Zax you took what I said and extrapolated well beyond reasonable thought. Nowhere did I mention posting his name,address and such.
I also stand by my thought that he got what was coming to him. All he had to do to avoid this was to decide "Hey I don't like this game" or even "F this game" and walk away. Instead he chose to make multiple accounts to continue his crusade.
Do I think it was 100% right for them to post his IP addy? Nope I don't. But they own the board and they have the right to do as they please.
Originally posted by Grunch How could they even have a lawsuit against me?
Well, just as a side point. Well they could start up one saying because their game isn't getting much players is due to a guy named Grunch that scared everyone away warning all folks it was not a real game. Plus with the only option they can afford to sell it on the net since they can't afford a publisher. So, it would be easier to convince others it was a hoax since they don't see it in the stores. But I wouldn't worry about it, even if they did try to pursue (which is VERY HIGHLY UNLIKELY) you could always say that how they responded to you hurt them more than your rants at their site LMAO
Sorry if my logic is getting scrambled, but I just got hit with the tired bug.
What sucks is I was really looking forward to this game it looked awsome. I didnt have any trouble with them before until tonight when I got banned for what I originally thought was being off topic in a thread I created so I was pissed off. Then I found out it was because I said "wtf" just like that not spelled out or anything in a very early thread of mine the same one to be exact. I was reading about the delay of beta and launch and to me that sounded great because it was more realistic then the "vapor" date of feb 25 and was going to pre-order a copy when I got home from work.
I wasnt going to message boards saying it was vapor I was asking questions on their website asking about the game and what was up with the rumors I heard from other people from other websites including their own. Its their boards they can easily ban people if they can sue people for making multiple accounts VN would be gillionairs by now.
"I'm sorry but your mmo has been diagnosed with EA and only has X number of days to live."
Yeah, well I have been following Mourning off and on for a while, but one thing I noticed is it was somewhat seemilar to WISH and we all know what happened to WISH!!
The way things have been going lately for MMO's I am very hesitate about buying anymore without a free trial. I haven't been satisfied witha MMO sever since AC. Well, I liked DAoC some, but fell asleep while playing after a while. Beta tested too many of them and own about 10 that I bought within the last 2 years.
Infact I have been playing EQ2 and WoW ever since release and I just uninstalled EQ2 because I don't want to get too much into a game where they have already planned out 3 xp a yr and this stupid adventure packs, let alone they are trying to get a buck for every little option they let you have. Too much into making money and not enough into wanting to provide us with a gaming world.
As for WoW, well it is ok to, but just like the genre has been going ever since EQ/AC days it is still the same. EQ2 has stuff WoW doesn't have and WoW has stuff that EQ2 doesn't have, but yet both don't have the best of what they both provide. Well, don't want this to turn into one of them topics....so I will not go on with that.
Anyway, Mourning, WISH, VanGuard, Hero's Journey, MEO, DDO and DnL were my next options. However I think in the end the only ones that seem to be going in the direction I want is either Vanguard or Hero's Journey. I think all the rest are trying too much mainstream which will turn them all into quick, easy play child games. Which if they are to be so successful, why didn't AC2 do so well? Maybe too much rant about it. How knows.
I want a game company that has a plan and plans to stick with it, not become weak with their ideas and start asking interested players what they want. I think that is what killed AC. I game company needs to be strong in their convictions if they really know what they are doing. I think VG and HJ will be the only ones so far that will do by their vision instead of what polls or what a lot of confused games think what they want. Well DnL I think is doing this also and I am impressed with it. But I think it is too focused on PVP. I prefer a balance of all elements. That would be a good game.
After seeing that thread, and alot of stuff that has been going on lately with Mourning. I'm not sure I even want to buy it anymore when/if it does come out. I read enough post there to see that most of the mods/dev's have some sort of 'elitist' complex. Thinking your better then the people you want to buy your game. Is the first and best way to make sure it fails next to making a crap product. See Horizons/David Bowman.
In War - Victory. In Peace - Vigilance. In Death - Sacrifice.
How would you guys feel about this? Scroll down a little to my name. I got banned for being OT on my thread I created. It seems I questioned the vaporness of the game to much and made them mad. Ashame I really looked forward to playing this game but not anymore.
It is 100% I-L-L-E-G-A-L for an official game company to on purpose post a customer's full IP address in public. Right now you can talk to a civil lawyer (most give FREE consultations) and look into suing that game company! If you do not know any civil law lawyers, check the phone book. (Every library has up to date phone books.) Sue them for thousands, to hundreds of thousands, to perhaps millions. They opened you up to identity theft. Any one of millions of hackers on the internet now have a chance to infiltrate your computer.
Someone with your IP can then access your computer - one way is via remote access. Go into your system. Target you specifically for viruses. Target you specifically to find out your real life name, address, Credit Card number (most internet providers require CC to sign up), phone number. And more. Heck, they can even visit your house and rob it. Or worse.
It is up to you if you want to let them get away with this without you making a stink about it. As long as one of the players, customers say or do anything, then they will get away with it. I never seriously thought about checking out their game Mourning. But if they had posted my IP you darn right I would be on the phone with my lawyer asking him for refrences to any civil lawyers he knows.
At the very least, you should copy that page of theirs with your IP. Print+page, open a graphics program, and paste. Then save it to CD<- . Make 3 backup CD copies. So if something ever happens to your computer, or you later do find your info has been messed with, you have a chance at legal action in the future.
They removed it already. I thought about taking screenshots but figured they wouldnt be of much help because people can alter them with little effort. The IP they posted was a government IP.
I really wouldnt want to take it that far I think there was a lot of misunderstanding between the devs and the community. They really need to work on their PR. Maybe in Romania they deal with people in a different way then we do in in the U.S.
"I'm sorry but your mmo has been diagnosed with EA and only has X number of days to live."
I might have tried this game until they pulled this. The only thing that I think really constituted breaking of the rules was the creation of multiple accounts. It it their site and their game so they are free to ban you if they want.
IP addresses are easy to find and perfectly legally to post such information. It is frowned upon because it can allow hackers to attack your system. The US Supreme Court has consistently rules that the internet is considered a massive conversation and is protected in the same way that all Speach in the US is protected.
But by posting such information they, and not you, might have legal issues. Simply posting the information is simply giving out public information which people can easily get - such as an address from a phone book. However, encouraging people to break US law by attacking your computer crosses the line that protects speach. Inciting people to commit criminal or violent acts is not protected under US law. The court system, espically when it involves the internet, will not usually get involved. However, if your system were to get attacked and you could trace it back to that company being directly or indirectly responsible, then they would be subject to criminal and civil prosecution.
You on the other hand are safe. Assuming you are not in Romania then you have nothing to fear from their law. US law is not on their side. Being an ass (whether you are or not) is protected in the US. All they can do is ban you from the site and game.
As for your IP. If you are on dial up, then it stays the same most of the time. There will be minor variation and certainly could easily be found. If you use DSL or Cable, 99% of the time it is a dynamic IP. You can release your IP (or simply reset your modem) and it will change. If you have a router, they do not have your real IP anyway. A cheap router will simply allow them to see the gateway IP address and not your comptuers, a good router w/ a firewall will often give out false IP information anyway. I would recomend to anyone that uses broadban connections, even with only one computer, to get a router. It is a good way for most people to prevent hackers from attacking your system. And if you do tend to piss a lot of hacker off, by a router that has a full hardware firewall built into it. It is much safer and better for your computer than running a software firewall.
For those that now feel the need to hide your tracks on the net, there are programs that will either hide your IP address, or even better bounce your signal all across the globe making tracing you and your real IP address almost impossible.
Legally there is nothing you can do about a violation of privacy from a Romanian company at the moment. Only after Romania joins the European Union in 2007 would any possibility of redress be available. The EU has strict privacy laws, more strict than those in the U.S. in regards to companies sharing personal information.
I don't think the Mourning devs know their cusomer base. Being a pure PvP game its customer base will be more combative and opinionated than found in other online games. So yes they are driving them away by being overly sensitive to certain postings.
He on a govt IP. Military, or civilian employee? Either way, if you're worried you might want to contact your local computer techs and tell them the IP might be unsecure. They can change it for you easily enough, but you can't alter it yourself on a govt system, usually. You might get some flak for surfing a game site, but if you're really worried, it might be worthwhile.
I am pretty sure IPs are not covered under the privacy act. Almost every website on the internet logs incoming IP addresses. Message boards universally log IPs, so by signing into a board (even if you are there as 'guest') you are giving the board owner your IP. If you are in IRC, your IP is generally visible to anyone else there. IPs are not really secret info.
Heck, there's a lot less secret than that. How many of you post your website on fan boards and such? Are you aware that if you own your own domain, you are probably giving out your home address and phone number? It's part of the internic information on your website.
Of course, there are workarounds for this as well, ways to protect your info. But if you whois a site at http://www.betterwhois.com, you get name, address, phone number, maybe fax number, sometimes other tidbits. And none of that info is private, because you have made it publicly available.
That said, I am not overly impressed with how the Mourning dev team is working either. Their idea of customer relations seems really off to me.
Comments
Zax you took what I said and extrapolated well beyond reasonable thought. Nowhere did I mention posting his name,address and such.
I also stand by my thought that he got what was coming to him. All he had to do to avoid this was to decide "Hey I don't like this game" or even "F this game" and walk away. Instead he chose to make multiple accounts to continue his crusade.
Do I think it was 100% right for them to post his IP addy? Nope I don't. But they own the board and they have the right to do as they please.
Well, just as a side point. Well they could start up one saying because their game isn't getting much players is due to a guy named Grunch that scared everyone away warning all folks it was not a real game. Plus with the only option they can afford to sell it on the net since they can't afford a publisher. So, it would be easier to convince others it was a hoax since they don't see it in the stores. But I wouldn't worry about it, even if they did try to pursue (which is VERY HIGHLY UNLIKELY) you could always say that how they responded to you hurt them more than your rants at their site LMAO
Sorry if my logic is getting scrambled, but I just got hit with the tired bug.
What sucks is I was really looking forward to this game it looked awsome. I didnt have any trouble with them before until tonight when I got banned for what I originally thought was being off topic in a thread I created so I was pissed off. Then I found out it was because I said "wtf" just like that not spelled out or anything in a very early thread of mine the same one to be exact. I was reading about the delay of beta and launch and to me that sounded great because it was more realistic then the "vapor" date of feb 25 and was going to pre-order a copy when I got home from work.
I wasnt going to message boards saying it was vapor I was asking questions on their website asking about the game and what was up with the rumors I heard from other people from other websites including their own. Its their boards they can easily ban people if they can sue people for making multiple accounts VN would be gillionairs by now.
"I'm sorry but your mmo has been diagnosed with EA and only has X number of days to live."
Yeah, well I have been following Mourning off and on for a while, but one thing I noticed is it was somewhat seemilar to WISH and we all know what happened to WISH!!
The way things have been going lately for MMO's I am very hesitate about buying anymore without a free trial. I haven't been satisfied witha MMO sever since AC. Well, I liked DAoC some, but fell asleep while playing after a while. Beta tested too many of them and own about 10 that I bought within the last 2 years.
Infact I have been playing EQ2 and WoW ever since release and I just uninstalled EQ2 because I don't want to get too much into a game where they have already planned out 3 xp a yr and this stupid adventure packs, let alone they are trying to get a buck for every little option they let you have. Too much into making money and not enough into wanting to provide us with a gaming world.
As for WoW, well it is ok to, but just like the genre has been going ever since EQ/AC days it is still the same. EQ2 has stuff WoW doesn't have and WoW has stuff that EQ2 doesn't have, but yet both don't have the best of what they both provide. Well, don't want this to turn into one of them topics....so I will not go on with that.
Anyway, Mourning, WISH, VanGuard, Hero's Journey, MEO, DDO and DnL were my next options. However I think in the end the only ones that seem to be going in the direction I want is either Vanguard or Hero's Journey. I think all the rest are trying too much mainstream which will turn them all into quick, easy play child games. Which if they are to be so successful, why didn't AC2 do so well? Maybe too much rant about it. How knows.
I want a game company that has a plan and plans to stick with it, not become weak with their ideas and start asking interested players what they want. I think that is what killed AC. I game company needs to be strong in their convictions if they really know what they are doing. I think VG and HJ will be the only ones so far that will do by their vision instead of what polls or what a lot of confused games think what they want. Well DnL I think is doing this also and I am impressed with it. But I think it is too focused on PVP. I prefer a balance of all elements. That would be a good game.
Oh well, don't ban me. I guess I am OT huh? LOL
"I'm sorry but your mmo has been diagnosed with EA and only has X number of days to live."
Hey
In Denmark and I'm almost sure that also in the US Ip's are personal information ! So posting it public is not allowed !
Blawrf
After seeing that thread, and alot of stuff that has been going on lately with Mourning. I'm not sure I even want to buy it anymore when/if it does come out. I read enough post there to see that most of the mods/dev's have some sort of 'elitist' complex. Thinking your better then the people you want to buy your game. Is the first and best way to make sure it fails next to making a crap product. See Horizons/David Bowman.
In War - Victory.
In Peace - Vigilance.
In Death - Sacrifice.
"I'm sorry but your mmo has been diagnosed with EA and only has X number of days to live."
It is up to you if you want to let them get away with this without you making a stink about it. As long as one of the players, customers say or do anything, then they will get away with it. I never seriously thought about checking out their game Mourning. But if they had posted my IP you darn right I would be on the phone with my lawyer asking him for refrences to any civil lawyers he knows.
At the very least, you should copy that page of theirs with your IP. Print+page, open a graphics program, and paste. Then save it to CD<- . Make 3 backup CD copies. So if something ever happens to your computer, or you later do find your info has been messed with, you have a chance at legal action in the future.
They removed it already. I thought about taking screenshots but figured they wouldnt be of much help because people can alter them with little effort. The IP they posted was a government IP.
I really wouldnt want to take it that far I think there was a lot of misunderstanding between the devs and the community. They really need to work on their PR. Maybe in Romania they deal with people in a different way then we do in in the U.S.
"I'm sorry but your mmo has been diagnosed with EA and only has X number of days to live."
I might have tried this game until they pulled this. The only thing that I think really constituted breaking of the rules was the creation of multiple accounts. It it their site and their game so they are free to ban you if they want.
IP addresses are easy to find and perfectly legally to post such information. It is frowned upon because it can allow hackers to attack your system. The US Supreme Court has consistently rules that the internet is considered a massive conversation and is protected in the same way that all Speach in the US is protected.
But by posting such information they, and not you, might have legal issues. Simply posting the information is simply giving out public information which people can easily get - such as an address from a phone book. However, encouraging people to break US law by attacking your computer crosses the line that protects speach. Inciting people to commit criminal or violent acts is not protected under US law. The court system, espically when it involves the internet, will not usually get involved. However, if your system were to get attacked and you could trace it back to that company being directly or indirectly responsible, then they would be subject to criminal and civil prosecution.
You on the other hand are safe. Assuming you are not in Romania then you have nothing to fear from their law. US law is not on their side. Being an ass (whether you are or not) is protected in the US. All they can do is ban you from the site and game.
As for your IP. If you are on dial up, then it stays the same most of the time. There will be minor variation and certainly could easily be found. If you use DSL or Cable, 99% of the time it is a dynamic IP. You can release your IP (or simply reset your modem) and it will change. If you have a router, they do not have your real IP anyway. A cheap router will simply allow them to see the gateway IP address and not your comptuers, a good router w/ a firewall will often give out false IP information anyway. I would recomend to anyone that uses broadban connections, even with only one computer, to get a router. It is a good way for most people to prevent hackers from attacking your system. And if you do tend to piss a lot of hacker off, by a router that has a full hardware firewall built into it. It is much safer and better for your computer than running a software firewall.
For those that now feel the need to hide your tracks on the net, there are programs that will either hide your IP address, or even better bounce your signal all across the globe making tracing you and your real IP address almost impossible.
Legally there is nothing you can do about a violation of privacy from a Romanian company at the moment. Only after Romania joins the European Union in 2007 would any possibility of redress be available. The EU has strict privacy laws, more strict than those in the U.S. in regards to companies sharing personal information.
I don't think the Mourning devs know their cusomer base. Being a pure PvP game its customer base will be more combative and opinionated than found in other online games. So yes they are driving them away by being overly sensitive to certain postings.
He on a govt IP. Military, or civilian employee? Either way, if you're worried you might want to contact your local computer techs and tell them the IP might be unsecure. They can change it for you easily enough, but you can't alter it yourself on a govt system, usually. You might get some flak for surfing a game site, but if you're really worried, it might be worthwhile.
I am pretty sure IPs are not covered under the privacy act.
Almost every website on the internet logs incoming IP addresses. Message boards universally log IPs, so by signing into a board (even if you are there as 'guest') you are giving the board owner your IP. If you are in IRC, your IP is generally visible to anyone else there. IPs are not really secret info.
Heck, there's a lot less secret than that.
How many of you post your website on fan boards and such? Are you aware that if you own your own domain, you are probably giving out your home address and phone number? It's part of the internic information on your website.
Of course, there are workarounds for this as well, ways to protect your info. But if you whois a site at http://www.betterwhois.com, you get name, address, phone number, maybe fax number, sometimes other tidbits. And none of that info is private, because you have made it publicly available.
That said, I am not overly impressed with how the Mourning dev team is working either. Their idea of customer relations seems really off to me.
Owyn
Commander, Defenders of Order
http://www.defendersoforder.com