The only hard core pvp in mmo's ive played is my jedi in swg. Darkfall, you only wear what you are willing to part with, so theres no death penalty. Do people care about cities that much in DF? Most were empty when i played. UO only if you were a pk. Eve is hardcore once your alliance/corp is at war. MO im assuming is like Darkfall. Skill loss is a hardcore Death penalty in my opinion suitable for mmo's. Losing your stuff you get over real quick. They get your heart pumping, but not like old swg jedi. For me anyway.
I just don't care about items. Decay on my light saber was worse than losing anything in all the other games I've tried.
See you in the dream.. The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
...jjjjjust remember that this site and this poll represents at most maybe 1% of 1% of all MMORPG gamers...
Well, mmorpg's have the worst pvp in video games. You cant have a good pvp in an mmo when your forced to spend months to level up and gear up. The technology wont allow for it to be good on a AAA scale. Once it is, pve will be a small minority to pvp mmo's. Not saying they will be permadeath, but I imagine you can take the weapon of your kill or it wouldnt even be considered. Complete opposite of mmo's now. Where level and gear and numbers matter. And those who think player looting is good only make up 1%.
So you may be right, for now. MMOrpg's are still for nerds, even with WOW.
See you in the dream.. The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
It's true, permadeath is really only useful as a storytelling tool. It is counterproductive for a PvP MMO because you want there to be conflict, but you don't want the cost to be so terrible that everyone is afraid to do it.
But I'm using perma-death as a *hardcore* tool.
What, are those that claim to be "hardcore" not willing to risk all? Doesn't seem too "hardcore" to me then.
I know Aion is around the corner and the game most people are going to try out if the PvPvE is as good as Korean players or other players who have been on the Korean servers are saying BUT if it isn't...... I really hope all the people who have posted here that are looking for a meaningful PVP experience are also looking at Earthrise's progression. I"d really like to have like minded people to fight with and against in a game where resources and crafting matters. I look forward to competing with you if either of these are the case..
It is difficult to judge whether PvPvE will appeal to NA players simply because the gaming mentality of Korean can be quite different from our own. My earliest gaming experience with mmorpg was within Asian gaming community. Their approach on how to play mmorpg was a form of subconscious roleplaying from their cultural background. It does not mean they actively roleplay but every player would play as a team in an organized fashion voluntarily. Of course I am not discounting the fact there were always rogue elements in the game, but the interaction between these players and the guilds was what kept pvp interesting.
Resources gathering and crafting matters in Aion, it in fact make up a good portion of the game. After playing around with it in beta, it is obvious how guilds will want to organize how they are carried out. Resource gathering is a simple task, but the materials need to be gathered in large quantity should a guild choose to outfit their ill equipped members with crafted equipments. Crafting level up are just series of repetition workorders and autocraft idle time. Crafting criticals are rare, even when the craft level is higher than the item require. However when it does pay off, it pay off handsomely. A piece of armor will be able to gain much higher basic stat while remain the same level to equip. The rare critical rate is the reason for the large quantity of materials if the crafter is aiming for a certain piece of HQ equipment. This mass production keep the materials in demand, but it is all on paper, there no way for me to tell how it willl pan out in the actual launch.
In regards to the poll. There was no third option, so I voted casual gamer.
It's true, permadeath is really only useful as a storytelling tool. It is counterproductive for a PvP MMO because you want there to be conflict, but you don't want the cost to be so terrible that everyone is afraid to do it.
But I'm using perma-death as a *hardcore* tool.
What, are those that claim to be "hardcore" not willing to risk all? Doesn't seem too "hardcore" to me then.
PVP and pve that are involved in mmorpgs, cant have permadeath for anyone other than hardcore at RPG's. Hardcore roleplayers are the hardest core of them all. What you would expect to find in a RPG. Jedi in old swg had it. It was meant for roleplay. As soon as non hardcore roleplayers got them, that ended. You cant ask pvp players to give up pve acheivements that are forced on them so they can pvp, or pve to give up theirs if pvp is forced on them. If it was only pve, you'll find permadeath guilds. If it was only pvp, they dont exist yet, but you'd find the same.
Roleplayers are the hardcore in RPG's. If they're not, then they are one of the others just rp'ing inside a RPG. The Hardcore are playing the game.
Thats the way I see it. I never understood RP'ing inside a RP game anyway. I think its an excuse to not participate in parts of the game, which still makes no sense to me.
See you in the dream.. The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
It's true, permadeath is really only useful as a storytelling tool. It is counterproductive for a PvP MMO because you want there to be conflict, but you don't want the cost to be so terrible that everyone is afraid to do it.
But I'm using perma-death as a *hardcore* tool.
What, are those that claim to be "hardcore" not willing to risk all? Doesn't seem too "hardcore" to me then.
Have you played EVE Online? Familiar with it? Players have spent months and months to build Titans and these things permadie when killed. Months and months of hard work down the drain
Can you imagine this? Also, Titans do not logout when u go afk or exit the game. They always exist on the server
You cannot say hardcore pks are afraid of risk? Well, most are to an extent. But they will play a hardcore MMO
Also in EVE you can lose skill points. If you go boom in a T3 cruiser u are promised and assured by the devs you will lose skillpoints.
Technically this is not permadeath per se since your character in EVE itself is immortal however you do lose months and weeks of hard work in that game easy
If we look at the amount of losses i would say this is comparable
on topic I wouldnt mind playing a game that struck a nice balance between the two. Whereas players actually cared more about something else rather than their own character. So as long as we can have meaningful world pvp where people actually care bout dying cause it would hurt their teammates/guild/faction- then I'd be down for that
Until then I usually stick to the tougher MMOs like EVE Online. Because I get rich world pvp, etc
However I'd be open to something else more mainstream-y if it gave meaningful world encounters.
Comments
The only hard core pvp in mmo's ive played is my jedi in swg. Darkfall, you only wear what you are willing to part with, so theres no death penalty. Do people care about cities that much in DF? Most were empty when i played. UO only if you were a pk. Eve is hardcore once your alliance/corp is at war. MO im assuming is like Darkfall. Skill loss is a hardcore Death penalty in my opinion suitable for mmo's. Losing your stuff you get over real quick. They get your heart pumping, but not like old swg jedi. For me anyway.
I just don't care about items. Decay on my light saber was worse than losing anything in all the other games I've tried.
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
Well, mmorpg's have the worst pvp in video games. You cant have a good pvp in an mmo when your forced to spend months to level up and gear up. The technology wont allow for it to be good on a AAA scale. Once it is, pve will be a small minority to pvp mmo's. Not saying they will be permadeath, but I imagine you can take the weapon of your kill or it wouldnt even be considered. Complete opposite of mmo's now. Where level and gear and numbers matter. And those who think player looting is good only make up 1%.
So you may be right, for now. MMOrpg's are still for nerds, even with WOW.
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
But I'm using perma-death as a *hardcore* tool.
What, are those that claim to be "hardcore" not willing to risk all? Doesn't seem too "hardcore" to me then.
It is difficult to judge whether PvPvE will appeal to NA players simply because the gaming mentality of Korean can be quite different from our own. My earliest gaming experience with mmorpg was within Asian gaming community. Their approach on how to play mmorpg was a form of subconscious roleplaying from their cultural background. It does not mean they actively roleplay but every player would play as a team in an organized fashion voluntarily. Of course I am not discounting the fact there were always rogue elements in the game, but the interaction between these players and the guilds was what kept pvp interesting.
Resources gathering and crafting matters in Aion, it in fact make up a good portion of the game. After playing around with it in beta, it is obvious how guilds will want to organize how they are carried out. Resource gathering is a simple task, but the materials need to be gathered in large quantity should a guild choose to outfit their ill equipped members with crafted equipments. Crafting level up are just series of repetition workorders and autocraft idle time. Crafting criticals are rare, even when the craft level is higher than the item require. However when it does pay off, it pay off handsomely. A piece of armor will be able to gain much higher basic stat while remain the same level to equip. The rare critical rate is the reason for the large quantity of materials if the crafter is aiming for a certain piece of HQ equipment. This mass production keep the materials in demand, but it is all on paper, there no way for me to tell how it willl pan out in the actual launch.
In regards to the poll. There was no third option, so I voted casual gamer.
But I'm using perma-death as a *hardcore* tool.
What, are those that claim to be "hardcore" not willing to risk all? Doesn't seem too "hardcore" to me then.
PVP and pve that are involved in mmorpgs, cant have permadeath for anyone other than hardcore at RPG's. Hardcore roleplayers are the hardest core of them all. What you would expect to find in a RPG. Jedi in old swg had it. It was meant for roleplay. As soon as non hardcore roleplayers got them, that ended. You cant ask pvp players to give up pve acheivements that are forced on them so they can pvp, or pve to give up theirs if pvp is forced on them. If it was only pve, you'll find permadeath guilds. If it was only pvp, they dont exist yet, but you'd find the same.
Roleplayers are the hardcore in RPG's. If they're not, then they are one of the others just rp'ing inside a RPG. The Hardcore are playing the game.
Thats the way I see it. I never understood RP'ing inside a RP game anyway. I think its an excuse to not participate in parts of the game, which still makes no sense to me.
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
But I'm using perma-death as a *hardcore* tool.
What, are those that claim to be "hardcore" not willing to risk all? Doesn't seem too "hardcore" to me then.
Have you played EVE Online? Familiar with it? Players have spent months and months to build Titans and these things permadie when killed. Months and months of hard work down the drain
Can you imagine this? Also, Titans do not logout when u go afk or exit the game. They always exist on the server
You cannot say hardcore pks are afraid of risk? Well, most are to an extent. But they will play a hardcore MMO
Also in EVE you can lose skill points. If you go boom in a T3 cruiser u are promised and assured by the devs you will lose skillpoints.
Technically this is not permadeath per se since your character in EVE itself is immortal however you do lose months and weeks of hard work in that game easy
If we look at the amount of losses i would say this is comparable
on topic I wouldnt mind playing a game that struck a nice balance between the two. Whereas players actually cared more about something else rather than their own character. So as long as we can have meaningful world pvp where people actually care bout dying cause it would hurt their teammates/guild/faction- then I'd be down for that
Until then I usually stick to the tougher MMOs like EVE Online. Because I get rich world pvp, etc
However I'd be open to something else more mainstream-y if it gave meaningful world encounters.
I'll second your agreement.
I also endorse this message
If it was hardcore PvP, there would be consequenses for being a killer... But there ain't.
So it's not hardcore PvP, it's Anarchy PvP.