Well SV was too busy to respond so that is an instant refund. They said they will have dedicated support staff after launch. They may contest the charges being reversed at that time...
If they did not respond to the dispute (like they did not with my credit card dispute) they have no way of reversing the charges to getting their money back. It is their fault for not returning the customer's emails and it is their fault for not contacting the credit card companies and responding to the dispute.
They will not try to get their money back because they are the ones that did not respond to the disputes / charge backs.
Sorry what I was trying to say is that if they (your friends) do it now. . they may have 10 days before SV decides to respond. . thus getting their money back by default. If they wait until release to try they might have it disputed. I am not suggesting people take advantage of them being too busy - but not getting any response at all from support . .even an automated response saying they will respond in several months is enough for a refund.
I don't think it was a scam, they just have no experience developing anything previous to Mortal Online. They do not have a strategy or a plan on what they are doing. They are throwing stuff together hoping it works. Example, just look at them not testing patches before releasing them, and they end up breaking more of the game than what they were trying to fix.
You talk as if you develope software, or games, as a living and know completely about what you're speaking of. The facts are, that more than 80% of you don't know what you're talking about. I'm a programmer myself, and the unfortunate fact of life is that programming in itself is a buggy process.
I have done programming and was hired by Origin to work on UO/UO2. I know enough to know that what gets down on paper as "awesome" and top of this list often doesn't make it.
Logic is only prestine to a certain point. When objects start referring to other objects just to move ONE thing in real time space on the server things start getting complicated code wise. Almost every programmer knows that for every 1000 lines of code there is most likely going to be 20-40 bugs based on the quality of programmers that wrote said lines of code. In addition to the law of programming, Mortal Online's staff is VERY small trying to get a LOT done before launch. This is inevitably going to cause a lot of bugs to occur that normally might not in a AAA title.
Additionally, due to MO being an indie company (and not selling out to EA, Sony, etc etc ruining the game's future) their budget is VERY small compared to said AAA titles. They have, quite frankly, run out of money for development. They have two choices, to launch or to fold. Preferably, given the vision i've seen so far in-game, I hope they live prosperingly post-launch as they have shown quite a lot of promise for a AAA sandbox title.
So they are stressed and make more errors. It is easier to do it correctly the first time then to try and fix it. They are having trouble fixing it.
I'm just rather disappointed in this community. We ALL have complained about the lack of Sandbox titles, and the illumination of greed within the MMO industry pumping out crap products just for the money. Yet, when a title finally comes out (from an indie company no less) more than half our community wants to burn it down because they're too small to cater to the AAA customer service we've all come to expect.
I don't want AAA customer service. . I would have been happy with an automated e-mail saying they will respond after release - or to contact them then.
I like MO. I like the concept. I liked them more when they said "this is going to be rough" Now they are saying nothing. I know they are busy but when you e-mail to ask to cancel your pre-order for a good reason (non beta related) and you don't get a response that is not great. If I drop into IRC I can ask a question of a DEV and get a response. I asked about thieving once. . I was told how awesome it was going to be. None of this is there yet. It is. . on paper.
I support what they are trying to do. I want to buy the game in the future if it is successful. I know you were not referring to me specifically but how many indie films do you watch? Some people expect a certain polish even if the substance is not new or fresh. SV is taking a chance. They are rolling the dice right now. People can feel however they want about it. I always expect a lot of people to not have hard of some movies I like. . they likely would not get through the first 15 minutes. If they did they might see how great it is. but that is my opinion. . even if then they still might think it sucks.
I like MO. I like the concept. I liked them more when they said "this is going to be rough" Now they are saying nothing. I know they are busy but when you e-mail to ask to cancel your pre-order for a good reason (non beta related) and you don't get a response that is not great. If I drop into IRC I can ask a question of a DEV and get a response. I asked about thieving once. . I was told how awesome it was going to be. None of this is there yet. It is. . on paper.
Thats what the entire game is. They keep telling people a specific feature will be in "soon" as it is on paper. The entire game is on paper and its "potential" is not realistic to what the game actually is.
The classic example of this is "Have you stopped beating your wife yet?" "Yes" implies that you were beating her. "no" implies that you are still beating her.
Hell no. I'm proud to support this indie sandbox project.
How long have you followed Starvault? I have been there from block A and I am glad I got a refund because I saw unprofessionalism every time they would do the simplest thing.
Since my initial response was deleted for trolling, I will restate this in a more neutral tone. This poll is a classic example of a loaded question. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question The classic example of this is "Have you stopped beating your wife yet?" "Yes" implies that you were beating her. "no" implies that you are still beating her.
I emailed SV four times asking for a refund - they have not even answered once. I look on their mess now and tell myself that at least I got entertained for my money by watching the oncoming megafail that MO "release" is going to be.
I emailed SV four times asking for a refund - they have not even answered once. I look on their mess now and tell myself that at least I got entertained for my money by watching the oncoming megafail that MO "release" is going to be.
Your card company (VISA, MasterCard, etc) will give you a refund for your purchase, just call them up and file a dispute with the order. You have up to 1 year by US law.
Where is the not foolish enough to order it option?
This is my vote as well.
I wish I did not preorder, but that is not what this thread is about I do not think. I think its only about if the person finding out MO is getting released this month is getting a refund before that said release.
Hell no. I'm proud to support this indie sandbox project.
How long have you followed Starvault? I have been there from block A and I am glad I got a refund because I saw unprofessionalism every time they would do the simplest thing.
But I am glad you support them.
I've been following them since before they began the beta program. They've come a long way, and they have a long way to go. But then so does every MMO upon its initial release.
As I recall Starvault was quite clear when they offered you the choice to purchase the game before it was released. They said before you ever handed over your credit card info: "No Refunds." Now you guys all come in here whining like you've been robbed in some back alley somewhere.
Not that I should be surprised, this is the mmorpg.com forums after all...
Since my initial response was deleted for trolling, I will restate this in a more neutral tone. This poll is a classic example of a loaded question. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question The classic example of this is "Have you stopped beating your wife yet?" "Yes" implies that you were beating her. "no" implies that you are still beating her.
Explain what your talking about please.
If you are unsure what a loaded question is, well, follow the link. If you are unsure why I consider it a loaded question here is my explanation:
"Yes" implies that you have requested and received a refund. (implying that you don't like Mortal and don't think it will improve)
"No" implies that you have requested a refund but not received one yet. (implying dishonest business practices by SV)
There is no way to answer the question if you ordered and have no plans on asking for a refund. There is no way to answer if you decided not to order it in the first place (regardless of whether you decided for or against buying it) There is no option for "I never buy an MMO at release, they're always a mess"
The question was posed as a yes/no question (both of which reflect poorly on SV) when really there are multiple answers.
I've been following them since before they began the beta program. They've come a long way, and they have a long way to go. But then so does every MMO upon its initial release. As I recall Starvault was quite clear when they offered you the choice to purchase the game before it was released. They said before you ever handed over your credit card info: "No Refunds." Now you guys all come in here whining like you've been robbed in some back alley somewhere. Not that I should be surprised, this is the mmorpg.com forums after all...
Actually that is incorrect. Their "No Refund" policy was NOT clear when you pre-ordered the game and was only to be found in a small clicky off to the side of the order page. At no time did it pop up and at no time did you have to read it to order. Also.. given the way they promoted their orders as being "limited" and creating a stampeed on the day the shop was opened there was very little chance that anyone was going to go looking for a refund policy.
All that is moot though as you are guaranteed a refund (within certain parameters) by both EU Law and US Credit Card regulations.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Even the return policy they had was not clear. . You were buying a license and they said that they are usually not refundable. They left it open.
Also - in their news section they stated that they can not "process" returns during beta because they do not have CS staff. They said that this staff would be in place after release. Why would they say they can not process them now. . because of staff and that they will have the staff later. . this suggest that the later staff would be able to process returns. . meaning they are possible.
Comments
If they did not respond to the dispute (like they did not with my credit card dispute) they have no way of reversing the charges to getting their money back. It is their fault for not returning the customer's emails and it is their fault for not contacting the credit card companies and responding to the dispute.
They will not try to get their money back because they are the ones that did not respond to the disputes / charge backs.
Sorry what I was trying to say is that if they (your friends) do it now. . they may have 10 days before SV decides to respond. . thus getting their money back by default. If they wait until release to try they might have it disputed. I am not suggesting people take advantage of them being too busy - but not getting any response at all from support . .even an automated response saying they will respond in several months is enough for a refund.
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
I don't think it was a scam, they just have no experience developing anything previous to Mortal Online. They do not have a strategy or a plan on what they are doing. They are throwing stuff together hoping it works. Example, just look at them not testing patches before releasing them, and they end up breaking more of the game than what they were trying to fix.
You talk as if you develope software, or games, as a living and know completely about what you're speaking of. The facts are, that more than 80% of you don't know what you're talking about. I'm a programmer myself, and the unfortunate fact of life is that programming in itself is a buggy process.
I have done programming and was hired by Origin to work on UO/UO2. I know enough to know that what gets down on paper as "awesome" and top of this list often doesn't make it.
Logic is only prestine to a certain point. When objects start referring to other objects just to move ONE thing in real time space on the server things start getting complicated code wise. Almost every programmer knows that for every 1000 lines of code there is most likely going to be 20-40 bugs based on the quality of programmers that wrote said lines of code. In addition to the law of programming, Mortal Online's staff is VERY small trying to get a LOT done before launch. This is inevitably going to cause a lot of bugs to occur that normally might not in a AAA title.
Additionally, due to MO being an indie company (and not selling out to EA, Sony, etc etc ruining the game's future) their budget is VERY small compared to said AAA titles. They have, quite frankly, run out of money for development. They have two choices, to launch or to fold. Preferably, given the vision i've seen so far in-game, I hope they live prosperingly post-launch as they have shown quite a lot of promise for a AAA sandbox title.
So they are stressed and make more errors. It is easier to do it correctly the first time then to try and fix it. They are having trouble fixing it.
I'm just rather disappointed in this community. We ALL have complained about the lack of Sandbox titles, and the illumination of greed within the MMO industry pumping out crap products just for the money. Yet, when a title finally comes out (from an indie company no less) more than half our community wants to burn it down because they're too small to cater to the AAA customer service we've all come to expect.
I don't want AAA customer service. . I would have been happy with an automated e-mail saying they will respond after release - or to contact them then.
I like MO. I like the concept. I liked them more when they said "this is going to be rough" Now they are saying nothing. I know they are busy but when you e-mail to ask to cancel your pre-order for a good reason (non beta related) and you don't get a response that is not great. If I drop into IRC I can ask a question of a DEV and get a response. I asked about thieving once. . I was told how awesome it was going to be. None of this is there yet. It is. . on paper.
I support what they are trying to do. I want to buy the game in the future if it is successful. I know you were not referring to me specifically but how many indie films do you watch? Some people expect a certain polish even if the substance is not new or fresh. SV is taking a chance. They are rolling the dice right now. People can feel however they want about it. I always expect a lot of people to not have hard of some movies I like. . they likely would not get through the first 15 minutes. If they did they might see how great it is. but that is my opinion. . even if then they still might think it sucks.
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
I like MO. I like the concept. I liked them more when they said "this is going to be rough" Now they are saying nothing. I know they are busy but when you e-mail to ask to cancel your pre-order for a good reason (non beta related) and you don't get a response that is not great. If I drop into IRC I can ask a question of a DEV and get a response. I asked about thieving once. . I was told how awesome it was going to be. None of this is there yet. It is. . on paper.
Thats what the entire game is. They keep telling people a specific feature will be in "soon" as it is on paper. The entire game is on paper and its "potential" is not realistic to what the game actually is.
stop going offtopic
Since my initial response was deleted for trolling, I will restate this in a more neutral tone.
This poll is a classic example of a loaded question. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question
The classic example of this is "Have you stopped beating your wife yet?" "Yes" implies that you were beating her. "no" implies that you are still beating her.
Unfortunately no as I waited too long. I have a very expensive paperweight sitting in the back of my closet now.
Bans a perma, but so are sigs in necro posts.
EAT ME MMORPG.com!
You have up to 1 year by US law.
Hell no. I'm proud to support this indie sandbox project.
How long have you followed Starvault? I have been there from block A and I am glad I got a refund because I saw unprofessionalism every time they would do the simplest thing.
But I am glad you support them.
Explain what your talking about please.
I emailed SV four times asking for a refund - they have not even answered once. I look on their mess now and tell myself that at least I got entertained for my money by watching the oncoming megafail that MO "release" is going to be.
You can't get a refund. People need to learn to read up what they buy.
Yes you can, its call a credit card "dispute" or "charge back" even paypal have given people refunds.
Starvault's return policy was not even legal. But that's beside the point.
Your card company (VISA, MasterCard, etc) will give you a refund for your purchase, just call them up and file a dispute with the order. You have up to 1 year by US law.
This is my vote as well.
This is my vote as well.
I wish I did not preorder, but that is not what this thread is about I do not think. I think its only about if the person finding out MO is getting released this month is getting a refund before that said release.
How long have you followed Starvault? I have been there from block A and I am glad I got a refund because I saw unprofessionalism every time they would do the simplest thing.
But I am glad you support them.
I've been following them since before they began the beta program. They've come a long way, and they have a long way to go. But then so does every MMO upon its initial release.
As I recall Starvault was quite clear when they offered you the choice to purchase the game before it was released. They said before you ever handed over your credit card info: "No Refunds." Now you guys all come in here whining like you've been robbed in some back alley somewhere.
Not that I should be surprised, this is the mmorpg.com forums after all...
Explain what your talking about please.
If you are unsure what a loaded question is, well, follow the link. If you are unsure why I consider it a loaded question here is my explanation:
"Yes" implies that you have requested and received a refund. (implying that you don't like Mortal and don't think it will improve)
"No" implies that you have requested a refund but not received one yet. (implying dishonest business practices by SV)
There is no way to answer the question if you ordered and have no plans on asking for a refund. There is no way to answer if you decided not to order it in the first place (regardless of whether you decided for or against buying it) There is no option for "I never buy an MMO at release, they're always a mess"
The question was posed as a yes/no question (both of which reflect poorly on SV) when really there are multiple answers.
lol guys wtf, why refund ? i think i see your stats
Actually that is incorrect. Their "No Refund" policy was NOT clear when you pre-ordered the game and was only to be found in a small clicky off to the side of the order page. At no time did it pop up and at no time did you have to read it to order. Also.. given the way they promoted their orders as being "limited" and creating a stampeed on the day the shop was opened there was very little chance that anyone was going to go looking for a refund policy.
All that is moot though as you are guaranteed a refund (within certain parameters) by both EU Law and US Credit Card regulations.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
slapshot you should have asked how to buy a game from internet before buying it...
Obviously I knew how to buy a game... as... I completed a purchase...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Even the return policy they had was not clear. . You were buying a license and they said that they are usually not refundable. They left it open.
Also - in their news section they stated that they can not "process" returns during beta because they do not have CS staff. They said that this staff would be in place after release. Why would they say they can not process them now. . because of staff and that they will have the staff later. . this suggest that the later staff would be able to process returns. . meaning they are possible.
They have not been clear.
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
My purchase went well. I threw in an extra $10 for a job well-done.
You paid for the game, why/how did you add an extra $10?