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IP Breaks, or - How This Game is NOT Trek
MMO_Doubter
Member Posts: 5,056
For the sake of Trek fans interested in trying out this game, here is a list of known ways the game breaks the spirit and design of the Trek IP.
1 - You can only be the Captain. You can't play the navigator. You can't play the chief Engineer. You can't play the science officer. There is one class - captain, with three possible 'builds' -tactical, science, engineering.
This also mean that captains run the entire ship on their own. Players can't form a crew and run a ship together.
2 - Captains own every ship they unlock. Yep. Don't know where Picard is keeping the 'Stargazer', but he can park the Enterprise and run around on his old ship if he likes.
3 - Captains and their ships are immortal. Don't worry about battles anymore, because you can't die, and your ships can't be destroyed.
4 - Ground combat features personal shields and ranged healing abilities (spells). Standard fantasy MMORPG combat with a Trek skin.
Feel free to add more examples.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Comments
"Because it's easier to nitpick something than to be constructive." -roach5000
Well star fleet was still a military, so as to the goin back to your old ship thing, um nope. Once you stand relieved of command of one ship you can go back and visit, but unless your an admiral don't think your getting the keys. Sure they had shields but it wasn't exactly portable, and some injuries you just can't heal with a hypo full of nanobots.
All that aside I was still okay with the game until they said make your own playable race with any of the traits you have unlocked on your accounts. Want a antina headed, simbiote bellied, cold blooded alien if you got those unlocked go right ahead. I'm not saying it's a bad idea, I'm just sayin make the players have to submit the race with some sort of lore for approval before unlocking it for them. Yes you gota wait, but it keeps people from making some godlike race and naming them the Pwnzualot species, with a discription of I be here to pwnz your ships.
1) I love how people say that you being able to only be the captain "breaks" the ip, really so you are trying to say Star Trek was truly about someone other than the Captain? I guess you didn't watch too much Trek because while other's were shown following the captains orders I'm fairly certain that most of the episodes focused on the captains decisions and his crews reactions to his decisions especially where the original series is concerned. The Next Generation did a better job of making the crew of the ship important but I don't see why you guys talk as if a single show dealt with the topic of hand from anywhere other than the bridge and the captains decisions.
2)To be honest with you neither you nor I knows what Star Fleet allows, basically how do you know that Picard couldn't go back to the 'Stargazer', since the show was about the Enterprise that subject would obviously never have been broached. But more importantly so what? What if I wanted to take an older ship out to "relay a story from my own personal past". I mean how unimaginitive do you have to be for this to be "game breaking".
3)Honestly how often did you truly worry that The Enterprise was in danger? Don't lie now. We all know they were going to win every scenario but of course this is tv so we don't get to see them go through it fifty times til they get it right but that's really where again your own imagination comes in.
4)Ground combat is so rarely represented in Star Trek I'm forced to wonder how you seem to presume to know so much about it.
Wow I should have realized this was just MMO_Doubter trolling this game again, I'm hard pressed to think of how a person could be so miserable as to have nothing better to do than to cling to any single possible argument against something. I mean just yesterday it was the Z-Axis, you guys just don't quit do you and again you guys hang your hat on so many arguments I have to wonder if you truly have other reasons for all this "hate".
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
1. A big part of the show was about the crew interaction. This is completely unavailable in the game. They could have made a game where player crews were optional and you could also do stuff on your own. They did not.
2. Stargazer was destroyed, and in any case if someone else was Captain of that ship he couldn't just go back and take over because he wanted to -- that's not how Starfleet (or any pseudo-military organization) works.
3. They could have made it so you had to earn a new ship if your ship got destroyed. That would have been an interesting way to go about it. I am willing to concede this point to gameplay though.
4. There are no personal shields outside of the Borg as far as I recall, and you don't explain ranged healing at all with what you wrote.
New stuff:
5. There's also the fact that apparently the Federation largely goes around blowing things up and engaging in combat. Very little non-combat play and from what the reviews tell us, it isn't very engaging.
6. The Klingons have been reduced to a 99% PvP-only race restricted to special PvP instances and their heritage and culture are not represented well by this at all.
First and foremost your complaints are so nitpicky it's silly. You basically said I want to watch the show, not play the game. Cool, go watch the show. You have to make changes when you cross media, there's a reason that a book is changed to a script, otherwise you'd go to the movie to...read the book on a big screen?
When it comes to a game, GAMEPLAY takes presedence over everything else. If the game needs a system of recovery and defense, then you put one in, yeh it may just have a TREK skin but that system makes the game fun. Unless you think it's cool to just beam down and rely on dodging lasers. Think about it...n/m..
From another perspective for you lorehounds and RP types, yeh yeh they still call the games MMORPGS but we ALL know that's not the case anymore, almost NOBODY role plays anymore, so asking for an all powerful check system on what is acceptable and not acceptable from a role play perspective is just dumb. In fact it's a dumb idea even FROM an RP perspective, anything that inconveniences your players ultimately alienates your players and you loose paying customers.
Don't forget, the game is about making money, play the game to enjoy the game, don't complain that it's not Trek Enough for you, that's not th epoint. The game is either fun, or it is not. Go from there.
In case you're wondering, I have only mild curiousity about this game, it doesn't seem like my cup of tea so I probably wont be buying it, however I'm also not picking it apart like some.
"Because it's easier to nitpick something than to be constructive." -roach5000
Quoted for truth. Also I heartily agree with the majority of the rest of the post.
"Because it's easier to nitpick something than to be constructive." -roach5000
1)It's debatable as to wether a "big part of Star Trek was about the crews interaction". Why because Bones got to say cool lines like "I'm a doctor Jim not a miracle worker!". Star Trek was not in my opinion about the crews interaction it was about the crew following the orders of the captains.(While you are taking the bait of Doubter remember we don't all see the IP the way you do).
2)You nor I know what would happen in the event that Picard tried to go back to captain the Stargazer, as far as I'm conerned this is an issue never dealt with in Star Trek so how do you guys presume to invent things? When did any captain attempt to take control of an older ship only to be thwarted by the present captain? While I agree it's more than likely not the way it works but obviously things will have to change for a video game and since most of us get to name our ship to start what would really be the point of them taking your old ship which you worked to build up? It's not like it will be given to new players. On this point you guys are again crying about nothing important.
3)How many times was the Enterprise destroyed? And I don't ever remember Kirk being made to earn it back (I think in one film he was demoted but it was more because he disobeyed orders than because he destroyed the Enterprise).
4)Well if they do exist on the Borg there is no reason to assume it couldn't be adapted or what have you either way it's pointless to argue because the crews we saw are the top one percent, the class of the federation so yes they often fought against great odds and won, well if certain things need to be done to offer every player the same experience who I am to argue with that.
5)I can't really argue with this point for those out there who want a Star Trek game light on combat and heavy on exploration(which is the way Star Trek has always been) and diplomacy STO has a way to go but as far as I'm concerned quests are a small concern because they can always be added in later, basically if folks find themselves fighting more than they'd like to in STO without much else to do they will complain and ask for more diplomacy missions and will get them so I can hardly see why this would really be a black mark just not something they did a good job on from the start.
6)I don't know what's going on with the Klingons but from what I read out of Emmert's mouth it is that Klingon's have the same content as the Federation but most of the first tier you play is tutorial and that is what is not in for Klingon's, and until the company tells me otherwise I'll go with what they say as opposed to all of you on the board who keep twisting the Klingon situation to mean what you want it to.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
How about soloing multiple borg ships as a newbie! That was my personal fav.
I'm just going to pop in for a moment to say that whether certain posters are fine with the IP breaks is irrelevant here, as it doesn't change the fact that they are IP breaks.
This thread is merely to inform Trek fans of how this game will differ from the IP it was based on.
Whether they like or dislike the changes is up to them.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
I read there will actually be a storyline tie in to explain how the borg was weakened.
Another point I wanted to touch on that fit's perfectly into this post is why do we keep recycling this same lame ass "This is against the IP argument?"
You all realize the person with the most authority to the IP has given Cryptic permission to work with the IP.
Who should I trust about what the IP is about the person who is an extension of the original holders or some anonymous joker on the internet who by virtue of his name suggests he will only have negativity to post?
To be honest with you folks IP is nothing more than those same "skins" you complain about anything story wise that Cryptic choses to do is more lore than anything that is suggested by people on this site and Paramount is the only one who can say "what Cryptic is doing is so bad it will not be a part of the main lore of Star Trek.
With that being the case why all the daily crying? I understand you don't think the game is going a way you'd like move on it isn't difficult (unless you are addicted to drama which I'm fairly certain some on this site are).
But again get off your IP soap box because none of you is more qualified than me let alone Cryptic to dictate what the IP is about.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
MMO-Troll has a lot of time to flame star trek from Cryptic but doesn't have the time to write an article and yells he has to grief.
So far, I'm finding that there aren't as many changes as you might think.
"Because it's easier to nitpick something than to be constructive." -roach5000
And I'm just going to pop in and inform fans of the IP to consider the source. Whether certain posters think the IP is broken or not is irrellevant, as it doesn't change the fact that it is a game based on the Star Trek IP and anyone who claims to love/like the ip should be finding out for themselves and not just taking you on your word for it especially since they just need to look at your post history to see you don't like anything as it is, you always think you personally know what's best for the community and that your opinion is the only one that matters in your view.
And while you try to vaguely point me out I stand loud and proud and proclaim you a troll and say that your post history shows you do nothing but jump onto the band wagon of any single possible post that reflects negatively on STO. So while I concede certain things about the IP don't work well you quickly throw your lot in with anything negative makes one wonder if you truly believe the hype or if you just think your mission is to make everyone else a doubter like you.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
I am waiting for the "IP breaks! You are not suppose to survive everytime your ship gets blow up. Not to mention you can get a new ship and back in action in 10 sec"
Give it a rest....it's a game.
Sure no one ever went back to their old ship....
1) Star Trek Motion picture:Admiral Kirk assumes command of Enterprize.
2)Wrath of Khan:Admiral Kirk assumes control of Enterprise from Captain Spock.
3)Kirk is given a new ship at the end of Vovage Home, renamed Enterprise
3)Star Trek First Contact;Worf returns to duty on Enterprise from Defiant
4)Beverly Crusher left Enterprise and came back
I watched Insurrection too and it made me download First Contact and Undiscovered Country
Insurrection really didn't feel important enough to warrant a movie imo. A two part episode, sure, but a movie?
Nothing really happens to the story. And that world is never brought up again. Like, Picard never returns even after he retires....which it seems like that's something he would do since he appeared to want to stay badly, but was needed elsewhere.
Maybe someone else knows if that planet is ever mentioned again?
I agree.
This is a game we're talking about, dawg. How the hell do you expect it to be exactly like the TV shows and the movies?
I mean, seriously. This is your big problem with this game? Really?!
I'm freaking speechless.
Edit: Seriously, I'm far from being a huge fan of Cryptic and I definitely don't plan to purchase their latest attempt at a fast food MMO but what you're complaining about is simply silly.
Seems like grasping at straws to justify their stance that this game will fail.
None of these really support the 'Picard decides to run a mission on his old ship' IP break.
You could add to the above examples Commadore Decker relieving Scotty? of command and attacking the Planet Killer back in the Orig series while Kirk was off the ship or that Fed Ambassador doing pretty much the same to whoever Kirk had left in charge while gone. All these examples would be on par of a senior with a legitimate right to be there relieving a junior of command.
The IP break would be of a same rank (or senior) just showing up with no right to be there (after all he did just desert his post to show up on your doorstep!) and taking over. That's pretty much wrong in any military.
Personally I think that once you trade in a ship it should be gone and not kept parked in the garage for when you get nostalgic.
SWG (pre-cu) - AoC (pre-f2p) - PotBS (pre-boarder) - DDO - LotRO (pre-f2p) - STO (pre-f2p) - GnH (beta tester) - SWTOR - Neverwinter
I'm not going to repeat what has already been said because so many have already pointed out the craziness in your arguments.All I have to add is that I hope you keep it up. You are doing far more to help the game than hurt it. Please carry on /thumbs up.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
None of these really support the 'Picard decides to run a mission on his old ship' IP break.
You could add to the above examples Commadore Decker relieving Scotty? of command and attacking the Planet Killer back in the Orig series while Kirk was off the ship or that Fed Ambassador doing pretty much the same to whoever Kirk had left in charge while gone. All these examples would be on par of a senior with a legitimate right to be there relieving a junior of command.
The IP break would be of a same rank (or senior) just showing up with no right to be there (after all he did just desert his post to show up on your doorstep!) and taking over. That's pretty much wrong in any military.
Personally I think that once you trade in a ship it should be gone and not kept parked in the garage for when you get nostalgic.
There are occasions when Captains in the US Navy are ordered to take command of a ship temporarily