...Literally, the people selling the ads are in Hawaii and the people doing the editorial are in Eastern Canada and the New York/New Jersey area.
I don't care (ty adblock/flashblock) but just as an FYI, in the internet age, the above statement has absolutely no bearing on the the point in question that is being responded to.
Yes and no. If we were all in an office together, we'd pick things up is my point.
The general point is: the editorial team never discusses ads with the advertising team. Period.
Perhaps some interdepartmental communication would do you guys some good then. Question, do the writers LOOK at the site? You do know the ads for Dragon Age were up far in advance of the article right?
Do you guys not run the articles by Craig and Ben? How much input do they have on what you guys write about? Just curious.
Did they not know that might come across looking like more paid advertising?
How important is it for mmorpg.com to have the appearance of journalistic integrity? I'm not mocking here, I'm being serious, because if appearing to have journalistic integrity is important on this site, I have to say you're failing.
I'm not saying we don't talk ever, I'm saying we never discuss advertising.
Obviously, we can see the ads on the site, but we have covered this game well in advance of launch, well before the ads.
Craig/Ben run the site, but generally leave the editorial alone. They never request we cover specific games (so as not to let ads influence things). Their involvement is more on the "we want to add feature X to the site" side of things (like blogs), or asking for more/less of certain kinds of articles (like say reviews in general). Nothing to do with specific titles.
The fact is, we're stuck between a rock and a hard place. On one hand, people demand we only show advertising for MMOs or related titles. So we do. You don't see car banners, Phoenix University, and Orbitz as a matter of general policy, which Craig has posted here several times.
Yet on the other hand, people get mad when there is editorial on games that do have ads. If we never wrote about games that have ads on our site, there would be no content. Period. I cannot think of a single major MMO launch that I don't remember seeing an ad for on the site. Should we stop covering Aion and Warhammer too?
To me, it's no different than CNN reporting on Obama and McCain during the election, yet still running campaign ads. It's the cost of doing business and why we're very careful to keep the two streams separate.
There is no way to prove this, but I can say I've never once seen an ad on the site and gone out to cover the game because of it. We have also never been asked to post something on someone because they were going to advertise or as part of any financial deal.
I will say now, we plan to do about the same amount of coverage as we did on Dragon Age on Diablo III and Mass Effect II for exactly the same reasons we covered Dragon Age (see first post I made). If one or both advertises, good for them. If they don't, that's fine too. The decision long predates that.
no.
people are not complaining about mmorpg.com writing editorials on game's which are advertised here.
the point is that first, it was an article on a spg which is doing heavy advertisment here. that rised a few eyebrows. but that is not the main issue.
main issue being that the article was not an objective review of the game, nor an interview about the game's features, nor a history of the lore if you like....
it was about how fantastic the game is and how it relates to mmos and WoW and if you put everything together its rather suspicious.
myself personally i wouldnt mind if you advertise african safaris and even perhaps write about your personal adventure on them but that is a long way from writing about how the safari compares to the landscape in Age of Conan Khemi or how it reminded you of the beatiful vistas in SWG Tattooine.
I've been really busy playing DA for the past days. Its good - but he longterm enjoyment of this game will be built on the toolset and the future content for the game.
With that beeing said - If you play the normal "skip everything and rush to top lvl" MMOs then you will miss out what DA is all about. The game is built on a totally new gameworld that is specially built around the game. There is some deep lore to go through and for those that really care- there is so much to sink your teeth into.
Dragon age seting as a MMO game tho .... no - its not an open world game and is very much resticted in features that alot of the big guns of MMOs are providing.
I will give my final verdict on DA when I have played through all the origins charas. So far I must say its a very well done game. But plz dont try to compare it to MMO games. It isn't one .
Just want to qoute a comment in one of the news article "EA is performing well, with quality, sales and segment share up so far this year," said CEO John Riccitiello. "We are making tough calls to cut cost in targeted areas and investing more in our biggest games and digital businesses." Fact - Mythic and WAR is not one of those big games.
I don't know why all the hype over Dragon Age to be honest, the story is generic the characters are bland and the classes are extremely limited in customization. when i got my first advanced class i was really excited till i found out how little it impacted my characters playstyle. what because i can choose my dialog? wooo so i can be snarky, or evil or the good guy but really nothing changes except my party members may not like me .... awwww.
its a decent game, just glad i didnt spend money on it if you know what i mean.
The yellow part concerns me in regards to the Star wars Bioware/EA MMO.
If Dragon Age is the model of "story" based gaming, then worry for the online MMO they are making. The perspectives of starting out are different, but they all meld together in Ostagar and there is little or no variance. I bet the MMO will be like Guild wars, which isn't bad. The down side is that GW is free to play.
so you start different but you still get the same story, you're still a grey warden, you still meet the douchey Allistar and the Emo wizard? geez not much replay value in that then.
Omg get off the forums, The main story objective is always the same, but its how you complete that one objective that makes the game unique your choices CLEARLY impact you and your party throughout the game.
Originally posted by Dana I will say now, we plan to do about the same amount of coverage as we did on Dragon Age on Diablo III and Mass Effect II for exactly the same reasons we covered Dragon Age (see first post I made). If one or both advertises, good for them. If they don't, that's fine too. The decision long predates that.
It's the wrong decision. This is supposed to be an MMO site. Those games you mentioned don't fit that category.
It's as simple as that.
MMO_Doubter
Find another website that offers as much MMO content and news as "www.mmorpg.com" But this article involves a major gaming company involved in MMO's SW:TOR was even mentioned. They have every right to include an article or advertisement from a lead gaming company. Bioware makes it relevant automatically.
I don't know why all the hype over Dragon Age to be honest, the story is generic the characters are bland and the classes are extremely limited in customization. when i got my first advanced class i was really excited till i found out how little it impacted my characters playstyle. what because i can choose my dialog? wooo so i can be snarky, or evil or the good guy but really nothing changes except my party members may not like me .... awwww.
its a decent game, just glad i didnt spend money on it if you know what i mean.
I know what you mean. I only played for an hour and couldn't stand the combat anymore. Glad I didn't waste any money on it!
Has anyone else gave it any thought that Dragon Age may eventually become a mmo hence part of the undisclosed reason why Bioware wanted this game advertised on this site ? Bioware even said themselves that The Old Republic may not be the only mmo they work on.
Has anyone else gave it any thought that Dragon Age may eventually become a mmo hence part of the undisclosed reason why Bioware wanted this game advertised on this site ? Bioware even said themselves that The Old Republic may not be the only mmo they work on.
The way DA:O is atm, it could never work as a mmo.
Has anyone else gave it any thought that Dragon Age may eventually become a mmo hence part of the undisclosed reason why Bioware wanted this game advertised on this site ? Bioware even said themselves that The Old Republic may not be the only mmo they work on.
The way DA:O is atm, it could never work as a mmo.
And your reason for saying this is ??? Obviously things would have to change but it is more than doable for a mmo.
I find Dragon Age brilliant as a setting and, if not as a traditional story, as a story told through a game. I think if folks understand some of the allusions and references they'd recognise that not only is Bioware's storyteller fully aware of what he's borrowing from, and how to change things around to keep you interested, but probably from many sources (including historical ones) that I suspect most players just don't even know exist so they can't recognise what's actually going into the story. If you don't listen to alot of jazz don't be surprised when you don't find a jazz song interesting and find it sounds like every other jazz song.
This, and much of the rest of the post it came from. The underlined section was, erm, underscored by this little tidbit from a conversation between my main character and Alistair:
"I'm just here to spout off one-liners and deliver bad news."
I almost did a spit-take on hearing that, seeing how true it has seemed from time to time. Despite that, there's significantly more to the Alistair character than what he claimed, but there's enough truth in the statement that you can tell the Dragon Age developers were having a good laugh at their own expense. The moment had a distinctly Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back feeling to it a la all of the times they reference something from real life, then turn and stare at the camera for a moment.
"It's nothing but a 90-minute long dick and fart joke. Who would pay to see that?" -everyone looks at the camera-
-Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
Dragon Hype...errr...Age. Two words. Memory leak. It will leak out of my memory hopefully faster than it leaked into my PC's memory. Another Lie-o-ware commercial milk run. RIP the real Bioware. Why is this console crap of an offline crpg even brought up here ffs??? Please.
They say that right before you die, your life flashes before your eyes. That's true, even for a blind man. ^DareDevil^
Sadly the only thing keeping me from buying this is the fact there's no multiplayer (according to my searches). I loved Elder Scrolls III...but I just couldn't get into it knowing I was the only one in that world, and Dragon's Age will be the same thing.
Would have been great if it was like Neverwinter Nights's multiplayer mode.
Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall.
Has anyone else gave it any thought that Dragon Age may eventually become a mmo hence part of the undisclosed reason why Bioware wanted this game advertised on this site ? Bioware even said themselves that The Old Republic may not be the only mmo they work on.
The way DA:O is atm, it could never work as a mmo.
But warcraft did and it was a real time strategy game.
Dragon Hype...errr...Age. Two words. Memory leak. It will leak out of my memory hopefully faster than it leaked into my PC's memory. Another Lie-o-ware commercial milk run. RIP the real Bioware. Why is this console crap of an offline crpg even brought up here ffs??? Please.
What do u mean console crap, the gameplay is more like old school PC rpg like baldurs gate which I like.
The only thing I don't like about Dragon Age is how it's adopted standard party structure for most MMOs - that is, you need a tank, healer, and mage in your NPC party. I'm finding it extremely difficult to progress unless you run a standard "MMO" party of NPCs. Even the strategy guide highly recommends that you run one of a handful of "suggested" group strategies, most of which are built around tank N spank.
The thing I love about first person RPGs is I don't need to have the "perfect" party structure to beat certain content. In games like Oblivion, I could run a mage tank or a fast but fragile rogue and still be competitive. I really feel that DA:O forces me to take certain NPCs for certain quests, much like MMOs force me to group with certain classes in order to beat raid content.
For a MMO site they sure are pushing this SINGLE-player game hard. Next thing you know there will be a splash on the main page that takes up...oh, wait. Well at least there isn't a mini-splash across every graphic for every article...son of a...
There were a lot of coincidences around the arrival of this article, but what if there really wasn't anything else to write about? No major announcements? No new images? And a lot of people on this site are obviously playing the game, myself included. It's a bit of a stretch, but its not like you talk 100% work with everyone at work all the time.
So, if they wrote it for the right reasons, as the quick defense by a mod suggests, then good for them.
If they wrote it for the wrong reasons, as the shotgun blast to the face that is their ad campaign, then shame on them.
I'm going to play the whole game through once, then go through and pick entirely differenct choices. If I end up landing on both sides (an evil destroyer and a noble savior), then I'll say this story thing works. If not, it's like getting the directors cut of a movie and comparing the three 45 sec cut scenes with the original theatrical release, great for a movie ... CRAP for an rpg selling story.
I supported this site doing ads for Dragon Age but thought the one on the article pictures was a bit much. But now we have an article about the game too. What lessons did Bioware draw from MMO’s? This seems a thinly disguised excuse to have an article about the game to me. Stick to MMO’s guys the list of dubious articles just keeps getting longer: The Aion score, how the new pets in WoW are not RMT’s really and now a review of a solo game.
What’s next? How Call of Duty MW brought MMO design into its game? Or how about dlc for Dragon Age, we really need a feature on that too. Sheesh.
God I love this site. An article for a game that doesn't even have multiplayer options (something the old great titles from the golden age of Bioware had) It's very simple. Game mechanics haven't changed since the BG games pretty much (useless tactics system aside). Class system is probably simpler than most of their past games. Actual tactics are a joke, CC + DD rinse and repeat. Stunning the undead with a mind blast, nuff said. The ability to murder some npcs in the game seems to be the only "innovation" the developers came up with, not that I'm complaining bout that part lol. The story and the lore. Well it is obvious they read and definetly watched LOTR about a million times. Graphics are the only thing I can admit to really enjoying, and even they weren't spectacular. MMOrpg.com needs to change its name and just make a Gamespot clone tbh if they want to be in advertising.
I supported this site doing ads for Dragon Age but thought the one on the article pictures was a bit much. But now we have an article about the game too. What lessons did Bioware draw from MMO’s? This seems a thinly disguised excuse to have an article about the game to me. Stick to MMO’s guys the list of dubious articles just keeps getting longer: The Aion score, how the new pets in WoW are not RMT’s really and now a review of a solo game. What’s next? How Call of Duty MW brought MMO design into its game? Or how about dlc for Dragon Age, we really need a feature on that too. Sheesh.
I agree whole-heartedly, as much as I love this site, the fact that MMORPG.COM has done much advertising on their site for Dragon Age makes my suspicious sense tingle. I mean seriously guys, this is an MMO site, don't fall into the back pocket's of all those big shot companies that shell out the cash. MMORPG.COM should stand for more than just the bundles of green paper, that's why it has such a large fanbase, not to mention the fact that talking about Dragon Age and its similarities to real MMO's, a poorly veiled reason for advertising the game, is not only deceptive but just insulting to the people/fans that read the articles on this site. Don't drive away the very people that make this site what it is.
Dragon Age = most hyped game in history So highly hyped (payed) that even a site dedicated to MMOs writes articles about it.
Big fan of Bioware here. But DA:O is average RPG. And even that is to much of a compliment
I agree completely.. DA:O did absolutely nothing to impress me in terms of gameplay and fun factor. The only reason I managed to press myself to complete a playthrough was that the story had some interesting elements.
Comments
this game is amazzinnnggg
I don't care (ty adblock/flashblock) but just as an FYI, in the internet age, the above statement has absolutely no bearing on the the point in question that is being responded to.
Yes and no. If we were all in an office together, we'd pick things up is my point.
The general point is: the editorial team never discusses ads with the advertising team. Period.
Perhaps some interdepartmental communication would do you guys some good then. Question, do the writers LOOK at the site? You do know the ads for Dragon Age were up far in advance of the article right?
Do you guys not run the articles by Craig and Ben? How much input do they have on what you guys write about? Just curious.
Did they not know that might come across looking like more paid advertising?
How important is it for mmorpg.com to have the appearance of journalistic integrity? I'm not mocking here, I'm being serious, because if appearing to have journalistic integrity is important on this site, I have to say you're failing.
I'm not saying we don't talk ever, I'm saying we never discuss advertising.
Obviously, we can see the ads on the site, but we have covered this game well in advance of launch, well before the ads.
Craig/Ben run the site, but generally leave the editorial alone. They never request we cover specific games (so as not to let ads influence things). Their involvement is more on the "we want to add feature X to the site" side of things (like blogs), or asking for more/less of certain kinds of articles (like say reviews in general). Nothing to do with specific titles.
The fact is, we're stuck between a rock and a hard place. On one hand, people demand we only show advertising for MMOs or related titles. So we do. You don't see car banners, Phoenix University, and Orbitz as a matter of general policy, which Craig has posted here several times.
Yet on the other hand, people get mad when there is editorial on games that do have ads. If we never wrote about games that have ads on our site, there would be no content. Period. I cannot think of a single major MMO launch that I don't remember seeing an ad for on the site. Should we stop covering Aion and Warhammer too?
To me, it's no different than CNN reporting on Obama and McCain during the election, yet still running campaign ads. It's the cost of doing business and why we're very careful to keep the two streams separate.
There is no way to prove this, but I can say I've never once seen an ad on the site and gone out to cover the game because of it. We have also never been asked to post something on someone because they were going to advertise or as part of any financial deal.
I will say now, we plan to do about the same amount of coverage as we did on Dragon Age on Diablo III and Mass Effect II for exactly the same reasons we covered Dragon Age (see first post I made). If one or both advertises, good for them. If they don't, that's fine too. The decision long predates that.
no.
people are not complaining about mmorpg.com writing editorials on game's which are advertised here.
the point is that first, it was an article on a spg which is doing heavy advertisment here. that rised a few eyebrows. but that is not the main issue.
main issue being that the article was not an objective review of the game, nor an interview about the game's features, nor a history of the lore if you like....
it was about how fantastic the game is and how it relates to mmos and WoW and if you put everything together its rather suspicious.
myself personally i wouldnt mind if you advertise african safaris and even perhaps write about your personal adventure on them but that is a long way from writing about how the safari compares to the landscape in Age of Conan Khemi or how it reminded you of the beatiful vistas in SWG Tattooine.
I've been really busy playing DA for the past days. Its good - but he longterm enjoyment of this game will be built on the toolset and the future content for the game.
With that beeing said - If you play the normal "skip everything and rush to top lvl" MMOs then you will miss out what DA is all about. The game is built on a totally new gameworld that is specially built around the game. There is some deep lore to go through and for those that really care- there is so much to sink your teeth into.
Dragon age seting as a MMO game tho .... no - its not an open world game and is very much resticted in features that alot of the big guns of MMOs are providing.
I will give my final verdict on DA when I have played through all the origins charas. So far I must say its a very well done game. But plz dont try to compare it to MMO games. It isn't one .
nope, but i bet star wars the old republic is.
The yellow part concerns me in regards to the Star wars Bioware/EA MMO.
If Dragon Age is the model of "story" based gaming, then worry for the online MMO they are making. The perspectives of starting out are different, but they all meld together in Ostagar and there is little or no variance. I bet the MMO will be like Guild wars, which isn't bad. The down side is that GW is free to play.
so you start different but you still get the same story, you're still a grey warden, you still meet the douchey Allistar and the Emo wizard? geez not much replay value in that then.
Omg get off the forums, The main story objective is always the same, but its how you complete that one objective that makes the game unique your choices CLEARLY impact you and your party throughout the game.
It's the wrong decision. This is supposed to be an MMO site. Those games you mentioned don't fit that category.
It's as simple as that.
MMO_Doubter
Find another website that offers as much MMO content and news as "www.mmorpg.com" But this article involves a major gaming company involved in MMO's SW:TOR was even mentioned. They have every right to include an article or advertisement from a lead gaming company. Bioware makes it relevant automatically.
I know what you mean. I only played for an hour and couldn't stand the combat anymore. Glad I didn't waste any money on it!
Has anyone else gave it any thought that Dragon Age may eventually become a mmo hence part of the undisclosed reason why Bioware wanted this game advertised on this site ? Bioware even said themselves that The Old Republic may not be the only mmo they work on.
The way DA:O is atm, it could never work as a mmo.
The way DA:O is atm, it could never work as a mmo.
And your reason for saying this is ??? Obviously things would have to change but it is more than doable for a mmo.
This, and much of the rest of the post it came from. The underlined section was, erm, underscored by this little tidbit from a conversation between my main character and Alistair:
"I'm just here to spout off one-liners and deliver bad news."
I almost did a spit-take on hearing that, seeing how true it has seemed from time to time. Despite that, there's significantly more to the Alistair character than what he claimed, but there's enough truth in the statement that you can tell the Dragon Age developers were having a good laugh at their own expense. The moment had a distinctly Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back feeling to it a la all of the times they reference something from real life, then turn and stare at the camera for a moment.
"It's nothing but a 90-minute long dick and fart joke. Who would pay to see that?" -everyone looks at the camera-
-Wrayeth
"Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
Dragon Hype...errr...Age. Two words. Memory leak. It will leak out of my memory hopefully faster than it leaked into my PC's memory. Another Lie-o-ware commercial milk run. RIP the real Bioware. Why is this console crap of an offline crpg even brought up here ffs??? Please.
They say that right before you die, your life flashes before your eyes. That's true, even for a blind man. ^DareDevil^
Sadly the only thing keeping me from buying this is the fact there's no multiplayer (according to my searches). I loved Elder Scrolls III...but I just couldn't get into it knowing I was the only one in that world, and Dragon's Age will be the same thing.
Would have been great if it was like Neverwinter Nights's multiplayer mode.
Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall.
The way DA:O is atm, it could never work as a mmo.
But warcraft did and it was a real time strategy game.
What do u mean console crap, the gameplay is more like old school PC rpg like baldurs gate which I like.
The only thing I don't like about Dragon Age is how it's adopted standard party structure for most MMOs - that is, you need a tank, healer, and mage in your NPC party. I'm finding it extremely difficult to progress unless you run a standard "MMO" party of NPCs. Even the strategy guide highly recommends that you run one of a handful of "suggested" group strategies, most of which are built around tank N spank.
The thing I love about first person RPGs is I don't need to have the "perfect" party structure to beat certain content. In games like Oblivion, I could run a mage tank or a fast but fragile rogue and still be competitive. I really feel that DA:O forces me to take certain NPCs for certain quests, much like MMOs force me to group with certain classes in order to beat raid content.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You? - Build A Character - D&D Compendium
For a MMO site they sure are pushing this SINGLE-player game hard. Next thing you know there will be a splash on the main page that takes up...oh, wait. Well at least there isn't a mini-splash across every graphic for every article...son of a...
You could use that argument to excuse coverage of any game, movie, or book in existence.
Let's have reviews of the recent 'Dune' prequels, because 'Dune' would make a great IP for an MMO (which I believe is true).
Limit it to actual MMOs, whether past, present, or in development.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Well, level design would be easy for Dune.
There were a lot of coincidences around the arrival of this article, but what if there really wasn't anything else to write about? No major announcements? No new images? And a lot of people on this site are obviously playing the game, myself included. It's a bit of a stretch, but its not like you talk 100% work with everyone at work all the time.
So, if they wrote it for the right reasons, as the quick defense by a mod suggests, then good for them.
If they wrote it for the wrong reasons, as the shotgun blast to the face that is their ad campaign, then shame on them.
I'm going to play the whole game through once, then go through and pick entirely differenct choices. If I end up landing on both sides (an evil destroyer and a noble savior), then I'll say this story thing works. If not, it's like getting the directors cut of a movie and comparing the three 45 sec cut scenes with the original theatrical release, great for a movie ... CRAP for an rpg selling story.
I supported this site doing ads for Dragon Age but thought the one on the article pictures was a bit much. But now we have an article about the game too. What lessons did Bioware draw from MMO’s? This seems a thinly disguised excuse to have an article about the game to me. Stick to MMO’s guys the list of dubious articles just keeps getting longer: The Aion score, how the new pets in WoW are not RMT’s really and now a review of a solo game.
What’s next? How Call of Duty MW brought MMO design into its game? Or how about dlc for Dragon Age, we really need a feature on that too. Sheesh.
God I love this site. An article for a game that doesn't even have multiplayer options (something the old great titles from the golden age of Bioware had) It's very simple. Game mechanics haven't changed since the BG games pretty much (useless tactics system aside). Class system is probably simpler than most of their past games. Actual tactics are a joke, CC + DD rinse and repeat. Stunning the undead with a mind blast, nuff said. The ability to murder some npcs in the game seems to be the only "innovation" the developers came up with, not that I'm complaining bout that part lol. The story and the lore. Well it is obvious they read and definetly watched LOTR about a million times. Graphics are the only thing I can admit to really enjoying, and even they weren't spectacular. MMOrpg.com needs to change its name and just make a Gamespot clone tbh if they want to be in advertising.
I agree whole-heartedly, as much as I love this site, the fact that MMORPG.COM has done much advertising on their site for Dragon Age makes my suspicious sense tingle. I mean seriously guys, this is an MMO site, don't fall into the back pocket's of all those big shot companies that shell out the cash. MMORPG.COM should stand for more than just the bundles of green paper, that's why it has such a large fanbase, not to mention the fact that talking about Dragon Age and its similarities to real MMO's, a poorly veiled reason for advertising the game, is not only deceptive but just insulting to the people/fans that read the articles on this site. Don't drive away the very people that make this site what it is.
Pick up your game MMORPG.COM
I agree completely.. DA:O did absolutely nothing to impress me in terms of gameplay and fun factor. The only reason I managed to press myself to complete a playthrough was that the story had some interesting elements.
I'm surprised the front page article didn't have Dragon Age: Brought to you by Dragon Age picture on it... the irony.