its entirely too unstructured and unrestricted, im not sure i'd really call it a sandbox either, simply because what you can do in game, really isnt that varied, it is all about pvp, and that isnt the same as sandbox. i think people sometimes get too sidetracked into thinking, if a game isnt a theme park, it must be a sandbox.. muddy thinking at best.
I would agree that there isn't much variation to what you can do in the game. And you aren't left with any choice really when it comes to what variation there is left (like joining a clan/not joining a clan). After playing other games I recognize the fact that the game is unstructured/unrestricted, but I see this as more of a lack of actual content than a "Freedom" aspect. This lack of content is what fools people into thinking that the game is a sandbox. However, its that same lack of content, lack of choice and lack of variation that makes the game NOT sandbox.
ah...yeah. just what "content" would you like to see??
Further more, Phry, Darkfall isn't "all about PVP"...in fact even some of the trolls around here will tell you that there's plenty of PVE in the game....plus crafting, gathering, city building, territorial conquest, exploring, socialising, and housing, to name a few things.
Maybe you're just FOCUSED on the PVP?? Maybe some people just NEED an NPC to tell them what to do, and in a wide open, un-restricted world, they simply don't know how to proceed??
its entirely too unstructured and unrestricted, im not sure i'd really call it a sandbox either, simply because what you can do in game, really isnt that varied, it is all about pvp, and that isnt the same as sandbox. i think people sometimes get too sidetracked into thinking, if a game isnt a theme park, it must be a sandbox.. muddy thinking at best.
I would agree that there isn't much variation to what you can do in the game. And you aren't left with any choice really when it comes to what variation there is left (like joining a clan/not joining a clan). After playing other games I recognize the fact that the game is unstructured/unrestricted, but I see this as more of a lack of actual content than a "Freedom" aspect. This lack of content is what fools people into thinking that the game is a sandbox. However, its that same lack of content, lack of choice and lack of variation that makes the game NOT sandbox.
Further more, Phry, Darkfall isn't "all about PVP"...
Warg0ul,
I'm a strong believer that I will PVP one day and it keeps my fire lit when it comes to this game. Of course I love PVE or I wouldn't still be playing this game but I won't be deterred in my relentless pursuit of PVP sometime this year.
its entirely too unstructured and unrestricted, im not sure i'd really call it a sandbox either, simply because what you can do in game, really isnt that varied, it is all about pvp, and that isnt the same as sandbox. i think people sometimes get too sidetracked into thinking, if a game isnt a theme park, it must be a sandbox.. muddy thinking at best.
I would agree that there isn't much variation to what you can do in the game. And you aren't left with any choice really when it comes to what variation there is left (like joining a clan/not joining a clan). After playing other games I recognize the fact that the game is unstructured/unrestricted, but I see this as more of a lack of actual content than a "Freedom" aspect. This lack of content is what fools people into thinking that the game is a sandbox. However, its that same lack of content, lack of choice and lack of variation that makes the game NOT sandbox.
ah...yeah. just what "content" would you like to see??
Further more, Phry, Darkfall isn't "all about PVP"...in fact even some of the trolls around here will tell you that there's plenty of PVE in the game....plus crafting, gathering, city building, territorial conquest, exploring, socialising, and housing, to name a few things.
Maybe you're just FOCUSED on the PVP?? Maybe some people just NEED an NPC to tell them what to do, and in a wide open, un-restricted world, they simply don't know how to proceed??
Crafting, gathering and city building all fall into the same category of Crafting. Territorial conquest is a neat term for "sieging" which has been done many times in many games. Housing isn't actual content unless you have tea-parties with your friends in them. Socialising and exploring i would definitely not call content. So basically besides the notorious grind (which you refer to as the "trolls PvE") there is:
Crafting
Sieging
That is not a very impressive list of content. Those are the basic elements that almost every mmo contains in some form. I would have expected the "ultimate PvP" game to have at least some form of a PvP advancement system, while currently there is no incentive that I am aware of to kill another player at all besides getting their loot. I don't think there anyone needs to be told by an NPC what to do in this game. Basically you can either hit a tree/rock/bush or you can hit mobs. I think it's less of a problem with being told what to do and more of an issue of "what is going to be less painful to do atm".
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
its entirely too unstructured and unrestricted, im not sure i'd really call it a sandbox either, simply because what you can do in game, really isnt that varied, it is all about pvp, and that isnt the same as sandbox. i think people sometimes get too sidetracked into thinking, if a game isnt a theme park, it must be a sandbox.. muddy thinking at best.
I would agree that there isn't much variation to what you can do in the game. And you aren't left with any choice really when it comes to what variation there is left (like joining a clan/not joining a clan). After playing other games I recognize the fact that the game is unstructured/unrestricted, but I see this as more of a lack of actual content than a "Freedom" aspect. This lack of content is what fools people into thinking that the game is a sandbox. However, its that same lack of content, lack of choice and lack of variation that makes the game NOT sandbox.
ah...yeah. just what "content" would you like to see??
Further more, Phry, Darkfall isn't "all about PVP"...in fact even some of the trolls around here will tell you that there's plenty of PVE in the game....plus crafting, gathering, city building, territorial conquest, exploring, socialising, and housing, to name a few things.
Maybe you're just FOCUSED on the PVP?? Maybe some people just NEED an NPC to tell them what to do, and in a wide open, un-restricted world, they simply don't know how to proceed??
That is not a very impressive list of content. Those are the basic elements that almost every mmo contains in some form. I would have expected the "ultimate PvP" game to have at least some form of a PvP advancement system, while currently there is no incentive that I am aware of to kill another player at all besides getting their loot. I don't think there anyone needs to be told by an NPC what to do in this game. Basically you can either hit a tree/rock/bush or you can hit mobs. I think it's less of a problem with being told what to do and more of an issue of "what is going to be less painful to do atm".
TwinkyME,
The content in Darkfall is player driven my friend. I'm in vent right now making my own content with my 3 new swimming friends. Right now we are talking about how we will kill our remaining 6,000 PVE mobs in the most productive manner as a group. We talk about what we are watching on TV while our characters are swimming into a rock. We seldom talk about PVP because we haven't had much experience with that aspect of the game yet. We talk about how great it will be to someday participate and compete in the coveted PVP that eludes us at the moment. We talk about not having seen anyone other than each other while swimming over a 19 day period of time and how we are lucky to be able to swim unabated for 12-15 hour periods. If you aren't able to create your own content you will begin to burnout on this game. I've been working in this game for 58 days and have a long, long way to go. I also went through this evolution as you are and you to will figure out how to entertain yourself if you are going to survive the journey. Send me a PM and I'll get you into my vent and help you as much as I can to make this game more enjoyable.
I This won't be fun when I get tired of grinding mobs, because PvP will always suck for someone who just started, like me. So unless they change something I don't think I can continue to put time into it.
This is the problem in Darkfall.
Darkfall isn`t hardcore, it`s just an incredible grind for no reason. If a person chose to kill several thousand of one sort mob just to level up melee, the fanbois will call it RPG. No it`s not RPG (roleplaying game), it`s just the closest mob to the city the person live. Any mob will do, and we chose the one that gives us the best gain. It`s boring, repetative, a grind, frustrating and it makes players quit. Even Xipher, the avid grind defender is abusing a mob that don`t move to max his magic gains.
You are all saying the same, Darkfall is a niche mmo. Who are this niche crowd Darkfall is made for?
What segment of the mmo community likes poor PVE, huge grind and full-loot pvp. All we know is that they are a few hundred players out of 20 millions. The niche group you are cheering simply doesn`t excist. You might be an idealist at the beginning, but soon the reality will kick you hard in the face. As soon as you join a decent clan and see the tricks we use, you`ll adapt or leave. Because we macro, afk swim, bot and exploit any mob we can to lessen the grind. We don`t do it because we want to, but because we have to.
But then again we are amongst the 500 hundred that can play Darkfall the way it was suppose to be. We have competative pvp, sieges, decent chars, ships, gear, mats and money. If they lessen the grind, more will be able to enjoy the real Darkfall. We would eliminate the macroing and the huge time players spend leveling their chars.
And what would pvpers do if they don`t have to kill NPCs for level and skill gain? Guess one time.
Just ask Agricola how fun large battles and sieges are in Darkfall with a competative char. I just wish more players could see the what Darkfall is suppose to be. We can grind for gear, mats, horses and money when we don`t pvp.
I This won't be fun when I get tired of grinding mobs, because PvP will always suck for someone who just started, like me. So unless they change something I don't think I can continue to put time into it.
This is the problem in Darkfall.
Darkfall isn`t hardcore, it`s just an incredible grind for no reason. If a person chose to kill several thousand of one sort mob just to level up melee, the fanbois will call it RPG. No it`s not RPG (roleplaying game), it`s just the closest mob to the city the person live. Any mob will do, and we chose the one that gives us the best gain. It`s boring, repetative, a grind, frustrating and it makes players quit. Even Xipher, the avid grind defender is abusing a mob that don`t move to max his magic gains.
You are all saying the same, Darkfall is a niche mmo. Who are this niche crowd Darkfall is made for?
What segment of the mmo community likes poor PVE, huge grind and full-loot pvp. All we know is that they are a few hundred players out of 20 millions. The niche group you are cheering simply doesn`t excist. You might be an idealist at the beginning, but soon the reality will kick you hard in the face. As soon as you join a decent clan and see the tricks we use, you`ll adapt or leave. Because we macro, afk swim, bot and exploit any mob we can to lessen the grind. We don`t do it because we want to, but because we have to.
But then again we are amongst the 500 hundred that can play Darkfall the way it was suppose to be. We have competative pvp, sieges, decent chars, ships, gear, mats and money. If they lessen the grind, more will be able to enjoy the real Darkfall. We would eliminate the macroing and the huge time players spend leveling their chars.
And what would pvpers do if they don`t have to kill NPCs for level and skill gain? Guess one time.
Just ask Agricola how fun large battles and sieges are in Darkfall with a competative char. I just wish more players could see the what Darkfall is suppose to be. We can grind for gear, mats, horses and money when we don`t pvp.
Thank you for explaining why joining a clan is so important. I always see people like warghoul saying that you a good clan is necessary for playing darkfall..they never say why but now I see. This explains the clan group that I saw hitting a mob that wasn't even moving with magic. Thanks to you the picture is all coming together now.
Again I have to agree with you and restate what I mentioned earlier...anyone playing darkfall for PvP should welcome faster skill gains and a lessened grind. Why wouldn't you? Why? It just means more players to play with/against. I guess people who defend the grind must enjoy killing new players who have no chance? how else can you explain not wanting a lesser grind? Oh yea, "it would be a fps game!" or "fps games are that way-->" lol, how does a minimal grind make the game anything like an FPS? or is that just another cookie cutter response? MMORPG doesnt mean grind, and a good PvP mmorpg would make you advance through PVP not through an insane PvE grind. Please.
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
I This won't be fun when I get tired of grinding mobs, because PvP will always suck for someone who just started, like me. So unless they change something I don't think I can continue to put time into it.
This is the problem in Darkfall.
What segment of the mmo community likes poor PVE, huge grind and full-loot pvp. All we know is that they are a few hundred players out of 20 millions. The niche group you are cheering simply doesn`t excist. You might be an idealist at the beginning, but soon the reality will kick you hard in the face. As soon as you join a decent clan and see the tricks we use, you`ll adapt or leave. Because we macro, afk swim, bot and exploit any mob we can to lessen the grind. We don`t do it because we want to, but because we have to.
Is your clan recruiting? Me and my 3 swimming friends would like to shave 30 days off of our swim across the pacific. Anyone with over 15,000+ PVE kills has my respect and would like to associate myself with your clan if possible.
ah...yeah. just what "content" would you like to see??
Further more, Phry, Darkfall isn't "all about PVP"...in fact even some of the trolls around here will tell you that there's plenty of PVE in the game....plus crafting, gathering, city building, territorial conquest, exploring, socialising, and housing, to name a few things.
Maybe you're just FOCUSED on the PVP?? Maybe some people just NEED an NPC to tell them what to do, and in a wide open, un-restricted world, they simply don't know how to proceed??
Crafting, gathering and city building all fall into the same category of Crafting. Territorial conquest is a neat term for "sieging" which has been done many times in many games. Housing isn't actual content unless you have tea-parties with your friends in them. Socialising and exploring i would definitely not call content. So basically besides the notorious grind (which you refer to as the "trolls PvE") there is:
Crafting
Sieging
That is not a very impressive list of content. Those are the basic elements that almost every mmo contains in some form. I would have expected the "ultimate PvP" game to have at least some form of a PvP advancement system, while currently there is no incentive that I am aware of to kill another player at all besides getting their loot. I don't think there anyone needs to be told by an NPC what to do in this game. Basically you can either hit a tree/rock/bush or you can hit mobs. I think it's less of a problem with being told what to do and more of an issue of "what is going to be less painful to do atm".
ah...yeah. just what "content" would you like to see??
Further more, Phry, Darkfall isn't "all about PVP"...in fact even some of the trolls around here will tell you that there's plenty of PVE in the game....plus crafting, gathering, city building, territorial conquest, exploring, socialising, and housing, to name a few things.
Maybe you're just FOCUSED on the PVP?? Maybe some people just NEED an NPC to tell them what to do, and in a wide open, un-restricted world, they simply don't know how to proceed??
Crafting, gathering and city building all fall into the same category of Crafting. Territorial conquest is a neat term for "sieging" which has been done many times in many games. Housing isn't actual content unless you have tea-parties with your friends in them. Socialising and exploring i would definitely not call content. So basically besides the notorious grind (which you refer to as the "trolls PvE") there is:
Crafting
Sieging
That is not a very impressive list of content. Those are the basic elements that almost every mmo contains in some form. I would have expected the "ultimate PvP" game to have at least some form of a PvP advancement system, while currently there is no incentive that I am aware of to kill another player at all besides getting their loot. I don't think there anyone needs to be told by an NPC what to do in this game. Basically you can either hit a tree/rock/bush or you can hit mobs. I think it's less of a problem with being told what to do and more of an issue of "what is going to be less painful to do atm".
Ah ha!! You ARE CrittRockets!! Busted!!
did you post in the wrong thread?
MMOluva, i don't think what you mentioned is actually darkfall content. I know what player driven content means but that includes doing things withtin the actual game not in ventrilo. i can talk about my times in guild wars while in ventrilo while playing darkfall but that doesnt make it darkfall content. its good that you at least found a way to get some entertainment out of the game though and i applaud you for that.
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
ah...yeah. just what "content" would you like to see??
Further more, Phry, Darkfall isn't "all about PVP"...in fact even some of the trolls around here will tell you that there's plenty of PVE in the game....plus crafting, gathering, city building, territorial conquest, exploring, socialising, and housing, to name a few things.
Maybe you're just FOCUSED on the PVP?? Maybe some people just NEED an NPC to tell them what to do, and in a wide open, un-restricted world, they simply don't know how to proceed??
Crafting, gathering and city building all fall into the same category of Crafting. Territorial conquest is a neat term for "sieging" which has been done many times in many games. Housing isn't actual content unless you have tea-parties with your friends in them. Socialising and exploring i would definitely not call content. So basically besides the notorious grind (which you refer to as the "trolls PvE") there is:
Crafting
Sieging
That is not a very impressive list of content. Those are the basic elements that almost every mmo contains in some form. I would have expected the "ultimate PvP" game to have at least some form of a PvP advancement system, while currently there is no incentive that I am aware of to kill another player at all besides getting their loot. I don't think there anyone needs to be told by an NPC what to do in this game. Basically you can either hit a tree/rock/bush or you can hit mobs. I think it's less of a problem with being told what to do and more of an issue of "what is going to be less painful to do atm".
Ah ha!! You ARE CrittRockets!! Busted!!
did you post in the wrong thread?
MMOluva, i don't think what you mentioned is actually darkfall content. I know what player driven content means but that includes doing things withtin the actual game not in ventrilo. i can talk about my times in guild wars while in ventrilo while playing darkfall but that doesnt make it darkfall content. its good that you at least found a way to get some entertainment out of the game though and i applaud you for that.
Your thread made me think about something. When you say self-destructive and entertainment it made me think about the realitity of my choice to play Darkfall. I bought this game to escape reality for a few hours and be entertained during my stay in-game. The opposite has happened to me while watching my character play Darkfall. During my 12-15 hour sessions of doing nothing it has forced me to magnify my real life choices and what I see has me feeling worse each day after logging out. Each day I'm gaining weight and thinking about all of my bad choices in life which really has started to make me feel like a failure in life. While my character plays I get the feeling I should try and learn a new language or learn to play a piano. Instead day after day I get fatter and feel more and more like a loser. If I would just put as much effort into something productive in real life as I am putting into Darkfall to someday be able to PVP I might accomplish something. This game has backfired on me in a good way but it hurts when I'm forced to look at my life through a high-powered microscope for 12-15 hours continually trying to force myself to stay focused on PVP a year from now. My real life is a lot worse than I'd ever truely realized and I can thank Darkfall in a strange way.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Too many DF gamers, in order to encourage ppl to try the game, put out this idea that a newbie can have a chance against a vet if he was skilled enough with dodging and accurate enough with his swings. Then when the newbie is killed in 2-3 hits or dead before he/she knew they were being attacked, they nerd rage about being misled. They are right to think so. There's no way a newbie or even a group of newbies can kill a vet unless he's afk for several mins.
Don't go into the game thinking you're going to be fighting battles with vets and doing any real damage. Look for others skilling up in similar areas to pvp with. Even then, you have no idea if that's really a fellow newbie, or a naked vet skilling up his weapon skills on gobbies.
Too many DF gamers, in order to encourage ppl to try the game, put out this idea that a newbie can have a chance against a vet if he was skilled enough with dodging and accurate enough with his swings. Then when the newbie is killed in 2-3 hits or dead before he/she knew they were being attacked, they nerd rage about being misled. They are right to think so. There's no way a newbie or even a group of newbies can kill a vet unless he's afk for several mins.
Don't go into the game thinking you're going to be fighting battles with vets and doing any real damage. Look for others skilling up in similar areas to pvp with. Even then, you have no idea if that's really a fellow newbie, or a naked vet skilling up his weapon skills on gobbies.
Odd because I've done what you claim is not possible when my character was only at the 2 month mark. But I guess people are going to have to take your word for it.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Too many DF gamers, in order to encourage ppl to try the game, put out this idea that a newbie can have a chance against a vet if he was skilled enough with dodging and accurate enough with his swings. Then when the newbie is killed in 2-3 hits or dead before he/she knew they were being attacked, they nerd rage about being misled. They are right to think so. There's no way a newbie or even a group of newbies can kill a vet unless he's afk for several mins.
Don't go into the game thinking you're going to be fighting battles with vets and doing any real damage. Look for others skilling up in similar areas to pvp with. Even then, you have no idea if that's really a fellow newbie, or a naked vet skilling up his weapon skills on gobbies.
Odd because I've done what you claim is not possible when my character was only at the 2 month mark. But I guess people are going to have to take your word for it.
hm, I don't consider a 2 month old char a newbie anymore. I was referring to ppl closer to a week or 2 old. At 2 months, you could be surging in several skills and be very capable of dropping a vet especially if you get the drop on them. You can "take my word for it" or not, I don't care.
Too many DF gamers, in order to encourage ppl to try the game, put out this idea that a newbie can have a chance against a vet if he was skilled enough with dodging and accurate enough with his swings. Then when the newbie is killed in 2-3 hits or dead before he/she knew they were being attacked, they nerd rage about being misled. They are right to think so. There's no way a newbie or even a group of newbies can kill a vet unless he's afk for several mins.
Don't go into the game thinking you're going to be fighting battles with vets and doing any real damage. Look for others skilling up in similar areas to pvp with. Even then, you have no idea if that's really a fellow newbie, or a naked vet skilling up his weapon skills on gobbies.
Odd because I've done what you claim is not possible when my character was only at the 2 month mark. But I guess people are going to have to take your word for it.
hm, I don't consider a 2 month old char a newbie anymore. I was referring to ppl closer to a week or 2 old. At 2 months, you could be surging in several skills and be very capable of dropping a vet especially if you get the drop on them. You can "take my word for it" or not, I don't care.
hm, I don't consider a 2 month old char a newbie anymore. I was referring to ppl closer to a week or 2 old. At 2 months, you could be surging in several skills and be very capable of dropping a vet especially if you get the drop on them. You can "take my word for it" or not, I don't care.
Apologies. For some reason I assumed you defined a newbie in a different way.
Damned assumptions.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Too many DF gamers, in order to encourage ppl to try the game, put out this idea that a newbie can have a chance against a vet if he was skilled enough with dodging and accurate enough with his swings. Then when the newbie is killed in 2-3 hits or dead before he/she knew they were being attacked, they nerd rage about being misled. They are right to think so. There's no way a newbie or even a group of newbies can kill a vet unless he's afk for several mins.
Don't go into the game thinking you're going to be fighting battles with vets and doing any real damage. Look for others skilling up in similar areas to pvp with. Even then, you have no idea if that's really a fellow newbie, or a naked vet skilling up his weapon skills on gobbies.
Odd because I've done what you claim is not possible when my character was only at the 2 month mark. But I guess people are going to have to take your word for it.
hm, I don't consider a 2 month old char a newbie anymore. I was referring to ppl closer to a week or 2 old. At 2 months, you could be surging in several skills and be very capable of dropping a vet especially if you get the drop on them. You can "take my word for it" or not, I don't care.
You have to take into account the age of his character. He made his character long before yours so it was easier for him to grind with less veterans then there are now. You can probably add 50% to his 2 month time frame for you to be pvp ready.
Also take into account the 2 month time frame is probably only viable if you play 8-12 hours per day. Unless you join a clan and shoot mobs that never even move all day long. I can tell from my gains over the past 2 weeks that It will take me much longer than 3 months to reach my goal because I cannot dedicate 8 hours a day to the game.
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
The issue woud not exist if AV were not too stupid to implement skill caps, and skill decay. As it stands you can never, ever, ever not even if you play everyday catch someone who has been playing since month 1 and plays on average close to the same time as you. You both play as much, but you will never be able to catch up to him, ever, simply impossible, unless he stops progressing. Since you can learn everything to max and never lose it, there is no meaningful economy, or ability to progress vai risk/reward or making intelligent choices. There are no "builds" or "character templates" of any kind, no intelligent way to build your character, none - you must learn everything available. It is a stupid system that I agree with the OP will in the end break the game permenently, and probably already has.
Solution: Increase stat gain by 50% and increase skill gain by 20% over the current basic speeds. Further, increase skill gain above 60 by 30%. In addition, introduce skill decay on soft cap and a hard cap on total skill points spent.
I quit after a month and I know of three other noobs who quit for the same reason that I did.
The game has a tremendoulsy boring grind, basically you start a harvesting activity then you alt-tab and browse the web.
Creating a harsh PvP environment then making new players stand no chance is a mindbendingly bad design.
This is why I call Darkfall a hardcore PVE mmo.
The lack of skillcap was a huge mistake, and the huge grind totally destroyed what could have been a great pvp mmo with a few 100 k players. The only way they can save Darkfall is to increase the stat/skill gain, as this will buy them time to make the specialization needed to get some diverety of the players. Letting new players compete in PVP fast is the only way we can save this game.
The top clan on EU 1 at the moment is a world of warcraft guild. They have grinded their chars to max level, and now they call the others scrubs and non factors. Talk about irony in a so called pvp mmo.
Please don`t support a huge grind if you haven`t played DF for a while. If you need high level to kill new players that`s ok, but please don`t brag about your deed :P
I've been playing since beta and I can honestly say that the population seems pretty stable with even a bit of growth. (unscientific observation). so I wouldn't say that its "dying" in any way.
It is a rough game for noobs there is no getting around that. It takes some time to get competititve if you wanna get into the 'gank' leagues. which involves grinding which is in every game.
I've been enjoying the game for a while, but now i'm starting to eye my next game which i'm thinking will be earthrise which looks cool. may keep my DF acct active. who knows. Many may be shockd, but you can like more than one game at a time. Its not a one or the other world yet.
I've been playing since beta and I can honestly say that the population seems pretty stable with even a bit of growth. (unscientific observation). so I wouldn't say that its "dying" in any way.
It is a rough game for noobs there is no getting around that. It takes some time to get competititve if you wanna get into the 'gank' leagues. which involves grinding which is in every game.
I've been enjoying the game for a while, but now i'm starting to eye my next game which i'm thinking will be earthrise which looks cool. may keep my DF acct active. who knows. Many may be shockd, but you can like more than one game at a time. Its not a one or the other world yet.
would you attribute whatever growth you are seeing to the $1 trial? I was playing last night figuring there would be a lot of people on since it was friday but i all i saw was the same 3 people talking in race chat about things that weernt even related to darkfall. is it normal to never see anyone killing mobs or could i possibly be killing the wrong mobs?
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
So did I....but that post gave proof finally to my suspicions. Certain key phrases and arguments that he uses in every one of his threads.
Hopefully the mods take notice and ban his new account.
I'm sure they'll catch on. Aside from you know who's weekly troll thread, they really don't let much slip by these days.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
I quit after a month and I know of three other noobs who quit for the same reason that I did.
The game has a tremendoulsy boring grind, basically you start a harvesting activity then you alt-tab and browse the web.
Creating a harsh PvP environment then making new players stand no chance is a mindbendingly bad design.
This is why I call Darkfall a hardcore PVE mmo.
The lack of skillcap was a huge mistake, and the huge grind totally destroyed what could have been a great pvp mmo with a few 100 k players. The only way they can save Darkfall is to increase the stat/skill gain, as this will buy them time to make the specialization needed to get some diverety of the players. Letting new players compete in PVP fast is the only way we can save this game.
The top clan on EU 1 at the moment is a world of warcraft guild. They have grinded their chars to max level, and now they call the others scrubs and non factors. Talk about irony in a so called pvp mmo.
Please don`t support a huge grind if you haven`t played DF for a while. If you need high level to kill new players that`s ok, but please don`t brag about your deed :P
Hardcore PvE MMO haha, it is sad that we could even ponder giving a title like that to a game advertised as having ultimate pvp action. The first thing I thought when i saw the $1 trial and thought of trying the game was that I wouldn't have to PvE as much as other games. how wrong i was.
I'll never get why they slapped the terrible PvE grind on top of the PvP, besides forcing players to pay 15 a month for the duration of the grinding. i think if they allowed new players to PvP sooner the game would get more players like you mention.
the fact that you say the top guild is a world of warcaft guild really shines some light on what kind of game we are really playing. it is funny and i'm glad i picked the north american server so I don't have to listen to them calling everyone scrubs. lol
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
Comments
ah...yeah. just what "content" would you like to see??
Further more, Phry, Darkfall isn't "all about PVP"...in fact even some of the trolls around here will tell you that there's plenty of PVE in the game....plus crafting, gathering, city building, territorial conquest, exploring, socialising, and housing, to name a few things.
Maybe you're just FOCUSED on the PVP?? Maybe some people just NEED an NPC to tell them what to do, and in a wide open, un-restricted world, they simply don't know how to proceed??
Warg0ul,
I'm a strong believer that I will PVP one day and it keeps my fire lit when it comes to this game. Of course I love PVE or I wouldn't still be playing this game but I won't be deterred in my relentless pursuit of PVP sometime this year.
Crafting, gathering and city building all fall into the same category of Crafting. Territorial conquest is a neat term for "sieging" which has been done many times in many games. Housing isn't actual content unless you have tea-parties with your friends in them. Socialising and exploring i would definitely not call content. So basically besides the notorious grind (which you refer to as the "trolls PvE") there is:
Crafting
Sieging
That is not a very impressive list of content. Those are the basic elements that almost every mmo contains in some form. I would have expected the "ultimate PvP" game to have at least some form of a PvP advancement system, while currently there is no incentive that I am aware of to kill another player at all besides getting their loot. I don't think there anyone needs to be told by an NPC what to do in this game. Basically you can either hit a tree/rock/bush or you can hit mobs. I think it's less of a problem with being told what to do and more of an issue of "what is going to be less painful to do atm".
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
~ Billy Corgan
TwinkyME,
The content in Darkfall is player driven my friend. I'm in vent right now making my own content with my 3 new swimming friends. Right now we are talking about how we will kill our remaining 6,000 PVE mobs in the most productive manner as a group. We talk about what we are watching on TV while our characters are swimming into a rock. We seldom talk about PVP because we haven't had much experience with that aspect of the game yet. We talk about how great it will be to someday participate and compete in the coveted PVP that eludes us at the moment. We talk about not having seen anyone other than each other while swimming over a 19 day period of time and how we are lucky to be able to swim unabated for 12-15 hour periods. If you aren't able to create your own content you will begin to burnout on this game. I've been working in this game for 58 days and have a long, long way to go. I also went through this evolution as you are and you to will figure out how to entertain yourself if you are going to survive the journey. Send me a PM and I'll get you into my vent and help you as much as I can to make this game more enjoyable.
This is the problem in Darkfall.
Darkfall isn`t hardcore, it`s just an incredible grind for no reason. If a person chose to kill several thousand of one sort mob just to level up melee, the fanbois will call it RPG. No it`s not RPG (roleplaying game), it`s just the closest mob to the city the person live. Any mob will do, and we chose the one that gives us the best gain. It`s boring, repetative, a grind, frustrating and it makes players quit. Even Xipher, the avid grind defender is abusing a mob that don`t move to max his magic gains.
You are all saying the same, Darkfall is a niche mmo. Who are this niche crowd Darkfall is made for?
What segment of the mmo community likes poor PVE, huge grind and full-loot pvp. All we know is that they are a few hundred players out of 20 millions. The niche group you are cheering simply doesn`t excist. You might be an idealist at the beginning, but soon the reality will kick you hard in the face. As soon as you join a decent clan and see the tricks we use, you`ll adapt or leave. Because we macro, afk swim, bot and exploit any mob we can to lessen the grind. We don`t do it because we want to, but because we have to.
But then again we are amongst the 500 hundred that can play Darkfall the way it was suppose to be. We have competative pvp, sieges, decent chars, ships, gear, mats and money. If they lessen the grind, more will be able to enjoy the real Darkfall. We would eliminate the macroing and the huge time players spend leveling their chars.
And what would pvpers do if they don`t have to kill NPCs for level and skill gain? Guess one time.
Just ask Agricola how fun large battles and sieges are in Darkfall with a competative char. I just wish more players could see the what Darkfall is suppose to be. We can grind for gear, mats, horses and money when we don`t pvp.
Thank you for explaining why joining a clan is so important. I always see people like warghoul saying that you a good clan is necessary for playing darkfall..they never say why but now I see. This explains the clan group that I saw hitting a mob that wasn't even moving with magic. Thanks to you the picture is all coming together now.
Again I have to agree with you and restate what I mentioned earlier...anyone playing darkfall for PvP should welcome faster skill gains and a lessened grind. Why wouldn't you? Why? It just means more players to play with/against. I guess people who defend the grind must enjoy killing new players who have no chance? how else can you explain not wanting a lesser grind? Oh yea, "it would be a fps game!" or "fps games are that way-->" lol, how does a minimal grind make the game anything like an FPS? or is that just another cookie cutter response? MMORPG doesnt mean grind, and a good PvP mmorpg would make you advance through PVP not through an insane PvE grind. Please.
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
~ Billy Corgan
Is your clan recruiting? Me and my 3 swimming friends would like to shave 30 days off of our swim across the pacific. Anyone with over 15,000+ PVE kills has my respect and would like to associate myself with your clan if possible.
Ah ha!! You ARE CrittRockets!! Busted!!
did you post in the wrong thread?
MMOluva, i don't think what you mentioned is actually darkfall content. I know what player driven content means but that includes doing things withtin the actual game not in ventrilo. i can talk about my times in guild wars while in ventrilo while playing darkfall but that doesnt make it darkfall content. its good that you at least found a way to get some entertainment out of the game though and i applaud you for that.
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
~ Billy Corgan
Your thread made me think about something. When you say self-destructive and entertainment it made me think about the realitity of my choice to play Darkfall. I bought this game to escape reality for a few hours and be entertained during my stay in-game. The opposite has happened to me while watching my character play Darkfall. During my 12-15 hour sessions of doing nothing it has forced me to magnify my real life choices and what I see has me feeling worse each day after logging out. Each day I'm gaining weight and thinking about all of my bad choices in life which really has started to make me feel like a failure in life. While my character plays I get the feeling I should try and learn a new language or learn to play a piano. Instead day after day I get fatter and feel more and more like a loser. If I would just put as much effort into something productive in real life as I am putting into Darkfall to someday be able to PVP I might accomplish something. This game has backfired on me in a good way but it hurts when I'm forced to look at my life through a high-powered microscope for 12-15 hours continually trying to force myself to stay focused on PVP a year from now. My real life is a lot worse than I'd ever truely realized and I can thank Darkfall in a strange way.
Ya I figured that out days ago. Catch up man!
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Too many DF gamers, in order to encourage ppl to try the game, put out this idea that a newbie can have a chance against a vet if he was skilled enough with dodging and accurate enough with his swings. Then when the newbie is killed in 2-3 hits or dead before he/she knew they were being attacked, they nerd rage about being misled. They are right to think so. There's no way a newbie or even a group of newbies can kill a vet unless he's afk for several mins.
Don't go into the game thinking you're going to be fighting battles with vets and doing any real damage. Look for others skilling up in similar areas to pvp with. Even then, you have no idea if that's really a fellow newbie, or a naked vet skilling up his weapon skills on gobbies.
Odd because I've done what you claim is not possible when my character was only at the 2 month mark. But I guess people are going to have to take your word for it.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
hm, I don't consider a 2 month old char a newbie anymore. I was referring to ppl closer to a week or 2 old. At 2 months, you could be surging in several skills and be very capable of dropping a vet especially if you get the drop on them. You can "take my word for it" or not, I don't care.
I'll take your word for it.
After 58 days I can't kill a vet.
Apologies. For some reason I assumed you defined a newbie in a different way.
Damned assumptions.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
You have to take into account the age of his character. He made his character long before yours so it was easier for him to grind with less veterans then there are now. You can probably add 50% to his 2 month time frame for you to be pvp ready.
Also take into account the 2 month time frame is probably only viable if you play 8-12 hours per day. Unless you join a clan and shoot mobs that never even move all day long. I can tell from my gains over the past 2 weeks that It will take me much longer than 3 months to reach my goal because I cannot dedicate 8 hours a day to the game.
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
~ Billy Corgan
I quit after a month and I know of three other noobs who quit for the same reason that I did.
The game has a tremendoulsy boring grind, basically you start a harvesting activity then you alt-tab and browse the web.
Creating a harsh PvP environment then making new players stand no chance is a mindbendingly bad design.
The issue woud not exist if AV were not too stupid to implement skill caps, and skill decay. As it stands you can never, ever, ever not even if you play everyday catch someone who has been playing since month 1 and plays on average close to the same time as you. You both play as much, but you will never be able to catch up to him, ever, simply impossible, unless he stops progressing. Since you can learn everything to max and never lose it, there is no meaningful economy, or ability to progress vai risk/reward or making intelligent choices. There are no "builds" or "character templates" of any kind, no intelligent way to build your character, none - you must learn everything available. It is a stupid system that I agree with the OP will in the end break the game permenently, and probably already has.
Solution: Increase stat gain by 50% and increase skill gain by 20% over the current basic speeds. Further, increase skill gain above 60 by 30%. In addition, introduce skill decay on soft cap and a hard cap on total skill points spent.
This is why I call Darkfall a hardcore PVE mmo.
The lack of skillcap was a huge mistake, and the huge grind totally destroyed what could have been a great pvp mmo with a few 100 k players. The only way they can save Darkfall is to increase the stat/skill gain, as this will buy them time to make the specialization needed to get some diverety of the players. Letting new players compete in PVP fast is the only way we can save this game.
The top clan on EU 1 at the moment is a world of warcraft guild. They have grinded their chars to max level, and now they call the others scrubs and non factors. Talk about irony in a so called pvp mmo.
http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=239799
Please don`t support a huge grind if you haven`t played DF for a while. If you need high level to kill new players that`s ok, but please don`t brag about your deed :P
I've been playing since beta and I can honestly say that the population seems pretty stable with even a bit of growth. (unscientific observation). so I wouldn't say that its "dying" in any way.
It is a rough game for noobs there is no getting around that. It takes some time to get competititve if you wanna get into the 'gank' leagues. which involves grinding which is in every game.
I've been enjoying the game for a while, but now i'm starting to eye my next game which i'm thinking will be earthrise which looks cool. may keep my DF acct active. who knows. Many may be shockd, but you can like more than one game at a time. Its not a one or the other world yet.
I self identify as a monkey.
So did I....but that post gave proof finally to my suspicions. Certain key phrases and arguments that he uses in every one of his threads.
Hopefully the mods take notice and ban his new account.
would you attribute whatever growth you are seeing to the $1 trial? I was playing last night figuring there would be a lot of people on since it was friday but i all i saw was the same 3 people talking in race chat about things that weernt even related to darkfall. is it normal to never see anyone killing mobs or could i possibly be killing the wrong mobs?
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
~ Billy Corgan
I'm sure they'll catch on. Aside from you know who's weekly troll thread, they really don't let much slip by these days.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Hardcore PvE MMO haha, it is sad that we could even ponder giving a title like that to a game advertised as having ultimate pvp action. The first thing I thought when i saw the $1 trial and thought of trying the game was that I wouldn't have to PvE as much as other games. how wrong i was.
I'll never get why they slapped the terrible PvE grind on top of the PvP, besides forcing players to pay 15 a month for the duration of the grinding. i think if they allowed new players to PvP sooner the game would get more players like you mention.
the fact that you say the top guild is a world of warcaft guild really shines some light on what kind of game we are really playing. it is funny and i'm glad i picked the north american server so I don't have to listen to them calling everyone scrubs. lol
"I'm not going to die glamorously. I'll probably be eating a Twinkie, take a bite, and fall over."
~ Billy Corgan