is getting raped by consoles in sales.
Arakazi: The vast majority of the "sale increases" these reports are talking about come from asian countries such as Korea and China, where especialy MMORPG's are very popular. Thing is, they play very different games than we do, so it doesn't mean jack for game developers here.
Wow I love reading these fanboy wars... *laughs*
Look.... this is a fight that no one can win.
1) ALL consoles vs 1 format (PC) is NOT a fair fight, and I too laugh at this... I mean, how unbalanced a view can you get when you compare at LEAST 3 (and most likely 4-6) platforms TOTAL sales to 1.
2) NPD is crap when it comes to PCs.... simply put it does NOT record digital download sales... which means anything bought on Steam, Impulse, direct2drive, or even any direct download from the developer themelves, are ALL ignored. And UNLIKE consoles, PC gamers seem to have welcomed this medium with open arms.... so where it might not matter so much on console levels, it matters like hell on PC.
Sorry, but because of this alone, no POS stats are going to settle this argument... because no one is really tracking the necessary ones on the PC.
Now that said, can we go back to playing games instead of whining over who is playing on the wrong damn thing? Dammit people!
I doubt that digital downloads would make much of a difference tbh, people prefer hard copies. But I do think that piracy does make a big impact. And your right it is hard not to laugh at.
Concidering even boxed games now mean a download with steam, basically making the discs useless? (Empire, Fear2, Dawn of War 2... not just Valve games anymore.) I would say in PC land, digital is becomming the end-all-be-all... like Gamestop is for the console world.
i lol'd
i lol'd
Judging by your "contribution" I have more to laugh about.
That's a staw man. If we're going to count download games then we also have to count game sold through the Playstation store and Xbox Live. That's all the casual "arcade" games as well as the classic PSX and original Xbox games. I'm willing to bet that Braid sold better on the XBox than on the PC.
I just dont understand the hostility in this thread. I play games on the PC, I play games on my 360. For me its win/win. I will admit, since I have given up MMOs I do use the 360 considerably more.
The quality of PC games has nothing to do with market problems, really.
But with more console games coming, it's noticeable the trend of less solid products for the PC.
I feel the same way. This is the ongoing debate between the PC Elitists and the Console players that has been going on since the mid 80's. I used to be one of the PC Elitists myself until the current generation of consoles made me realize how incredibly stupid I was being. I now own a Xbox 360 and most of my casual gaming has moved to that platform as it's just a whole lot easier to use, It just works no matter what the game is and despite how much the Elitists like to disbelieve... the games are every bit as good if not better. I still use my PC for gaming and to access the internet. Most of my PC games these days are MMOs or web based games. I also prefer the PC for a lot of games where point and click gameplay just makes sense(Mostly RTS or TBS type games).
Also I have what is probably a run of the mill PC. It not that old, out dated or cheap but it's not 'state of the art' either. All of the new games coming out will work on it but on most the best I can hope for with any decent playability is medium settings. With the Xbox 360 I get full settings on every game right out of the box. $300 dollars for an Xbox just made a whole lot more sense than over $700 dollars in PC upgrades to be even remotely comparable in my book.
My PC still does everything I want it to do and I now have an Xbox for everything it didn't do. I think I've got the best of both worlds and the 360 purchase saved me hundreds of dollars to do it. It just makes good sense.
Bren
while(horse==dead)
{
beat();
}
PC is the largest, best selling gaming platform. Always has been.
1 PC game sales alone > all of PS3's combined.
1 PC game sales alone > 1/2 Xbox 360 games sales.
heh talk about flawed logic.
First of all, PC isn't the best selling gaming platform, even if we keep by your ridiculous logic of 1 game being a representive of sales.
The sims, which is the best selling PC game , sold 16 million.
To compare:
Super Mario Bros 1: 30 million
Wii play: 23 million
Wii fit:18.22 million
Super Mario Bros 3: 18 million
Mario Kart Wii: 15 million
Gran Turismo 3: A spec: 14 million
These are only home consoles, handheld console software sales even more ofcourse.
Your numbers are also incorrect (surprise!)
As of June 30 2008, The Playstation 3 sold 94 million software copies, so I'd like to know which game has sold 94 million copies, Minesweeper? haha.
I'm not sure how much the Xbox360 has sold, but as it has more hardware sales and a higher software attachment to the PS3, probably a lot more.
It's funny how you first said that console sales have always outsold PC software, but now it's suddenly the other way around? seems as if you can't keep your story straigth.
Xbox 360 has $5.9 billion of standalone software revenues total.
Warcraft of Warcraft alone has $3 billion. PS3 = teh fail.
The PC is the best selling gaming platform. PC>sales than any other platform.
All other platforms combined >sales than PC.
PC>PS3
PC>Xbox 360
PC> Wii
Consoles >PC.
PC is the largest, best selling gaming platform. Always has been.
1 PC game sales alone > all of PS3's combined.
1 PC game sales alone > 1/2 Xbox 360 games sales.
heh talk about flawed logic.
First of all, PC isn't the best selling gaming platform, even if we keep by your ridiculous logic of 1 game being a representive of sales.
The sims, which is the best selling PC game , sold 16 million.
To compare:
Super Mario Bros 1: 30 million
Wii play: 23 million
Wii fit:18.22 million
Super Mario Bros 3: 18 million
Mario Kart Wii: 15 million
Gran Turismo 3: A spec: 14 million
These are only home consoles, handheld console software sales even more ofcourse.
Your numbers are also incorrect (surprise!)
As of June 30 2008, The Playstation 3 sold 94 million software copies, so I'd like to know which game has sold 94 million copies, Minesweeper? haha.
I'm not sure how much the Xbox360 has sold, but as it has more hardware sales and a higher software attachment to the PS3, probably a lot more.
It's funny how you first said that console sales have always outsold PC software, but now it's suddenly the other way around? seems as if you can't keep your story straigth.
Xbox 360 has $5.9 billion of standalone software revenues total.
Warcraft of Warcraft alone has $3 billion. PS3 = teh fail.
The PC is the best selling gaming platform. PC>sales than any other platform.
All other platforms combined >sales than PC.
PC>PS3
PC>Xbox 360
PC> Wii
Consoles >PC.
Sorry Baff, but you're going to have to come with actual sources instead of self made up numbers.I just pointed you towards the PS3 sales which are 94 million copies. There is not a single PC game that has sold 94 million copies, or even 20 million copies. Halo 3 alone made 560 million in revenue, Call of Duty 4 on the 360 outsold Halo 3 so thats probably about 650 million in revenue. 560 million + 650 = more than 1.1 billion, and thats just 2 games. Your numbers probably came from Uranus.
http://www.xbox-scene.com/xbox1data/sep/EEApyykVlAjmnazhen.php
Give me one recently released game on the PC that has sold over 13 million copies. Don't bother: You can't, because none of them has. The closest thing are Sims 2 and World of Warcraft, both released in 2004.
Xbox360 and Wii are currently outselling the PC, PS3 is a bit uncertain atm.
It's just not happening Baff. Pointing towards a single game that's 5 years old isn't an indication of PC game sells.
The total software sales on consoles is much, much higher than PC games, so yes, Xbox360 software sales > PC software sales.
What was this thread about again?
Oh yes the future of gaming, anyone who thinks PC gaming is dieing is an idiot.
Continue.
O_o o_O
I didn't realise that money went out of date. That sales stopped being sales if it wasn't a title released this week.
Funny how you are happy to post sales figures for Super Mario's and other old games like the Sims when you thought they were impressive. But when they aren't you are all desperate to ignore older games.
Your console games are here today gone tomorrow. They make a lot of money for 3 months then it's over. How many console titles are still selling 15 years after release? Microsoft Flight made it's first Billion in 2004. It's never once topped the charts. (Every week they release another expansion).
Absolutely no console games are selling better this year than they did last year, let alone significantly better.
Warcraft made over $1 billion last year.
It made over a $1 billion the year before that.
Please show me one Xbox game that has made more than $ 3 Billion dollars.
I don't mind when it was released.
1 PC game has made more money than all those PS 3 games combined.
Just one title.
It doesn't matter how many new titles PS 3 bring out, they can't even compete with one 5 year old PC title. Add them all up together and PC sells more.
It's no good you looking at your little weekly sales charts of printed DVD's sold in shop windows to get a reliable picture of PC game revenues anymore.
Those days are long over.
My sources are Microsoft, Sony and Blizzard.
According to (PCGA) the PC gaming alliance, PC gaming netted $12.7 billion last year. Acccording to Microsoft to date, XBox 360 has netted $5.9 billion in games sales in totality.
[b]PC games sales in one year > 2 x (XBox 360 standalone game sales ever).[/b]
What did you think? A gamer base of 30 million consoles was buying more games than PC users?
Are you totally nuts? They sell 280 million PC's a year worldwide. Every year. That's 9 x (Total X Box platform sales ever) [i]per year[/i].
Xbox. RoflLmao.
How about I don't provide you with any sources for my figures and how about you use a little bit more common sense for yourself instead.
Sorry mate, but your in your in the wrong league. Just under half of all gaming software sold worldwide is on the PC platform. Consoles (including handhelds) make up the other half. (ELSPAa nd NPD figures have demonstrated that year after year too if you still feel you need more sources to tell you something that common sense dictates is obvious anyway). That's actually very impressive sales figures for consoles. I wouldn't knock it or be disappointed.
If you were to calculate it as games sold/platform unit, consoles would suddenly take all the titles. By a long way.
P.S. Lets also ignore the $6.7 billlion Online Poker made last year. Lets not even call that a PC game. Online Poker makes more revenue per year than Xbox 360 games have made ever. It's not listed in the NPD sales figures so lets ignore it.
I don't think anyone here thinks it's dieing. Changing yes, evolving into something else maybe but not dieing. The current generation of consoles are almost PCs anyways and in the future they will be even more so. What we are seeing is the logical next step already evolving. The PC and the Console will be totally compatible and interchangeable in the future. The future console will be nothing more than a PC for your TV. Cheaper and more entertainment oriented but a PC just the same. Hell the Xbox 360 is almost at that point already. Just add web browsing to it and you'll basically have an entertainment focused PC. The programming code used for the Xbox is already a PC programming language that has been used for PC games for the last 7-10 years. Say what you will about Microsoft but they are on the right track as far as consoles are concerned. Making the console compatible with the PC was a brilliant move and a logical next step in console evolution. Future consoles will compliment the PCs and not replace them.
Bren
while(horse==dead)
{
beat();
}
I didn't release that money went out of date. That sales stopped being sales if it wasn't a title released this week.
Funny how you happy to post sales figures for Super Mario's and other old games like the Sims when you thought they were impressive. But they aren't.
Your console games are here today gone to tomorrow. They make a lot of money for 3 months then it's over. How many console titles are still selling 15 years after release? Microsoft Flight made it's first Billion in 2004. It's never once topped the charts.
Warcraft made over $1 billion last year.
It made over a $1 billion the year before that.
Please show me one Xbox game that has made more than $ 3 Billion dollars.
I don't mind when it was released.
1 PC game has made more money than all those PS 3 games combined.
Just one title.
It doesn't matter how many new titles PS 3 bring out, they can't even compete with one 5 year old PC title. Add them all up together and PC sells more.
It's no good you looking at your little weekly sales charts of printed DVD's sold in shop windows to get a reliable picture of PC game revenues anymore.
Those days are long over.
My sources are Microsoft, Sony and Blizzard.
Ah baff, you're so poorly informed it's just funny.
The Playstation 3 sold 96 million software copies (this was back in 2008). Lets say 45 million were sold at 60$., probably a lot more but lets just say it for the sake of arguement, the rest were sold at 30$. Thats A LOT more than 3 billion buddy.
They actually sell a lot longer than 3 months. Go to your local gameshop, you'll see a little system called the Playstation 2, with a whole ton of platinium game collection often dating back with games from 2002 ~ 2003. The Playstation 3 and Xbox360 also launched brand new labels to republish older games. The arguement that only new games sell is a misconception by PC elitist.
These so called "15 year PC games" don't make a difference. Sorry, but a 10 year old PC game being sold for 5$ is not going to make you rich. 13 million copies of a 60$ game, however, does make you rich. Very, very rich.
Your sources are not Sony, Not Microsoft or Blizzard. They are assumptions, nothing more.
My sources are Sony, Microsoft and Blizard and this is "an assumption".
Please re-read my completed earlier post for more sources and figures.
You should note that while PS 2 was an excellent selling paltform, it didn't outsell the PC either. No console ever has.
It's the same old common mistake mate. Consoles sell more games than PC, but that's all the consoles combined and they don't sell significantly more. 5+ platfroms more or less = 1 very big selling platform.
15 year old games like MS flight might not make a difference to you, but the fans are still playing it. Games designers are still copying it. The dev's are still releasing multiple expansion packs for it per year.
I don't like guitar games. So lets discount them from console sales. lets wipe a $ billion or two off Xbox's sales figures.
Ok hang on a minute, lets not. What sells sells. 15 year old, 5 year old, 6 month old or brand new today. If it's still selling it's still selling.
And I have to say as a customer, if the game I want to buy costs $5 not $60 that is an added bonus. I don't want to pay 12 x as much money for a game that will be out of date in 1 year. How thick would I have to be to think that is an advantage?
As a producer you should realise that although they take less money per unit on older games, it's all profit. The dev's have been paid. The engine license paid. The investors repaid. It's all cream.
You don't just get the big payola on launch, but you get a pension for the next decade after!
Please re-read my completed earlier post for more sources and figures.
You should note that while PS 2 was an excellent selling paltform, it didn't outsell the PC either. No console ever has.
It's the same old common mistake mate. Consoles sell more games than PC, but that's all the consoles combined and they don't sell significantly more. 5+ platfroms more or less = 1 very big selling platform.
You didn't post any sources, When I asked you for links to your sources you refused to give any.
Your logic is also flawed, 290 million PC's don't mean a damn thing, sorry.
How many of those can actually play modern games? Suddenly that number drops significantly now lets also remove the amount of people who don't actually play games. Yup, that number decreases yet again.
Having a PC does not make you a gamer.
If PC gaming was actually doing so well, where are those big numbers? There are no big selling games on the PC anymore, we have already concluded that. Only WoW and Sims 2 still make those numbers, both nearly 5 years old and by the time Call of Duty 4 is 5 years old, it will probably have outsold them (WoW only counting box sales obviously)
Thats because these big numbers come from casual games and China (which plays completely different kind of games, Ever heard of Fantasy Westward Journey 2?) So the PC gaming industry YOU'RE interested in is in strong decline (Unless you got a suddenly recently discovered interest in Chinese MMO's and web browser games?)
I'll also explain to you why this slow selling of PC gaming is a negative thing.
Lets say Call of Duty 4 sold 13 million copies on the Xbox360 at 60$ a piece in 2 years. Thats 13 million x 60$
Lets take one of those older games you still find in bargain bins, say, Half Life. It's one of the most popular PC games.
According to Valve on report posted on Gamesutra, Half Life sold 8 million copies as of 2004, and 9.3 million had been sold by 2008.
This means that it took Valve 10 years to sell 9 million copies of the game (4 million less then the 360 version of CoD4), and obviously many of them were far below the original retail price of 50$ as the price of these games goes down.
You want common sense? Here is common sense for ya: If PC gaming was doing this well, why did the PC gaming alliance came into existance? get a clue.
Steam, Impulse, D2Drive don't release sales figures for their online sales.
Popcap sells silly amounts of games that console companies could only dream of.
As for PC gaming, there will most likely be a shift back to it. It always happens.
We start out with specialized hardware, then it gets integrated into a uniform platform.
look at computers:
specialized hardware for each company -> a PC with software
Look at graphics cards:
Specalized hardware for each game (see pong) -> Graphics cards for every game
Look at Physics cards:
Seperate -> Integrated into Graphics cards
Look at Consoles:
Seperate -> _________.
give you a hint... people will learn you can hook a controller up to a computer and in 2020-2025 when we hit the photorealistic graphics and we either have to move to VR or instead of improve the graphics improve the price.
Prices of high end gameing technology will get cheaper and cheaper and the one edge specialized hardware (consoles) has will be gone.
PC will be there.
after 6 or so years, I had to change it a little...
id Software's CEO raises many valid points in this interview.
www.gamespot.com/news/6207773.html
Probably been said, but worth saying again.
In essence the lines between console and pc have been blurring for years, all the next gen systems have large amounts of online content, ten years ago online was the exclusive realm of the pcs. Now, there games that can be console or pc, and every since 1st gen Xbox, consoles have become essentially dumb-downed pcs in terns of what components are stuck inside of them. A little less software, no chance of upgrading, but many of them even offer keyboard perphrials these days. Not to mention the growing selection of games that are released on consoles and pc's, not concurrently but close enough.
If I was asked for my opinion, I'd have to say neither. Sooner or later one will be consumed by the other and there will simply be 'gaming' without the need to pick a specific media. Though that is still some distance in the future, it could be speculated that this debate would be ended by some form of immersive VR technology, or to a lesser extent some direct nueral connection from the brain to digital computing technology.