I find it curious that the arguments against them dumbing down the game use the complaint of the game having required too much thought and effort. So by removing the requirement for that thought and effort, are they not dumbing down the game? WoW has been required less effort over the years in multiple ways. It is hard to argue against that. You will get a lot of complaints from the people that enjoyed the theorycrafting side of the game - working through to get the "best" possible. You will find that the casual players will be happier with the changes. The argument overall in that sense is nothing new. Blizzard has attempted to appease those with less time, desiring to expend less effort, and perhaps not having the ability to deal with the game since prior to BC. Some people are not surprised by the continued devolution of the game, whether they cheer for the changes or criticize them. Be honest, sheesh.
since when were video games something that had to be as complicated as possible to be considered worth playing?
the stat changes will have no effect on how hard/easy the gameplay will be, or change what it is like to control your character, or to beat a raid. its a gear-based number/stat simplification that will save the dev team alot of time when putting together gear. personally, I would rather them not waste resources on number tweaks when they could be working on better content, be it for WoW or any other game in development. not to mention the time it saves the average player. we already pay a sub and spend hours playing the game. why should we have to net-surf unofficial websites to understand a 'videogame' function. then again, this is also a demographic of people who think it's wrong to learn boss by playing them firsthand, and would rather people research youtube videos before they 'play' a videogame to relax and have fun. It is really a sad control that the industry has over some people. me? I just think it's fun to play in a fantasy setting shared by thousands of other people.
at what point was it neccessary ( or more to the point rationally acceptable) for a person to spend hours of time researching a videogame in order to understand a simple function like stats? I would rather spend my time just playing a game ( or doing something else entirely) than keeping up with every change that happens with patches, updates, expansions, unless the changes are integral to my jounrey through the simulated world. content, spell changes, bug fixes are nice to read through but i don't want to spend any of my free time reserching a function that is not implemented INSIDE of the game I am playing. by that I am meaning, there is no in-game explanation of how much of what stat a certin class is meant to have as a current balance for each teir and why should it be somehting so complicated ( as it has nothing to do with control, gameplay) that the player base needs to net-surf to get answers.
There are plenty of other worthwhile things to do with life (really, its true), and considering that alot of people already spend hours and hours just playing, I find it fair that there should be no reason to have to spend MORE time just to be sure your stat combination is not gimping you. It is totally resonable that a rogue should need to focus primarily on Agility and not have AP, crit chance, armor pen and whatever other imaginary nothings that can be worked into a % to determine the dps I can push. Again, this change has nothing to do with the skill (or lack of) involved to play the game.
realisticly, a rogue needs agility. attack power and crit chance are in the mix as well, yet they are just break downs of the OG stat we are trying to stack. and people act like there is a purpose in that? and that it hurts how 'fun' a game will be if it is simplfied?
I also have to add..... videogames SHOULD be casual...... and there is no reason that they should not accomodate a casual atmosphere. If someone is so 'hardcore' that the atmosphere does not appeal to them, then there are many other options in your life, and at no point was WoW ever a very 'hardcore' game in the first place.... it is extremely user friendly and easy to run on even low-end systems. it is designed in a fashion that a child could pick up the basics, just as the majority of every video game I have ever seen in my entire life. Any videogame can be mastered by a 10 year old and anyone who tells themself differently has a more problems than I care to point out.
i just hope epic loot will get back and be epic loot. as it was in vanilla wow. u raid, u get epix, u dont raid go do something else. . NOT god damn LFG to 25man instances.. i got back few days ago and was like omg!? back in the days epic loot was truly epic loot.
Epics are pretty much the normal candy munched on by anyone who can max lvl a toon. you can do random dungeons from 70-80, and get 2 triumphs a day, which can buy you t9 gear and gear equal to it by the time you hit 80. kinda cheap but it does help the played base get into the current content. I am unhappy with many things in WoW these days and have a diverse opinion on what they did with raiding this xpac. As a casual player ( i detest the average WoW guild atmosphere) I enjoy being able to log in and find a raid but it does hurt how serious people take the game. they think its so easy and rely on everyone else to carry them through it.
It used to be exciting to get an epic, now i almost cringe because I know it is not worth crap until I enchant and gem it, and even then, if thats assuming that is does not hurt a different stat I have to build, and just gets tossed in the bank until I feel like giving enough of a damn to balance things out (which usually cost hundreds of gold). It is no longer exciting to get upgrades, it's an expensive chore.
Those stats were not difficult at all to understand....I used to love this game before Wrath of the Lich King and was even thinking about coming back once Cataclysm comes out. But from the recent news I am hearing about basic game mechanic changes, I think I'll pass on that offer.....
Good job Blizzard at turning your game from a revolution in the gaming industry to a laughing stock in the MMO world!
[Mod Edit]
Currently playing: Star Wars: The Old Republic, World of Warcraft, Dota 2, League of Legends
Waiting on: Blade & Soul, Guild Wars 2, Tera, Kingdoms of Amular, Firefall
as something i agree in. WoW is a very very simple MMO, and is one of the fastest leveling ones out there.
WoW is easy and was made more dumb, to meet casual gamer standards, and to make it really easy.
i played a lot of WoW, for fun not for competition, or leveling. I played WoW for PVP, and to roll people with RL friends. (was boring tho, would rather of been playing CSS)
Maybe its just me to catch on to all the games i play very fast, even portal my first time playing i flew through the levels my first time because i just caught on.
only 3 games i know where i didn't catch instantly: HoN, EvE, and Supreme Commander.
On the other hand, even though this takes out a lot of options and makes the diverse option of gear building extinguished, it will be very easy to gear up (Good and Bad), and gear ninja's or gear whoring will be less.
EDIT: Something Blizz should be working on is a better security, to protect against bots, found 6 bots in 2 days.
It certainly is not "dumbing down" the game. There was a really good blue post, by Ghostcrawler I believe, that gave some examples of where complex did not equal better or more interesting. Making something simple does not mean the same as making it easy.
Take DnD for instance, it has what 6 stats? It's not exactly tic-tac-toe. Those that say it's making it easy-mode just want something to complain about.
Current games: WoW, Runes of Magic Past games: WAR, DDO, Fiesta, AoC, Rohan, Dungeon Runners, Free Realms, Tabula Rasa, LoTRO
The game is still pretty much as hard as you want it to be. If you want it to be hard, then you do all the theorycrafting yourself and stay away from elitist jerks and similar forums - or in fact, stay away from all forums.
For everyone else it is a matter of going to those forums, reading exactly what equipment to wear, what rotation to maximise your dps, and then woohoo off you go. I do hope that all those complaining about how it is being 'dumbed' down never go to forums or get any tips from anywhere, in order to make the game as hard as possible.... oh wait.
When I want to play a spreadsheet, I load excel. If I want to play an spreadsheet with nice graphics, I play Eve. WoW is not my choice of spreadsheet.
Many don't, it's just seems many of the complaints are comming from the 'hardcore' crowd (well at least Wrath's version of it), it's the same players that whined about the Teir gear becomming obtainable via HCs, they say it's 'dimb down' purly because everyone will be on par with them when it comes to understanding the stats, so it's not just something 'exculsive' to the 'elite', and the hardcore haters are just using their bitching as 'vaild' reasons to hate the game even more.
The 'elite' WILL rage quit, I've seen this comming since the accouncement of Cata, stat stacking is basically being thrown out the window and archtype is comming back on par with each other, reason stands that CC in raids will be back in play, and heavydamage wont be limited to just Tanks and Melee anymore, sounds very much like Vanilla again, as many Vanillas have said the game looks inviting again so basically the game as come full circle, the current 'hardcore' are leaving, and the new 'hardcore' could end up in fact the 'orginal hardcore'.
Funny how the game started as 99% PvE game, and they keep tuning it more and more to PvP. Well, I guess that's natural, as they save quite some work if they have players beat up each other instead of expecting dungeons.
Funny how the game started as 99% PvE game, and they keep tuning it more and more to PvP. Well, I guess that's natural, as they save quite some work if they have players beat up each other instead of expecting dungeons.
Well Blizzard have said for a while now they missed the WARcraft, if you even glace at the Cata lore it screams that Horde and Allience will no longer be 'bubbies' againest the next 'big bad', this is purly about surival now, it's offically the 'end of the world' and the only way to insure your race surives - remove the competion
Many don't, it's just seems many of the complaints are comming from the 'hardcore' crowd (well at least Wrath's version of it), it's the same players that whined about the Teir gear becomming obtainable via HCs, they say it's 'dimb down' purly because everyone will be on par with them when it comes to understanding the stats, so it's not just something 'exculsive' to the 'elite', and the hardcore haters are just using their bitching as 'vaild' reasons to hate the game even more.
The 'elite' WILL rage quit, I've seen this comming since the accouncement of Cata, stat stacking is basically being thrown out the window and archtype is comming back on par with each other, reason stands that CC in raids will be back in play, and heavydamage wont be limited to just Tanks and Melee anymore, sounds very much like Vanilla again, as many Vanillas have said the game looks inviting again so basically the game as come full circle, the current 'hardcore' are leaving, and the new 'hardcore' could end up in fact the 'orginal hardcore'.
While I'm guilty of not following wow much since about mid way through Tbc anyone can look at todays armor and see the game is just too bloated stats wise. It seems like a nice change to me. I enjoyed my time when playing and even though my account was hacked (authorization hack) I may create a new account a few months after Cata to re-level through its content for fun.
... You can change the stats on your gear ... You take a single stat on your gear and change it on an individual basis to what you like to invest in. More intellect, less stamina etc ... If that's dumbing down than my grandmother is Napoleon. So CATA is more than a complete revamp of old Azeroth and wiping all level 1-60 quest content. Tough luck.
Add in the guild based PvP competition and a complete end leveling system (Path of Titans) with a needed world profession (archeology) and ....
The only dumbing down here is the fear of the WOW haters/bored ones. ... another 4 year of dominant "fear" is in the works (for those that don't see the obvious). Incoming Wizardry no doubt.
Post forgot to mention, how everyone in CATA will have around the same amount of HP. And the DMG GAPS are still same. Yet rogues will gain energy faster from haste, and hunters gain focus faster from more haste as well.
From that i can say that bliz still doesn't know how to balance, just dumb it down and buff the most played classes. (Pally/DK/Hunter/Rogue)
Well I say time will tell. Some of the things sound good while some are a bit scary. The thing I keep replaying is the fact that all gear changes will take effect Before Cat so how is that gonna hurt us till Cat goes live? Something to wonder because what we have developed and worked out currently will all go away and we will still be on the world before Cat.
Some things are going away "poof" and some just changing to become "more effective". If it all flies and works like they plan then what will be the things for us to worry over?
We all know when Cat goes live and there are so many changes to the world and all that is in it we can expect to play very little till all the lag and bugs get worked out. Why would this expansion be any different that others. Basically the game world is getting a makeover.
As a vanilla hardcore raider, (Full naxx clear in vanilla) these changes are good for the game . There is absolutely nothing hardcore about reading a gear chart to see what items are best in slot for you and gearing accordingly.
And if reading best in slot charts are your bag, I have faith they'll still be around for those who cannot bother themselves to think on their own even when these changes are implemented.
... You can change the stats on your gear ... You take a single stat on your gear and change it on an individual basis to what you like to invest in. More intellect, less stamina etc ... If that's dumbing down than my grandmother is Napoleon. So CATA is more than a complete revamp of old Azeroth and wiping all level 1-60 quest content. Tough luck.
Add in the guild based PvP competition and a complete end leveling system (Path of Titans) with a needed world profession (archeology) and ....
The only dumbing down here is the fear of the WOW haters/bored ones. ... another 4 year of dominant "fear" is in the works (for those that don't see the obvious). Incoming Wizardry no doubt.
Post forgot to mention, how everyone in CATA will have around the same amount of HP. And the DMG GAPS are still same. Yet rogues will gain energy faster from haste, and hunters gain focus faster from more haste as well.
From that i can say that bliz still doesn't know how to balance, just dumb it down and buff the most played classes. (Pally/DK/Hunter/Rogue)
To break apart your 'claims' Pallies get 'hurt' a lot more by this change, with spellpower and the manapool size all going into Int and the regen going into Spirit the talents will really 'define' their roles more and you'll find Retri Pallies wont have the contstant use of their aoes and bubbles as even tho their damage and pool is high their regen wont be (thus putting more focus on their judges again) and once the pally is OOM they become just a block of HP, thats hardly 'favouring' the class.
Same can be said about healthpools, yea hunters will be able to contantly fire in thorey forever but it works both ends here by time they're out of focus and waiting for it to recharge they're probly still going to be met by the sharp end of an axe, again how does that 'favour' hunters?
The key point is this isn't just a one off class change happening to a certian class, ALL classes are effected to the core of their classes and Cata has been designed with those changes in mind, this isn't just a 'slap on a new stat system to the exsisting product, the 'exsisting product' will barelt exsist after Cata hits
It's amazing to me how so many people completely ignore all the other announced stat systems and tunnel vision on "how can they simplify the game QQ". So they changed some stats and removed others, big deal. Now you have to think about the mastery system, plus the titan paths or what ever they are calling it nowadays.
IMO, the new stats plus those two other stat things, plus gems and enchants is WAY more than enough for theorycrafters to have all the theorycrafting fun they want. There will still be spreadsheets, there will still be debate, but this just makes the game a little more balanced between good players and newbie players. The great players can still be great.
Originally posted by Deewe Stamina, spirit, intellect, haste, block rating, parry, mastery, armor, resilience, strength, agility, hit rating, expertise, and critical Strike Rating: 14 different stats to manage!
You forgot Spell Penetration.
So, is Chess a game for dumb people? I mean Pawns only have one attack.
It's amazing to me how so many people completely ignore all the other announced stat systems and tunnel vision on "how can they simplify the game QQ". So they changed some stats and removed others, big deal. Now you have to think about the mastery system, plus the titan paths or what ever they are calling it nowadays. IMO, the new stats plus those two other stat things, plus gems and enchants is WAY more than enough for theorycrafters to have all the theorycrafting fun they want. There will still be spreadsheets, there will still be debate, but this just makes the game a little more balanced between good players and newbie players. The great players can still be great.
Ok I take back what I said in my earlyer post. Some yall make good points,Very good points....thats why discussions are great . I intially jumped the gun :P but they way you and some others stated/commented. It does make me think back to Vanilla when there were not so many things to keep track of and it was FUN, did not feel like a math test in college.
... You can change the stats on your gear ... You take a single stat on your gear and change it on an individual basis to what you like to invest in. More intellect, less stamina etc ... If that's dumbing down than my grandmother is Napoleon. So CATA is more than a complete revamp of old Azeroth and wiping all level 1-60 quest content. Tough luck.
Add in the guild based PvP competition and a complete end leveling system (Path of Titans) with a needed world profession (archeology) and ....
The only dumbing down here is the fear of the WOW haters/bored ones. ... another 4 year of dominant "fear" is in the works (for those that don't see the obvious). Incoming Wizardry no doubt.
Post forgot to mention, how everyone in CATA will have around the same amount of HP. And the DMG GAPS are still same. Yet rogues will gain energy faster from haste, and hunters gain focus faster from more haste as well.
From that i can say that bliz still doesn't know how to balance, just dumb it down and buff the most played classes. (Pally/DK/Hunter/Rogue)
To break apart your 'claims' Pallies get 'hurt' a lot more by this change, with spellpower and the manapool size all going into Int and the regen going into Spirit the talents will really 'define' their roles more and you'll find Retri Pallies wont have the contstant use of their aoes and bubbles as even tho their damage and pool is high their regen wont be (thus putting more focus on their judges again) and once the pally is OOM they become just a block of HP, thats hardly 'favouring' the class.
Same can be said about healthpools, yea hunters will be able to contantly fire in thorey forever but it works both ends here by time they're out of focus and waiting for it to recharge they're probly still going to be met by the sharp end of an axe, again how does that 'favour' hunters?
The key point is this isn't just a one off class change happening to a certian class, ALL classes are effected to the core of their classes and Cata has been designed with those changes in mind, this isn't just a 'slap on a new stat system to the exsisting product, the 'exsisting product' will barelt exsist after Cata hits
So your saying in other words that Hunter and pally are now balanced since they suffering, at least you think they will suffer.
Pallies in vanilla were good, but all the people who shouldn't be gaming in the first place who are not considered gamers, QQ'd to much about their class. Pally was not hard to play, it did not suck, you just had to spend a little time putting a piece together and thinking it through.
PS. If you have to read a chart to know how to build your class gems and stats, etc. Then you fail, if you leveled your own class and look around the skills a little. You probably would get a idea what is best.
Comments
since when were video games something that had to be as complicated as possible to be considered worth playing?
the stat changes will have no effect on how hard/easy the gameplay will be, or change what it is like to control your character, or to beat a raid. its a gear-based number/stat simplification that will save the dev team alot of time when putting together gear. personally, I would rather them not waste resources on number tweaks when they could be working on better content, be it for WoW or any other game in development. not to mention the time it saves the average player. we already pay a sub and spend hours playing the game. why should we have to net-surf unofficial websites to understand a 'videogame' function. then again, this is also a demographic of people who think it's wrong to learn boss by playing them firsthand, and would rather people research youtube videos before they 'play' a videogame to relax and have fun. It is really a sad control that the industry has over some people. me? I just think it's fun to play in a fantasy setting shared by thousands of other people.
at what point was it neccessary ( or more to the point rationally acceptable) for a person to spend hours of time researching a videogame in order to understand a simple function like stats? I would rather spend my time just playing a game ( or doing something else entirely) than keeping up with every change that happens with patches, updates, expansions, unless the changes are integral to my jounrey through the simulated world. content, spell changes, bug fixes are nice to read through but i don't want to spend any of my free time reserching a function that is not implemented INSIDE of the game I am playing. by that I am meaning, there is no in-game explanation of how much of what stat a certin class is meant to have as a current balance for each teir and why should it be somehting so complicated ( as it has nothing to do with control, gameplay) that the player base needs to net-surf to get answers.
There are plenty of other worthwhile things to do with life (really, its true), and considering that alot of people already spend hours and hours just playing, I find it fair that there should be no reason to have to spend MORE time just to be sure your stat combination is not gimping you. It is totally resonable that a rogue should need to focus primarily on Agility and not have AP, crit chance, armor pen and whatever other imaginary nothings that can be worked into a % to determine the dps I can push. Again, this change has nothing to do with the skill (or lack of) involved to play the game.
realisticly, a rogue needs agility. attack power and crit chance are in the mix as well, yet they are just break downs of the OG stat we are trying to stack. and people act like there is a purpose in that? and that it hurts how 'fun' a game will be if it is simplfied?
I also have to add..... videogames SHOULD be casual...... and there is no reason that they should not accomodate a casual atmosphere. If someone is so 'hardcore' that the atmosphere does not appeal to them, then there are many other options in your life, and at no point was WoW ever a very 'hardcore' game in the first place.... it is extremely user friendly and easy to run on even low-end systems. it is designed in a fashion that a child could pick up the basics, just as the majority of every video game I have ever seen in my entire life. Any videogame can be mastered by a 10 year old and anyone who tells themself differently has a more problems than I care to point out.
Epics are pretty much the normal candy munched on by anyone who can max lvl a toon. you can do random dungeons from 70-80, and get 2 triumphs a day, which can buy you t9 gear and gear equal to it by the time you hit 80. kinda cheap but it does help the played base get into the current content. I am unhappy with many things in WoW these days and have a diverse opinion on what they did with raiding this xpac. As a casual player ( i detest the average WoW guild atmosphere) I enjoy being able to log in and find a raid but it does hurt how serious people take the game. they think its so easy and rely on everyone else to carry them through it.
It used to be exciting to get an epic, now i almost cringe because I know it is not worth crap until I enchant and gem it, and even then, if thats assuming that is does not hurt a different stat I have to build, and just gets tossed in the bank until I feel like giving enough of a damn to balance things out (which usually cost hundreds of gold). It is no longer exciting to get upgrades, it's an expensive chore.
Those stats were not difficult at all to understand....I used to love this game before Wrath of the Lich King and was even thinking about coming back once Cataclysm comes out. But from the recent news I am hearing about basic game mechanic changes, I think I'll pass on that offer.....
Good job Blizzard at turning your game from a revolution in the gaming industry to a laughing stock in the MMO world!
[Mod Edit]
Currently playing: Star Wars: The Old Republic, World of Warcraft, Dota 2, League of Legends
Waiting on: Blade & Soul, Guild Wars 2, Tera, Kingdoms of Amular, Firefall
as something i agree in. WoW is a very very simple MMO, and is one of the fastest leveling ones out there.
WoW is easy and was made more dumb, to meet casual gamer standards, and to make it really easy.
i played a lot of WoW, for fun not for competition, or leveling. I played WoW for PVP, and to roll people with RL friends. (was boring tho, would rather of been playing CSS)
Maybe its just me to catch on to all the games i play very fast, even portal my first time playing i flew through the levels my first time because i just caught on.
only 3 games i know where i didn't catch instantly: HoN, EvE, and Supreme Commander.
On the other hand, even though this takes out a lot of options and makes the diverse option of gear building extinguished, it will be very easy to gear up (Good and Bad), and gear ninja's or gear whoring will be less.
EDIT: Something Blizz should be working on is a better security, to protect against bots, found 6 bots in 2 days.
It certainly is not "dumbing down" the game. There was a really good blue post, by Ghostcrawler I believe, that gave some examples of where complex did not equal better or more interesting. Making something simple does not mean the same as making it easy.
Take DnD for instance, it has what 6 stats? It's not exactly tic-tac-toe. Those that say it's making it easy-mode just want something to complain about.
Current games: WoW, Runes of Magic
Past games: WAR, DDO, Fiesta, AoC, Rohan, Dungeon Runners, Free Realms, Tabula Rasa, LoTRO
The game is still pretty much as hard as you want it to be. If you want it to be hard, then you do all the theorycrafting yourself and stay away from elitist jerks and similar forums - or in fact, stay away from all forums.
For everyone else it is a matter of going to those forums, reading exactly what equipment to wear, what rotation to maximise your dps, and then woohoo off you go. I do hope that all those complaining about how it is being 'dumbed' down never go to forums or get any tips from anywhere, in order to make the game as hard as possible.... oh wait.
When I want to play a spreadsheet, I load excel. If I want to play an spreadsheet with nice graphics, I play Eve. WoW is not my choice of spreadsheet.
I don't see an issue with the stat changes.
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
Many don't, it's just seems many of the complaints are comming from the 'hardcore' crowd (well at least Wrath's version of it), it's the same players that whined about the Teir gear becomming obtainable via HCs, they say it's 'dimb down' purly because everyone will be on par with them when it comes to understanding the stats, so it's not just something 'exculsive' to the 'elite', and the hardcore haters are just using their bitching as 'vaild' reasons to hate the game even more.
The 'elite' WILL rage quit, I've seen this comming since the accouncement of Cata, stat stacking is basically being thrown out the window and archtype is comming back on par with each other, reason stands that CC in raids will be back in play, and heavydamage wont be limited to just Tanks and Melee anymore, sounds very much like Vanilla again, as many Vanillas have said the game looks inviting again so basically the game as come full circle, the current 'hardcore' are leaving, and the new 'hardcore' could end up in fact the 'orginal hardcore'.
Bring on the WARRRRGGHH!
Funny how the game started as 99% PvE game, and they keep tuning it more and more to PvP. Well, I guess that's natural, as they save quite some work if they have players beat up each other instead of expecting dungeons.
Let's play Fallen Earth (blind, 300 episodes)
Let's play Guild Wars 2 (blind, 45 episodes)
Well Blizzard have said for a while now they missed the WARcraft, if you even glace at the Cata lore it screams that Horde and Allience will no longer be 'bubbies' againest the next 'big bad', this is purly about surival now, it's offically the 'end of the world' and the only way to insure your race surives - remove the competion
Bring on the WARRRRGGHH!
lol so they are trying to be as simple as vanilla wow but without the misttake they had done back then ?
lol good luck !
Many don't, it's just seems many of the complaints are comming from the 'hardcore' crowd (well at least Wrath's version of it), it's the same players that whined about the Teir gear becomming obtainable via HCs, they say it's 'dimb down' purly because everyone will be on par with them when it comes to understanding the stats, so it's not just something 'exculsive' to the 'elite', and the hardcore haters are just using their bitching as 'vaild' reasons to hate the game even more.
The 'elite' WILL rage quit, I've seen this comming since the accouncement of Cata, stat stacking is basically being thrown out the window and archtype is comming back on par with each other, reason stands that CC in raids will be back in play, and heavydamage wont be limited to just Tanks and Melee anymore, sounds very much like Vanilla again, as many Vanillas have said the game looks inviting again so basically the game as come full circle, the current 'hardcore' are leaving, and the new 'hardcore' could end up in fact the 'orginal hardcore'.
While I'm guilty of not following wow much since about mid way through Tbc anyone can look at todays armor and see the game is just too bloated stats wise. It seems like a nice change to me. I enjoyed my time when playing and even though my account was hacked (authorization hack) I may create a new account a few months after Cata to re-level through its content for fun.
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
... You can change the stats on your gear ... You take a single stat on your gear and change it on an individual basis to what you like to invest in.
More intellect, less stamina etc ...
If that's dumbing down than my grandmother is Napoleon.
So CATA is more than a complete revamp of old Azeroth and wiping all level 1-60 quest content. Tough luck.
Add in the guild based PvP competition and a complete end leveling system (Path of Titans) with a needed world profession (archeology) and ....
The only dumbing down here is the fear of the WOW haters/bored ones.
... another 4 year of dominant "fear" is in the works (for those that don't see the obvious).
Incoming Wizardry no doubt.
Want a real mmorpg? Play WOW with experience turned off mode and be Pve_Pvp King at any level without a rat race.
Post forgot to mention, how everyone in CATA will have around the same amount of HP. And the DMG GAPS are still same. Yet rogues will gain energy faster from haste, and hunters gain focus faster from more haste as well.
From that i can say that bliz still doesn't know how to balance, just dumb it down and buff the most played classes. (Pally/DK/Hunter/Rogue)
Well I say time will tell. Some of the things sound good while some are a bit scary. The thing I keep replaying is the fact that all gear changes will take effect Before Cat so how is that gonna hurt us till Cat goes live? Something to wonder because what we have developed and worked out currently will all go away and we will still be on the world before Cat.
Some things are going away "poof" and some just changing to become "more effective". If it all flies and works like they plan then what will be the things for us to worry over?
We all know when Cat goes live and there are so many changes to the world and all that is in it we can expect to play very little till all the lag and bugs get worked out. Why would this expansion be any different that others. Basically the game world is getting a makeover.
Gikku
As a vanilla hardcore raider, (Full naxx clear in vanilla) these changes are good for the game . There is absolutely nothing hardcore about reading a gear chart to see what items are best in slot for you and gearing accordingly.
And if reading best in slot charts are your bag, I have faith they'll still be around for those who cannot bother themselves to think on their own even when these changes are implemented.
Post forgot to mention, how everyone in CATA will have around the same amount of HP. And the DMG GAPS are still same. Yet rogues will gain energy faster from haste, and hunters gain focus faster from more haste as well.
From that i can say that bliz still doesn't know how to balance, just dumb it down and buff the most played classes. (Pally/DK/Hunter/Rogue)
To break apart your 'claims' Pallies get 'hurt' a lot more by this change, with spellpower and the manapool size all going into Int and the regen going into Spirit the talents will really 'define' their roles more and you'll find Retri Pallies wont have the contstant use of their aoes and bubbles as even tho their damage and pool is high their regen wont be (thus putting more focus on their judges again) and once the pally is OOM they become just a block of HP, thats hardly 'favouring' the class.
Same can be said about healthpools, yea hunters will be able to contantly fire in thorey forever but it works both ends here by time they're out of focus and waiting for it to recharge they're probly still going to be met by the sharp end of an axe, again how does that 'favour' hunters?
The key point is this isn't just a one off class change happening to a certian class, ALL classes are effected to the core of their classes and Cata has been designed with those changes in mind, this isn't just a 'slap on a new stat system to the exsisting product, the 'exsisting product' will barelt exsist after Cata hits
Bring on the WARRRRGGHH!
Stamina, spirit, intellect, haste, block rating, parry, mastery, armor, resilience, strength, agility, hit rating, expertise, and critical Strike Rating: 14 different stats to manage!
It's still way too complex and will stays confusing for most.
Too many players will stay clueless and will end with the full sets not knowing what to choose as gear.
The most well understood and lovingly analyzed & documented rule system in the world is "inherently confusing."
A bizarrely organized mess of arbitrary changes, upending the whole system and obsoleting everything ever written about it, is a "dumbing down."
Updated my journal.
einexile the meek
Vacuos, Winterlong, Vaciante, Eicosapenta
Atlantean, Tyranny, Malton
they are just removing all the stuff that is useless or has become useless, and that's a good thing!
Now you aren't really forced to get certain pieces of gear because of the defence (I used to be a frost tank)
I'm already looking forward to cataclysm!
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waiting for ... nothing..
It's amazing to me how so many people completely ignore all the other announced stat systems and tunnel vision on "how can they simplify the game QQ". So they changed some stats and removed others, big deal. Now you have to think about the mastery system, plus the titan paths or what ever they are calling it nowadays.
IMO, the new stats plus those two other stat things, plus gems and enchants is WAY more than enough for theorycrafters to have all the theorycrafting fun they want. There will still be spreadsheets, there will still be debate, but this just makes the game a little more balanced between good players and newbie players. The great players can still be great.
So, is Chess a game for dumb people? I mean Pawns only have one attack.
Needless complexity isnt always better.
Ok I take back what I said in my earlyer post. Some yall make good points,Very good points....thats why discussions are great
. I intially jumped the gun :P but they way you and some others stated/commented. It does make me think back to Vanilla when there were not so many things to keep track of and it was FUN, did not feel like a math test in college.
World of Warcraft will never have guild or player housing. Ever.
Post forgot to mention, how everyone in CATA will have around the same amount of HP. And the DMG GAPS are still same. Yet rogues will gain energy faster from haste, and hunters gain focus faster from more haste as well.
From that i can say that bliz still doesn't know how to balance, just dumb it down and buff the most played classes. (Pally/DK/Hunter/Rogue)
To break apart your 'claims' Pallies get 'hurt' a lot more by this change, with spellpower and the manapool size all going into Int and the regen going into Spirit the talents will really 'define' their roles more and you'll find Retri Pallies wont have the contstant use of their aoes and bubbles as even tho their damage and pool is high their regen wont be (thus putting more focus on their judges again) and once the pally is OOM they become just a block of HP, thats hardly 'favouring' the class.
Same can be said about healthpools, yea hunters will be able to contantly fire in thorey forever but it works both ends here by time they're out of focus and waiting for it to recharge they're probly still going to be met by the sharp end of an axe, again how does that 'favour' hunters?
The key point is this isn't just a one off class change happening to a certian class, ALL classes are effected to the core of their classes and Cata has been designed with those changes in mind, this isn't just a 'slap on a new stat system to the exsisting product, the 'exsisting product' will barelt exsist after Cata hits
So your saying in other words that Hunter and pally are now balanced since they suffering, at least you think they will suffer.
Pallies in vanilla were good, but all the people who shouldn't be gaming in the first place who are not considered gamers, QQ'd to much about their class. Pally was not hard to play, it did not suck, you just had to spend a little time putting a piece together and thinking it through.
PS. If you have to read a chart to know how to build your class gems and stats, etc. Then you fail, if you leveled your own class and look around the skills a little. You probably would get a idea what is best.