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This game is not good IMO.
Well it does if you like grief in the starting zone, if you are into loot stealing and PVP killing in the noob zone this game is for you.
The loot boxes are not specific to the creator of the box therefor it can be looted by anyone. There are towers to "protect" noobs however it does not prevent any sort of player harrassment, where another player can be right next to you while you are fighting and can loot your kill as soon as the box drops.
The GM's who are almost always in the game encourage this griefing behavior.
Welcome to Eve 2.0 with a twist with Perpetuum you can grief in High Sec areas.
[Mod Edit]
Comments
Hello, I am Dehrios. Being the GM you mentioned here, Ill explain.
1. The loot boxes are not specific to the creator of the box therefor it can be looted by anyone. - This is being changed. We talked about it more in-depth today and got player feedback from it..
2. The GM's who are almost always in the game encourage this griefing behavior. - Considering this is a sandbox mmorpg, why limit playstyles?
Oh.. I dunno.. Because there's a line to be drawn. Eventually "griefing" becomes harassment? You guys do have rules against harassment right? There should be some type of penalty attached to this. Especially since you *want* players to continue playing the game and having GMs that incite chaos and perpetrate harassing behavior just turns away new and potential customers.
You do realize you're in a beta right? I'm still waiting for my invite but betas are testing stage. Who cares if there are griefers in the game? It's not the first game to have it; Mortal Online, Darkfall have noob zone griefers. At least Mortal Online has a system set up to where if you're being attacked then you can call the guards. I'm actually looking forward to a mech mmo but until I get a beta to see the game in it's current state and see what's being planned for it I will hold judgment.
Either way you go, there will still be abuse in any system that gets put in. Its trying to find the lesser of two evil's inside of a haystack.
Honestly, nowadays a MMO has to be aimed at a certain crowd. It helps to weed out people just trying to find the next bandwagon. If PvP is a major aspect of a game then by all means let it start at second 1 when the player enters the game. Eventually players who enjoy the game will learn to travel in groups or become really good at defending themselves. I enjoy PvP, and knowing that you can get blasted off the bat in this one just teaches me to be more aware of my surrounding.
"Oh look, that player is charging me, perhaps he wants to shake hands...ZZZAAAPPP...well bygolley he shot me I think that's grounds to retaliate, have at thee foul mech player, feel the wrath of Pewpew McGee."
We need more PvP focused games, let it weed out the men from the boys
Quoting for posterity... though I'm not sure what more needs to be said. Who even knows if this poster is even who he says he is? Suffice it to say, every negative action needs at least the possibility of an equally negative response. At the very least there should be some tangible consequence for negative actions. The possibility that the game designers encourage outright griefing of other players is a huge turnoff for most potential customers. If you want your game to end up with nothing but sociopathic griefers griefing each other in your game before it eventually closes because even the griefers can't stand it, then have at...
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"Searchers after horror haunt strange, far places..." ~ H.P.Lovecraft, "From Beyond"
Member Since March 2004
Quoting for posterity... though I'm not sure what more needs to be said. Who even knows if this poster is even who he says he is? Suffice it to say, every negative action needs at least the possibility of an equally negative response. At the very least there should be some tangible consequence for negative actions. The possibility that the game designers encourage outright griefing of other players is a huge turnoff for most potential customers. If you want your game to end up with nothing but sociopathic griefers griefing each other in your game before it eventually closes because even the griefers can't stand it, then have at...
first, that is in fact Dehrios, a GM for the game. second, it comes down to team play, if you don't want to be griefed, then get a group together and go farm outside of the police towers, someone tries to take your stuff there, kill them.
now, whether you are a new player or an older player, you can always find someone else to play with. beginning players are instantly put into a starter Corp, which means other players will be there as well so if you need help or want to go farm something, ask for some assistance. the game is meant for teamplay and to join a corp and work close with them.
Perpetuum has and will be going through many changes, they are working on a new Industrial system and from what i have heard a new pvp system soon to follow. and i am sure there is a loot system in the books at some point, but with everything else in the game that needs to be looked at, im sure its not exactly high on the list.
Yes, Closed Beta and the purpose is to test for bugs and UNKNOWN issues, I knew in less than 10 minutes that anyone can loot a loot box on the ground no matter who created it, that was almost a month ago.
There is no consequence for taking a can from someone who just killed a mob, how long do you need someone to do that to you or follow you for several hours no matter where you go inside a Station, another zone before you get fed up?
There are at the time of this writing five bot types: Arkhe (noob), Light, Assault, Mech, Heavy Mech.
You are in an Arkhe and less than 10 minutes old, I am in a Kain (Mech) I have two buddies with me who are in a Waspish (Assault) and Arbelest (Assault). And no matter where you go we follow, you kill we take your loot. Knowing that there is absolutely nothing you can do about it nor am I and my buddies going to get be punished in any way by a NPC protecting you or being able to attack for taking your stuff. Even if you could attack what good would it do 3v1, two 2nd tier and one 3rd tier mech vs a starter...This is what happened to cause the above post.
Yes, Closed Beta and the purpose is to test for bugs and UNKNOWN issues, I knew in less than 10 minutes that anyone can loot a loot box on the ground no matter who created it, that was almost a month ago.
There is no consequence for taking a can from someone who just killed a mob, how long do you need someone to do that to you or follow you for several hours no matter where you go inside a Station, another zone before you get fed up?
There are at the time of this writing five bot types: Arkhe (noob), Light, Assault, Mech, Heavy Mech.
You are in an Arkhe and less than 10 minutes old, I am in a Kain (Mech) I have two buddies with me who are in a Waspish (Assault) and Arbelest (Assault). And no matter where you go we follow, you kill we take your loot. Knowing that there is absolutely nothing you can do about it nor am I and my buddies going to get be punished in any way by a NPC protecting you or being able to attack for taking your stuff. Even if you could attack what good would it do 3v1, two 2nd tier and one 3rd tier mech vs a starter...This is what happened to cause the above post.
then maybe you should take a look at mining to make money till you can get into a bigger bot. there are other options you can do to make money and advance. there are also missions to make money.
then maybe you should take a look at mining to make money till you can get into a bigger bot. there are other options you can do to make money and advance. there are also missions to make money.
There is an "or" in that above statement. It did not matter what was done if it was outside the station there was three people who were with in 50-100m of me all the time, you cannot Approach a Station unless you are within 1000m. When they were asked to leave it was made to seem that I was the bad person because I was getting VERY tired of constantly being followed, having someone I did not know calling me names and acting like a 6 year old in chat. Here is a quote from one of them on this subject.
"""its important to test the mechanics used for harassing people.
Because when the game hits live, the numbers of a**holes, like me, will multiply by 1000
Imagine the a**hattery and shenanigans then.
You need to test, you need to a**es the effects and you need to think of game mechanics that can be implimented to allow victim to defend.
Look at that "other game" it got can falgging, and thats a process of 4 years of endless can stealing horror campaing.
Now you got to deal people that grief you with can flipping big_smile
irony i know..."""
Only edit I did was trim the language for polite company.
This is a "tester" who has been in the game since the 9 Jan 10, there has been one update since I started. 1 Feb 10, and this update had nothing to do with what is stated above. The discussion this quote come from was in Dec 09, I think its been well established that you can harass someone in a myriad of ways.
Both of you are right. You because the game makes griefing too easy, and while we want it to be a harsh world, it's still just a game. And the one you quoted, because he is trying to make his point by using the game's flaws until we take notice and make fixing it a priority. A rather unfriendly way if you ask me, but effective nonetheless.
We're a very small team and we can only do so much at once. We have a set roadmap of stuff to implement and we only make changes to that plan if we really need to, like when many players raise their voices about something. And indeed this seems to be the case here, however we already have done changes to loot handling in the past few days, which will hopefully diminish the harassment of new players in protected areas (out in next patch).
then maybe you should take a look at mining to make money till you can get into a bigger bot. there are other options you can do to make money and advance. there are also missions to make money.
There is an "or" in that above statement. It did not matter what was done if it was outside the station there was three people who were with in 50-100m of me all the time, you cannot Approach a Station unless you are within 1000m. When they were asked to leave it was made to seem that I was the bad person because I was getting VERY tired of constantly being followed, having someone I did not know calling me names and acting like a 6 year old in chat. Here is a quote from one of them on this subject.
"""its important to test the mechanics used for harassing people.
Because when the game hits live, the numbers of a**holes, like me, will multiply by 1000
Imagine the a**hattery and shenanigans then.
You need to test, you need to a**es the effects and you need to think of game mechanics that can be implimented to allow victim to defend.
Look at that "other game" it got can falgging, and thats a process of 4 years of endless can stealing horror campaing.
Now you got to deal people that grief you with can flipping big_smile
irony i know..."""
Only edit I did was trim the language for polite company.
This is a "tester" who has been in the game since the 9 Jan 10, there has been one update since I started. 1 Feb 10, and this update had nothing to do with what is stated above. The discussion this quote come from was in Dec 09, I think its been well established that you can harass someone in a myriad of ways.
my guess would be you had a run in with M2S, now, while they are a**holes at times, they have brought alot of bugs to the attention of the devs (and anyone that knows me will know that i dont really defend them.. in fact, i hunt them) now, that being said. if you mine, or do missions, it wont matter if they follow you. and just because you don't know how to check keybinding to make looting quicker, dosnt mean everything is messed up. if you were to try one of the many other options to make money, or even just give you somthing to do, im sure you would be able to calm down and stop acting like a 6 y/o yourself.
now, a few people don't make a game bad, a looting system is on the list, and there are other things you can do that don't involve you having to loot therefore you cannot be griefed by the players.
have a nice day, grow up.
/bump
this sounds like a great game. never heard of it before, thanks for advertising
too bad its not fantasy, i am not into scifi mmos. but this really deserves bumping, let the crowd know there are hardcore pvp games out there other than darkfall. community lacks and needs such stuff desperately
and lastly, allowing does not mean encouraging. you cant say gm encourage griefing if they just dont give a damn about it
just go back to wow (yeah i know its old saying but still sounds l33t)
Playing: Rohan
Played (from best to worst): Shadowbane, Guild Wars, Shayia, Age of Conan, Warhammer, Runes of Magic, Rappelz, Archlord, Knight online, King of Kings, Kal online, Last chaos
Oh.. I dunno.. Because there's a line to be drawn. Eventually "griefing" becomes harassment? You guys do have rules against harassment right? There should be some type of penalty attached to this. Especially since you *want* players to continue playing the game and having GMs that incite chaos and perpetrate harassing behavior just turns away new and potential customers.
Don't play Eve much huh?
This is basically Eve with Mechs.
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
Don't know how I missed this gem, this could be something... I hate spaceships it seems but mechs
cool I am tired of care bear sissys being allowed in games. oh now, this game is killing me stop it, oh no theres a death penalty all I want is a button I press that tells me I am special.
Really don't know how i've missed this game, yes it may be similar to EVE but in all honesty that's not a bad thing when you consider how many sci fi sandbox MMO's there is or just plain sandbox for that matter.
The gaming industry is stagnant at the moment, pretty much every game that is being released is the same old bs of go bash some squirrels for abit then go bash a scripted boss at end game for phat loots, the game industry needs more of this type of game I think to get away from the sesame street hand holding crap that is currently on the market.
I loved EVE played it since 2003 but cap ships killed it for me so hopefully this will be a bit more refreshing, and as to getting griefed in a starting zone well god forbid trying to find a group in an MMO, I mean aint that what MMO's are supposed to be all about?
But yeah who knows how this game will turn out might be good might be bad, gonna keep an eye on it though as if you don't like bashing fairies the options are severely limited.
I always think that griefing at noob starting places is a bad idea. Unless the griefing is very unrewarding in most situations(like EVE in high sec space). So that it only takes place to settle a score instead of encouraging bully behaviour. If the last is happening regurarly, the game will never take off.
It kind of depends on if noobs get the chance to learn to play the game. If their time gets wasted too much by getting killed time upon time because of some corpsecampers, the game will suffer in subs.
This has nothing to do with carebear or being 'tough' in a game.
Just an update the new players can't be griefed by stealing from their loot cans. The cans are secure for a specific amount of time and then open for others to take from them if the owner left them and the timer has ran out.
Some of these types of griefing has spawned a few thread on the game forums. Remember the game is beta and things have to develop as the game moves forward into Open Beta and Release.
Hope to see everyone interested in the game come and check it out when it goes Open Beta.
You forgot to mention that those other mmo's you mentioned all failed as games and most likely will endup shutdown before the end of the year. So I don't think it would favor your point to use them as examples, heh. Games that favor pure pvp and griefing, fail, period.
On a side note, is there not an NDA with all the info that has been talked about by supposed beta testers and GM's here? lol
No NDA on Perpetuum.
Hmm... EVE's system is quite better... if someone bullies/griefs you stealing your cans you can just hotdrop a few buddies on him and police will consider it a "legitimate defense" action.
It's a nice middle way between "you can grief without consequences" and "you cannot grief at all".
Yes, I would like to see Perpetuum move more towards the type of system where loot cans are open to everyone and the player has a choice to steal or not and if the player steals he flags to the owner of the can. But for now it is what it is....
EVE's PVP and griefing system is actually quite well thought out and caters to pretty much all play styles, from Carebear to Killer.
Few other PVP MMO's achieve a similar balance hence they don't have 300K subs. One thing is certain, unrestricted ganking (especially if the victims have no chance to fight back) leads to very low sub numbers. (or cash in your shop)
Developers of this game do well to remember this.
I know there's a market for the "hardcore" PVPer, but its a small market in the long run.
And to the GM who said why would they restrict game play in a sandbox, the real world is the ultimate sandbox and its full of restrictions to the gameplay. Sure,we have PVP combat, but only according to a certain ruleset, at certain times, and those who break those rules face harsh consequences. (such as permadeath)
MMO's really shouldn't be that much different.
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